watched alan thick and you on the wonder years. you were television dads to a whole generation. a lot of the reaction to alan thicke's passing to people my age, he has a place in our hearts and minds from the special time in our lives. thanks for taking a few minutes. >> i just talked to joanna kern who is devastated. we all are. >> thank you for taking the time. >> thanks. bye-bye. >> dan laueria. that doll it for this hour from new york. up next, m trtp daily with chuc todd. good evening. if it's wednesday we are here in west virginia. at the black sheep burrito and brews, welcome to "mtp daily" this used to be the most reliable of democratic states

and now it's solidly trump. clinton lost by 42 points. it sent shock waves through american politics, but here big time. he takes the oath of office in 36 years and battling bipart an criticism and his rejection of intelligence and business conflicts. as the same goes in politics, loyalty is everything. we begin with a test of that loyalty. trump supporters don't just trust him, they seem to trust only him. he questions intelligence on russia, so do they. he picks a cabinet of billionaires to champion the middle guy and they love it. how do we know? a focus group of 12 trump voters conducted and moderated by pollster peter hart on behalf of the university of pennsylvania. part of our polling team. it was a fascinating and eye-opening look at the trump

phenomenon. when trump talks, his supporters listen. what trump says, they say. >> i can't be bought. >> you can't buy him. >> you can't buy him. >> we use political hacks. they have no clue. >> politicians are not good deal makers. >> they made a mistake when you chose mitt romney. he was a disaster as a candidate. no energy or nothing. he was stiff. >> that's something that mccain and romney refuse to do. >> trump has come under intense bipartisan fire with business conflicts. he canceled that and these supporters couldn't care less about the issue. >> he is not putting his financial affairs into a blind trust and bothered by that. >> this is unprecedented what is going on with his wealth and everything. >> no concern around the table?

>> trump has come under scrutiny for rejecting findings that russia tried to interfere with the election. are the supporters worried? take a listen. >> not concerned at all. >> no. right now i'm not concerned. >> i know the media twists a lot. it wouldn't surprise me if they are just putting it out there as a theory. >> julian assange said it wasn't the russians. >> i think it's nonsense. >> what came out came out. >> i know what some of you are thinking. they might be lifelong conservative republicans. guess what. they are not. >> did you vote for either reg clinton or obama? >> obama. >> my favorite president would probably be obama. >> i voted for obama. >> i voted for obama. >> i voted for clinton in the past. >> i voted for clinton in the

past. >> i voted for obama once. >> that's right. seven out of 12 of that trump voter focus group voted for bill clinton or barack obama. i am joined by the moderator who is the democratic team of our nbc "wall street journal" poll. as well as nbc news editor. peter, i have to say i think the most -- it's not that surprising, but if you are donald trump and you saw that focus group and the intro we did you have to feel pretty good about your core base and your ability to talk to your base. >> peter, did you not hear that? i think we are having an audio issue with peter.

it was interesting that if you are donald trump and you are the trump white house team and you see the focus group and you realize the core base is with you through thick and thin. >> this group was willing to give donald trump just a very, very wight berth, almost limitless leeway at the beginning of his presidency saying that they are totally unbothered by the stories that are plastered on the front page of newspapers and of nightly news. about his conflicts of interest and russia and the cia story. what the voters want to see is results on two issues. jobs and obamacare either changed or repealed. those are animating issues. those are the things he wants to see action on right away. as far as the day to day tone ai lot of these voters said he

needed to moderate his tone after the election and he has to the extent that he tweets more than we would like or he would be more presidential there. that's a far less concern than the bold action than his business savvy and the things they liked about him that got him elected with the folks. >> i think we have the audio issue fixed. i think carrie did a good job of answering that first question. let me go to the 30,000 feet. what surprised you about this focus group? >> two things, check. first and fore most, not only the leash he gets but the breath of saying he is the person in charge and deserves the power. congress should listen to him and there is not necessarily a sense of an independent brand. more importantly than that is how the voters sort of looked at the world. thats these are the people who

