and i think you started to see that daylight emerge yesterday when republicans wasted no time in calling for jeff sessions to recuse himself. >> that'll do it for this hour and week. thank you both for joining us. mtp daily starts right now. if it's friday, denials don't add up. >> tonight, the russian connection. new questions about russian ties in the trump circle. a defiant white house calls it a total witch hunt, republican senator rand paul and democratic senator amy cloeb shire join us. plus guess who used personal e-mail for official business? this time it's vice president mike pence on the the defense. >> there's no comparison whatsoever. between hillary clinton's practice -- >> and the separation of sports and state. >> i'm working hard to get sports back to get jobs back. >> we'll hear from north carolina's new democratic governor about the fight to repeal the state's controversial

bathroom bill. this is mtp daily, and it starts right now. good evening. i'm chris jansing in new york, welcome to mtp daily. new revelations as two more trump campaign officials face scrutiny over the contacts with russia nap comes just 24 hours after attorney general jeff sessions, former trump campaign advisor recused himself from any investigation into the campaign after it was revealed he met with the russian ambassador during the election and didn't disclose it. president trump is blasting these russia stories as a quote, witch hunt. the new developments come after the president, the vice president, the white house chief of staff, the press secretary, and his deputy all went on the record at various points in the last two months to deny contact between the trump campaign and russian officials. which we now know isn't entirely

accurate. on january 11th, as he was exiting a press conferce, president trump was asked by a reporter whether members of his team were in contact with russian officials during the campaign. he said, no. since that time, we've seen multiple senior white house officials echo that denial. >> can you say with 100% confidence that mr. trump or anybody in this campaign had no, no conversations with anybody in russia during the campaign? >> no. i mean, i'm just telling you -- it's all phony bologna garbage. >> i'm asking you a direct question, was there a direct contact between trump or his associates and the kremlin or cutouts they have? >> i joined this campaign in the summer and i can tell you that all the contact by the trump campaign and associates was with the american people. >> can you still say definitively that nobody on the trump campaign, not even general flynn, had any contact with the russians before the election?

>> i don't have any -- there's nothing that would conclude me that anything different has changed with respect to that time period. >> and according to usa today, the white house deputy press secretary told reporters last month, quote, no contact took place. in addition to contact with russia during the campaign, both carter paige who the trump describabled as an informal advisor and j.d. gordon, national security adds visor met with the russian ambassador at the republican convention in cleveland last july. that's according to usa today. gordon has confirmed the meeting. and here's what page told my colleague chris hayes last night. >> did you meet him in cleveland? did you talk to him? >> i'm not going to deny that i talked with him. although -- >> so you did? >> i will say that i never met him anywhere outside of cleveland. let's just say that much. >> additionally, as nbc news reported back in november, president trump's former campaign manager, paul manafort,

is being probed by the fbi for his ties to russia. the president fired his national security advisor, mike flynn, two weeks ago for misleading the white house about a call he had with russia in december. and all of this doesn't include the president's sometimes head-scratching defense of russian president vladimir putin or president trump's denials of u.s. intelligence on russian hacking. it also doesn't include the bizarre episode during the gop convention where pro-russia language about ukraine slipped into the gop platform. bottom line here, as the president complains of a witch hunt, questions continue to pile up. i'm joined now by republican senator rand paul of kentucky who is demanding his party make public a secret draft of the current obama carrey placement bill. senator, we're going to get to that top nick just a minute, i want to begin with the subject of russia. and i just to want ask you up front, do you trust republicans to investigate a republican president, the leader of his

