stephen paddock opened fire into a crowd of about 22,000 people at a music festival, killing at least 59 people and injuring more than 500 others. this video came in overnight of fbi agents searching the hotel room where paddock carried out the attack. we're told police recovered 23 guns from the room, including a handgun, ar-15 style assault rifles and rifles equipped with scopes. two of those were reportedly set up on tripods in front of the windows. also there, hundreds of rounds of ammunition. and another 19 firearms were recovered from the suspect's home in mesquite, nevada along with explosives and thousands of bullets. most of what we know about the shooter came from his brother who spoke several times yesterday. >> he's definitely only himself. there's no -- there's no

affiliations. once again that i know of at all. i mean there's no affiliations. there's no church. there's no religion. there's no politics. there's nothing. >> has he had any issues? >> no. no mental illness. i mean once again that i know of. >> from what i know, he was perfectly fine. he had substantial wealth. he was a multi-millionaire. he had multiple million dollars, okay. i mean our condolences to everyone. we just don't understand. like i said, an asteroid just fell out of the sky and we have no reason, rhyme, rationale, excuse. there's just nothing. nobody is ever going to say he was a normal guy.

okay. this was a single guy who gambled maybe more hours than you know gambles probably. but it was like a job to him. and i'm just going to say this -- i'm done. he was a -- he was a guy with his girlfriend who lived in the hotels for -- i mean he got comp to stay in the hotels. he gambled that much. he was a substantial gambler. >> was he violent. >> he has no history of violent if any shape or form. he's been divorced twice. he's good friends with both of his exes. >> so many questions this morning. and also just the country

reeling from the large scale of loss of life which really defies the mind because you even have, you know, some of our worse days in afghanistan that don't even reach these numbers. >> i don't think and alex correct me if i'm wrong here, built this was far deadlier than any day we had in either 16 years of war in afghanistan or 14 years of war in iraq. far deadlier than either of those two wars that have been going on -- together you had 30 killed in the 2011 afghanistan attack. 49 in the orlando. one day in iraq in 2005 i believe where 37 american troops were killed. but willie, this was far deadlier. and far more random.

david french wrote something in the national review yesterday. very careful up top saying he wasn't trying to push any conspiracy theories whatsoever, just trying to make sense of something that made no sense at all. he just said based on earlier reports of shooting in the las vegas it's bizarre. here's a guy who his brother said wasn't political, wasn't religious, liked to gamble, he had a lot of money, he flew planes. not a gun guy at all. and yet he had a stockpile of these guns. apparently no axe to grind. and i read report this guy even had gone to the music festival, liked country music. had gone to the same music festival. and so here america is trying to make sense of something that makes no sense, because after this happens we constantly look at someone who committed this action. now this guy, fill in the blank.

newtown. okay that kid fill in this blank. we try to quickly fill in the blanks here. this is no quick fills in of the blanks here. >> no. clint and i were talking a minute ago, this is a very difficult profile if you're the fbi trying to figure out. you can't find the steps normally you would find leading up to something like this. obviously carefully planned and orchestrated. when you talk about tripods being set up, cameras in the hallway, to detect whether or not the police were coming and how much time he still had to shoot, that's long premeditation and the guns were not bought in one fell swoop. they were purchased over time, littlely mostly. the gun dealers, certain number of weapons say they were sold to him legally. he passed back gound checks. he was a social check. he was an accountant. he was a realtor. he flipped apartments.

came into contact with the lot of people. this one i imagine your friend in the fbi are befuddled this morning. >> basically two categories you look for. technical indicator of the plot that's about to unfold and behavior indicators which gives you some sort of intelligence about what the situation s-what the motives are, why this person did it. you look across this, it's befuddling. you have the most highly sophisticated technical surveillance in las vegas. they did not pick up on anything in terms of preparation for this, moving weapons into the building. on the behavioral side usually you look for triggers. family, financial, professional, psychological triggers where they are preparing for death, preparing for suicide, getting angry at family members or co-workers. the only thing we know is this weak tie to his father's history on the most wanted list and that

doesn't seem to correspond with conducting an act of this nature. >> make barnacle, obviously this re-ignite the debate on guns but even before that, i've been hearing from my daughters, i've been hearing from young people, the country's sense of security again has been shattered in a way that it's making -- it's making it a lot like other countries where you live in a very insecure fashion, where you can't go to a concert now without thinking about something like this. how could we? >> well, no doubt, i would think, because most americans leading normal american lives are unlike anyone serving in public life in congress most americans realize a sad depressing truth. these killings will continue. they will not stop. somewhere out there today, in this country, there is someone who wants to top the number 59.

and they have the weaponry to do it. we are in the midst of madness and we are represented by a group of people in congress, not all of them, but enough of them who have over the years repeatedly made a conscious decision not to do anything to tighten existing gun laws to prevent guns meant for war and killing to be purchased by average americans. >> there is that. we don't know much about the guns yet given the story is so fresh. but my -- one of my children has been brought up in this culture where they get ready for school shootings and she recently had a shooter on campus and now it's become a part of our daily conversation. in your nairobi there was a vigil last night just because people needed to talk. >> yeah, there was. right now there's so many -- so

many things that seem to be coming at us every day. in such rapid succession. two days ago it was the tragedy of puerto rico that we thought we were going to be talking about all week. then this tragedy comes up. and there's a sense -- the pace quickens. and the chaos out of washington quickens. we have north korea. our children have north korea to worry about. we're still involved in active war. so at the vigil last night we all came together and i just said, i was explaining there -- there was an interfaith service and people just came together because -- >> what happened. >> they are scared. it seems this is a world out of

control. we have, for years, been going to places, telling people that everything was going to be okay, you know. if democrats get elected, you know, i usually call my mother, it's going to be okay. republicans are elected, i have to tell our friends on the upper west side we'll get through this. yesterday we said this to a group of people and i'm just getting a sense that they don't believe it any more that everything was going to be okay. it reminded of something that bobby kennedy said back in 1966 in south africa, where you feel helpless. you feel like you can't make a difference. and kennedy said back then he said there's a danger of futility to believe there's nothing that one man or one woman can do against the enormous array of the world's ills, against missery, against ignorance, against injustice and against violence.

bobby went on the say it's from numerous diverse acts of courage and belief that human history is shaped. each time a man stands up for an idea or strike out against injustice, sends forth a tiny ripple of hope and from million nexts of energy those ripples build a current which can sweep down the mightiest walls of oppression and resistance. and mike barnacle, bobby kennedy in 1966 was talking about the need for courage for those that were struggling under the continued weight of apartheid, a struggle that would go on for another 20 years. and kennedy himself showed courage going there when nobody wanted him there. certainly not the united states government. but it seems to me in 2017 what this country needs the most

right now, if we want to talk about resistance, it's courage to do the right thing when it comes to the issues. also courage to show kindness and even the smallest of action. we're a coarsened culture. we have an unkind leader whether you voted for him or not, whether you support him or not. most people will agree donald trump is not a kind man. he's a mean man. he's crude. he's brutal. he says horrible things. he's insulting. and it seems to me that with all of this anger and rage pouring at us, with all of this bad news coming at us every day, the most defiant thing we can do is show uncommon acts of kindness. to be kind when nobody is expecting it. that starts with me right here.

that starts with all of us right here because we have to give our children a reason to believe that things will get better and fight against all of the bad news that we're receiving. be defiant enough to show that it can happen. >> you know, joe, the cost of being kind, the cost of being thoughtful, the cost of being compassion to people who have been damaged or who are hurt or who are vulnerable against us is nothing. it costs nothing. what you participated in last night, unfortunately, is one of the things that this country is very practiced at. a moment of silence. a moment of mourning. tying yellow ribbons on a post for those lost in a war, for

those lost in our communities. but the common sense that's necessary to at least abate these mass killings does not exist because of the culture that we're a part of. i can guarantee you, we can all guarantee one another given twitter and facebook and instagram the grief, the shock, the mourning that we're all participating in right now will be gone by this weekend's pro football games. it will be gone. and the meanness and the contempt and the viciousness that you experience on twitter or instagram or whatever, that will re-ignite -- it's already re-igniting today, less than 48 hours after 59 cases of homicide are on the books of the las vegas police department. >> that's our challenge. willie, our challenge is when we're insulted, when we're attacked, when somebody says something vicious about someone we love, we have to turn the other cheek. we have no choice.

