billing taxpayers even to reimburse mar-a-lago over $3 million, which is now the subject of ethics and legal complaints. so it wasting taxpayer money a fireable offense for the trump administration for everyone but the president? the answer obviously is we'll see. that does it for us. "hardball" starts now. here comes the judge. let's play "hardball." ♪ good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. donald trump came face-to-face last night with his political power. in a republican primary fight in alabama that pitted an establishment-backed candidate and lost big. the president went down to alabama himself last week to rally supporters for his candidate luther strange.

he downright tweeted for his guy. today, all those tweets have been deleted. he's now enthusiastically backing the republican candidate roy moore. >> we have a man who's going to be a great senator and i'm very happy with that. i spoke to him last night. i never met him. i never spoke to him. i'm very happy with him and i have to say luther came a long way from the time i endorsed him and he ran a good race but roy ran a really great race and i know they did in the campaign but he works hard and i'm sure things will work out. >> and anyway, roy moore and why are moderate republicans afraid? he's the chief justice of the alabama supreme court which was once removed from the bench for removing a bench from the monument and for instructing judges in the state to ignore

the legalizing of gay marriage. he backs criminalizing homosexual behavior wherever it can be found. >> do you think homosexuality or homosexual conduct should be illegal today? that's a yes or no question. >> homosexual conduct should be illegal. >> he's calling homosexuality itself evil and abhorrent and immoral and detestable. he's suggested attacks of 9/11 happened because god was punishing what he calls perverseness. he was asked about that last night and didn't back down. >> i'm not god. i don't know what god does. it's the lack of morality in our country that has landed these things and the oem basis for morality in this country is god. >> which has led to these things. over the years, moore has backed

the birther movement questioning president obama's legitimacy. >> i think they can holler political question all they wish but it's a simple fact that if he's not a natural-born citizen, he's not qualified to be president. and i don't care who he is. >> well, moore has advocated blocking a muslim-elected official because he's a muslim. he's falsely stated that there are communities under sharia law right now in our country. here he goes. >> false religions like islam who teach that you must worship this way are completely opposite than what our first amendment states. >> well, that is the man who will very likely be the next u.s. senator from alabama. what does it mean for the senate and republicans and for president trump? i'm joined by "the washington

post" robert costa and eli stokels and somebody is going to the trump side of trump. >> the white house is pushing back on the idea today with the whole situation but it was a political rupturing for president trump. it showed he did us not have total control over his core voters, the republican base, and that that's uneasy. that makes a lot of republican senators on capitol hill feel uneasy about their chances next year as they look at re-election. >> well, does this mean that trump -- does he now realize he's in the caboose, not in the engine, and that he's responding to this populist grassroots thing which may have his heart, alt-right, if you will, not exactly positive about diversity and certainly not big on gay rights, that group that backed him, is he the leader of that group or simply the repository

of their support until they get somebody further right than him, like judge moore? >> alabama is not an example of those voters moving away from president trump. he still remains their leader in spirit but he's not their director and that's a really key distinction. they're not taking queus from this white house and if you're a republican on capitol hill, he can't pull strange across the finish line and then you start to wonder if maybe i should retire. we saw senator corker say that yesterday. others, i'm told, are mulling the same. >> let me go to annie linsky. is there a republican party? there's mitch mcconnell, he's there, but he seems to have no relationship to the president. the president would rather deal with his fellow new yorker chuck schumer and have chinese with him out of those little white boxes, he's more at home with him than this guy from kentucky. i don't even know what he does anymore. he can't pass anything.

health care defeated again and again. and then we're going to try to deal with this far right guy. >> yeah. it's such a fractured party right now. there are so many pieces to it and i think certainly when you saw last night when steve bannon got up on stage to introduce roy moore, i thought -- and said this is the beginning of the revolution, you know, that was a key piece because one of the power centers is clear bannon, not necessarily trump and then you have mitch mcconnell on the other side. >> on the deep south and a lot of parts of the country, would you rather have steve bannon, the alt-right hero or the president -- by the way, if i were really cruel, i'd have a big box score up there and it would say -- oh, we have one. bannon, 1. trump, 0. it's the first time they've gone up against each other and

