dispatched to reach a place where chemical weapons were use used,. the plans are delivering the chemical weapons. i'm not convinced this was the case, nor are we convinced by the tv images or by the statements of people at the airport. there were no signs to support the statement. the allegation that chemical agents were used at all, i'm sorry for taking so long to commt, b i would like to und underline that we are 100% sure that if our colleagues at u.n.

as well as the hague tried to avoid this investigation, this will signify that they are reluctant to find out the truth. but we will insist the truth should be found. >> secretary tillerson, i want to ask you about your conversations with president putin about syria. you've predicted assad will leave power through a political transition. how will you compel assad to participate in a political transition that leads to his own ouster? are war crimes charges on the table, and how long will the united states wait for russia, and for mr. lavrov as our parts. do you feel that you.

since you had those discussions with secretary tillerson. >> we did discuss at length the future role for assad, whether it be in a future political process or not. clearly, our view is that the reign of the assad regime is coming to an end. they brought this upon themselves. we discussed that russia is their closest contact in the conflict, perhaps has the best means of helping assad recognize this reality. we do think that it's important that assad's departure is done in an orderly way so that certain interests and constituencies that he represents feel that they have been better negotiated.

we lead you to the process forward. the final outcome, in our view, does not provide for a role in the assad family for the future governance of syria. committee dhooingt the international community will accept that, we do not think the world will accept that. [ inaudible question ] >> we discussed the issue that as time goes by and more evidence continues to be gathered, it is possible that the threshold necessary to charge individuals, including the star of assad, may well be achieved. as you know, this is a very high legal hurdle in order to bring such charges to an individual. i would not suggest to you all that evidence is in place,

however, i think there will be people working hard to make that case. >> translator: i for one would like to say that i do not think that russia and the u.s. have -- on any. rex tillerson, we mentioned the agreements that are receipted not just. . bashar albuquerque -- bashar

assad and i had sort of a background. he's a neat guy, and not looking into history, but to deal with the matters of today. the thing is, the world is built in such a fashion that if we do not take lessons from the past, we will not be able to achieve success and the president. and i record. western country, major country. dismissing that requires a utilitarian leader, failure to launch upon us in 1989.

your tv station. residential areas were shelled. the italian embassy was also attacked. several trains and bridges were bombed. the shelling went on for three mont months. then they run out of. -- double do-do, his facility is. >> there was another dictator who after. i believe tommy bath was the only one to repent publicly,

admitting it had been a fake or the grounds for thegadhafi. there was no place for this dictator in his country. it was said democracy will prevail, but we know what's happening in libya right now. the libyan state is all but nonexistent. our president talked about that yesterday with the italian president. right now we're trying to restore the libyan statehood through the church of national reconciliation. we're trying to put an end to. as your media.

incidentally, there are others. the president of sudan, there has been a warrant for his arresti arrest issued, and the obama administration decided in order to solve this problem, they had to be split into two hafz. his wife wanted. so don was split into two parts in a quite answer with the

people -- and then washington ntszed that sanctioned could be imposed the. they are trying to oust this school, dictator, totalitarian leader is well known to us. we know how it ends. a successful ouster of a dictator is hard to remember. if you have any pointers, i would be glad if you could share them with me. on syria, as our president has stated on many occasions, we are not to put our hopes on anyone's, bashar assad or anyone else, right now. we want them to sit at one

negotiating table. the gather together. this is an interesting ndiadial. the future of syria has to be determined by the seal yan-- saliency. we we have to agree on how the company should be built. . to feel representative at government agencies. well, the issues related to

certain personalities was said without any consequences for the people. thank you. >> no questions. driver's license. em. i received. there is cyber security in accordance to what the american media says that they were -- the u.s. is trying to keep north korea from happening using same means. a working group has been set up. are you talking about resuming

the work of the bilateral presidential commission? do you plan to do that? thank you. >> we touched only briefly on the issue of cyber security, and in particular, on the challenges that it is placing on everyone in terms of a new threat, an emerging threat. but i think i do make a distinction when cyber tools are used to interfere with the internal decisions among countries as to how their election is conducted. cyber tools to disrupt weapons programs. that's another use of the tools. i make a distinction between those two. clearly this is an issue tha

tharj -- that will use further discussions, and it is in the agenda that lovlav passed over to me. >> i can only assume we are. you probably haven't heard. we said that on much karpz. there is concern about the activities of the so-called russian hackers. they started to pursue the world without relating to the procedures that exist between russia and the u.s.

