but this president likes to hear from a lot of different people. and he likes to talk to his family, which that's not going to change. >> something yesterday that i thought was a great idea, andy card was on one of the shows and he suggested that perhaps the staff secretary proof tweet for president trump. >> we'll keep this going. we'll debate reigning in presidential tweets. my thanks to my panel. that does it for this hour. i'm nicolle wallace. "mtp daily" starts right now with chuck todd. >> good luck to that person who wants to be the twitter editor. if it's tuesday, does the white house have a flake news problem? tonight, taking on trump. >> to be conservative, you can't embrace conspiracy theorys or to talk about alternative facts. >> is this just one senator's

searing indictment of the president and his party or a canary in the republican coal mine? plus -- >> i do want to be clear, the president was not involved in the drafting of the statement. >> the story out of the white house on that don junior russian meeting has changed, again. and controlling the chaos. >> somehow they've got to restore some sense of discipline. and frankly, the chief of staff has a responsibility to do that. >> i'll speak to the man who, among a lot of other things, is a former white house chief of staff brought in to right a ship. this is "mtp daily." and it starts right now. good evening, i'm chuck todd in new york. welcome to the ultimate test of

loyalty for conservatives. and the ultimate test of discipline for the president. just whose republican party is this right now? jeff flake of arizona is out there, publicly torching the trump presidency, as it falls deeper into crises of its own making like it did today, when sarah sanders acknowledged that president trump was involved in drafting that misleading statement about his son's campaign meeting with the russians, which ended up being in direct contrast to what his lawyer told me on "meet the press." senator flake is trying to shame his republican colleagues for what he says is an enabling of this president. >> i think to be conservative, can't be to embrace conspiracy theorys or to talk about alternative facts. there are truths that are self-evident. isolationism, that's not conservative. conservatives have always been more, you know, more steady in demeanor and in comportment.

that means something. chaos is not a good principle. the party has lost its way. we've given in to nativism and protectionism. >> in his new back, he goes further. he says his party is in denial that they created this mess, they're selling their souls for party victories that won't last and backing an erratic president whose base politics are the spasms of a dying party and time to do something about it. he demanded his party grow some backbone. here's the reaction from some of his senate colleagues, all of whom have been critical at this president at one time or another. >> he's essentially saying that all of you are in denial about president trump. >> well, look, everybody has different opinions about president trump. b >> are republicans afraid of plump? >> you know, we're here trying to do our duty. thanks.

>> i don't really have a response. >> i haven't had a chance to read jeff flake's book, but i'm going to do that. >> we've all expressed where we agree and disagree with the president. but it's our job to make sure we're representing the people of our states. >> no, i don't agree with that. i think the president is getting better all the time. >> we didn't create him. the american people chose him. jeff flake is a good buy, but he beat me and 16 other republicans and the former secretary of state. >> we're a long way from a mutiny, if you are looking for that. and if you have any doubt where paul ryan stood today, he tweeted the following. it is time for the wall. but senator flake's break from the party comes as he faces re-election in arizona. there's going to be a canary in the coal line. can flake's conservative survive in the face of trumpism, or can

trump and all of his chaos survive a conservatism? there's plenty of folks on the right fed up with both approaches, which is why we saw so many senators aggressively defend either approach. we're left with a toxic collision of a party that is losing faith in a leader they see as feckless and the leader losing faith in the party that he sees as disloyal. >> my father said it. he said it a couple of weeks ago in a tweet. he said, am i going to have to carry this whole weight on my shoulder? when are some of the people in my party going to protect me? >> we should honor his win. but he has an obligation to be president for all of us, and to stop the chaos. most of the chaos is generated by him, and no one else. >> looking ahead to the next night, republicans might be

negotiating against themselves again when they try to overhaul the tax code through reconciliation. although some in the white house sound like they're not sold on the republican only approach just yet, it is where things seem to be going for now. i'm joined by kristen welker from the white house and kacie hunt from capitol hill. kristen, we've been hearing a lot from the congressional side. i have to say, i this a lot of folks are surprised, myself included, that we have not heard the president respond to jeff flake today, which is somewhat unique and remarkable, given his try when it comes to criticism from within the party. >> i think that's right, chuck. and if you take a look at his tweets in total today, they've been pretty on message mostly about the economy. there was one tweet defending his views of twitter. but we were all expecting an early morning tweet storm against jeff flake. it didn't come.

