tv MSNBC Live MSNBC August 13, 2017 2:00pm-3:00pm PDT
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welcome, everybody. you're watching msnbc. we're following some breaking news out of seattle, washington, where another alt-right movement is happening there as we're dealing with the fallout from charlottesville, virginia and we're watching this alt-right rally in seattle, washington. marchers calling themselves the freedom rally. the seattle times quoting them as when they come they bring violence, racism, sexism, homophobia, transphobia and
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islamophobia as well as other things to the town with bigotry. it was set to start at 2:00 p.m. at westlake park in seattle and we're dealing with charlottesville, virginia and we're watching some activity picking up on the ground there and we're hoping to get a live report from the ground as things do start to unfold there and we'll bring it to you, a live report from seattle, washington, as soon as we get it. welcome, everybody. i'm yasmin vossoughian and let's start with the latest with charlottesville, virginia, a city recovering from clashes. streets reopened and barricades removed, but the consequences still raw. officials have now identified 32-year-old heather heyer as the woman killed after a car plowed into counterprotesters. a vigil will be held in about an hour. her mother is speaking out about heather's passion for equal rights. take a listen. >> it was important to her to speak up for people that she felt were not being heard, to
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speak up when injustices were happening and she saw in the lives of many of her african-american friends particularly and her gay friends that equal rights were not being given and equal voices were not being shared. >> and police have identified the suspect. 20-year-old james alex fields jr. from ohio. he's been charged with second-degree murder. his first court appearance will be tomorrow. the department of justice ordering a civil rights investigation. overall saturday, 35 people were injured, three arrested for earlier skirmishes. residents there, still, of course, in shock. >> having these hatemongers come to my city just -- it broke my heart. it really did, and to see what happened to that young woman and the young man who took her life 20 years old, his life is shot
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now for what? just -- for what? >> and that anger is spilling over into a press conference today held by the white nationals rally organizer jason kessler. the crowd chanting "shame" and "murderer." [ crowd chanting "shame" ] >> then he was chased away by counterprotesters and a security scrambled to maintain order and a very heated and emotional day. >> maya rodriguez joining me live from virginia. what more information do you have about what took place at that presser? just incredible to watch that footage. >> right, and this all started just about around 2:00 this arch. that's when jason kessler had set up this news conference by city hall just a short drive down from where we are right now. when he got there and stepped up to the podium there was a huge crowd assembled before him and
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it was not a friendly crowd. he tried to speak. he tried to say his peace. he talked about the fact he was disappointmented about how law enforcement and city officials had handled the run-up to the rally and that was about all he got in. he was drowned out by the crowd. some people started shoving him, pushing him and he tried to get away and they started chasing him and he started running away. at some point someone tried to tackle him and he landed in the bushes. police started escorting him out of the way. you heard what people were chanting and chanting all kinds of things at him and among them was "go home" and "murderer." a lot of angry people out there. i am being told that many of the people were residents from charlottesville. i've had people saying i was out there with my family and my neighbors. there were also some counterprotesters out there, as well and charlottesville remains a city that is deeply, deeply hurt by the events that have happened over this weekend.
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>> so incredibly emotional in that city today and quite frankly, around the country and hopefully around the world as they see what's going on in charlottesville, virginia. give us the latest on the suspect and what they're finding out in the investigation and looking into the suspect. are they finding anything out on social media or his plans as to what took place yesterday? >> reporter: right. well, james alex fields, he's 20 years old and facing several charges including second-degree murder. a senior law enforcement official has told nbc news that right now it's not clear whether he came here with the intent to do that kind of harm or if this was something that sort of built up over the day as far as his level of anger over what was happening out here with all of the violent outbreaks that were happening. this, in fact, is where some of those protesters and counterprotesters clashed in the street, but at this point, law enforcement officials are telling nbc they're not clear yet on what motivated him to drive into the crowd which is what they are alleging happened
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in this particular case. >> we'll certainly watching be watching as things unfold there. an incredibly emotional time. maya rodriguez, thank you for joining us. appreciate it. >> want to turn back to seattle where another alt-right rally is planned. the organizer has asked followers not fight back should counterprotesters show up. nbc's steve patterson is there. what are you seeing on the ground there? >> reporter: yasmin, we are in the middle between two protests. right now we're in the middle of the counterprotesters and these are anti-fascist, anti-neo-nazi and antialt-right protesters who are marching down toward a park toward where the pro-trump protesters, pro-trump rights protesters have gathered. you can hear the crowd and there's a lot of anger and a lot of support for black lives matter as they continue to march to their destination.
