and i think perhaps we're going to see some great journalism come out of this period of time. >> all right. claire, eric, that is going to have to do it. thank you both for joining us. that brings us to the end of the hour. that's going to do it for us here in new york. tonight, do not miss lester holt's exclusive interview with president obama on air force one, the dateline nbc special barack obama the reality of hope. 10:00 p.m. eastern on nbc, mtp daily starts right now. >> if it's friday, doubts on the legitimacy of the presidential election hit a new level. tonight, a bomb shell declaration from congressman john lewis. >> i don't see this president-elect as a legitimate president. >> why this living civil rights icon and respected member of congress says the russians stole the election. plus, how russia has become a new test of republican allegiance to trump. >> is vladimir putin a war

criminal? >> should we ignore the lessons of hisy in our relationship with vladimir putin. >> do you think the russians were behind hacking into our election? >> finally, the future of political messaging. while political advertising will never be the same. this is mtp daily and it starts right now. good evening, i'm chuck todd here in washington and welcome to mpt daily on this auspicious friday 3th. it was nearly 42 years ago to the day that president jared ford bluntly told the nation this. >> i must say to you at the state of the union is not good. >> folks with just seven days until this inauguration, you could argue that american democracy and american leadership are facing a crisis of confidence. the likes of which we haven't seen in a very long time.

democrats have aggressively gone after trump. they've aired their grievances about policy, templement and the election process. it was clear that questioning the legitimacy of the office of the presidency was a line they would not cross. until now. today i spoke with democratic congressman john lewis in congress for an interview. he isn't your average house democrat. he's a civil rights legend and center of the democratic caucus. when he speaks, the caucus listens, now listen to this. you have forged relationships with many presidents. do you plan on trying to forge a relationship with donald trump? >> you know, i believe in forgiveness. i believe in trying to work with people. this is going to be very hard. very difficult.

i don't see this president-elect as a legitimate president. >> you do not consider him a legitimate president, why is that? >> i think the russians participated in helping this man get elected. and they have destroyed the candidacy of hillary clinton. i don't plan to attend inauguration. it'll be the first one that i miss. since i've been in the congress. you cannot be at whole with something that you feel that is wrong. >> it's going to send a big message to a lot of people in this country. that you don't believe he's a legitimate president. >> i think there was a conspiracy on the part of the russians and others to help him get elected. that's not right. that's not fair. open democratic process.

>> you're a man of action. you have been your whole life. do you believe this president is not legitimate. what would you tell young folks, young activists to do? >> i would say to young people, and i continue to say it today and i'm going to say it during the next few days is we celebrate and commemorate the birthday of martin luther king jr. when you see something that is not right and not fair, not just, off moral obligation to do something. we cannot afford to be quiet or to be silenced. >> what should be done? what should nancy pelosi, chuck schumer, what should barack obama do? >> we must not be silent. we all must act. >> folks, serious inflection point in the american democracy. it's a messy tangle and volatile situation. the office of the presidency is facing an unprecedented credibility crisis. the fbi is under review following allegations it meddled in the election. so is the department of justice. the intelligence community looks

like it's engaged in open warfare with the incoming commander in chief. they have kwked putin's russia hacked democratic institutions in an effort to help trump. fake news and failing piles of garbage for their reporting on the issue. congress says it's own credibility crisis and now the legitimacy of america's highest office is being publicly called into question by civil rights legend. let me bring in the panel. i want to see your reaction. >> you know, i think what john st. louis reacting to and what a lot of americans are reacting to is that we've learned a lot of information over the last several weeks. and in a informal course of business, you would have further investigation into this. you would have house committees,

you would have senate committees, actually look at these possibly to restore the legitimacy or answer the questions that people have before then. and what's -- what's odd about the moment we're in is that we both have these deeply troubling allegations that a foreign power was involved in our elections to help donald trump. that's not coming from me. that's not coming from hillary clinton. that is coming from government sources. that's coming from our intelligence agencies. and yet, we see a stone walling from republican leaders who had investigation after investigation, and i believe that stone walling is creating more questions than it's answering. and so i plead with leaders and republican party, republican leaders in the senate, republican leaders in the house to answer these questions, we need a bipartisan, independent