party, something that affects not just him, but members of his cabinet, or would you think the more appropriate thing would be to have a special prosecutor? >> well you know, i think law enforcement is probably the most appropriate first venue. fbi, usually investigates the people that have broken the law. i think i would start there. and i still haven't been actually informed exactly what laws have been broken, but if laws have been broken, i'd start not with a political investigation, i'd start with the fbi. >> would that include doj? >> well, you know the fbi investigates, and then i think the way it works, you know, i'm not an attorney, but i think the way it works they present the evidence, either to a grand jury or sometimes to the department of justice and then the department of justice decis. >> but you didn't seem to trust the department of justice last summer when they were looking into hillary clinton's e-mails, in fact, you tweeted a couple of times today comey and obama's doj made it clear to the american people there is no accountability, no justice, and the clintons live by different

rules. you also tweeted on july 5th, this is a loss for the rule of law and further degrades america's faith in the justice system. so, i guess based on those comments, i wonder if you feel the same way now. if you didn't trust a democratic-led doj back then, can you trust a republican doj now that the president is republican or the people who are -- they're looking at are republicans? >> you know what, i think they're not exactly the same situation, and maybe not at all the same situation. so for example, we had four of our security forces die in benghazi, and we were investigating something i think of great significance, there was also an investigation of whether or not hillary clinton had allowed top secret e-mails to be sent in an appropriate manner. i think that's a little different than saying a u.s. senator one time sfoek an ambassador. we've had problems on both sides

misremembering whether you melt with the russian ambassador. one of the democrats this week tweeted out she never met with the russia ambassador and very certain of herself until someone showed her a twitter feed and she had. we have to decide before you take big, big steps, let's take some small steps and determine any laws have been broken. >> for some people the small steps started with the statements that were made repeatedly by members of this administration and president himself saying unequivocally that nobody, nobody in that inner circle had ever spoken to any of the russians when clearly they had. not only had they, but at least one case, it had happened right at trump tower. >> yeah. i'm not really aware of all, you know, the detail us of who spoke to whom when. i haven't really been apart of that. >> but don't you think that's critical to getting to where -- whether or not something went on that was not right? >> you know, a lot of people have made as if there is some great thing that has either been against the law or to be found.

i have yet to be made aware of that. if someone makes me aware of the laws broken, then i think really law enforcement ought to be involved, but i get more of the sense of a political sort of witch hunt in this sense and still people very, very unhappy with the election, you know, immediately calling for the resignation of everybody they can point their fingers at. i think there is a political aspect to this. and the better way to keep politics out of it is probably let law enforcement look at it. >> but is the better way to have someone who is independent, who's outside of politics do it? i want to play if i can, senator, what you told fox news radio about republicans investigating their own. let's take a listen. this was after by the way mike flynn. >> i don't think it's useful to do investigation after investigationing with particularly of your own party, we'll never get started with doing the things we need like repealing obamacare if we're spending our whole time having republicans investigate republicans. i think it makes so no sense. >> for people who are concerned about this, if you're going put it to rest, serious questions have been raised by serious people --

>> i think -- >> someone outside of the political system? >> i think you have to put in context the quote you just played. i was asked about john mccain investigating trump, and i think there's bad blood between the two. and i think that's not necessarily the best venue. so while democrats can politicize investigations, so can republicans. and the point i was trying to make, that i think was last on some people, is that maybe law enforcement ought to do this if there is someone that has broken the law. and i think the fbi is the best venue. that's also, you know, what occurred under the clinton investigation, no investigation is perfect, it's very hard to keep politics out. you know, there was the appearance of impropriety when loretta lynch met with bill clinton while his wife was being investigated. so there are potential pit falls in having the government investigate the government. i ink the least political probably is the fbi. >> i want to urn to obamacare. a lot of play when you were in the halls of congress yesterday and you were looking for the secret plan, which is

apparently kept in a locked room. having said that, you've been very clear about the fact you want to repeal and then replace. you want to do in that order. for the millions of americans who look and say, the republicans don't have an agreement right now. on what that replacement looks like. and i'm concerned that the plan that i have is going to go away, what do you say to them? how do you repeal without having something already in place and agreed upon? >> let's be very clear. i'm for repeal and replace on the same day, but in separate bills. and it makes a big difference because i think republicans are united in repeal, they're not really reunited in replace. house leadership i think wants to replace with obamacare like. most of the conservatives in the house and the republican, we don't want obamacare light, we want repeal, but we to want offer those struggling to have insurance an alternative. and this replacement bill we have offered, i have put together. it's been out there for over a month now. and many of the ideas that are

