because we have a house and senate who is will us getting there stuff out of the tax code. >> not all lobbyists are bad, mean are good. it's gotten so out of hand and it hurts you. thank you for watching. see you tomorrow night. if you cannot watch live, set dvr, make sure to follow me @twitter greta. "hardball" starts right now. party asher, let's play "hardball." good evening.. i'm chris matthews. we're less within a week within new administration president trump made possible fight anything that stands in his way. abc news last night shows gung

ho president ready to defend implement devisive campaign promises. as trump said, he intends to implement version of the plan. >> are you concerned it's going to cost more anger. >> there's plenty of anger right now. how can you can have more? >> david. i mean, i know you're a sophisticated guy. the world is a mess, the world is as angry as it gets. you think this is going to cause anger. the world is an angry place. >> despite word of the secretary of defense, trump refused to take water boarding off the table. he double down for call-in investigation to back up

investigation 3 to 5 million of illegal immigrants caused him popular vote victory. 2016 election. here what he said about that last night. >> do you think that talking about millions of illegal votes is dangerous to this country? >> not at all, people feel the same way i do. >> you don't think is underminds your -- >> they did not come to me. those were hillary votes. >> he may want to begin investigation at home within the white house a lot of people close to trump are registered to vote in two states. in addition to son-in-law jared kushner and daughterity fannie. >> it came at at trump this

morning issued thisali you'llty mate tum on twitter. we are seeing emerge battle as advertise in 2016 campaign, get businesses tax cuts. there's battle between his agenda and crowd size and 201 popular vote. it comes as discuss a path ford. there to cover it is nbc casey hunt. the republicans have gotten used to have a plan because they did not have a president. now they have a president that come into door with his plan, how are they meshing in filly? >> republicans have no idea what donald trump's plan is until he tweets about it. even they they maybe trying to

convince him behind dloes closed doors. they are being constantly surprised. take today the wall on mexico was going to be paid forment sean spicer made comment about how there's going to be tax from mexico. paul ryan think this is them embracing to -- only to have spicer take it back this one part on the table. it's why it's about so uncomfortable to watch them answer plans over trump's jepd over the last two days. they don't want to be talking about all. they don't want to be talking about the election in 2016, investigation into voter fraud. there is not typically how the relationship goes between the party that controls both wlous

and congress. >> isn't there a problem and focus, for example, but trump want to do something to stop illegal immigration, the people in the congress do they have a plan to the wall. do they go along with big spending. i wonder if those to alone are going to cause a clash prey soon? >> yes, a lot of donald trump's populist agenda contrast directly championing for years now. these guys are fiscal conservatives, they are big on border security but they do not wnt to alienate histories because they believe they are long-term in the future in the party. there's a personality clash. mcconnell refer to each other by title, they wear ties to work

every day, donald trump, i he wears a tie, he refers to people by first time. he called his commerce secretary, wilbur. the way they interact is oil and water sometimes. >> thank you casey hunt. rather than focus on raen -- today spoke out against water boarder after trump reopened that debate on torture. >> i believe my members are comfortable on that. >> torture is not legal. it's we agree it's not legal. >> since becoming president, political -- during the campaign

many supports and advisers said they took promises seriously but not literally. putting them at odds with the critiques but memrs with the own party. you're an expert i know you know all of this. you know trump is trump. he is his own guy. he want to deal with infrastructure, build stuff, republicans are hesitant to spend money. but tell me how they get together. republican regulars and trump? >> the media, particular, the media want to focus on nix and knacks and voter investigations all of that. >> $20 billion wall that little thing -- >> let's talk about whether

there has to be anything close. i'm for border security. we need secured border. but a wall is not the best way to get it there's variety of technology augought to be used. the wall is the best thing in some places, but if this goes through we'll get kind security people wanted and voted for thought they were going to get back in 1986 if you remember. >> yes. >> the first thing we promised the people in 1986 was a secure border and no one has produced that. now trump's determined to produce it. when he talks in terms of a waum