bannon's won. trump's lost. >> trump knows it. bannon knows it. you know, i think -- >> he doesn't have a whiteboard? >> well, he had a whiteboard in the office with all of his to-do items on it. but it's less important about whether it's bannon or trump who is officially endorsed and roy moore is a demagogue and relates -- >> a lot of people believe this stuff. >> i think that's right. >> anti-gay -- he's the old testament version of trump. >> i think ideologically there is an argument that you could make that he's a bit closer to pence than trump. he's a conservative in a much sort of -- he really believes it in a way that trump has an ideological flexibility that we hear about so much. >> the reason trump endorsed strange in the first place was because he was easily manipulated. he had advisers bring his comments that were negative by

trump and he said i don't like that. who else can i endorse? he endorsed strange not really knowing that moore was out there and likely to win. so he got himself in this box but you heard him today basically saying, well, they used mitch down there a lot. i was treated fine but they used mitch, sort of like republicans use nancy pelosi in the general election. what he's saying is this isn't my fault. obviously trump made it easier for them to use mitch. mitch, you're not getting this done. mitch, it's your fault. >> they are running against mitch the way they used to run against tip o'neil or teddy kennedy. look, this is republicans. roy moore has been an aggressive critic against mcconnell. "i hope it sends mcconnell and the senate leadership fund another message, that they can be beaten and scared once in a while." watch this baby. >> they lied about repealing obamacare. now mitch mcconnell's d.c. is

spreading million for lies about roy message. send them all a message. >> that was a strong message. sort of an alabama sound a little bit. a fund-raiser e-mail told supporters judge roy moore in the u.s. senate means the end of mitch mcconnell's reign asthma majority leader. your point in. >> it's a thankless position. he decided he's hanging it up and you have other republican challengers styled along the lines of trump in arizona and a number of other states emboldened by this. alabama is the tip of the sphere. >> it looks like it's the leadership that was becoming atrophied and useless. there's the trump crowd and still republicans vote for trump in every poll we take and then there's the part that just wants to quit. charlie dent, walking away.

that part i think is going to grow. >> yeah. >> i think a lot of these guys don't like this. >> dent calls himself the governing wing of the republican party. they are showing -- not anymore. if you leave, you're not gm governing anymore. >> in the first 7, 7 1/2 months of the trump presidency, there's been very few accomplishments, if any. luther strange was not -- this is another instance of an establishment installing a candidate that the people decided they didn't like and i think when you are in that dynamic, especially right now, you're asking for some trouble. >> let me go back to robert. let's talk about how trump won and where he may be in trouble around the edges. he won not just because of the tee in pennsylvania, between pittsburgh and philly, he won because he did pretty well, certainly better than expected in the suburbs, bucks county, montgomery county even and did

well in le hihigh valley and pls like that. now charlie dent is quitting. what about fits mat trizpatrick meehan. are they getting nervous about their kissing cousin here? >> they are not nervous when they hear the president talk about tax cuts today. that's the kind of refrain they'd prefer to hear every day. >> yeah. >> what makes them nervous is him talking about the nfl and taking a knee and the policy of grievance and the president wading into the culture wars. that makes republicans skittish about their re-election chances and they are not confident that the president can focus his message, focus the party ahead of 2018. >> well, one theory i've heard, which makes sense to me, every time trump decides to deal with the democrats, deal with nancy on keeping the government going, boring stuff like the debt ceiling, going along with daca which doesn't really offend the right wing that much in the suburbs, he bounces it off with

some wild right-wing cultural -- he feeds them circus, as i said last week, while he feeds them bread, too. he keeps them happy on pragmatic stuff, the left and the center. meanwhile, he keeps the right wing and his people stoked up with the cultural fight. do you see that pattern? i do. he's mixing it up like a baseball pitcher. he's making it up. the right-wing cultural stuff with the pragmatic dealing center and the left. >> my sources say there's somewhat of a strategy at times. but chris, to be candid, often the president is careening from controversy to controversy. while he's using his instincts to try to guide him and understand what his base wants, there's really no coherent way of understanding a lot of the political strategy that's coming out of this white house. >> eli, last word. is it strategic? >> i think rob put it very well. sometimes it's a matter of impulse control but he does know that he needs to sort of keep the base happy.

