health care is on hold in the gop senate, one change they are not going to consider is guaranteed health insurance for everyone. what are americans missing? >> making the minimum wage more like a living wage. who gains? who doesn't? how exactly donald trump can be both for and against raising the federal minimum. ♪ ♪ this week i had a chance to challenge the president's very own economic advisor gary cone how the white house plans to grow the economy to spending on

trump care s. >> that spending part of the equation derailed especially when it comes to medicaid for america's poor, which is where we start today. >> all right. well, it was another tweet from the president that got all the attention this week. it's this tweet right here that illustrates how the white house is trying to sell trump care. look at this quote. democrats purposely miss stated medicaid under the new senate bill and the president posted a chart showing spending on medicaid indeed going up, well, mr. president and introduce you to a concept that economists use when they actually make forecasts. it's called the baseline. in this case, what the current law of the land obamacare would spend on medicaid over the next two years and thanks to the minor correction, spending under trump care compared to what is actually forecasted now under obamacare will be less.

which amounts to a big fat cut. >> right. and this is the problem because the biggest thing trump care is going to gut, if it becomes law is the expansion of medicaid to the poor. we have this big conversation all the time about obamacare being in a death spiral and collapsing. that's the insurance market, the individual insurance market with 11 million people in it. some of whom are happy with it and didn't have insurance and preexisting conditions but some people have a valid concern about that. middle class people whose pr premiums went up. medicaid has 70 million people on it. 11 million people on the exchanges, 70 million on medicaid. that's a big deal. >> and i had a chance to talk to gary cone about what this new bill would ever and he was pretty cut and dry with how great, how big it would be and how americans were really going to like it. >> america will be happy with what we give them. they will have a product they can buy. they will have a product that's

going to be cheaper. it going to be a product they get to taylor for their needs. >> so those are gary cone's words but if you actually look at the polls out this week, not talking about one. you have u"usa today", fox news opposing it 58%, 45, 54, 55. gary's comment is a little bit of a get what you get and don't get upset and you're going to like it and look at the numbers based on what the public knows and it's limited, they don't. >> the issue is if you want to argue as they did that this is a better program, it may take you awhile to come around to like it. that's one thing. for gary cone to say to like it and it might look different than the bill they got right now. we'll keep on talking about that but whatever health system our elected officials settle on, one idea that should be considered will almost certainly not be on the table and that is guaranteed insurance for all americans.

every single one regardless of income, age, is it impossible? for fact sake, the rest of the world doesn't seem to think so. >> we need to accept that obamacare is dead. we need to understand in the reality is that what the choice is putting in a system that is affordable and accessible or a single payer $32 trillion health care plan that the majority of house democrats support. >> when it comes to fixing health care in america, the choices need not be so stark. the single payer system is only one form of what is known more broadly as universal health coverage. that's a public health system in which every person is guaranteed insurance to pay for medical costs. but that doesn't necessarily mean socialized health care. 58 countries around the globe have universal health care systems and 34 of 35 developed countries in the world offer some form of universal coverage. all of them except for one.

the united states. here is how universal systems work. there is a mandate that every person must have insurance that covers basic health services. that pulls the financial risk of health coverage across the population, which brings down costs for all. on average, spending per person on medical care is 60% lower in developed countries with universal systems than it is in the united states. the insurances paid for through some combination of premiums and taxes. those payments help subsidize coverage for the people who can't afford it and that's very different from the current american health system where thousands of different parties, some private, some public and some individual chip in a bit while millions of people still go without insurance because it's too costly. calls for a universal system in the united states go back decades but all attempts so far have failed. still, new polling suggests that 60% of americans think the federal government should be responsible for guaranteeing health for all.

critics of universal health systems point to higher taxes and longer wait times for doctors because they often prioritize urgent cases. but the u.s. can have long waits, too. more often than not because insurance companies are trying to save money. health premiums continue to rise. no health system is perfect but gives coverage to all, still have its day. >> now, again, i say all the time, i grew up in canada where there is a single payer system. universal health care, 34 out of 35 developed countries, universal health care, not single payer but universal. why wouldn't this work in america? >> i'm not saying mathematically wouldn't work but culturally, many americans feel very tied to is this idea of choice. they don't like the idea of universal everyone gets one thing. americans like to have the right to say yes or no to anything. it's really engrained.