we really have no choice at this point in american culture in 2017. we can participate in that. we can feed into that. or we can be defiant and say enough is enough. >> yeah. and i think, unfortunately, what mike was describing started almost immediately yesterday. if you were online it's a familiar pattern now. there's a shooting where people are still dying. we're still count be bodies. there's a fight online and on tv about gun laws whether they should be stricter and whether gun laws would have stopped this particular shooter. how many times have we sat here? we've done this for ten years. how many times have we sat here whether it was a movie theater in colorado or an elementary school in newtown, connecticut or anything over the last couple of years we've seen in san bernardino and elsewhere, and we said something has got to change. something has to change. nothing has changed. the question is, in a country

where you have almost as many guns floating around as people, what could you do? is there a law that actually would have stopped this guy yesterday or if a criminal has it in his mind he's going to kill people because there's so many guns floating around would he get the guns anyway? is the horse out of the barn? are there too many guns anyway that a new law wouldn't stop somebody like him or the kid in newtown. >> what we have to be honest about -- certainly after newtown we talked about it. i'll put it on my shoulder. we talked about it nonstop for about six months for increased background checks needing to know why people needed to buy -- you can call them automatic weapons. people say automatic weapons have been banned. okay. then semiautomatic weapons. you're trying to take away my pistol. it's a circular, a game of semantics. but, clint, for those that would

resist any attempts to limit the madness of the proliferation of guns across this country, the one point they always seem to have on their side is -- well all the things you're asking for, joe, wouldn't have stopped newtown. all of the things you're asking for, joe, wouldn't have stopped las vegas. all the things you're asking, which i think in many cases they may have very good points. but you talk to any law enforcement officer, you talk to bill bratton, you talk to people that we praise every day for keeping us safe, they all say there's no reason americans should have military style weapons in their possession. no reason whatsoever. and after newtown i had several

pretty tough debates with some very good friends and at the end of the day there's only one reason for somebody to have these weapons in their hands. only one reason. and it's only one. they will not say it. in a radio today or a tv debate. it's because they think the government is coming to get them and they want to have a stockpile of weapons and so it's to kill american soldiers or members of the american government. there are some people that just like collecting and shooting. fine. you can do what other countries do, register them and put them, you know, in the gun clubs where they stay there. >> right. >> but why do we have a group of laws that a guy can have 20 weapons, 25 weapons like this and literally kill just -- go

hunting for human beings like he did a couple of nights ago. >> we're the only country that legislates that the offender has the offense over police and law enforcement. we're talking about silencer right now being put -- >> talking about doing that this week. >> thousands of people -- >> which would make it even more difficult to figure out where the mass murderer is firing from. >> yes. these are offensive weapons. one of the strangest things for me having come from the military -- we carried around weapons with weapon safety training for weeks. we weren't allowed to carry ammunition with our weapons. you can buy that exact same weapon i was trained on and the ammunition at any time. any time you want. you can deploy it in any way you want. no coincidence when we look at the death toll of orlando, las vegas, when you see what terrorists do when they get these weapons in their hand this escalation over the past two,

three years continues to climb. there's nothing that will change that. >> and remember, mika, terrorists on the most wanted list have actually had videos done in the past. we talked about this after newtown. saying if you're in america, here what you do. go to a gun show and you can easily buy these weapons and use them against americans. it's the most efficient way to go out and hunt down and kill americans. >> it's crazy. it's absolutely crazy. >> one final point, dow jones checked it yesterday, gun stocks soared. >> of course. let's get the latest from las vegas joining us from las vegas chris jansing. are police saying anything at this point about a motive. >> reporter: they had a late night news current. they said that's the focus of their investigation. every where you go people are

asking the question why. there are no good answers. when you look at what we know about shooters in modern history of these mass events, you don't see anything like what we've seen before. police denying in that late night news current that he had any relationship to isis, even though the organization said that this was not san bernardino. there were no political views as his brother said. this was not charlestown where you had a white supremacist. this was not a case in virginia as we saw with steve scalise where the shooter was targeting republicans. in tucson you had a caves mental illness. there was no history for him of that. and at least right now even though they went to his house in mesquite and, obviously, have collected items there including presumably his personal computer, no writings like we saw in columbine to help explain what he did.

the only anomaly in his background besides earning his living as a gambler was his father was a bank robber. escaped from prison. he and his family raised by their mom, they moved around from place to place. butts again, his brother said yesterday he was the least angry member of the family about what had happened to them. he was known here along the las vegas strip. we now know from police last night that he brought at least ten suitcases into the mandalay bay behind me. when light comes you can see those two windows that he knocked out where he set those tripods and opened fire on that crowd of people at the harvest festival. the guns bought, as you said, seem to be mostly legally although those around him didn't know he had an obsession of guns. one more thing it may be that it could have possibly been worse. in that secarch of his home in

addition to more guns and dozens of rounds of ammo they found explosive. when they searched his vehicle they found ammonia nitrate which is a key ingredient in home made bombs. this morning las vegas as it wakes up will still see the streets behind me outside of mandalay bay closed. many of the casinos seem to be operating as usual from our check early this morning. but the question, the overriding question joe and mika of why still has no answer. >> msnbc's chris jansing. thank you very much. >> we have to close this out because we have talked some about policy here, which it's so interesting. i was trying to stay afoot as much as possible yesterday as people were talking about this. it does, it brings the worse out of people. but i did pick up -- oh, you can talk about guns right now. like saying you can't talk about climate change when we have 87

hurricanes coming back-to-back. we can have the debate. i may not agree with you. but we can at least talk about it. but i just -- for people at home, i just want to put this in proper context. just because something is the louder screamer in a debate done mean they are right. chances are good if they are screaming in this debate they are in the minority. after newtown we talked about increased background checks. nine out of ten americans -- nine out of ten americans support background checks, enhanced background checks. was it done here? i don't know. maybe, maybe not. would make america a safer place. might keep hands out of -- guns out of the hand of people that abuse their spouses, might keep guns out of the hands of people that abuse their children, might keep the guns out of the hand of terrorists. certainly something that law enforcement officers, the cop that protects you wants.

six out of ten americans according to a poll that was taken in middle of last year's campaign, six in ten americans support a ban on assault style weapons. that's the majority. now people are going to say they are coming to take guns. no, actually that's not the case. mike barnacle, might be for more extensive gun control. maybe mika is less than me. there was a case in 2008 that finally said the second amendment means what the second amendment means which is that americans have a right to keep and bear arms. it's not about militias. it's about you having the right to have a gun in your home to protect yourself. right? it's not about having an arsenal, though. and even scalia, even scalia, even this conservative court

said that second amendment right only extended to hand guns. if other states want to limit the rights of people to have assault style weapons or to have clips that you can go out and kill 50, you know, 59 people, you know, just by firing guns in a crowd and continuing, well states have a right to regulate that if they choose to do so. connecticut certainly has. other states certainly have. but the thing is, people screaming today, they are in the minority. the nra, in the minority on these issues. even the overwhelming majority of republicans support sensible gun safety laws. even the majority of nra members support sensible gun safety

laws. increased background checks. to make sure that the people that have guns are well enough to have those guns and don't have the background that could lead to another las vegas or another orlando or another newtown. and yet you have the nra fighting what we all want, what most of us want and you have republicans in congress cow touting to this special interest group. at some point they have to stop. at some point they just got say enough. at some point they just have to say, really? me getting re-elected is not worth my children living in a culture where they go to bed at night afraid that tomorrow might be the day that they get shot

down and if you don't think your children aren't filled with that fear you need to spend more time at home talking to your children because they all are. we'll be right back. in its economy, in medicine, in science and in national security. one company designs and builds more supercomputers than any other. an american company. hewlett packard enterprise. leading the way to discover... to innovate... and to protect. hewlett packard enterprise. a national asset in supercomputing. my "business" was going nowhere... so i built this kickin' new website with godaddy. building a website in under an hour is easy! 68% of people...

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xfinity mobile. it's a new kind of network designed to save you money. call, visit, or go to xfinitymobile.com. our community cannot be shattered by evil. our bonds cannot be broken by violence. though we feel such great anger at the senseless murder of our fellow citizens, it is our love that defines us today. and always will. forever. >> the police department has done such a fantastic job in terms of the speed and we all very much appreciate it. so we'll be going to puerto rico tomorrow and on wednesday we will be going to, as you know, as i just said, we'll be going to las vegas on a very, very sad -- very sad moment for me, for everybody.

for everybody, no matter where you are, no matter what your thought process is, this is a very, very sad day. so we're going to be doing that on wednesday. and we'll be spending a full day there and maybe longer than that. so thank you very much, everybody. appreciate it. thank you. thank you very much. >> a lot of bad news coming in. of course the president there talk about puerto rico as well as what happened in las vegas. also, willie, bad news in the music world. really bad news. tom petty passed away yesterday. >> yeah. played a show just a few nights ago out in l.a. went into cardiac arrest at his home on sun night and then died yesterday. just another bit of stunning news on an already horrific day. huge fan of his. i came into tom petty, i was 7 years old in 1982 when the you got lucky video came on mtv.

it was bizarre. the song was good. he was actually an innovator with videos. early rock and roll mtv guy and follow him through -- people talk about free falling. he went for 40 years relentlessly making hits and never compromising as a rock star. never went pop but his songs broke through on the charts and just one of the most unique and original voices ever in american rock and roll. >> gainesville, florida guy. mike barnacle, he was never in better uniform than when he put on the hat for the mad hatter, "alice in wonderland". tom petty, he seemed to be two things at once. a straightforward rock and roll guy. just pure flat out rock and roll guy. >> gainesville, florida. >> gainesville, florida. great songwriter, great performer. also, again, sort of that strangeness, that uniqueness

that makes great rock stars great rock stars. >> used to be chalk lines on the football field. there's a weird confluence of events, synergy, i don't know what it was. i spend most of the weekend when i was in the car listening to the tom petty channel on sirius xm radio. it reminded me once again that millions of artists that are out there. millions of rock and rollers and singers, tom petty, you listened to everything -- you listened to the whole song. you wouldn't change -- you just listened to all of it. incredible writer of sons. incredible performer. but bizarre that he would die this way. >> let's get back to the two major challenges for the president who goes las vegas tomorrow. after touring puerto rico today, joining us now from washington senior political analyst for nbc news and msnbc, mark hall persoperso --

halpern. in guess he's getting the message on puerto rico. there's a lot of criticism that this president for many different ways handled puerto rico horribly. >> reporter: well first of all to join everybody's voices in grieving for what happened not just in las vegas and puerto rico but the country as a whole to try to deal with these things. the president in both these case traveling for the next two days. three-part challenge. short term of addressing the country and trying to hold us together. i thought his statement yesterday was pretty dignified and the tone was right. medium term he needs go to these places and make sure the federal response is what it needs to be. in puerto rico people of puerto rico, to a large extent have questioned whether the federal response has been enough and he needs to oversee that in a very hands on way. like he's the mayor of a small town. make sure it's happening. longer term particularly with las vegas are there things that the government should be doing to try to protect the american