>> circuses. >> he thinks -- our reporting is that he thinks this nfl controversy, which he has stoked, is actually good for him. this is a country that's dividing the country that thinks it's to his political benefit. >> route 40 on a friday night, the guys on the stools telling us -- i think you may be right. there may be a mix on this. robert, eli, annie, what a trio. coming up, the devastation in puerto rico is massive, unfortunately, and the trump administration is pushing back against the growing criticism but is it doing enough? even republicans are warning about it. we'll talk to the governor of the puerto rico, next. plus, roy moore's victory in alabama challenges the republican party as we know it. trump has helped create something on the right, something that he can't control. the question is whether democrats can exploit the republicans' lunch republican republicans' lurch on the right. and tom price used private

planes to meet up and have lunch with his son at taxpayers' expense. he's one of the three cabinet trump members now fleecing american taxpayers. and finally, this is "hardball." my experience with usaa has been excellent. they always refer to me as master sergeant. they really appreciate the military family, and it really shows. we've got auto insurance, homeowners insurance. had an accident with a vehicle, i actually called usaa before we called the police. usaa was there hands-on very quick very prompt. i feel like we're being handled as people that actually have a genuine need. we're the webber family and we are usaa members for life. usaa, get your insurance quote today. i love you, droolius caesar, but sometimes you stink. febreze car vent clip cleans away odors for up to 30 days.

because the things you love can stink. ...has grown into an enterprise. that's why i switched to the spark cash card from capital one. now, i'm earning unlimited 2% cash back on every purchase i make. everything. what's in your wallet? we need gas. we need our hospitals not to become death traps. this is a big s.o.s. >> that was san juan's mayor talking about the humanitarian crisis that puerto rico faces and asking the u.s. government to do more to help. today president trump says he feels badly for the people of puerto rico and reiterated his

plan to visit the island next tuesday. >> puerto rico is in a very difficult situation. that place was just destroyed. that's not a question of, gee, let's dry up the water, let's do this or that. that place was flat. that is a really tough situation. i feel so badly for the people. >> well, the trump administration has come under criticism for not waiving the jones act. it was waived after hurricanes harvey and irma and critics say it's slowing down the aid that puerto rico needs right now. it's in contrast to the british in world war 2 when they sent every boat or ship they had to rescue their people. the president said today that they were still thinking about it but was concerned about the shipping industry. >> we have a lot of shippers and people that work in the shipping industry that don't want the jones act lifted and we have a lot of ships out there.

>> i'm joined by rica ricado rossello. >> we have having communication but you have to understand that this is a devastation of an enormous magnitude that our energy grid is completely destroyed and we are on an island. getting resources over here has been limited. we're working on it. we're delivering food and water and we're here to make sure that that is happening and done in collaboration with the federal government. >> do you want the president to waive the jones act? >> i think he should. we can have a larger discussion later if it's important in the long run or not but right now we need all hands on deck as they did in irma.

we had a one-week waiver. i think we need every boat that can come in and i don't think it harms the industry because, quite frankly, we need all hands on deck and every boat that can provide basic necessities should be coming to puerto rico. >> let's listen to the president. >> we have been really treated very, very nicely by the governor and by everybody else. they know how hard we're working and what a good job we're doing. as governor rossello just told me this morning, the entire federal workforce is doing great work in puerto rico and i appreciate he saying it and he's saying it to anybody that will listen. >> and the governor said we're doing a great job. in fact, he thanked me specifically for fema and all of the first responders in puerto rico. we have had tremendous reviews from government officials.

>> governor, is all of that true? are you on the same page with the president? >> yes, the president has been very diligent. he's essentially talked to me every day, every petition we have of him, he's answered in the affirmative. he declared puerto rico a disaster area, he waived the cost sharing for fema and now, you know, recently we asked him for more resources. they are coming over here. but i want to say, chris, this is also the state government that's helping. governor cuomo is helping, governor baker in massachusetts is helping as well, governor hogan, governor scott, governor mcauliffe. a lot of people are helping and putting resources but the president has been very diligent and has answered our requests. now we just need to recognize that those human resources that we need an island to get here as quick as possible. >> thank you very much, governor

ricardo rossello. god bless, puerto rico. is quitting the only way to show rebelliousness in the republican party right now? that debate is coming up next. this is where the action is. "hardball." and at our factory in boston, 1,200 workers are starting their day building on over a hundred years of heritage, craftsmanship and innovation. today we're bringing you america's number one shave at lower prices every day. putting money back in the pockets of millions of americans. as one of those workers, i'm proud to bring you gillette quality for less, because nobody can beat the men and women of gillette. gillette - the best a man can get.