in my replacement bill have been out there a decade or more. >> aren't you making my point? there's no agreement on the replacement. how can you replace on the same day? >> let me finish the point then, what i'm trying to say then is if there's no agreement on replacement, why don't we do the bills individually and see where we can find agreement? i think there's consensus among republicans on the repeal. there will be no democrats voting for repeal. on the replacement strategies, i think there are some democrats who may be for some of the different replacements. i have a free market oriented one, my guess is most democrats don't like freedom or the marketplace. they'll probably vote no. but there are some other big government republicans who want government solutions, maybe democrats will vote for some of those, and there may be a cobbled together replacement plan that involves big government republicans and democrats and there may be repeal that involves all republicans. i think there are different ways to get to an answe on obamacare, but i think all republicans are united in believing that what we have now

is a disaster that premiums are going through the roof. and that insurance companies are struggling under the weight of hundreds of millions of dollars of losses and can't continue as is. >> senator rand paul, thank you so much. >> thank you. i'm joined now by democratic senator. amy cloeb shar who was a member of the senate judiciary committee. all nine democrats are calling on sessions to testify about his past statements and his contacts with russia. additionally, a group of committee democrats, including the senator, calling for the doj's inspector general to investigate the decision to recuse himself. good afternoon, thanks very much for being with us. >> thank you, chris, great to be on. >> i want to read from part of this letter, you say that during his confirmation, the attorney general's process were at best incomplete and misleading. do you believe that either when he first testified or yesterday, when he explained that he didn't understand the question.

he believed it meant just about the campaign, do you believe he lied? >> this is why we want him to come before the committee again. senator franken, of course, my colleague was the one that asked the original question, and as he has said, the answers from now attorney general sessions were at best misleading. and some of the questions were asked at pss conference, but i can tell you the senators have a lot more questions we'd like to ask. i would like to ask him what exactly was the substance of those discussions. he says he doesn't remember all of them. perhaps the other people in the room did. for me, the significant fact is that the meeting with the russians ambassador took place only three days, chris, three days after president obama had met with vladimir putin at the g-20 summit where president obama told the world at a later press conference that he was not rolling back the sanctions. then low and behold, three days later, then senator sessions has this meeting with the ambassador

when no other member's of the armed services committee had a meeting it appears during that day or close to that day. and so i find that so odd as well as i want to know did he talk to trump -- >> give ewe different answer than he gave you then or a different answer than the statement he made yesterday? >> we had no opportunity to ask those questions. because the answer that he gave at the hearing was simply, well, you know, i was a surrogate a few times and didn't meet with them. and i guess he now says well that's because it was about the campaign. well, how did he talk to the campaign people before he met with the ambassador or any of them through his staff or directly, and then did he report to them afterward? those are questions that weren't asked that i'd like to get answers to. >> there are a lot of republicans who say there's no there there, the president has called this a witch hunt. you just heard senator rand paul, your colleague also call it a witch hunt saying this is by democrats who still haven't gotten over the fact that they lost the election. what do you say to that?