is a metaphor but i think -- we need border security. the thing that donald trump got elected because of is to grow e economy. more jobs, better paying jobs whether infrastructure or tax reform that brings home trillions of dollars, that's what this is about. it gets very little attention from the media. >> the problem with the '86 bill is we need a -- the problem is that the white working class guy that voted for trump, we're going to stop part of our effort we're going to stop illegal hiring of cheap labor across the

brder. they did not deal with it. is that part of the package, if so, why did he never mention illegal hiring. >> as you see when we go through this congress, there's things that security border, things that make it much, much, much, harder to hire somebody illegally and much easier and likely to government ask catch people doing that and they will be punished. this is what's going to be worked through with this congress. i think successfully. and the main this is we need is to grow our economy, we can't stand eight more years of 2% growth. president oba president obama never had a year where economic growth is 3% or

more. after the great recession in 82 and the reagan and bush years the committee grew 4 1/2% a year. >> president trump predicted this congress would be busiest ever. >> this congress is going to be busiest congress we've had in decades. maybe ever. think of that. we have to deliver enough all talk, no action. we have to deliver. >> howard fine man. i see a conflict. republicans they don't to spend money. democrats will spend a little on

domestic issues. and trump likes to spend money and build stuff. >> how do we deal with it. the problem is they're surrounding b tweets inhich donaldrump is dealing with everything but the meat and potato things that barbara was talking about. the things i do best is build things. that was great. i think even people oppose him say, okays, you build things. build things and stick to the economic message. that's what the guys and girls wanted to do. instead he picking fight with mexico over whose going to visit whom. on voters, laundry list of

cultural -- >> here is where the aural would be. would you rare cut social security medicare or start building stuff, what would they say? >> if you from able to convince them that the building stuff thing was real and make the other part liean you can sell that. that would take all the sale man ship that donald trump is famous for. don't waste your salesmanship on all this other stuff. >> jim baker was able to keep ronald reagan on track. it was cut tax, cut spending, build military. over and over again. reagan stuck to his guns. >> the thing about donald trump

he know he able to make news on any topic. he know he can respond to anything he sees on morning show -- what he needs to do is focus on what i think. i talk -- i went to all the rally, i talk to a lot of supports. i said where are you here. why were you hear for donald trump? . you didn't hear sanctuary cities, or voterer fraud, or the equal. you heard republicans say i think he can get jobs and build the economy. that's ultimately, that's generous idea what he was elected to do. >> we beginning to smell cement and earth moving. replace decay with the smell of construction. >> he said, the pipelines for

the gas is going to be fabricated from america is guy from pittsburgh. president trump called for voter first of all,eraud. all of registered to vote in two different states, corruption. torture works. even though the experts say it doesn't. he wants to take iraq's oil. inside the trump's resissants the women's march could lead to a movement. this a "hardball" where the action is. ♪

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today the republican retreat in philadelphia, president trump raved about his executive orders which he says putting power back into every day americans. trump said in 2012 when president obama trump tweeted why is he using executive orders -- complaining obama use of executive orders. they are aploweding trump's action tonight. we'll be right back. and medica. now with zero-dollar copays on select plans... ...and rewards points on all prescriptions, walgreens has you covered. so drop by and seize the savings! walgreens. at the corner of happy and healthy. i've been blind since birth.

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you brought in congressional leaders to the white house. you spoke about the presidential election with them telling them you lost because of the millions of illegal votes. >> you were note to suppose to talk to the press, the democrats viewed it -- >> io.

i said it i said it strongly because what's going on with voter fraud is horrible. >> welcome back to "hardball." that was trump investigation into voter fraud. fact-checker disagreed -- according to the president that doesn't matter. >> you know what's important, million of people agree with me whether i say that. if you looked the network on the people calling in, they are smart people. >> you think talking about illegal votes is dangerous to the -- >> mean people feel the same way i do. >> back in 201 he was looking into awuthenticity of president obama birth certificate. >> you have people searching in.

