such wide discussion and circulation, i know you're reluctant to criticize your colleagues in the navy, except for one football game each year. this doesn't look good, general. >> no, you're right. i mean, as an element of keystone cops all over this. couple observations may be helpful. the u.s. navy knows where every ship in the global surface fleet is instantaneously, 24 hours a day. there is no question about that. it's all on electronic grid worldwide system. second observation, when yo send a carrier battle group, they don't steam along the shore three miles out from the beach. they're out there as a presence and normally we announce them. north koreans can't follow anything at sea. so, i think, you know, what happened was the administration canceled the australian deployment, but picked up the maneuvers that were close to where the ship was, and then they said, look, we're getting the same threat out of it.

one other observation. what it tells you is there was never the slightest intention of flying carrier strike aircraft in north korea to take out their missiles or nukes, which most have been saying the last two weeks. >> true. and yet, jeremy, we talked about the possibility because we heard the president in real-time talk about this armada, clearly aimed at north korea, full disclosure. we reported it as fact. so did every news organization we saw including "the new york times" which has now published this different version of events. the armada comment got a wide circulation. >> the armada comment was april 12. it turns out on april 12, the carl vinson carrier strike group was 3500 miles away from the korean peninsula. it's like saying, a ship off the coast of san diego is headed to new york. i mean, it's just -- it's not even remotely true.

now, i think one of the reasons why the president made that statement incorrectly was that the president, i'm told, was not consulted at all about the movement of the carl vinson carrier strike group. this was a decision made by pacific command, by admiral harris. and the white house only found out about it when the navy issued its press release. so, the president in effect was taking credit for a muscular move that he played actually no role in deciding. >> barry, this is when i ask you about the new and developing relationship between a political novice who is now commander in chief of all u.s. military forces, and a standing military, jeremy's old shop at the pentagon, which is a force unto itself. >> well, it's going to be a very difficult period, there's no question about it. i think the good news is, look, secretary mattis, a very stable knowledgeable guy, the armed forces worships him.

we've got a good guy on the ground in korea, vince brooks, army four star. so, i think the military leadership is going to be just fine. the question is how do you govern govern a country when you have the president tweeting outrageous foreign policy on a daily basis. the pentagon muste confused and worried. >> and jeremy, this all comes under the kind of overall banner of transparency. as recently as a week ago, we learned about something as localized as white house visitor logs. but you have for sometime seen a larger meaning and a larger danger in not making those public. >> well, the white house invoked national security reasons for not making those white house visitor logs public as they had been made in the obama administration. and i've been trying to talk to people and try to figure out what national security purpose or intelligence rationale could there be. and i've come up empty, brian.

i cannot find a single national security rationale. if there is one or two or a set of people who go to the white house whose identities we need to mask, there is a process in place. there can be a process in place for essentially withholding that from the public. but otherwise this looks like an effort to side step transparency. >> jeremy bash, general barry mccaffery, gentlemen, thank you again for answering the call and staying up late with us tonight. another break for us coming up, the book every political junky is getting their hands on. new behind the scenes details of the presidential campaign everyone thought was a sure thing, but instead went down in defeat when "the 11th hour" continues. look closely. hidden in every swing, every chip, and every putt, is data that can make the difference between winning and losing. the microsoft cloud helps the pga tour turn countless points of data into insights that

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because when any barrier falls in america, it clears the way for everyone. [cheering and applauding] after all, when there are no ceilings, the sky's the limit. [cheering and applauding] >> our producer just said it feels like 100 years ago, and doesn't it? and we realize that a lot of our democratic viewers have a hard time seeing that again. welcome back to "the 11th hour". and here's a question. was it bad timing, a flawed candidate, espionage, hubris, or poor organization that led hillary clinton to defeat last november, or some combination of the above? the new book shattered: inside hillary clinton's doomed campaign reveals new previously unreported details on the inner workings of the clinton effort to win the presidency and

ultimately her downfall. with over 100 sources, the author describes the candidate determined not to repeat the miss takes of her failed '08 campaign and yet somehow doomed to repeat them. her defeat to donald trump left supporters and allies shell shocked, resulting in a late night phone call with her most powerful supporter, president obama. here is how the authors describe that moment. and we quote. with the president placing a consolation call, the reality and dimensions of her defeat hit hillary clinton all at once. she had let him down. she had let herself down. she had let her party down. and she had let her country down. obama's legacy and her dreams of the presidency lay shattered at donald trump's feet. this was on her. reluctantly, she rose from her seat and took the phone from huma's happened. quote, mr. president she said softly, i'm sorry. the authors jonathan allen and amy parns are here with us

tonight. congratulations to you both because a project of this size is a huge undertaking. >> thank you, brian. >> thank you very much. >> first of all, a question about ground rules. you did get incredible accs. what was the deal with those around you in the heat of battle about what their quotes were going to be used for and as? >> we wanted to get the most accurate, the most candid story. so, we reached agreement with the highest levels of the campaign early on that we wouldn't use anything before the election ended and we would only use it on background. and for the most part, i think we got a pretty accurate picture of what was happening inside the campaign. >> everyone has their moment of when they knew election night was going to be different than the plot line a lot of people expected. for us, it was having james carville on the air with us. and when he started to realize this meant virginia, when he started to realize this meant florida, he physically became