>> i think we're pretty aware, based on the last month that we lost the election. but the point that we're trying to make here is this is so much bigger than one candidate or than one political party. marco rubio has said that himself. why? because this was an assault on our democracy. when 17 intelligence agencies firmly say that the russians made a major attempt to influence our election, that should scare everyone because they were trying to make a difference in an american election, something our founding fathers worded against in the constitution that we wouldn't have the influence of foreign powers. and so, that's why i would like to see an independent commission, chris, right out of the congress can appoint one, made up of experts. non-political experts. just like we had at 9/11, to supplement the work of the intelligence committee that's already going on and allow us to see in a more open, transparent manner who happened and also how we can fix this moving forward. next time it may not be russia,

maybe it'll be another country. >> have you spoken to senator grassley or has diane feinstein who's the ranking neck spoken to him? do you have any indication at all that either there's an inclination to call jeff sessions back to retestify? i mean, not to even mention an independent commission. >> first of all, senator feinstein is the ranking democrat on the judiciary committee, and we have all asked for him to return to the committee. i have not personally spoken to senator grassley, i will do that next week, but i would believe that senator sessions now attorney general sessions is going to have to come before a committee anyway. since i've been there, the attorney general has always appeared before the committee routinely once or twice, three times a year for various reasons and oversight hearings. i don't think that attorney general sessions is going to be able to avoid coming before the committee. and once he's there, these questions will be asked. >> i understand what you're

saying about timing and i understand that there is concern about what some people thinks looks suspicious, clearlys we have stated in this program, there were statements made by the president and by top members of his administration that turned out not to be true about whether there had been any conversations. but, what is it specifically that you think rises to the level of calling for an independent commission? and i guess beyond that, how do you get that to happen, given the realities of where politics is right now? >> well. what we had happen here was unprecedented. 17 agencies told us this, $200 million in russian tv propaganda, trying to influence our election. you had campaign officials having their e-mails hacked into and then mysteriously the contents of them released in one incident just two hours after the access hollywood video came out. you have reports that there are nearly 1,000 troels in one

building in moscow, that are trying to influence not just our election, but elections all over the world. senator mccain and graham and i at end of the year spent a week in the baltics and ukraine and georgia, the stories we heard here were very similar to what the russians have done in america. hacking into lithuanian parliament members accounts, just when they've invited members of the ukrainian parliament to their country. shutting down the computer system in iowa stone ya after they had the awe das i did to move a statue. this is a very big deal. it's not even just about america, it's about democracies all over and moe tus op ran die that says we're going tos me around if we don't get their way. they're not friendedly economically or don't do our bidding. i think that is a very big deal, chris, and i think it's a cause for an independent commission. >> senator, good to see you, thank you so much 37. >> great to be on, thank you. we're digging deeper about the trump campaign's ties with

russia. that's ahead. and this sunday on "meet the press." chuck schumer sits down exclusively with chuck todd. tune in. we'll be right back. i realize that ah, that $100k is not exactly a fortune. well, a 103 yeah, 103. well, let me ask you guys. how long did it take you two to save that? a long time. then it's a fortune. well, i'm sure you talk to people all the time who think $100k is just pocket change. right now we're just talking to you. i told you we had a fortune. yes, you did. getting closer to your investment goals starts with a conversation. schedule a complimentary goal planning session today. youthat's why you drink ensure. sidelined. with 9 grams of protein and 26 vitamins and minerals. for the strength and energy to get back to doing... ...what you love. ensure. always be you. this i gotta try ldcats 'til we die...

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welcome back. a major political figure is taking heat today for using a personal e-mail account to conduct official business. no, not hillary clinton, vice president mike pence. the indianapolis star reports when he was governor of indiana, pence used an aol address to tuk advisors about sensitive business. including state responses to terror attacks. and the paper reports that aol account was hacked. now if you remember, pence came down very hard on secretary clinton for her use of a private e-mail server at the state department. here's pence with chuck todd on "meet the press" back in september. >> from all of the revelations over the last several weeks is

that hillary clinton operated in such a way to keep her e-mails and particularly her interactions, while secretary of state, with the clinton foundation out of the public reach. out of public accountability. >> vice president mike pence responded this afternoon at a op with speaker paul ryan in wisconsin. >> no, there's no dpar son whatsoever. between hillary clinton's practice and having a private server, mishandling classified information, destroying e-mails when they were requested by the congress and by officials. we have fully complied with all indiana's laws. >> we'll be right back where more on the russian specter clouding the trump administration. keep it here.