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show me fall tv. check out the best of the best hand-picked fall shows on xfinity x1, online, and the xfinity stream app. thirsty? i'm honored to be here today with many of your tremendous, modern day leaders. we're joined tonight -- and i want you to give him a nice hand, because he's on our side. got to take good care of our people, right? and he's got a lot of power for the people of kentucky. by our senate majority leader mitch mcconnell, where is he? come here, mitch. everything good? that health care is looking

good. good. thanks, mitch. >> health care is looking great. what a difference a half a year makes. that was president trump back in march praising senate majority lead leader mitch mcconnell. well, today after his candidate luther strange lost, he's stewing over a string of defeats. his seeming victory only coming when he works with house majority or minority leader nancy pelosi or chuck schumer, a fellow who speaks his language and eats chinese with him. he's openly venting about his frustration with what he considers the failed leadership by senate republicans and making fun of senator mitch mcconnell and john mccain. so in private he's mocking these guys. mitch mcconnell is saying that it would stroke insurgent bids across the country. this is just hours after one of his close allies, senator bob corker of tennessee, announced that he's not running for

re-election last year. yesterday it seemed to highlight a deepening divide between the establishment republican party so who or what exactly is the republican party of 2017? for more, i'm joined by matt sclapp who had dinner with president trump on monday night and david cornyn for mother jones and a political analyst. >>. >> i couldn't make it. >> i would have liked to have seen that. >> you can arrange it with your inside. because he put his name on the ballot for strange. by the way, there's an odd name. luther strange. but it didn't work. and this other guy is a wild man. a wild man. the stuff about gays is so out of line right now in terms of our constitution as we interpret it now and yet it doesn't seem to bother trump. he flipped 180 today.

he's my guy. >> that doesn't surprise me. i think trump was with luther strange because he was the incumbent although he was only appointed, he voted for the trump agenda. they ran this primary about who could be closest to trump and trump wants a reliable vote in the senate and he's going to be for the republican. >> a week or two ago we would say roy moore was a wild man. the ten commandments of -- >> he didn't go after roy moore, if you notice. >> you're missing my point. this isn't some odd state senator here. he's a united states senate, roy moore, and he's been kicked out of his judgeship twice because he won't obey the constitution. >> i think that's a problematic thing. >> he is going to follow the constitution? >> he's going to have to or he won't get seated. >> what does that mean? he doesn't allow his current interpretation affect him. i think you're stimying here. >> i'm not stimying. the president is standing behind the republican and i think roy

moore will be the next senator. >> the republican voters of alabama chose roy moore the way that the republican base chose donald trump. they are going for some of the more extreme and he's not just against gay he call it is beastiality and says there's sharia law in indiana. that shows he's not that smart of a person yet the primary republican voters voted for him. and it's a tea party fever in which they are turning towards extremists and they don't show experience or competence. >> as far as the tea party movement, they are focused on the constitution. as far as the governing majority.

the problem for mitch mcconnell and the other leaders who i have respect for in the congress is that the base of the republican party feels like they are not governing and getting it done. if they were getting these things done, like repeal and replace, we'll see what happens on taxes. i'm optimistic but if they don't get it done, they are not governing in that case. they were given a majority and it ain't happening. my party has a big problem that they are not implementing. >> musical chairs when you're in grade school and you lose a seat. it's like your party is losing seats for moderate. charlie dent from pennsylvania just quits, bob corker just sits. they are not comfortable in the party anymore, these guys. and all of a sudden a guy like roy moore feels comfortable. these other guys don't feel like they are. moderates or people who we used to call mainstream republicans are quitting. the wild people are coming on board. >> look, in fairness, i will tell you that i think the republican party is moving to the right and i think the

democratic party with elizabeth warren and bernie sanders, they are moving to the left. >> wait. you see nancy pelosi and chuck schumer actually trying to govern, find out where they can persuade the president -- not just the president but other -- >> give trump credit, too. >> yes. but they are the ones putting this deal together. they came forward and we may see this in infrastructure. we won't see it on tax reform because tax reform is going to be bad for people in the low and middle income. nevertheless, a lot of republicans do not want to govern. they want to disrupt and destroy. they want to come here and they don't want to have a health care plan. they want to get rid of what is there. >> just keep saying it. >> 50% of americans pay income taxes, chris. 50% don't.