>> absolutely. they could not believe what they are finding. >> he spending federal resources. let's watch. >> you have people that are registered who are dead, they are were illegals in two states. in new york and new jersey. >> funny he should say that. it turns out his incoming treasury steve minute -- of the "washington post." i done why know you keep putting you -- i'm going to go out and

find those people registered in two states. give me a break. >> they don't exist. >> except his family. >> be careful what you wish for here. >> chinese curse. >> there's no -- >> is there a serious problem of voter cheating in this country? >> no. there are instances or owe occurrences. it's not orchestraed where it involves millions of people. the reality of it is it's a talking point. it is a driving point, when i say that a lot of my supporter agree with me. >> they feel that way. >> the reality is the country c cannot afford and this government cannot afford this

type of waste of dollars to investigate something we know -- >> you know the city, for every call to action. this is going to be -- something going to be hired. labor department, who are these people he going to sign the order, when is he going to tell us who going to pay for this nationwide check? >> the cost of it with all due respect is the least scarry part. >> it is government money. when we rally against waste fraud and abuse, throw that in the basket. not only as pew resech and news organizations but government has looked at this through organization assistant

economy and did not find widespread voter fraud. the justice department investigates crimes. the interesting to be see what he does. interesting to see what he comes up with. it's going to hard to come up with this massive evidence, but i'm worried, not that this destabilizes voter trust in people but used to argue in favor of in addition em pediment to voting. too many voting, it's too few people voting. >> if if you take the take 11 million people, can walk into voting booth and get a vote is high. scared to death of being picked

up find a name of somebody's identity to steal, all the collaboration, the conspiracy behind the idea, 5 million people, figuring out how to vote for somebody else who agreed to vote that day and voted for hillary. they forget about michigan, pennsylvania, and wisconsin. that's what makes this ludicrous. >> numbers, independennumbers. here he is. >> we had a massive crowd of people. we had a crowd, i looked over that sea of people and i said to myself, wow.

i have seen crowds before, big, big crowds. that was some crowd. >> here is a picture of the crowd. the oaudience was the big as ever. look how par back it goes. >> the president tells us he want to show us one more image. >> this goes over here. this how far this is. it goes all way down here. >> the president also bragged about his speech to the cia on saturday, the one criticized political message. >> that speech was a home run. that speech if you look at fox, okay, i'll mention your network, they said it was one of the great speeches. they showed the people applauding and skaeming.

had one the -- super bowl stadium which is roar. >> i have no idea where in comes from. the image of the president, instead of talking politics, it'sntertainment. >> as he talks loud he tells the press to -- >> not shutting up steve bannon. not me. he called "new york times" said the press should just shut up. >> steve bannon did this? >> yes. >> there's a constitution he may

want to read. >> thank you, so much, michael and ruth. up next, donald trump says torture works. general said when it comes to torture donald trump doesn't have a clue. this is "hardball" where the action is. but i keep it growing by making every dollar count. that's why i have the spark cash card from capital one. with it, i earn unlimited 2% cash back on all of my purchasing. and that unlimited 2% cash back from spark means thousands of dollars each year going back into my business... which adds fuel to my bottom line. what's in your wallet?

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is the which is underway in philadelphia where she praised president's new vision for america. >> the newly embolden america is good for the world. america who is strong and prosperous at home is nation could lead at home. >> tomorrow may will meet with president trump at white house. corporation resubmit application to rebuild keystone pipeline following executive orders sign by president obama. back to "hardball." i have a general who have great respect for general mattis, who said he is not a

believer in torture. vi spoken to others in intelligence and he are big believeers, as an example water boarding. i have spoking with people at highest level, i asked the question does torture work the answer was yes, absolutely >> trump was told that yes, torture works. here he is on campaign trail. >> i said i'll answer the question. what do you think about waterboarding, i like it a lot. i don't think it's tough enough. you have to fight fire with fire. would you approval water boarding rkts you bet your ass i would approve it. in a heart beat.

