also testifies. the u.s. air force launches into space a satellite to provide critical warnings on missiles. that does it for orbit. that does it for us on this thursday. "morning joe" is in washington! it starts right now. at the end of the day, if we work hard and true to those things in us that feel true and feel right, the world gets a little better each time and that is what this presidency has tried to be about. it is true behind doors i curse more than and get frustrated and mad like everybody else does, but at my core, i think we are going to be okay. we just have to fight for it and we have to work for it and not take it for granted and i know

you will help us do that. thank you very much, press corps! good luck! >> wow. >> good morning. >> that was loaded. >> welcome to washington's hair club for men. i'm joe, along with jeremy. >> yeah, a lot of -- >> jeremy, three people today, jeremy, that would like to have a beautiful golden coiffe like you. their name is richard, and michael. how are you doing? >> we do just fine. >> i think you guys look handsome! >> the original members of the club! >> yes. >> just fine as you are. sometimes when you have hair like jeremy's, you look like you tried too hard. >> no, he doesn't! i just rolled out of bed! >> how did you get up, joe? >> oh, yeah, right. >> come on. >> louis, he does that too. >> louis, hires an architect! >> you need a ladder to do

yours. >> can we do this again? >> who is on the set? >> mike. >> michael. >> jeremy. >> yep, jeremy with the great hair. >> and richard. >> and richard haass who is screaming at the front of the "wall street journal" editorial page. >> sad. >> that says "don't make any sudden statements, mr. president. >>." he has a new book out so you might want to consider this perhaps partners with the book, "on a world in disarray" which is a good way to frame the debate. we are following the very latest on the condition of former president george h.w. bush and his wife barbara as they both remain hospitalized in houston this morning. we are going to go live there in a few minutes. >> i think we have a difference of opinion on this. what were your thoughts when when you heard the president say hey, everything is going to be okay? >> i did not think that was a good statement at all. i think it was an honest

statement but i think it was -- you heard what he said afterwards. we have to fight -- we have to move forward and a lot going on in there. first of all, we are going to be okay means everybody stop -- try to not be afraid because i know you are. and i think that he leaves office, it's extremely bittersweet and it's also probably a very sad time because for eight years, he's been building policies and ideas and developing around the values of this country and i think that many people in the democratic side of the aisle are worried that everything is in question. >> i think there are -- i think there are people very concerned just like there were people that are always concerned. mika, you and i, we always say this in speeches, we have spent the last ten years telling everybody it's going to be okay. people came up to us literally

after barack obama got elected and i had republicans saying this guy is a socialist. everything is going to be okay! >> when you say everything is going to be okay, you're saying it might not be. >> no, i'm not and neither is the president. >> really? >> two years later after the tea party won, we heard the same ing. we heard the same thing in 14 and now hearing it in '16 we lost. it chaps. let's fight and work and get back into place. everything is going to be okay. i thought he sounded reaganesque yesterday. i tweed this. i believe in this country. i believe in the american people. i believe that people are more good than bad. that's barack obama. it's an inspiring message. mike, i wrote a column about this two years ago, a it was sick and tired of people -- two years before i even knew donald trump was going to run for president, sick and tired of

people always saying the country is going to help because their sights are not the white house. >> well, that was quite a display yesterday from the president of the united states. the outgoing president of the united states and capsulated so much. and mornl respect for the office and an understanding and a communicative ability to tell the people the weight of the office, including to the incoming administration. quite a display. >> respect for the office, michael steele, respect for the institution and respect for the process. that has elected a man that has people in barack obama's orbit and a lot of people in the media's orbit terrified right now. >> it does. it was interesting. go back and look at some of the early interviews and certainly the press conferences that the president did in the beginning of 2009 and you can compare that

to yesterday and what mike was saying, in the sense that sobering understanding of the weight of the office. i think he has tried to ga some of that the laugh few months. he asked about his legacy. he wants it to be a part of the american fabric but recognizes to your point, joe, that transitions happen and change comes and throughout it all, we are going to be bigger and better and stronger. now what is going to be interesting, i think, for people on the other side whether democrats or in disarray where do we go, or the republicans assume maybe too much. now that we have the white house, the congress, and the senate, about what we are going to do next. i think there's some lessons to take from some that. >> i think the lesson for the media is and for political elites that have missed this all along is you've got to always remember. i heard some people talking last night, everybody is scared. everybody is scared. listen. >> there is an uncertainty.

>> here is the deal. you have to always remember people are scared in manhattan. a lot of them are excited on staten island. people are scared in palm beach county, but drive one county north, just go one county morning north to martin county, there are a lot of people excited. i'm not saying one group is right and one group is wrong. i'm saying i'm so tired of people saying this is what reporters need to do. no, reports need to report on the facts and they need to realize that there are tens of millions of people out there who have a different world view and if they understood that, mika, they would not have been so shocked when ronald reagan got elected and george w. bush got reelected or donned j. trump got elected. >> at some point we should talk about the march that is being planned. it's a little bit controversial given what you're said.

>> i think people should be able to march fept to. >> president obama made clear the markers that would cause him to speak out after he leaves office. >> is there a difference between that normal functioning of politics and certain issues or certain moments where i think our core values may be at stake. i put in that category if i saw systemic discrimination being ratified in some fashion, i put in that category explicit or functional obstacles to people being able to vote and exercise their franchise. i put in that category

institutional efforts to silence dissent or the press. i would put in that category efforts to round up kids who have grown up here and for all practical purposes, are american kids and send them someplace else, when they love this country, they are kids' friends and they are classmates and are now entering into community colleges or, in some cases, serving in our military. the notion that we would just arbitrarily or because of politics punish those kids when they didn't do anything wrong themselves, i think, would be something that would merit me

speaking out. >> richard, so many in politics about contrast. when you run against somebody you have to contrast against them. president obama was attacked so much for being a constitutional lawyer. now with the age of trump donning, a contrast and the american people are, obviously, saying that doesn't sound too bad. he is up in 60 percentage points. 60% and finishing 56% and finishing as strong as any president in a while. >> the style, we talked a little bit about george herbert walker back in the hospital. it's old school and a certain style and it's a low-keyed presidency in many ways and, obviously, the contrast between low key and what we are walking into is palpable. >> jeremy, he believes he owes

the next president the same silence that george w. bush gave him, and you can tell that is the right thing to do. >> he has been really the leader on that. >> that george w. bush gave him. that said, there were some very important caveats. you can hear him say i'm going to give him that silence unless you have to speak out on these critical points. >> i think you're getting at the subtler message what president obama was saying to democrats, do not expect me to be the leader of the opposition here. i'm not playing the bernie sanders and elizabeth warren rule. i'm going into retirement and speak out as people close to the president have said in recent days, only there are issues that i feel are so urgent and important that shake me at my political and philosophical core. i think he touched on those issues that have to do with

deporting people and he feels trump's philosophy is at odds with core democratic yideals. >> he went on in that press conference for two or three minutes with rhetoric that if hillary clinton had used the same rhetoric during the course of her campaign, it may have had a different result, the election may have had a different result because he addressed those who were left behind and lost in the system who feel their children have been neglected and won't do as well as they have done in this country. he was patalking to pennsylvani ohio, michigan, and wisconsin. >> he really was and maybe he doesn't have a role up front for democrats, but the party could really use him and people like david axelrod and david plouffe who saw this coming. by the way, while everybody said they were shocked that donald trump was going to win, at least

during the primary process it was david axelrod who said this guy could win and that, of course, when trump thanked axelrod for his support. trump does not a lot. if you say that he has a chance to win. plouffe said it. john favro at some point saying it. >> even the vice president. >> by the way, the vice president, mike, as you know the guy very well, not only said it, he was very worried about it when you were flying into scranton that hillary clinton had not spoken to the people she needed to speak to to win. >> one of the vice president's gift he has a home depot mentality. he goes home almost every weekend to wilmington, delaware. he will go to home depot himself to pick up a hammer or something like that and he has that sidewalk level gut instinct and he was deeply bothered and

cognizant of the fact prior to the election that that thing was going south. >> you know what biden is getting home, michael steele, on saturday? >> amtrak? >> i love it. >> he is going amtrak. >> this is great. >> i've ran into him a few times. >> he is going to leave the way he came in. >> i think it's important not to overlook as the former party chairman. i appreciate what you said about the president saying that, you know, i'm not going to be the guy, you know, to lead you out of this particularly wilderness. he led them into that wilderness he didn't do the thing he should have done, instead of taking obama for become outside of the dyc he should have built that infrastructure inside and whether or not hillary clinton wanted it is a separate matter but the party would be in a different place because of the ground game and bench for the party would have been developed over eight years and it wasn't. >> let's get an update on former george h.w. bush and mrs. bush who remain in a houston hospital this morning.

the president was admitted on saturday after experiencing shortness of breath and, yesterday, he was transferred to the icu where doctors had to clear a tube to clear a blockage in his lungs. the complication stemming from pneumonia. nbc news was told the president was still sedated last night and doing well. >> doctors believe the procedure, itself, was a success. and so now the president is stable resting comfortly in the icu and remain there for observation and under a better trajectory than the one that landed him in the icu. as for mrs. bush, it's a cautionary measure to have her there at the hospital. she woke up this morning with a coughing fit and also some fatigue and just general unease. and she decided to let the medical experts take over on that one too. so she is down there as well. >> joining us from the hospital in houston, nbc news correspondent gabe gutierrez. gabe, are you hearing anything this morning about their

condition so far? >> reporter: good morning, mika. we are still hearing that george h.w. bush is stable in the icu and as you heard jim mention, he seems to be rest be comfortably in the icu. he had been in the hospital several days and had not been made public until yesterday morning. he took a turn yesterday and doctors had to deal with the blockage in his lung. well wishes are pouring in from around the world. yesterday, a letter that he sent, the president-elect donald trump became public. he even joked with the president-elect that he couldn't make it to the inauguration because he would get in trouble with his doctors. the weather, of course, in january in washington. but he wished the president-elect well and said that he would be with mr. trump and the country in spirit. donald trump responded on twitter a few hours later wishing the bushes a speedy recovery and thanking him for the letter and president obama sent him his well wishes during his final news conference

yesterday afternoon. take a listen. >> we have been in touch with the bush family today after hearing about president george h.w. bush and barbara bush being admitted to the hospital this morning. they have not only dedicated their lives to this country, they have been a constant source of friendship and support and good counsel for michelle and me over the years. they are as fine a couple as we know, and so we want to send our prayers and our love to them. really good people. >> as i mentioned, well wishes are pouring in across the world. hillary clinton tweeting out late last night that she wanted the bushes back on their feet, color socks and all. bush 41 known for his colorful footwear. back to you. >> nbc's gabe gutierrez, thank you. wishing for the best there. thank you very much. >> richard, obviously, you

worked for president bush 41. tell us about him. >> we were talking about the respect for the office. it was during the gulf crisis after saddam invaded kuwait and i got a call saying the president needed to see you right away. he says, what are you doing? i said, john, you just called me to see the president. go back to your office and put your jacket back on. he doesn't want to see you or anybody else in the oval office without your jacket on. just a since of decorum. he had a conscious sense. he was a custodian and steward of the office. the presidency was there for him and for him there after he left office. very sensitive always whether it was gorbachev at the moment or he end of the cold war. always very sensitive of the political situation of others. he knew what he wanted to get and he also understood that other people had ploks and holi

his job was to manage other people's politic to get where they wanted to get. >> i'm working on a oral history where i interviewed a dozen people about their impressions of the first hundred days recently. dee dee myers put this in contrast transition from one white house to the next is so different. bill clinton got into trouble for wearing short sleeves in the oval office because the bush office was so buttoned down and stayed. here is plk coming in in blue jeans and pants instead of skirts for women and caught hell for it. >> we have so much more to cover here. still ahead on "morning joe," extremely contentious confirmation hearings yesterday as democrats cashed cla with more of donald trump's cabinet picks. rick perry's confirmation hearing is today for energy secretary burr did he even know what the job entails? there is some questions about that. >> i'm sure he did. >> no, no, he didn't. >> i'm sure he did. >> no, he didn't.