welcome back to mtp daily. i want to get to tonight's panel to talk about all things russia. i'm joined by joan walsh.

between them, you saw how big the divide is right now. beth, so where are we on this? >> well, we saw the divide and it's not going to heal any time soon. the thing that strikes me though chris, why don't the republicans want an independent council or independent investigation. this would take out of their hands. they have so many things on their agenda that they want to pursue. they want to pursue immigration reform, repeal and replace obamacare. they want to do tax reform. all of that is going to be bogged down on all these questions about russia if it stay us in the congress. so why not? why not put it out there? >> if you want to get all that stuff done and talking about obamacare and repealing obamacare with your forearm boss, rand paul just now, why not get it out of the way? if there's no there there, let's let somebody figure it out, but he echoed what the white house said whab republicans are saying calling it a witch hunt. >> i think that's republicans

are right now taking their lead from the trump white house and the trump white house has signalled very clearly that they don't want an investigation. and i think that what they're missing here is that by doing an investigation, by moving the issue along, they're not going to get bogged down. and right now, it's looking like the first two years of this presidency is just going to be a slow drip of more contacts with russia, and people, you know, stepping all over themselves in public statements and just a rehash, daily, of what did the trump campaign collude with russia. you know, what actually happened. >> that's the real problem here. the problem is that they deny, deny, deny, and then it's like, oh, but yes. oh, well then there was this one. >> right. >> and there was another one. >> right. it keeps going. it keeps coming out. more meetings coming out. and it's right, it's strange why does rand paul who, you know, ran against this guy, why do they all -- why are -- >> not afraid to go against fellow republicans. >> absolutely not. exactly. why is his casting his lot?

why is the entire republican congressional group with a few exceptionings casting their lot on donald trump? >> why do you think? >> i don't know. i think -- well i think that they think they can get enough of their skbraend through in a way this they probably wouldn't with another president. and so they're willing to sign on to this, but i just think at some point, they're going to have to cut bait or cut loose, cut him loose. this continues to be damaging. >> bargain here. >> exactly. >> they are saying we have the opportunity, the first 100 days especially, the first six months of a presidency when he has so much power and these majorities to really enact legislation and meaningful reform and roll back a lot of what president obama did. and so i think for now, republicans are really in a holding pattern, they really want all of this to stop and they want to be able to enact meaningful reform, but that i think really they're making a mistake. because this isn't going away. >> this is exactly what the american people didn't want. is this exactly why the american people voted for donald trump because they were sick of this. >> they were sick of this, but

they also will have questions. i've been out covering some of the republican town halls, and granted a lot of the folks who have shown up are more progressive voters, but there's a lot of questions about russia. it's not just about health care. these town halls are not completely dominated by don't take away my obamacare, affordable care act. they want to know what's going on about russia and say why don't you investigate this? why not get to the bottom of it? and people have a very hard time answering that questions. it's very strange that they seemingly as you said, don't -- they're throwing it entirely in with a fishy situation. even these guys don't know where this is going to come out. >> is there any there there do you think? >> i think -- >> is there something rotten in the state of denmark? >> i think there's a lot of there there. jeff sessions, the most extraordinary thing happened when he was asked that question by al franken. he was not asked a question about himself. he was asked if these ties exist, if we learn more about these ties, will you be able to handle it between the campaign and the russians, will you be able to deal with this fairly as attorney general? all he had to say, the obvious,

yes, instead he weirdly seemed to answer a question that he was perhaps prepared for, answering it badly, getting himself into this situation where some people even say he may have perjured himself. >> i talked to somebody whose prepped a lot of secretaries for these kinds of -- and she was mystified. breaking news, we just heard from chuck grassley's office, and we just reported that the nine democrats on the senate judiciary committee will calling for grassley to retestify. he's not going to recall him. no big surprise there. >> recall sessions. >> i'm sorry, recall sessions to testify and answer the questions that were, first of all to some exent -- >> that's what we're talking about. that's kind of crazy because it's such a basic, obvious duty of the senate judiciary committee. there is a big thing. sessions has now recused himself. thing that he had been asked about is very fishy. why not bring him back? it's as though we know it doesn't seem like the trump administration wants to get to the bottom of this -- >> if he was asking your advice,