torture works. believe me, it works. >> mike pompeo says he won't comply, it's illegal and should stay that way. >> if you were ordered by the president to restart the cia's use of enhanced intar gags techniques that fall all -- would you comply. >> i would not. >> i believe all of my members are comfortable with the stay of the law on that issue now. >> torture is not legal. >> we agree with it not being legal. >> refired four-star general,

barry mccaffrey. thank you. >> i have seen a lot of combat in my sometime, i think those statements by president trump are shameful. it's a violation of international law and u.s. federal law. we went through that chapter with secreta rums felled which they were panic why is why we issued the orders we have cleaned it and we're not going to go back. i'm astonished at president trump's issue on this. >> if you were to talk to speem who have experience in combat -- is it your view that trump is the odd man out? >> absolutely.

it's not going to happen. mattis is an adult. he is disciplined. he is the marine. this is not value of the u.s. armed forces. that issued during the rumfeld, put us at risk. we don't want anyone doing that to them. it's a bus that escape for a hundred years. this is a wrong way to go. it's not going to happen. it's a shameful position to take by the president of the united states. >> trump said he is not a military guy, but takes a business guy view of the war fair. if we go into iraq, he talking about we'll grab the oil. can you tell me, you're the expert, giving young men and

women to guard oil field over in iraq, i wonder what military mission that would be even if it were legal internationally? >> this is a fantasy. if we invaded iraq with 150,000 troops, stomped out their government and stole their oil that would be stupid illegal plan. but the notion you can take somebody's oil, i cannot imagine where he comes from with this position. >> a businessman's thinking. >> thank you general for putting that one to bet. up next we saw millions take to street over the weekend. could the women's march turn into movement that could -- you're watching "hardball."

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well kwcome back to "hardba" wake in the massive turn out many have been left wondering what's left. this week "time" magazine wonder how a march could become a movement. they are signs of the historic march on washington was start of the growing grass roots agenda. 60,000 people, 4,000 are set to march on april 15 for trump to release tax returns. panelist joins me. start with you heidi, is this start of something big what happened last week?

>> that's first contrast that we see with the tea party because it was so subtle. so many people see invested i what happened here it's something about bigger than des messic politics it's about preserving our idea of democracy. that's why you see internationally, people were 80 countries have donated to the recent planned parenthood to. >> to add to that, there's an idea, what i'm seeing that's different from black lives matter or occupy wall street, a talk to a lot of women who talked about the fact they were

concerned about immigration rights, or they were concerned about black lives matter so this idea that when one community is attacked or when one community happens issues it's something you soo be concerned about, that's different than the protests vi covered in the past. >> the various wings of the democratic party right now. there's the progressive wing, then you have the literal wing, and the governing part, schumer and al franken, how do they get together. the push seems to be to go left? >> i think women are leading the resistance right now. it's a women's march. there were a lot of women who

spoke at it it. it's going to be elizabeth warn that's taking too into the next. that's who pple are looking too for leadership now. >> an ashist just -- they want to do what, to they want to stop trump in his tracks or what's the goal? >> they want to stop him in his tracks and lose the next election. >> i think that's fair. >> they are frustrated that hillary lost. they want to usher in new generation -- >> i do think that some dem democrats are concerned about

taking on the obstructist label. president trump put your money where your mouth is, we're willing to work with you on trade compact and trying to try anning late a bill with the people in congress to work with them. >> it sounds like me talking. you don't have to like these people. you can get something from them. >> it is true you have bernie sanders saying you should not -- however, i think the unifying thing we can agree on is that donald trump is unifying -- you cannot get into this idea that you're going to say i'm about

climate, and that's -- i'm not ready to say that the progressives are going t win the battle. hillary clinton didn't lose by a landslide. it was a tight race. the people in the party are not saying -- tinchts. >> the wind could have turned and it could have been no come me helped them win. >> everybody is -- everybody is they -- people like to be with winners. the roundtable is sticking with us. this is "hardball" where the action is. nology gave us the power to turn this enemy into an ally? microsoft and its partners are

