crucial meeting with russian foreign minister sergey lavrov. we'll be monitoring it all. >> okay. thank you. that's a wrap for us. i'm alex witt alongside ayman mohyeldin. "morning joe" starts right now. the white house draws a tough line on syria, expanding nato and declaring assad's days to be numbered. a gaff on ukraine that unsettled allies. >> speaking of gaffs, in a mid afternoon firestorm, sean spicer calls his vegas rabbi. the controversy that involved adolf hitler, sheldon aid elson and a messy, messy passover. >> that's not good. the republican party asking what's the matter with kansas as a narrow win could spell big trouble for 2018. good morning everyone. it's wednesday, april 12th. with us onset we have pulitzer

prize winning historian jon meacham -- >> wait. jen, help us out here. we get barnicle and it's legendary. whenever we say meacham's name, everyone shouts out french and indian war. french and indian war. >> it was the first global conflict. >> how about just boring. >> pulitzer prize winning historian jon meacham. >> political writer for "the new york times," niclas confessore. will patterson also joining us. in make up in the back. >> pregame ritual. >> did i judge? >> a lot going on yesterday. >> wow. hard to know where to begin.

we'll give it our all here. >> give it our all. >> go, rocky. >> we're in the midst of a huge change. >> the best part of "rocky 2." >> a change of policy and tone. joe thinks so. i think it's a bungling to somewhere. >> david ignatius thinks so. >> "washington post" editorial page thinks so, too. >> who has been asking is sean spicer credible for the past three weeks to every journalist that comes to our set? >> sting? >> i don't know. is sean spicer credible, i've been asking. i thought he's been losing credibility day by day by day by day. >> that's not where we're going to start today. >> we're starting with what you see as a shift in policy and tone. >> hold on. it's not what i see as a shift in policy and tone. it's what david ignatius and a

lot of other people are noting over the past week. thomas friedman and others have noted there has been a shift of change in tone at least in foreign policy. >> okay. there are many that see a shift in policy and tone toward our position toward syria. the white house is accusing russia of trying to cover up the syrian government's role in last week's deadly chemical weapons attack. the trump administration says declassified intelligence shows the chemical agent sarin was delivered by a syrian regime aircraft. meanwhile, president trump is bolstering the u.s. role in one of putin's most hated alliances. today the president is scheduled to meet with the secretaryf general of nato at the white house. they're set to talk about strengthening ties and plan to hold a joint news conference. yesterday president trump signed a treaty allowing the entry of

plo month nag grow into the pact which would expand the reach in eastern europe. president trump will also travel to brussels for a gathering of nato leaders in late may. >> this is obviously, nick, a big change in what's been said about nato. we were wondering would trump's campaign rhetoric win the day, wore would you have people like general mattis saying if nato didn't exist, it's so important, we'd have to create it. who would win there? it looks like he's looking to his foreign policy advisers. >> seem like the masters of policy are coming into their own. they've had a couple months to get up to speed to find their way around the white house, this is tillerson and mattis. i do think tillerson also said ukraine should be a concern to taxpayers. there's a little bumpiness and inconsistency here. if you listen to nikki haley you hear one thing.

any given day it's confusing all over the place. >> not just rhetorical. donald trump last week attacked russia's client state in syria. that was a loud statement, letting russia control the narrative and say maybe the chemical weapons was a setup or the u.s. behind them which vladimir putin alluded to that this morning in an interview. it's not just rhetoric. you had rex tillerson say russia is either incompetent or complicit in these attacks. that's a lot different than what we've heard in the campaign trail. backed up last week by accident. >> we'll talk about it in a second where tillerson we had the gaff, no doubt about it, behind closed doors. in front of the camera he says assad is going to go, only a matter of time and russia better get used to it. we talked about this before, how russia's foreign policy since 1991 has been built upon resentment. althese peop sayg this attack was an inside game, the

russians said, please come attack us, are fools. they know nothing about the way russia thinks. to be there and be seen basically as completely impotent, we know when you're in syria, we don't like what just happened, we're going to blow some stuff up. it sends a who hisk message to russia and putin. >> christmas, the end of the bol shah vic revolution. an incredibly ferocious right flank that included vladimir putin that didn't want to see soviet greatness go away. they returned in ensuing decades -- an interesting combination of a pre world war i game. they want the ukraine, they want the ball ticks, they want eye reason and syria. with this nuclear overlay of cold war expansionism as well.

it's an interesting combination of the two. my own view of all of this right now is i suspect president trump is the political equivalent of climate change. it's not going to be always be hot, always be hold. it's going to be extreme swings. you saw it in the special election in kansas. you see it in the russia policy and the syria policy. he thrives on chaos. he's going to govern in the way he campaigned which was chaotically. >> for a country, mika, that is steeped and has built their foreign policy based on resentment, it's not beyond -- they certainly understand there's a reason why the united states didn't go into check vac yeah and we didn't go into hungary -- was hungary '68? but we fire 50 or so misles into syria in 2017.

my only point this is, this is deeply embarrassing for vladimir putin. you can play all the -- vladimir putin would never want to be sitting in a country where the united states just ran over him. it's interesting. >> let's break this down. secretary of state rex tillerson is warning in no uncertain terms about its ties to syria saying the assad regime was, quote, coming to an end. he said russia is at risk of losing its relevance in the middle east by continuing to support the dictatorship. still, the new secretary's inexperience is showing a bit. he reportedly said to a group of top diplomats at tuesday's g7 meeting in italy say, quote, why should u.s. taxpayers be interested in ukraine, question mark? that's according to france's foreign minister. >> willie? >> the state department said it was a rhetorical question. he wasn't asking why the heck

should we be spending our money? it was meant to open an discussion. >> why did the birds go on singing? >> exactly. >> here is david ignatius' piece that he thought kind of put things in perspective here. you say -- david said -- >> i didn't write this. i would i could claim david's columns. >> you inspire the post. >> trump's week of good decisions could rebalance the world and the white house. the trump administration's foreign policy has been a dizzying spectacle of mixed messages and policy reverseless during its first three months. but in last week's crucial tests, president trump made good decisions about syria, russia and china, moving his erratic administration a bit closer toward the pillars of traditional u.s. policy. the syria openings generally praised at home and abroad has consolidated the power of trump's core foreign policy team in ways that may alter the political balance in thi white use. trump has also tilted towd

china and away from russia. that rebalancing is the opposite of what trump seemed to favor during the campaign when he blasted china and wooed russian president vladimir putin at every opportunity. but it's a more sensible and sustainable course. >> nick, i think that's -- of all the things that we talked about, all the bright shiny objects in front of us, i think the biggest takeaway from the past week and i would say for most of the foreign policy establishment, it has been exactly what david ignatius said at the end. it's not about syria. it's about the fact that he now is actually focused on china in a constructive way. they had a very good meeting, and he seems to be tilting a bit more towards china and a bit more against russia. >> look, the important thing is the pillars of foreign policy that david mentions in that

column. engagement with china, care with russia and to follow that path to get more on base with what happened, the alliances that have propelled our strength and projection of power around the world is actually -- it's extremely important if you can keep it up. our allies were worried up until now. they were constantly sending up flares about alliances and nato and u.s. military force. it's fascinating that you saw obama alumni praising those strikes in syria which really suggests how much there was a desire for some kind of action there and president obama was the lid on it for a long time, for better or for worse. >> i was surprised by just how ready they all were to jump in, the obama administration, which suggests that i'm sure, people

like samantha power who i don't think spoke out onthis, but obviously she was deepl concerned about his syria policy but john kerry. i didn't hear too much from joe biden. all his top players told him for a long time, you can't let this go on in syria. >> john kerry had a plan in 2013 to do exactly what donald trump did last week, which was to attack the air force on the ground and ground the planes so they couldn't carry out those chemical attacks. that was out in the open, it was public, he said it. you have to believe there are a lot of people in the obama state department and the white house that wish obama did what trump did last week. >> two open accounts on obama's foreign policy legacy are syria and the iran nuclear deal, i think. we just don't know how those are going to turn out. that's what even in 25 years we'll be talking about what obama did and did not do. >> let's go to nbc chief global correspondent bill neely in

moscow. given the tension we're talking about, escalated rhetoric following last week's air strike and the idea that rex tillerson will confront sergey lavrov about the russia interfering in the u.s. presidential election. how did it get going? >> it began with a couple of lengthy opening statements, certainly from sergey lavrov, almost sounded like a dressing down at one point as rex tillerson listened, lavrov said we've heard a lot of ambiguous and contrary ideas from washington. we've seen a lot of troubling actions in syria, and it's fundamentally important that these actions don't happen again in the future. he also said it's important for us to understand the real interests of the united states. i think lavrov signaling there that they want clarity from america. is it assad must go or not? rex tillerson replied to that

says he wanted to identify areas of sharp difference and common interest. even when our tactical approaches might be different. i thinkhat word tactics is significant. tillerson isn't going in there with an ultimatum or a demand. i think he's going to focus on the tactics. you, russia, may think it's tactically wise in syria to ally yourselves with assad, with iran, with hezbollah, but strategically, globally does that make sense? is it in your global interest to be allied with these people? how is it going down in the sunni arab world, for example? russia has said we are not wedded to assad. our support for him is not unconditional. rex tillerson wanted to know under which conditions would you be prepared to get rid of assad and how long might that take?

one amazing statement that came out as they were meeting, from vladimir putin on a russian television interview that will broadcast tonight, putin has said the level of trust between the u.s. and russia has deteriorated under donald trump. now, that's pretty astonishing when you think of the level of trust that he had with barack obama which was zero, nil. he's now saying it has deteriorated under donald trump. so that message from putin, he also said where is the evidence that syrian forces used chemical weapons. there is none. on the chemical weapons issue, it could be that lavrov and tillerson, they still basically don't agree that the syrian forces used chemical weapons. >> nbc's bill neely on the ground in moscow for us. thanks so much. putin actually said in that same

interview, let this hang out there that the chemical attacks in syria came from somewhere else, not the assad regime. he didn'tay exactly where. suggesting perhaps we knew something about that. >> let's get back to what happened in the white house yesterday. it took several tries and hours of explanations. white house press secretary sean spicer issued a full apology for suggesting that adolf hitler did not use chemical weapons in world war ii. spicer made the statement at a press briefing responding to a question about why russia should abandon its support for the assad regime. >> we didn't use chemical weapons in world war ii. you had someone as despicable as hitler who didn't even sink to the -- to using chemical weapons.