chant usa, usa. when it comes down to it, they are talking about themselves. us. what they care about is not that the russians are hacking or being involved in terms of the election. they are not being concerned about what may happen throwing out people on immigration. it's a sense of what it means to us. it's not necessarily a bigger view of the world. it is what can be done to help us as individuals. that is different from a democratic party. >> you talked about that two core promgss that if he has to fulfill here, he gets a wide berth. how much patience do the folks have? >> nearly infinite from the voters right now. when asked what would disappoint

them about donald trump, they pointed back to his campaign promises. they said we want him to stick to what he talked about with jobs and health care. immigration and terror were two big planks. they said over and over again, the reason they liked him was his boldness and he is not beholden to anybody. if that changed, that would disappoint the voters. tharm saying he could not be bought and they were willing to give him a pass. he made his money. this was an argument in the focus group. he is not beholden to anybody and doesn't need more money. he will be a representative for the people. if patience runs out, it's because he is on those issues. they are willing to give him a

long sleesh. if you had a slew of clients and had to figure out how to win in trump's america and win over trump voters, what would you tell them you learned from this about how to communicate with the people? >> the most important thing is to get back to the neighborhoods. we ignored people from west of new jersey all the way out to the west coast. they need to get back there and i think we had a good economic message, but they stopped telling that message. change and how are we offering change and what's going to be different. the long leash is right. i have been here before and watched it the last 40 years. people always say they are going to give a long leash, but you are delivering and things change

more quickly than he expected. if in two years he hasn't accomplished that, we will give him more time. they want him to act presidential. right now in this interim period, they are giving mild criticism. it will get heavier if he continues doing the same thing. >> i will leave it there with the two of you. as always, we appreciate you bringing the focus groups to us. >> a big change. editor as large. bill, i should say congratulations, i think. this feels good. no more day to day management? >> exactly. i can spend more time doing god knows what. >> coming on here.

i will let you have the first word. anything surprise you at what you saw there in that focus group and how connected they are request their candidate? what struck me is how unhappy they were with how things are now. how willing they are to have things blown up. they don't care if he appoints people who don't have experience or don't care what they do. they just want things to change. that gives donald trump enormous running room to do things and they expect things to change. if in a year from now, things are not different especially the way washington works, these voters could become disenchanted with them. half of them were democrats as recently as four years ago. they are not dedicated republicans, but they signed on to donald trump. >> more than half of them were

voters for democratic presidents. the democratic party has a messaging problem. >> it's the power of trump's messaging. it was not about economics or anything that is typically political, but identity. taking america back to a point where frankly white americans had more advantages than they do now. at least perceptively. that's the question i would like to hear them ask. is identity and white identity specifically a drivewing force behind your support for donald trump? >> i was struck by how much what donald trump says, they say. it's not unusual they will echo some things, but it seemed

almost verbatim. it's like he is not just their president, but he is where they get their news from and their filter. plain and simple. >> they identified with him in a way that is somewhat unusual. maybe like peter, with the focus group and the millennial voters and december 2008. they would sound like barack obama and would have echoed barack obama and had great hopes and expectations for barack obama. 2010 was a rough mid-term for him. not because of his core voters, but it stuck with the democrats. swing voters swung. at the end of the day, it wasn't that different from 2o 12. the democrats are not in as bad

of shape as people being. trump and the republicans are not in a strong shape as they would think if they look at a friendly focus group and say we are just in charge and can do whatever they want. we need to execute on the policies and not executing on different policies that is not easy. >> the other thing that struck me is i tell you now you understand democrats who say my god, his business deals or oh, my god, this. it was clear any of the personal stuff got washed away. >> they didn't care about potential conflicts. they assume it won't matter to him because they think he is already so rich. they didn't care about the russian hacking and they didn't care to find out they cared about jobs and obamacare. they had trouble getting this on a third issue. build the wall didn't get a lot of play. are there jobs for them to go to. it has been a burden to pay for

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will go through 12 white men. there is diversity in the cabinet with ben carson, but if they are all confirmed, the big four, state, defense, justice and treasury and dhs if you want to call it the big five will be all white men. the first time since bush 41's cabinet in 1989. how much will donald trump pay a price for that if at all? we'll be right back. and ask if your heart is healthy enough for sex. do not take cialis if you take nitrates for chest pain, or adempas® for pulmonary hypertension, as this may cause an unsafe drop in blood pressure. do not drink alcohol in excess. to avoid long-term injury, get medical help right away for an erection lasting more than four hours. if you have a sudden decrease or loss of hearing or vision, or an allergic reaction, stop taking cialis and get medical help right away. ask your doctor about cialis. so we know how to cover almost almoanything.hing, even a rodent ride-along. [dad] alright, buddy, don't forget anything!