investigation that has republicans and democrats allowed to answer, ask questions, subpoena power, and that's when you'll get -- when we see all of this aired out, when we see answers in the public realm, then people who are perturbed about the results can have real answers. >> michael steele, was talking with colleagues today after i came back from this interview with john lewis. and it struck me, donald trump wasted the last two months. he had an opportunity to try to basically -- as one person said, make it so the asterisk doesn't stick. whether they are small or big gestures. the biggest one would be just say i want to get to the bottom of this too. >> absolutely. >> i think that is the most profound part about this. is that watching republican leadership just to your point, put of bricks in the wall has

been disturbing folks. my thinking is you want to get out there and expose that this did not happen. your suspicions are not founded. and yet, by their actions and their quiet, i guess support of what was coming out of russia or elsewhere, sort of denying this is feeding this mill. so when you see someone like a john lewis who's probably, you know, learning stuff as a member of congress and putting it together and you have other sources putting the stuff together, the narratives being created outside of them. >> right. >> and they're not controlling that going into inauguration and the first day of the administration, what are you dealing with? >> and there does seem to be this sort of -- momentum is a terrible word to use here, but a crescendo is probably -- crescendo where you had this week. john mccain, lindsey graham, marco rubio, controlled the messaging this week. >> rubio questioning tillerson is -- look, there are a lot of things obama's farewell speech, the trump press conferences, but if you're looking for something out of the hill that is the

moment, that's it. this is what i don't understand, it seems to me, and this is in line i think with the point, it seems to me that you can hold two things in your mind at the same time that donald trump is unwilling to do. the russians, according to to the fbi and the cia were hacking into democratic e-mails, john podesta, the dnc, with the expressed intent of hurting hillary clinton's chances and helping donald trump point one, point two, donald trump's victory does not necessarily need to be fully under -- you know, disqualified because of point one. trump is unwilling to grant -- i mean, he barely -- all the headlines said trump, finally. he basically said i think it's probably russia. i mean, it wasn't exactly like the strong -- >> declaration. >> and it's an asset that putin likes me. that was the press conference.

what i don't understand is point one can be true, you can have a bipartisan commission aimed at saying, it is -- we can all agree it is bad that a foreign power trying to hack into the election without saying, which is what john lewis is saying, point two which i wouldn't agree with, this is an ill legitimate presidency. they are not dependent on one another. >> and he is going to lead more people to -- give a permission slip to people that maybe wanted to say he was ill legitimate. >> i would just say to this though, it's because -- i mean, i once point one and two. the difference, i get it. it's the fact that he's unwilling, this meaning trump, unwilling to directly engage in this topic to state what facts are to continuingly take positions, to say great things about russia and putin. it is an interesting through line as of his sbar company the only area in which he's been really consistent is russia's

power. >> the washington examiner, i want to underscore your point. >> that is why people are think, he has something to side. >> i want to underscore your point here, washington examiner, conservative editorial page, something i was going to say for you guys a little later in the show. trump alone can clear suspicion over russia. this is what the examiner writing. trump needs to do more because at the moment it is hard to shake an uneasiness. he has lost the benefit of the doubt in this matter. he and allies are telling us to droord various allegations or asking us to ignore too many bits of corroborating evidence that is unseenly intimacy between trump and the corrupt regime. this was not the liberal, you know, "new york times" editorial page, this is the "washington examiner" a conservative publication. >> again, thing idea -- i was struck by the tone of the coverage from the press conference. which really, in truth, after being pressed repeatedly, he

said, i think it's russia, but it could be -- if you go and look at that sentence, and people are hacking all the time. okay. sure. right. like that is true. but we're not talking about all that, we're talking about in this particular instance in which every intelligence. >> reporter: translating broadly with the public right now. explain the power of john lewis as far as what his comments -- how they will resinate. >> i mean, he's -- i think he's a great moral leader for the country, but he's obviously a great moral leader for the party. and i think the challenges for folks is that, you know -- there's no reason to give the benefit of the doubt here. and every time we get a denial on hearings or investigations, it's just really feeding this. >> do you believe he's ill legitimate? do you feel too close to it?