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that destination may be something of a clash. we've seen a sizeable amount of seattle police on the streets in full riot gear. they have been ready for this event for some time. these two events were scheduled well before the events that occurred yesterday in virginia. so these are not reactionary to what happened. neither the pro-trump, pro-neo-nazi event and this event that counterprotests. this counterprotest is in reaction to the protest group, patriots' prayer who have been in this city, in cities in the west, in vancouver, in portland and here in seattle and everywhere they go they seem to cause problems. there seem to be clashes with counterprotesters. so police will be watching for that today as we continue to march towards this inevitable conflict. yasmin? >> we're all hoping that nothing takes place there like what we saw in charlottesville, virginia, just yesterday. >> steve patterson, we'll stay on top of this and i'm sure
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we'll be coming back to you later in the show. i want to turn back to the situation in charlottesville, virginia. this whole tragedy started because white nationalists took the streets in from test and the scheduled removal of the statue of general robert e. lee and the petition came from a young african-american high school student more than a year ago. our next guest was instrumental in taking up their cause. charlottesville vice mayor wes bellamy joining me now. it's good to see you. i know your city is reeling from what's taken place there in the last couple of days and i thank you for taking the time out to talk to us. why did you take up this cause and after yesterday, how do you feel about making that decision to remove that statue of robert e. lee? >> i need to correct you on one thing. for one, thank you for having me and before i begin, i must express my sincere condolences to the families of those who have lost their loved ones. we have seen individuals commit, in my opinion, acts of terror,
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domestic terrorism and now we have families who will not be able to hug their loved ones because of this. in terms to answer your question, i want to be clear. this is not about a statue. this is not about the removal of the statue. this is about white supremacy. what these individuals are doing is that they are using the statue as a way to mask their hate. this is only what they're saying is the cause of it all and we've seen this dark vitriol and we've seen individuals express their hate and i was listening before i came on, as you see in seattle, washington, there is no statue removal going on right now, yet these neo-nazis and alt-right individuals are still choosing to express their hate. these white supremacists feel as though their ideology and their white, pure race is better than anyone else and they want to try and intimidate us, but i can let you know, again, this is not about a statue, but charlottesville will not be intimidated. we will not cower. we will not be afraid and we will continue to stand tall, stand together and we will move
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forward. in account fa, we are already moving forward. this situation has made us even stronger and i'm looking forward to us continuing that work. >> were you surprised to see what happened yesterday? >> well, yes, i was disappointed and one thing i've also learned in this line of business you cannot be surprised by anything. you have to learn to expect the unexpected and unfortunately, again, my heart goes out to everyone who lost -- excuse me, the individuals who lost their lives and all of the individuals who are living with this tragedy, but i was encouraged by the fact that the charlottesville that i know, literally, less than a mile away from the melee and the rally that was going on here, i witnessed a group of young men that gave away 150 to 200 book bags to the dream in diamonds and that represents charlottesville. even in the midst of adversity we still rise together and take care of our own and we will continue to do just that. we will be a stronger community. we will grow together and the
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question is very simple. if we can't come together and rally around each other and lock arms after a situation like this when white supremacists come in and the ku klux clowns come in, we will need to do it. >> jeff sessions talked about the federal investigation that will look to have a civil rights investigation into what happened in charlottesville, virginia. what do you think will happen there? what do you want to see happen and do you think when something like that takes place, a civil rights investigation, is that enough? do they take it far enough? >> no. quite frankly, i'll be very honest with you, no. what needs to happen is a series of things. first and foremost, he needs to condemn these racist white supremists. when you have the leader of tkux klan david duke here to fulfill the promise of their president
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trump that they were going to take their country back, he needs to address these individuals and let the white supremacists know and i'm not talking about them in a roundabout way or the nonsense he gave us yesterday. directly address the white supremists. that's first. secondly, attorney general sessions, i am hoping that not only with the investigation that i'm hoping will be thorough that justice is served. i'll be very clear here. marginalized communities of color, african-americans, we've seen investigations be open time and time again and justice still not be served. if you have it right on tape and you see this individual, in my opinion, committing an act of terror, taking a car, driving it down a road into a group of protesters -- excuse me, counterprotesters and backing up and running them over again, that graphic scene, if that does not give you what you need i don't know what else will, but hey, we've seen things happen on camera before and often more times than not and not go the way it should.