people. those are big challenges. they are detail oriented things. they are performance thing. they are tonal things. not all of these have been the president's strength to say the least. these are two very big days not just for him but the country. jeb bush called him a chaotic country. these are chaotic times for our country. the symbolism of his leadership. >> i always ask this question just because the temperature changes daily inside the white house. what's the current weather report inside the white house? this is a president faced with a multitude of crises. some of the most difficult in some time with north korea, puerto rico, and the slate of other crises coming in his inbox and yet his weekend was, i think

is as chaotic on twitter as it's ever been after, again, more discussions about whether he's going to make the turn, whether he's going to make the pivot. we always say he's three hours away from a bad tweet. he had a number of tweet storms this weekend, which were unconscionable. >> lashing out at the mayor of san juan, puerto rico from his country club in new jersey. >> while he was golfing and the mayor of san juan, puerto rico was up to her neck in water and god knows what else trying to help the people on that island who are american citizens he was attacking. then when that went terribly bad for him, he then once again started to try to gin up racial issues talking about the flag and nfl. it's as bad a weekend as this

president has had certainly on twitter. can you give us any insight, anything you're hearing from inside the white house? >> general kelly. >> reporter: there's always been a little bit of a tale of two reality, the twitter feed and then everything else that's going on in the president's orbit and i think you're seeing that right now in a large way because the twitter stuff takes him off track, creates diversions, creates controversies, and yet i've been struck in the last probably five days, i guess, at how clearly general kelly and the white house operation recognizes that as much as they have incoming on many front that they really need to be -- the apparatus of the white house focused first on dealing with puerto rico from a substantive and political point of view and now on las vegas. it was clear -- i was over there briefly yesterday. it was year that the to can you of the white house is very much on we need to clear away any distraction from dealing with

this incredible tragedy in one of america's great cities. >> when you went to the white house yesterday, at least the operations of the white house, general kelly, all the president's men and women, you say right now are focused on puerto rico. >> reporter: and on las vegas. >> of course. >> reporter: and that doesn't preclude the reality that, as we sit here this morning the president can start tweeting about other things, controversies and what many would look like as distractions over puerto rico the tweets over the weekend to say the least but also other topics. that's the reality of how he operates in his twitter and box world, again, if you're looking for a silver lining in that, it seems like the government can do some things that are required even in the wake of the leader of government tweeting in ways that are off message and more than distractions, they divide

the country at a time and in the face of these two twin tragedies when, again, the president needs to step up. >> and bring people together. coming up there's new reporting on the las vegas massacre which may answer how the gunman was able to fire so many bullets so quickly. that's straight ahead on "morning joe". i can't wait for her to have that college experience that i had. the classes, the friends, the independence. and since we planned for it, that student debt is the one experience, i'm glad she'll miss when you have the right financial advisor, life can be brilliant.

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washington intelligence and national security reporter for nbc news and investigative unit, ken delaney. good morning. there's a lot of questions over the last 24 hours or so whether this was a fully automatic weapon or perhaps a semiautomatic weapon that was adapted by the shooter to make it into a fully automatic weapon. what more can you tell us about that this morning? >> good morning. we still don't have an official answer to that question but what we have is some reporting from the associated press overnight that says authorities found two bump stock devices in the hotel room and what those are modifications, legal modifications that allow a semiautomatic rifle to fire at a rapid rate. >> those things only cost -- you can get those things for 40 or 50 bucks, right? >> exactly. and the reason they've been deemed not an illegal machine

gun, joe, is because they actually basically allow the shooter to depress the trigger at a rapid rate using the recoil of the rifle. they don't meet the legal definition of a machine gun. go on youtube and look at videos they fire like a machine gun and could explain the rapid rate of fire we heard and saw in those disturbing videos. doesn't, of course, rule out that he had an illegal machine guns. machine guns have been banned since 1986. you can buy a grandfathered one. they exist. they are expensive and rare. register with the government and buy one. in nevada her legal. these bump stocks are a suggestive piece of the puzzle here. it's a puzzle that really when we look at this shooter, stephen paddock, there isn't exactly a profile of mass shooter but to the extent there is one he doesn't fit it. he's living an anomalous life here. this man whose family said is worth up to $2 million.

high stakes gambler. appears to be making a living as a gambler. he's 64 years old. lived in a retirement community with his companion. he's a college graduate. there's no record of criminality or of extremism. there's this flag in his background that his father was a bank robber who was once called a psychopath. other than that we don't have anything going his state of mind. that's the big missing piece here and presumably authorities will try to develop that as they look at his computers and social media. >> inning his father was a bank robber. not clear it's relevant in any way. does this new report from ap jive with what you've been hearing about perhaps being a modified, fully automatic weapon because it's so difficult now to legally get yourself a pre-1986 very expensive and very onerous process to get a fully automatic weapon. >> that's correct. i think that makes complete sense. even when you hear the cycle of which that is firing, it's not

what you typically a machine gun is firing quicker and at a higher pitch. this makes sense. i mean what you've seen pretty consistently any time there's a control put on fully automatic weapons you're seeing these off the shelf modifications to enable information have this function. again it comes back to what are the policies and regulation we want in this country. this is an easy solution to just return to fully automatic weapons is it about the intent we want to control fully automatic weapons or is it about the equipment. again there's a lot more that can to be done pinpoint shows how a $50 modification what might be a $500 weapon can turn into a mass killing device. >> ken, it would be so unusual as you had said if this were fully automatic weapon and we talked about, i guess, 1934 was when the law came into effect.

and i think charles cook at the national review yesterday said that there have only been three crimes committed, three crimes committed with a fully automatic weapon since 1934. so, again, another example. if this is one. we don't know yet. but if this is, was a fully automatic weapon that he was using -- again points to just how strange and how unusual this crime was yesterday. two days ago. >> yeah, absolutely. and, you know, if any shooter who is able to acquire a fully automatic equipment was this guy. he had the resources. they upped the total to 42 guns. those guns cost hundreds or more than thousand dollars. this was an expensive arsenal this man put together. there are shooting ranges in las vegas where can you go now and shoot a fully automatic weapon. as you said they are rare and tough to get and you have to register and this bump stock

alternative seems to have been a much easier thing for him to accomplish. >> by the way, one thing we haven't brought up and we need to almost 15 minutes in. there's been weekends in in chicago where 50 people have been shot. right? i mean, this happens every day in chicago. worth pointing out. >> with strict gun laws. >> yeah. with strict gun laws, but, again, with a gang situation out there that we are talking about our children being scared to go to school, scared to go to concerts. if you're a child in chicago, you walking to school every day is a reason to fear if you're a parent there, you've got to be afraid when you put your baby down at night that you can put your baby down and bullets can come into your home. this is -- this -- we're talking

about this today. this happens every day in chicago. >> over 50 people aren't killed every day in chicago, but to get numbers, i believe this past weekend 32 people were shot, four were killed. it is a part of daily life in chicago. >> this past weekend in chicago, 32 people shot. >> there's a very significant difference, though, between chicago and las vegas, and it begins with motive. in chicago there's motive for nearly every shooting. it's a pair of sneakers. you snitched. you were seen talking to this girl. you're on the wrong street, you crossed the territory. it's gangs. it's the access to handguns. you can actually rent a handgun if you're in one gang. i need a gun tonight, i'll give you 25. las vegas, there's no motive here. it's a mystery. there's no digital trail. >> but you know what? on both sides, you're talking

about how basically alluding to the insanity of gun laws that allow this to continue from orlando to las vegas, i agree completely, but again, why isn't there more of a resolve to not only take care of this. why isn't there more of a resolve to take care of what's happening in chicago. we've done it in new york, and by the way, anybody walking around new york in the 1970s and 1980s know what a remarkable turn around giuliani and bloomberg and de blasio has continued. what a remarkable turn around that has been. >> nbc ken, thank you very much. up next, we'll speak with congressman jim himes who says until they do something about gun violence, members of congress have blood on their hands. kevin, meet your father.

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does anybody actually believe that our gun laws are

too strong? give me a break. action to save lives is the only acceptable moral course for our country. without action, we are asking one person to be the next person to die because of our weakness to address evil. and then another and then another and then another. >> the nation's counting on you. >> all right. that was former congresswoman gabrielle giffordss and her husband mark kelley yesterday calling on congress to enact stricter dwgun laws. joining us from capitol hill, jim himes of connecticut. you've had some strong words about members of congress having blood on their hands if we can't get something done here.