you have to, if you're russia, ask yourself, is this a country that you and a regime you want to align yourself with? >> hitler didn't even sink to the level of using chemical weapons. what did you mean by that? >> i think when you come to sarin gas, there was no -- he was not using the gas on his own people the same way that assad is doing -- there's clearly -- i understand your point, thank you. i appreciate that. there was not -- he brought them into the holocaust center, and i understand that. i'm saying in the way assad used them where he went into towns, dropped them down into the middle of towns. the use of it. appreciate the clarification there. that was not the intent. >> as the comment sparked outrage, spicer issued a series of clarifications saying in no way was i try to lessen the horrendous nature of the holocaust. eight minutes later he changed

his statement from innocent people to population centers. ten minutes after that he added any attack on innocent people is reprehensible and inexcusable. he came back on camera and issued a full-floated apology, calling his weapons insensitive. >> iwas a comparison to make any kind of comparison. assad has done bad things. >> to be clear you recognize hitler obviously -- >> i'm well aware of what he did. but again, it is a distinction that didn't need to get made. they both did horrendous heinous things to innocent people. to make any comparison is regrettable and a mistake. i'm absolutely sorry, especially during a week like this to make a comparison that is inappropriate and inexcusable. >> by the way, i've got to say he got out there a lot faster than the ceo of united airlines. >> it was an apology from the trump administration, something we've never seen before. >> it was immediate,

full-throated. john said he is not an anti-semite. he just was ignorant on this point. >> it was boneheaded. i was surprised he called sheldon adelson to make an al polling. >> apology. >> the richest ju to ask for forgiveness. we've got bloomberg on speed dial, right, in case we mess up? >> always. >> the lack of context that a lot of people in trump's inner circle had is just stagering. >> what nick was saying during the break is something we've all felt, let's leave hitler out of it. he's without parallel in history. to try to compare anything today with what he did. >> whether from the right or the left. we were saying that about some news stories we were seeing when trump was coming in. >> don't get into a land war in egypt and don't invoke hitler as comparison. two great rules to live by. >> the third, of course, if

you're playing risk, don't ever think you'll be able to think over europe. it takes a while. president trump is giving less than a ringing endorsement of his chief strategist steve bannon. >> as rumors continue to swirl of rising tensions between senior aides a a possible shakeup at the highest levels of the administtion, trump told the "new york post" last night, quote, i like steve, but you have to remember -- >> i like steve, but. i like steve, but. >> which is sort of like in the south, bless your heart. >> look, look. hold on. the "new york post" headline. they pick that up, button right. "i like steve, but." >> i like steve, but you have to remember he was not involved in my campaign until very late. i had already beaten all the senators and all the governors and i didn't know steve. i'm my own strategist and it wasn't like i was going to change strategies because i was facing crooked hillary.

the president also added steve is a good guy, but i told him to straighten it out or i will. bannon joined trump's campaign last august. in a statement announcing the hire at the time, then candidate trump said i've known steve for many years. >> he's doing exactly what we said a couple days ago he was doing, and i had heard from talking to a lot of people inside the white house that they could tell you today that steve bannon came on board. and all this, that's why we've been showing donald trump from 1987. all this talk, mark halperin, that steve bannon created donald trump's nationalistic approach, nationalism, is insanity. and it's gone to a couple different levels of insanity. yesterday i started getting phone calls. bannon is now leaking that jared kushner is calling media executives to plant negative

stories on bannon which he's not doing. i don't want to confuse the viewers too much. but that's what got bannon in trouble in the first place, he's constantly leaking across washington, d.c., about how important he is to donald trump. and then he started attacking jared kushner. now he's abouto g kicked out of the white house. now he's leaking that kushner is leaking. it's like this guy -- somebody needs to tell him just stop while you're behind. >> you saw in the campaign, hillary clinton kept the same campaign manager, same team throughout the campaign. donald trump started with corey lewandowski, then manafort and then bannon. now he continues to think about, does he need to make a change. there's some constants, most importantly being donald trump. mike pence isn't going anywhere. jared kushner and ivanka trump aren't going anywhere. we talk about foreign policy this week, it's going to continue to be the issue. the president meeting with the head of nato today.

if donald trump doesn't think bannon can move his domestic agenda, he's going to have to make a change. >> what has he done? he screwed up the executive order but rushing that out there. again, just for the record let's be clear here. the department of homeland security lawyers told them specifically to make changes to the first executive order, and steve bannon ran over them and said no and rushed it to the president. the president signed it. the buck stops there. but bannon was the guy that rushed it in and there was chaos for a couple weeks. >> i'm sure he was helpful in other ways. >> involved in the debacle in obamacare and marching over to the josing you have to vote on this bill. >> threatening members of

commerce. >> argued against the syria thing. >> bannon is important. he is the guy who put the suit on the nationalism that trump represented. he is the one that dressed it up in some justifications and intellectualism. he was important in that sense. i think him being on the cover of "time" magazine, i kind of wonder if maybe tt was the turning point for donald trump, for president trump. >> no president likes to read that someone else is their brain. i've heard people talking about karl rove and george w. bush. believe me, george w. bush didn't like the idea that someone else was his brain. i think nick is exactly right. trump is the last great consumer of print media, among his other virtues. the idea that he counts the covers he's on, and i think bannon -- in new york in the mid '90s there was a huge shift because rudy giuliani thought he was cleaning up the city, and he

woke up one monday morning and bill bratton was on the cover of "time" magazine as the king of gotham city. bill bratton was gone. >> soon enough. >> that vernacular is hugely important to trump. >> again, the attacks and what people inside the white house don't understand is why bannon, quote, snapped. that's the word they're saying about two weeks ago. he snapped. he started trashing jared kushner. i had people starting to call me saying, hey, i heard this. wait, bannon told you that and he used his name? oh, yeah. it made absolutely no sense. when you're attacking jared, what you're doing is attacking jared, ivanka, gary cohen, dina powell. you're attacking a lot of people in the trump's close circle. it makes no sense. the guy stepped out of line, and he keeps trying to take credit for donald trump saying things that he said back in 1987. >> i want to know about the acid

in the bathtub. i can't figure it out. >> can't fire your son-in-law. still ahead, protests and rallies are scheduled at chicago's o'hare airport today as the fallout for united continues. a very different tone this morning from the company's ceo. we'll also bring in president trump's budget director nick mulvaney, second ranking member in the senate, dic durbin. congressman seth molten and nbc's andrea mitchell live from moscow. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. where's jack? he's on holiday. what do you need? i need the temperature for pipe five. ask the new guy. the new guy? jack trained him. jack's guidance would be to maintain the temperature at negative 160 degrees celsius. that doesn't sound like jack. actually, jack would say, hey mate, just cool it to minus 160 and we're set. good on ya.

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so you'rhow nice.a party? i'll be right there. and the butchery begins. what am i gonna wear? this party is super fancy. let's go. i'm ready. are you my uber? [ horn honks ] hold on. don't wait for watchathon week to return. [ doorbell rings ] who's that? show me netflix. sign up for netflix on x1 today and keep watching all year long. i see what's happening in this country where our so-called allies are ripping us off left and right with japan, saudi arabia and kuwait. i can tell you if i ever was in office which is unlikely because i don't think i want to be, if i ever was, that wouldn't happen. we wouldn't be taken advantage

of the way we are. we're a debtor nation, we were row money from japan to defend japan. the country, the united states is being ripped off and it shouldn't happen. >> that was steve bannon -- wait, no. >> wait a minute. that was trump himself. >> that was donald trump in 1987 when steve bannon was nothing but a glint in his eye. >> is he a partisan, ideological. that's him talking about the second term of ronald reagan. this time running for president as a republican he's talking about barack obama. his guiding philosophy of getting ripped off -- >> not as dark. doesn't have the kind of resentment and the anger of the campaign. >> by the way, that is what we've been saying, the bannon line, carnage. >> that's another bannon success, that speech, amazing. >> that's another thing we've

been saying, too, is trump behind the scenes is not this negative snarling person. he is what nancy pelosi or chuck schumer or anybody else tells you, elijah cummings, says he's charming. that's a peek into what steve bannon certainly had nothing to do with. >> that same deraa he did a donohue interview very similar in conte and prompted richard nixon who moved back to write him a letter saying mrs. nixon had seen and thought he should be running for office. so there was something about his appeal then that got -- >> you know what he is. we've always joked, he's been a democrat his whole life. he has been a democrat his entire life, but he's been a long island democrat. he has been a rockaways-type

democrat, he's been a nassau county democrat his entire life. for people trying to find a consistency in donald trump, he is a nassau county democrat that did well. >> it's archie bunker, not gold plan sacks. >> we said an archie bunker billionaire. that's one of the great ironies. he's come into office and hired all these goldman sachs people. he's hired all these billionaires. he's hired people that, you know, maybe he respects their business acumen, but sort of disconnected from what we were seeing on the campaign trail. coming up, new footage that seems to contradict the airline's original plane that the passenger was, quote, disruptive and belligerent. whiplash in washington? president trump backs a nato expansion while hess team talks

tough on russia. the man who used to lead nato, admiral james tavridis next on "morning joe." (phone ringing) they'll call back. no one knows your ford better than ford and ford service. right now, during the big tire event, get a $140 rebate by ml, on four select tires. ♪

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we have done so much for so many people. i don't think that there's a presidential period of time in the first 100 days where anyone has done nearly what we've been able to do. on top of it we just had, during the first 100 days, a supreme court justice approved, not just nominated but approved through a very, very hostile environment. >> veteran columnist and msnbc commentator mike barnicle joins us. >> legendary. >> former retired four star navy admiral jamesi ive rid dis.

