business with russia and i'm worried about that. >> let's going to have to be the last word. thanks to my panel. that does it for this hour. i'm nicole wallace. "mtp daily" starts right now. hi, chuck. >> hi, nicole. so the four o'clock breaker. >> you get a little bit of news sometimes. come on. >> good work ask approximate a good start to this. good evening. another whirl winld day in the city. lake breaking news on guess what, russia. wall street journal is reporting that special counsel rob mueller has impaneled his own grand jury in washington for the russian probe. not just using somebody else's grand jury but using his own. that's a significant deal. the paper calls the move a ramp up in the investigation and a sign of the investigation's growing intensity. that news is breaking on the same day republicans on the hill produced legislation to make it harder for the president to fire the special counsel bob mueller.

let's get right to the breaking news here. and we bring in our nbc news intelligence and national security reporter. so, ken, i want to clear one thing up right at the top. have we confirmed that special counsel bob mueller has impaneled his own grand jury, because this would be unusual, so let's get down to that fact first. >> we haven't confirmed that, chuck. and you're absolutely right. that is the most crucial question here. the wall street journal seems to be suggesting that he impaneled his own grand jury, a special grand jury that would hear only this trump russia case. that is not normal. typically prosecutors use whatever grand jury happens to be sitting in the federal district at that time to issue subpoenas and to take testimony from witnesses. now, in looking back, it seems that the watergate case had its own grand jury, at least a grand jury that was devoted substantially to watergate. it's not clear that other special counsel's in the past have had their own grand juries.

they just simply used whatever grand jury was available. and so if he is in fact kbamg his own special grand jury, that would seem to indicate a special significance to this, chuck. >> and there's two things, it's my understanding here. there would be two reasons why he might feel the need to do this. reason number one, volume in the amount of sums perhaps that he needs to issue. and number two would be because we're dealing with classified -- some deep classified stuff and maybe they need to impanel this grand jury in that sense so that they have some class -- so they can have access to this classified information. is that likely one of the two reasons? >> that seems likely. chuck, but in terms of volume, it's hard toe imagine -- i mean, there's so much we don't know about the pace and the scope of this mueller investigation, but it's hard to imagine that there would be enough volume in terms of subpoenas and witnesses to keep a grand jury busy full

time. but then again, you know, this case is so complex that it may be that mueller doesn't want to have a grand jury that's dieting a murder suspect in washington, d.c. in one hour and the next hour dealing with complicated matters in russia. >> i want stog through the nutsz and bolts of what he would be using a grand jury to do now. i think some people in the audience hear grand jury and then they assume am i going to hear indictment and charges. that's not always what p grand jury's are used for. explain. >> no. i mean, commonly it is. that's normally how they work, but a federal grand jury can consist of up to 23 members. they tend to serve for a term of up to 18 months. and they can sit for very lingty investigations. the most powerful tool that a grand jury affords a prosecutor is the ability to compel testimony, because a person does not have to go and sit for an interview with the fbi. you can decline to do that. but you have to answer a grand jury subpoena to appear. you can take the fifth amendment

and decline to testify on the grounds that your testimony may incriminate you, but if a prosecutor has granted you immunity so that you can't be prrd for your testimony, you are compelled to testify. and that is a great tool to get reluctant witnesses to provide testimony. and it's also a tool to issue subpoenas for documents and records, which we believe has already been happening in the mueller case because we have mueller has already been using grand jury's in va to obtain documents, chuck. >> and our assumption is he's been using a grand jury probably for months? >> yeah. that's our understanding. in the investigations of paul manafort and mike flynn, we have reported that grand jury subpoenas have been issued in those cases. >> all right. let me move over. stick around here a minute, ken. let me move over to kristen welker at the white house. the i know we got some early reaction from the president's legal team. kristen, what have you got? >> well, chuck,ist first of all, the approximated just left for west virginia and a number of reporters, including our own