[kid] i won't, dad... [captain rod] happy tuesday morning! captain rod here. it's pretty hairy out on the interstate.traffic is literally crawling, but there is some movement on the eastside overpass. getting word of another collision. [burke] it happened. december 14th, 2015. and we covered it. talk to farmers. we know a thing or two because we've seen a thing or two. ♪ we are farmers. bum-pa-dum, bum-bum-bum-bum ♪ >> there are ten democratic senators in states that trump won. he described the meeting asa informative. that job ended up going to another former governor from texas, rick perry. manchin said he will stay in the senate where he is up for senate in 2018. thanks for coming.

>> good to be here. >> good to be here. >> secretary of energy. why did you take the interview? >> i thought anything i can do to propel my state and energy is what we are all about. you have been able to observe that firsthand and i had a chance to talk about the bill we have been fighting for. we will get that done and something we need to do. president-elect donald trump has won every coal region in the united states he won west virginia overwhelmingly. i wanted to make sure we were on the same page and we have to get this done and find a pathway forward to have a balanced energy policy with coal winning. >> what does it look like? i talked to miners and the thing they are most excited about and they assume a burch of regulations are going away.

>> there was an overreach. there was a nuisance. what happens is all west virginians want clean water. there is a balance to be had. we built on the energy we produced right here. they are looking at the balance and they overreached and president obama and his administration from day one. they overreached and that shut us down. don't tell me you are from the working person when you are stopping them from working. they say we got what we have been asking for and we will get it. war war we know that the low price of grl gas had an effect and we have ridden the market changes, but never had the them holds under the water. that's what we feel like.

>> you get rid of the regulations that allow them to tread water again. >> to tablize. it can only grow. the federal commission determines on how energy comes on to the grid. if they are looking at the cheapest and not reliable and dependable. >> it's the most reliable and dependable until the natural gas. there has to be a balance. give us a chance to survive. we don't have the markets we had before. even with all the ability to go back and mine, we lost a lot of markets that shut down and changed over to cheap gas. there is a challenge. what does west virginia's economy look like in 30 years. >> woo have to have broadband throughout. we are a rural mountainous state. it's hard to get the signals. >> i have been hearing about the

promise with george w. bush and barack obama. >> it's the money. >> i thought there was a tax like a quarter of a penny. >> it went to the urban areas too. we got tom wheeler here. >> open your phone, right? >> we couldn't get a thing. he said i'm committed to get the money back to you. if you want to stop poverty, you have to get connectivity. >> what cole do you want to play? >> i want to make the senate work again. we have been miserable and i'm being honest. >> why did you stay? >> a lot of people wanted you to run for governor and you probably would have won? >> i have hope and faith that

chuck schumer is going to change and give us the spark we need and allow us -- i'm not a washington democrat. west virginia is different. we believe in hard work and helping everyone who needs help, but get off your butt and do something. don't wait for a handout. i know john and i know kevin carthy. i know the trump team. i kelt comfortable. i feel he wants to do something. you comfortable being a west virginia democrat? >> absolutely. my brand is very independent. that's who i am. why do i have to change my identity to think i am sbn important? >> they come up to you and say

help us reach out to rerl america and coal country. what advice do you give? >> let's get the chairman. >> you would like a 30 choice? >> absolutely. i think speaking from a hurl state that is getting our brains beat in because washington doesn't speak for us. it's hard for them to represent us. that's hard. you have to fight to be a democrat in west virginia. >> what are did bernie get that hillary excellent? >> i have a hard time explaining that one because i don't get it either. i don't understand it. >> showing up and caring about it? >> he did donald trump do so well everywhere? he was going to win west virginia. i knew that from day one. >> did you think by the biggest

margin in history? >> i didn't and he didn't either. he said i won big. he polled me how big he thought he won it. i said i think you won bigger than that. he was surprise at that. people were so mat and i felt it. they get matd r mad at everyone and they wanted change. they didn't think anyone would bring them change that has been ther bernie spoke of all these things against wall street. when you think about wall street that got bailed out. kai can't even take care of our coal miners. we didn't even ask for a brought. >> rex tillerson and his relationship with putin. is that a problem for you? >> that specifically is not a problem for me. i will tell you the reason why.