>> also the outgoing secretary jeh johnson will join us. >> we are in the dubliner bar tomorrow just as we have every four years, eight years ago, to cover the inauguration. we were and we have a picture and horrifying how much we have changed. a huge lineup including house minority leader nancy pelosi and here is a list of those who will be joining us torrow at 6:00 a.m. right here on msnbc. only this time, we will be sitting at the bar! you're watching "morning joe." we will be right back. thanks for loading, sweetie.

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♪ donald trump nominated his last cabinet spot yesterday. trump announced former republican governor of georgia

sonny perdue for agriculture secretary. the confirmation of james mattis says secretary of defense is speeding ahead, headed to a full senate after resounding approval by the senate armed services committee. today there are hearings for treasury secretary steve mnuchin and energy secretary nominee pick rick perry. >> i still believe, jeremy, mnuchin is going to have most kely very, very bumpy ride. >>h, absolutely. i wonder what the bumps mat in the end, though, joe. because if you talk to democrats before the tom price hearings, they were really optimistic that price could be the guy, maybe they would only get one they knocked down but price was going to be the guy but doesn't look like that is going to happen. the democrats are so impotent to defeat them. whether tom dash not paying

taxes or one hiring a nanny. these seem quaint. >> cute little problems. >> and they are going to sail through. >> what do you hear on betsy devos who did damage to herself, according to a lot of people? >> i think in the end i think she will be fine. there is a sense inside the inner circle the confirmation did not go as smoothly as possible and obvious to anyone who was watching. what is interesting there you saw where the base of the democratic party is. you had bernie sanders and elizabeth warren going after her on some really, really key issues that are vital to their core constituency. to what effect? >> that is an acid test for republicans. you see jeb bush coming out. you gee see other people who have been harshly critical of donald trump actually coming out full throat in support for betsy devos. this is about teachers unions versus school choice and i would be shocked to see any republican

defect whatsoever. >> yeah. >> you know what was kind of interesting, though? >> despite the fact she had a really shaky, at times, embarrassing performance on the hill. >> yeah. and during the course of those hearings, you saw off of jeremy's point, an interesting tangent on the democrats as they proceed further without barack obama. you had bernie sanders and elizabeth warren very intens very ideologically driven and you had a question asked sidewalk guns and rules and i think everybody was stunned watching her response. >> it should not have stunned somebody prepared for that position. there have been supreme court decisions that have talked about the inability to limit where guns are sold close to schools. this has been discussed a

thousand times. >> i don't even they she seemed stunned, that is the part that is a little -- that was a little concerning. >> just unprepared. >> she actually very strongly about what she was saying and it was -- it sounded with great respect, it sounded ridiculous in the context of hearing this from the senator from connecticut. it really did. that is, i think, the more concerning part is that she didn't seem to get that. >> she will pass. i think mnuchin's bigger problems are that donald trump is a populous. and you're going to have if people do their homework that undercuts that central narrative and in so doing, then do you get two or three republicans bolting saying i'm not voting for this guy? by the way he is not a democrat so why should i vote for mnuchin in i owe him nothing. i think that is why he may be in

danger. >> in his confirmation hearing today, rick perry is expected to tout his experience running texas, one of the world's biggest economies and a power center in global center age, particularly petroleum. he is likely to face questions about his previous calls to get rid of the energy department as well as his commitment to renewable energy sources but "the new york times" says the former governor may not graph what is taking on. the paper reports that he believes he was taking on a role as global ambassador for the american oil and gas energy that he had long championed in his home state. in the days after, mr. per peri discovered that he would be no such thing that, in fact, if confirmed by the senate he would become a steward of a vast national security complex he knew almost nothing about, caring for the most fearsome weapons on the planet, the united states' nuclear arsenal. >> so there is that. >> the times notes that perry's

predecessors were limbauuminari n nuclear science. one was earnest moniz. >> i think perry was there a couple of years. >> and led cheers at texas a&m university. >> that is sort of written in a snide way, isn't it? >> that was snidely written but it's a very good parallel to give you a sense where we are going here. >> before the man is discounted as a cheerleader, let us remember he ran one of the largest economies in the world in texas. i'm not defending him. what i have selected him as to run the energy department? no. in rick perry, you have a man who has had decade worth of experience in running some of the largest state bureaucracies in america. >> it seems an uncomfortable

fit. >> well, yes, it is. but, please, let's not act like this guy doesn't have the ability to learn what he is going to be running and run it effective. would he be my first choice? no. he would not be my tenth choice but let's not discount him as aing fool that doesn't know how to run things. >> i think he would surprise a lot of americans to find out the energy secretary is responsible for the nuclear arms arsenal. i think if you were to poll the average person they would say, it's about renewables or it's about this or that. >> what is he doing there? >> oh, my god. i think they are giving a lot of breaks here. >> that is the more important question, why does the energy department control the nuclear arsenal? >> because all this comes out of things nuclear. they oversee more than a dozen labs where the most advanced research goes on in this country. technicalically, it could be in the defense department and a certain argument for that and it's tens of billions of dollars a year, thousands and thousands of people, it's a big security issue and a big scientific issue and developmental issue.

but you've got an entire staff, the deputy secretary traditionally has done a lot of it' the case now and thousands of civil servants who do it. the energy secretary, look at ernie he was the adviser on the iran nuclear talks but his counterpart were managing those negotiations every inch of the way. governor perry has to decide what is his share of the portfolio and what is his deputy and other people are going to handle. >> part of his appeal to trump in the first place and the people around tmpru is that rick perry said he wanted to dismantle the department. trump's destroyer in these cabinet positions. rick perry is one of the chief among them. you have ray pruitt at the epa and people come into their new jobs and betsy devos to come into the education. >> this is the real thing of like the dream of 1994 which was

abolish the energy department and abolish the department of education and send the power back to the state. abolish energy and send the important work to the pentagon. this actually, again, it underlines just how ideologically conservative the cabinet picks are and what a surprise that is coming from donald trump. >> the interesting thing is just like 1994 and other times, i think we will be waiting a long time for those invitations for those closing out ceremonies. >> not going to happen. >> right. not going to happen. the question is how do you manage the department of energy and epa and the department of energy on how these institutions run relative to communities across the country and putting that power back in their hands may be looking at breaking parts of energy and doing certain things differently. maybe changing the way epa engages.

that is about the extent of it. >> spinning off the parts they don't think washington should do and sending those parts either to the pentagon or on education back to the classrooms. that will be the argument. >> it would seem there are two critical points here. who is the going to be the assistant secretary of energy to run that thing on a day-to-day basis? it's not rick perry. the other aspect when you think about it in terms of streamlining government, it makes no sense to have our nuclear weaponry in that department, given the fact we are dealing every single day, contentiously and increasingly contentiously with russia which has a stockpile of nuclear weapons. why is is not the nuclear arsenal under either state or on defense? >> again, this is all of the labs and future war head and war head testing and you could argue the pentagon has enough on its hands right now given all of the things in the in box of the secretary of defense. if it ain't broke, don't fix it. so many things going on that are facing this administration.

>> might be time to fix it. >> no. it's like redecorating the operating room while the patient is on the table. they have enough to worry about without necessarily dealing with organizational issues whether this or the intelligence community. i actually don't think it's a time to start reorganizing the u.s. government. >> if that is not the case then rick perry needs a very strong number two over there and northbound who has won a enough nobel prizes. >> you can do that. >> it doesn't seem like an exact fit. i'm just going to say. coming up, congressman tom price, the man expected to help reshape health care in america, faces tough questions over his plans for the affordable care act. and his stock portfolio and we will talk about that when jake sherman joins the table. richard haass has new advice for the president. quote. don't make any sudden moves. please. that is straight ahead in the must read opinion pages.