>> what are you reading with all the navy news in there. we had the expansion of nato which the russians absolutely loathe. the president is going to be meeting with the head of nato coming up. how do you read the tea leaves over the past 24, 48 hours? >> well, i hate to get too enthusiastic too fast. i need to curb my enthusiasm. but if nato were a stock, it's kind of rising. i recognize one tomahawk strike does not a spring make, like one swallow doesn't make a spring. but the strike and the nato piece come together in an interesting way, joe and mika. it shows you that the administration is waking up to the fact that we can't do this alone. we'll have to bring allies and partners in. i think when rex tillerson sits down across the table from lavrov, he's sitting down not

just for himself but with that alliance behind him. i feel better about nato than i did a couple weeks ago. >> admiral, good morning. it's willie. good to see you. rex tillerson said just yesterday that the assad era, quote, is coming to an end. that would lead us to believe that the policy of the trump white house, correct me if you've heard something different, is to remove assad from power. if that is the means -- if that is the ends, what are the means to get there? >> it's good to see rex tillerson step into the rollover the last couple weeks. i'm starting to be reminded when i say that delivery of his, that old line when the governor of texas sends a telegraph asking for some texas rangers to control a riot. they send one ranger. it's kind of one riot, one ranger kind of thing. it's that texas la chronic thing. i'm encouraged by that.

in terms of what's our laf raj, it remains the sanctions principally. we can jack those up. it remains nato and nato expansion around the periphery of russia which makes them crazy. that's why this montenegro thing is a pretty good move. i think he's got some cards to play. as you've been talking about this morning, the best card to play at the end of the day, russia, syria really? that's where you want to line up in the international sphere? i think that's the right one. >> given the sentiment you just expressed, given your military career, your knowledge of general mattis. the day after is always the critical moment in terms of 59 cruise missiles being sent over there. what did that do and what is it doing now to alter what we do on the ground vis-a-vis russia and other people, other nations in

syria? >> mike, as you know as a former marine, there's not a lot of tactical impact from that strike. it was a significant strategic presentation. it sort of says hey, there's more where this came from. it says we are going to enforce when we say that we are crossing the line or we see a line crossed, we're going to enforce it. number three, it's not just limited to syria. it really is a signal to north korea, and we also see the aircraft carrier carl vincent moving in that direction. it's a signal of strength. as you say, what happens next is really the important piece. >> mark halperin. >> admiral, in response to the arment by some people in both parties, nato expansion has been the last three administrations and this is what gets putin to feel threatened and get him in an expansionist mode. >> nato's treaty is based on the idea that nations can apply if they're democracies and meet the

standards of nato, they're granted membership. nothing has changed since that treaty was written in the 1950s. what has changed, and you're correct, is russia's perception of encirclement. i think we can work this with russia. what would really make their heads explode would be ukraine coming into nato or georgia. that's different than montenegro in the balkans, consolidating the balkans. i think we can thread that needle. you're right to flag it as something we should watch because it can overtip russia. >> admiral, it's nick confessore. as we were talking about the seemingship of the rhetoric on trump, i'm curious if you think they're beginning to tilt away from rouussia towards china or it's just a response to the events of the moment, if there's still desire in this white house to somehow make nice with putin if they can.

>> i think it's a little bit of both. i would say it's a bucket of cold water reality that's hit the administration as they watch putin's actions in the first 75 days. it's not just the trump administration reacting in its initial way, it's watching putin react. if you're in the white house, you're seeing syria, seeing the on going aggression in ukraine and you've got now a big difference, h.r. mcmaster in the white house, someone with a real global view, who understands the danger of russia. it's a cumulative effect. having said all that, i think if they could ease their way back to some kind of a deal with russia, they probably would, but i don't think it's in the cards and they're right to balance towards china. >> all right, admiral james tavridis, thank you for being on the show this morning. still ahead, trying to read the tea leaves in kansas. a republican win by just seven points in a special congressional race. compare that to how big his

predecessor mike pompeo won and donald trump and mitt romney. is this a sign of things to come? founding member of the freedom caucus, ken buck joins us. he's got a new book that may not win him a lot of friends in washington. we'll tell you why straight head on "morning joe." ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

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welcome back to "morning joe." new video just this morning taken moments before sunday's incident of the united flight where a passenger was dragged off. if new footage claims to contradict the airline's claim that the passenger was, quote, disruptive and belligerent. >> no, i'm not going. i am not going. >> the passenger las now been identified as dr. david dow of kentucky. fellow passengers say dr. dow and his wife first accepted the offer of $800 each to give up

their seats for crew members but returned when they realized they couldn't get home in time for work. $255 million in value knocked off inyesterday. >> they really should have given them like a $1,000 voucher. another $200. i'll tell you what, all the uber rides you want until midnight. take it. until midnight and free drink voucher at johnny's, the airport bar. whatever. this is costing them a quarter of a billion dollars. >> given all that's happened over the last two days, the ceo of united changing his tune a bit after blaming dao, ceo oscar munoz wrote in a letter, i deeply apologize to the customer forably removed -- >> by the way, that's an actual photo of most united flights yesterday. >> he apologized to customers

aboard. no one should ever be treated this way. i want you to know we take full responsibility. we will make it right. ceo promised thorough review which includes the policy for handling what he now refers to oversold flights instead of overbooked. dao's lawyer released a statement asking for privacy until his client is released from the hospital. the company also has a problem in washington. top senators congress committee and aviation subcommittee sent letters demanding answers from the chicago department of aviation, o'hare international airport, and from the ceo of united. so united put out three statements, one was actually an internal e-mail leaked that seemed to have the tone all i don't think. yesterday issuing full throated apology to the customer and say they would change the way they do business. >> what if e cops came on and did united bidding and forcibly dragged a guy off a plane so one of united employees could catch a flight to louisville. >> i think i read or heard

chicago city council is having a hearing on that. they are aviation police. that's what the material is. whether they fall under some sort of chicago port authority, i don't know, but aviation police, i don't know what their arrest powers are. >> it's united planes. >> why they have not been charged with assault and battery is beyond me. that clip on a sidewalk -- >> those police officers should go to united gate agents and say, this is your problem. i'm not going to beat somebody up so one of your employees can get on a flight, they can get in a car and drive. >> i understand oversold flights, i didn't yesterday. >> i learned jetblue doesn't over sell flights. >> lots of different confusing reasons why it happens. i've been in that situation where i've heard the offer, we'll give you a $400 voucher. they never offer anything that is worth changing your plans, missing a day of work, not making it to see patients.

you know what, in they had upped the ante a little bit they wouldn't be in this -- they are going to pay so much more, they probably should have offered someone a year of free flights they would have done better. >> mark halperin, the most offensive thing, if they come on and say, hey, this couple needs to get home. their children are at home, could you give up your seat. or this is a doctor who has patients he has to get back to, or you name it. most of the people that, you know, i see on airplanes, they wouldn't be happy. they would be like, okay, give me an $800 voucher. here they beat this guy up to get their own employees in the seat. i don't know any of us sitting here to say, oh, yeah i'm going to give up my seat after i've been trying to get home for two days and i've got patients waiting for me tomorrow morning so your employee can get to louisville tonight.

no. it doesn't work that way, buster. >> everybody is focused on what the ceo did in the communications department. obviously a huge, incredible mess up for a giant company. i think what this highlights is what we all see when we travel, which is there's no responsible person at the gate on the plane when there's a crisis like this who is making decisions. it's impossible to imagine an industry -- you go to a movie theater -- >> that's exactly right. >> you go to a movie theater and there are more empowered people to deal with an unorthodox situation. the fact there was no pilot new york city flight attendant, no gate agent intervening. >> where was the pilot. >> incredible. >> that's the pilot's plane. where was the pilot? we've all been in a situation where there was a disruption and you've had a pilot that walked back and calmed things down. >> also another really important question is why did those united workers have to get to louisville on that flight? why didn't they drive?

how long a drive is that? >> five hours. >> five hours. >> why did they have to be on that flight? >> we see this throughout the entire airport process. now, listen, i've got to say, 95% of the tsa agents that i come across are great. there occasionally are some people that have an attitude, unnecessary and rude. i've always wondered, why isn't there just one tsa supervisor in a red jacket walking around making sure that instead of 95% of the tsa agents being courteous, 100% are courteous. or if somebody is being disruptive and lying, the person in the red jacket can come over. mark is exactly right. you go to a movie theater and there's more order than there is flying through airports. >> coming up, what president trump just said about vladimir putin as the secretary of state starts a chilling meeting in moscow. we'll bring in andrea mitchl

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woulbe hilarious. you can almost hear the voice inside his head. >> somebody as despicable as hitler who didn't sink to using chemical weapons. have you to, if you're russian -- oh, no. did i just defend hitler? hitler? i think i did. why did i even do that. i think when you come to sarin gas, he was not using gas on his own people the same way. oh, my god. of course hitler gassed people. i learned that in high school. we all did. what the hell are you doing, sean. you stupid, stupid, stupid. >> i'll see you back in a little bit. i know we'll have one more. thank you. >> that's a nice -- >> we've all had those moments. >> no. sean spicer issues an apology after creating controversy that involved adolf hitler, and

passover. plus white house draws a tough line on syria, declaring assad's days to be numbered and a gaffe on ukraine that unsettles allies just a smidge. we'll bring in andrea mitchell live from moscow. and i like steve, but -- what trump is saying this morning that has his strategist more out in the cold, like gone. >> chilly. >> it's over. you know, when you get the "but" that's bad. that's bad, right? >> yeah. >> welcome back to "morning joe." >> on bannon, it's really bad. >> he does it twice or three times. i like steve but -- >> i like steve but -- >> he wasn't really with me that long. that's never -- that's like obama under the bus material. >> he basically said bannon jumped on my bus late. >> i like him, though. >> we've been talking about for a very long time.

stupidity of bannon. >> the president of the united states, you can't walk around washington, d.c., leaking stuff about how you made him president and now manipulated his presidency and molding his thought process because it's yours. >> always get the story out that he and trump were together late at night having dinner and how many nights a week they would be having dinner while inside the white house you can see katy r tur, one person after another peeling off from him. right now he is an island onto himself. good luck finding the person that calls themselves an ally of steve bannon. >> i spoke to an ally of steve bannon the other night. >> is his name steve bannon. >> his name is not steve bannon. sometimes we say i spoke to an ally of steve bannon and it's steve bannon but, no. they say he's in a very bad place. this is an ally of steve's.

not an ally of reince priebus or jared kushner. >> let's do the list. incredible inaugural speech going down in history as one of the worst ever. >> carnage. >> oh, my gosh, the muslim ban, i think that was a success sort of. >> definitely. >> and he really worked it on health care. >> great job. >> so i would think -- >> actually started to see -- >> three for three. >> -- back in speech where you started hearing stories about bannon going in trying to get carnage speech in before congress. stephen miller was like back off. stephen miller has been linked to bannon in a way that stephen miller learned pretty early on

was making him uncomfortable. i didn't hear this from stephen miller but from different sources that bannon kept trying to get him to put carnage into the speech. miller said i'm good. let me write the speech. it was a speech mainly written by the people that steve bannon has been fighting ainst. >> that speech was a missed opportunity. >> it's one thing -- >> going before congress. >> it's one thing to have a time of rivals. it's another to have folks in your administration that have diametrically opposed policy views. to square a steve bannon world view and jared kushner world view is a very difficult thing to do. >> except it's not steve bannon's world view, it's donald trump's world view and it has been donald trump's world view. >> the issue -- >> the difference between jared kushner and steve bannon is, jared kushner will do what donald trump wants him to do. steve bannon wants everybody to

know he's the puppet master. >> but nobody knows what donald trump wants. therein lies the fundamental problem of this administration. donald trump is not somebody who is tied to any one ideology. he's somebody that goes wherever the wind takes him. so he can change his mind on a dime, sorry to use all those cliches, but he can change his mind any moment and tweet something and everybody has to scramble to find a policy to go with it. >> what jared kushner wants is what the president wants, which is not him sucking up to the president, him being a traditional white house aide. and again, steve bannon's point of view is not donald trump's point of view. trump has been talking about the same thing for all these years. and bannon has gotten in trouble for telling everybody basically i am the keeper of the nationalism flame.