don't tread on me to say all things for everyone is the same, it's kind of one of the reasons you saw people over the last years say things like they felt like obama was leading towards having socialist tendencies. it's this idea. >> you got bernie sanders and elizabeth warren talking about a single payer system that has republicans saying see, if we don't pass a bill in the bill now, we go to the issue. health care itself while unusual expensive in america, health care is not broken. coverage, access to health care is broken. >> if you said to someone, don't you think everyone should be cared for, that person might say back to you yes but i want my freedom more than that. >> yeah, it's an interesting topic. >> it's complicated. let's get back to gary. the president's lead economic advisor, former president of goldman sachs. i sat down with this man. he left goldman sachs after 25 years and talked about cutting

taxing and getting rid of regulation regulations. two things that will spark economic growth this year, in fact, the very success of the policies that administration is putting forward are counting on it and remember what we said about baselines. not goals. baselines. well, when i challenged mr. cone on this, things got spirited. >> american business is over regulated. businesses are unable to expand -- >> that's not true. >> it is true. >> banks have been able to lend. you yourself the president of goldman sachs said we have a stronger balance sheet than ever. banks don't have a lending problem, middle market banks have a lending problem. >> stephanie, how do you get a strong balance sheet? you horde cash. you don't lend. the strongest balance sheet in the world -- >> you mean to tell me goldman sachs, jp aren't lending? they are lending. >> they are lending to the most credit worthy borrowers in the

world. you don't expand the economy by lending to the top borrowers. you expand the economy by lending to smaller medium-sized businesses that are actually hiring people to grow their businesses. >> or of course, collapse the economy by lending to non-credible borrowers and yes, on one hand you can say hoarding cash is holding us back. hoarding cash could also be known as banks did not have cash on the balance sheet. the probably right answer is somewhere in the middle. >> assumptions of economic growth and trump said the economy is going to grow by three, four, five, 6% economic growth. >> where is that going to happen? >> no. the economy is growing at about

2% and you asked gary about that and he thought three was not unreasonable. >> he did not think three was unreasonable. he said listen shs on, once you deregulate, it could happen, betting on that, come on now. >> let me show the viewers what estimates in 2017 are for the american economy. goldman sachs get to the high 2% and gold man and the world bank, all of them all say we're taking into account the fact that there might be tax reform, that there will be a pull back in regulation. nobody gets to that place. he was the president of goldman sachs and his own former employer doesn't share his optimism. >> the fact that these views are based on tax reform, if we don't get through health care, are we going to get to tax reform? >> no. >> if we don't, then what? >> the tax reform or a big tax cut come in large part from the savings that you make in the health care bill. so if you don't get the health

care bill, tax reform will be close. >> last point, a reason you saw the market boom is the promises of deregulation, the promises of tax cuts. the market can move on a dime. what you haven't seen is companies yet bringing cash back, opening up factories. that's not happening in the real economy? i want to wish you a happy energy week. it been energy week at the white house. >> sassy. >> a true energy revolution. he's late. the revolution began. we'll fact check coming back. raising the minimum wage, does it help people or hurt them? people debate the answer what isn't up for debate? making a living on minimum wage is virtually impossible for families, it is, that's next.

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hate to say it but we have to leave it the way it is. the minimum wage has to go up. people earn at least $10 but it has to go up. >> that was the same president taking entirely different positions on the minimum wage. unable to make up his mind about calls to raise the minimum wage in this country from $7.25 to somewhere around $10. like the president's economists they can't seem to agree whether raising the minunesota mum wage would help or help. >> it would help make ends meet and studies say just that but a new study is looking at seattle, they said it could be a job killer. >> raising the rate could affect jobs. >> yeah, maybe it will wipe jobs out, actually. the debate isn't settled, this is what everyone needs to know about raising the minimum wage and who it would really impact and how. >> america today has a federal

minimum wage of $7.25 an hour but states are allowed to make their own rules and 29 of them passed state minimum wages as high as $11 an hour. in 2016 voters in four states, arizona, colorado, maine and washington passed ballot measures that gradually raised their minimum wages to as high as $13.50 an hour by the year 2020. the federal minimum wage was first introduced in 1938 during the great depression and was set at 25 cents an hour. it has been raised many times since, but the last time was eight years ago during the last recession. and some working full-time at today's minimum wage can't break the federal poverty line of $24,600 a year for a family of four. >> i think the fact that the u.s. has been slow to raise minimum wages after a year of inflation suggest that we're lagging behind that we can raise it somewhat. >> supporters of raising the

minimum wage say the increase would narrow the pay gap that's wri widened between america's rich and poor. over four decades, wages have shot up 138% for the wealthiest americans compared to just 15% for those on the bottom of the income ladder. once more, some argued giving america's lower income workers a little extra pay could help boost economic growth. >> anything that redistributes lower income to lower income people is is stimulating and this is raised as both something that maybe the economy needs at certain times but something that offsets the employment affect of minimum wage and could stimulate the economy and make it easier for an employer to pay the higher minimum wage. >> opponents say businesses will be hard pressed if forced to pay higher minimum wages and melee o -- may lay off workers or cut