would you say go and do it or would you say, you're just putting yourself throughout for no reason at all. the democrats are just going to go after you for no reason? >> i think that of most of the people involved in this, senator jeff sessions strikes me as the least likely to have been up to something unseemly. he met with the russian ambassador, so what? why not just say you met with him and moved on? the only reason, i don't know if i would necessarily encourage him to get more out there, that press conference he did was kind of shaky. his initial written response prepare ud remarks, it differed from what he ended up saying in the end, which was that, you know, he was a little more vague and i had didn't exactly -- and his answers just contradicted each other within the course of one five-minute press engagement. that makes me think that what is there being hidden here? >> he was going to send a letter to the judiciary committee which is not going to satisfy the democrats. >> and it's not just jeff

sessions. we found out that jared kushner, the president's son-in-law also met with a this russian ambassador. tales brought in through the back door of the trump tower. now again, there isn't really on the face of it a reason why folks can not meet with these highly placed people in foreign governments, then why lie? >> how many people came through the front door were seen by the golden elevators, some came out afterwards -- >> some were controversial, some caused a news storm. this would probably would have happened with the ambassador, still, they would have survived it. >> the number of contacts i find very interesting too that so many people in the campaign were so interested in, you know, meeting with russian emissaries, because you have, i was coordinating the foreign policy on senator paul's campaign, and a lot of lobbyists will contact you trying to get you to meet with the foreign client, there just wasn't time. it made no sense for me to do so, but there weren't enough hours in the day. so it is that -- that strikes me

as a little off. >> yeah. you're going to stay with us. we have more to talk about with. but up next, new moves towards a bathroom bill repeal in north carolina. can governor cooper make good to do away with it? we'll hear from the governor, next. you totaled your brand new car. nobody's hurt, but there will still be pain. it comes when your insurance company says they'll only pay three-quarters of what it takes to replace it. what are you supposed to do? drive three-quarters of a car? now if you had liberty mutual new car replacement™, you'd get your whole car back. i guess they don't want you driving around on three wheels. smart. with liberty mutual new car replacement™, we'll replace the full value of your car. liberty stands with you™. liberty mutual insurance. imy moderate to severeng crohn's disease. i didn't think there was anything else to talk about. but then i realized there was. so, i finally broke the silence with my doctor about what i was experiencing. he said humira is for people like me

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welcome back. north carolina's new democratic governor roy cooper was narrow le elected in november as republicans swept the rest of the ticket. ran against the controversial hb 2 law. that's so the-called bathroom billhich blocks local governments from passing antidiscrimination measures. it stirred emotional protests both for and against. in an msnbc panel in north carolina this week of three trump supporters and two clinton supporters, all of them expressed dissatisfaction with that law. >> i mean, can you imagine if every municipality had their own version of the bathroom bill. go to a town, think, where do i go to the bathroom? >> going to the bathroom. how is it -- no matter who you are, how can you make a problem

of going to the bathroom? >> we find a way to figure out thousand argue about that. going to the restroom. >> now backlash over the law caused organizations to pull out of the state, including the ncaa. there is bipartisan agreement in the state that something needs to be done with the law because of it's economic impact. cooper and the republican-controlled general assembly have been in discussions about how and if to repeal hb 2. chuck todd spoke with governor cooper earlier this week. take a listen. >> so i know that you guys got close to an agreement, actually before you were sworn in. and there was this -- it was almost going to be sort of a mutual decision, the legislature backs off if the city of charlotte backs off and you got charlotte to move, why didn't that make it through the assembly? >> it should have because house bill two is not who we are as north carolina yans. it writes discrimination into