likely the influence of the new chief of staff here, retired general john kelly who has been clear, trying to send a signal there is a new sheriff in town. that he's not going to tolerate discord and some of these tweets that are off message. but will we see this over the course of time? that remains to be seen. we've had sort of the pockets of the president being very restrained when it comes to his messaging. i think when it comes to the relationship on capitol hill and this next battle that you talk about, the challenges, not only do you have republicans, conservatives like jeff flake speaking out, obviously he's been critical of candidate trump all the way back to the campaign trail, but republicans just don't seem that afraid of him. that's why you have lisa murkowski saying i'm going to vote against you in the health care fight. how does he get republicans on board to get tax reform done? the reality may be that they're looking at tax cuts, because they don't have that big, broad

support and they didn't get health care reform passed. >> very quickly, i'm curious, was there any chatter, you know, off camera or any chatter that hey, this president plans to make jeff flake pay a political price in 2018? any of that chatter today? >> i think there's not that chatter today. there was more of a dismissing jeff flake today say thing is someone who has always been critical of the president. we're not going to worry about him. but more broadly, that's the direction the president could go in as we get closer to 2018, not just against jeff flake but others who have been critical from him. >> the lack of response from him, that is very mature way to respond. so kasie, you talked to any member you could find today, none of them willing to back up jeff flake. is he a man on an island, or a man on a public island, but if there were a private island, he

would have a lot of company? >> i think he has a lot of company on his private island, but nobody wants to be seen showing up by private plane on the island. i spoke to a number of republicans today. you saw there john cornyn responding hey, are you afraid of president trump? they all insist that they're not, but there is this pervasive fear of president trump. i think that's driving a lot of these dynamics. look at the actual on paper progress that this congress has made on behalf of president trump. they're ignoring his plea to take up health care again. mit and they're ignoring his frustration with jeff flake. we have a new statement tonight that unequivocally says the nrsc

supporting senator flake, as we do all of our incumbent members. so they're still standing by him. >> i know you just caught up with him. tell me about the quick interview you just had with jeff flake. >> so i talked to him about this. one thing i will say, chuck, to what kristen was saying about the white house not responding, this has been a long-time critic, senator flake has been a little taken aback by the level of focus on what he had to say. i think he's been a little bit -- he's not said -- used the same strong words that he used in the op-ed in the book on camera necessarily. but he did have one noteworthy statement. talking about populism and the president's impact on the country. take a look. >> populism is -- you can win elections with it. it's popular, it's populism. but it's not a governing philosophy. it's kind of a sugar high.

and if you continue in that vein, we'll lose elections. >> reporter: i think it's noteworthy that i didn't use the word populism in a question, he brought that up on his own by himself. look, i think flake also is confident that mcconnell will stand by him. he said hey, look, i have one tough re-elections in arizona before. >> thank you both. and kristen, give a special shutout to dennis gaffney. i think this is his last live shot on our show today. >> it is indeed, chuck. we just had some cupcakes, toasting him for an incredible legacy. >> he did plenty of my live shots and made me look less ugly than normal. >> makes us all look good, that's for sure. he's smiling from ear to ear right now. >> thank you both. let me bring in my panel.