>> along with kellyanne. >> a ceo mentality. what have the people around him done for him lately. that's what he wants to know. the philosophy around steve bannon he said a couple months ago is the deconstruction of the federal government. you just itemized how that was going. the arrogance of showing up in washington thinking you're going to tear the federal government down and burn it to the ground was pure arrogance. it showed up in the executive order. we have courts that stopped the muslim ban. it showed up in repeal of obamacare. s unitedtates congress you have to get it through. steve bannon has been frustrated and now donald trump is looking at the laundry list of things steve bannon said he was going to do and couldn't get done for him and saying you're not the guy to help me be a great president. >> to help write a speech that squashes out optimism this presidency could have. >> talking about the inaugural. >> yes. it's beyond -- it's really sad. >> a dark speech on a day looking for light. katy, your source, who says he's

in a dark place right now, steve bannon. did you draw it out? describe it. >> so i will give you the lay of the land here. so there are two major things that are going on right now. one of them for steve bannon is that the family is against him, as has been reported pretty widely. jared kushner, ivanka, et cetera. >> that would be it right there. >> the poll numbers are not good. donald trump pays attention to poll numbers. he's very aware of them. he might not acknowledge they are bad, might try to sugarcoat them in public but he's very aware of public perception of him. those two things are going wrong. it's said to feel like a combination of the way things were with manafort in the administration when things weren't going smoothly for trump. his poll numbers started to drop. he's in a precarious position coming out of the convention. and also the same way cory lewandowski when he was coming up against the wall that his

role in the campaign as well where the family was out to get him. remember, it takes months to convince donald trump to do away with somebody. it took months with cory lewandowski, and cory lewandowski assaulted somebody, was accused of assaulting somebody and was arrested for it. eventually he was let go. but he was accused of it, and there was videotape of him grabbing a woman. so that was cory. this is going to take some time. >> you know, the real problem began, and insiders don't know why, the real problem began when he started attacking kushner to third parties a couple wks ago. the third thing causing the problem, actually, mika, why don't you read what he told "new york post" last night. he's taking note of bannon continually taking credit for what he's doing and also counting the number of breitbart articles that attack him.

>> which would be if bannon is so responsible putting the president at 34%. the president told "new york post" last night, i like steve, but have you to remember he was not involved in my campaign until very late. i had already beaten all the senators and governors. i didn't have steve. i'm my own strategist. it wasn't like i was going to change strategies because i was facing crooked hillary. the president also added, steve is a good guy, but i told them to straighten it out or i will. compare this to what trump said about bannon when he joined trump's campaign last august. quote, i've known steve for many years. >> mark halperin, we've been saying for some time here that it looked like jared, ivanka, gary cohn, dina powell were the ones that were gaining influence and this has been happening over the last three or four weeks. where does it go from here with,

again, a lot of people identified as bannon's aides publicly now going to the president saying i'm not with bannon. i'm with you, mr. president. >> the domestic challenge is the same as foreign policy challenge, the establishment in the press and washington would like a conventional administration. they like when he does things with nato. they like when he works with congress in a more traditional way. that is not the essence of what got trump elected, so they need to put together a team, whether it's with the current people or new people, that does those two things simultaneously. harness what makes donald trump a potent political force but also deal with the realities of working with congress, getting things through the courts. bannon is one of the few people in the white house and in trump's life who is creative, innovative, takes risks, advocates taking risks. someone has to be for that. that other group within the white house is a more traditional, more conventional group of thinkers. so he's got a lot to figure out. >> donald trump is for that.

we've been saying for some time, donald trump is the disrupter in chief. he actually needs to start hiring people who actually know how to get an executive order through a basic court test and how to get legislation through congress. >> there's no doubt he needs that and more of that, although i think there are better staff there. he can't be the disrupter all by himself. someone has to be thinking in an innovative way and implement some of the things he wants to get done. look, there's lots going on. we've talked about a ton of issues today. the legislative agenda is currently in huge crisis. >> let me ask a question. i'm glad you went there. name the person in donald trump's inner circle that knows how capitol hill works. >> mike pence. >> mike pence knows -- >> mick mulvaney. >> mike pence knows how to talk

to the conservative republican base. who knows how to go talk to democrats, get 40 to 45 of them, along with 180 republicans and pass that through the house? >> there is no one like that, but that switch to that strategy, which you've been talking about, which i think a lot of people thought was the original vision on infrastructure, on tax reform, switching to that is a huge project. because the minute you switch to that, it's going to come up on the debt ceiling, come up on the government shutdown. the minute you switch, that you think the freedom caucus squealed over health care? they will squeal louder if donald trump tries to get nancy pelosi's help to raise the debt ceiling. you're right. that is in some ways the biggest need. is there someone -- again, always go back to james baker. is there someone in the white house who can have a vision to say we're going to have the political courage and creativity to figure out how to get legislative agenda moving again in a more bipartisan way. >> katy, i'm being told inside

the white house that actually the person that's going to be taking the role of steve bannon moving forward is somebody obviously you have seen very close to donald trump for a very long time and that is stephen miller. stephen miller is going to be the disrupter in chief inside the administration. talk about how close donald trump and stephen miller have been throughout the campaign and why they have been close. >> stephen miller came from jeff sessions. he was jeff sessions communications director. jeff sessions was the first senator to sign onto donald trump's campaign. so stephen came on at an early time when people were still very unsure of donald trump. he came on as his speechwriter. he started to learn donald trump's voice, formulate that america first policy, and get him on prompter but also keep to that outsider message, which is what miller -- >> you say his voice.

people inside tell me miller would always -- people throw words at him and he'd go, no, no, no, he doesn't talk that way. learn his voice. >> a good speechwriter will learn -- a good tv news writer will learn the voice of the person speaking the words they write. miller did a pretty good job of that when you watch donald trump on prompter. when someone doesn't trip up on the prompter all the time that's because they are reading words that sound like they would have come out of his mouth regardless of who wrote them. so stephen miller is certainly a force. i want to make two points about what mark halperin was saying. donald trump was elected to be a disrupter, yes, but he was also elected to get things done. he was elected as somebody who would be able to reach across the aisle and to work with democrats, not somebody who was just going to stone wall, somebody who was going to stop things from happening. the freedom caucus elected to stop things from happening. i'm not sure if donald trump abandons the freedom caucus, moves away from them, moves more

toward the center, starts working with moderates on the democratic side, that is going to engender negative headlines or negative feelings from his base of support. his base is varied. they are from a number of different walks olife in this country. they are not necessarily conservative idealogues in any way. they just want to see donald trump get something done. second point unrelated. bannon leaving the white house. don't you have to worry about what he does if he does leave the white house? does he go back to breitbart? what happens if he's back at breitbart. >> there's talk right now. >> exactly. what sort of liability could he be on the outside? >> the question is, whether mike barnicle, when he's on the outside of the white house, whether breitbart knows donald trump is president for the next 3 1/2 years is going to listen to bannon say, hey, trash the republican president. our readers will love that. no, they actually won't. >> they have to fix it. >> by the way, they are making phone calls, allies outside the

white house now, to make sure bannon can't cause them too much of a problem. but i can't believe bannon doesn't get with the problem, exits, finds a soft landing pad somewhere maybe with mercer running a super pac. >> if he loves the white house back to breitbart began carving up the president of the united states at breitbart, he would further expose him self for what people are accusing him of being now, ego centric individual bound with unrelenting anger at so many things. talking about what's going to happen with the legislative package, i'd like to ask halperin, if you're still there, mark, where is paul ryan in all of this, dealing with the freedom caucus and helping this administration? has he just disappeared? is he going to stay disappeared? >> no. he's got to deal with the immediate crisis. i know it's relatively boring for many but the debt ceiling increase and dealing with the government shutdown are things

immediately in paul ryan's eyesight and he's got to figure out when they get back in three weeks how they are going to deal with that. he's got to figure out whether health care, tax reform is going to have to be pushed back. there's a bunch of huge decisions. during congressional recess as you know, the president has got the stage to himself. he has it all this week. again, they are dealing with sean spicer, they are dealing with steve bannon, dealing with a lot of this international stuff, not getting a lot of forward momentum on this. i'll just say again about bannon and about the people around the president. what i have never figured out is why he wants this job. you talk about the prospect he'll go back to breitbart or be a thorn. does he believe in donald trump? donald trump's vision? his colleagues? i'm not saying kept particularly but rhetorically. that will go to the question of will he fight to save his job? if he doesn't, what does he do and people loyal to him do, particularly breitbart.

>> i think the headlines this morning are how to get bannon out. that's being worked out. they are trying to figure it out. as you pointed out, katy tur, it's complicated. spicer's credibility is crushed. if it hasn't been already, it is crushed, how to deal with that. top level officials in the white house are saying miller is the one to watch. this the guy who said the president's powers are not to be questioned on the sunday morning talk shows. but apparently he is getting with the program. keep an eye on him. we'll see. katy tur, thank you very much. still ahead on "morning joe" as a congressman he called 2013 government shutdown, quote, good policy. but now mick mulvaney is white house budget director and it's democrats threatening to shut down the government. he joins us live from the white house. first senate's number two democrat dick durbin takes a break from his two-week recess to join us here on set. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. my business was built with passion... but i keep it growing by making every dollar count. that's why i have the spark cash card from capital one.