>> i think i'm a little hard. >> reporter: i believe i was a victim of russian hacking. it's a little hard for me. >> totally agree, that's why -- >> the issue we now know is that from published reports, this is not fake news, published reports, the fbi did receive a warrant for two -- to investigate trump's connections, his campaigns connections to russia. >> report in the guardian -- >> it's a report in the guardian -- we've not been able to confirm this. >> it's not original dossier. it is a report -- >> nothing to do with the other aspect. >> it's a report. i want to be crystal clear. but it has not been denied, no one -- my only point is, there are all of these issues, many of them are ridiculous, many of them are very serious. there were a bunch of connections, reported them publicly between paul manafort and others. the point is people are going to continue to press on these going

into the future unless we get a public airing. and i don't know why -- >> who are these people? if it's anyone out of the clinton camp -- >> absolutely. >> east coast or the west coast, trust me, this is not going resinate with the trump supporters and voters out there. >> there is no question, if you looked at that press conference -- if you looked at that press conference, basically brb from his perspective, and people say it's not a game, i understand that, from his perspective, he wins this week. why? his confirmation -- people look like -- >> i disagree. >> this is the media. >> independent voters care about these issues. [ overlapping speakers ] . >> vikt have i a different thing in his world now. >> i'm going to sneak in a quick break here. when we come back, we're going to dig deeper into russia. by the way, catch more of my exclusive sit-down with congressman john lewis, of course this sunday on "meet the press." also interview with senator diane feinstein, as well as the

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welcome back. my colleague lester holt sat down with president obama on air force one earlier this week. it was all for a dateline nbc special that airs tonight. lester asked president obama about the moment he learned donald trump would be his successor. take a listen. >> tell me what happened that night watching those results when you realized that donald trump was going to win, was there an unvarnished barack obama at that moment? >> you know, you know there was just surprise. you know, generally speak iing not just me, but my team had been pretty good at seeing something coming.

and partly because just the polling so was off and the data was off. there was a surprise. i think the president-elect would be the first to acknowledge he didn't run a conventional campaign. and it's not clear that he or his team thought they were going to win. and so, so i think more than anything, it was just surprise. >> that dateline special, barack obama the reality of hope airing tonight at 10:00 p.m. eastern on your local nbc station. up next, new question about president-elect trump's team and their ties with russia. we'll be right back. with my moderate to severe ulcerative colitis, the possibility of a flare was almost always on my mind. thinking about what to avoid, where to go... and how to deal with my uc. to me, that was normal. until i talked to my doctor. she told me that humira helps people like me get uc under control and keep it under control when certain medications haven't worked well enough.

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perhaps a series of phone calls between michael flynn and russia's ambassador to the united states. on the same day that the obama administration announced tough new sanctions against russia including the expulsion of 35 russian diplomats. a phone call did happen, but they dispute the timing saying he spoke to him, but on date before sanctions were announced. and that the topic itself did not come up. we are joined now, david, let me start with that trump claim, contra addiction, what say you? >> i take the trump team at their word that it was the 28th of december not as i wrote the 29th. the 28th is the day in which many nudes organizations said that these sanctions were

eminent. the washington post -- >> the day -- irrelevant in this case. >> i think the day is irrelevant. the washington post wrote the day before the 27th that they were coming. so on a day when it was known that these sanctions were coming by the trump team's own account, the national security advisor does admit to general flynn had this conversation with the russian ambassador. that's undisputed. and the question is, you could make an argument from policy standpoint that, sure, you know, incoming national security advisor should do that. but the on very eve of the sanctions, was it right to have that conversation? that's the issue i tried to raise. >> not trying to out your sources here, but this indicates that there's some monitoring going on. people are leaking out of flynn world, people are leaking -- something's happening here. obviously there's some discomfort somewhere on this issue. >> i want to talk about sources,