monica alba shouted questions at him to try to get reaction from the president himself. not clear if he heard those questions, but no response from the president. in terms of what his legal counsel was saying, let's start with ty cobb who of course has been on the job for just a couple of days. he's a washington, d.c. attorney who is no stranger to these times of battle is. he says grand jury matters are typically secret. the white house favors anything that accelerates the conclusion of mr. mueller's work fairly. the white house is committed to fully cooperating with mr. mueller. this from jay sekulow who is another attorney for the president h. with respect to the kbalk of the grand jury, we have no reason to believe the president is under investigation. this seems to be the strategy, chuck, to really focus on that nugget, the fact that the president has said, james comey told him he was never under investigation. now, of course, that was a different time. that was when james comey was the fbi director. that's no longer the case. >> right. >> and a number of news outlets, including nbc news have reported that bob mueller is looking into

whether the president obstructed justice. no reaction on twitter from the president, but of course he heads out to the very friendly territory of west virginia, so he could perhaps say something about this this evening. but we've talked about for months the fact that this is the issue that hangs over this administration like no other, chuck. >> look, i say this. i don't know if jay sekulow has this informing. maybe he would know, maybe not, but his statement by acknowledging with respect to the kbaj of the grand jury, he says it as fact, it almost sounds as if the president's legal team is confirming the fact that this happened. >> well, and important to point out ty cobb has said that he has not been made aware of that. and that's why you have that part of the statement grand jury matters are typically secret. and again, they seem to really be focused on the president's past conversation with james comey. but the mere enact that we got these very swift responses, chuck, the fact that they're very coordinated would speak to your point, that this is something that they're aware of. >> well, i was just -- well,

they're -- they're coordinated, but they actually are in conflict here in that specific fact of whether the grand jury has been impaneled or not. >> yeah. >> any way, kristen welker, i'm going to let you go. i know you've got to run. thanks very much. >> thanks. >> we're seeing, this is the president pat andrews. so he just got there from coming from the white house on marine one. we will see him walk up. trust me, the press does not get close enough to shout questions at this point on andrews. in fact, the prosecute he is is probably already on the cabin. joined by someone who knows his way around a government investigation, tom davis, a long time republican congressman from virginia and he feels chairman of the house committee on government reform. essentially the watchdog committee of congress on all things having to do with congress. thank you for being here. we were going to have another topic here, but you're pretty good on this stuff. you're very familiar with these grand jury process says frankly because you represented the part of virginia that would sometimes be roped into this. what do you see here?

what should be of concern to the president? >> number one, it's really not unexpected. to some extent this is inevitable that you're going to impanel a grand jury whether he goes through virginia or gets his own. it tells you they're ramping it up and it's serious. these start to consume white houses. so, you know, it's going to be a few tough months. it doesn't mean anybody end up with indictment. >> what does this do at no time congressional investigations because i sit here and think, geez, if i've been a congressional investigation and yes, you have subpoena power, but man, mueller has power. mueller has got power to compel. mueller has got some things that congress doesn't have. >> congress has subpoena power, but perfectly a subpoena power, you've got to go to the floor, justice department to enforce it. mueller has powers. triple. >> what's the point of the congressional investigations at this point. >> they go after policy. they're looking at russia and

the interference of russia incorporate probe and what does this mean in the future. so they have a separate role, but it's not going to be the juicy kind of things that the media thrives on. >> when this happens, look, you were government reform. there was major investigation going on -- >> we investigated the clinton campaign. >> but let me ask you this. how much harder does it make it for congress to do what it wants to do if you have this special counsel over here? i mean, does it -- or can you really work in tandem? >> well, you can work in tandem, but you've got to get a rhythm and you don't want to step on the investigation. so whatever congress does, they're going to be checking with mueller saying are we getting in the way of your slefgs at this appointment, are we outing witnesses that you don't want to testify at this point or are you through with them? so there's a rhythm to this and they're going to have to find it. >> the reason we had you on today we were going to talk about this we're seeing a growing comfort level of republicans on capitol hill willing to push back at the president's powers, whether it's the sanctions bill or whether it's a bill to guarantee bob