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because, you know, people just don't see this, the level of brutality, the level of viciousness. but when they drop barrel bombs and bombs of any kind right on top of a civilian population, that's the worst thing -- i've never seen anything like it. frankly putin is backing a person that's truly an evil person. i think it's very bad for russia. i think it's very bad for man kind. it's very bad for this world. >> the white house is accusing russia of tryin to cover up the syrian government's role in last week's deadly chemical weapons attack. the trump administration says declassified intelligence shows the chemical agent sarin was delivered by a syrian regime aircraft. meanwhile president trump is bolstering the u.s. role in one of putin's most hated alliances. today president scheduled to meet with secretary-general of nature at the white house. yesterday trump signed a treaty

allowing the entry of montenegro into the mutual defense pact which would expand its reach in europe. secretary of state rex tillerson is warning russia in no uncertain terms about its ties to syria saying the assad regime was, quote, coming to an end. russia at risk of losing relevance in the middle east by continuing to support the dictatorship. still the new secretary of state's inexperience is showing just a bit. he reportedly said to a group of top diplomats at tuesday's g7 meeting in italy, quote, why should u.s. taxpayers be interested in ukraine. that's according to france's foreign minister. >> let's bring i think member of senate judiciary committee, democratic whip dishing durbin of illinois. senate, first of all, congratulations, cubs doing well, 5-2, great season. it seems as if david ignatius and others are saying there is

starting to be a shift in america's foreign policy perhaps because of mattis and mcmaster's growing influence with the president. how important is it we expanded nato yesterday? >> absolutely essential. ukraine us exhibit a why it is essential. countries of poland, baltics, ukraine, is essential. i agree with david ignatius. what you're seeing is moderation of the views of donald trump at least in the white house foreign policy that differ from what we heard on the campaign trail. started off as president -- >> now ignatius said moving towards china in a way we can deal with china. they are all talking pretty tough on russia. >> yes. what a change. what a dramatic change in such a short period of time. think a week ago, about a week

ago, here is secretary of state tillerson saying let the syrian people decide if assad has a future. within seven days we're attacking them. so there is a transition taking place. you have identified jared kushner as one of the elements of the transition. i think that's true from what i've heard. it's an indication they are moving toward what used to be the center stripe, mainstream foreign policy. >> gentlemen, obviously general mcmaster, general mattis obviously having really -- >> joe, i voted for more generals than i ever dreamed i would as a kid growing up in the '60s. >> isn't it funny, i say this to mike all the time you think of generals around the president, you think of jfk and the warmongers he had around him, the people he didn't trust. now you have maybe 15 years of war. generals is the moderating influence. >> if you saw mattis yesterday, what a great, solid performance. >> right. >> he wasn't intimidated by the

audience. he was playing the press saying maybe it's your turn to ask a question and getting solid answers like a man who has seen combat and watch people die, making life and death decisions. praise the lord that that sort of person is that close to the president. that's the thing most of us fear the most. it's 3:00 in the morning. he takes a nap between tweets. there's a knock on the door. five minutes to make a life or death decision. who does he call? >> i think he's got a team around him because of what's happened in syria that he's actually spending time with that actually adds value to this president in a big way. >> no question. look what mcmaster is doing. >> trump made these choices. >> think about the tradup with the national security council. we went from genal flynn to general mcmaster. we went fromk.t. mcfarland to dina powell. >> you want someone opposed to the war go to pentagon. read mcmaster's book, dereliction of duty, which outlines flaws and cowardice at

the command level in the 1960s. >> you talk to the military, young military, aspiring leaders, mcmaster is a hero. he's a person that spoke up and talked about the errors of foreign policy and how they were played out in military decisions. >> when you hear rex tillerson say the assad era is coming to an end like he did yesterday, what do you hear in that? that can happen a few different ways, from the syrian people somehow, russia leaning on him convincing him to leave power. i don't see any incentive for him to do that. or come from western coalition led by umbrellas removing him from power. what does that mean to you? >> i think back to four years ago at home springfield, illinois it's sunday night and i get a phone call from president obama. what's up, president? well, we see some chemical weapons in syria. i want to come to congress and ask you as a member of the foreign relations committee to vote for a resolution and give me authority to do something about it, which i did. and a number of republicans joined us, corker, mccain,

graham. then it came to general congress and they said, what's next after this 60 day effort to discourage assad from chemical weapons? they backed off, both democrats and republicans backed off and that was the end of the red line as far as the president was concerned. so i ask the question, what follows 60 missiles, whatever, what's next. >> that's my question. how is assad removed from power ultimately. >> 23 of us voted no on the iraq resolution to go to war. we said no on the question. >> would you vote no on the missiles fired thursday night. >> i believe in my view, crimes against humanity, that is in the interest of the united states of america. >> i'm not pushing you on this next question, this is more of a general question for everybody that's been talking since last thursday nigh when we ask what's next, what's next, wt's next, a very wise question to ask. if they are saying our policy is not changing, we're not invading

syria, isn't perhaps that the wrong question on what's next, what are you going to do. is it just going to be a missile strike? we may be a focused missile strike that general mattis suggested to the president, maybe that's what moment called for and maybe there is not a next until he crosses another red line. >> i think you might put your finger on it. i'm not sure they have a plot that says this is step one. >> right. >> what they did was assert this president is willing to use force. that was the statement, against a dictator using weapons that are inexcusable when it comes to conflict. >> all right. here is jon meacham. >> senator, you're talking about being surprised you voted for as many generals as you did. one of the reasons i think a lot of these generals are as buttoned down as they are is because of vietnam. it's the colin powell model. we're now in the 16th year of war in afghanistan, 14th year almost to the month in iraq.

what do you think the next generation of generals will be learning from these wars that are the longest in our history. >> that's a good and important question. i think the frustration of vietnam with all the lives lost and money spent and division within the united states, look at what's happening in afghanistan today. i voted for that war. we were going after the people responsible for the terrible tragedy of 9/11. yet you look back on it now and say where are we today in terms of stability and future of afghanistan. we still can't field an army in afghanistan to execute basic peacekeeping and stop the advance of the taliban and other terrorist forces. so i would say there's still a level of frustration. the greatest military power in the world has its limits and people have to understand when we say we're a great nuclear power, doesn't mean much when you're dealing with roadside bombs. >> all right. thank you so much. greatly appreciate you being with us. >> thank you. >> dick durbin, thank you very ch. today marks a big step ithe trump administration's plan to

keep a campaign promise that is slashing government beaurocracy. the white house is telling federal agencies it's time to shrink the size of their workforce. joining us from the white house director of the office of management and budget mick mulvaney. good to have you on board this morning. >> good morning, everybody. >> all right. so tell us more about these plans. how is it going to actually happen? >> by the end of the day today we'll roll out guidance to federal agencies on how they are supposed to implement government restructuring in terms of their hiring and firing. when the president first came into office he instituted a government wide hiring freeze. it's not unusual for new management of a company or government to say, all right, do nothing new. settle in and see what's going on. we've done that now. we'll end the hiring freeze today. we'll start allowing agencies to start hiring in a smart fashion. some will have to continue to get smaller, some bigger consistent with the president's budget. we're done with across the board hiring freeze today.

we're now transitions into the smarter, more surgical plans of running the government. >> mark halperin. >> director, are you going to need democratic votes to raise the ceiling or avoid a government shutdown or can you do it all with republican votes. >> those ar couple different questions. the debt ceiling is probably in september. government funding comes up the end of april. my guess is we'll probably need votes across the parties but obviously possible to do it with just republicans in the house. by the time you get to the senate, i think the debt ceiling can be raised under reconciliation, which takes 50 votes. the appropriations bills, the funding in april would need 60. >> would you prefer to do it with democratic votes or indifferent to that? >> let's talk about the april funding situation because that comes first. we already started to talk to appropriators on the hill both in the house and senate and both parties and we've set forth our priorities. it shouldn't come as a price to anybody. the president wants more money for defense, more money for border enforcement, more money for things like educational

school choice. he wants reductions in spending. the same things you saw wpped up in our budget. we like to see those things in the april funding bill. >> director mulvaney, it's willie geist. good to see you this morning. president trump said again last night in an interview that he wants to, quote, do health care first. he said i have to do health care first. i want to do it first to really do it right. at the first failure of repeal of obamacare, the president had said he was ready to turn the corner and look at tax reform. from your standpoint, where is the focus on the white house, health care or tax reform? >> all the above. we can do more than one thing at a time. i've got a meeting on tax reform. we've got a meeting i think later on today or tomorrow on infrastructure. we met yesterday with a group of ceos about this government restructuring and obviously discussions are continuing all the time about the health care bill. it's not just sort of a one off. yes, there's a rhyme and a robbery to what has to go first, what should go first but that doesn't mean the white house is just doing one topic at a time. >> so you share the president's belief it's wise to go back in

on health care despite the initial failure? >> i think there's a couple of advantages to doing health care first. there's political reasons for doing it, builds momentum. also economic reasons to do it, numeric in terms of cbo scoring and arcane senate rules that actually benefit tax reform if health care goes first. so for a variety of reasons, i think the president is absolutely right. we continue to work on health care but that doesn't mean we stop working on other things as well. >> mick mulvaney, thank you very much for being on the show this morning. >> thanks, everybody. just ahead a potential blockbuster report from the "washington post" that claims there was a court order to monitor carter page over concerns he was working for russia. >> working for russia actually get fisa court. >> which is very hard to do. >> very hard to do. probable cause he was an agent of russia. >> carter page was one of trump's foreign policy advisers during the campaign, or was he? we'll talk about that still to