and i don't know how my sources knew that there were such conversations between flynn and him. it does raise the speck or so that there's a lot of concern. >> i think there is a lot of concern. one of the things i was trying to say in any column this morning is at end of the this week, and the back and forth trump's understandable anger at the leaking of unsubstantiated material, but the continuing allegations and issues, it's really important that the american people know what's true and what's false. that in some way we have a resolution, people often talk about in the post-truth era, and trump says fake, fake news, it's really important to know what's real. and you do that by an investigation, either by congress or by the justice department or both. >> what is -- what kind of pressure is the obama -- outgoing obama administration feeling right now on this very

topic? >> i think a lot. and as i devilled into this more and more a little the last seven months, they've been under intense pressure for months. we didn't realize it. these allegations about russian hacking, about russian efforts to help trump and the possibility that people in the trump entourage were in touch with the russians have been around since late summer. and we now know that the obama administration authorized the intelligence agencies to brief the so-called gang of eight. the senior congressional leadership about these issues starting in september. so from september on, the obama administration has known that there was this intense effort to destabilize our political system by russia. why didn't they do more about it? and i think the answer is they were genuinely scared that if they move, the russians would

escalate in ways that they couldn't control and that the election itself might be vulnerable. >> are they missing the proverbial smoking gun here? because i've got to think if they truly had it, we'd know. considering the intensity of the situation right now. >> but if by that you mean if they had -- whatever -- >> whatever they had. definitive, the definitive proof of more than just what russia says. >> they've had some months to look at this set of allegations, like major news organizations, the washington post, nbc, other news organizations, they apparently have been unable to establish that the major allegations are true. it's my understanding, i wrote this morning in my alcohol um that the fbi investigation's remains open. does that mean it's still an active investigation? i honestly don't know. >> and there is an difference between open and active. >> something that's open has not formerly been closed. once it's closed, the fbi

director would be free to tell us that. >> and that's what he did. and there was a specific phrase he used actually when he was having his back and forth with angus king when he gave him a nudge on the whole idea of going -- we don't speak publicly about investigations, and then made note -- essentially made note of the clinton e-mail investigation and say it's different for closed investigations. that seemed to be the tip. >> well, i think that was a statement that this is not yet closed. when it is closed, there will be appropriately an aouncement as with the hillary clinton e-mail investigation. i think, chuck, the best guarantee that there will be a resolution of this, a firm-based for the country is the investigations to be appropriately completed. and the people who will guarantee that are members of the incoming administration. i think everybody watched carefully as general mattis about mike pompeo, the proposed cia director responded, and they gave very clear, direct answers

to those questions. and it's obvious they want to see this resolved just as a matter of national security. >> can it do your job if it's not? >> i don't see how -- i don't see how trump can have a successful presidency. it does take the issue that he wants to go forward with in terms of improving registrations with russia. people are going to be suspicious of that to the point that they're going to resist it, unless he has a resolution. unless he has a firm base of fact on which to base his policy. >> quite the scoop this morning. or it was last night as this was making the rounds. a the love reporters as always having it. >> thank you. >> thank you. seven of trumps cabinet picks had confirmation hearings this week, that the time, questions about president-elect trump's relationship with russia were front and center thanks in large part to three senators who drove the agenda all week. john mccain, lindsey graham, and marco rubio. >> do you think the russians were behind hacking into our

election? >> i have done no research into that. i've known just what the media says about it. >> do you think you could get briefed any time soon? >> well, i'll need to. >> i think you do too. >> is vladimir putin a war criminal? >> i would not use that term. >> there's so much information out there. it should not be hard to say that vladimir putin's military has conducted war crimes in aleppo. i find it discouraging, your inability to say that, which sing globally accepted. >> putin wants to be our enemy. he needs us as his enemy. he will never be our partner and he believes that strengthening russia means weakening america. >> is vladimir putin and the russians looking at all of this and saying we've done a really good job of creating chaos, division, instability in the american political process? >> i have no doubt that the discourse that's been taking place is something that vladimir putin would look at and say, wow, that was among the objectives that i had. >> let me bring back my panel.