having said that, there's still so much to learn about what happened in las vegas, the types of weapons used, how he got them, where they came from. should we wait until we know exactly what we're talking about, or what's it going to take? >> mika, waiting is one of the many tools that the folks who would have us do absolutely nothing on gun safety employ. they say it's too soon. it's too soon to politicize and act. i don't remember after 9/11 when people flew airplanes have buildings, i don't remember thinking what we need to do is wait and not take action. on hurricanes, we don't wait and not take action. and it's not like we need to know a whole lot more than we already know. we could in this buildings, and this is why i get so angry at the united states congress. i'm standing in the one building in america where with one hour of hard work we could pass a couple of bills that could be consistent with second amendment rights and consistent with what

we're supposed to do which is represent the will of the people, things like universal background check, limiting the kind of weapons people can have. we could pass those bills today, and we would reduce the carnage. last night instead we stopped talking about sports and dinner and had 20 seconds of silence. we do nothing when we could save lives. >> let me ask. after newtown, we on this program talked for a long time about the need for expanded background checks, talked about the need of limiting the ability for people to get ahold of assault style weapons. it seems in many of these cases, like, for instance, background checks. background checks as muff as i support them and 90% of americans support them, wouldn't have stopped what happened yesterday, and wouldn't have stopped what happened in newtown. so what do you say to your

political foes on this issue when you say you want increased background checks, but that wouldn't have stopped las vegas or newtown? >> and joe, i'd say that may be true, and i would say that's the other tool that people use when they try to stop any action. we will never stop gun violence in the country any more than we'll stop any other kind of violence in the country or any more than sweden or norway or great britain can stop gun violence. if he passed universal background check supported by some 90% of the american people, violence would go down. las vegas is a fantastic example as the kind of thing that makes the papers. but as you know every single day in this country, there are almost two las vegass. 90 people who died, two-thirds of whom die because of decide, because there's a gun improperly stored in the house. we could do something about it. >> congressman, we were just talking about chicago and what's

happened in chicago over the past several years. you can also talk about mass shootings. in america there's practically a mass shooting every day if you look at the statistics. it's wildly out of control. the question is what legislation can we pass that will have a substantial impact on that because you look at chicago, willie as you brought up before, chicago has pretty stringent gun control laws. >> yeah. i get that, joe. chicago is the other thing we talk about when the question is how do we reduce this? there is no silver bullet here. but there are three or four pieces of legislation that would reduce the number of guns on the street that would reduce the ability of people with violent pasts to acquire weapons. let's get beyond law. i happen to believe there are probably a half dozen things we can do that are consistent with second amendment rights. what about storage and fewer

firearms being stolen and rented out by gangs. there are lots of things we could go to bring our mortality more in line with the rest of the civilized world. we're not even interested in talking about them because this particular proposal wouldn't have solved that problem or because chicago has a big problem. the question this building needs to answer and the people like me need to answer is there are things we could do. why don't we do them? >> totally agree. it is just past the top of the hour right now. we're speaking with congressman jim himes of connecticut. also with us, mike barnicle. former fbi special agent and msnbc contribute clint watts. senior political analyst for nbc news, mark halperin, and also columnist for the wall street journal and political contributor for nbc news, peggy nunen. >> peggy, the supreme court is hearing a case today. i've been waiting for this case to be heard for some time.

i think it's one of the most important political cases the supreme court has heard in a long time. it feeds into this discussion. and that is they're going to be hearing arguments on gerrymandering. and i think in part, if people want to understand why the gun control debate is so extreme in the house of representatives especially, all they have to do is look and see how those districts have been carved up, and it doesn't matter whether 90% of americans want increased background checks to keep guns out of the hands of terrorists, in these carved out districts. enough of the vocal constituents are powerful enough that members fear their votes in primaries in a lot more than they fear the nra not giving them 5,000 or

$10,000. >> yeah, and you have seen how some of those congressional districts are shaped and arranged state by state. really weird configurations. certain voting blocks are doing certain things. it creates a certain political stay sis so most incumbents feel safe. i'm glad it's being discussed. i have no insight over whether this is a federal or state matter, but certainly, it's been on the minds of many people. it does keep things frozen. it almost makes you think of the word cartel as if each of the parties has a certain cartel. let me just throw in, though, joe, i have obviously as a citizen who loves america, i have complete sympathy for and for everybody who is extremely

upset, everybody coming forward with ideas, i never think it's the wrong time to talk about gun control. i always think it's a fine time. >> if not now, when? >> that having been said, we've all been through this so many times. i'm starting to think that there are some problems that cannot be solved. they can be managed. and i think what we've been going through with all of this gun violence the past few decades is something we can manage better. my own thing, very much on my heart the past few year is please, we need more mental health services. the man who did the shooting in vegas doesn't fit the normal demographic. normally it is young men who are unstable who have been veering toward violence and acting odd for a long time. neighbors say he stuck to himself, he was this, he was that. there are untreated mentally ill people in america who need more

intervention about whom nothing can be done until they hurt someone. that's my contribution for today. >> and all the people said, amen. >> yeah. >> we certainly agree with that. >> congressman himes, it's willie geist. i want to ask you to get specific. these are all different, these cases from newtown to orlando to congressman and scalise and your colleagues being shot in a baseball field in virginia earlier this year. let's talk about the one in front of us because it just happened. what is the specific law, you think, in an ideal world, the congress there, where you're standing could pass that would have stopped what we saw. this man passed background checks. he didn't fit that mental illness profile from what we know right now. so what would you recommend in terms of legislation that could have stopped this shooter? i think you do have to be specific if you want to be constructive about what to do to stop these. >> yeah.

and look, it's a fair question, but i don't want the point to drift away from the fact that if we just focus on what would have stopped this particular shooter which was an incident which was pretty different from the gun violence that takes 90 lives every single day, two-thirds of those deaths being suicides, we can get distracted. let's say there are things we need to do to stop that kind of thing and things to do in chicago and there's mental health and other things. look, this is a weird case, because we don't -- it's hard for us to understand. if this guy had been a muslim radical, we'd know how to think about it. if it was a deeply disturbed individual, wooerd know how to think about it. we don't know how to think about this. he appears to have have had something like three dozen guns, some of which were modifiable to wreak the kind of havoc marines have on an enemy beach.

we ought to look at the fact that it appears american citizens can buy dozens and dozens of weapons. >> some of which are military. >> i can focus on this incident. can i help you out here, how? and ask why a guy has three dozen guns that are suitable for -- >> an arsenal. >> suitable for running on the beaches of normandy and shooting nazis. don't talk to politicians. talk to any law enforcement officer in america who is responsible for protecting you, your family, my family, the families of chicago in this country, and ask those law enforcement officers whether they think that guy or any civilian should even have one. they will tell you. bratton will tell you no. right? >> yes.

>> no. >> and congressman, that's what i meant by getting specific. are you talking about a ban on semi automatic rifles, for example? >> yes. i think joe is absolutely right. i think he's right in how law enforcement thinking about this. law enforcement is sometimes on the opposite end of the weaponry that should be in the hands of the military. i understand this is tough. how do you define an assault rifle. i get that. it's hard. >> let me stop you there. it is tough, and the gun lobby will always go there. no matter what you say, ban assault rifles, okay, ban semi automatic weapons. they say now you're trying to take my pistol. keep it simple. if a civilian has a weapon that can shoot through police armor, go through the policeman's body, go through another person's body and kill both of them at the same time, i think maybe we can

define that as something that civilians don't need. >> that's a good start. >> and let them define their way around that one, or if the house gets their way, and they try to make silencers this week, if they try to make those more readily available for civilians, so police officers didn't know where the shooting was coming from -- >> are we really talking about this? >> is that something that americans need in. >> there's no way. >> and congressman, let's go to the human nature aspect of this. how do you feel as a resident of connecticut who live less than 25 miles from newtown? how do you feel about mingling with everybody day, slapping them on the back, smiling and saying hello everyday to people in the house of representatives who have over the years repeatedly made a deliberate decision to vote to do nothing

to stop the transportation of rifles meant for mass killings to legislate common sense things, to try to prevent or dwindle the number of mass killings. how do you feel about hanging around with them? >> well, i've been clear on my feelings. i said after orlando i'm not participating in moments of silence in rooms where you could fix the problems. but it's worse than that. right now somewhere in this building the leadership is trying to figure out what the decent interval of time is between the horrific murders and when they can bring forward the bill joe is making reference to that makes it easier for people to get silencers. so answer the question, i need to work with them and i want to do that and that's my job. but the american people need to start holding their representatives accountable for not doing a couple of the things we know have massive support in this country. >> congressman, thank you for

being with us. at this point i feel like i have to make my regular disclaimer. i'm a second amendment guy. i believe heller was passed properly. there are quite a few people in this audience that disagree with me. i think the second amendment means what it means. americans have a right to keep and bear arms, to have weapons in their home and be able to protect their families. i don't think it means what liberals think it means. it means you have a right to keep and bear arms, but i also believe it's the weapons are not needed. after newtown so many of my friends from northwest florida, so many people who voted for me members of the nra said i just don't need those weapons to go out and kill deer. you know why you need those weapons? you kill humans. that's what they're used for. >> how do you convince the outliers that -- >> what do you mean?

90% of americans agree with me. rond reagan agreed with my position. not only on this. george w. bush agreed with this position. ronald reagan believed assault weapons should be banned. george w. bush believed assault weapons could be banned. the extreme. this is 10% of the population. >> how do you convince them in the congress and the house and senate if you like your gun, you can keep your gun, it's okay, but you're going to stop buying the ar 15s? >> i would never say if you like your gun, you can keep your gun, because then they'd go, oh, barack obama. >> that's what they're referring to. >> let's be honest about this. i don't know if you agree with this or not, peggy. bill o'reilly tweeted yesterday this is the price of freedom. nope. actually, i have seen it firsthand. kpi campaigning. i've seen it firsthand. you've probably seen it

firsthand as well. there's a sense of paranoia that's ginned up by the nra to say they're coming to get your guns. and it's been that way -- back in 1994 people would say they were going to come get my guns and pry them out of my cold, dead hands. i said listen, i'll tell you what. they're not going to come get your guns. your cold dead hands, you can just shake them out. you're going to be fine. >> i would let me throw out a question. how many americans have -- we know there's just about one gun for every american in 2009 when the population was 310 million. we had that many guns. how many americans have ak-47 like assault rifle like repeat guns, i'm sorry, i forget the

phrase, semi automatic and automatic? how many have them and why? what is -- what are they afraid of? i don't think we can so easily say they just want them to kill other americans. most of them don't. >> last hour i can tell you -- >> there's a reason. tell me. >> whenever i get into these debates after newtown with my second amendment friends, people who had been on the same side of me fighting, so the second amendment would mean what it means, you would just keep pushing. what do you need them for? >> why do you want them? >> because they need them in case the government comes. and they think that they'll have to use them to protect themselves against government. to which i said to one person, i said my friend, let me tell you. let's just break this down. he finally admitted. he was the first. i said let me break this down for you. if that day comes, they're not going to knock on your door.