mueller's investigation lives. >> right. >> if he gets fired, having it codified in congress. how do you see that? is this just republicans having some distance here or is this about re-establishing the legislative branch's authority. >> i think the russia thing is very much about tabby establishing the legislative's branch's authority in foreign affairs. part of it is putting some separation from the president who appears erratic to some and members wanting to put some distance. we don't know what the atmosphere is will be a year from now, but i will tell you in every republican's mind are they going to face a large headwind and if so how do i distance myself from that and that may mean distancing themselves from president trump. >> so being able tow things like i've been strong on making sure we have a thorough investigation but on policy i agree with him on x. that is that the type of thing that some republicans may -- >> in a swing district that's

golden. you've got to be able to walk both. you've got to be able to hold the trump supporters, but you can't let those swing or independent voters that have voted for you in the past leave you. and it's tough. now the other part of this is you have a lot of republicans who are still in solid republican districts where that trump base is dispositive in a primary and they can't get too far away from it. >> we've totally glossed over something that also happened today, a unique thing. you're a political junky, which is a sitting governor is switching parties. that's one of the reasons why the president is going to west virginia to celebrate the party switch of that -- of the governor, who was elected as a democrat becoming a republican. when you look at west virginia's politics that's not surprising. what is surprising that he would do this after going through the painful aspect of having to win as a democrat while trump was winning by 40 points. >> right. and he's got three years left of his term. now, he has a republican legislature he's got to deal with, but i think it tells you in washington as we pay attention to certain things, out

in the hirnt lands there's still a lot of support for the president. we have alignments, realign wants going in these parties, and i think the west virginia governor has picked up where the winds are going in west virginia. >> do you think we're in the middle of one? there's nobody i know living that could tell me what county voted which way going back to 1948. that's you, tom davis. you've seen plenty of reauto line wants, are we in the milled, beginning, end of one? >> we've been in an alignment. the republican party base has moved from the country club to the country. this has been going on. part of it is social issues, environmental issues and the oil patch and the coal patch. and we see the opposite taking place in places like my old county of fair fax. so we're in a realignment. we don't know where it ends up. i think if president trump lost it might have been an asterisk, but this has moved the align linement further. >> and if your -- do we start seeing the same week that we have jeff flake sort of not comfortable with the direction of the republican party, you

have governor of west virginia not comfortable with the direction of the democratic party, is that not itself the picture of realignment taking place, one is happening in this border state that's diverse fieg one is happening in a state that's oh moj news. >> ate lo lot of convictions out there and a lot of people caught saying where am i in five years as the parties move around. but we have certainly seen a realignment in rural states, arkansas and west virginia. higher income higher suburban counties that used tore the republican base they've been moving in the opposite direction and i don't see anything stopping that in the near future. >> all right. i got a little politics in here. tom difs a, i appreciate it. thanks for coming in and doing double duty for us. we've got a lot more on this. we're going to be following too wide's late breaking news. the special counsel robert mueller has reportedly impaneled his own grand jury to solely focus on the russia investigation. it would be a huge development if that's the case.

we'll have much more coming up on this in a minute. we'll be right back. i keep hearing about? sure, just sign up online. then we'll alert you if we find your social security number on any one of thousands of risky websites. wow. that's cool. how much is it? oh, it's free if you have a discover card. i like free! yeah, we just want you to be in the know. ooh. hey! sushi. ugh. i smell it! you're making me... yeah, being in the know is a good thing. know if your social security number is found on risky sites. free from discover.

welcome back. as i hinted earlier, president trump is on his way to a campaign rally in west virginia. every ever the show man the president dang he would a big announcement to come at that rally during a white house appearance this morning. >> we're going to west virginia tonight, by the way. we're going to have a very big announcement, which will be very exciting, i think, for the media and everyone else. >> well, thanks to our good friend jonathan martin at the new york times we think we know what that announcement will be. the west virginia governor will be changing his party affiliation from democratic to republican. hardly a traditional democrat justice won election in noe by 7 points while president trump carried the state by more than 40. this is not the first party affiliation switch for governor justice. in the past he's been registered as both a republican and an independent. the switch also furts republican control of governors mangsz

nationwide. now hold the governor ship in 34 states. the most states they've held since 1922. so much power and they don't know what to do with it. the last governor to change parties while in office, by the way, rhode island's lincoln achieve who went from independent to a democrat in 2013. you can republican president trump to bask in the cheers of the crowd tonight. we'll be right back. binders. done. super-cool notebooks. done. that's mom taking care of business. but who takes care of mom? office depot/office max. this week, filler paper just one cent with