welcome all. this feels like we are -- the canary in the coal mine with jeff flake. we criticize politicians all the time for not taking a risk. he's doing this, arizona. he's putting his political career on the line with his criticism. no one can say he's not doing that. >> i believe that. i believe he saw something in the tea leaves three or four months ago when he started writing the book, which that trump has hated him since the fall of 2015. they had a confrontation in a meeting and flake told him his behavior was appalling, and trump said i really hope you lose. and flake said i'm not up next year. and there are noises about some of them primarying him in arizona, and whether flake would find himself in the race of his

life and trump would be winking and nodding for people to vote for his opponent. he may think he has nothing to lose. but having said this, this was an extraordinary thing he did, and he is reflecting opinion inside the republican party about -- opinions expressed freely during 2016. trump has brought the same spirit from the campaign to the presidency, and as haste week's hijinks with anthony scaramucci indicate, that is a terrifying thing for anybody who wants the country to be managed effectively. not just scaramucci, but the failure to pass a health care bill, which is a sign of not only his weakness, the president's weakness. he can't scare murkowski, collins and mccain for voting

for the health care bill, he's not -- it's not that he's a lame duck. he's pretty lame for somebody only seven months into office. >> that's a bunch of other quotes here and in some ways he blames the voice. we've given into politics of anger. these are the spasms of a dying party. anger and resentment and blaming groups of our people might work in the short term, but it's a dangerous impulse in a pluralistic society. the state of arizona gave us joe arpaio. the republican party there has always been schizophrenic, it's given us john mccain and jeff flake, and then back in the day evan meekum. he really is putting himself and this issue front and center. >> we're one of the last states to recognize the king holiday. the reality is, you have to ask

yourself what was donald trump's crime in the minds of republican elites. jeff flake has voted 95.5% with donald trump. the predictive score is he would have voted with trump about 61% of the time. so this is not a difference in content or what they want to do. it is really to me about the gap between the text and the s subtext. if donald trump committed a crime among republican elites, he made the long-term subtext -- if you've been listening to right wing talkradio, the same anger and rage and anger at the changes in the country, the same sort of, you know, sometime vulgarity existed. it's just that elites in the republican party didn't accept that as the way to market the party to the world. donald trump recognized better

than they did that he could simply identify with the text of what people were saying on talkradio or listening to when they heard rush limbaugh, the anger and rage they felt all the time, the political correctness and the i can't say these things, trump said yes, you can, or i can say them for you. all trump did is take a lot of the anger already there. trump is just making it open and obvious, and the republican elites can't stand it. they want to get rid of medicaid. trump's instinct is to say that's mean. trump knows more about the republican base than jeff flake does. >> she brought up an interesting point. how does jeff flake square voting with him? what is that line -- it's clear jeff flake's problem is more in character than anything else. >> jeff flake is essentially

doing what donald trump is doing, except in reverse, which is making a statement about what he sees the values and the tone of the republican party should be. donald trump has a tone that he thinks should be the tone of the republican party. jeff flake, he reminded me of mitt romney. >> ever use the phrase compassionate conservative? >> when mitch mcconnell brings forward a bill, of course jeff flake is going to vote for that. donald trump has no policy ideology. he doesn't have any policies he wants to advance. he was brazen and bold saying i don't think people care about policy on the campaign trail. so yes, jeff flake is going to vote with the policies. >> jeff flake is a conventional republican conservative. donald trump is an unconventional, non-republican, non-conservative. >> and most of the base of the

republican party agreed with donald trump. >> and they also agree with jeff flake. they like trump, they have no trouble with flake's voting record or no problem with the way flake views things. >> how does this play out? >> it's about character and behavior. >> if that mattered, donald trump would not have been the nominee of the republican party. he ran against the tin dolls of the beltway media. he ran against marco rubio -- >> you said trump is nice on medicaid. >> no, no, i said he understands the base of your party better than the e heat lites do. >> it's not my party. >> the elites of the republican party thinks that the base agrees on eviscerating medicaid. donald trump understands the base of the party is fine with big government, as long as they're the beneficiaries. [ overlapping speakers ] donald trump gets them and the

elites of the republican party don't. >> this makes very clear that jeff flake does not agree with donald trump that donald trump is someone to be feared in 2018. >> all right. we'll pause the conversation. coming up, can john kelly bring some much-needed direction to the white house? i'll talk to someone who has been in kelly's shoes. former clinton chief of staff william panetta joins me just ahead. only had me by one grade. we bought our first home together in 2010. his family had used another insurance product but i was like well i've had usaa for a while, why don't we call and check the rates? it was an instant savings and i should've changed a long time ago. there's no point in looking elsewhere really. we're the tenneys and we're usaa members for life. usaa. get your insurance quote today.