they're going to put a drone over your head, and it's going to float there for three days, and then they're going to give you three or four days to let your children, your wife come out. >> i have these conversations too. >> and then you come out with your weapon, your air 15, aim it up at the drone. they'll melt you. this is the lunacy of it. now, if the federal government wants to get you, the federal government is going to get you, your little gun is not going to do anything. >> my sense of it is, i don't hear that so much, but what i do hear is there is a sense that society is collapsing. the culture is collapsing. we're collapsing in crime. the world is collapsing. crazy people with bad haircuts have nukes informal everything is going bad. terrorism, et cetera. they want to be fully armed on their hill at home. and you can say the same thing you do, but you'll lose. but they're americans and they

want to go down fighting. >> i hear that too. they want it for the apocalypse. they want it so when people come to get their food supplies. >> for when the grid goes down. not to turn dire in the middle of the morning but they're frightened. >> what are they fed? look to our politics over the last three decades. it's the politics of fear. not the politics of hope. you grow your candidacy on fear. >> and survival. >> be afraid of the immigrants, the gay, the culture being stripped from you. someone is always out there lurking to take something from you, defend yourself. >> and following up on what peggy said, maybe peggy -- >> which brought us trump. >> a lot of things brought us tru trump. >> maybe this is the net result of people growing up over the past 17 years and seeing one failure after the other. 1999 impeachment.

2000. the recount where we can't even elect a president the right way. 2001, 9/11 and not getting that right. 2002 wmds. 2003 iraq. 2005 katrina. 2006 the meltdown in iraq. 2008 the meltdown of the stock market. i could continue. i don't need to. where confidence in this government has been shattered and perhaps that's what leads to the paranoia you're talking act. they're not going to protect me. i have to defend myself and my family. >> yeah, and you can add society things like our families collapse. there are drugs around. i am a man and i can't find a job to support my family. there's all sorts of stuff that i think is royaling us. a generalized fear that you see some other countries gloat about that maybe america is on the way down, not the way up.

when people are thinking that, they are americans. we grew up in a certain culture. they will gun up. >> the place in the world has been lost. >> i think a lot about the reasons for these things. >> i think for bill o'reilly, there is no freedom in fear. that's where this turns and they've pushed this fear agenda to a point that people are paralyzed to go out of their house. they're paralyzed to get on the internet. >> that's the price of freedom? great. >> if that's the price of freedom, we have nothing. >> and glenn beck used to sell survival cds. we joked about it -- >> funny, but it's not. >> survival seeds. >> this has been fed to a group of americans now for 30 years. >> yeah. and definitely for a good decade. >> these are the costs. i'm not saying what happened yesterday was the cost. we're talking about the culture in general, why are people running out and buying these guns. >> joining us now from

washington, pete williams. pete, where do we stand in the investigation into las vegas? >> we know a lot about what happened, but we don't know why. invest g investigators say they have found nothing to suggest why he went to the hotel. they searched his house in mesquite, nevada. they say that didn't turn up any notes or e-mails or social media postings. nothing to indicate how long ago he developed this plan. they did find more guns in his house. he owned more than 40 weapons. and they did find a substance that's used for making exploding targets for gun practice but no clues about motive. several gun stores in the region in nevada and other states say he bought handguns and rifles over the past several months, but they and the federal agents say the sales were legal. one question is how did he modify the weapons to make them shoot automatically? authorities have said his

live-in girlfriend, marilou danley, the one yesterday they said they were eager to find. she was out of the country but they want to talk to her. they want to know if she had any idea of what he was up to or if she did anything to help him prepare. >> investigators are looking at three main avenues. when and where did they get the guns? were they modified? secondly was he in touch with or inspired by somebody else? isis claimed he was part of the caliphate and did this for them. but authorities say there's no evidence of that. and finally, did all of his gambling bring on serious financial trouble, serious enough to make him think maybe that he should take it out on las vegas? so still no answers to why. >> pete, we've sat with you through many of these mornings. can you speak to how unusual it is at this phase of the investigation not really to have any clue as to a motive. often we're used to immediately

after a shooting you go to a facebook page or twitter handle and see the story played out for you. we don't see this often where even fbi people, people we talk to off the record are still searching for answers. >> we don't have anything he himself apparently said or left behind or wanted to have come out. secondly, we don't have anybody saying, yeah, you know, now that i look back, he did seem kind of suspicious. we don't hear that from relatives or neighbors or his former employers. nobody said, you know, this guy had really short fuse. none of that. we don't see any obvious signs he was preparing for it. we don't find anything, and of course, then there's just the sort of if you will, demographic facts. he's older than the normal mass shooter. he's well off. his brother said a multimillionaire. now, i think one question is they're going to take a serious look at his finances. he did seem to have a lot of

money, but suddenly did he lose a lot of money? was he thinking that there's some financial problems he was having? a lot of questions, but you're right, willie, normally at this point we at least are pointed in some direction and we're not here. >> nbc's pete williams, thank you. ahead, remembering the victims. 59 people lost their lives at a music concert, and they will not be forgotten. we're going to hear some of their stories straight ahead on "morning joe." we'll be right back. you nervous? ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

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throughout history, the one meal when we come together, break bread, share our day and connect as a family. [ bloop, clicking ] and connect, as a family. just, uh one second voice guy. [ bloop ] huh? hey? i paused it. bam, family time. so how is everyone? find your awesome with xfinity xfi and change the way you wifi. the las vegas shooting is now the deadliest mass shooting in american history surpassing the 49 killed just over a year ago in the pulse nightclub attack in orlando. it's also more than the total amount killed in virginia tech and sandy hook elementary school shootings impieb combined. sunday night's shooter was

deadlier than the deadliest single day for americans in the afghanistan war. 30 afghans and a working dog died in to 11. t deadlier than any day for americans during operation iraqi freedom. in 200537 u.s. troops were killed during a single day. 31 in a helicopter crash and six in combat. the 527 wounded on sunday is also far and away the highest for a mass shooting. and more than total service members wounded in desert shield and desert storm. and for some perspective, about 680 were injured in the oklahoma city bombing. from 1968 to 2015 more than 1.5 americans were killed in firearm

deat deaths. this is more than americans killed in the revolutionary war, the civil war, and all the wars. joining us now, tom brokaw. where do we begin with this conversation about guns? you wanted to bring up two points. >> i'm not encouraged it's going to take it to a new and what we hope would be a more practical level in this country. today there will be a run on guns across america. everybody selling guns, cabelas or a local shop in a community in the west, they'll be selling out a lot of weapons and ammunition as well. >> mike said the stocks went up yesterday. >> yeah. because people think they're going to crack down on us. and the fact of the matter is the nra has gone dark for the moment. but they were involved in trying to get silencers approved for weapons. if there was a silencer on that

weapon, people wouldn't have been aware right away about what was happening. >> if there were a silencer on the weapons used in las vegas, can you imagine into a crowd of 22,000 people? >> what's the purpose of a silencer on an automatic weapon? >> so you don't know where the bullets are coming from? >> they call it suppressers. >> the silencers don't -- >> but they muffle it. >> they muffle it. and what's happened in this country with guns is that we've gone from when i grew up and i still have, my father's 3030 which is an old weapon, and i have a .223 remming ton as well. i have a lot of shotguns, but let me show you what's advertised on the big gun stores in america. this is cabelas we have. that's what you see. they're pushing that very hard. every page about guns on cabelas has a military style weapon of one kind or another. one after another. and they're expensive.

but at the same time the people who buy those weapons many of them are kind of gun smiths. so they put them back in their original military form without too much trouble. joe and i were talking about this earlier. you could get a kind of automatic trig tore put on the ar-15, and you can't trigger it very fast, but the mechanical one can make it fully auto. these are the issues we have to be dealing with, quite honestly, there's an enormous economic boost going on here for people with gun shops and people who want to have the guns they have and the nra, obviously, is one of the most effective political lobbying organizations in america however you feel about what their final result is. >> peggy, last night i was at a vigil in new canaan, connecticut. and it wasn't just about what

happened in las vegas. it was about what happened in puerto rico. what's happening in puerto rico. houston. florida. bad news seems to be coming at us at a faster clip than ever, and if there's ever any pause in that bad news, we can expect chaos coming from the white house in the form of insulting tweets. or things that seem to destabilize this country and i'd even say the international order if you look at the north korean tweets. take a step back and tell me, what do we say to our children? what do we say to our grandchildren? are we too -- are we too in the moment right now because thank god that i didn't remember 1968 that well? i remember looking into my grandmother's face after bobby kennedy got killed and seeing the fear in her eyes. i could ask both of you, is now

the battle days, or have americans been absorbing these types of shocks for a very long time? >> well, we have, but briefly you said what should we tell our kids? at a certain point you got to tell your kids we're turning off the tv. we're unplugging. >> again. >> in no more screens. we're going to have a consideration, play music, read a book. we'll read a magazine. there's a lot we can do, but this constant jarring insinuating jabbing thing where we are exposed every day to so much bad news and hot opinion, so much crazy on social media, so unplugging is just a really good idea periodically and in some ways at this moment, another thing, though, i think has to be said in fairness. mr. trump, our president, never shows any appreciation for the