five dollar minimum purchase. ♪taking care of business. people spend less time lying awake with aches and pains with advil pm than with tylenol pm. advil pm combines the number one pain reliever with the number one sleep aid. gentle, non-habit forming advil pm. for a healing night's sleep. any effort to go after mueller could be the beginning of the end of the trump presidency, unless mueller did something wrong. the president's not in the business of drawing red lines which it comes to the law. the law is above any presidential red line. this is not draining the swamp. what he's interjecting is turning democracy upside down. >> welcome back to "mtp daily." the president has been warned as we continue to follow tonight's breaking news on the russia

investigation. tonight's panel. knows her way around a special counsel. >> and a grand jury. >> we have people that are we will versed in that. lonnie, i think you're the one with a lot of green. impaneling your own grand jury is a big deal, right? >> yeah. >> is there any reason to downplay this development. >> no, no. it's significant. otherwise you would just use a grand jury that's around. so previously the mueller investigation was using a grand jury in alexandria virginia. now they're using one that's been impanel, parm reportedly impaneled for this. gives them the power to compel testimony as the reporter was saying earlier. it's a significant deal, particularly if they're exclusively devoted to this investigation. >> you were at a white house when i wasn't clear, ken starr always had his own grand jury or did he just use a grand jury back in the day. >> well, i went to it and it was

the same people on different days. ic tell you that. and i think eventually they had -- they did for a while to get subpoenas used whatever the d.c. sitting grand jury was, butible eventually there was one that was appointed to just manage this matter. >> just explain, what did this do to the white house -- what does this mean inside the white house? >> it's like the things you never want toll found dead, jury impanel. >> that's a pretty good way of putting it. found dead. >> grand jury impaneled. when i heard this my stomach did a flip just in memory of what it was like. and i had to go to the grand jury. and what you don't really realize until you have to do do this is the lawyer is not allowed in there with you. i had my lawyer with me during fbi interviews and he would defend me and protect me and tell me what i needed to answer and didn't. you're on your own you've just got to answer everything they ask you. and it's a very scary situation and because you don't have a lawyer in there you're very

worried about saying anything that could possibly, you know, not be fully telling the truth. and i think that people will find in the white house it's a much different dynamic and it just gets a little graifr, you're much more concerned about your own welfare in that situation. >> so you don't get to have your own lawyer in there. >> no. >> does that mean the prosecutor ask you questions or the grad jury -- >> no. the grand juries, they can ask questions. they asked me a question literally on an alien landing on the white house. there is no lawyer present. you can go out and talk to your lawyer, but you can't -- >> take a break. >> yeah, you can take a break. >> i want to confer. >> but you can't have your lawyer in there. and everybody is under oath, and you can be -- you know, you could get prosecuted for perjury. it's a very sobering thing. i think we sort of knew we were headed here, but to actually be here, it's a sobering day. >> david. >> i think there is a button that is on donald trump's desk

which is, you know, this legal investigation is closing in, every time he gets near it, he pushes it, and i think this is going to trigger some kind of a response, whether we'll be back in the terrain of firing special counsel mueller, we'll have to see, but i think he's going to feel cornered, angry. he'll push back. >> you know, it's interesting and i want you to pick up on this because before this news happened, one of the things i was going to highlight today is the discipline, at loes in week one, that i think john kelly has been able to instill in this white house. but one of the -- the but was going to be how will he hangds his first mueller induced news cycle. >> you know, one interesting thing reportedly last weekend, he called jeff sessions and said this talk about you being fired, you being forced out, i'm just here to tell you that your tenure is secure, backing away from what was seen as a

preliminary step toward firing mueller. so if that's the course that kelly is taking, he potentially is on a collision course with his president if the president gets angry. >> this to me is going to be the big test. >> it seems to me the best he can do. because this is out of his control largely what's happening. so he can only control what's in front of him, which is the execution of the strategy on a day-to-day basis -- >> that's been the mind-set for six months that he's not been able to do it. >> but john kelly hasn't been the chief of staff and i think he brings a different level of discipline to that team, experience to that team and a different relationship with the president. >> yeah. that will be tested. i think if john kelly hadn't been appointed we would be talking about support for the president being very weak and people starting to bristle what he was saying with sessions, not voting for the healthcare bill. is and kelly staifd that off so he's shored up some support, but it's very tenuous. >> this also comes at a time the