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joining us now is senior writer at politico and co-author of "the playbook" jake sherman

with us. are you ready for a big week in washington? >> i'm very ready. >> are you excited? >> i'm not excited for the traffic and i'm going to try to avoid -- >> don't leave your house. >> let's talk about tom price and donald trump's pick for the hhs secretary. obviously, had rough hearings. sort through it, though. it's a little confusing. now there appears to be two stocks. one stock, he claims that his broker purchased. but the second stock, he admitted that he purchased himself. is that correct? >> yeah, this is a huge problem. i don't know why any sitting member of congress is trading actively in stocks. they probably shouldn't be allowed to. the big issue is chris collins, the congressman from new york who is close to donald trump is on the board of this company and bragging the other day in the speaker's lobby how many millionaires he has made in buffalo in front of the other people. they say he provided tips to tom price.

but it was all public information. listen. this is not going to sink him but it's not good. >> here is the exchange between patty murray and price about the disputed stock. take a look. >> did representative collins tell you anything that could be considered, quote, a stock tip? yes or no. >> i don't believe so. no. >> well, if you're telling me he gave you information about a company, you are offered shares in the company at prices not available to the public, you bought those shares. is that not a stock tip? >> that's not what happened. what happened was that he mentioned -- he talked about the company and the work that they were doing in trying to solve the challenge of progressive secondary multiple sclerosis. i studied the company a period of time and felt it had some significant merit and promise and purchased the initial shares on the stock exchange. >> congressman, you told me you did this on your own without the broker. yes? >> no. i did it through a broker.

i directed the broker to purchase the stock but i did it through a broker. >> you directed the broker to purchase particularly that stock? >> that's correct. >> she did a good job. >> very good friend of my -- >> i yo eknow people don't like about when i was in congress but i'm going to talk about when i was in congress. if i was sitting on the house floor and a guy came up to me and started talking stock tips, no, i'm serious. i would turn to him and say, hey, i can't even say what i would say to him. but the words would be. >> thank you. >> >> do your -- and then i would say something else and the last word would be job. i wouldn't yell but i'd say, hey, do your job. what are they doing talking about stock tips? i'm dead serious here. >> we are missing something. >> in an area where he has more power than other members of congress?

this really smells terribly. and if i were a constituent of his, i mean, what the hell are doing talking to other members of congress about stocks you're going to buy while you're representing the people? >> the problem is he going to be hhs secretary as obamacare is repealed and replaced and everything he does is going to come under a microscope and that is not something that donald trump needs right now as he takes on this huge herculean task. >> you can talk to hundreds and hundreds of people i worked with in the house of representatives over four terms, never once will they ever say, hey, joe was talking about his financial situati situation. >> you didn't have any money. >> since then, they have passed a stock act. surprising this kind of stuff, a lot of it, at least, was not explicitly outlawed. so when with tom price did it, democrats are alleging that he possibly did violate the stock

act, which is a huge problem, if we were living in a different era. i don't think there is anything that can stick to these nominees now. >> this is bad, bad form. >> it's bad form but the bar has been lowered. >> neighbor it shouldnmaybe it lowered. you know who can raise the bars? the senators who are making these decisions. >> who are advising and consenting whether it's mnuchin or whether it's price, and maybe price has been -- maybe this is an unfair attack. maybe there is information i don't know about, but it sure sounds bad. i would not vote for a guy that was getting stock tips on something he was voting on when he was in the house of representatives. >> absolutely. and i totally get it and agree with you. but the question is where does the energy to support that position come from? because it's not coming out of the public. the public is not outraged and

concerned about this. >> they should be. >> the incoming administration not outraged and concerned about this because they made the nomination. >> how about a republican showing some spine saying this is not the party we are? >> how does that stand in contrast to the incoming president who very simple hasn't even showed us his tax returns, right? that is the counterargument that a lot of people have. so they sit back and go, if that doesn't matter, why should this matter? >> jake, i'm going to the senator specifically. if they don't like the fact that donald trump hasn't released his tax returns and don't like the fact there isn't -- that questions about russia have not been answered, i mean, it seems to me the reaction to that is not, well, just the hell with it, let's throw the baby out with the bath water, it would be let's hold the standard high where we can. but are there no republicans that are going to be doing that in a case like this? >> in the short, no. why did the incoming trump administration, why didn't they

know about this. >> because the core of what they stand for is to eliminate the kind of corruption that allows people in public service to enrich themselves. that is at the core of donald trump's political philosophy, his campaign and what people voted for. >> conflict of interest all over it and it's legal corruption and it's part of a larger pattern where congress often exempts itself from the same sort of things that mere americans have to deal with. it's one of the reasons their ratings are what they are. >> jake, before we go, you have great text here in the playbook. getting an office near the oval office? some concerned about this? and hotel information. trump hotel. >> i think whole picks is probably the most underrated trump staffer. i think she is going to be a huge gateway to donald trump because donald trump trusts her. >> yes, he does. >> i think people have tried to push her out for a long time. >> not going to happen? >> doesn't work, does it? >> it ain't going to happen. >> a lot of people have been pushed out and hope is still

there. >> it is remarkable and i think every time i ask a question in the trump world, i get -- you should go to hope and talk about that. so i think that is a very telling thing. i think on the hotel issue which is a playbook classic, there is a lot -- no hotels are sold out. i think the ritz and the four seasons probably are. steven wynn in the hotel last night. the trump hotel is not letting reporters in this week which is an interesting element for trump, inc., as we like to say. >> wow. fascinating, jake sherman, thank you. i don't get it. >> daniel litman, our colleague at politico tried to go in with a breakfast meeting with a friend yesterday and they said are you a reporter? he said, yes. they said, reporters aren't allowed this week. >> why? >> i don't know. it's a government building so donald trump is taking over the government so i don't expect much recourse. >> a government building, they don't have a right to do that. >> they don't and it's bad. it's chilling. it shouldn't happen. >> shouldn't reporters all just

go there for breakfast? >> that's where i had breakfast today. >> apparently you can't make a reservation. the reservation on on the open table, if you call the restaurant, have been sold out for weeks. >> and drinks are expensive so maybe they will take their business elsewhere. >> coming up on "morning joe." >> what i'm saying is nato is obsolete. nato is obsolete and it's extremely expensive to the united states. disproportionately so. we should readjust nato. >> donald trump just doubled down on those comments from back in march. now nato's secretary of state general is punching back. msnbc keir simmons brings us that interview from davos switzerland, next on "morning joe."

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do you agree with president-elect trump that nato is obsolete or do you agree with general mattis that it is vital? >> i think nato is an important

alliance for us to have and now we need more allies than ever and we need more alliances than we have ever had and i think it's one we need to strengthen. >> that was south carolina governor nikki haley yesterday at her confirmation hearing to become the next ambassador to the united nations. >> what are you hearing, mike, about her? >> perhaps the world's snarkyest town washington, d.c. i was heard yesterday that nikki haley makes sarah palin sound like henry kissinger. >> yikes. that's harsh. >> we started hearing several weeks back real concerns for the people who were preparing her over her complete ignorance of foreign policy. she certainly seemed to go through the hearing very well yesterday. but foreign policy experts that were working with the trump team to prepare her were shocked by her lack of knowledge of matters

dealing with foreign policy. >> joining us from davos, switzerland is keir simmons. >> reporter: you speaking to the secretary-general you know he has to work with the next president, and yet knows the next president has described the organization he leads as obsolete. interestingly what he told me was he spoke to donald trump after the election. i said to him, did the president-elect say to you that he believes what he was speaking to you on the phone, mr. secretary of state general, i think nato is obsolete? he said, no, he didn't say that and he had some strong words in response to that kind of description of nato. take a listen. >> nato is the most successful alliance in the history, because we have been able to constant change. for 40 years, nato is about

tleskt defense in europe until the end of the cold war in 1989. then ought hear and helped end the conflict in other areas and terrorism and now again to this and stepping up our efforts to fight terrorism. so nato is strong because we are constantly changing. i'm looking forward to working with the new president of the united states to continue to change nato, both in in terms of defense spending and also in fighting terrorism. >> reporter: you heard him reference terrorism. during that interview, he hit every talking point that the president-elect has been raising. he hit the issue of defense spending by european countries. he hit the idea of nato pivoting more towards fighting terrorism. so he talked about dialogue with russia. for those people who talk about donald trump as a bull in a china shop you have the secretary-general of nato who

seeming to move toward donald trump's view of the world. guys? >> wow. nbc's keir simmons, thank you for bringing us that interview. >> i think it would behoove foreign policy experts, richard, as well as journalists and people trying to sort through what donald trump said during the transition to take angel merkel's position which is we will wait until this man is sworn in as president and then judge him by his actions. we are not going to follow twitter and we are not following the interviews. we are going to wait and see. it's all just too confusing and conflicting. he also says nato is very important. there is a seemingly contradiction on about every issue. >> but a fairly consistent criticism of alliances. the idea that the allies -- i thinks there a -- where i take issue with mr. trump that basically our return on investment isn't good, that he looks at all of the things we do in the world and says look at all of the costs and it's not worth it. i would simply say i think nato is one of the great investments

in american history. we have helped to keep the stability in europe. this is the part of the world. >> world history. >> that is the venue of the two greatest wars in modern history and in part because of nato during the cold war and avoided that and now still playing an important role and given what russia is doing an important more role than before. i call it a bargain for the united states. >> after the two most devastating wars in the history of mankind not a land war since 1945. there has not been a major outbreak between power since 1945 since nato was formed in 1987. some of our allies need to step up and some are beginning to step but an insurance policy we have to have. >> at the top of the hour dig into mr. haas' piece "don't make any sudden moves, mr. trump."

and our guest coming up is jeh johnson. "morning joe" is coming right back. swings. sure we could travel, take it easy... but we've never been the type to just sit back... not when we've got so much more to give when you have the right financial advisor, life can be brilliant. ameriprise with sleep number, there's an adjustment for that. tilt your tormentor and put those snores to sleep. does your bed do that? come into a sleep number store where the queen c4 mattress is now $1199. it's a no brainer.

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theountain at a mexico restaurant? also, why is he writing like that? we are not going to copy off of you! >> welcome back to "morning joe." look at that beautiful morning on capitol hill as the sun is coming up in washington. it's a new day. tomorrow is going to be an even newer day! >> think of all the stock tips told in there. >> a lot of stock tips and a lot of money being made. >> exactly. >> along with laws being made. still with us here in washington the president of the council on foreign relations and author of the new book "a world in disarray american foreign policy and the crisis of the old order," richard haass. joining the conversation is national political correspondent for "the washington post" karen timleton. former treasury official steve rattner and "the new york times" reporter amishratbr.

>> i don't know if you heard last hour talking about price but shocked you had members of congress exchanging stock tips with somebody who was on a committee that had a great deal of power over that stock. i was actually shocked by it and it never happened in my seven years here. that's nothat we talked about. am i being hopelessly naive? is this what members of congress do behind closed doors after they kick me out of the room? >> but i think, also, the whole question of buying investments that are not available to the general public just seems like a bad idea for any public official. you are essentially asking to have that come back and bite you at some point. the number three house democrat had to leave congress over that.