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>> i thank you for joining us on this incredibly emotional weekend and i think a lot of people are scratching their heads and you can't believe it's 2017 and something like this is still happening and we'll talk about the president's response. charlottesville vice mayor wes bellamy. >> dr. bellamy. >> excuse me. thank you so much for joining me. thank you. >> president trump tacking heat from all sides, and charlottesville violence, and many sides on saturday, and it's also the words he did not use. he didn't call out white supremacists directly and he didn't call the car plowing into protesters terrorism. the response has been swift "the weekly standard" asking today why won't trump denounce white supremacists. "the dallas morning news," on saturday president trump failed his country. the white house trying to clean things up. a spokesman said the president said very strongly in his statement yesterday that he condemns all form of violence, bigotry and hatred and that
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includes kkk, neo-nazi and all extremist groups. he called for national unity and bring all americans together, but of course, the president did not call out white supremacy himself either saturday or so far today. michael singer took him to task for it. take a listen. >> look at the campaign he ran. look at the intentional courting both on the one hand of all these white supremacists, and antisemitic groups and look on the other hand the repeated failure to step up, condemn, denounce, silence put to bed all those different efforts just like we saw yesterday and we just are aren't seeing leadership from the white house. >> and the president's vague statement also coming under fire from his own party. >> when people have driven trucks through crowds in europe he's called it radical islamic terrorism. he should use this opportunity today to say this is terrorism, this is domestic terrorism. this is white nationalism and it has to stop. >> he missed an opportunity to
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be very explicit here. these groups seem to believe they have a friend in donald trump and the white house. i don't know why they believe that, but they don't see me as a friend in the senate, and i would urge the president to dissuade these groups that he's their friend. >> but homeland security tom bosser doubled down on the argument that there's more than one side to blame. >> the president not only condemned the violence and stood up at a time and a moment when calm was necessary, and didn't dignify the names of these groups of people. what they fouvend when they showed up were groups from outside that showed up on both sides looking for trouble, dressed in riot gear, prepared for violence. >> joining me now msnbc political analyst howard feinman and editorial director at the huffington post, and joe watkins, republican strategist and former bush 41 aide and fordham university's christina grier author of "black ethnics," race, immigration and the pursuit of the american dream.
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thank you all for joining me. joe, i want to start with you. former communications director anthony scaramucci, the mooch, in his first interview since his firing was also critical of trump's response. a guy that could not keep his mouth shut for the 11 days in which he was employed as communications director. he said the president did not go far enough. comment on that. give me your reaction to that. >> he was right. the president didn't go far enough. the president is somebody who is has demonstrated time and again that he's not at all bashful about calling people out, about calling it like he sees it, about saying that he's displeased or that things won't happen under his watch in the strongest possible terms. this was a time for him to do that. this was a time for him to call out the racists and a time to call out the white nationalists and call out the people that committed the grievous acts of terror against other americans yesterday in charlottesville, virginia, and he said it in the strongest terms possible and so he missed an opportunity to
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stand up as the president of the united states and to condemn this kind of racism and domestic terrorism in the strongest terms that he could have. >> joe is not the only person saying that the president missed an opportunity, christina. he asked african-americans many times on the campaign trail, what do you have to lose? vote for me. >> clearly a lot. let's stop saying alt-right. these are white supremacist groups and the normalization of donald trump and his white supremacist ilk is part of the problem because we're not using the language we need to use. these are people who are either members of the kkk or other groups and we can't keep calling them fringe groups. they're groups of american citizens of lower class, middle class and upper class white american citizens who have a certain vision of who should and shouldn't belong in this country. when it comes to donald trump, most african-americans know he's not for us or anyone else who is a marginalized group. he has steve bannon right next door, he has steve miller and
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gorka. he put forward jeff sessions who has a 40-year history. >> he's coming out with a stronger response from the president. this is also a president who constantly talks about his good genes. these are code words that he's also sending to many of his supporters, as well. so to say at the beginning of last week when we were possibly engaging in north korea and he's shooting from the hip and he's so bold and audacious and interacting with venezuela and now all of a sudden he's clutching his pearls when it comes to time to say white supremacy. when you have david duke saying i'm fulfilling the promise so don't back away because we put you where you are and any republican who did not denounce donald trump is with donald trump. >> ivanka trump had no problem calling out white supremacy tweeting out today there is no place for white supremacy and neo-nazi. why can't the president call it like it is.
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what's going on here? >> he's been reductant for years to do that kind of thing. remember, during the campaign it took weeks and months for him under pressure to finally in a half-hearted way publicly distance himself from david duke. at first, he said he didn't know who he was and then when he was backed into a corner and under extreme pressure in the campaign finally said something. this is a similar situation here. the way the cold-eyed, calculous of the trump world is, he doesn't dare denounce these people because symbolically and emotionally and in a way, thrillingly almost for his voters, they are a distillation of many of the views that they hold and there's something about his base and his politics that prevents him from wanting to put distance between himself and the hardest core of what i call the
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white right movement. not only do you have republican senators denounce his failure to speak up at this point including you showed a clip of cory gardner. he's the head of the republican senatorial campaign committee. so he's looking at the 2018 senate races. he denounced him and if you check breitbart, for example, they're not full throated into the defense of the president right now. fox news is a little equivocal on the topic. paul ryan and mitch mcconnell, the leaders of the house and the senate are issuing bland statements. they haven't had the guts, frankly, to come forward and be specific, but they're going to be under pressure to do it. this is a big political mistake by donald trump and you're going to see increasing pressure and you may even see the departure of steve bannon, i think, who was not defended today. steve bannon being kind of the embodiment of this political strategy inside the white house.