ashen, and he became -- his mood went dark. that's when we knew. what can you share with us about what it was like on the inside that night? >> it's interesting, you know, the first signs of trouble were florida early in the night. and they see what's going on there, and in particular there were a couple of people, craig smith who is one of president clinton's oldest aides and allies, and steve shale is a long-time democratic operative in florida. kept calling people that they knew and saying, this doesn't look good, this doesn't look right. and ultimately they saw that they were going to lose in florida. and then the question was, is what we're seeing in florida, is the change in republican and democratic strength in some of these areas in florida, is that going to be extrapolated out to north carolina? will it be the same in parts of pennsylvania -- rural parts of pennsylvania, suburban parts of pennsylvania, wisconsin, there was a sinking feeling early on

that was going to happen. they had to wait and watch as this went on. hillary clinton herself was pretty stoic during the night, you know. that loss in florida, even though it didn't mean that they were going to lose the election, where they were losing and the way in which they were losing really sort of early on set the tone. and it never got -- never got much better. the end of the book is a blow-by-blow behind the scenes what went on in the peninsula hotel where hillary clinton and her brain trust were, you know, from the beginning of that night all the way through her calls with president obama, her call to president trump -- now president trump. >> adding to the sadness of that night was the setting, the glass ceiling that was a metaphor at the javitz center. even the lectern in the middle of the giant stage, shaped like the united states, the structure full of mostly young campaign volunteers, victory was so clearly in the air early on that

evening, and their faces changed on live television as we watched. amy, i pose the question at the start of the segment, was it bad timing, a flawed candidate, espionage, hubris, or poor organization, or a combination of all of them? >> i think all of the above, brian, and here's why. i think she didn't have a message. we detail in the book pretty -- we give you a tick tock, the very beginning her launch speech went awry. she had 20 people working on the speech instead of just the principal usually and the speech writer. so, you already have warring factions. they couldn't really decide what the message was, what the center of gravity was. this was her very first -- this was her moment to basically say -- to lay the groundwork and say this is what she was about. she didn't do that properly. and then it kept going. it was, you know, these warring factions. there was infighting at the top. the top two political advisors,

jo podesta and robbie mo, they didn't get along. you know, one didn't trust the other. there were other, you know, accounts lower down the level where -- lower down the line where people were infighting and they didn't quite know and how to get access to secretary clinton. so, and then there are image problems and there are e-mail problems and all of this sort of coupled with russia and comey kind of built the big picture of how she lost. >> i want to read two quotes. number one, in her view it was up to the people she paid to find the right message for her. a construction deeply at odds with the way sanders and trump built their campaigns around their own gut feelings about where to lead the country. this next quote, around the nevada caucus time, she tells a friend, i don't understand what's happening with the country. i can't get my arms around it. how do i get answers to this?

jonathan, how could she not have a tactile feel for politics after so many years in politics? a fair question. >> it's a very fair question. and bernie sanders had that tactile feel for the populism, the rising populism. >> the president did. >> the current president did. her whole life she has been somebody who believes you make change by working in the system. this is something we saw in the 2008 election, in the primary where she debated a little bit with barack obama over whether it was martin luther king, the outsider or linden johnson, the legislator, and then president who made the biggest difference in civil rights law. this is somebody who really truly believes that in the establishment and i think people saw that about her, that she was representing the establishment and the status quo. of course, donald trump's argument was the exact opposite,

he was a disrupter, he was somebody who was going to bring change. she just couldn't -- she said, these are her words, couldn't wrap her mind around what was going on in the electorate, that desire to change things so much that antipathy for anything that was part of the system or the establishment, she just -- it wasn't just that moment right after new hampshire where she said that there were other times where she expressed similar feelings. that she didn't have that feel. you know, i think she is somebody who knows a great deal about public policy. i think somebody who understands legislative tactics very well. but not that natural politician. not her husband that goes out, talks to an audience, tells a little what they want to hear to get them to trust him, at least in the moment. you know, not barack obama with the mass charisma or george w. bush with the mass charisma. this is somebody who didn't have a natural feel for it. she knew it at some level. >> let's take a -- let's fit in a break and continue our conversation. when we come back, finding the

words to say, it's all over, what to say publicly and privately in that moment. our interview with the authors will continue when "the 11th hour" continues. if you have moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis like me, and you're talking to your rheumatologist about a medication... ...this is humira. this is humira helping to relieve my pain... ...and protect my joints from further damage. humira has been clinically studied for over 18 years. humira works by targeting and helping to... ...block a specific soue...