>> especially in your area of expertise. i could see if it was like an energy tip. hey, there is, you know, a company that really knows what they are doing in north dakota. that is one thing. this is right in his wheelhouse, in an area he is trying to influence policy on. >> right in his wheelhouse but i feel like the rules have changed and the things that might have been unethical or things that might have gotten somebody's confirmation pulled are completely different now. people are going into jobs with almost no experience and people are going into jobs with very surface level understanding i was in the confirmation hearing for the education secretary and there were basically federal laws people were asking her about that she doesn't know and also mean that people would be pulled out of their confirmation hearings so not the case. if the guy at the top has set the bar to be that he is inexperienced and maybe had some shady dealings, of course, that is top down and going to go all the way to his cabinet members. >> but the rules have quite literally changed in the senate, thanks to the democrats. it now takes only 51 votes to

confirm a cabinet nominee where it used to take 60. >> at the end of the day that is harry reid's greatest legacy, actually. greatest -- not being greatest but biggest most. the 51 votes which, by the way, is so consequential. how i found out haw groat the senate was in checks and balances. i remember when i was getting into politics i remember loving the united states senate in '92 and '94 when it slowed everything down for bill clinton and hating it in '95 and '96 when it slowed down everything for us. and somewhere around '97 and '98 said it's a pretty brilliant system. as they say, you power the tea in the sauce and it cools it down. >> the other thing that a little bit concerning whether the deeply divided politics we have are going to affect these confirm medications and maybe should be -- >> if you look at the education secretary it's never a

controversial appointment. john king the outgoing education secretary was only confirmed 49-40 because of the senate has become so politicized. so it's going to be interesting to see even ones who get through, whether they get through on fair close votes. going back to the prior point. the congress operates by different rules than the executive branch. not surprising on these conflict of interest issues. you could not serve in the executive branch with those stocks and congress has always written its own rules for itself. >> yeah, which, again, republicans need to understand -- and let me say it again for the 20th time the past couple of months. there is an election in two years. another election in two years. remember that. >> this moment is very short. >> it really is. >> it goes away. >> again, i always talk about karl rove's permanent majority in 2004 and nancy pelosi and

2010 the tea party comes in and change the world and then barack obama is elected in 2008. two years later in 2014, the republicans win historic gains. so, yes, republicans this is your year. 2016. better do some things right or 2018 is going to be very ugly for the republican party. >> we want to get to richard's piece in "wall street journal." we have been trying for two hours to get to this. >> it is worth the wait, mika. >> don't make any sudden moves, mr. trump. that is the title. you're right, richard, in part, this. consistency and reliability are essential attributes for a great power. allies who depend on washington for their security need to know that this dependence is well placed. serious doubt about america would inevitably give rise to a very different and much less orderly world. as soon as president-elect trump is inaugurated he will face many

different challenges and rushing to reverse longstanding american policies could make existing ones harder to resolve. american foreign policy could stand some change. but it should be introduced only when probable benefits outweigh the risks and costs. the new administration should proceed with caution. it is inheriting a global situation that can only be described as dauntsing. this is no ti-- daunting and th no time to make conditions worse and some lesson from business you can transfer into global strategy if you use some of this advice wisely. >> if you're in a hole, stop digging and oath do no harm. you're inheriting as difficult an inbox as any commander in chief, as any president i would argue has inherited in modern time. >> multilayered. >> is his inbox more difficult than the one george w. bush left to barack obama? >> i think it is. >> i think it is. >> and you can argue in parts things that obama did things

like libya and things he didn't do, syria. the failure of this country, in part, because of donald trump but also hillary clinton and bernie sanders approve the transpacific partnership trade agreement. north korea advance and the russian occupation of crimea. this is a more difficult world. i used the phrase disarray. it's a daunting inbox and my argument to the new team is be mindful of adding to it. changing the one china policy, tearing up the iran agreement, moving the embassy to jerusalem and walking away from the paris climate change pact. any number of things i would say don't do on and it something don't just do something stand there could be pretty good strategic advice and would be my recommendation. >> when you think of all of those extremely complicated interrelated problems, the impact of one tweet, joe, what the impact of one tweet could be if it's the wrong tweet. >> except for the fact that the

impact of those tweets have now been devalued. you have the most important leader in europe saying i'm not looking to the tweets and not listening to what he says. i'm going to wait until he is president of the united states. no. but the impact is the tweets aren't having the impact that they would have had if, say, barack obama had done this out of the blue. >> i know. >> in 2014. i'm going to say, though, again, this is what is frustrating about some of the news reports about interviews. there is a lot of cherry picking and the cherry picking is saying, he is saying he is going to move the embassy to jerusalem and that is going to happen. that is policy. there are other reviews we will know not quite yet. we are going to wait and see. the same thing with nato. nato is obsoleject ssolete and important to me and germany is on standing with putin' talks about how much respect he has for angel merkel.

there is -- they are disjointed statement. there's no making u.s. policy out of them and i do think we have to wait. i do hope that his foreign policy team reads your op-ed this morning and they follow that advice. >> thank you. but i also just think you're right. he has covered a lot of sides of a lot of issues but it has created a sense of uncertainty in the world. my point when countries feel uncertain they tend to do one of things. either appease power and/or take matters into their own on hands and the saudis invade yemen or certain companies decide they need nuclear weapons of their own. we needbe very careful about sending out mixed messages, creating a sense of concern. this is a world that depends on us. an alternative world will not be good for the united states. >> i want to push back on the idea that a tweet can't really create that uncertainty and isn't being taken seriously. this is a president or president-elect that has not wanted to walk back statements

after he has made them. he is someone he says something i'm going to build a wall, he is building that wall. he says i'm taking this call and change the china policy and i'm going to do that. i think if he tweets something that isn't changed in the u.s. policy, then we can expect he is probably going to stick to that even if he waivers and he has disjointed statements, if he says something he feels as though the people are reacting to that and he feels as though people are in support of this tweet, then he is going to stick to that policy. i think there is real danger into saying those are tweets that that is not real policy. >> except the fact if you read the times of london interview, if you read all of the interviews over this past weekend, if you are capable of drawing any coherent policy out of that interview, you are much more talented than i think most of us in washington -- i'm not talking about you. i'm talking about anybody. steve rattner, there is incoherence there. there are -- you know, there are three policies on germany, two

policies on nato and two policies, you know, and, again, even on -- we hear going to move the capitol of jerusalem and move it to jerusalem. then he asked, no, not yet and see what happens. now he is starting to understand they want middle east peace. that is their big gul. he thinks big. he realizes the palestinians can't come and make peace if the capitol is moved to jerusalem and where the tweets hit reality when they start talking to foreign leaders and say, wait a second, think twice about that. >> on the issues he doesn't have a lot of experience or depth or knowledge, i agree with you. i think on the one hand. on the other hand, on this, that, tweet, statements, whatever they are lead to incoherent. but they don't know quite to make of it and see what happens. but i was struck yesterday by

the polls you showed because on issues where he has been very consistent and very firm on, like, trade, and on immigration, he has changed the way people think about these issues when you look at those polls and he has moved the country in a direction that i think a lot of us would not be happy about. >> a great point. he's moved the american people to a place where neither party was on protectionism, on, you know, america first. protecting jobs. >> yes, he has. again, there are those of you who don't particularly like that but where he is thinking clearly and has a very strong point of view, whether it's right or not, he has led the country to a different place. >> absolutely. >> karen, how are leaders not only the hill but foreign policy leaders as we move toward the day that donald trump becomes president of the united states, do they have any better grasp on who this man is and what type of leader he will be on january 20th than they did when he came down that escalator a year and a half ago? >> i don't think so.

i think part of the challenge for everyone here, including for us in the media, is trying to figure out what -- when we hear things from donald trump, are we hearing a policy statement or a negotiating position? because he really does seem to approach things on this sort of deal by deal by deal basis, and, i mean, he is a real estate guy still in some respects and it will be interesting to see how this sort of instincts that have gotten him this far in the business world and specifically the project to project to project real estate world are going to serve him when he is the chief executive of the united states. >> karen, you just made the key point. >> yep. >> it is all negotiation. if he says he is going to start with the 40% tariff in china, that is his opening bid. if he talks about taiwan, that is a negotiating chip -- if he is talking about nato being

obsolete. he is shaking down the nato member countries to contribute more. that is the key point. it is all negotiation because you're right. >> a different language. >> he still sees himself and it's obvious if you look. he still sees himself as the real estate guy going into a negotiating room with i'm going to punch them in the face first and get a good deal out of them. >> you saw that already on the health care. he brought the drug companies. i'm going after pharma and they have to negotiate. this is a goal the democrats got rolled on this a number of times. >> he's brought big pharma and lockheed and boeing to the table and he has brought ford to the table. he has brought all of these car companies to the table saying we were planning to do this 12 years ago. no, they weren't. >> i would respectfully argue

with that. >> do you think gm was getting battered and their stocks were going down, that if they had had a plan to make a billion dollar investment they wouldn't have put it out then instead of losing -- >> you're taking on the car czar on this? >> sure. why not. >> here he go. >> my point, though. it doubles down on your point which is when he sticks to these sort of tweets, it actually helps him with the american people and there is a consistency there. you can't do this in foreign policy. >> look. he has been very good at bringing these companies in, as you say, getting them to say or do something which we can debate whether they were going to do it or not any way and then declaring victory. i agree with your other point that his whole style and the way he goes about things is a business deal and he says, you know, i want this and they do this and he agrees to it and he says, this is a victory and i've had a win. that has worked for him so far and see if it turns into substantive progress. >> jerusalem a horrifying thing for the arab world saying we are

moving the cap tolg itol to jer. he doesn'tnd that but he is talking to the palestinians who say back off of that and we will give you some concessions in other areas. >> protests around every american embassy. this would have real complications for american service men and women and diplomats around the world. >> you now said that twice. >> all of the dimplomats are at home. >> what richard is saying it's one thing to do this to a couple of u.s. companies. another thing to start messing about with the most emotional situations in the world. >> if you want to get help from china, here is if we push him on the one china policy it will shut down his ability to work with us on north korea. >> how well havehe chinese an cooperating with us -- >> good question. >> we have been bending over backwards. by the way, you will get no

complaints on any of these major issues but when you talk about china, i think a lot of americans peel like i do. we have been bending over backwards for 20 or 30 years, giving china whatever we want because our companies are so desperate to go in there. i remember the ceo of boeing when we were voting on mfm in the 1990s actually having the guts, i was going to use another word -- to say come to us and china is a bigger democracy than american because more people vote there. i don't think -- and david ignatius agrees on this point -- pushing china back a little bit is not a bad thing to do. but, please, i don't want anybody to get confused what i'm saying here. i don't think you make foreign policy through tweets. that is dangerous. i agree. >> you should push china back on certain issues including the south china sea and not doing enough on north korea. you don't choose the single no loaded issue in china which they say as representing the future of their country which is taiwan. that is the one issue you do not

derive leverage on. >> richard haass and karen, thank you both to both of you. steve and rammish stay with us. >> karen, by the way -- >> good-bye, richard. >> is karen leaving? >> karen is leaving. >> karen brought up the best point this morning. she is going to leave with. >> a gold? >> a departing gift. rice a roni, the san francisco treat. >> thank you. >> if we could underline one comment, it was yours. that is in his mind, at least for good or ill, it's negotiation. >> yes. a language we have to all learn. the outstanding secretary of homeland security has one last responsibility before his tenure ends, overseeing security at tomorrow's inauguration. we are going to speak exclusively with secretary jeh johnson about that and whether the agency is ready for the transfer of power. tomorrow live at the bar at the dubliner to cover the president's inauguration in "morning joe" style. we have got a cast of a thousand