president may be right in his signing statement on the sanctions bill when you think about the office of the presidency. the politics of the russia investigation and the tools that you want to have for doing dim -- there's running in conflict here. >> so i do think there was more merit to the president's position on the signing statement in the way in which his freedom to operate as chief executive has been surk um described by this law that says the president can't take off sanctions without congressional review. i think he's right to say that's an unusual step. the problem is that he has so completely alienated his normal sources of support that people are taking positions on this that they would not have taken. i mean, george w bush repeatedly had signing statements making the same point, barak obama similarly. >> i had a democratic senator, very prominent say to me not too long ago i never thought i was

going to be a russian sanctions hawk. and it was uncomfortable with it but felt like almost tramd is not the right word, but boxed in. understanding that it's not the best policy, at the same time they had to do something. that was the mind-set. >> you should be careful about taking positions thousand in this sort of fever that they wouldn't take otherwise. >> they were worried that he would undo it otherwise, right. they had to do it. they had to do veto proof -- >> when you guys were in the white house you guys were fighting congress from putting restrictions on the iran sanctions when you were doing the iran deal for the same -- >> yes. that is the domain of the president and it was greatly infringed upon by this bill. >> arguably more has come to light about russia so to the extent that people are changing or evolving their positions it's because russia does stand out to american interests repeatedly. that it wasn't just a talking point from the 2012 campaign. but the point simply is i think

people are now realizing that russia is a serious challenge, and we do need to do something about it. and these sanctions, frankly, don't go far enough in my mind. and so there is still further to go, and this ended up being a consensus. >> you say it's not far enough. what more would you do? >> well, i think the economic element of it has to be much tougher. i think there has to be some real bite to those. i mean, talking about the sort of diplomatic element of this is something totally dichlt, i think, from something that really gets at the economic nature of this. >> do you buy this? i feel you're not fully -- >> i think the idea that you can sanction russia sbup fundamental submission is probably wrong. russians, as they have demonstrated through their history are pretty good at suffering. i think the point that secretary tillerson has been making in this debate seems right, that we're going to need to have serious discussions, negotiations with russia. they've begun on syria and it's time when the president needs

does seem some room to maneuver. i'm reminded of nixon during watergate. we had a foreign policy crisis. the president needed to be strong enough to maneuver in that, and this is a very damaged president right now. >> congress gave you guys more room to man you're to foreign policy than you thought you'd have in the late 90s, right, when it came to bill clinton he was better at compartmentalizing? >> i think that he was better at understanding what's in his control and not. and he was better at putting aside the investigation and how that was proceeding and understood the way that he was doing his job and the way that the american people support him is because they saw him doing his job. but we always, always maintained a relationship with the speaker even as they were prosecuting the impeachment case against him where there was an soap line to talk about -- there was a bombing of iraq going on during the impeachment vote and having that and sh was just able to do the job as they understood they had to do in both institutions.

>> all right. i want to pause the conversation here. boy, this turned out to be a great panel for this and we weren't even planning. first person account of a grand jury. that's something else. >> that was scary. >> you made that clear. stick around. we'll have more reaction from today's breaking news from capitol hill in just a minute. ♪ ditching the cover-up for good? that's cool. showing off my arms? that's cool. being comfortable without a shirt? that's cool. getting the body you want without surgery, needles, or downtime? that's coolsculpting. coolsculpting is the only fda-cleared non-invasive treatment that targets and freezes away stubborn fat cells. visit coolsculpting.com today and register for a chance to win a free treatment.