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h.r. mcmaster, the head of the national security council had nothing good to say about him today, and anthony scaramucci, the mooch had nothing good to say about him today. so i think one casual tee from this may, i think, be steve bannon in the days ahead. let's see. >> i don't know. we've been talking about the removal of steve bannon for quite some time and he seems to be sticking around. >> kelly, i want you to weigh in here. at one point you're seeing is the republican senators and congressmen, people from trump's side weighing in he didn't go far enough and at what point will the republicans hold the president to task? >> that's one of the most striking things to me. you have people like corey gardner, marco rubio and orrin hatch and many others who are actually saying, listen, mr. president you need to call this out for what it is and be specific. i have to say this is the -- yet again, donald trump steams toee bringing people together.
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a diverse people, with diverse viewpoints. >> that's not new. >> and we're all -- we all agree that the president has made a huge mistake here and as people said, this is because of stuff that he did on the campaign trail. david duke is a nobody. when was the last time he held elected office? but the reason he is getting so much press is because donald trump had such trouble distancing himself from david duke during the election and so, of course, people are now going to be giving david duke a platform because it's not clear that the president really disavows him and that's really outrageous and it's amazing to me that it's so hard for donald trump to do this and he campaigned someone who was a straight shooter and telling it like it is and that's exactly why a lot of people voted for him and we saw it in exit polls and he seems like the kind of guy who will tell the truth and tell it like it is. it seems like he can only do that when it's convenient to him and in this case, it's really outrageous that he can't call a
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spade a spade and just be honest about what happened in charlottesville. >> i think the difficult thing here is considering the fact that of j sessions saying we'll have a federal civil rights investigation looking into all of this. what exactly will happen coming out of all of that? we continue to have these conversations over and over again and when will we put pen to paper. they're all going to be back with me so make sure you stick around and thank you for joining me for now. up next, the rising number of hate crimes in this country, and what can be done to prevent them and can the justice department target the leaders of these white nationalist groups? that's ahead, everybody. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪
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can celebrate a life like no other. find out how at sanfranciscodignity.com. waelcome back, everybody. we want to take you back to seattle where we're keeping a close eye on the alt-right rally and counter demonstration going on right you in. steve patterson is in seattle for us following the protesters in the march there.
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steve, give us an update. >> reporter: yas men, we're at the tip of the spear of counterprotesters who are marching through downtown seattle. you can see them marching on -- [ indiscernible ] >> you can see them lined up over here and it's possible for the counterprotesters to get to the pro-supporters. we've also heard about at least one arrest so far. >> steve, we're having a hard time hearing you so we are going to check back in with you when we have better audio, but we appreciate you following that for us. turning now to the horrific, vents in charlottesville, virginia, they're drawing national attention to the white extremist movement and the rise in hate crimes since the november election. a number of reports have shown an increase in hate crimes and in groups that support white
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nationalists and anti-immigrant and anti-muslim rhetoric in particular. at the same time the department of homeland security in july rescinded a number of grants the obama administration had promised to groups working to fight neo-nazis and far-right extremism. the day after charlottesville, many are looking to the trump white house with serious questions about how the administration will handle the resurgence of hate in this country. joining me now is a panel of experts and domestic extremism and lisa brook, former special agent in charge of the birmingham office, christina grier who is back with us, former birmingham prosecutor joyce vance and republican strategist joe watkins back with us, as well. lisa, i'm going to start with you. the southern poverty law center reporting a spike in biased crimes just after the election last fall and has since mapped out a list of over 900 active hate krgroups across the nation. what kind of hate and bias in particular are you seeing?