idea that when history turns dark and tragic and quick, what we need is stability. what we need is a serve calm. we need the president elected to be our leader for four years who goes for quietly, certainly, qualmly, says the right things and is not doing the loses temper stuff and the shoot your mouth off stuff. at a moment when things are jarring, you shouldn't add to the jarringness. it's a mistake he makes. i don't know why he makes it. >> i think he -- >> we have these conversations every morning after another terrible shooting like this. mike and i were just talking. it's less than five years since sandy hook when a guy walked into an elementary school and slaughtered 20 six and seven-year-olds and their principal. not much change third down this country. i can't think of anything that

changed dramatically that would have prevented anything like that from happening. do you have hope? you have the lock ving view of . do you have hope that something will happen to change what happened? >> essential optimist given where i started and ended up. the country has been extraordinarily good to a lot of people in this country and the rule of law. but i am more discouraged now than i have been in a long time in part because our political leadership. the president of the united states and the republicans who are leading the congress at the moment, they're also on the democratic side. they're not much interested in finding a way to work together. they have their positions, and they stake them out, and they're completely separate from one another. as i go around the country, people who have strong feelings as republicans or democrats always say the same thing to me. why can't they get together? why can't they learn to talk to each other in civil terms? the president came out on his first morning when he was being elected president and said i'm going to have a public works

project. we're going to get jobs to repair this country. we haven't heard a word about it since then. most of the tweets are designed to divide people to get his troops to rally around him in some fashion. that's not the role of the president. the role of a president is to be the leader of all the people to have a strong political philosophy, but to have other people see how it can be to their advantage to have him as their leader, and he can reach across the aisle and find ways to work with them. a man who whom peggy worked, ronald reagan had an extraordinary ability to do just that. we know he had a very strong philosophy, but he talked to tip o'neal constantly. when he didn't, jim baker was up there saying to tip o'neal, mr. speaker, here's what we're going to do next week. i want to be clear this is going to work out okay. we don't have anything like that anymore going on. and that's a terrible, terrible commentary on where we are in the 21st century.

i'm a grandfather. i look at my granddaughters who have all the advantages in the world, and they're very political, and they're pretty despondent at this time. they're not encouraged about where the country is going. >> mike, i'll ask you too. we've had an opportunity through some remarkable work by ken burns to a lot of americans to relive the vietnam war, the chaos of that time. how do you compare that a year later -- we talked about '68 before with tet, the assassination of martin luther king, the assassination of bobby kennedy, the chaos in the streets of chicago. how does that compare to now? >> i don't think anything compared to 1968, even with all the horrific mass murders in this country. i like tom am an optimist about

the united states of america. today the greatest country ever. i'm here. tom is here. we have no right to be here other than a combination of luck and a little bit of skill. >> you should be in jail. >> there's a hymn sung often at catholic funeral masses, be not afraid. be not afraid, america. tell your children be not afraid. we will overcome this, but learn our history. we don't teach our history to ourselves or our children. this is the greatest story ever told in the history of civilization. the united states of america. who we are. our potential. what we can do. if we only grasp two things that are missing in public life, courage, and common sense. >> let me add a third that's desperately needed. humanity. humanity. >> more than ever. >> we need it. >> tom brokaw, thank you very

much. >> coming up, senator chris murphy says that mass shootings are an american problem, but he says there is an american solution. he'll tell us what that is when he joins us next on "morning joe." we just found the body of a woman last night. her head... is missing. [ stirring music playing throughout ] who does he leave the snowmen for? this killer is completely insane. [ gasp ] [ distorted voice ] i gave you all the clues. you could have saved her. he's been watching us the whole time. no. [ screaming ] [ distorted voice ] this is just the beginning. [ screaming ] the snowman.

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all right. we just want to mention that we did ask a number of republicans to be on this morning pause you're seeing a lot of democratic lawmakers joining us this morning. and they all declined. joining us now democratic senator chris murphy of connecticut. he was the congressman for newtown, connecticut when a gunman killed 20 school children and six educators in 2012. i'm with you on this. i don't understand when we talk about this if not now at a time like this. >> yeah. listen, i think it's a very convenient tool of the gun lobby to say there's got to be a 24, 48 hour waiting period before we talk about change. the fact of the matter is the entire country is focussed on why this happened. and the reality is that much of it is rooted in the evil inside this one individual, but much of it is rooted in our laws which allowed him to get his hands on weapons that are illegal in

almost every other civilized country. maybe he still would have taken a pistol and killed dozens below but it would have been difficult without the semi automatic weapon and the modifications legal in this country. i think we have to talk about change immediately. and the fact of the matter is while everybody is focussed on las vegas, mass shootings represent 1% of the gun casualties in this country. every single day people are being killed by guns. and we need to talk about what's happening in baltimore and chicago and hartford on a daily basis. we can't just bring this up when there's an enormous max executi execution. >> i want to ask the same question i asked your colleague from connecticut a few minutes ago. be specific about this case in las vegas. you have been in the past when these terrible incidents have cropped up. what would have stopped this man

in las vegas from going up in that hotel room and breaking out the window and shooting be into that crowd? there are two nevada gun stores who say he passed federal background checks. not a lot in his past that would have been red flags to people. how could this have been prevented? is there a law in congressman himes said yes to a ban on semi automatic rifles. >> absolutely. let's be clear. the pace of the epic mass shootings, 10 or more people being killed doubled after the assault weapons ban expired. that's not a kons dense. i think we also have to look at the after market modifications that allows you to turn a semi automatic weapon into a semi automatic weapon. i think the gun lobby wants you to only talk about the policy changes that would have affected the shooting that happened the day before.

we have to get back to the evergreen changes, things like universal background checks that probably would have stopped many of the other murders around the woir country that happened before the shooting in las vegas. i think the gun industry wants us to only talk about the policy change that would have affected yesterday's mass shootings. background is the most likely legislation through congress because it enjoys widespread public approval and is probably most dispositive on the amount of gun violence that happens every day across this country. >> i understand, but it's worth talking about what would have prevented the deaths of over 50 people. he passed these backgrounds checks. to be pacific, ban bump stocks and ban semi automatic rives. are you for that? >> i'm for both of those things. i think we ask ourselves a question in and around newtown every day. it's not just a question of the

specific damage that these weapons do. they allow you to kill a lot more people, but in newtown we ask yourselves whether he would have walked into that school without tactical weaponry. there's a false kind of courage that comes with attaching yourself to these kind of very powerful weapons, and there is a question as to whether the shooters would ever take up position if all they had was a pistol instead of a dangerous military style weapon. >> senator chris murphy, thank you very much for being on this morning. >> thank you. >> up next, we'll remember the victims of the las vegas massacre. their stories next on "morning joe."

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she saw them as a sign that her grandparents were watching over here. cameron robinson, an employee of the city of las vegas. attending the concert with her boyfriend. sister confirmed the death to the las vegas review journal. he was 28. ron was 41. sister told the boston globe that she attended the concert with her husband and daughter, who escaped unharmed. the mother of three boys, loved to travel with sons. brother told utah tv. lisa row her ra was remembered by students at the high school where she worked as someone who was there for them. volunteered with homeless and elderly. hit along with the colleague in the manhattan beach police department who survived. debby allen went to the concert

with her 29-year-old son. they arrived separately and watching apart. she tried to find him, a veteran of the war in afghanistan, when she heard the sound of gunshots. >> i was trying to run towards wherever i thought he might be. and this man wonuldn't let me. kept pulling me away and telling me you can't run towards the gunfire. >> how did you hear the details of what happened to your son. from the man that was with him. the fireman walking behind him. >> what did he tell you. >> he told me my son was shot in the chest. he said i'm hit. i'm hit. and then he bent down again and gunfire began and my son just fell back. he is a vet. he has a shirt with a gunshot through it. he sat on a lot of bombs and never blew him up. and. >> in afghanistan. >> and he was a proud american.

he sang spanish. he sang in spanish all the time. he was so beautiful. >> that is just a small portion of the victims. we're going to continue to tell their stories as we learn more about the lives lost. still ahead this morning, what could have driven the gunman to open fire on a crowd of music fans. there's no clear motive yet. officials looking at everything from gambling to his personal life. we'll have the very latest on the investigation. next on morning joe. oh it's, it's fine 'cuz... i got myself one too. oh! from you, for me, happy anniversary. i love it. that is very thoughtful of you. thank you. get the amazing new iphone 8. and with all at&t unlimited plans, get hbo for life. less than $40 per line for four lines. only from at&t.