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we are looking live on the senate floor, where the senate is working to confirm christopher wray as the fbi director. andrew mccabe has been serving

as the acting director in the interim. so now he'll be sworn in, presumably in the next 24 hours. this is the first time any fbi director is getting more than one no vote, there is three of them. the entire state of oregon is a no on wray. looking fabulous in my little black dress? that's cool. getting the body you want without surgery, needles, or downtime? that's coolsculpting. coolsculpting is the only fda-cleared non-invasive treatment that targets and freezes away stubborn fat cells. visit coolsculpting.com today and register for a chance to win a free treatment. this is a story about mail and packages. and it's also a story about people. people who rely on us every day to deliver their dreams they're handing us more than mail

they're handing us their business and while we make more e-commerce deliveries to homes than anyone else in the country, we never forget... that your business is our business the united states postal service. priority: you ♪ >> >> welcome back. the new white house chief of staff did not waste any time yesterday asserting himself in his new role. he's the latest in a long line in white house chiefs of staff, brought in by presidents to right the ship in tumultuous times. another president, bill clinton, made one of those moves bringing in leon panetta to serve as chief of staff to calm a jittery capitol hill and white house staff. presidents clinton and trump were in similar positions in the polls when they had to make

their chief of staff. i'm joined now by leon panetta. i don't know what to say. i need the chief title today, sir. >> it's which ever one you want to use, chuck. normally it's secretary panetta. >> you will love this lead. this was in "the new york times" the day you started. the announcement came at a time which mr. clinton is being strongly buffeted by political cross currents home and abroad. his stam his health reform effort is being picked apart in congress and he's increasingly being accused of indecisiveness in foreign affairs. so you do know what john kelly is going through. oven

obviously, there's some differences between perhaps the public discipline of donald trump and bill clinton. but let's focus on the similarities. explain what you think john kelly is going through right now that you remember. >> well, i think the big challenge is to walk into the white house and really be able to get your arms around the operations within the white house. it's really critical that he establish relationships first and foremost, obviously with the president. there has to be a relationship of trust between the president and the chief of staff. now, in addition to that, he's got to be able to establish a relationship with the staff that's there, and make them understand that he's going to be chief of staff, and that they're going to have to go through him. so i think the real challenge for john right now is to be able to put in place elements of

discipline, a strong chain of command, the ability to develop some kind of orderly process or policy. those are the big challenges that he faces from the get-go. >> now, you had to create a personal rapport with bill clinton that wasn't there in the beginning, because you were a washington and california guy, with an arkansas democrat. and you're brought in to fix things. on one hand, you have a honeymoon period. how much advice do you give to john kelly saying if you got tough decisions to make, make as many as you can in the first couple of weeks. how do you basically take advantage of your honeymoon period with your boss? >> well, it's very important that first and foremost that john kelly and the president understand each other in what needs to be done. and that the president is willing to delegate that

authority to his new chief of staff. that has to take place. bill clinton understood the problems that were in the white house. he was willing to delegate authority to me as chief of staff, to be able to reorganize the white house and develop the kind of chain of command. that was important there. so the most important ingredient is to have a president who is willing not only to give you the authority you need, but is willing to back you up and to trust you in that process. that's going to be fundamental to john kelly's ability to be able to get his job done. >> you don't have just a unique insight of the job. john kelly, i believe he was one of your chief military aides during part of your tenure at the pentagon. what is a skillset that he has that you wish you had going into being chief of staff? >> well, i do know john. he was my military aide when i was secretary of the department