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>> well, if we look immediately post-election, we saw things reflective of the rhetoric that mr. trump shared during his campaign. it was racist, of course. it was xenophobic and anti-muslim and we weren't surprised that the majority of those crimes were directed at immigrants or those perceived to be immigrants and we know that the incidents of islamophobia or anti-muslim hate and bias incidents have tripled in the last year. so we've seen that go down a bit, but as far as college campuses go, we see a resurgence in white nationalists doing direct recruiting on college campuses. >> rick, with this in mind, you've served as a member of the fbi counter terrorism division. is there enough resources being diverted to hate crimes in this country? that's always a challenge, trying to match resources against threat and effectively
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manage risk. so hate crimes in this country ebb and flow. we saw the number of these groups after president obama was elected increase and then during the course of his two terms decrease and then immediately as the southern -- my colleague from the southern poverty law center pointed out, after president trump's election there is now an uptick in the white supremacist and white nationalist groups. so the challenge for the fbi and law enforcement is going to be to try to match up resources to counter that potential threat to our society. there are about 250,000 hate crimes reported every year and it's estimated that only 50% of the hate crimes that actually occur are reported, giving another layer of challenges to investigate these crimes and put these groups out of business. >> so, rick, you're saying that's the challenge, but are they actually doing it? >> yeah. i think you'll see -- well, i think you'll see particularly in
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light of events yesterday in charlottesville, a renewed effort to match resources against this threat. i know -- i've read and understand that as early as april of this past year the department of justice set up a sub committee to look at this increase in hate crimes and hate groups. so i think the government can oftentimes move very slowly, but i think you will see a response by the federal government. >> there's that word look again, and not do, rid? >> right. >> joyce vance, in alabama, your office prosecuting a hate crime for what a man tried to hire what he thought was a kkk hitman to murder his african-american neighbor. how active is the kkk in the south at this point, and also tell us about any sort of newer white supremacist groups that are active in this country because there are people that don't necessarily know the activity of these groups. >> fortunately, thanks to the groups that groups likalisha's
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employer, the kkk is bank runned for the most part in the deep south, but rick and i, when he was the fbi s.a.i. in birmingham and i was u.s. attorney had the opportunity to work together on a number of cases that i would call domestic terrorism or white supremacy linked groups. we see groups like the sovereign citizens rise up in areas across the country including alabama and seattle where protests are going on today, but also many of these groups that have infiltrated police and in alabama, the department had to let go of two officers who had links to white supremacist groups and this is as rick says, it ebbs and flows and it's a constant theme, not just in alabama, but across the country. we saw it last year out west with the bundy ranch prosecutions. i think it will be a continued feature of the landscape and the justice department needs to put
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resources into domestic terrorism as well as into international terrorism. >> christina, you tweeted about what was happening in charlottesville. you said invoking ror on blacks. the torch is, quote, invoking terror on blacks. what did you mean by that? >> was that not your tweet? >> no, i don't think so. let's be clear, so the kkk and torches, we've had supreme court cases that have talkeded about whether or not cross burnings were racially motivated or if that's just freedom of speech for anyone in their yard. what we need to make sure we remember is one, these marches have a very, very long history. two, we can't just put it in the south. we see that these white supremacists are marching in seattle and as malcolm x said everything south of the canadian border is the u.s. south. we've seen police officers in baltimore, washington, d.c., get reprimanded for having white supremacist paraphernalia on with their police uniforms. we know the kkk is a strong hold in pennsylvania, indiana and new
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york state. so when we conceptualize what domestic terrorism looks like, we also have to make sure we don't just put it in the alabamas and the virginias and these old confederate states and recognize that this is the united states of america problem, and it's not going anywhere because we have a president who is stoking the flames. he's been doing this ever since he slid down that gold escalator and announced his presidency. he definitely supports these groups because when he was pushed during the campaign, he couldn't denounce them. he just said i would tell them to stop it. and even today when he's been pushed, he couldn't bring himself to say stop it. >> so i think that's a much larger conversation. >> want to bring up the seattle protests full on your screens right now and you're seeing protesters, i believe, it's protesters, they're spraying silling string at the police officers that are standing there. >> joe, i want you to weigh in on this. this isn't just happening in places like charlottesville, virginia and this isn't just
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happening in the south and this is a countrywide issue and this is a country wide problem and really, what do we do about it? >> i know that's a really huge question to ask someone, but i think that's the frustration they have and so many people have that people are looking into the organizations and they have investigations, but what do we do? this this is a time to hear from the president of the united states and in times like this in the past when there have been americans at each other's throats over issues of race and color, american presidents have gone on national television and have talked to the country about -- from the standpoint of their moral imperative as president of the united states about what we need to do going forward and what the country needs to look like. this is such a time. we need to hear from the president of the united states that this kind of racist activity is not going to be tolerated under his watch and that these kinds of acts by people against americans of good will won't be tolerated and that