we would have had to extradite them from third countries. back then, we said we are not interested and these citizens do college. . at anyone trying to breach the international norm but also rea realm. at the end of the obama vangs in december yoo. i would rather give them to agencies agreed, but at the last minute, the obama administration was used. they were probably very, very interested in undermining the

american/illinois. once again, that's confirmed, and that is we wihen we decided meeting of special envoy should be viewed by the president and followed up by reg free. leaving tv to a new trial of. did i lateral kpt cash kuhn. it mop r mob.

we've got channels that just seem toll ol. no, it might be in a different format. we have designated special persons to look at grievanciegr to look into how we can overcome the these. our other concessions the united states mate miight make exchange of the russian government. did you point out to the russian governor that they interfered in the election?

if assad finds his own government attacked them with chemical weapons, what will the russians do? did you present evidence to secretary tillerson today, and would russia refuse to agree in any correspondent pauktsz that results in the ousting of bashar al-assad. . >> there have been actions taken in the ukraine, as you know. that has been fairly well established in the united states and spoken to on the hill with congress. it is a serious issue. it's one that we know is serious enough to attract additional sanctions.

we are mindful of the particular interference in our elections, and i'm sure russia is mindful of it as well. >> the state secretary has not said the new sanctions at all. we have, unfortunately, no settlement in a majority of those issues. if this investigation reveals the government's implementation in chemical attacks, let's say a hypothetical. we do not want to speculate. we see how speculation can bring

results. we see some aesthetical statements from the senate after the attack on the air base. we do not want to speculate on what's really important on the serious matter of the use of chemical weapons on trying to exonerate anyone, at the attempts of staging and attack of use of chemical weapons. they have established the compliance with the american administration, the russian lords, the lords of any other country. but the principal has to accept it. today we understand an appeal to the haig an unbiased,

transparent investigation. but should there be a dragging on of this investigation, we'll have to make the necessary conclusions. now, as for the allegations that the u.s. government has irrefutable proof that we interfered with the electoral campaign, i have to say once again that we have not seen any facts or hints at facts. we have not seen any evidence. no one has shown us any evidence even though we have requested on many occasions that these evidence has to support the accusations we hear. we do understand there are people who want to undermine our

relations, but these are just names with answers. we want a complete report and then we will respond accordingly. >> good evening. we bring the question to both, do you want to start a strike group with an air sport caveat? if this group has been sent to the peninsula, does this signify the u.s. has some plans for military intervention in north korea. thank you. >> the strike group is routinely in the pacific ocean. it's in the pacific theater. and its movements in the pacific

are made in a way that is planned by the military planners. there is no particular objective in its current course. the vincent sales up and down the pacific routinely, so i would not read anything currently into the carl vincent's current locations. >> the only thing i can say is that among other issues, we have discussed the situation on the korean peninsula. as far as i understand, given all the answers, we still have a common determination to resolve this issue through peaceful

means through diplomatic talks. there are certain efforts undertaken by the participants of what used to be called the six-party talks. we also have ideas of our own just as our chinese counterparts do. we believe we've got to rally around the cause of finding peaceful solution to this issue. and the last question? >> thank you very much. mr. secretary, before these meeting, you said you believed russia was either incompetent or complicit in these chemical weapons attacks. after your extensive meeting with lavrov and putin, do you know which ones was and what could be built to eliminate that