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it ends in why. the "washington post" today published what they say are transcripts they obtained from president trump's january calls with mexican president and australia prime minister. now, some of the major moments in these calls came out months ago, literally i think within a week of the calls happening. but now the full transcripts have somehow been leaked, and they have more interesting nuggets that also give us more insight into the tone the president used with these foreign leaders and how they reacted to the american president. for example, mexican president said this, my position has been and will continue to be very firm saying that mexico cannot pay for that wall. president trump responds, but you cannot say that to the press. the press is going to go with that and i cannot live with that. i cannot negotiate under those circumstance. president trump is also under fire for a comment he made about new hampshire when he was with the mexican president. while talking about drugs entering from mexico, he said i won new hampshire because new hampshire is a drug infested

den. now, if you remember, president trump's conversation with the australian prime minister centered on a deal president obama made to take a number of middle eastern refugees that were detained near australia. president trump said of the deal, this is going to kill me. i am the world's greatest person that does not want to let people into the country. frustrated with the trump bell call, president trump referenced how good his calls with other world leaders that day went, including vladimir putin. the president said, look, i spoke to putin, merkel, abe of japan, to france today, and this was my most unpleasant call. well, there you go. interestingly, there's been a lot of people who have left the white house in the last two weeks, and we have more leaks on what happened inside that white house. coincidence in up next on "mtp daily," another perspective on this evenings breaking news. a grand jury has been impaneled soley for the russia investigation. but first, hampton pearson, cnbc

market wrap. >> thanks, chuck. we had stocks finishing mostly lower on wall street as the russian investigation heats up. but the dow bucked the trending hitting ilts seventh straight record close. the dow gaining 9, the s&p losing 5. shares of apple lost one% a day after the tech giant pushlgd the dow over the 22,000 mark for the first time. shares of viacom surgerying nearly 4% after earnings beat expectations. the expect's stock is still down for the year. that's it from cnbc, first in business worldwide. your joints... or your digestion... so why wouldn't you take something for the most important part of you... your brain. with an ingredient originally found in jellyfish, prevagen is now the number one selling brain health supplement in drug stores nationwide. prevagen. the name to remember.

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the president is not thinking about firing bob mueller, so this is -- this speculation that's out there is justin correct. i mean, that was -- >> and would you advice him in a grand jury that that would be a bad idea. >> look, my job is to deal with the facts as we have them and the case as we have it. the decision that the president were to make on bob mueller is a

decision that i'm not involved in. >> welcome back. we're going to get some early reaction from capitol hill. joined now by senator jack read of rhode island. is an exoh fisho member of the senate intelligence committee and if you have been a watcher of that hearings you know what that means. it means he still gets to participate in those meetings. welcome, sir. >> thanks very much. >> let's start with the caveat that we have not yet confirmed that bob mueller has impaneled his own grand jury. what does that poishl development, though, mean to you, say to you? >> well, it says that the case is proceeding forward, and it also, if in fact there is a grand jury impaneled, means that bob mueller has more powerful investigative tools at his disposal. the grand jury can subpoena records, call witnesses. those knsz can invoke the fifth amountedment, but they are not represented by an attorney.

essentially it's the government prosecutors who are controlling the grand jury proceedings. so it's a very powerful investigative tool and it sooms in keeping with very thoughtful, very thorough, very deliberate way that bob mueller is proceeding in this investigation. >> what does this do to the tell committee's investigation? and i understand that, you know, we had tom davis on earlier and he said a congressional committee does an investigation to decide if there needs to be better policy, but is there a point where the intel investigation is just limited because mueller has got all the tools and he can do things more thoroughly? >> well, i think that's the reality, frankly. a congressional investigation, i must say both chairman burr and vice chairman warner have been doing a very good job on a bipartisan basis, but we do not have the means to compel people as the grand jury does. we don't have the detailed investigative staff and the resoshsz that bob mueller has.

so just for the nature of the resources and the law, he has a decidedly more effective and he fisht way to proand find the facts and that's what he's doing. >> there's been some movement on this idea of codifying bob mueller's ability to continue this investigation if for some reason the justice department decides they don't want him any more. how likely is that legislation going to pass? >> i think it expresses a strong sentiment on a bipartisan basis that bob mueller should be allowed to proin his investigation. that's the only way we're going to resolve this to the satisfaction of the american public. and i think that sentiment is very strongly held. getting legislation through is complicated in any case, and i don't think that will happen immediately. i think what it does, though, is send a very strong signal that on behalf of the american people, this investigation has to go forward, has to reach a