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welcome back to plor"mornin jo joe". it is tuesday, october 3. with us we have mike barnicle. contributor for nbc news and msnbc peggy noonan. we want to get to the las vegas shooter. trying to figure out why 64-year-old steven paddock opened fire on a crowd in las vegas. killing 59 people and injuring more than 500 others. fbi agents pouring over arsenal or weapons seized from the hotel room where he cared out the attack. including a handgun. ar 15 assault rifles and rifles equipped with scopes. new reporting from the ap says

the shooter had two bump stocks that could have converted semi automatic firearms into fully automatic ones. another 19 firearms were recovered from his home in mesquite, nevada along with explosives and thousands of bullets. most of what we know about the shooter came from his brother. nbc carry sanders spoke with him yesterday. carey joins us now. seems like such a mystery. go oftalking about the older brother. asking questions. told fbi his brother had no political affiliations. was nonreligious. these are some of the details he shared with us in his 70 minute conversation. that his brother was 64 years old. he was a retired accountant. a full-time gambler who was a

multimillionaire according to his millionaire. twice married and divorced. no children. as a youngster was a coin collector. at a young age got his pilot's license. he did have a temper when people smoked cigarettes around him. >> he gambled. it was like a job. it was a job. he was an accountant. it was a job for him. he was a exact guy. in the sense he would kill a bunch of people he didn't know. he would blow smack back in. he carried a cigar to blow smoke. he was the king of micro improvision. there's a quote for you. >> we hear his brother who clearly said he had no indication. he said he receiptrecently spok his brother after hurricane maria came through florida because his older brother wanted to know how their mother had done. she's 90 years old.

lives about a block away from where eric lives there. he had apparently texted saying his mom returned. she was doing okay. the actual phone conversations between brothers actually were not that common. it sounds as if they were not particularly close. he said it was a typical conversation they would have about the weather. the stock market. their mother is 90 years old. married to a man who was a bank robber. now the mother of the worst mass murder in modern times in u.s. history. >> nbc carey sanders. thank you. very not talking about any

conspiracy story here. he said and he's one of the first to bring up points that you and i were talking about. doesn't make any sense. this guy was a gun guy. didn't have any political or religious views. and yet he massacred people like a trained terrorist. this required planning. this required logistics. this required going into a hotel. >> money. >> and a lot of money. this required weapons going into a hotel room. if you were taking fire in one window, you could go to another window e. and yet, nobody can find anything to suggest that he

had a motive for this at all. is this one of the strangest -- certainly the most heinous mass shooting in u.s. history. is this one of the strangest crimes you've ever seen in your life. >> not only the most unbelievable. most chilling. most improbable sort of perpetrator. you usually have some sort of motive. terrorist. i think the first time i came on here, it's a political, social. religious ideology. when you look at mass shooters and you don't have those idea oolg ologies we start to look for fear. something. signals. when you look at both on the technical side, las vegas is one of the best police departments in the world. has some of the best security in the whole world. even governments go to vegas to learn how to do security.

on the behavioral side, we would look for intelligence. what would tip us off to this. we would look for mass weapons purchases. rehearsals. giving away goods. he committed suicide. they tend to give away life's earnings. we've seen none of that across family connections or in terms of social media, no real signature. an older gentleman at 64. usually in their 20s or 30s. . it's really hard to find. >> this has happened twice now. steve scalice's gunman was 64. >> yes. the new pattern which has been strange is, you know, very low social media signature, even in the scalice case, only a few posts. not a lot of communication with family members and deciding to act. from a law enforcement perspective, even if you do well on the analysis. if the laws haven't changed, there's not a lot of ways to

detect this. >> let me ask you ththis shooti ask you this -- scalice shooting. both in their 60s. both a bit removed from the society. not enough to draw any attention and both seemingly planning the event for some time. remember. scalice's shooter was in a ymca where he rarely worked out. just sat there. asked the republicans or the democrats going there. had a specific intent. and cared out this action. >> both picking vulnerable targets they knew they could control the situation. both used weapons that you couldn't purchase. when it comes to defending against weapons like this, we're going to come out of this. very hard to come up with what's the afteraction review. what can we do webetter next ti. >> let's switch things up. bring in james allen fox.

professor of law. member of the usa today board of contributors, it's good to have you on. given the conversation we're having right now. what questions can you ask about this at this point? where would you be looking. what would be curious to you given so many dead ends, seemingly, in the conversation when it comes to what led to this? what might have motivated this shooter? >> obviously we want to know why and we may not ever get to that point. i think it's also important that we be careful. not to paint a picture of this buy the to the extent he becomes larger than life. he becomes humanized. oftentimes we assemble the psychological autopsy, we create someone who could be a role model for others. i think we have to be careful. it's okay to shed light of the crime, but not a spotlight of the criminal. we want closure on this crime. if we anticipate we can learn

information that will allow us to predict and identify the next killer, we believe we're disappointed. rare events fortunately, but no way we can identify mass killers before we strike no matter how much we know about them. >> it's a rare event. is it a rare event or are the numbers just rare. >> trump administration nit's n in terms of mass killings general lly 20 a year. in terms of public mass killings we have about six a year. sure, the death toll a year is staggering. by the way, also encourage us not to keep talkinglargest, the the record. records are there to be broken. that can challenge other people to become a record setter. does it really matter if it was a record. if it was the largest or not.

absolutely not. it's tragic regardless. >> so let me ask you this professor, sounds like after all these terror attacks that we've seen, you'll have the media four or five days talking about the terrorists, talking about if the connections with isis. basically doing exactly what the terrorist want you to do when he or she committed that act. and i've said for some time, i would love for news outlets not to even mention the name of terrorists. it sounds like you're saying the same thing. to a degree about these domestic assaults. these domestic attacks. do not lift, do not give these people any oxygen, so to speak, in the media because you're only feeding the next mass shooters.

hope that they can go out in a blaze or glory. >> i understand the logic of not wanting to identify the killers name. the name is not the biggest issue here. it's the way we accentuate the horror and play into the very small group of people who would love to create this kind of drama. who would love to become the next record setter. so the name is one thing. sure. we all know the name. when we go overboard and we paint a profile of this guy to the extent that becomes larger than life. it becomes, again, a role model for other people. when we put their pictures on the cover of magazines. when other people see them as heros, not only did they get even with society, hey, but they're famous for it. in fact, we saw that in the sandy hook killer. he admired the shooter from

norway. wanted to outdo his row model. we have to be careful about toning down the drama, the embellishment and high personally. this is a horrible crime no matter whether it's a record or not. i wanted to ask you professor is you were talking about contagion essentially. terrorist learn from other terrorist and other criminals and mass shooters. aside from this turning down the spectacle of these events, how else do we deal with contagions and make sure we trim the stem line. if you look at the causality of frequency, we have an upward trend over the past few years regardless of the perpetrator.

>> we would love to be able to figure out a way to prevent this. unfortunately we can't identify the killers. what about things like security. sure. and there's short-term. adding security to concerts and other entertainment events makes sense because of their concern about copy catting. in the long run, not sure that is all that effective. mass killers are very determined. they find a way no matter what obstacles they put in their way. in terms of policy response, we're going to hear a lot of proposals about gun control. that's great. expanding the access to mental health. with that prevent a mass murder. probably not, but it will prevent many of the kinds of crimes we see every day in america. the death toll we saw in las vegas is about the same we see every day in america, of course. not all at once. not one event. those are the crimes we can prevent. so this is doing the right thing perhaps for the wrong reason. mass killings are rare, hard to

prevent, hard to anticipate, but if we are moved to act, we can reduce the carnage naturally every day in american cities. that would be the great legacy here. >> professor of criminology, law. thank you very much. let's go back to las vegas now. msnbc correspondent standing by there. what are we hearing about the investigation. >> well, it's fixated in three main areas. one of them is right behind me. that system mandalay bay hotel. as the sun starts to come up, we'll be able to see the two windows the perpetrator pushed out to be able to set up tripods as well as guns reported. 23 different weapons. ten different suitcases over a period of days. checked in on thursday. officials of the hotel say at no time did anybody who went in there, for example, to clean the room see anything that was out of the ordinary.

they're looking very closely at that, including the security footage there at the mandalay bay. they're looking at the venue. they're looking at the place where 22,000 people were. obviously that is the crime scene. and then they're also looking at his home, which is about 60 miles from here. they have gone through everything we presume they have taken out computers and other information. at this point, there is absolutely no indication that he left behind as say the columbine shooters did, any massive writings. also talked about social media. no big fingerprint there. maybe not surprising for someone of his age. police at a late night news conference last night completely dismissed a kocouple of things t there. number one, isis claims. they say there's nothing that indicates to them he had any terror motive. also say there was stuff going on online that it had to be more than one shooter. they believe this was a lone wolf.

singer shooter. in the early hours when police were looking for a potential accomplice, his girlfriend, found out yesterday she is in tokyo japan. they live together, but they're trying to get her back. they said they've interviewed her, but would like to ask her more questions. the focus of the investigation, joe and mika, why. they want to know a motive and people here in vegas, around the country, and around the world want to know that right now too. right now, no good answers. >> thank you so much. coming up for just $50, you can legally modify a gun to make it fully automatic and there are plenty of youtube videos to show you how nbc tom costello has been looking into that angle and he joins us next with the new reporting on that. moments away from president trump's departure to puerto rico where his administration's response to hurricane maria has been called into question. we have a live report from the white house straight ahead. building a website in under an hour is easy with gocentral...

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law enforcement putting a heavy focus. how the shooter got his hands on so many essentially military grade machine guns. let's go to washington right now and talk to nbc news tom costello. tom, what have you found out so far. two nevada gun shops and one in utah told us they told guns to the suspect legally. semiassault weapons and ammo are legal in nevada. converting to a true semiautomatic is against the law. did he use a clean kit. in case a bump stock to get around the law.

some semi automatic. including two 23 and 308 colbert rifles. 19 more in his home. the question this morning were those weapons already automatic when paddock purchased them or did he modify them. an easy way around federal laws which ban fully automatic weapons. the kits themselves actually legal, available online for $50. or you can also find videos. >> by just replacing the stock. >> showing how to convert a gun. >> the federal government has banned fully automatic machine guns for more than three decades. any fully automatic weapon made and registered before 1986 can be bought and sold legally. while some states have law s limiting semi automatic weapons, they're legal in nevada. >> returning some sanity to the insanity of current gun regulations can be exceptionally helpful. >> this morning as investigators

search for a motive, all signs point to a suspect equipped to carry out maximum carnage. >> it's a matter of holding the trigger and moving the gun back and forth. about spraying the crowd to cause maximum damage and death. >> the fbi has a problem of attracting all guns involved. does not allow a computerized national gun database. >> president trump left the white house on his way to joint base andrews where he's going to head to puerto rico. spoke to reporters about the las vegas massacre. this is what he said chl. >> we have a tragedy. we're going to do -- and what happened in las vegas is in many ways a miracle. the police department has done

such an incredible job and we'll be talking about gun laws as time goes be, but i do have to say how quickly the police department was able to get in was really very much of a miracle. they've done an amazing job. go ahead. >> well, i think she's come back a long way. i think it's now ago no longered wh acknowledged what a great job we've done. texas and florida we get an a plus. i think we've done just as good in puerto rico and it's a much tougher situation. now the roads are cleared. communications starting to come back. we need their truck drivers. their drivers have to start driving trucks. we have to do that. at a local level they have to give us more help. i will tell you the first responders, the military, fema, they have done an incredible job in puerto rico. and whether it's her or anybody

else, they're all starting to say it. i appreciate very much the governor and his comments. he has said we have done an incredible job and that's the truth. >> we'll talk about that later. >> he was a sick man, a demented man. a lot of problems i guess. and we're looking into him very, very seriously, but we're dealing with a very sick individual. thank you. thank you. >> that's the president and melania trump heading to andrews. we're going to fly down to puerto rico. the police officers found of the shooter. it was actually ten minutes. and he had taken his own life by the time they went through that.