lack of us if i could, siresident trump has called bashar assad an animal. this is the group your government continues to back. can you tell us how long russia will be willing to risk the lives of its soldiers and spend its money to protect him? >> with respect to russia's knowledge of the chemical attack, we have no way to know that there was any involvement by russian 4forces into this attack. what we do know, and we have a high confidence that the attack was planned and carried out by the regime forces at the direction of bashar al-assad. >> translator: i can only say

once again that justice for the hackers and the chemical incidence in syria, we very much would like to get some concrete evidence, not just words. so far we have not seen any facts, and let me highlight once again in syria, we are acting at the request of the government of the country, which is a member of the united nations. this country is under sanctions of the security council. in order to fight terrorism, and it is in our interests, to prevent damascus from being

involved. the obama administration did almost nothing to achieve the objective it had stated when being tablished. against the front or isis until the russian air forces were deployed in syria. after the deployment, the u.s. administration only performed strikes against certain held against forces. we've got some suspicions. we think that the el nesfro rg people shop around to avoid transcript b, to overthrow the assad regime with force. we know how this is going to end because we saw similar situations in libya and iraq, and we do hope the people will

prevail and know how to learn from history. as for who is responsible for the crimes committed in syria, we have to look into that. but as one counterpart said, there will be time for everything we've got to set priorities and listen to priorities from washington saying i say, as property number 1, as mr. spicer has said we have the forces without doing anything to you. the assad regime. this is the same thing john kerry had told me. the u.s. administration. they're a more serious threat and a more important objective than the acid regime. so i think we think along the same lines. we have to see the common threads. they are apparent. and if we are to fight isis, if

we are to emerge victorious from this fight without ousting the regi regime. when ousting the regime, this is no guarantee we will defeat isis. on the contrary, isis might remain victorious if we oust the regime. colleagues, this is the end of the press kompconference. thank you for participating. thank you. >> and you have been watching the end of a remarkable press conference after a remarkable day. marathon meetings between u.s. secretary of state rex tillerson on your left shaking hands with sergei lavrov, the veteran foreign minister for russia.

he's been the dean of the top diplomats, and the two of them having a meeting with vladimir putin, the president of russia. very interesting mixed messages coming -- maybe not mixed, they were entirely separate messages coming but they actually seemed coordinated. what these three gentlemen agreed upon is they don't agree generally about anything. in fact, general lavrov said we have difficulties with the majority of items on our mutual agenda. when it comes to syria, he said it is hypothetical and speculative that the chemical attack was planned and executed by the syrian regime. secretary rex tillerson said several times that he believes the attack was planned and performed by the regime of bashar assad. russia said they're not convinced of that, and rex tillerson said they discussed at length syria's leader. the agreement between the two,

they said, is they want a unified and stable syria, which is about as milquetoast a statement you can come out with. obviously everybody wants a stable country. they don't agree what stability in syria looks like. what's important about that point is that russia believes a stable syria is not possible with the ouster o bashar al-ass and left with the various groups fighting in syria. america doesn't have as clear a position on exactly what success in syria looks like. our team of correspondents and analysts are standing by with the latest. let's start with hallie jackson who is at the white house and bill mealie in moscow. putin said a meeting would not take place. what do we know about that? >> all russia said was a meeting was not on the agenda and that's

typical. mr. tillerson has always met wi -- vladimir putin always met with john kerry every time he came here, so it was quite possible he wouldn't meet with mr. tillerson. however, he did for two hours, and mr. tillerson and lavrov met for three. the first word was from sergei lavrov saying, this has been a long day. all they agreed on, i think, was that they didn't agree on very much and that their relations were at a terribly low state. and on that, mr. lavrov said the current situation with the u.s. is far from easy. we need to deal with the irritants in our relationship. and rex tillerson said the current state is at a low point, which is interesting. that would suggest that it's even lower perhaps than it was under barack obama. we can't let this continue.