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any time i've ever taken over a new organization, certainly, i go top-to-bottom and look real hard at how we are doing business. clearly people that would have come before me, if i'm confirmed, many all did a great job. secretary johnson and others, but my typical approach is to do a top-to-bottom assessment and i certainly will do that. >> all right. there is one person i don't think a lot of people are worried about. >> that is retired general john kelly promising to look under the hood at homeland security if he is confirmed as the department's new secretary. joining us now, the man he

mentioned during that testimony, outgoing homeland security secretary jeh johnson. >> mr. secretary, good to see you. >> good morning. >> how are you? >> busy time for you. >> you're working? >> he is trying to prepare an inauguration. >> you're working. >> this is inspect inauguration security day for me. >> wow. >> after a number briefings about our security, i intend to go out and look it over myself, wearing my favorite dhs jacket. >> how big of an operation is this going to be? i started to notice in the 2000 inauguration, things changed. even before 9/11, things changed. a lot more washington got shut down. >> security will be enormous. there will be approximately 10,000 dhs personnel, secret service, tsa, coast guard, and a number of other components supporting the security for the inauguration. there will be another 12,000 or so federal personnel, including

7,800 national guard, fbi, metro police, supported by police force from the area and park police, of course, capital police. 28,000 people directly or indirectly supporting the security for the inauguration. >> well, the transition, itself, seems to be moving forward. there are also marches planned. >> yes. >> and are you sort of looking holistically at balancing this city as it sort of expresses itself on a number of levels? >> well, there are two things that are somewhat unique to this inauguration. one is we are expecting about 700,000 to 900,000 people in the mall area and a series of events that begin today and tomorrow and saturday. we have, at last count, 103

groups that have either applied for permits to demonstrate or that we see from social media intend to come to town. >> what are you expecting on that front? >> the concern is some of these groups are pro-trump of them are con-trump and may not play well in the same place. so park police, in particular, along with the metro police, have made plans to try to separate the groups to try to put them in areas where they are not directly facing off against one another, like we did in cleveland and philadelphia this last summer. >> what is your greatest concern? >> well, i said last week that we see no specific credible threat against the inauguration but that is only part of the story. we live in an age now of the self-radicalized actor, the so-called lone wolf, and we have to be concerned about the

vehicle threat like in nice, for example. >> right. >> the hard vehicle security area is where we are prohibiting vehicles, except official vehicles getting into the area and it's extra fortified this year with dump trucks and heavily armored vehicles to prevent anybody who is not aurnl authorized from being in the area that is not supposed to be there. >> you're going to be succeeded in office by a very competent man. >> i know him well. >> many things under homeland security that a lot of people aren't away of. everybody is aware of the protective services and tsa, things like that, but cybersecurity. where does that rank in terms of the handoff to the incoming administration? your concern about cybersecurity, given what we have gone through in this country, and your concern for the future in terms of, you know, jacking it up, our protective development. >> good question.

i like general kelly. he came to office with a counterterrorism national security focus from my experience in the pentagon. and i quickly learned that cybersecurity need to be right up there with counterterrorism. if counter terrorism is one cornerstone, cyber needs to be the other. we made intangible proving in improving our private cybersecurity and something i hope general kelly is going to continue to focus on. is there a lot more work that has to be done and up there in one of our premier missions. >> what did you learn from cleveland in securing that? i was there. both pro-trump groups and people against trump were in cleveland together. i was nervous about that so i'd like to know a little bit about that. also, how are you going to be monitoring this real-time? are you going to have 10,000 of those people monitor twitter or facebook or what are you doing there? >> the cleveland police, in particular, i thought, did an

excellent job of defusing situations, separating groups, monitoring emerging tense situations, and we are going to be doing much the same. we are going to have a lot of resources. all of these police forccap capital police and park police and the fed we have been planning this since july and we have pretty sophisticated ways to make sure things don't get out of hand. >> what is your impression of general kelly? >> john kelly was the secretary of defense's military aide when i was in the department of defense. first time i ever heard about john kelly was when i was at dover to greet his son's casket coming back from afghanistan and there were all of these marines there saying we are all here for general kelly. some months later, he showed up in the pentagon and i got to

know him well. i consider him a friend. he's a good man and i think he will be well received by my work force when he takes over. >> fantastic. >> that is good to hear. >> we want to thank you so much for your service. >> thank you. >> to our country. we greatly appreciate it and thank you for being here. >> thank you, sir. >> good luck. >> thank you. >> homeland security secretary jeh johnson. today is another big day for donald trump's his incoming administration one of the most contested cabinet hearings is set to happen today on capitol hill. nbc's kristen welker and kasie hunt will join us with their reports coming up.

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well, the number of democratic lawmakers planning to skip tom's inauguration is up to at least 65. but one democrat who will be attending is congressman elijah cummings and he issued a statement saying this is a decision each member must make for himself or herself. the inauguration is bigger than president-elect trump. early this week on "morning joe," congressman cummings

signaled the willingness to work with president-elect trump. >> i know the president-elect is watching and i would say to you, president-elect, i'd be happy to meet with you at any moment but we have work to do. the american people want us to get to work for them and lift them up and if you want to deal with prescription drugs and reducing the prices, i'm here with you. if you want toeal with the health care for all, i'm here with you. >> wow. joining us now nbc news white house correspondent kristen welker and newly minted nbc news capitol hill correspondent kasie hunt. >> reporter: another busy day on capitol hill. they are doing work here at the house so it's a little loud so excuse me, if i raise my voice. but a busy day on capitol hill. steve mnuchin, president-elect trump's pick for treasury

secretary will have his confirmation hearing and he is expected to be drilled on the decisions he made and his bank made during the financial crisis. we told he is prepared to address those questions head on. then rick perry up for the department of energy, his confirmation hearing set to get under way as well and he is expected to be pressed on a whole range of issues, including the nuclear weapons that falls within the department of energy. that is an area he doesn't have a whole lot of experience so expect tough questions there. and president-elect trump has now officially finished rounding out his cabinet overnight. we learned that he plans to tap sonny perdue for agriculture secretary. now this pick raising some eyebrows because with the completion of his cabinet, it means that he will be the first president-elect since 1988 to not have named any hispanics as part of his cabinet and angklgrg

some of the hispanic groups and sean spicer saying we got 5,000 other staff positions to fill out so this will be a diverse administration but, obviously, the cabinet choices are the top ranking positions here within an administration so that is drawing a lot of scrutiny, particularly given all of president-elect's trump's hard line stances on immigration. we are going to hear from sean spicer today. he is going to hold his first on-camera briefing an hour and a half from now so expect him to get pressed on all of this. >> thank you, kristen welker. >> battling a leaf blower. let's talk about the selections having the problems devos, obviously. then tom price having some problems. then steve mnuchin today. a guy who is going to get knocked around on the hill. >> joe, i had one republican tep teleme privately that steve

mnuchin -- if donald trump has promised to drain the swamp, steve mnuchin is the swamp and this is a republican talking. i think there is going to be a lot of resistance, particularly to what happened during the financial crisis. his company was involved. this company that he purchased for pennies on the dollar from the government after the financial crisis included a reverse mortgage company that one time started foreclosure proceedings against a woman 27 cents short on an insurance payment. the kind of thing i think you can expect from democrats. >> are there republicans that are going to actually vote against him? >> i don't think at this point necessarily but something could go wrong in this hearing. had he to turn over his tax returns. they learned more things in the process of gathering his materials. he had to resubmit his questionnaire. this is just something where, you know, how we have unpredictable things coming up? you remember tom daschle? they found things in his tax returns that were problematic. this is one place i think the potential for unpredictable things that could cause republicans to oppose him but we

don't know yet. we have to see how he performs. i think tour point, joe, there has been some evidence that the trump transition team has fallen down a little bit on preparing some of these people for the hearings. even rex tillerson who was expected to perform really well, he had more trouble at that hearing than people examined. >> who can we expect the toughest questions from? >> i think claire mccaskill is on the committee and i think somebody you should keep an eye on and also sherrod brown. >> your concern about the lack of knowledge of these picks? >> we can say bringing a business person to washington could be a good thing and bring their set of skills. >> absolutely. >> if you look back at history people coming to washington without a senior level like mnuchin and without having any prior washington experience have generally not worked out very well. it's simply a different experience. you're going from a command and control ceo type of role to a

much more collaborative ko l leth lethal. you have to get the politics of it and theater is involved and it's a different set of skills. >> some of the deal making, joe, you would know, is behind closed doors. it's not lobbed out in the public. sometimes you never hear about certain deals that are made and why votes are cast. >> completely different skill set. there is a reason why generals that look like they are going to be a great candidate for president go out and usually by about the third day, everybody is grimacing going, ew. our ceos, the same thing with them. you go top-to-bottom in this administti not a lot of washington experience. there really isn't. the one person that can step in and say i've been here 30 years, this is how it worked when reagan ran into trouble, this is how clinton took care of it when he ran into trouble, there is no institutional knowledge whatsoever. >> well, as someone out on the

campaign trail and talked to trump supporters, this is what people wanted. they voted for someone who didn't have any political experience. they put him in the highest office of the land. and now they are also they were chanting during the swamp and this is what happens when you drain the swamp. you get new people who don't have experience and don't have institutional knowledge and we will see how they run the government. if they can run the government and this goes smoothly, then maybe we will see a re-election of donald trump. if this blows up in their face by the time the term elections come along things will be a lot different in washington. >> the first real test to that is the hearing, the first public setting in which you get a sense of how these individuals are going to fare here in d.c. on do they get the nuances and gray areas in answering the questions? how well prepared, joe, we were talking before, how well prepared are they to actually come in and not just manage the top line arguments, but to really show some skills to sort of dealing with washington and

it's a whole different set of experiences for them. >> it is. >> mnuchin is going to be particularly interesting because he probably has the least experience of any of the ones who come so far forward in the public arena. tillerson certainly did as the ceo of exxon and so on but he has never been out there. >> well, mnuchin has been the one person that comes up over and over again when you ask them who are you worried about, right? we talked a lot about tillerson and mccain and lindy graham but at the end of the day transition officials were not saying we are concerned about how tillerson will get through and others who talked to him said he is impressive and came away with a great impression but not the case with mnuchin. the transition team have concerned and he has not made a universal positive image. >> for people on the ill, for members, republicans, house and senate alike, they are going to be looking for the person in the administration that knows how to get things done. >> right. >> because -- >> usually, that person emerges.