of defense. he's a tough marine. he understands what discipline is all about. he understands what a strong chain of command is all about. he understands what an orderly process is all about. he understands that you have to stay focused on accomplishing the mission. those are all important ingredients that go to his experience as a marine. those are good qualities. i think the important thing he's going to have to pick up on is the politics of operating within the white house. the politics of understanding where the staff is, what the relationships are, and also the politics of dealing with capitol hill. because in the end, if this president is going to survive, it isn't just have just to change your chief of staff. you have to get some things done for the country and the chief of staff is going to be very important to whether or not that happens. >> before i let you go, there are two developments on the international front that i want to get you take on.

secretary tillerson made sort of the most remarks he's made yet about north korea and he said the following in a briefing to reporters. he said he wants a dialogue with north korea, he doesn't want regime change. he said we are not the enemy, but they are threatening us. we're not asking for reunification of the peninsula. he's trying to send a message they want to talk, negotiate. does et seem to be a contradiction of where we were headed before? frankly, i am confused to what is our policy when it comes to north korea and that leadership. >> well, that's the first thing that i think the administration has to focus on is one of the things that john kelly and general mcmaster are going to have to focus on is what is the strategy here? obviously, there has to be containment. obviously, we have to be tough in terms of our military presence. obviously, we have to be tough in terms of making clear that

the north koreans cannot develop an intercontinental ballistic missile that could threaten our country, and we have to take strong steps to deal with that. but at the same time, we have to reach out diplomatically to see whether there is an opportunity to engage in negotiations. but it's going to take both efforts. you need a strong military effort. you need a strong diplomatic effort. if there's going to be any hope of dealing with north korea. >> and there's been some reports, there was "washington post" report and no final decision, but the state department is thinking about editing the mission statement that would eliminate of promoting democracy, essentially promoting democratic values around the world. are you concerned about that? some could argue that american foreign policy has to be more realistic and pragmatic, so take that out of the mission. what say you? >> america's diplomacy in the

world has been based on our values and our principle value is our respect for our democracy, our freedoms, and our ability to be able to engage in self-government. those are the critical features of what makes us a strong country in the world, what makes us the world leader. if we eliminate reference to democracy, if we limit reference to the basic freedoms and liberties that are critical, not only for our country but the rest of the world, then i think it undermines our ability to exert world leadership. it makes us weaker. >> so you would advise secretary tillerson don't make any changes to this? >> don't mess with that. you don't need to mess with that. what you need to do is to get more diplomats in the state department to do the job that you have to do, which is to reach out to the world and engage in diplomatic relationships that can help our country provide security to the world.

>> secretary panetta, wish we had more time with you. but appreciate you coming on and sharing your views, sir. >> good to be with you, chuck. still ahead, why a power grab in venezuela could have a significant impact on our politics at home, coming up next. this is the new guy? hello, my name is watson. you know wine, huh? i know that you should check vineyard block 12. block 12? my analysis of satellite imagery shows it would benefit from decreased irrigation. i was wondering about that. easy boy. nice doggy. what do you think? not bad.

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what we would want to see is for venezuela to return to its constitution, return to its scheduled elections, and allow the people to have a voice in their government that they deserve. >> welcome back to "mtp daily." the trump administration says all policy options are on the table when it comes to dealing with president meduro of venezuela. it comes after a move by meduro to change the country's constitution and grant himself more power, right out of the strongman playbook, if you will. it was after weeks of violent protests. after two opposition leaders were arrested in overnight raids, u.s. treasury department put heavy sanctions on the president of venezuela, accusing

him of human rights abuses and calling him a dictator, disregarding the will of his people. join me now is the author of "the florida playbook" and has been covering the issue of venezuela interests in american politics. mr. caputo, good to see you. >> good to see you, chuck. >> let me start with the fact that the two senators from florida here, democrat and republican, are lock step on what to do about venezuela and what action they want to see taken. it reminds me of how lock step the two parties were when it came to cuba policy oh, i want to say circa 25 years ago. >> before marco rubio coined the term a few years ago, but venezuela is the new cuba, its government is not only reminisce