we need to put an end to this steady degradation. then they talked about ways that they would do that. but apart from ukraine, which they said they touched on a little, and the situation in the korean peninsula which they agreed was bad, really a lot of the discussion was not really based on syria but based on what happens next with president assad. mr. tillerson sdhey discussed assad at length. he said assad should leave power in an orderly way. the reign of the assad family is coming to an end and russia can help him realize this reality. they have the means to do so. but he said it's also important assad's departure should be done in an orderly way and it's unclear how that might occur. lavrov's reply was very interesting as well. he said the u.s. has an obsession with regime change, with getting rid of dictators. we've got too many examples of that and hardly any of them are

positive. >> and he cited a number of them. >> the discussion might have been about a number of things, just obviously focused on syria and focused on assad. >> sergei lavrov very artfully focused on a number of those examples of regime change, the implication being the u.s. doesn't know what to do at the other end of the regime change. interesting, though, that the words that bill just read that rex tillerson said sound very much like the obama administration policy about bashar al-assad, that he has to go in an orderly fashion. it does not seem like any departure from policy. hallie jackson is at the white house. hallie, in an interview this morning, president trump chastised president putin for backing bashar assad. let's listen and then we'll talk about it on the other side. >> frankly, we talked chemicals because people just don't see this, the level of brutality, the level of viciousness. but when they dropped barrel

bombs and bombs of any kind on top of a civilian population, that's the worst thing. i've never seen anything like it. and frankly, putin is backing a person that is truly an evil person. and i think it's very bad for russia. i think it's very bad for mankind, it's very bad for this world. >> putting aside the fact that while assad was barrel bombing his people, donald trump was tweeting that bark obama shouldn't have any involvement in syria, the formal ties go back between russia and syria to 1944. russia has a naval base and now an airfield in syria. at this point shaming vladimir putin may not be the best strategy. sdplz that is sort of the big question and the potential question mark on the strategy moving forward. i would pull back and say a couple things, ali. number one, the language you

heard from vladimir putin was strong. president trump expressed a desire to work with him in his campaign, last year calling him a stronger leader than president obama. the question now, though, what we heard from rex tillerson was very tough talk. we have not heard that matched yet from president trump. for all the talk about how crucial this press conference that we just watched was, and it was, remember, there is another one here at the white house in about two hours from now. less than that at this point. we will hear from the president directly. we'll hear when he stands side by side from the asian public, we were going to get that, and i wouldn't be surprised if this wasn't the driver of those questions. the news conference we heard from the u.s. side, the secretary of state reiterating, essentially, what we have been hearing from officials here, and that is that there is a firm

belief that assad was behind the chemical weapons attack. you saw tillerson sitting directly across from lavrov who, bill said, was firm in his responses as well. the only other part was opening remember additional sanctions. you heard the secretary of state say they briefly talked about this but adding it was serious enough. again, a big question mark is this relationship between u.s. and russia clearly is changing from where donald trump hoped it would be on juary 21st. >> clearly a question of whether it's on the road to improving or on the road to worsening. the two most important diplomats in the world took very different inferences on everything that

added up. the washington editor at large for the atlantic, and with me, nina shevrei is here. you believe thfis was a very important deal. you believe there may have been some sort of breakthrough. >> i don't know about the breakthrough. i think it's very early to tell. but i think the tone was different. yes, they disagreed on a lot of things, essentially everything. but rex tillerson actually stayed away from blaming the russians, from pk saying, we don't have a firm belief. >> it important, i think the tone was very calming and satisfying, and the news was that rex tillerson and vladimir

putin were to meet for five hours. they are trying to see if their reels ship can be better. >> one of the things lavrov said was, we understand each other a lot better than we did in the beginning. what do you think that means? >> i think it means, the reason i'm speaking in a calmer tone and i think it's important. there was always some sort of ak indication on the corner. tillerson was ryve, very careful about that. he knows the russians very well. . he knows that confronting the russians is only. he may actually give assad up, but it would be on his terms. therefore, tillerson seems to believe that it's important to work very hard to find that

common ground. even as he started that common ground -- >> yeah, it was interesting. i've never seen two guys disagree to disagree as well. captain from a what we believe -- you would more than i would about this, but a joint. but the idea of cyber interference in. he said, i would rather talk about cyber activity during a campaign rather than try to interrupt a military program. >> that statement was important. the united states from time to time carries out cyber warfare operations on military programs,