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>> any that you can start off with this morning with us. >> well, i know, i can give you

some of the names. >> i'd be delighted. >> i wouldn't mind. >> do you have that list so i'd be more accurate? okay, ready? wale walidphares, who you probably know. carter page. >> then candidate trump named carter page as a member of his foreign picy team at a meeting with "washington post" editorial board. now reports fbi obtained a court order last summer to monitor the communications of carter page. according to the post it was part of an investigation into possible trump ties between the trump campaign and russia. law enforcement and u.s. officials tell the newspaper that the fbi and justice department got the warrant after convincing a fisa judge there

was probable cause to believe page was acting as an agent of a foreign power. page, who has not been accused of any crimes and denying wrongdoing is firing back at the post report. in a statement to nbc news he said in part this, i was so happy to hear that further confirmation is now being revealed that shows how low the clinton/obama regime went to destroy our democracy and suppress dissidents who did not fully support their failed foreign policy. a republican source close to the trump campaign and white house tells nbc news that carter page had no official title with the trump campaign, was never on the staff, was never compensated by the campaign, did not sign standard employee paperwork, did not have a campaign e-mail and did not even have access to trump tower and that carter page did not ever meet the president or personally give him advice as stated by carter page himself. >> so the question is, you know,

did he just -- did somebody hand him a list of names? >> yes. >> that he read to the "washington post," which certainly sounds like that's -- >> trump in campaign mode. >> that's trump in campaign. we must remember, though, that is one of the great editorial board meetings of all times where he talked about his hands for about 45 minutes. so i don't know, again -- >> a deflector. >> if anybody has seen carter page around donald trump -- >> let us know. >> i never saw or heard him around there. willie, this is the same guy in an episode of the americans, russians, we interprcepted russians who called him an idiot. >> idiot was the term. donald trump said in a white house press conference he was asked about carter page. never spoken to him, never heard of him. that "washington post" interview came up so obviously he heard of him. as the white house said the

campaign had no former relationship with the guy. remember, carter page did say he met on the sidelines of the republican convention with the russians. there's no question i think that he had some relationship with the russians. the question is did he have a relationship with the trump campaign. the campaign says no. >> anything that knows about fisa judges. fisa judges are not obama fisa judges or clinton fisa judges. i know a few fisa judges. they are tough people, and they are not swayed by what anybody -- at least the ones i know don't give a damn what you or any politician thinks. if you get probable cause for the fbi to investigate this guy y be an agent of russia, that is not because he met with anybody at the convention, that's his story. >> let's frame this up in terms of the post story. i have no idea what carter page's relationship was or wasn't to the trump campaign.

but you do not get a ifi a fisa warrant on a whim or suspicion. have you to have probable cause. the fbi in this case apparently had probable cause. then you go to the fisa court comprised of judges. i couldn't name the judges on the fisa court. they ga to great lengths to really disguise who the fisa court judges are and they, thus, get a warrant to look at carter page. so take it from there. >> it's just one of those calls you never want to get that fisa is looking at you, a fisa warrant is issued against you. >> personal experience. >> doesn't start the week off right. >> you don't want that. you don't want a late night call from meacham talking about a war. >> couple of pops, picks up the phone. >> next, just heard dick durbin's support for president trump's missile strike in syria. we'll see if one of his colleagues agree, seth joins us

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welcome back to "morning joe." yes, were you about to say? >> talking about boston globe. >> newspapers and reading online as opposed -- >> the red sox. >> speaking of boston, i guess, i'll try and segue. >> north shore. >> joining us from boston member of the house armed services committee democratic congressman seth mullton massachusetts. he served four tours in iraq. >> thank you for being with us. i'll ask you the same question i asked senator durbin. does there have to be a what's next in syria? does there have to be a next military strike?

that's what the media and some politicians have been saying. what's next? was that strike actually enough? >> well, right now we have no idea because i will say this, if there is a strike, they have to present a plan to not only getting us into syria but getting us out. that that plan has to be in military and diplomatic actions and they have to come before congress to get approved. do you oppose last thursday's attack? >> i think it is a good decision. the question is where do with go in syria. it is not fair to our troops to ask them to risk their lives without any end game.

>> the president has said, our strategists are not changing in syria and rex tillerson have said the same and russians need to understand that assad won't be there for long. is that enough guidance for you saying that our policy is not changing and we are not sending troops in syria. >> well, it is fine if we don't do anything more. what we caught to talk about is what is the strategic plan for syria. the reality is we have troops on the ground there now. i am not sure if they know what they are doing. when i am gone to talk to some of the troops fighting in sir yarks syria, i asked them, what are you fighting to achieve. i was in the iraq war. when i went out on patrol every night. i knew what the plan was. i knew the iraqi government that i supported.

i knew that if we make them successful, we could go home. i don't think any plan like that in syria right now. lets take those countries in iraq. you have spent an enormous number of time in your life on the ground in iraq. when you go home on the weekends and a parents come up to you and asks you, i have a 19-year-old son. he's a corporal and he's in iraq today, he may go to syria tomorrow, why is he there? what do you say? i do get that question a lot.

what i would say is as someone who fought in iraq and now came back. it is my solemn responsibility to make sure that who ever we sent back there, they have a plan to win and come home for good and we don't find ourselves in the end less cycle of defeating the terrorist group and having no plan to secure the peace and we have to send the troops back again. it is painful to me as a marine core veteran to see what we fought in iraq squandered because we did not have a plan to secure peace. they did not just defeat iraqis army. they put their weapons down and went home because they lost faith. the same applies to afghanistan and the same certainly applies

to syria where we don't have any plan what so ever. >> congressman, i want to ask you a question getting your take and experience, a question that a lot of people throwing around, that's the standard for american intervention in syria. i understd of the attack that took place on thursday night, but, also donald trump talked about the humanitarian angle of it and he saw young children suffocating and dying and images on tv that impacted him. would you get those same feelings if it was not chemical weapons and killing children there and killing mothers and fathers holding their children. how does the american people decide. how do we know it is appropriate for american power and military force to use in syria. >> this is one of the hardest questions that we face as the

american people and certainly as congress who's responsibility it is to make these decisions and authorizes any sort of intervention. i am a believer that we caught to stand up for human rights. that's someone uses chemical biological weapons. that's a read line that we don't let people cross. there is a lot of people, tens of thousands of innocent, syrian civilians. suffering of what they are getting targeted by. the bottom line is this, we have to have a plan. we cannot go into a conflict that's opened ended. you know general powell famously said we have to have an exit strategy. i don't see an exit strategy in syria. having said that, i have added this, syrian conflicts have

unsolved problems oiver the world. we won't have refugee crisis that royal -- >> congressman, that's not their position right now. >> it is not now. i am giving wily credit to say that these are tough decisions. just leaving it alone it is not an easy answer. what i would like to see is a plan for syria that talks about how we can end the civil war. general patreus suggested the no fly zone and troops talking about sectioning off portions of the country like the kurdish region and the north. that's something we should discuss. whatever it is, we got to have a clear plan and everybody is committed to it. when american soldiers risking their lives every night, they know the plan to secure the peace once they are done. >> congressman.

thank you for being with us. >> seth mullen. >> thank you. >> in a few minutes we'll bring in bill neely and plus, white house press shawn miean spicer e said bashar al-assad is worst than hitler, we'll have more when peter join us in the white house. we'll be back in the moment. knowing where you stand has never been easier.

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of adolph hitler a messy pass over. >> it is not good. the republican party is asking what's the matter of ckansas asa narrow win can spill big trouble. >> good morning, it is wednesday 8:00 a.m. on the east coast. we have our john mechum. we bin with many are seeing as a big change in policy and tone when it comes to america's position towards russia. the white house is accusing russia of trying to cover up the syria syrians' chemical attack. >> it was delivered by the regime. >> today the president is

scheduled to meet with the secretary of general of nato at the white house. they're set to talk about strengthening ties and plan to hold a joint news conference. yesterday, president trump signed a treaty allowing the entry of monenegro. president trump will travel to b brussels for a gathering in late may. >> this is a big change of nato. we were wondering will donald trump's rhetoric win the day or will you have people like jonah mattis saying, if nato would not exist -- looks like once again as he does on thursday night. seems like the kind of master on policy here coming in on their own. they have to find their way around the white house and mr.

tillerson and mattis. >> i do think tillerson said that you crane should not be a concern to taxpayers. >> we'll get there. >> there is a little backumpine if you listen to nikki haley. >> it is not just rhetorical. >> and let russia control the narrative of syrians maybe saying maybe these chemical attacks were set up or the u.s. is behind them which vladimir putins alluded to that this morning. it is not just rhetoric. you have rex tillerson saying it is complicit of these attacks. >> and front of the camera, he

says, assad is going to go and it is a matter of time and russia might as well get used to it. we talked about how russia foreign policy since 1991. all theme say these attacks are in -- >> they know nothing about the way russia thinks to be there and be saying basically as completely eminent to the united states. we know you are in syria, we don't like what just happened, we'll blow some things up. it sends a horrific message to russia and putin. >> it included a young vladimir putin that did not see soviet and -- they returned to a

preworld war i. they want the ukraine and iran and syria. with this nuclear over lay of cold war expansion as well. it is an interesting accomodation of the two. my view is i suspect president trump is the political equivalent of climate change. it is not going to be hot or cold but extreme swings at all points. you saw the special election in kansas and the russia policy and syria policy. he thrives on chaos and he's going to govern in the way he campaigned which is chaotically. >> it is not beyond, they certainly understand. there is a reason why the united states did not go to czech and

we did not go to hungary in '68 but we fired missiles into syria in 2017. this is deeply embarrassing for vladimir putin and you can play all the hey somebody is helping somebody. no, vladimir putin would never want to be sitting in the country where the united states just ran over him. >> lets go with tillerson. >> lets break it down. rex tillerson is warning in no uncertain terms of its ties to the syria. the assad regime is coming to an end. russia is at risk of losing its relevance in the middle east by continuing to support dictator ship. >> he reportedly said to a group of top diplomats at tuesday's g-7 meeting.

why why should u.s. taxpayers should be interested in crukrai. >> the state department says it was a rhetorical question, asking why we should be spending or money. it was meant to open discussions anyway. >> this is david's ig nation. >> the trump administrations foreign policy has been a dizzy speck cal of mixed messages and policy reversals during its first three months.