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people who commit these acts of violence because of the color of somebody's skin or the sexuality that those kind of people will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and hearing that from the president of the united states will do much to help americans feel better about the direction in which we're headed and about the fact that the leadership of the country is on the side of the people. so this is what we need to hear and he can tweet it, but he can give a speech from the oval office, as well, talking the strongest possible terms that he won't tolerate this under his watch. >> you can't help, but think back to the shootings at emanuel ame church, when president obama gave the speech after losing so many people in that church shooting that was so incredibly tragic. >> i want to bring back steve patterson standing by in seattle, washington. steve, what are you seeing? >> stand by. >> reporter: if you can see us right now, there is a clash between counterprotesters,
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yasmin, if you can see, there is a clash between counterprotesters right now and police. i uft just want to show you what's happening -- you can see silly string and you have counterprotesters getting right in our face as you see there. there's been a number of people moseying back and forth between the line and people are trying to cause disruptions. obviously, the frustration with the counterprotesters is that they're trying to get to the pro far-right supporterers, but it seems that at every point along this march have prevented them from doing that. so now we hear things that are deployed in the crowd. we don't know what that is. that just went off and this scene is getting obviously extremely heated. i wanted to show you back here, a sizeable crowd and maybe more than 300 now. this is the tip of the spear that has come up right against the police line. there are police situated pretty much on every street all of the way down since we've seen so far and the frustration has been building. we've heard at least one arrest so far that whatever they're
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deploying there seems to be harmless. you can barely smell it, but they are deploying something from the crowd over the police line as well as silly string on police. police, meanwhile, are standing by it appears with tear gas. it appears with anti-crowd disruption deployment. they have not fired anything yet and we're right in the front lines of it so if we do, we'll be right in the middle of it. we' >> we'll keep watching the images there. i want to apologize to our viewers. as you know this is live television and if you were offended by the language that was used we certainly apologize and we'll try to make sure that doesn't happen again, but again, live television so keep that in your mind as you're watching the breaking news coverage. christine, i want to bring you back into the conversation and bring my whole panel for the conversation and react to this rid now. >> it is so interesting concerning what you just said in that -- on so many people equate what happened in charlottesville
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to the south and a very progressive place and yet we're seeing -- actually, let's stand by. it seems like things are taking another turn there. >> steve, talk to me. what's happening? >> there appears to be a clash between police and counterprotesters. they've -- something has been deployed in the crowd and you can hear those going off. from what it feels like that is tear gas, but they have just deployed. the police line is now pushing into the crowd and the crowd is dispersed. the crowd was right against those counterprotesters who had just been right in the faces of police as this march continued and froze sort of in the middle of the face of police. the counterprotesters seemed to go at police and police, as you just saw pushed back, deployed tear gas. we'll send it back to you, yasmin. >> are you okay? i want to make sure you're okay. it sounded like you were losing
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your voice there. take care of yourself for a second. we want to -- have -- are you okay to talk with us? >> reporter: yeah. i can talk to you. i'm okay. >> so how is the crowd reacting to things as well or do police seem like they have a handle on the situation there, steve? >> reporter: well, police -- they do. they had a very solid police line, pretty much on every alley that would funnel the crowd toward the pro-company supporters, the national supporters and they were moseying around and gathering waiting for the coming storm. we're at the tip of that storm right now. these protesters are pushing forward and they're extremely frustrated because they're trying to get at those supporters who are in that park, and so they've gotten extremely aggressive with police. police, though, as i mentioned, have kept a solid line and they've had batons out this
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whole time. they've been in riot gear and they're not obviously afraid to deploy tear gas and deploy agents to disperse the crowd, so they have done that. they've been holding strong so far. we have not seen sort of any counterprotesters break through the line and when that does happen police push back pretty harshly, yasmin? >> steve, you've been talking to people on the ground and talking to the protesters. what are they saying to you? what changes do they want to see happen? why are they there today? >> reporter: so, yasmin, keep in mind that this rally was scheduled well before the events of what happened in virginia. this was a counterprotest rally to usher in those white nationalist protesters who were here for another reason. nothing related to that virginia rally. they were here sort of doing their normal rounds. they're a group that does this sort of protest up and down the west coast. they're sort of faumous in this area for leaving conflicts behind everywhere they go.
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so this crowd was here to push back against them. obviously, the crowd is much more sizeable, much more angry probably because of the events that took place yesterday and you can see them now really pushing up against that police line. they dispersed just a few seconds ago, and now they've seemed to sort of funnel back in up once again in the face of police who are not afraid to push back, yasmin. >> talk about why seattle? why is patriot prayer in seattle now? >> reporter: so according to patriots' prayer, the group that you just mentioned, they sort of target west coast as they describe liberal left-leaning cities that don't agree with their value system. they seem to be sort of angry at cities like portland. they operate in vancouver, even beyond the borders of the u.s. and then here in seattle where they feel like this is a liberal stronghold. this is a place where they need
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to push their belief system on the people here to sort of bring their ideal system here, and so we've heard a lot from them, both with their social media postings and just talking to them in the crowd. the strange thing is so far that has been the peaceful group. now that group has not clashed with counterprotesters because, as you see, police is still holding the line, but they tell us they just want to be here to get their message out and even their leader telling us, basically to keep his people peaceful and to not clash with counterprotesters and it appears that's what police are traying to avoid at this point with this very angry crowd of counterprotesters, yasmin. >> it seems like one of the leaders, he posted on facebook that there be no clash with the counterprotesters, i think, that's what steve patterson was referring to when he said the leader of patriot prayer saying not to clash with any counterprotesters, but it seems like some clashes are happening. of course, as we see this unfold