that's not my number gls we, ch. and a lot get rebates. so don't say that the poor are paying income taxes. the second thing is, if you're going to -- >> property tax? don't tell me the working people don't pay taxes. >> i said income taxes. they don't pay income taxes. i'm for them paying -- i'm for the -- i'm the low tax guy here. i'll win that argument every time. the fact is, if schumer and pelosi get credit for trying to govern, trump's in that mix and you have to give them all credit for trying to govern. you can't say it's just the democrats trying to reach across the aisle. >> how are mitch mcconnell and paul ryan trying to -- >> that's the problem. >> you can't have it both ways. they can't be extreme to meet the republican party base desire and then -- >> don't worry, they are not. >> wouldn we be better off if w didn't have obamacare? >> i think --

>> you can say it your way if you'll answer. >> i will answer. i think we would have been better off on these big questions of entitlements that we do them in a bipartisan way like your old boss. >> see, the problem with that -- >> we're better off without it. >> better off repealing it. >> absolutely. >> but not having nothing, you see how big the government is. that is absurd. >> they are unable to get a vote that says repeal obamacare because they know it's better than what we had. >> i will say, on your tv show, that this country would be better if obamacare had never passed and there's a lot of democrats -- >> no. thank you. you're not speaking for the minority of the republican party and david cornyn speaking for many in the democratic party. new reporting that these kremlin-linked facebook ads promoted green party candidate jill stein in an attempt to divide the clinton vote. we'll explain why the russians

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here's what is happening. president trump is in indianapolis pitching the republican tax plan and calling it a once in a generation opportunity. corporate and individual taxes would be slashed and tax brackets consolidated. it is not clear how republicans will pay for these cuts. university of louisville

basketball coach rick pitino has been let go for taking cash to steer athletes to certain managers and schools. a driver trapped by rushing water from flooding water was rescued. only a tiny guardrail was holding the suv in place. crews got the woman to shore safely. now back to "hardball." welcome back to "hardball." president trump is lashing out over reports revealing the extent of the russian-sponsored ad campaign on facebook during the 2016 election. he says the social media company worked against him, suggesting that facebook also colluded with other media outlets. "facebook was always anti-trump. the networks were always anti-trump. hence, fake news. "the new york times" and "washington post" were always

anti-trump. k collusion? "some backed bernie sanders and his platform even after his presidential campaign had ended. jill stein was the beneficiary of at least one of the russian-bought political ads," according to someone familiar with the ad. it said, "choose peace and vote for jill stein. trust me, it's not a wasted vote." the senate intelligence committee has invited facebook to testify in an open hearing. there are representatives from twitter that will meet with both intelligence committees tomorrow. i'm joined by eric swalwell who sits on the house intel committee. i'm over wewhelmed and it showsw jill stein made the difference in states like michigan where she got 51,000 votes, the marvin between hillary clinton and trump was 11,000. five times the vote.

in wisconsin, she got 31,000 votes. trump won by 21,000. so if there was a conniving here, a strategy to destroy the election for hillary by dividing up the left and center vote, it worked. my question to you, when they write the history of this campaign, will they write that the russian involvement in dividing and conquering the political spectrum was decisive? >> chris, good evening. also note the level of sophistication. the hash tag on what you just read said "grow a spine, vote jill stein." that was an idiom. the smartest political scientists in russia probably wouldn't understand how to use u.s. idioms. they were trying to alienate

likely clinton voters and peel them out of the way. that's what we're seeking to understand. >> do you know the technology that would prove what you just said, how facebook was used, how smart intel spotting on the ground, like you suggested, knowing the idioms and that kind of stuff, how it worked to be a collusion? >> one way we could do that is look if advertisement a, the jill stein advertisement that was funded by russians, if there's a similar or identical advertisement funded by another foreign entity or a u.s. person. you could probably assume that they were in some way working together but using cutouts to post it because $150,000 seems like a relatively low amount and the russian way is to use cutouts and other sources of funding. so you can do that diagnostic by doing a pixel analysis. it's going to take time but that's one way that better be