trump has also tilted toward china and away from russia. that rebalancing is the opposite of what trump seems to favor during the campaign when he blasted china and wooed vladimir putin at every opportunity. it is a sensible and sustainable course. >> of all the things we talked about and all the bright sunny objects in front of us, the biggest take away from the past week and i would say for most of the foreign policy establishment, it has been what dave ignation at the end. it is about the fact that he now is actually focusing on china in

a constructive way ahead of very good meeting so he seems to be tilting a bit towards china and a bit more against russia. >> well, the important thing is pillar is a foreign policy that david mentioned in the column. engaging with china and care with russia and follow that path and get more on base on what have been the alliances that propelled our strengths and projection of power around the world. it is extremely important if you can keep it up. our allies were worried up until now. they were constantly, you know, setting up flares and alliances and u.s. military force. this is all reassuring. it is fascinating to me where you saw the obama alumni and

president obama was lit on it for a time >> i was surprised by just how ready they all were to jump in the obam administration which suggests that i am sure -- i am sure people like samantha powell -- >> but, john kerry, i did not hear too much from joe biden. all these top players told him for a long time, you cannot let this go on in syria. >> john kerry had a plan to do what trump did which is attacking the grounds so they could not carry chemical atta s attacks. that was out in the public. we know how he feels. >> the two open accounts on obama foreign policy legacy are

syria and the iran nuclear deal. we don't know how it is going turn zoout and even in 25 years we'll still talk about what obama did or did not do. >> bill, given all the rhetoric of last week's air strike and russia interferinging of the und states election, how did all this meeting get going? >> it began with a couple of le lengthy opening. it sounded like a dressing done at one point as rex tillerson listens. we heard a lot of ambiguous countries and ideas from washington. we have seen a lot of troubling questions. it is fundamentally important

that these questions don't happen again in the future. it is important for us to understand the real interest of the united states. they want clarity. tillerson replying to that, he want to identify areas of sharp difference and common interests even when our tactical approaches maybe different. i think that word tactic is significant. tillerson is not going in there with an you wi demand. but, strategically, globally, does that make sense? is it in your global interest to be allied to these people, how is gunpoioing to be good for yo? >> i think he also tlie try to

a wedge. our support for him is not unconditional. tillerson would want to know under what conditions would you be prepared to get rid of assad and how long will it take. one amazing statement that i think is worth mullying over that came out just as that he were meeting from vladimir putin on a russian interview that was broadcasted tonight. the level of trust between syria had been deteriorated. >> the level of trust that he had with obama is zero. and now he said it is deteriorated under donald trump. that message from putin, he says where is the evidence that syrian forces use chemical weapons. there is non. on the chemical issue is it can

be tillerson and larov, they don't believe that the syrian forces used chemical weapons. >> bill neely. >> pepsi and delta and united and now the white house's secretary. first, what's worse than reading your own press when the president does? >> a new interview of donald trump is less than warm to his top adviser to stephen bannon. is his stock falli in the white house. you are watching "morning joe," we'll be right back. knowing where you stand has never been easier.

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as rumors continue to swirl.

>> trump told the new york post, i like steve but -- >> you have to remember -- >> hold on. >> the new york press headlines, they picked that up here. [ laughter ] >> bottom right there. >> i like steve, but -- >> i like steve but he was not involved in my campaign until very late. i had beaten the senators and governors and i did not know steve. i my own strategist, it was not like i was going to change strategies because i was facing crooked hillary. the president also added, steve is a good guy but -- >> but -- >> but i toll them to straighten out. a statement announcing the hire at the time, trump said "i have known steve for many years." >> he's doing what he said a

couple of days ago that he was doing. i heard from talking to a lot of people inside the white house, they can tell you the day that bannon came aboard. that's why we show donald trump since '97. self-esteem bannon created donald trump's nationalist camp approach, nationalism is insanity. it is going through a couple of different levels of insanity. bannon is now leaking the jared kushner is calling media executives to plant negative story on bannon. i don't want to confuse the viewers too much. that's what got bannon in trouble in the first place is he's leaking across washington, d.c. about how important he is to donald trump. then he started attacking jared kushner. how, he now he's about to get kicked out of the white house and now he's

leaking and cushner is leaking. n somebody needs to t him stop while you are behind. >> donald trump made two changes, started with corley lewandowski and manafort and bannon. >> mike pence is not going anywhere and jared kushner and ivanka trump is not going anywhere. it is going to continue an issue of the president meeting ahead of nato today. is the domestic agenda that trump ran on. self-este bannon is essential on that. >> coming up on "morning show." the ceo reallocated his statement of the passenger being dragged from his flight. we'll have the latest on that when we come back.

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i see what's happening in

our country. if i were ever in office which is unlikely, if i ever was, that would not happen, we would not be taking advantage of them. we borrow money from japan in order to defend japan and we paid interest on that money. it is ridiculous. the united states is being ripped off and it should not happen. >> that was steve bannon. >> wait a minute, that was trump himself when bannon was nothing but a glimpse in his eye. >> is he a partisan and has a lot of ideology, that's him talking about the second term of ronald reagan. this time he's talking about barack obama. his guiding o f philosophy of not getting ripped off. >> he's not as dark. he does not have the kind of resentment and anger as some of

the campaign last year. >> that's what we have been saying. the bannon line. >> that was another bannon success. that speech, amazing. >> history. >> that's another thing we have been saying. trump behind the scene is not this negative snarling person he is, nancy pelosi or chuck schumer or anybody else who tells you. elijah cuings. he's charming. >> that's a peak of what self-esteem bann bannon is. >> he did a donohue interview that was similar and promised richard nixon to move back and writing him a letter, mrs. nixon had seen it thought he should be running to office. there is something about his

appeal that's deeply intuitive. >> we have always joked, he's been a democratic all his life. he has been a democrat all his life but test a long island democrat. he's been in nassau county democrat his entire life. for people trying to find consistency in donald trump. he's a nassau county democrat that did well sfooch. >> well, it is archie bunker and not golden sack. >> that's one of the great iro y ironi ironies. he's come to office and he hired all these billionaires and people that, you know, maybe he respects business-wise. >> sort of disconnected of what we were seeing. >> coming up on "morning joe." the press secretary is forced to

apologize after comparing hitler to bashar al-assad. peter alexander is joining us live after interviewing sean spicer and asking him what he was thinking. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

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we didn't use chemical weapons in world war ii. we have someone like hitler who did not think of using chemical weapons. ask yourself is this country and the the line o regime. >> what did you mean by that? >> he was not using gas on his own people in the same way that assad is doing. there was clearly, i understand your point. thank you. i appreciate that.

there was not in the -- he brought them into the holocaust center, i understand that. i am saying in the way assad used them where he went into town and dropped them down into the middle of town. it was brought -- the use of it. i appreciate the clarification. that was not the intent. >> that was sean spicer in the briefing room answering questions why russians should ban its support to the assad regi regime. >> right answer. how he got there of the long and wining road. to it was a long one and he issued a bunch of clarifications and an apology. >> in an interview with nbc's peter alexander, he joins us now from the white house >> joe and micah. >> chris christie delivered shawn specieser some advise is a

good general rule is don't bring up hitler. sean spicer tried to clear up his controversy that's making it a bit work. he was trying to lyle the gravity. >> suggesting that assad's actions using chemical weapons were worse than hitlers ignoring the fact that the nazi gassed million s of people during the holocaust. he e-mailed a series of clarifications to nbc news where he said, in no way i was trying tolessen the horrendous nature of the holocaust. however, i was trying to draw a contrast of tactic of using

airplanes to dro chemical attacks on innocent people. >> it was after those clarifications that he came out in front of the camera and we spoke provided this apology. >> take a listen. >> it was a mistake to make anything in comparison and assad have done bad things. >> you recognize hitler obviously did kill -- >> i am well aware of what he did. it was a distinct that dion tha not need to get made. it was a mistake. i am sorry to make a comparison that was inappropriate and inexcusable. >> new eastern spancy pelosi sa be fired. is your job safe? >> i made a mistake and i am owning up to it.

i hope that if everyone understands that we all make mistakes and asking for forgiveness. >> at the end of the day, it does speak to questions of spicer's credibility and paul manafort only had a limited rule that the house intelligence getting its intelligence from the white house, this week of 48 hours ago, saying the u.s. would consider striking syria if it used just not chemical weapons and bombs, that would mean full scale war. he later clarified from that as well saying that the u.s.'s per serious condition have n decision has not changed. >> wow. >> now the cia director mike

pompeo as he speaks. james thompson by 30 points. compares that to mike pompeo by 32 points. mitt romney won in the district by 26 points. now, democrats are looking at next tuesday's election in georgia' sixth district. >> the election is likely headed to a run off. joining us now republican congress and member of freedom caucus. he's the author of the new book, ken buck, "drain the swamp." >> it is great to have you with us. >> the consensus within the parties, it is the people in power and out of power and you either play the game or with the people in power or you get

kicked to the side. >> there is a bipartisan bankruptcy going on right now. people in both parties are willing to spend more money but not willing the make the tough decisions that put their elections at risk. >> why thnot? >> we have been talking about it for years. it was $4 trillion debt. we are in $20 trillion debt now. >> we'll be at $30 trillion in five years. >> what's so embarrassing of the current situation, we don't have major military conconflict, yete are still spending in debt >> right, what about entitlements. that's the core issue for consercon s conservatives. president trump himself have said he does not want to touch those. >> why is it so difficult in

washington to go after entitlement programs. >> that's always a difficulty in going after any program. the reality is this president is taken security and medicare off the table. we are trying to address medicaid with a work requirement and giving states in the hotel care act. we'll see if that gets done. the majority of the budget is mandatory spending or the entitlement. it is important that we nibble around the edges and do more than nibble when it comes to discretionary spending. mandatory spending is the big chunk. >> congressman, do you think washington is a reflection of the country's special interest or does it create them? >> that as people want, wily

wants his wardrobe deduction. whatever it maybe. >> and that creates a need for these programs. is washington reflecting wh what -- or is there a dpragreat good? >> the large corporation and large interest groups are playing in washington, d.c. in spite of the interest of the american people. i think that there is very little relations of what the american people need and what the interests are in dc. >> can you explain quickly, i don't want to bored people. when people are talking of cutting and spending on the hill, they're talking about cutting of 10% or 11% of the budget, medicare and medicaid and social security. it takes up what? 60% or 75% of the budget. it is the fastest growing

budget. how do we get that message to americans that we are going bankrupt and taking $5 from the national institutes of health is probably not the move we want to make. well. >> it is and it is not. >> it is a good first move to take education and transportation and other programs move them back to the state where they started. >> that's not going to fix our budget. >> it is not to fix if whole thing but it is the right move. >> so a small part of it. >> we are going bankrupt towards a mandatory program. >> fixes on social security are fairly easy to envision but not easy to implement. we got to raise retirement wage a age. we got to do simple things that will get us down that road. medicare is difficult because it is tied in the healthcare issue generally. there are fixes, people don't

want to vote on that because they are comfortable in the s m swamp. >> charles peters, "we do our part toward a fair and equal america." >> the forces that shaped the decade are familiar in our own times. demagogues are ton rise. >> in the summer of 1932, the two most dangerous men in america were douglas macarthur and hughes long. >> explain that a little bit more. >> the book charlie written is about, he ran jfk's campaign in 1960s. he had the most cash. >> the biggest bag of cash. >> that's a whole separate thing. how did a kennedy voter in the