the heart of the story is the -- is a man who has been at the center of controversy involving russia and that's michael flynn, the national security advisor and someone that seems to present some unease request with other members of the republican foreign policy assessment. >> and i would say, one of the seven hearings this week, one of the people who does not need to be confirmed. so look, i think this is the point here i made earlier. this is where there's smoke you have to answer too make clear that there is not fire. right. i mean, that's the issue here. it's that -- it's not an isolated incident. each of these things doesn't happen in a vacuum. i make no accusation there, but the dots are all there. it is up to someone senior, like donald trump to say look, beyond a tweet that says, ridiculous, fake news, this isn't about the media.

ultimately end of the day, you can make it about the media. >> and this is what makes this so -- it's obvious what the easy thing to do is politically. to let a little steam out. >> of course. >> it's obvious. >> to the chairman's point, get in front of it. >> it's easy. >> get in front of it. >> and that is -- it goes back to the editorial review, and that is the head scratcher. the obvious solution here, to essentially you could actually compartmentalize this for at least a while. focus an obamacare, whatever. >> my suspicion is what's driving this right now is exactly what you said. it's that number two. is that sense that donald trump has that this is all about delegitimizing his win. that this is about the only way you won is because you had -- >> that's what he told me last sunday. >> that certainly a positive explanation. let's be honest about that. >> until -- >> right the only other explanation --

>> there is some connection. >> the other explanation is much more nefarious, but you need a whole lot of evidence to make that real. >> okay. >> you just do. we've had that point that you can have all the documents throughout, but until it really gets -- like you said, drilled out in the public and you have the hearings, you have the independent review of what happened here, there's always going to be a suspicion, and that works to donald trump's advantage. as long as it's that little bit of suspicion, he can claim that. >> here's what's coming with, the rubber is going to hit the road because there is going to two things that hit his desk or attempted to his his desk. tougher sanctions against russia and the second is it's my understanding there is going to be a bipartisan bill that will come out of the senate calling for an independent commission on this. >> which he should be 100 incompetent favor. >> that's the big question, right? why doesn't he sign that? >> we'll see. >> i think the issue here is it's not just smoke. i mean, the things that we've seen so far this year is the

republican platform takes an extraordinary step on ukraine. his policies on syria, a significant difference. his language on russia. his language on nato. these are a bunch of policy positions for a person who has not been seriously consistent across the board, he has positions that align with russia, which is odd for a republican. he's allowing democrats to take the national security tough position here. and i think the challenge here is that it's just so obvious, it's months ago he should have said we should have had investigation. the fact that he refuses to do, and i think raises questions substantial questions because, it's so obvious -- >> so look, in the political problem you guys -- >> doesn't say yes to it, people are going to say forever it confirms -- >> to what end? does this go? so i mean -- >> when's he going to start losing republican support on capitol hill? >> clear the air. >> rubio on tillerson? is it something like that that has real impact.

you know. >> all right. you guys will be back. we might talk about something else. still ahead, the 2016 election broke a lot of rules, changed the political landscape. how will politicians change the way they work for your vote? and pay for that message. stay tuned. liberty mutual stood with me when i was too busy with the kids to get a repair estimate. liberty did what? yeah, with liberty mutual all i needed to do to get an estimate was snap a photo of the damage and voila! voila! (sigh) i wish my insurance company had that... wait! hold it... hold it boys... there's supposed to be three of you... where's your brother? where's your brother? hey, where's charlie? charlie?! you can leave worry behind when liberty stands with you. liberty stands with you™ liberty mutual insurance i've been fortunate enough to win on golf's biggest stages. but when joint pain and stiffness from psoriatic arthritis hit... even the smallest things became difficult. so i talked to my rheumatologist... and he prescribed enbrel...