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we're hoping that it doesn't develop to the point at which it did yesterday. i think a lot of people are hoping and praying and watching this rolling coverage that we've been seeing out of seattle washington, there. >> i want to bring in lisha brooks, the law director of the southern poverty center. talk to us about this group, patriot prayer. what do you know about them? >> they identify themselves as an alt-right group. they're firly new. we've seen them at anti-sharia demonstrations in the past. their leader did call on the group not to respond to the counterprotesters, but this is exactly what they want. this is what anti -- this is what fascist ohs and white nationalist groups want. they want to see chaos. they want to bring more attention to their cause and then they can paint the liberals as the bad guy. so they're not the innocents in this at all. >> steve, i want to go back to you. are you seeing messages out there from the counterprotesters, asking people
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to demonstrate peacefully? >>. >> at this point, no, although it's not appearing like, you know, they came here to cause trouble. there seems to be a few different elements in the crowd, right? you have people who are holding pro black lives matter signs who have come out really to be a part of the support system of this counterprotest crowd to sort of fight back against the message of those white nationalists, and then you have people that we see often in crowds like this, people wearing masks and people wearing sunglasses, and people wearing ski masks and people completely covering their face for whatever reason, but in some cases those reasons are pretty negative. so we've seen sort of both of those elements sort of together at this point, but also those elements break out and that's when we see the flash points of anger and violence right now focused at police because they can't get through to where their objective is at this point,
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yasmin. >> have there been any messages from the higher ups in the community in seattle and the mayor there speaking out about what's been happening in the street so far. i know it happens that the rally just started 45 minutes or so ago and there hasn't been much time that's gone by, but any urging from the mayor there, or the governor of the state for people to stand down, to protest peacefully? >> reporter: again, like you said, i think it's too early to say that at this point. right now the message is really, you see it. it's with those batons and the riot gear that the police have on. it's the message is the posturing is do not break through this line. do not mess with, you know, the first amendment rights of people who are behind them and do not cause a conflict. i think right now the city is really focused on trying to keep the peace. and so you can hear, obviously counterprotesters angry to hear this, but that's so far the
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message from city posturing with their police, posting on pretty much every street corner to keep this crowd away from that other crowd because i'm not sure they know what's going to happen if they put those twoel ems together, yasmin. >> i want to reiterate to people as they're watching this live breaking news rolling out of seattle, washington. things happen, people say things and we do apologize for that and we'll try to make sure that doesn't happen, but again, we can't control people as they're out there in the streets rallying for something that they believe in. we have another shot of the rally at patriot prayer in the park. i believe that is the shot right there as you're seeing is that man talking right there. steve, give me sort of a lay of the land here. how far away is that line of police officers and those counterprotesters from the rally that's happening in the park? >> reporter: yasmin, i'd say we're probably less than a quarter mile away or so. we're two blocks. >> two blocks away my producer
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said. it's hard for me to tell because i've been in this crowd for so long now and they seem to be stopping and marching and stopping and marching. we're about two blocks so extremely close. if we took away this police line and probably some of the s.w.a.t. equipment and police vehicles that are behind the line we'd probably be able to see at least the first glimpse of patriots' prayer if we have a camera down there. again, that size of the crowd, probably about two dozen people and probably a little bit more at this point, and we haven't been able to get back there in the past 20 or 30 minutes, but they've been holding in place there and again, two blocks away from here you see the tip of the spear and the counterprotesters up against the police line facing down towards where patriots' prayer is. >> i want to bring in rick schwine, former fbi. >> rick, yesterday in charlottesville, virginia, the governor terry mcauliffe was criticized for not having enough police presence and the police
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weren't doing necessarily enough. a lot of people criticizing him for that. they did as best as they could and there were people carrying semiautomatic weapons in the crowd and they had to be cautious with their actions there. >> from what you're seeing in the video and what took place in seattle, do you believe the police are doing what they're supposed to be doing? >> they are and they're caught in a no-win situation because the police have to stand between the protesters who have a permit or they're lawfully exercising their first amendment rights and the counterprotesters who may or may want be there lawfully and whether the police agree or disagree with either side is a moot point. their job is to protect people's cop stushl rights to be heard, and what we're seeing play out is really a sad commentary on our society on how divisive our society has become with our brave men and women in law enforcement caught right in the middle of it. and now have become the object
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of the of these counter protesters and have to not only protect the original patriot prayer group, but also have to protect themselves. >> steve, if i still have you. if you want to get your take from the size of the crowd, there are only supposed to be 200 only supposed to be 200 people attending the patriot prayer side, but you are more in the counterprotesters area. how many people are you seeing in that area, and do you have any indication as to how many people are with the patriot prayer people? >> reporter: i was with patriot prayer earlier and i was there as many of them were starting to arrive. i would say maybe a few dozen, maybe one or two dozen people there with that size increasing as we go. but that was early. again, i haven't seen that crowd in a while. this counterprotest has been swelling since we've been here. i would say it started off with maybe 200 to 300 people. maybe it might now be pushing 400 at this point.