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functioning government so we're in good company with other countries like italy and japan which has been downgraded. >> who wins these things? >> the nordic countries. anecdotally they're also the countries that have the best policies on equal pay for women. >> bernie sanders loves those nordic countries. he does? >> so mine is something having to do with twitter. up until today donald trump was tweeting from an account that was linked to a gmail account. people think that was a security risk because obviously now it's the most important twitter in the world. >> are we back to hillary here? >> we are not back to hillary but there was a lot of talk about it and now he's switched to a white house dhouse.govwhit >> does he get in bed without staff a tweet? >> from our understanding there's an android phone he's tweeting with within the white house. >> and there's no intercept. nobody to say "stop, that's no

good"? nobody can do that? >> not that we can tell. >> wow. laura? >> my colleague just reported that an interview with obama's drug czar just magically disappeared from the government's web site. it was scrubbed off by the trump administration and so it seems like they're trying to slowly erase the obama administration's legacy from the web sites. >> wow. anybody got anymore? >> another day. >> elizabeth warren quietly posted on facebook last night to defend her endorsement of ben carson for hud. it seems like there's tons of outrage among progressives that she's not completely obstructing everything trump is trying to do. >> so she voted for ben carson. >> yeah. >> i was in the hearing. one of the things she did was grandstand about this idea that donald trump needed to release his tax returns and that this was all about kind of trump -- yeah, all about trump but shi didn't go after ben carson in that hearing. i was more surprised that senator brown voted for him because he was reading off ben

carson's issues and all the things he said about public assistance so i was surprised. >> to hear democrats saying that we cannot run around with our hair on fire about absolutely everything. if we want to make progress or stop some of the worst stuff that they think is coming down the pipeline they have to prioritize and not be outraged about every single thing that happened. >> the progressives that ran the march are furious for not being completely obstructionist. >> but if you're the mayor of boston you'd like to get some grants. thank you laura, yamiche and heidi. when we return, let me finish with trump watch. you're watching "hardball." ♪

(vo) do not go gentle into that good night, old age should burn and rave at close of day; rage, rage against the dying of the light. do not go gentle into that good night. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

trump watch, thursday, january 26, 2017. there's something strange in the neighborhood. i'm talking about the area of 1600 pennsylvania avenue here in washington. why would an american president, even a brand-new one, want to say things that are impossible, even for his most committed fans, to believe. some examples. look at a picture of the washington mall in january, 2009, at the time barack obama was taking the oath of office and then you put beside it a picture of the same wall when president trump was being sworn in. okay. with people looking at the pictures you say this is what our new president is saying that his crowd was bigger. his is bigger. let's try another. you look at the popular vote count and see hillary clinton defeat trump by nearly three million votes. then you hear president trump saying three to five million illegal immigrants voted for

hillary. what would you make of that? would you say, yeah, up to five million people living in the shadows went to their local voting station and used the name of someone on the registered voter list they were assured was not going to vote that day. three to five million, ten million illegal immigrants of voting age did that? well, again, do you believe it? suppose trump were to say there are 10,000 rapists waiting in tijuana to run across the border. would you believe that? suppose he told you the moon was made of blue cheese or whatever. where would you stand on that one? after all, didn't he begin this discussion by talking about immigrants across the rio grande being rapists. didn't he say for five years one of the illegal immigrants in this country right now was barack obama, the guy he road to the capitol with last week? before you answer, let me remind you of two statements, one from ronald reagan, the other from one of the marx brothers, both are relevant. president reagan once said in urging people to pay attention to that their health "don't be afraid to see what you see." i didn't think of better advise

by the way. especially for people afraid to go to the doctor. the other squoquote is chico man "duck soup" who are you going to believe? me or your own eyes? that's it for me, "all in" with chris hayes start right. tonight on "all in." >> you have people registered in two states. >> a voter fraud investigation that began as a game of telephone with a professional golfer. >> why did he write the report? >> tonight, why the president abruptly canceled the kickoff of his voter fraud probe. and what we learned from his first big interview. >> this goes all the way down here. all the way down. i. plus, today's diplomatic meltdown with mexico. >> the american people will not pay for the wall. >> and a political firestorm after the white house floats a 20% tax hike to pay for the wall.