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i had cases where i was tied or up in a poll, but she had spent in a state like 50 million and i had spent like 2 million. and they said, donald trump is not spending the money like -- and i'm saying wait, that's a good thing. >> political advertising, like so many other things after the 2016 election appears to have

forever changed. president-elect donald trump upended the campaign norm that winning means spending more on ads. donald trump spent about one-third less on ads than romney in 2012, clinton's campaign spent about the same amount as obama did four years earli earlier. obviously that didn't add up to success and the whole landscape of political advertising itself appears to have changed. how ad dollars were spent took a dramatic shift. essentially, this was the year that tv ad spending went to the direct ad smile style. still where the most ad dollars are spent, but overall, spending on broadcast tv ads dropped by 19%. spending on more niche, broadcast radio ads went down by 23%. direct mail, and dingal ad spending grew by a massive 789%. so what do the categories that grew have in common? they allow for the more precise voter targeting. the very nature of campaigning

has changed and it's going to keep on changing how campaigns spend money. kip casino tracked this shift. he's the author of this report. the final analysis, what happened at political advertising in 2016 and forever, mr. casino, welcome to the show, sir. >> thank you very much. >> so this is the campaign, when we look back and say this was the campaign that essentially where the way campaigns used to do direct mail is now how they do their tv advertising. where 100 ads to 100 different constituencies. >> that's pretty much it. what we've seen is a change in the way politicians that are thinking forward will look at how to spend their ad dollars. looking from -- instead of saying we've got to talk to everybody so that somebody will listen, we're just going to talk to the people who we know are going to vote for us and the

ones we to want vote for us and try and not talk to the other folks at all. >> there's at unintended consequence which means we also -- that means that persuasion ad is dead. that all advertising messages, if you can do this -- if this is where the trend is, then all advertising messaging is only going to be targeted to people that you think will agree with you. that is -- that will have reverbuations in the future. >> i think it will. i don't think we've seen the end of what's going on yet though. i don't think you can discount the fact that trump was a one odd phenomenon that his ability to get earned media is not something that's likely to be able related unless weir going to get a staple of movie star candidates. >> well, although that's

possible, we could have a trend setting on that front going forward, but let me go to what's next. so, if we saw sort of this was the year that broadcast tv got slash end a we saw the rise of more sophisticated cable targeting, the rise of more digital targets, what's next? what was the tiny slice that didn't exist ten years ago that's coming? >> i think what's coming is the consideration of mobile. the idea that you can reach people in their back pockets and pocketbooks instead of waiting for them to get in front of a screen. people haven't figured out how to do that very well yet. i think they will. >> and is there -- has there been -- what kind of testing do you feel like's been done, have they done enough. do they know that doing it this way truly has worked or are they moving into these categories before they know for sure this is the smartest way to go about

this? >> well, you know, you and i know, chuck, that advertising is basically research. you're trying to improve your message every time out. the beautiful thing about doing the stuff online is it allows you to test hundreds of thousands of times in a month. and that's exactly what the trump campaign did this time around. they actually were able to run 750,000 message tests in one month. >> was there less money spent because some of these entities, some of these platforms didn't know that they could charge more? and that essentially this will flatten out and you'll start seeing a rise again and the big money's going to be necessary to do digital? >> absolutely. i think one of the reasons we're seeing this leveling off is that

cable and digital are relatively cheap. >> all right. kip casino, it's fascinating trend spotting that you did. i think you're right this is the start of a new era. this will be one of those pivot points in the world of campaign advertising. appreciate the report and thanks for coming on. still ahead, republicans set the wheels in motion to repeal obamacare. but can the party rally around one replacement plan as john madden says, if you have two quarterbacks, you have none. when you have six plans, you probably have none. stay tuned.