hours. >> if they think it's too expensive and can't afford to pi the wages, that will happen. >> listen, if they raise the minimum wage and small businesses end up cutting jobs, no money is worse than not enough money. >> so this -- >> it's a complicated situation. >> one can be sophisticated enough to hold both thoughts at the same time. people should earn a living wage and it's tough for small businesses to have to pay that higher wage but it's a circle. if you pay people higher wages as bob shiller said, they spend it. if you give rich people extra money, they save it or invest it. if you give low income people money, they have to spend it. >> they need it. >> that actually increases demand, which could increase jobs. so that's one way to look at it. the other way is a lot of people work two jobs because they can't make ends meet. you will lose some jobs but maybe some people will earn more money. i don't know i know the answer

to this one but people earn not enough money when earning minimum wage. >> you seen small business sentiment rise on the idea there will be deregulation. a lot of small business owners have said i'm strangled by regulation if some of that red tape, if some of those fines and fees went away, that could give them a little more flexibility, especially on the wage front. >> let's talk who these people are. there is a myth it's students and people in their first jobs. let me show you if you raised the minimum wage to $10 an hour, it would impact about 21 million people in america. >> 21 million people. >> they move into a space where they can possibly have enough money to live. it's just -- we have to think about this. in the last election, not the last presidential election but the midterms before that, pour states that otherwise voted republican, by the way, voted to increase their minimum wages. so people sort of understand this is a big issue. >> i want to add one more

element. good capitalism, thoughtful capitalism. we hear about this leadership more and more. take economics and put it aside. there is some level of moral obligation. not just shareholders and customers you're shareholders a customers you're delivering for. >> it's also your workers. in the richest country in the world, we have to figure out a way to deal with this. coming up, a bill that lets airlines advertise misleading fares is one step closer to becoming law. >> come on, now. >> honestly. the price advertised may not actually be the price you pay. >> the fees get you he ever time. plus ali has been joking, i'm not, i'm serious, it's energy week at the white house, with president trump promising new energy dominance. the thing is, we're already dominating! thanks in part to his predecessor. we've got that, next. ♪ hey, bud. you need some help? no, i'm good.

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this vast energy wealth does not belong to the government. it belongs to the people of the united states of america. [ applause ] yet for the past eight years, the federal government imposed a massive job killing barriers to american energy development. >> that of course was president trump speaking during energy week at the white house. and of course expanding america's vast emergency potential, it sounds great. here's the thing, though, ali. we're already coming out of one of the greatest expansions of energy creation in the united states. since president obama took office, we've seen a boom. >> i don't know that president obama actually intended this. i don't know that he wants to be known as the president under whom oil, particularly, oil production through fracking,

increased dramatically. but the fact is it did. it's been one of the most dramatic areas of job growth in the past few years. >> and it's that growth that from an environmental and economic perspective, in natural gas, has hurt the coal industry. it's not like another country for the coal industry. innovations in natural gas are environmentally sound. >> or sounder than coal. >> sounder. >> president obama lifted a 40-year moratorium on exporting certain american oil. that speech -- happy energy week, but it didn't work so well. >> this is an industry that the president continues to go back to. if you look forward, the growth industries are not coal. >> let's talk about airfares. >> this kills me. listen to this. >> have you ever seen an airfare too good to be true? it seems like a bait and switch. a $60 airfare could run you

hundreds of dollars when taxes and fees are included. but that's a thing of the past for most people. since 2012, a department of transportation mandate has forced airlines to include taxes and fees in the first advertised price you see when you're on the website. >> thank you. >> great. now there's new legislation making its way in the house that could overturn those rules, making it hard for us to compare the prices that we would actually pay for airfares. believe it or not, the good legislation from 2012 might be undone. >> then answer this. why? why would you want to change the legislation to mislead the american people? >> there's no good reason. maybe there's a lobbyist who is paid some money to members congress to change this. >> that's a good reason. >> because there's no good reason to remove the transparency that you have when looking for an airfares. the best thing that has happened to airfares is i know how much a plane is going to cost when i get on the internet. but that will change if your congress lets it. >> maybe. that does it for us.

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then smash it into a tree. your insurance company raises your rates... maybe you should've done more research on them. for drivers with accident forgiveness, liberty mutual won't raise your rates due to your first accident. liberty mutual insurance. hey there, everyone. i'm alex witt at msnbc headquarters in new york. there's new fallout over the senate republicans' plan to repeal and replace the affordable care act. four of the senator are targets of an ad campaign by a political action committee which has backed progressive candidates including senator elizabeth warren. here's one that will run right here on msnbc and other outlets in senator dean heller's home state of nevada starting today. >> when i hear that president trump and senate republicans are trying to cut her medicaid, i just want to cry. i can't afford micah's care