conducted. >> let's look at something we overlooked. i over looked it. look at jill stein sitting there with putin. michael flynn was there. michael flynn is there on the left. vladimir putin is in the middle. very comfortably there in moscow with the head of the russian government there. what do you make of the courtship? brought her over there, wined and dined her and then promoted her through facebook, apparently. well, they did. >> yeah. frankly, chris, i'd love to hear from jill stein about why she was at that dinner and whether she had followed up at all with any russians. that would also be helpful for us in our investigation, knowing now that the russians sought to use her candidacy to also tear down or take away votes from hillary clinton. >> i couldn't get her on "hardball" but i guess putin knew how to get her over there. i couldn't even get gary johnson here. he didn't even know any world

leaders. she wouldn't come on this show but wouldn't mind hanging around with him. the russians are sophisticated enough to divide the political spectrum to the detriment of the progressive hillary who could have won. thank you very much, eric swalwell. up next, is this draining the swamp? health and human services secretary tom price is under fire for taking taxpayer-funded private jets. he's not the only cabinet member under fire for reportedly abusing the system. these guys are supposed to be cleaning the swamp. they are swimming in it. you're watching "hardball."

i will tell you personally, i'm not happy about it. i am not happy about it. i'm going to look at it. i am not happy about it and i let him know it. >> he's not happy about it. he'll let him know. that was president trump being clear in commenting on health and human services secretary tom price's use of private jets for

official business. the cost taxpayers is more than $400,000 since may. politico reports that that price combined business with pleasure rather than "price took a government-funded private jet in august to get to st. simon's island, an exclusive georgia resort where he and his wife own land. on june 6th, hhs chartered a jet to fly price to nashville where he owns a condominium and where his son resides. price toured a medicine dispensary and spoke to a local health summit and had lunch with his friend." well, the hhs inspector general is reviewing those expenses and now the president is looking into price, too. let's watch. >> do you still have confidence in the health -- in him? >> i am not happy with him.

>> would you fire him, sir? >> we'll see. did you hear that? price is one of the three trump cabinet members facing questions about their air travel. let's bring in the "hardball" round table, cornell and betsy, a politics reporter and john feehery is a republican. what do you make of this stuff? you can say small potatoes but it's what most people connect with. >> this reminds me of when david watkins, remember him, he was fired in the clinton administration because he took a helicopter ride with golf clubs. any c anytime you embarrass your boss, it's bad for you especially when your boss is not sure about you. david watkins got fired and caused a big problem for the clinton administration in 1994. this is a problem for the president. >> see, i'm thinking about the average person who take as trip once in a while, they consider it a real luxury and sit in 28d and they are wondering why does

this guy get to sit on this private plane at my expense. >> exactly. and it's the optics which is damaging to price. >> and we don't even see it. >> right. everybody knows how planes work. everyone is familiar that private planes are slightly nicer than the alternative. i mean, i don't know. i would assume. >> you have your own flight attendant, nobody is bothering, plenty of air to breathe and nice cupcakes and stuff to eat while on the plane. >> sounds pretty good. yeah. and normal people can understand that that is a special privilege that appears to be coming with tom price. >> sorry to interrupt, but cornell, he's not talking about a private flight to somewhere in oklahoma. philly. he could take the train. it's not a big haul. you walk over to union station, ride over there on uber and get on the train and there in an hour and a half. what's the problem? >> this is really problematic to someone who came in and talked

about draining the swamp. this is such an easy picture for americans to think, okay, when they think about what is wrong with washington, big fat cats, riding in a limousine, smoking cigars, flying on private jets doing "hardball," right? this goes against what his brand is. his brand was, i'm going to drain the swamp and the populist for the small people and this is actually an important story for democrats because this undermines the foundation of donald trump's brand and what he talks about is draining the swamp and he's actually filling the swamp. >> let me fill up the dance card. epa inspector general is reviewing the cost of administrator scott pruitt frequent trips home to oklahoma and steve mnuchin's use of the military jet to fly from new york to washington at the tune of $25,000. here's how mnuchin defended that travel. >> let me say that the inspector general is reviewing my travel. i look forward to that review.