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let's review: heat, plus relief, plus healing, equals thermacare. the proof that it heals is you. welcome back tonight, i'm obsessed with our obsession over superstitio superstitions. the first of two in 2017 by the way. two big horror movie friday debuts. lots of people consider the number 13 unlucky and friday the 13th is especially more unlucky for any number of ridiculous reasons that you could find on the internet. why buildings in the u.s., especially hotels don't have a 139 floor, why calling it the 14th floor when everybody knows it's the 13th floor makes people less afraid. i have no idea. did they see the mooif saturday the 14th. apparently it does. but it's not just the number 13 that strikes fear in the hearts of the superstirks. in chinese culture, it's four that's unlucky. some buildings that dater to a chinese clientele have gone

above and beyond to make chinese customers feel more comfortable. las vegas, the hand lay bay doesn't have a fourth floor. or an any of the floors in the 40s. the elevator actually goes from 39 to 50. i'm not kidding. not everyone is determined to avoid unlucky numbers. today, in what the london telegraph suggested might be the unluckiest flight ever, friday the 13th travelers took feign air flight 666. not a fiery pit as satan levels. wasn't anymore hellish than it usually is. the two pilots, last names were kennedy and lincoln. anyway, for all you superstitious people out there, happy friday 13th. we'll be right back. to feel this special... you need to eat this special. ♪ i love it kellogg's special k... ...made with whole grains and fiber

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time for the lid the time is back: >> i get it it's friday helsinki because going to take helsinki let go to rubio are both considered potential okay helsinki that's enough -- while he didn't think tillerson was that great fears

what would come after what do you say to that kind of thinking? >> i say if he votes against tillerson a lot of progressives will be shaking their heads, if he delivers the vote for somebody to answer basic questions and that that's -- i think that's a very difficult position. there are a lot of conde rice, bob gates, and making a lot of democrats feel comfortable. >> at the end of the day he did ha he had to do in the committee. >> i think he did. >> he believed what he had to believe and did what he did on

the econocommittee, i do in the them pulling away. >> i think what will happen, the argument for that is i address many of my concerns helsinki in the interim, i have spoken with him and with bob gates who have assured me -- that's the political way out helsinki i think he may take it. >> he setup the questions that when you do the questions, the toughness of the questions, you can't argue that i'm standing on principal by voting for the guy who you made difficult for him -- he didn't ask open-ended question, he prosecuted the case. >> that's fine. >> that happens all the time. >> i would not be so convinced

that mccain and graham, bob gates would have a lot of impact. i think considering where r e rubio is, i think it's more likely that one or both of them. >> unless it's indik kaive -- unless it's indiktive of a broader. >> if that happens where does trump go next? >> that's the easiest way -- >> i think there's an interaction between the forces, the lest we can get answers, they creates more pressure on the tillerson vote. >> i think that's right, i think that's outside force here,

careful of the latter. after the break questioning the -- stay tuned rodney and his new business.

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incase you missed it, congressman john lewis said donald trump he does not believe is a legitimate president of the russian meddling of the election. it's not first time a president's legitimacy has been questioned. in a lot of people questioned the legitimacy of his victory, this happens every time popular vote moves into the white house. saying in 1888 when you may remember the occasional cry of file in the 2000 when george w. bush won the election. a lot of people did not accept the idea that the vice president john tyler or any vice president could legitimacy ascend to the presidency. a lot of people called him a an acting president. some republicans claim to doubt president obama citizenship and therefore the legitimacy of his right to serve in the office of the presidency. none of this is meant to pass judgment it's just to remind us this isn't the first time

someone question the legitimacy of the presidency. this won't be the last. it doesn't make it any less shocking to some of us when you do hear it from people with big influence. that's all for tonight. we'll be back monday with more "mtp daily." for the record with greta starts right now. >> thank you chuck. "for the record" tonight, intriguing questions, about keeping your friend or is it about keeping enemies closer. raise is on to dump obamacare. a young girl suicide streamed