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i know we have still not shattered that highest and hardest glass ceiling but someday someone will and hopefully sooner than we might think right now. and to all the little girls who are watching this, never doubt that you are valuable and powerful and deserving of every chance and opportunity in the world to pursue and achieve your own dreams. >> hillary clinton in her concession speech the morning of november 9. we are back with the authors of the new book "shattered."

what went into that speech. how do you do that as a politician who has just suffered this spectacular kaleidoscopic loss? >> it was really tough for her. there was a difference of opinion in the room. there were some aides who wanted her to go out in fighting mode and reiterate what she had been saying all along throughout the campaign that donald trump wasn't the right person and kind of go in attacking him. there were other whose wanted her to do what she did and be a little bit above a little gracious, a little more gracious. i think those people won out. there was this division there and it was interesting to see how it played out. >> she went out the next morning, they worked on this after she had conceded wee hours of the morning. and then very early next morning before she went out to give the concession speech she had

instructions for them. one of the things that she had done is she had drawn a circle with a cross, the sign for female in the margin. she wanted them to say that thing about little girls about knowing that they are valued. i think this is somebody who it was hard not to have sympathy for somebody who has been trying to achieve this goal for a long time and denied it in 2008 and 2016. >> some people say this is the most powerful speech she gave in the campaign and that it struck the right tone. it was just perfect. >> except for the timing. >> except for the timing. >> what do you do about the x factor in the book, the millions of people who will forever believe that russia had its finger on the scales of the election, that this was down to 80,000 votes in four battle ground states still being litigated in the streets of our country and washington, d.c.

how do you deal with that in what is instant history? >> i think you read the words. we are telling the story of people inside the campaign, people who knew her, people who worked on the campaign. we didn't talk to many outsiders. this is their story. this is something that they wanted out there. it's very easy to deflect and say this is all russia. i think as we said earlier it is part of that story and that narrative. i think her campaign was much more flawed as we detail in this book and all you have to do is basically read these words and these chapters and that will play out. >> i think it is important to remember a couple of things when you look at these questions. number one, with comey that letter at the en this is sll related to the e-mail issue. while jim comey did not have a prosecutable crime to go after i don't think very many people say her setting up a server outside

the state department system was the right call. this was something that was if you look at the stuff about russia, we are learning more about that now, but we knew a fair amount about it before the election. she talked about it in the debates. she talked about donald trump -- she called donald trump a russian puppet. 17 intelligence agencies told us all that russians were trying to influence the election. and the other thing that you never hear right now from democrats is any talk about the obamacare price stieks that consumers were made aware of. i think it is hard to disaggregate those things. a change could have tipped the balance. one question you have to ask is if one fifth of donald trump's voters thought he was unfit to be president weren't they available to her if she had run the right campaign? >> jonathan and amy are authors of a piece of deadline

journalism and instant history. both of those are fraught but the readers and orders of the book seem to think early on you have gotten it right. congratulations with this piece of work. thank you for coming on our broadcast. >> thank you. >> you will not mind if we take a look at some instant history. this is osoff at the podium in georgia. let's listen in. >> this is already a victory for the ages. [ cheers and applause ] that no matter what the outcome is tonight whether we take it all or whether we fight on we have defied the odds. we have shattered expectations.

we are changing the world. and your voices are going to ring out across this state and across this country. we will be ready to fight on and win in june if it is necessary. [ cheers and applause ] and there is no amount of dark money, superpack negative advertising that can overcome real grass roots energy like this. [ cheers and applause ] so bring it on. because we are courageous. we are humble. and we know how to fight.

this is not a story about me. this is a story about this community at this moment in history. this is a story about women in this community. [ cheers and applause ] those strong and determined women who have picked us all up, who are carrying us forward, who are going to carry us to victory tonight or in june. so for all of youho have been pounding the pavement, knocking on doors, making phone calls. and there are thousands of you -- and there will be thousands more.

thank you. this is the most inspiring team i have ever had the honor of being a part of. [ cheers and applause ] so for those of you who want to stick around, stick around. this is going to go on for a little bit longer. let's show what people power is all about. [ cheers and applause ] let's show what it means when we say that we have more in common than we have apart, that we reject fear and scapegoating and division. that we choose to love one another and to make things happen and to win. thank you so much, everybody.

thank you. >> so as you heard it's still going to be a long night in georgia. that was jon ossoff speaking to reporters quite candidly trying to take advantage of media time and attention here in the 11:00 p.m. hour on the east coast. casie hunt is there in the crowd. casey, while he was talking we updated the numbers here. i am showing him at 48.6%. so that was just kind of a status report from the podium, right? >> reporter: that's right. he said there was no outcome tonight in this election but claims this was already a victory for the ages they are trying to say that he did much better than was ever expeed. this district was held for decades by republicans. this is something of an expectation setting game going on between democrats and republicans. they had set the bar to a certain extent at that 50% mark because quite frankly that is

what would have given him the best chance at winning this seat at all. >> casie hunt, thank you very much. again, the breaking story, the rolling story tonight in georgia, that goes on. that does it for us for this hour. rachel maddow taking over. o. foreign affairs is out with the new issue titled present at the destruction trump in practice. it's illustrated with this pictogram of air force one jetting directly into, volcanic eruption? mushroom cloud? giant mountain? end of the world? you get the idea. that picture and idea set the