it's not we are going to pick this person who can do this. >> they usually have somebody with the institutional knowledge. i don't know that person is there and that is going to be very frustrating. what the incoming administration has to remember is that barack obama's greatest political failing wasn't with the republicans who were against him from day one, it was with senior democrats who, mooeika, we hear from day one, senior democrats and the senate especially were complaining about barack obama not reaching out enough, not understanding what they needed. >> yeah. >> there was that -- >> he says it -- you know? >> yeah. but that's -- he didn't value them neither did really george w. bush in saens. the last two presidents have failed in reaching out even to their own party on the hill and it cost them eventually. the question is who does donald trump have who is that person that can go to hill and say, i understood saying we ran over you this time, but give us your

vote and we will make sure you get what you need now. >> i think there are two positive things that the trump administration has done on this front. one is mike pence, in addition to reince priebus and also the staff around mike pence, the people that have worked for mike pence, they know the people who work for paul ryan so there is great communication both directly between the principals and among their staff which is really important. two, more broadly there is a lot of confidence in the people that donald trump has selected for his national security team. and i think that is a step that has reassured a lot of people on capitol hill. they really like mattis. they really like general kelly, rex tillerson is a little bit on thinner ice but still in a good place. >> they respect him. >> exactly. >> exactl >> you're right about mike pence. mike pence actually is that person. >> mike pence is that person. >> and reince as well. >> they have a massive domestic policy that they are trying to get through. for example, today, mnuchin is going to be grilled about the fact that he has said there is

going to be no net tax for the wealthy which is in direct contradiction of trump's stated tax poll and also ryan's tax policy. >> nikki haley yesterday -- >> with we need to talk about that. yesterday, nasa revealed that last year was the hottest year on record. the third year in a row that global temperatures reached record levels. so a perfect day to hold hearings for donald trump's controversial pick to lead the epa and that is ahead on "morning joe" as well.

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trump's pick to lead the environmental protection agencies, oklahoma scott pruitt,

appeared for the public works committee. in the past, pruitt has doubted the scientific climate change. he said it's far from settled. pruitt told lawmakers yesterday that it's not a hoax. he also suggested it's unclear how much of a role humans actually play in affecting the climate and sparred with senator bernie sanders over that question. >> well, senator, the job of the administrator is to -- >> why is the climate changing? >> senator, in response to the co 2 issue, the epa administrator is constrained by statutes. >> i'm asking your personal opinion. >> my personal opinion is immaterial. >> really? you are going to be the head of the agency to protect the environment and your personal opinions about whether climate

change is caused by carbon materials is immaterial? >> he has been on this issue. we've been asking who the leader of the democratic party is. over the past week and a half or so, bernie sanders has stepped up and said i am the leader of the progressive movement moving forward. >> he has. my god, i don't know how many times i've listened to this stump speech and it's a central part of what he has to say it has emerged and find no leaders and you've seen bernie sanders generate the headlines where trump's nominees have said that. >> democrats have been watered on all levels and are looking for the future and talking

about. harold ford said that people were in arizona trying to figure out who the democratic party would be going forward and that is bernie sanders. it certainly looks like he's the leader of the democratic party. >> bernie sanders is definitely someone who watched a lot of those stump speeches with k.c. he's come out really forcefully and hit people on the head. when i think about betsy devos, one of the first questions he asked before saying that the country is turning into an oligarchy, how much money have you given to the republican party, she said i'm not sure, $200 million. this idea that he's really just asking a very straight, simple question, why is the climate change changing and the possible head of the epa can't answer that question, that tells

progressives that this is a target and we really have to watch this guy. >> that's interesting. i do appreciate the idea that he's the leader of the emerging progressive democratic party. but then you have, also, is the epa an environmental issue or is it economics and wall street, which is the elizabeth warren wing of the party? so i think while -- >> i think it's all of it. >> it's all of it, but how do they settle that out? because those are two very, very diametrically opposed issues that have very different impacts in terms of how the party positions itself to make an argument to the american people. >> well, i think progressives believe in both of those things. but the real problem for those of us in the center of the party, we are scared. we feel outnumbered and feel like the french resistance hiding in the woods. >> i'm serious here, who would be sort of your candidate?

is there anybody? >> every conversation i have with my fellow more centrist democrats is who is my leader and who are we getting behind? you hear about michael bennett. he's a great guy. he's one guy. and after that, you start to say the governor of california , governor of -- >> it used to be people like harold ford. a guy raised in memphis who actually understands the entire country. that's who used to be that sort of candidate was the face of the dlc that could unite all members. >> sure. harold would be great. he's not in office. the point you've made often, the democrats have a shrunken number of people who are in office. jason candor. he lost the race. we're short of people in prominent positions who believe what some of us believe and have leadership qualities. >> so is hillary going to run for mayor of new york?

she's way ahead of de blasio. >> i would undertake that bet. >> why don't you take him? >> thank you all. >> thank you, guys, so much. still ahead, community organizer, constitutional senator, we look at president obama's closing message yesterday and what could be his next act. and rick perry says there's been a learning curve for the former governor of texas to get up to speed to become the next secretary of energy. "morning joe" is coming right back.

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if you want help improving your a1c and blood sugar numbers with a non-insulin option, click to activate your within. ask your doctor about once-weekly trulicity. at the end of the day, if we work hard and if we're true to those things in us that feel true and feel right, the world gets a little better each time. that's what this presidency has tried to be about. it's true that behind closed doors i curse more, however, and sometimes i get mad and frustrated like everybody else does. but at my core, i think we're going to be okay. we just have to fight for it. we have to work for it and not take it for granted and i know that you will help us do that. thank you very much, press

corps. good look. >> that was amazing. >> first of all, we have mike, michael, jeremy. >> yep, jeremy. >> and we've got richard. >> and richard haass. and "the wall street journal" editorial page says, "don't make any sudden statements, mr. president." >> he has a new book out, "the world in disarray". >> what were your thoughts -- i think we have a difference of opinion on this. what were your thoughts when you heard the president say, hey, everything's going to be okay? >> i did not think that was a good statement at all. i think it was an honest statement but it was -- and you heard what he said right after, we have to fight -- we have to move forward and there was a lot going on in there. first of all, we're going to be okay means everybody stop trying -- try to not be afraid because i know you are.

and, you know, i think that he leaves office. it's extremely bittersweet. it's also probably a very sad time because for eight years he's been building policies and ideas and developing around the values of this country and i think that many people when the democratic side of the aisle are worried that everything is in question. >> well, i think there are. i think there are people that are very concerned. just like there were people that are always concerned. you know, mika, you and i, we always say this in speeches. we've spent the last ten years talking to people. after barack obama got elected, republicans said this guy is a socialist. everything's going to be okay. >> but when you say everything is going to be okay, you're saying it might not be. >> no, i'm not. and neither is the president. and two years later, after the tea party won, we heard the same thing. we heard the same thing in '14

and now we're hearing it in '16. i'm glad the president is saying that. he's sending a message to people on his own side, his own party, we lost, it happens, let's fight and work and get back into place. everything's going to be okay. and i thought he sounded reaganesque yesterday. i believe in this country and in the american people and i believe people are more good than bad. that's barack obama. it's an inspiring message. mike, i wrote a column about this two years ago that it was sick and tired of people -- two years before i knew donald trump was going to run for president, sick and tired of people always saying the country's going to hell because their side is not in the white house. >> that was quite a display from the president of the united states, the outgoing president of the united states. >> amazing. >> it encapsulated so much of who that man is. you had a combination of compassion and, most

importantly, respect for the office. >> yes. >> and an understanding and a communicative ability to tell people the weight of the office, including to the incoming administration, quite a display. >> respect for the office, michael steele, respect for the institution, and respect for the process that has elected a man that has people in barack obama's orbit and a lot of people in the media's orbit terrified right now. >> it does. and it was interesting, go back and look at some of the early interviews and certainly the press conferences that the president did at the beginning of 2009 and it goes very much to what mike was saying. a sobering understanding under the weight of the office. his legacy, that's important. he wants a lot of his achievements to be a part of the american fabric. but i think he also recognizes, to your point, joe, that

transitions happen. change comes. and throughout it all, we're going to be bigger, better, stronger. what's going to be interesting, i think, for people on the other side, whether you're democrats in disarray trying to figure out who is going to lead the party, which way do we go, or republicans who assume maybe too much. now we have the white house, the congress and the senate about what we're going to do next. i think there's some lessons to take. >> i think the lesson, though, from the media is and for political elites that have missed this all along, you've got to always remember -- and i heard people talking last night, everybody's scared. >> there's an uncertainty. >> here's the deal, you have to always remember, people are scared in manhattan. a lot of them are excited on staten island. people are scared in palm beach county. drive one county north, just go one county north to martin county, there are a lot of people excited. >> yeah. >> i'm not saying one group is

right and one group is wrong. i'm saying, i'm so tired of people saying, this is what reporters need to do. no. reporters need to report on the facts and they need to realize that there are tens and millions of people out there who have a different world view than this and if they understood that, mika, they would not have been so shocked when ronald reagan got elected, when george w. bush got re-elected or donald j. trump got elected this time. >> president obama made clear the markers that would cause him to speak out after he leaves office. >> there's a difference between that normal functioning of politics and certain issues or certain moments where i think our core values may be at stake. i put in that category, if i saw systematic discrimination being

ratified in some fashion. i put in that category explicit or functional obstacles to people being able to vote, to exercise their franchise. i put in that category institutional efforts to silence dissent or the press. i would put in that category efforts to round up kids who had grown up here and, for all practical purposes, are american kids and send them someplace else. when they love this country, they are kids' friends and

classmates and are now entering into community colleges or in some cases entering our military. the notion that we would just arbitrarily or because of politics punish those kids. when they didn't do anything wrong themselves. i think it would be something that would merit me speaking out. >> you know, richard, so much of politics is about contrast when you run against somebody you contrast against them. barack obama mired in the low 40s, mid-40s at some point in his presidency and was attacked for sounding too much like a constitutional lawyer. now in the age of trump dawning, there's a contrast that american people are obviously saying, that doesn't sound too bad. he's up at 60 percentage points, 60% and finishing 60% and