our law we know the effect of it. it has cost of thousands of jobs and hundreds of millions of dollars. and we know it's put a stain on our great reputation here in north carolina. i think one of the reasons that i won as a democrat for governor during a trump wave, even beating an incumbent republican governor is because people were tired of these social issues. they were tired of issues like hb 2 and they wanted to focus on jobs a the economy. but unfortunately, the right wing of the republican party continued to want to bring up these social issues and they are effectively blocking repeal of house bill 2 in north carolina. we almost had it. i had an agreement with the leadership in the republican -- they have super majorities. we had an agreement that i would get charlotte to back down if they would repeal house bill 2.

they caved into the right wing of their caucus. they're still caving into the right wing of their caucus. it is time for us to move forward. it's time for us to get this done. as governor i've worked to tell people that this is a new day in our state. we have a new governor who opposes house bill duo. >> there's a lot of people watching from outside of the state and wondering, gee, the president's have executive authority, they can do certain executive action, president trump actually just had the justice department for instance back down on putting out those new guidances for schools when it comes to transgender restroom issues. so, i guess do you just not have that constitutional authority in the state? >> this is a law. the general assembly put in place. it's like president obama dealing with the republican congress. they're just laws that are on the books. >> so there's no executive authority, there's no executive order you can issue to temporarily stop it. >> not that i could do to get

rid of house bill two, and that's why the legislature has to do it. >> so look, april 18th comes and goes, there's your -- and i know you're trying to create a deadline and sense of urgency here, doesn't seem like the legislature has the same sense of urgency u you have. april 18th comes and goes, are you stuck with this and you just move on and you have to try to do other things? >> i'm working hard to get sports back whereby to get jobs back. i'm winning some arguments with companies by telling them this is a new day in our state. we have a new governor unlike before who supported house bill two and sign it. i'm opposed to it. i tell people this is not who we are as north carolina yans. come back to our state. help us defeat house bill two. you know we're a good state. great universities. great jobs. but there's some like the ncaa and the acc, they want to see tangible evidence from the legislature that they repeal this law. and we're working to try to get

it done. i'm willing to even compromise, there are a number of republicans who want to yeah they say okay, we'll repeal it, but we've got to replace it with something else. the problem is, it needs to work toward eliminating discrimination. and it needs to work. we can't have a house bill 2.2, something that's just as bad and something that won't bring the jobs back. >> this means you don't like the idea of the one compromise idea which would tell cities they would need to put these ordnances to a local referendum. >> i proposed a number of compromises so there are a lot of issues we could talk about. but having these many house bill two fights in cities all over north carolina, when we already have this reputation with this hb 2 law, with the millions of dollars that will be spent, with the 30 second ads, with the national spotlight on our state, it'll be a problem. and it's sort of like putting

the 1960 civil rights act on the ballot in the 1960s. i mean, it's voting on the rights of a minority -- >> but let many be devil's advocate here. there's an exhaustion -- there's clearly an exhaustion over debating this issue. if this is what it took to get hb 2 repealed, and the risk was okay other cities you may have this pop up as a local referendum, but it bha the public's exhausted from it, and at least short term you've gotten rid of hb 2. >> well the problem is that you can't get enough votes for this option because most of the democrats are not buying this. they know that it will create significant problems in cities all over north carolina, it'll put the spotlight back on us for all the wrong reasons. >> governor, what would happen if you put hb 2 up for a referendum statewide. would it win or lose? >> i think it would lose. i think people are sick of it. they want their legislature to

act. and it is time for them to act. it's time for them to repeal house bill 2, let's put this issue in our rearview mirror, and it's time to move forward to get on to other things. >> all right. governor roy cooper, democrat coming to us from raleigh today. governor, thanks very much. >> thanks, chuck. still ahead, we will look at what to expect from the rollout of a revised travel ban. keep it here.

welcome back.