conclusion, and i'm confident i think many people are that pob mueller is the right person to do it. >> so is this more of a threat of legislation that's designed to, okay, white house, if you do this, literally we can put this on the floor and pass it so it's more of a, you know, the trigger lock is off, just fyi. >> well, it's both. it's both a serious attempt to provide a legislative framework so that the investigation can go forward, but it is inherently alternatives a signal on a bipartisan basis that are mr. mueller has the confidence of many, many people here on both sides of the aisle. and again, on behalf of the american people, we have to get answers, and we have to get answers that will be accepted. they won't be dismissed as partisan. they won't be dismissed as being just convene. they have to be conclusive, and i think bob mueller can do that. >> i want to talk about the idea of sanctions and who should have

control over them. the president when he signed the bipartisan bill that added more sanctions to russia, north korea and iran, he had a pretty tough signing statement that essentially frankly not something that barak obama also believed when he was president which is that congress doesn't have the ability to tie the hands the way this bill does of the president. where are you on this in the idea should the office of the presidency have its hands tied the way you tied donald trump's hands on russia? >> well, i think the first point that should be made, this was overwhelmingly supported by both the house and the senate. so this is not a faction of the congress trying to interfere with the president. but i think the president's attitude, particularly to russia, was such that he was losing, i think, the confidence of so many people that he would take effective steps to ensure

these sanctions were in place until they could achieve their objective. one is the recognition of their interference in our election and other elections. and also, their behavior towards the current and their on going behavior in the area of ukraine. in the russia case it was a very combatic is statement that we have to maintain these sanctions. and i think it would apply also to the other sanction provisions. >> no. i understand that this was a reaction more to the individual in the office of the presidency, but as you know, barak obama complained about congressional attempts to tie his hands on iran sanctions. where were you on that? >> every president feels that he has the authority to conduct american foreign policy without any significant interference by congress, and it is over our history a back and forth between congress' trying to assert what they think is their prerogative and presidents pushing back. what i think is instructive is

that in this case president trump signed the legislation. he could have refused to sign it. he could have vetoed it. he could try to test it in court. i presume, if he can find the standing to do that. but i think at the end of the day, he complained, but he recognized that this is something he had to do. >> all right. senator jack read, exoh fisho on the intel committee and of course the ranking member on armed services as well. senator read, thank you, sir. >> thank you. >> we'll be back. a lot more "mtp daily" right after this break. eye drop approved for both the signs and symptoms of dry eye. one drop in each eye, twice a day. common side effects include eye irritation, discomfort or blurred vision when applied to the eye, and unusual taste sensation. don't touch container tip to your eye or any surface. remove contacts before using xiidra and wait at least 15 minutes before reinserting. chat with your eye doctor about xiidra. whoo! testis this thing on?!

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welcome back. tonight i'm obsessed with the president's travel schedule. as we said tonight he's headed for a political rally in west virginia. in west virginia, that's the same west virginia he went to just last week. that's the same wrf that gave mr. trump 68% of the vote last year, second highest in the country. same west virginia that hasn't voted democratic since it went for bill chin. same west virginia where not even one county has gone democratic. trump won by more than 3,000 votes in wisconsin, michigan and pennsylvania. come on, so why the shuttle to west virginia? one reason that we mentioned earlier is to celebrate the fact that the democratic governor of the state is expected to anoungs that he's switching parties. remember, tht president's third trip to west virginia as president. so this is also about the roar of the crowd. west virginia loves the president, and the president

loves to feel loved. think of it as a vanity rally. and really what politician doesn't. but we are keeping track. when is he going to the mountain and pacific time zbloenls at some point in we'll be right back.