finishing as strong as any president in a while. >> we talked a little bit about george herbert walker bush being back in the hospital. a little bit of 41 in the style. it's old-school. it's a little bit of -- it's a certain decorum. it's a low-keyed presidency in a lot of ways. the contrast between low key and what we're walking into is palpable. >> jeremy, he believes that he owes the next president the same silence that george w. bush gave him and you can tell, that's what he wants to do. he believes that's the right thing to do. >> he's been the leader on that. >> that george w. bush gave him. that said, there were very important caveats. >> right. >> you can hear him saying, i'm going to give him that silence unless i speak out on these critical points. >> right, joe. i think you're getting at the subtler message of what obama was saying to democrats, do not

expect me to be the leader of the opposition here. i'm not going to play the elizabeth warren and bernie sanders message only when there are issues that i feel are so urgent and important that shake me at my political and philosophical core, only then could you expect to hear from him. and he touched on those issues that have to do with deporting people, issues where he feels trump's philosophy are at odds with democratic ideals. >> and there was a particular moment in that press conference yesterday when he went on for two or three minutes with rhetoric that if hillary clinton had used the same rhetoric during the course of her campaign, it may have had a different result. the election may have had a different result because he addressed those left behind and lost in the system, who feel that their children have been neglected and won't do as good

as they have done in this country. he was talking to pennsylvania, ohio, michigan, wisconsin. >> he really was. maybe he doesn't have a role out front for democrats, but the party could really use him and people like david axelrod, people like david plough who saw this coming. by the way, everybody who said they were shocked that donald trump was going to win, at least during the primary process it was david axelrod who said this guy could begin. of course, that's when trump thanked him for it. he does that a lot. if you say that he has a chance to win. plough said it. you had john favroe at some point saying it. by the way, the vice president, as you know the guy very well, not only said it, he was very worried about it when you guys were flying into scranton that

hillary clinton had not spoken to the people she needed to speak to to win. >> yeah. one of the vice president's gifts is he has a home depot mentality. he goes home every weekend to wilmington, delaware. he'll go to home depot himself and pick up a hammer. he's got that sidewalk level gut instinct and he was deeply bothered and cognizant of the fact prior to the election that that thing was going south. >> do you know biden is getting a home on saturday? >> going amtrak. >> i love it. >> that's just great. >> i've run into him a few times. >> he's going to leave the way he came in. >> it's important not to over look him as the former party chairman, i appreciate what you said about the president saying that i'm not going to be the guy, you know, to lead you out of this particular wilderness. he was the guy that led them into that particular wilderness because instead of taking obama for america outside of the dnc

and keeping it out there, he really should have built that infrastructure and whether or not hillary clinton would have won is a separate matter but the party would have been in a different place because a lot of the ground game and the bench for the party would have been developed over eight years and it wasn't. still ahead on "morning joe," the rage. steve kornacki joins -- you can hear him in the halls. he's freaking people out. plus, rick perry has said he wanted to get rid of the energy department. now might be his chance. we're going to look ahead at his confirmation hearings set for this morning. first, bill cairns with the forecast. >> we've been really warm in the lower 48. yesterday in fairbanks, it dipped to a negative 50 degrees. this is what happens when you take boiling water and throw it up in the air. inant snow fun.

just look at the air. it's beautiful in slow motion. stuff affecting us in the lower 48, rain in louisiana and a couple tornado warnings in mississippi. nothing confirmed, no damage. as far as the rainfall goes, this is the rain that is going to soak the deep south that will make its way up to d.c. inauguration day, a brief period of light rain is likely sometime between 10:00 a.m. and about 2:00 p.m. opening remarks at 11:30 and the ceremony begins at noon. 47 degrees, that's good at least. it will be mild in the nation's capital. we'll continue to monitor the forecast for you. in the lower 48, it continues to be very mild. there's the setup. drive today. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. are you getting this? these numbers are off the charts...

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donald trump nominated his last cabinet spot. he elected sunny perdue for agricultural secretary. the confirmation of james mattis as secretary of defense is speeding ahead, headed to a full senate after a resounding approval by the committee. hearings today is for steve mnuchin and rick perry. >> they were really optimistic that price could be the guy. maybe they'd only get one that they could knock down but price is going to be the guy. the democrats are so i mpotent n

their nominees. to think about the scandals that we dealt with, whether it was tom daschle not paying taxes, an undocumented immigrant who was a nanny, she's seem quaint. >> cute little problems. >> that some of these nominees here. >> what do you hear about betsy devos who did damage to herself? >> i think in the end she'll be fine. there's a sense inside the inner circle that the confirmation did not go as smoothly as possible. that was clear to anybo watching. what was so interesting there, you saw where the base of the democratic party is. you have bernie sanders and elizabeth warren going after her on some really, really key issues that are vital to their core constituency. and to what effect? >> that is an acid test for republicans. you see jeb bush coming out and people harshly critical of

donald trump actually coming out in support for betsy devos. this is about teacher unions versus school choice. i would be shocked to see any republican defect whatsoever. >> it was kind of interesting -- >> despite the fact she had a really shaky and at times embarrassing performance on the hill. >> yeah. and during the course of those hearings, you saw off of jeremy's point, an interesting tangent on the democrats as they proceed forward without barack obama. you have bernie sanders and elizabeth warren grilling betsy devos and then chris murphy ask the question, the sidewalk question, guns in schools, which stunned i think everyone watching, her response. >> it should not have stunned

somebody prepared for that position. there have been supreme court decisions that have talked about the inability to limit where guns are sold close to schools. this has been discussed a thousand times. >> i don't even think she seemed stunned and she felt very strongly about what she was saying and with great respect, it sounded ridiculous in the context of hearing about this from the senator from connecticut. she didn't seem to get that. >> mnunchin is going to govern as a populist and then if decrathave dontheir homework, it undercuts that. and in so doing, then do you get

two or three republicans saying i'm not going to vote for this guy. why should i vote for mnuchin. >> rick perry is expected to tout his experience running texas and a power center in global energy trade, particularly in petroleum. he's likely to face questions about his previous actions to get rid of the energy department and his commitment to renewable energy sources. "the new york times" indicates that he may not fully grasp what he was taking on. "mr. perry gladly accepted, believing he was taking on a role as a global ambassador for the american oil and gas industry that he had been championed in his home state. if in fact confirmed by the senate, he would be a steward of

a vast national security complex he knew almost nothing about, caring for the most fearsome weapons on the planet, the united states' nuclear arsenal." "the times" also notes that his predecesso predecessors, for ernest moniz, the future of the nuclear science has been a lifelong obsession. come on now. that was snidely written but it's a very good parallel to give you a sense of where we're going here. >> before the man's discounted as a cheerleader, let us remember, he ran one of the largest economies in the world

but in rick perry, you have a man with decades worth of experience and running some of the largest state -- >> it seems like an uncomfortable fit. >> it is. but please, let's not act like this guy has the ability to learn what he's going to be running anrun it effectively. was he my first choice? no. he wouldn't have been my tenth choice but let's not discount him as a bumbling fool who doesn't know how to run things. >> it would surprise a lot of americans to find out that the energy secretary is responsible for the nuclear arsenal. i think if you were to poll the average person, oh, yeah, it's all about renewables or -- >> oh, my god. >> but that's where -- >> i think they are getting a lot of breaks here. >> that's the more important question, why does the energy department control the nuclear arsenal. >> because all of this comes out of things nuclear. they oversee a dozen labs where some of the most advanced research goes on in this country. and technically, it could be in

the defense department and there's a certain argument for that and tens of billions of dollars a year, thousands and thousands of people. it's a big security issue, it's a big scientific issue, developmental issue. you've got an entire staff, deputy secretary has done a lot of it. that's the case now. you've got thousands of civil servants who do it and the energy secretary, if you look at ernie moniz, he was managing those negotiations every inch of the way. so governor perry's going to have to decide what's going to be his share of the portfolio and what is his deputy and other people going to handle. coming up on "morning joe," tom price faces grueling questions over the timing of the affordable care act. jacob sborof will talk about how it impacts doctors and their patients.

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with respect to the inauguration, i'm not going to comment on those issues. all i know is i'm going to be there. so is michelle. and i have been checking the weather and i'm hardened by the

fact that it won't be as cold as my first. >> steve -- >> i've got it out of my system. >> at last check, 60 democrats will sit out of the inauguration. and trump co-sign fould sign fo five executive actions. joining me now is steve kornacki and author sophia nelson, her new book, "reclaiming our founder's vision for a united america." what god goo timing.

>> i'm old enough to remember this. you, of course, are not. remember the draft dodgers were granted clemency by him on the first day and sort of started things under this divisive manner. i know trump wants to start fast. >> that's not always good. i'm old enough to be your older sister, joe. but trump is the least likely person to start slow and be thoughtful about what he's going to do. >> they want to go big early. >> i think what he's going to do is predictable. he'll do the wall, roll back regulations. he'll say he's starting to build the wall and say mexico is going to pay for it, of course.

and you know what, i bet we get tweets of what they are going to be because for him, you know, trump is to twitter as the federalist papers were the founding fathers. so we're going to get actual actions, actual actions to your book, sophia. >> 20 million people just like that. >> steve, following up on what was said earlier today, the american people voted for change and they voted for donald trump. they voted for outsiders. and they are going to get it. you talk to the trump people, they all want to start big. they all want to be disruptive. it's not one of these things where you get promised one thing and then get to washington and we're going to change and go mainstream. nothing mainstream about what they want to do. >> no. there's always momentum for a new presidency. there's extra momentum here that comes from the nature of the surprise of the result. if shocked people.