like the iranian nuclear weapons program, or north korea. now, that is going to become interesting in the future because the russianed used those exact same cyber weapons systems to affect elections. they make no distinction whatsoever. i was surprised tillerson brought that up. it was almost like a tacit admission because someone believes the russian interference with the united states needs to be brought up by russia. that gives an indication of what's going on inside the white house. early on, i thought till r sers was just a messenger, that he wa't setting any policy, and he didn't really have any staff to do that policy. and the russians was a diplomatic force playing not just to the foreign ministry and the kremlin but to the world. it looked like two entirely different things. but tillerson brought the

message that nikki haley, the republicans and the senate and general mattis and general mcmaster believe in, and the tillerson of four days ago just seemed to exist. >> there was one moment that didn't seem in keeping of what president trump said, but generally speaking, this did sound a lot more like nikki haley did before. in the next hour and a half, the president will be meeting with the secretary general of nato, and they have a few very key issues. they've got russia, which is always at issue. . they described to taeblg turkey and they've got north korea. does this set the stage for what donald trump and the nato head are going to talk about? >> i'm sure they're going to discuss all these potential scenarios. it's odd when you bring up north

korea and syria. we are, in a way, dependent on china with regard to north korea and russia with regard to syria. we've got both of these to deal with involving two complicated leaders. tillerson basically said assad has to go just like barack obama said bashar assad has to go. we don't have the means to do that, russia does, and i think it's highly unlikely physical. putin agreed to redeploy the opportunity. >> leet take a poll of everyone on the screen at the moment. in your opinion, steve, is the temperature a little bit lower than it was when this conversation started or a little

bit higher? >> i think along with what nina just said, the temperature is maybe a little lower by a degree. i don't think anything has been solved. it is pretty frozen. >> do you think so, malcolm? >> i'm not quite sure because when i hear lavrov speak, i start to wonder, what is he setting up for the next stage in this conversation? russia doesn't do anything just for the benefit of lowering or raising temperatures, they have strategic objectives they want to meet here. so if there appears to be the very fact that we're having discussions and that that now puts us on parody with russia, russia -- they're going to get something out of it. >> that is the kind of in answer. nina, thank you for staying, by the way. nina has been here since the beginning of the whole thing.

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that comment by president trump adding fuel to the fire of speculation that steve bannon may soon hear "you're fired." now a source close to the president tells nbc news that his comments were a warning shot, highlighting that the president doesn't say these things in haste. here's what president trump told the new york post. quote, you have to remember he wasn't involved in my campaign until very late. i'm my own strategist and it wasn't like i was going to change strategies because i was facing crooked hillary. steve is a good guy but tell him to straighten it out or i will. this was a meeting held between jared kushner and steve bannon. the president was frustrated with the constant squabbling and the coverage of it. but he reportedly has said the infighting has stopped. but it's not just the showdown between bannon and kushner that

may be irking the president. there was an "snl" skit that didn't help and it has not gone over well with the commander in chief. corrine jean-pierre is a spokesperson. bannon told katy tur that the chief strategist is, quote, in a very bad place right now. what's your thought? >> he's in a terrible place made in the point in the set-up. donald trump has essentially thrown him under the bus. he really took any credit away from him that he had in the campaign. remember, ali, president trump has surrounded himself with different ideas than in the campaign. the campaign was largely centered around steve bannon ideas. but in the white house he surrounds himself with people

that have different ideas than steve bannon, and some of those ideas come from his son-in-law jared kushner who seems to be in charge of everything but the galaxy, and steve bannon's portfolio is shrinking. he seems shrinkingful he seems to be in a precarious place. he doesn't have a lot of allies. some junior members like steve miller. he is very isolated there. >> let me ask you, this happens. there are peel in the president's orbit. whatever president it is. who have different opinions. they fight it out. we've always had these shake-ups. sean spicer says overblown. he has his own problems today. what's the real story? if you're not following the palace intrigue as closely, what's the story? >> donald trump is reaping exactly what he sowed. he knew what he was getting when he hired steve bannon in one of the most important positions you