you have to have relationships. i spent time in germany. why? i started talking to some of them. they said the cold war is colder than when it was on. that's our job. we are the leaders of the free world. we have to reach out. i'm cashed about rex. they said follow the money. follow the money. i don't know how intertwined it is. the person is going to say no matter what, it's about america and the security of our country. it's not about do i protect my investments. those are the things i hear a lot of fellow democrats speaking about. him having a relationship, no, we need that relationship, but i hope we can say no to him. i know rex. i know rex from this standpoint.

he has the heart of a lion. he has the compassion too because i watched him with the boy scouts. he is very big in the boy scout movement. we put the scout camp in. >> i'm going to leave it there. good to see you. all right. with some republicans questioning trump's choice of exxon-mobil ceo, i will talk to a republican who held the job. former secretary of state james baker joins me ahead. ♪ i want a hippopotamus for christmas ♪ ♪ only a hippopotamus will do at the united states postal service, we deliver more online purchases to homes than anyone else in the country. and more hippopotamuses, too. ♪ so whatever your holiday priority, our priority is you.

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>> here in west virginia for a special edition of "mtp daily" a special interview tonight later on msnbc. we sit down with the cast of hidden figures. a new film that tells the untold story of three african-american women or the brains behind one of the greatest space operations in the history of nasa. the launch of john glen into orbit tonight at 7:00 p.m. eastern. fascinating conversation. we will have more mtp daily, but first here's the market wrap. >> thank you, chuck. stocks pulling back from record levels and the dow sliding 118 points and the s&p shutting 18 and nasdaq sinking 27. the federal reserve raised rates by a quarter of a percent. the second increase in about a year. the fed chair janet yellin said

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>> welcome back. jim baker knows his way around a presidential cabinet. served as chief of staff to ronald reagan and george h.w. bush and secretary of the treasury and happens to know the man who may be the next secretary of state, rex tillerson, the ek onceo. jim baker's law firm had a long history with them. welcome to the show. >> nice to be with you. >> let me start with a simple question about rex tillerson. what gives you the confidence that can make a good secretary of state? >> well, what gives me the

confidence is that i know him personally. i will have to admit to you up front, he is a friend. and yes, my law firm has done work with exxon in the past. i watched rex as he has managed that huge big corporation for the benefit of the shareholders which is what he should be doing. in my opinion he is an excellent choice for secretary of state and has the opportunity now to become a very, very effective one. he has the international experience. he has the managerial skills and he has the knowledge. >> you thought hey, don't judge his relationship with vladimir putin beyond his time at exxon. do you know, does he have a different view of putin as a civilian than as he did does as

ceo of exxon? >> no, of course i don't know that. i haven't talked to him since his nomination and the president-elect indicated he was going to nominate him. in fact, i didn't talk to the transition team about him until the monday afternoon before he was mentioned tuesday morning by the president-elect. i'm not one who has been out here talking to him about all of this it. i have no idea. i'm telling you what i think. >> what would your advice be to president-elect trump and if it is secretary of state tillerson on how to handle putin? is this a time for closer ties with russia? >> look, you are talking to somebody here who supports the current approach to russia. what russia has done. i have not been bashful about

that. i don't think if you -- if we can stand back and permit country fist they don't like what's going on in a neighboring country to roll the tax. i think that violates all norms of international behavior. i have been a supporter of the idea of sanctions and i will continue to be a supporter in terms of the national interest of the united states. >> let me go to two other trips around the world here. i want to start with china. donald trump has decided to be tough on china already. some see the phone call with taiwan as one level of provocation. he doubled down on it himself. what do you make of it? do you have warnings for him for saber rattling with china? >> we have a lot of things at stake. areas where we can cooperate with china and i'm thinking about north korea and trade and