the state department scaled back the rollout of it's annual human rights report today. in a break with tradition. the report was not presented by the country's top diplomat. secretary rex tillerson wrote the preface to the report but did not make any on-camera comments. senior official at the state department said that rather than focus on the messenger, the report speaks for itself. but some human rights advocates are concerned that this departure reflects something larger. a down play ugh of human rights issues by the trump administration. there was criticism within the republican party as well. senator marco rubio wrote on facebook that he was disappointed in the choice, saying quote, others around the world look to the u.s. and often to the secretary of state specifically for signs of where we stand, whose side we're on, and how strongly we will back up our words with actions. and we will hear from senator rubio this weekend on "meet the press." chuck todd will speak exclusively with senator minority leader chuck schumer.

more "mtp daily" after the break. ♪ ♪ everyone deserves attention, whether you've saved a lot or just a little. at pnc investments, we believe you're more than just a number. so we provide personal financial advice for every retirement investor.

the welcome back to "mtp daily." it's time for the lid and my panel is back. before we put a lid on the week. you have to go to the beginning, it started out well for president trump. he had speech, it was well reviewed and before the night was over, everything blew up. what is white house going to do? >> they cannot continue the momentum of when they have made a good play. he was getting applause from across the aisle from the speech. the bar is low. president trump, he cannot seem to continue on a straight narrow path without being wheels off. now he back to tweeting.

now he has been tweeting threats against democrats. >> we thought we got guidance to see the travel ban, maybe next week. >> we thousand it was going to come the day after the speech. they wanted to let it sit and marinate, as we said, the problem with russia over took events. there's a problem with the roll out and dhe have to get this one right. if it's going through the proper legal vetting, they are going to take green card holder off the list. perhaps from people iraq are not going to on the people tt are banned. they are exploring ways to make this airtight. is it going to get caught up in the notion they cannot get out of their own wait. they need to get this right this time. >> on the other side, a lot of them feel like they are back on their heels. what's going to happen when this

does come out? >> it depends on how bad or good it is. because we're not doing what we need to be doing for the refugee crisis. that's a democratic value. there's going fear of people getting caught up in it. i don't know that you can do this size of a ban completely correctly and not wind up with a lot of folks kept out of the country wrongly. >> when he talked about rex tillerson and he criticizing the fact that this tradition of saying we're for human rights and him coming out and sating that clearlily isn't getting done, why is that? what's going on in the state

department? >> senator rubio is correct that it's that united states stands up and we essential it like it and produce this human rights report that is subject to heavy lobbying from allies and fashions around the globe. i wonder if the presentation of report and secretary tillerson not making a statement is less than a product of we're not for human rights and -- >> we don't have the briefing, e we going to go to briefing next week? >> we were told we were on monday. people covering the state departments can't get their phone calls returned. >> we doesn't know since

secretaries we have very few ambassadors who have been appointed. there's a lot of work that goes into alliance and diplomacy around the world. >> i think that it is deliberate agenda. >> thanks for all of you. coming up, a marty mcfly time warp. stay with us. i'm a concrete mason.

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welcome back. in case you missed it a lot can happen in 30 plus years. just ask mcply. he was the michael j. fox character back to the future. when he travels from 1985 back to 1955. he has to explain that a b. movie actor would become president of the united states. >> tell me, future boy, who is president of the united states in 1985? >> ronald reagan. >> the actor. hoe so vice preside, jerry lewis. >> think if he had gone forward to 2017 imagine his surprise when he discovery this man is united states senator from minnesota that being al frannen and then there's the chess

dumbing nrk real estate camera that's right, donald trump, yes that donald trump is now president of the united states. senator al franken and president trump maybe a lot to handle for marly mcany. that's it for now. "for the record" with greta starts now. twitter attack president trump using favorite weapon to lash out. schumer and pe lesscy demanding investigation into ties to russia. tonight vice president mike pence playing defense speaking out on e-mail story, he used el