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that's mom taking care of business. but who takes care of mom? office depot/office max. this week, filler paper just one cent with five dollar minimum purchase. ♪taking care of business. welcome back to "mtp daily." it's been less than six months since mike flynn resigned as president trump's national security advisor. could we be seeing another major shake up within the president's national security team. president trump is considering firing the top military commander in afghanistan out of frustration that the u.s. isn't winning and now new york times claims that there are reports that he's considering moving current national security advisor, hr mcmaster into that role. remember, mcmaster is still an active member of the military. mcmaster has recently over seen a perjury of sorts, getting rid of some mike flynn loyalists and those who are more aligned with

the steve bannon wing of the republican party. but if the president decides to reassign mcmaster, who replaces him? time for "the lid." panel is back. so, david, i put this to afghanistan, second straight president sitting there going, to me it's like, do you blame president trump for saying more troops there? the last president eight years ago said the same thing. this is not something that's trumpian. this is something that's perp x perplexing. >> i think this is what the president should do. the military comes back in supporting their commander. he's been there two years but he's fighting the battle as he said it. the president ought to say, wait a minute. we've been doing this for 16 years. we're in stalemate after all that time and you're asking me for more troops. i don't get it. that's what he's done.

i think there is interest on the part of trump turning saying you've had ideas about making this a covert action. how do we do that? the general is a superb commander. >> it's literally eight years to the month, president obama maybe worded it differently but he had the same frustration. >> it was status quo, the option they wanted and certain nuclear war. those are the three options that you would get. it's all about whoever is in front of him. his universe is only as big as the people in his family or vicinity. he can't seem to think there's

other people that might be good at this. >> the pressure that a president can face from generals or the pentagon establishment can be quite intimidating. >> absolutely. >> he's surrounded by generals. >> not only that but it's clear that the president likes to listen to generals. he likes to be surrounded by generals. he likes to take advice from general. some of that push back had got to be more difficult. what was interesting about this national security team and the question has to be where is the juice coming from? if you look at those transcripts from the turnbull from australia. what was noteworthy the person that keeps coming up is jared kushner. it's not mike flynn. it's not general mattis. that is the figure that keeps oncomion coming back in all of those transcripts. >> we may be jumping too far

ahead. it's clear the president and general mcmaster don't have chemistry. that doesn't mean they don't agree but there's a chemistry issue here. you don't want to go through through security advisors in six months. >> the president may no have chemistry with mcmaster but he and jared kushner and his daughter have real chemistry with mcmaster's deputy.

i can see the team getting through this period despite whatever tension. >> what i find interesting is if you're john kelly, you probably think all right i'm not a political guy but as chief of staff i know my way around national security. if you're replacing a national security advisor, seems he wants somebody lower profile. >> could be. i think he's in a good position to restore order where order hasn't existed previously. the big wild card is the president. >> that's for sure. well, another one of those days. >> yes and it's august. only august 3. >> never, say it's only august. that's the worst phrase to say. thank you very much. quick note, quick apology to

senator jack reed. on our banner he was identified by a republican from rhode island. he's a democrat. typos happen. our apologies. wi wanted to make the correction. after the break president trump dumps on sports illustrated. what's up with that? we'll be right back. plap it's pretzels. word. ladies, you know when you switch, you get my bomb-diggity discounts automatically.

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sports illustrated is fake news or according to president, or according to the president today. sports illustrated linked the feature that came out on

president trump and the game of golf. the president trump is quoted as saying that white house is real dump. the president tweeted a response last night, quote, i love the white house. one of the most beautiful buildings, homes i've ever seen. fake news said i called it a dump. totally true. s.i. added to the list of fake news. in a podcast the remarks were not just from one person. they were overheard by many people at his new jersey gol ever course by many people. >> it's not a lie. the president said this in front of eight or nine members and staffers at bedminister. it was his first visit to the club after he had opinion residing in the white house. it was a moment of candor. >> in front of eight or nine staffers at his golf club. that will be a lot of potential collaborators there. then again, maybe if we ask the

president and he'll want to mulligan on his original comments. the beat with ari melber starts right now. good thing you got that law degree tonight. you're going to be using a lot more this hour than usual. >> chuck, i have a j.d. on me and i have a lot of j.d.s in the building. good to see you as always. >> all right. breaking news tonight, robert mueller has convened a grand jury in washington, d.c. to pursue his criminal investigation to the trump campaign's possible ties to russia and possible obstruction of justice. this is bad news for the white hous house. grand juries are secret proceedings used by prosecutors to build case. they do not always lead to indictments but they are good for prosecutors and dangerous for any subject of an investigation. there news tonight what chuck was just