it shocked republicans, too. it shocked paul ryan. i thought we got a preview during the transition when the house republicans tried to make that change with the ethics watch dog and donald trump spoke up and the republicans backed off and told me they respected the election result. they felt that they tapped into a force that they didn't know s there andhey don't ful understand. they believe he represents it and are more in touch than they are but initially that's going to give him a wider birth. the parallel maybe is ronald reagan 1980, the fact that he won was a shock to people, the fact that the size of his victory was a shock and even democrats for the first six months, that's how he got the tax thing through in 1981. democrats were so intimidated by a result that they had never seen coming that they gave reagan a wide birth coming in. i don't know if democrats are going to feel that way but republicans have the vote and they are going to give him deference here. >> sophia, you talk about the founding fathers in your book. i was looking over some

inaugural addresses and the nature around them. in 1800, actually, a campaign far more divisive than we've seen in our lifetime, thomas jefferson, people didn't think he'd be able to rule a country and he bent over backwards sounding more like his political opponents in his inaugural address than his allies. i don't think we'll have that from donald trump but we're at a point where our leaders need to look back to the founders. >> i think that's right. as far as donald trump's inaugural address, i saw a tweet that he was working on it himself for the last few weeks and i winced because i don't know what that means. but i think he will surprise us all and the inaugural will be straightforward, direct and i think it will be donald trump. so i think in that regard i don't expect him to really do a

lot of bending. i think he's got an agenda. i think he was elected to change things and i think he intends to do that. >> so much opportunity, though, for this address that i -- >> i agree. >> -- i worry he might pass up on. i hope he capitalizes on. >> we were talking about kellya nchl nne when we started. i hope she's the guiding force. because she's a woman, women is her specialty, i'm hoping with the women's march coming up that he understands that there is a large segment of this country that feels like hillary clinton won 3, 4 milon popular votes and that not that he's illegitimate so much but that she won. >> yeah. >> so she's got to -- >> i think as it pertains to women, margaret, i'll pass it to you here, but in passing i'll say that i do think there are some things coming up in this administration that haven't been announced yet but i'm beginning to hear about behind the scenes that will be for women making

sure that there are avenues where their issues are addressed, whether it pertains to equal pay, maybe not in the way that the last administration defined it but other types of workplace policies that will be important as well as access to capital. i think that's coming, actually, believe it or not. >> dina powell, 10,000 women, is now advising ivanka trump. >> exactly. >> and, you know, back to you, i think kellyanne conway and melania will have influence over trump, especially over women but i don't think we can expect him to not tweet. >> guys, you underestimate him. >> i think it may slow down but i would not even bet my

chocolate crow saunt on that. >> the question is, the inaugural address, i think he surprised people after his victory with his speech there. >> at the convention? >> the convention speeches, yeah. >> is that the donald trump we might see? >> i think we'll probably get more of that than you would -- the sort of the brash guy who is going to start throwing it out there. he wants to keep it short. it will be sweet in donald trump's terms but i think for me, this speech, as much as i is to the nation, sort of a clearing call of where donald trump want to lead us, i'm also, again, putting the political lens glasses on and, joe, i'd love to get your thoughts on this. does this begin to brand or rebrand the republican party? because this president is in a space that the gop that we know is not. >> i know.

>> reconciliation, i don't think is going to happen as smoothly and cleanly as people think. >> you have three parties now. >> that's right. >> steve, i really do believe you have paul ryan's republican party, nancy pelosi's party and donald trump's party. >> and whatever bernie sanders is doing. the most telling thing out of the nbc polls is the top issues that americans agree with him on, tariffs, america first, protectionism, all of the things that neither party has been espousing. but donald trump has bent popular will to his position. those are not republican positions. donald trump has his own political party now. >> i think it's interesting that

i made the comparison to reagan. we're useto every republican calling after ronald reagan and any other republican had another one been elected, we'd be hearing the parallels about what reagan did. what you're hearing from the trump people is andrew jackson, the populist president. >> right. >> working-class president. the issues that you're talking about, talking about trade, america first, this idea that we're done with stupid overseas wars that waste our resources. those are andrew jackson themes. those are themes that 150, 200 years ago resonated and that's the parallel you hear that i heard people around donald trump saying this inaugural address, think of andrew jackson. that's the country he's speaking to. and i think he's bringing the republican party around to being much more of a working-class party. >> on the screen, you're looking at what donald trump said at the dinner for mike pence. there you go. >> there hasn't been anything like this since andrew jackson.

"what year was andrew jackson"? that was a long time ago. and it was. but it was 1828 and he was the first president that was not a virginia landowner who owned slaves or a member of the adams dynasty. jackson was a radical, radical shift. >> i don't know that trump wants to compare himself to andrew jackson in a number of ways, but i do agree with you that andrew jackson was very different from his predecessors and he was a straight talker. he was in your face hardcore america, we're tough, we'll get it done. but i think reagan is who i think trump will model. it will not go amiss, at least for me, that britain has a prime minister and i thought back to

being in high school when ronald reagan and margaret thatcher were running the world and maybe we have a woman prime minister in britain and we've got a tough, brash american president although reagan had been a governor, trump's never held office. i do think that if trump calms himself down a little bit, stays off twitter, i think he's got a shot at doing really good things because he's got good people around. >> sophia nelson, thank you for coming back. "reclaiming our founder's vision for a united america." steve and margaret, stay with us. still ahead, what investors want to hear from the president-elect's treasury nominee at this morning's confirmation hearing. "morning joe" is back in a moment.

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i have no idea. >> let's bring in cbnc's dominic chu. >> steve mnuchin is gng to get a grilling. senators will be asking all

kinds of questions about the economic health of america, the federal budget, what he sees his future tax policy for the u.s. he's likely going to face questions about his past as a goldman sachs banker as well as the controversial investment a few years back being accused of faulty mortgage practices. we're watching defense contractor lockheed martin. the deal could be close to $9 billion and see the cost per jet fall below $100 million a piece for the first time in that program's history. it's the early target of president-elect donald trump's programming. one other stock we're going to watch closely is netflix. it's expected to open at record highs. it reported stronger profits and also added over 7 million

subscribers globally over the last quarter. netflix has been spending a ton of money on more original content and signed a deal with jerry seinfeld. they are planning about a thousand hours of original content this year versus 600 last year. >> whoa. that's a lot of work. cnbc's dominic chu, thank you very much. >> we credit all of that work to the crown. have you seen it yet? >> i've seen it at least twice. but netflix, the crown, original content programming, they pose a huge -- sony has a movie studio of in los angeles. >> you look at jeff buccas in 1999. hbo was a little more than basically a videotape and jeff buccas was the first to do this.

instead of playing old film, i'm going to jump t cliff and risk it all on a little series called "band of brothers" and it changed everything forever. you saw netflix do it later on and they continue to with "the crown". >> and do content for a living. writers, directors, actors, they are now, many of them, much more attracted to small screen productions than they are to big screen get in your car and bring everybody, buy the popcorn, you know, $50 -- >> you have a lot more creativity. same thing when you look at pot spotify. we don't have to sit here and freak out about something that we're going to put out because i

could just stream something next week. >> yeah. >> jacob soboroff will be here when we come back. the better. i love you. but i love him. i love him, too. so do i. they also know you should get your annual check-up. it could save your life. it's a new year. schedule your check-up today to learn your four health numbers and start the year off right. cigna. together, all the way. at bp, we empower anyone to stop a job if something doesn't seem right, so everyone comes home safely. because safety is never being satisfied. and always working to be better.

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i thodid the ancestrydna toian. find out i'm only 16% italian. so i went onto ancestry, soon learned that one of our ancestors was eastern european. this is my ancestor who i didn't know about. in canada and other cotries,ll people have the right to get health care. do you believe we should move in that direction? >> if you want to talk about other country's health care systems, there are consequences to the decisions that they've made just as there are consequences to the decisions that we've made. i believe, and i look forward to working with you, to make sure that every single american has

access to the highest quality of care and coverage that is possible. >> has access to does not mean that they are guaranteed health care. i have access to buying a $10 million home. i don't have the money to do that. >> all this week, msnbc's jacob soboroff has been digging into the potential real-world implication of trump's campaign promises and this morning he's looking at the promised repeal and replacement of the affordable care act. jacob joins us now from mt. sinai hospital. jacob? >> reporter: good morning, mika. a replacement of obamacare will come soon after repeal but they are not so sure of that here in chicago and it's not just patients but hospitals like this that serve at-risk communities that are worried. check this out z so this is the telementary floor. patients are here because of

pneumonia and heart attack and stroke. >> reporter: folks here call ground zero for the affordable care act. that's because the hospital serves a community with seven times the unemployment rate as the rest of chicago. three times the rate of chronic disease. >> if it's repealed, it's actually going to be much difficult for the hospital to treat patients efficiently. >> reporter: donald trump says he wants to repeal and replace the affordable care act because it's destroying our country. even president obama admits the law hasn't fixed u.s. health care and could use some fixing itself. a repeal without a replacement could result in 20 million people losing health insurance entirely, including many of the patients here. >> i'm going to sit on the floor and chat with you for a minute, if that's okay. so what brings you here? >> well, i had a problem with my heart. >> and how are you feeling? >> i feel a lot better now because i had treatment. >> and how long have you had insurance recently?

>> scrubbe out there? >> let me see. >> so i'm talking about mr. hall. >> mr. hall is doing very well. i expect that he's going to go home tomorrow. he would need medications for life. >> and so what he was saying to us about getting on the affordable care act, you think if he had had insurance previously, you might not be seeing him now? >> absolutely. he may not have this stage of heart failure that he's in right now. >> put on hand sanitizer. >> i have to get in the habit of doing this. hi, sir. so what brings you here? >> pneumonia. >> pneumonia? >> and asthma. >> asthma? >> yeah. >> you know, with the obamacare, i'm thinking coverage and i appreciate that. but i don't know what's going to happen if they put trump in

there. i might die any time. >> with trump in there, if they take away the obamacare. >> the american hospital association says the millions of people expected to lose coverage with an obamacare repeal, health care services, jobsing with the effect on patients, this hospital is a pillar in the community and we're serving a lot of patients that wouldn't go anywhere else because they can't find anyone else and it's going to be on the patients and also on the hospital as well. >> reporter: there's been a lot of focus on what the aca repeal guys would mean for kids on their parents' health care and people with pre-existing conditions. but i have to tell you, it's hospitals like this one and the services they offer that stand to suffer greatly as well and that's what i learned here on the ground. see you guys in washington

tomorrow. >> jacob, hope to see you tomorrow. thank you so much. great work. >> final thoughts this morning? >> mike, final thoughts? >> we're in a studio where in the year 2000 turns to politics tim russert said florida, florida, florida off of jacob's piece. the future of the trump administration, i'm saying health care, health care, health care. >> it will determine whether he wins wisconsin, michigan, pennsylvania and wisconsin. >> steve kornacki? >> and whether republicans retain power in two years. >> i love taking the big picture view at a moment like this. who would have ever thought two years ago the 2016 campaign would end january 20th, 2017, with donald trump being sworn in as president of the united states. >> and on top of that, we spent an entire year and a half talking about the collapse, mika, of the republican party and how the republican party would pick up the pieces and it's now the democratic party this week that has to find itself.

>> i think elijah cummings said the best thing, we need to move forward. >> in mar-a-lago. it's going to be trump care and it was very reassuring. he knows he owns it. >> appreciate the protests but this is about america coming together tomorrow so let's do that. we're going to see you tomorrow live from capitol hill. that does it for us this morning. thank you so much for watching. we greatly appreciate it. stephanie ruhle right now is i can approximating up the coverage. >> thanks, guys. i'm stephanie ruhle. i'm live in washington, d.c., and we're one day away from donald trump officially becoming the country's 45th president. there is action in this town under fire. trump's pick for secretary treasury