can have. and honestly, a white supremacist should be nowhere near the oval office. and now, steve bannon is clearly being thrown under the bus or soon to be thrown under the bus for the first 100 days of disaster that the trump administration has been doing. let's be clear here. donald trump and steve bannon are one and the same. donald trump was donald trump before steve bannon joined the campaign. six years ago, donald trump was the one who decided to be the spokesperson for the birtherism. he's the one that took star of david and went after hillary clinton and called her corrupt. he is the one that couldn't denounce david duke. so it is not just bannon that's the problem here. the fish really -- >> let's talk about the factions within the west wing. teem bannon, team kushner, team priebus. if the president is shifting away from bannon possibly, who

gains? >> i really think it is the family. i think jared kushner has been given an enormous amount of responsibility which is concerning. he doesn't seem to have the requisite experience. it may turn out he does a terrific job. but what's on his plate now is the presidential plate. and it is very hard to, unless you focus a few things to get anything done, if you're just spread out all over the place. clearly the family. >> thanks to the two of you for joining me. we were hoping for a longer conversation but misters lavrov and tillerson. >> a he tried to te aim at bashar al assad. seeing double?

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go long.

i made a mistake. no other way to say it. i got into a topic that i shouldn't have and i screwed up. it is a very holy week for the jewish people and the christian people. this inot to make a gaffe and a mistake like this is inexcusable and reprehensible. >> sean spicer making another stop on his apology tour. he sat down with greta van susteren and asked for forgiveness regarding his comments yesterday, comparing

bashar al assad to hitler yesterday. >> we didn't use chemical weapons in world war ii. even hitler did not sink to chemical weapons. he was not using his gas in the same way. there was clearly, thank you. i appreciate that. there was not, he brought them into the holocaust center. i understand that. >> ouch. here with me, the democrat from new york. good to see you. yesterday you called his remarks unbelievably inappropriate, uninformed, offensive and inexcusable. he has apologized many times. i know from a long time ago, you accept the apology but how do things like this get said? what does it tell but the administration that he can make comments like this? >> it shows an appalling

ignorance of history and insense it. how anybody can say anything like that. in his apology, he said assad dropped, use chemicals on his own people as if the couple hundred thousand german jews who were murdered in the holocaust, many through the use of gas, were not german. hitler said, if you're jewish, you can't be germ an. like in syria, you're not really assyrian. it is appalling and it shows that he has a lack of historical knowledge and sensitivity beyond believe. this unthe fortunately is in line withomof the other insensitivity. doubling down on it. >> our own craig melvin had to

corner the froze include jews in hospital tlocaust had he been r. or the fellow working for steve bannon. >> in this case, what do you think should happen to sean spicer? do we accept the apology and move on? >> i think we accept the apology. i think he ought to be fired, not because he said something so stupid and offensive but because of what it reveals about his ignorance of history. he is not suitable for that job. >> thank you for your time. congressman nadler of new york. a big meeting for the president is coming up in the next hour. kate snow picks things one that news. you have a busy afternoon. >> you did too. i'm kate snow and we're watching several stories. here the big ones, starting with the main event. president trump's joint press conference with the nato secretary general. they have a lot to talk about. we'll get you ready for that.

we'll bring it to you live when it starts about an hour from now. that's not all. a very busy, very important day for american foreign policy. the second meeting. 5,000 miles away has the world's attention this afternoon. secretary of state rex tillerson sitting down with russian president putin. plus, is steve bannon on the hot seat? president trump giving a less than ringing endorsement of his chief strategist. i want to introduce to you hallie jackson, michael o'hanlon here. the director of research at the brookings institution. if i can, hallie, i'll start with you. let me start with bill in moscow. that's where we've had all the action in the last hour and then i'll get to you. that press conference between foreign minister of russia and secretary tillerson, it was