sent of cuba but heavily influenced by it. so you have the belief in florida that what meduro is doing and what chavez before him was doing is destabilizing the region. what we're starting to see in florida is more and more of an influx of expats coming here from venezuela. and the latest wave are the venezuelans. there's at least 117,000 who now live here. it grew that much between 2000 and 2012. it's probably about 36,000 venezuelan born voters on the florida voter rolls. >> and let's remember the way this works. this is -- basically this new exodus out of venezuela began with hugo chavez, and obviously it's been accelerated with meduro. but the venezuelans that have come over, they were the ones that had the means to do it,

that had the connections to do it. so almost by the definition, these new venezuelan residents and soon perhaps to be voters and citizens, they come in extraordinarily engaged in the political process as it is, which i assume makes them more persuasive to the marco rubios and bill wells. >> of the 35,000 venezuelan born voters in florida, their turnout rate in the last election was 80%. the rest of the state was 75%. but it's an up for grabs lector cat. of them 17,000, about half, are registered as independent voters. about 12,000 are register eed a democrat, 6,000 registered as republicans. they appear to lean a little more left than the right.

but it's not clear which way they broke right or left, and they seem to be up for grabs and both parties are trying to grab them. >> i have noticed in my visiting back home pockets of the influence of venezuelan exiles and venezuelan culture. but is it -- are you starting to see larger communities being built in south florida just from the same way we have a little havana, we're going to have a little caracas. >> you're not quite seeing that, but the city of dural where donald trump has his golf course, but it's fick named duraluela. you're seeing these bigger pockets grow in influence and numbers. you're going to see more and more of that as the meduro regime appears to crack down more and more. one of the lessons from cuba, if

you're going to do sanctions, don't expect them to change a dictator or a regime's behavior, do it because you think it's necessarily the right thing to do. but i don't have much faith, considering our cuban history, in venezuela or meduro changing his behavior to the degree we want it to change. >> and is history repeating itself, where the people that can make the change in venezuela are fleeing and then comes here. >> you know, mao said all political power comes from the barrel of a gun, and meduro is intent on exercising that political power right now. >> mark, a pleasure to have you on. still ahead, why so many statements by this administration require a sequel. . the at&t network is helping first responders connect with medical teams in near real time...

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...with pantene 3 minute miracle daily conditioner.s... a super concentrated pro-v formula makes hair stronger* in just 3 minutes. so it's smoother every day. because strong is beautiful. >> >> welcome back. tonight, i'm obsessed with this administration's apparent inability or refusal to tell the truth the first time they're asked. all presidents and all administrations shade and shape the truth to their own advantage. but what we're seeing now is of a different order of magnitude. and today's grudging acknowledgement that president trump did help draft his son's statement about his meeting with a group of russians after denying exactly that, it's just the latest example of this administration's taste for fake news. the following statements are simply from recent appearances

on the sunday version of "meet the press." >> can you tell me about the reports that the president was involved in the initial response that donald trump, jr. gave "the new york times"? >> so i read those reports as well. and the president was not -- did not draft the response. the response was -- came from donald trump, jr. >> i notice you ducked the aspect of whether you can guarantee that nobody will be worse off financially. >> i firmly believe that nobody will be worse off financially in the process that we're going through, understanding that they'll have choices that they can select the kind of coverage that they want for themselves and for their families. >> i have talked to general flynn. none of that came up, none of the subject matter of sanctions or the actions taken by the obama administration did not come up in the conversation. >> there was no challenge of american policy currently by mr. flynn with the russians? >> none. >> i answered the question of

why the president asked the white house press secretary to come out in front of the podium for the first time and utter a falsehood, why did he do that? it undermines the credibility of the entire white house press office. >> don't be so ofly dramatic about it, chuck. they're giving sean spicer -- he gave alternative facts to that. >> in these and other cases what the administration said ended up being wrong. not a shade of it, not a way to spin it, it was just flat out wrong. did the people say what they believed to be true at the time? did they mislead unintentionally? did they mislead intentionally? was it a lie? was it that kind of motivation? we don't know that, but at this point, they have accumulated a ton of instances where it appears they owe us that explanation in that front. it's a reminder why young journalists are taught the