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where we are situated at the tip of the spear of this, i would say a sizable number of people, a few hundred, are gathered around police and a few dozen on the front lines again in the face of police trying to push past that police line, very angry that they're not able to do that at this point and want to push on those two blocks away into where patriot prayer is. that's the situation as we have it right now. then, as we mentioned, the police really posted on every street along this march, funneling the crowd away from each other. so trying to keep those two elements separate, trying to keep everybody in the city safe, which at this point seems to be a challenge. back to you. >> did you speak to the people in the patriot prayer rally at all? what were they saying? why were they there? why do they want their voices to be heard? >> again, it is sort of they want to espouse their ideology on what they consider to be a left-leaning liberal stronghold. that's why they're here in
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seattle. that's why they came. they came well before the events that happened that took place in virginia. i didn't really get a chance to talk to them because this was happening very quickly after i -- right after i arrived. but they seem to be sort of just starting to set up, just kind of moseying around, getting ready. i think they were, on some level, anticipating this because some of them obviously some of them wearing street clothes, some of those wearing those "make america great" hats because obviously there is a big element of trump supporters in that crowd. but some of them also with sort of what appear to be sort of kevlar fatigues, with what appear to be helmets that might protect from an attack from a crowd that was angry at them. so i think they were prepared and anticipating some sort of conflict. of course, just by their presence, of course egging it on just by being here. so again, that crowd about two dozen, about two blocks away at this point as this crowds wants to meet them very badly.
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>> steve, stand by for me. we're about seven minutes to the top of the hour. we've been watching a rally called the freedom rally, the group, an alt-right group called patriots prayer. it was a rally planned before what happened in charlottesville, virginia. about 200 people were scheduled to be there. it's happening now in seattle, washington. you are also seeing footage of counterprotesters there. our own msnbc steve patterson on the ground for us covering that. you are seeing silly string and other things that were being thrown at the officers earlier and now those officers are standing in that lineup to make sure there are no clashes between the counterprotesters and patriot prayer protesters about two blocks away. everyone praying what took place in charlottesville, virginia does not happen on west coast in jad seattle, washington. want to bring back in our msnbc analyst. you are watching this footage out of seattle, washington. are you surprised as to what you
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see? looks like we don't have joyce. are you surprised to see what's been going on in seattle? >> no. but i think what's also important to notice is the militarization of our police state. this looks like many people overseas. in their quest to maintain peace we have to remember that you don't get to have peace if you don't have justice. the level of frustration i think that many people in this country have it seems as though so many sectors of our government, and so many sectors of our law enforcement, are more concerned with making sure that white supremacists are happy and feeling great and not people who were actually happily demanding justice. how often do marginalized communities have to go through these sort of traumatic events without some sort of resource.
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so when you look at the visual of these batons and helmets and everything looks like it is 1950s all over again, i think we really have to ask ourselves what is the leadership doing to begin to think about the ways in which our law enforcement acts with citizens. some of the most compelling videos are from ferguson. if we don't do something we will see many more fergusons. those were people who were actually just trying to be heard and be seen at a time where our country is ignoring them. >> this reminds me of ferguson. this reminds me of baltimore as well. that was not under president trump's watch, to be honest. that was under president obama's watch. >> we see the police acting very differently right now than they did in ferguson. >> steve patterson, you are on the ground for us still. we do only have a couple of minutes before we go to break. but any changes that you've seen in what's been happening on the ground there? >> reporter: at this point the police line seems to be sort of in place. counterprotesters sort of remain where they have been for about
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the last few minutes or so. the chanting really, the sort of aggressive chanting at the police has tapered down a little bit, too. we heard there were possibly police coming to support this line. maybe to reinforce and bolster the line here and maybe to push and try to disperse this crowd in the next few minutes. that's something that we've heard based on reporting in the crowd. but so far, everybody's just kind of holding strong in extremely tense scene with counterprotesters and police. >> steve, you'll be joining us back at the top of the hour. we appreciate your reporting for this hour with us. please stay safe. steve patterson with msnbc. we will continue to follow the situation out of seattle, washington where a patriots prayer rally is going on. those are counterprotesters there as well. you see the police lineup making sure that those two groups remain separated. i have a whole panel joining me again at the top of the hour. we'll be following breaking news out of seattle, washington where
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that rally is taking place there along with the events that took place in charlottesville, virginia over the last couple of days. a lot of news to talk about, everybody. keep it here. you're watching msnbc. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ (flourish spray noise) (flourish spray noise) (flourish spray noise) (flourish spray noise) the joy of real cream in 15 calories per serving. enough said. reddi-wip. (flourish spray noise) share the joy.
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welcome back, everybody. we're following a breaking news situation in seattle, washington where counterprotesters there are squaring off with police as they demonstrate against an alt-right rally in the city. it comes just a day after the deadly situation in charlottesville which remains on edge. also an explosion of anger once again. you hear an explosion of anger once again in the city on edge. this time charlottesville residents unload on the organizer of a hate rally that ended in death. as the man accused of murder prepares to head to court, a community and a family mourn the life lost.
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