i'm comfortable and we've had our legal counsel review everything but if their suggestions will follow it, that's number one. number two, it doesn't cost $25,000 an hour but it costs a lot of money. and number three, as i've said, there are times when i need secure communications to be in touch with the president, the national security counsel and that's the reason why. >> he said betsy was comfortable with this discussion. >> yeah. >> he didn't bring it up. >> i heard people sound slightly more comfortable than secretary mnuchin sounded in that clip. part of the reason this is such an issue for republicans, that this broad question of cabinet secretary taking private flights is a problem is because one of the main criticisms that congressional republicans have of obama during the prior administration was government waste. it's something republicans love talking about. they love talking about spending and the individual line items and suggest that those expenditures are the reason that we have a national debt at all and now the republicans are in power and in a position to all

of a sudden think, oh, maybe a private or military plane from new york to d.c. would be nice. the tables have kind of turned. >> this is why we have a problem with the government that does nothing. because the democrats don't mind spending money. they don't mind. i have to tell you, they don't mind spending money. it's a fact. republicans don't want to do anything like that. the people trust republicans usually are more tight-fisted than democrats. they think they are generally more tight-fisted. this isn't helping. >> that is not necessarily true. if you look at where the deficit explodes, chris, it explodes under republicans. >> it explodes when we have a recession. >> you can explain this because there's a busy schedule and they have a lot of places to go and it can be a pain to take commercial trouble. that being said, they don't like this wasted money from the taxpayers. >> trump doesn't like it. he better fire that guy's butt. he was caught on camera and knew the wrong position to be in would be to defend this guy. >> and this is a problem for

those cab sinet secretaries. trump doesn't have a lot of patience for these guys. bannon got way ahead of the president and he got fired. it wasn't just -- this doesn't just happen with president trump. it happens with a lot oftrump, h a lot of presidents. >> who is winning the fight, bannon or trump? >> right now it's bannon. >> thank you. bannon is beating trump. >> i think trump is still winning. >> are you a trumpster snow. >> i'm for the country doing better under this president. >> this is "hardball" where the action is. new roads and bridges. new mass transit. new business friendly environment. new lower taxes. and new university partnerships to grow the businesses of tomorrow today. learn more at esd.ny.gov

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we're back with the hardball round table. cornell, tell me something i don't know. >> a lot of data coming out particularly looking at minority voters. in 2008, 2012, the african me h african-american was most likely voter. there's a lot of questions in the party whether or not we're going to see a reversion back to pre-obama times with minority voting and youth voting. if so, it's a problem for the democrats. >> who gets the vote, elizabeth warren or bernie sanders. >> i think harris or booker. >> the new ones. >> yes. >> go ahead, betsy. >> this is the most dangerous week yet to be a white house senior staffer because there are reports that bob mueller and his team are going to question

president trump's inner circle this week or the coming weeks. and the reason that's dangerous, we can expect there to be an fbi agent in the room for those interviews which means any of these folks on mueller's list willfully mislead, it's a felony, against the law. >> marsha blackburn will replace bob corker in the senate. >> she'll run and win. >> protrump and proestablishment. >> that could be good for us all. when we return, let me finish tonight with trump watch. you won't like it. you're watching "hardball." (avo) when you have type 2 diabetes, you manage your a1c, but you also have a higher risk of heart attack or stroke. non-insulin victoza® lowers a1c,

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trump watch wednesday, september 27th, 2017. the donald trump driving the engine of this angry train or simply riding in the caboose. the answer came late last night from alabama. the voters down there just gave his candidate a whoopin'. why? for the same reasons they went for trump last year. they found someone running for office with the same anti-washington, waent establishment anti-the way things are brand and more so. roy moore is the judge that ignored the supreme court on every issue. the court wanted to ban the 10 commandments from his courthouse. no wonder someone said trump went to bed last night embarrassed and pissed. he had been outtrumped by someone les politically house trained than him. now even donald trump would run for office against sodomy.

but with the emergence of roy moore, donald j. trump has come face to face with an old test pt version of himself, a fire and brimstone preacher to match his reality tv number. that's hardball. thanks for being with us. all in with chris hayes starts right now. tonight on all in -- >> our rights don't come from the government. they come from all mighty god. >> insurrection in alabama as the president deletes tweets and gets bhiends roy moore. >> i'm very happy with him. >> can democrats prevend a senator roy moore? >> it's the lack of morality in our country that has led to these things. >> then -- >> when i first heard the president's comments, i was so enraged -- >> no concern over the trump response in puerto rico. >> a lot of people that work in the shipping industry that don't want the jones act lifted. >> and new