i'm thinking about security in the pacific. there are a lot of areas where where we have tensions with the south china sea and tibet and human rights. my view is that the obama administration has done a pretty reasonably good job of cooperating with china where there is room for that cooperation. and managing the tensions that exist in the relationship. i do know this. it is extraordinarily important that the united states and china have the best possible relationship that they can important to both countries. i think that's the way i would approach this. and you need to approach it as a whole and not in discreet elements of the relaonship. >> and final foreign policy question for you. it has to do with israel and the american embassy.

apparently donald trump is serious about actually moving the embassy to jerusalem. what are the upsides and downsides if he goes through with this decision in. >> the downsides are you have to get along with a heck of a lot of arab countries surrounding israel with whom the united states has interests and relationships. that is snag runs counter to improving nose relationships or maintaining the relationships. on the other hand, it is something that is very important to the government of israel. they always would like to see an administration come into office and do that. he is going to have to make the same judgments. he will have to sit down and listen to his advisers and decide whether that is something he is going to do or whether

it's not listening to the pros and cons. the pros and cons on the arguments on both sides of the issue. >> before i let you go, you are very active in trying to essentially stop african elephant poaching. this is something you worked on when you were secretary of state and continuing to work on. what more needs to be done and what do you need done by congress and the administration? >> we need to do something about it. what i have done as secretary of state is what we ought to do again. push for and find a way to implement with other countries a global ban on the trade of ivory. that's the only they think is going to stop this. we did that and we saw great progress with the herds coming back for about eight or ten years and there were exceptions put into the ban and we lost the progress we made. today the situation is far more

dire. we need to take that kind of action again. >> secretary baker, i could go on and it would be nice to do that, but it's an honor to talk with you. i appreciate you sharing. >> my pleasure. thanks so much. >> talk soon. we will be back. we have a lot to chew over. back in a moment.

>> i'm obsessed with people who

work with their hands and not at a keyboard. i promise there will be a lecture on working class heroes. i want to talk about people who how people feel about whether their voices are heard. it's hard to believe, he is one of six states who voted forward jimmy carter or ronald reagan. those days are gone. west virginia made up of working class white voters was the most pro trump state in the country and their policies that republicans talk a good game. ultimately they are all about the rich. right now either these voters a party seen easy representing coastal elites.

>> i heard it all over, not just here in west virginia. he has given people a sense that their voices are being heard and people in washington are listening. at least they are listening. is donald trump going to be their champion? we don't know and they don't know yet. so far he won their trust and gratitude for simply listening. for now, that's enough for them. we will see if it's enough in two and years. we will be back after this. ♪ see ya next year. this season, start a new tradition. experience the power of infiniti now, with leases starting at $319 a month.

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back with a panel here with me now. bill, let me start with you. secretary baker, is he and gates and rice, are they big enough names for tillerson to overcome nervousness from rubio, graham,

and mccain? what have you heard that made you feel better? >> nothing much, honestly. this is not a matter of where you testify that someone is a good guy and he gets in the country club or he's a good guy to have at the bar. this is a serious job where your previous views and activities have to be looked at. they will take a serious look and a man with no foreign policy experience in government at all. he has not expressed many views in the issues. the only thing we have to go by is the ceo of exxon. there he has been a good butty and against sanctions. those create problems as matters of policy for a fair number of republicans on the hill and off the hill. >> i have to say you tell me. you have been around washington as long as i have. this feels like a nomination that is going to be tough to get

through. where do you assess things? >> this is a nomination where we will have hearings and be tough members of the foreign relations committee and want to talk to him about him about particularly policy but also a sense of his views on policy toward other parts of the world. i actually think the endorsements by james baker and bob gates and condoleezza rice are pretty important. these are highly respected figures, particularly in the republican party who are saying, this is a guy we think would be good in this job. you saw baker talking about managerial experience. so for tillerson to really have problems getting confirmed, he needs to fumble answering questions that russian policy or there needs to be something that comes out through the vetting that raises some questions. >> right. >> you know, one of the things senator joe manchin said to me about tillerson is that he wants to, he has no problems with him trying to have a better