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lid time. panel is back. phillip, let me start with you. this issue of boy, the white house just keeps getting caught not telling the truth. they seem to be okay with it in the moment. it's like everything is short term. get out of the moment, avoid a bad story in the moment and hope it just never pops up later. we go with this idea. did the president get involved in donald trump junior's statement. new york times said he had a hand in that statement. jay said to me as we just showed, no. no part of it at all. now sarah huckabee sanders is saying he took an interest in the way any father would. >> anything further the thing that struck me about what sanders said is she said his origin gnal statement is true wh is misleading. >> you want to define true. there was no, nothing in there

was fault. they just didn't tell us. >> here's the thing to keep this mind about donald trump, his experience in politics is you say whatever you want to say. late er you backtrack. >> you said it experience in politics. you are both new yorkers here. that's his experience dealing with tabloids. you could say whatever you need to do to get through page 6 today and worry about it later. >> it's up, your down. it is what it is. market change in real estate. trump used to dealing that way. i wonder what does don do all day. tlp is a white house counsel office that should be advising these guys to conduct themselves that doesn't put them in legal jeopardy. we lempbed this time and time again, in other words for the team to tell the truth, they have to be told the truth by the principle. we don't know what donald trump

is telling them. >> i think something happened that first week after his election when it was laid out by lawyers that he would not have to denude himself of the trump organization and there was this body of law that suggested that a president could not be indicted or sued or be the subject of criminal action while in office and he was like, get out of jail free card. >> he's like this is great. i can go four years without lawsuit. >> nixon was right. i'm free. i'm not kidding about this. you can see it when he said it three or four times this november or december. it's like this lightbulb over his head. problem is, nobody else has the free pass. his son doesn't have a free pass. his daughter doesn't have a free pass. all these people are lawyered up. they're going to be interviewed. >> hesitate realit's really jus

pence. it's the two heads of the executive branch. >> remember the fact he was told repeatlied for a year and a half you can't do this. you can't lie. you have to be honest and he won. he was validated, obviously, he spends a lot of time how he's validated by having won the election but this in particular he feels that way. >> this gets a the challenge we all get accused of bias but when somebody is this blatant in their contradiction it makes you question everything they say. >> i think beyond trump's legal jeopardy, the problem is it starts to call into question the mundane coming out of the administration. you're smoezed esupposed to tr

basic. it becomes to trust the difficult writ large. we're back at the nixon moment because minor things are lies. i don't know. i can't head our tailing of it. that's what he wants. >> all white houses do this. all white houses spin, through news story, try to change focus. say we're moving forward for a year when bill clinton became president. it's time to move forward from this story. the story just been out for an hour. that's a classic thing. >> we'll leave it there. thank you all. you can catch joy reid tonight. she's filling in for rachel maddow. after the break you wouldn't

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in case you missed it, bobby kennedy is running for the u.s. senate. not this bobby kennedy. his name is robert kennedy junior, no, he's not this robert kennedy junior either. it's this robert kennedy. robert kennedyactually.

he goes by the name bobby. he's not related to the massachusetts kennedys. he's a relatively unknown and if lightning strikes twice and he makes it through the primary, this robert kennedy would join john kennedy in the u.s. senate. not this former senator john kenne kennedy. this john kennedy, the republican senator from louisiana. again, no relation tofully of the kennedys that have been mentioned. that's all for tonight. the beat starts right now. i hope at some point we will put out a programming note to help people identify all the various kennedys. in it's a lot of kennedys and names matter in politics, as you well know. have a good night. >> take it easy. donald trump junior's russia meeting back in the news tonight for one reason. his father insisted on getting involved.