1960s become a trump voter in 2000s. >> and how is obama voter 2008 became trump voter in 2017? >> and there is been a number of forces including greed, a kind of ramping consumerism. a need to make a lot of money that has helped drive the country apart. we don't have the unifying experiences of a draft. widely experiencing public schools. and that as a fraction of the country in ways that can be recovered because the 30s as you kindly quoted. we are not exactly in a an -- there was questions of capitalistic democracy, was it going to last? >> there is a balance of the

question of how do we strike the balance where we take care of the least fortunate among us but we also don't make unwisedd investment in broureaucracy and washington, d.c. that don't work. >> we did not have the kind of deficit spending in our country since we had since then. we are engaged in deficit spending in a way that allows members in congress and avoiding tough decisions. we have to have a balance budget. we have to make sure we make those tough decisions so that we are responsible. >> balance budget amendment. i don't care what year they say. i want the next person running for president telling me if they are going to balance the budge. budget. >> if it is in the year of 2025, that's better to push it off. nobody will give an answer

anymore. i understand it is difficult. >> the experience teaches us and charlie argues this in the book that it is a combination of public and private institutions. >> right. >> the government and private industry, the massive mobilization. it is not all one or the other. it requires an intelligent ability to realize what works in government and what does not. and pushing forward because when you look at what government did in the 30s and 40s and 50s. it created the graeatest achievement. the strengths that won the cold war is an immense achievement. the argument for charlie is if we had a spirit of generosity, it would work. >> thank you for being with us, ken buck. >> "drain the swamp." >> say hi to tim martin for me.

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enbrel, the number one rheumatologist-prescribed biologic. knowing where you stand. it's never been easier. except when it comes to your retirement plan. but at fidelity, we're making retirement planning clearer. and it all starts with getting your fidelity retirement score. in 60 seconds, you'll know where you stand. and together, we'll help you make decisions for your plan... to keep you on track. ♪ time to think of your future it's your retirement. know where you stand. in a moment, united's tough day in the market, losing $255 million in value during -- >> a voucher would have been so much cheaper. >> more than a voucher but a lot less than that. first here's a look at some of the stories we've covered so far

today. white house press secretary sean spicer issued a full apology. >> he got out there a lot faster than the ceo of united airlines. >> i thought he's been losing credibility day by day by day boy day. >> well, it was an apology from the trump administration. something we've never seen before. >> i like steve, but you have to remember -- >> i like steve -- >> which is sort of like in the south, bless your heart. >> bannon is now leaking and jared kushner is calling media executives to plant negative stories. >> if donald trump doesn't think steve bannon can move his domestic agenda, he's got to make a change. >> no president likes to read someone else is their brain. >> tillerson has said the level of trust between the u.s. and russia has deteriorated under donald trump. >> it seems like theind of masters on policy here are coming into their own.

>> president trump is the political equivalent of climate change. it's not always going to be hot or always going to be cold, it's going to be extreme swings. >> if you saw mattis yesterday, what a great, solid performance. praise the lord that that sort of person is that close to the president. >> russia's foreign policy since 1991 has been built upon resentment. >> it's kind of a bucket of cold water reality that's hit the administration as they watch putin's actions. >> when i've gone and talked to some of the troops fighting in syria, i asked them what comes next, what are you fighting to achieve? they don't seem to know. >> i can't believe dick durbin speaking on donald trump's foreign policy team, praise the lord. >> well, it is a really strong one. during a meeting with ceos yesterday, president trump discussed the need for high-paying american jobs. when he estimated how many jobs his administration has already created. >> we've made a lot of progress. you see what's going on, you see the numbers.

we figure over 600,000 jobs in a very short period of time and it's going to start catching on now because some of the things we have done are big league and catching on. already we've created more than -- almost 600,000 jobs. >> according to the u.s. department of labor, in february and march they created over 330,000 jobs. the president served only two weeks the month of january but claimed full credit for that month's 220,000 jobs. even if he did take credit for that, he'd still be at 533,000. >> where did he get that number? >> i think somebody told him, you created 600,000 new jobs. >> no. that's a thing. >> dominic chu -- >> i don't think anyone told him that, joe. i think he just made it up. >> they could be fake numbers. >> so, dom, united. >> united. the hits keep coming. >> fly the friendly skies. >> it used to be the friendly skies and everything went awry with this passenger, a physician in kentucky.

but if you take a look overall, the comments are now apologetic. they didn't start out that way but now ty're turning about face and we're going to talk about the apologies. oscar munoz making statements this is never going to happen again. they're pledging an internal review. it's going to be completed by the end of the month. they're never going to let law enforcement on the plane again to take a paying passenger off. he spoke this morning again on "good morning america" just talking about this idea of apologizing and trying to get maybe their ducks in a row a little bit. take a listen to what he said with regard to the culpability of what happened and who was to blame. >> do you think he's at fault in any way? >> no. he can't be. he was a paying passenger sitting on our seat in our aircraft and no one should be treated that way, period. >> it took him -- >> come on, that was the right answer. >> it took him a long time to get there. >> what's interesting is you get the sense that the initial

response, where he didn't really apologize at all, you think maybe he was trying to defend his employees a little bit, i'm not throwing anybody under the bus just yet. but in the statement he made yesterday, he said it's never too late to do the right thing so now he's out there apologizing, trying to get on people's side again here. this is all with regard to lawmakers now calling for possible action. maybe guys in washington saying there should be an investigation. >> an incident like this really in the long run hurt united? you go online to find a flight, united is $300, airline x is $500, we're taking the $300 flight. >> you know what's interesting, i had asked in a twitter poll a couple of days ago when we talked about incident happening, i asked if it really mattered to people. do you boycott them because of this or does price matter? most people say that it's price that matters to them. they're going to fly the plane that gives them the best fare. what's interesting about this is why didn't you just offer people more money. you went to 800.

why not go to 1200 or 1300. this would have saved millions in lawyer fees. >> go to $3,000. make it worth it. get them off the flight. >> you can make the case that the one thing that has helped united is the deregulation during the obama administration when all these airlines were allowed to merge and buy one another, so your choices as a consumer are severely restricted. >> right. that's what's happened so far. that's one of the big issues with regard to what's happening with united right now. >> uber also in the news. >> rachel whetstone has decided to step down as the head of communications at uber. >> things aren't going well for uber. >> so jill hazelbaker is a very high profile woman. she's going to take over that role at uber. but you guys mentioned how difficult it's been for this company. they're fighting allegations of sexism, management upheaval in turmoil, they have a lawsuit from google's parent company

about possibly stealing secrets with regard to self-driving car technology. >> i heard last week somebody said if this were a publicly traded company, the ceo would be gone. >> it's interesting you bring that up, because there's been a lot of -- even though it's a private company, worth $68 billion by the way in private markets right now, there is no way that you can look tick by tick with regard to what it trades at like we can other stocks like united. whether the ceo at the helm right now is a founder by the way, and there's a case to be made founders have the passion and drive that it takes to run a company in the stage it is right now. private companies are still owned by public investors, mutual funds, things we own in our 401(k)s. you wonder whether or not if they were publicly traded whether you'd see market values hit like they were with united given the fact the pr nightmare has escalated to the point it has. >> does uber drag passengers out of cars yet? >> there was a very high-profile

argument with one of the drivers. >> a couple of months ago i went to an interview in pittsburgh because they had the pilot program for the self-driving cars. in the two days after i interviewed them, so much happened to uber, we couldn't air the interview because they wouldn't let us come back and talk to them again. there's been so much swirling around uber, you can't keep it state. >> it's such a high-profile company. we've all used it. i'm not sure what people's experiences are but this is in the forefront of so many americans' lives. it will eventually go public, but who knows how this is going to affect it. >> i've had good experiences with it. something interesting happened this weekend. joey came out for my birthday. i said did you get an uber? he said no, i look lyft. first time i heard that. and it's just -- it's always interesting how things like this happen, uber dominates the entire market. until the day it doesn't.

>> right. and you talk about the idea -- remember, we used to talk about walmart dominating the retail landscape. even now. i mean for me, like so many other americans, the first place i now look if i'm buying anything, i go to -- we say google is a verb. amazon is like a verb to me. even if i don't buy from amazon, i use it as a benchmark. i go there first to see what the price is there and the trader in me wants to comparison shop around to see if i can get a better deal. >> it's really incredible. i this past week did something i've never done before, bought a guitar off of amazon. >> come on. >> you can always go to all these other sites but it was a pretty standard guitar i wanted to get. checked out the other prices. what am i doing? i get everything through amazon. so went to amazon and, sure enough, their price was really good. i got the guitar i wanted and,

you know, i hit it. it showed up at my door two days later. >> you can talk to people, i'm sure you have, who own big retail stores, raulph lauren, will there be stores. >> they're shutting their flagship store. >> amazon has disrupted the retail landscape with what they're doing. i live in a small town in connecticut and we have a town dump. i waited in line for 15 cars at the town dump. i never go there. i had so much cardboard in the back of my truck. >> exactly. i have an issue with this. >> everyone is dumping cardboard now. >> because everyone is buying everything, their paper towels on amazon. it's ridiculous, and all the boxes? no thanks. yeah, that's -- anyhow, we leave you this morning. alex, i hope this isn't -- with some harrowing video out of paris where a carnival ride malfunctioned. >> i don't want to see this. >> leaving a little girl

swinging wildly above the ground. the straps apparently holding her malfunctioned. she was left hanging by her ankles barely off the ground. the owners of the ride say it's a miracle no one was hurt and they're vowing to dismantle the ride. oh, my -- oh, my god. >> why are we doing this? >> that's not fun. >> show alex's face. >> that's not fun. >> i want to see alex's face. put alex up. >> why would they do that. >> toss to chris jansing now, it's her time. >> why would you do that, alex? >> it was incredible video and she's fine. >> chris jansing, we got nothing else. chris, go ahead. >> how could you possibly top that, joe and mika. thank you. i am chris jansing in for stephanie ruhle this rng.