relationship with people we don't get along. with his issue was he wants to make sure that tillerson won't be profiting from this job, essentially. those things. and he said that's the type of conversation he's heard among democrats. how hard should democrats work against tillerson? >> very hard. as hard as any trump nomination on the board right now. what we have here is this. tillerson' only pros for democrats is that he seems to interrogatory reality of climate change and he is in favor of the climate deal. so given the fact that if trump took us out of that deal, he would have to deal with the immediate consequences of that, i think that's important to note. at the same time you can't have a secretary of state that is close ties businesswise and perhaps even personally with a murderous regime. that's really what putin's regime is. and to support a murderous regime in syria with bashar al

assad. this is not someone we want to be close to. what democrats need to understand, to hype up those facts the severity of this. >> it was just interesting to hear him describe the putin regime the way he did. and i have noticed a fascinating split but i would argue it is inside the republican party on tillerson. it does seem as if the business wing is a lot more comfortable with tillerson than maybe the national security wing of the party. i've seen plenty of business republicans say, you know what? that's what changed china policy. business community, pushing this, they want to do deals with russia. >> they may be. or they're supporting the businessman or they don't think it is as important. what you think about what's happening in aleppo. some of us do. for me this would be a continuation of obama's policy.

obama's weakness with regard to putin and in general has led to this unbelievable season. and as far as we can tell, trump is comfortable with that and mr. tillerson might be comfortable with. that what is starting, it is, we have not had a secretary of state in modern times, arrest fas far back as i have been able to think who had no government experience or no foreign policy experience. or who had a record being in the foreign policy debates. is that a necessary i? of course not. someone could come in and do a great job but it is reasonable to have skepticism about it. and then look at the ties with russia. you can say no, mr. putin, i don't want to be accepting some order of friendship from you. the other recipients were a bunch of thugs and murderers. >> susan, i want to switch gears

slightly and that goes to how some democrats and the clinton campaign is reacting to the narrative we saw, the "new york times" yesterday. the narrative of the russian hacking plus the cia's allegation that it was more than just disruption. it was intended to help trump. but there seems to be a split in the democratic party of how hard to fight on this front. how hard to push president obama to be more aggressive on this. where do you think this falls? >> with additional disappointment, the "new york times" story this morning and elsewhere about the fact that the white house did not make this more public during the campaign. that they didn't make a bigger public deal of it. so voters and operatives and everybody were more aware of what was going on. i don't think that will happen. i think there's a sense that this is a really serious, this is an assault on our democratic

institutions and whether or not it had a real effect on the outcome of the election. and democrats are concerned once obama is out of the white house, it won't get scrutiny it ought to have. >> yeah. that's what i hear from some democrats. they think the obama white house lacks a sense of urgency on this. >> i think the democrats really lack a sense of you know urgence votes. this is happening right here at home. republicans have sponsored any number of different voting restrictions, 14 in this election alone. so let's take a look at what's happening here as well as what happened with russia. >> all right. i'm going to have to leave it there. i appreciate it. thank you much. doing this remote panel, this was fun. sorry you're not here in charleston. we have a lot more of mtp daily

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before we go, i want to give a big shout out of thanks to the black sheep burrito here. they've been gracious hosts for us. i want to thank all the folks i met today. we'll have much more from my trip this single on "meet the press" and we'll have more.

hello. it is 6:00 p.m. on the east coast. you're watching msnbc live and we have new reporting on donald trump's conflicts of interest. we'll hear from a democratic member of congress who says the government cannot wait to intervene on all this. also, face to face with a confessed killer. drama courtroom moments as the survivor in the mass shooting at a.m.e. church testified today. and big changes at the white house. and we're not just talking about trump moving in. donald trump said this would be the week he would make clear the distinction between his private business. then he lded. today he literally put those conflicts on display holding a meeting with tech executives and then bringing his kids to it. the same kids taking over the trump organization so that it is separate from government activities.