certainly obviously. talking about there. a bit bizarre. incredible challenge. you're looking at hotels surrounding an open field. 50 stories high. it could have come -- >> 22,000 people. >> yes. i do think they did remarkable job based on the situation. it also points to in a situation like this where you've got whale appears to be some modified automatic weapon. any response is not quick enough. we are lucky in the sense las vegas deals with mass events. they know how to deal with crowds unlike any police force in the world: we saw first responders there offduty. which did great work.

we dole think that to make sure we don't continue to see this happen. >> you talked about the president before. never knowing exactly what to say. are actually times of trouble. adding to the friction. and the chaos. the president of the united states outside of the white house about to head down to puerto rico. yearsi in using his comments to criticize puerto rico, saying, quote, they need to give us more help. >> their local level. >> i think the people there are suffering in the worst part of such an incident like an earthqua earthquake or hurricane. when it's coming, you're scared. you have a lot of adrenaline. when it's happening you batten down and survive the best you

can. in the five to ten to 15 days afterwards, the suffering comes. that's the point they're in. there are people on hills and not able to get off the hills. they're surrounded by water. they're running outs of water. running out of electricity. >> a kind word turn away wrath. if some people have criticized the president and under duress, okay, i understand. i'm coming to see you. we're going to make this work. make this okay. >> it's just not going to happen here. >> i'm coming to see you and yet my president of the united states again, as he goes to puerto rico, criticizing the people of puerto rico, saying we need their truck drivers to drive or completely devoid of the situation down in puerto rico. and what they are saying they

need to get more help. the statement they want is never heard from the president of the united states. going in to what is essentially a war zone. >> you know, this is personal. in is not here. it doesn't belong to anyone at this table other than me. watching the president of the united states just then i was reminded again as i am reminded nearly and dealrly now, he exhausts me. i'm tired or seeing him. i'm tired of hearing him. i'm tired of guessing whether he knows what he's saying or doing. >> that's a question we all had when we heard him talking about how difficult it was to take care of puerto rico. what did he say. it is an island surrounded by water. surrounded by big water. surrounded by ocean. all true. >> all true. >> aplus plus.

and my god, the fema or somebody yesterday or the day before said said this is the greatest logistical challenge that the united states has ever faced and said out of fema, to which i say sir, the ghost of mcarthur. and the troops who landed, they mock you. from beneath their white crosses. as do the 115,000 troops under general dwight eisenhower who came ashore oklahoma beach. scaled the cliffs and freed a continent. please just shut up and do your job. all right. >> we'll be right back. >> i shouldn't have said that. do your job. >> will armstrong and buzz arm

strong might have something to say about that. >> why does president trump attack people at most vulnerable. no matter how powerful, john mccain or gold star family or mayor of san juan, puerto rico. no insult can go unanswered. doesn't know how to turn that off. if someone is pleaded for help from an island, you're the president of the united states, you are the leader. it's not your job to stomp on that person. it's your job to ask how you can help, the same way you did in houston and florida. why is puerto rico different from houston and florida where he got credit for his response. >> i apologize for saying shutup. let me strike that from the record and say please do you job. peggy, you were there with ronald reagan as he talked about what are heros did. scaling the walls of normandy. what would those boys say when

we're hearing a fema director say this is too hard for the united states of america. we just can't do this. this is the greatest lodgist cal challenge we nifaced as a count. >> gosh, i didn't know this was a logistical challenge, but i believe we met it. on the largest issue of the president, not the fema director, but it is in part the job of a president to be the lone suffering one. if you know what i mean. the patient one. the one who you can't bait into an angry exchange on twitter. you can't flip him. that's what we ought to have. tom brokaw a moment ago spoke of reagan and tip o'neill. i was thinking, reagan did some

subtle things. one of them is was the day he was shot. an extreme moment and he was an extreme physical position. he started making jokes. he didn't just tell those jokes on the gurney for the nurse skms docto and doctors. he wanted to signal you're all okay. that's all right. the president got shot. it's all right. we're laughing over here. you set a tone in the funniest darn ways. and i wish this man were better at setting a tone. >> he is setting a tone. just setting the wrong tone. very, very well said ronald reagan. we'll be right back after this. this is an island. surrounded by water. big water. ocean water. we're closely coordinated with

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this morning learning more about the las vegas gunman at the mandalay resort. joining us from vegas, joe friar. joe, we were inside the hotel as the whole thing was happening. what's it like there now. >> it's right. still stunningly quiet here in las vegas. last night it was a monday night. would have been busy like vegas normally is, but it was pretty quiet. monday night football would normally be a huge draw. not so much last night. casinos trying to return to normal. people with travel plans to come here whether fun or business, certainly a different tone. look at many led signs around las vegas. messages about blood donation. relaying information about the hot lines people could call to learn more about the victims. they're thanking the first responders and paying tribute to

many victims. definitely a different tone here. we do know with each news conference learning a little more about the suspect, steven paddock. investigators say they found 23 guns inside of the hotel room. he had actually moved into that room on thursday. so he had been there three days prior to this shooting. he used more than ten suitcases to bring the gun in. those who work here didn't see anything unusual. people are in and out of hotels with a lot of suitcases. >> back to you guys. nbc's joe friar. thank you very much. conservative radio host. author of before you wake. life lessons. from a father to his children. >> and a few recipes too. >> and a few recipes. just like richard's books. so eric, talk about the backdrop to this book. in 2016 and what could easily be termsed the worst year of your

life. ed the worst year of your life. s. >> i got admitted to i colorado dying. the day i entered the icu, my wife ruz diagnowas diagnosed wi incurable form of lung cancer. at this time we had protesters showing up and people calling radio station demanding i be fired. a woman in my wife's bible study said she wanted to punch me in the face. my kids got yelled at in the grocery store. that their father was destroy the country by not supporting the president. they would come home crying from school saying their mom or dad said i was going to get shot. >> we had people show up at the front door. armed guards for three months. exciting year. >> so wrote a book to my kids out of it.

one upside. >> the book you wrote for your kids, before you wake. talk about what you learned in 2016 and how it's made you a better father and how it led to this. >> number one, politics isn't as important as we tend to make it be in the country these days. so many of the fights we think are most consequential aren't. i would rather my kids not measuring their worth on likes on instagram and facebook. all with the internet age can construct communities for ourselves where everyone thinks the same. we never have to encounter the homeless man down the street or the idea that runs counter to our home. >> you talked about the most powerful weapon in bringing our communitying back together which leads to society coming back together, civilization coming back together.

is the kitchen table. explain. >> i love to cook. realized it was a great way to bring people to our house. wanted to just get ourselves a circle of friends around us who our kids could have a safe space. we're not yelling at each other about politics and being able to make a pot of gumbo and bring people over. recipe in the books. >> would you allow a troy state fan to come over right now. >> i'm boycotting lsu until they stop boycotting winning. >> it's going to get ugly. >> some of the stories you just related over the last year get to something we've been talking about a lot on the show. seems politics has superceded basic humanity. what kind of person walks up to your kids in a grocery store and yells at children about their dad and tells them he's ruining the country. they couldn't stop and think maybe yelling at these kids is

less important than whatever is happening in my life. i guess my question to you is how do we get that back. we saw it again yesterday. you know, you had 59 people dead in las vegas. they're probably trump voters. country music concert. how do we recapture basic humidity. >> humanity. >> turn off the internet. i think twitter brings out the worst in all of us, myself included. forcing us to get to know the person next door to us. i'm always shocked they don't know the person in the apartment next door to them. let alone the person down the hall from them. meeting actual people in your neighborhood is the easiest way to start. >> i'm curious, eric, the supporters of candidate trump and president trump who were so upset with you. you did not support him. during the pain and and probably the first few months of his

presidency, a, are they as angry with you as they were? are they still coming to the house? are they still saying hello, eric, i would love to punch you or has something changed with them. some of them are still very angry. there are a few people i've long been acquainted with, we're not necessarily friends, but i don't talk to them anymore. a lot of them i think winning helped them get over it. my boss with my wife's cancer having insurance was desperately afraid if i didn't suddenly support the president, i was going to lose my insurance and lose my job. i couldn't bring myself to do it. neither could christie. she would have killed me if i sold out for her, but ratings went and you happen people listened. i get trump supporters all the time saying i disagree with you, but at least know you mean what you say. >> we go every three months for a scan. have one on halloween. that gives us a three month rest period we don't have to worry. >> you live in three month

increments. >> yes, she has a ct scan every three months. at some point her cancer will mchugh at a time mchugh at a time. >> they're good. they've got a healthy sense of self esteem. we keep them off social media. it's built off playground social media and not likes and retweets self esteem. >> what you said about communities that the kitchening table is the best way to build communities. it's also the best way to talk to your children. and making sure you have that set time, family meal time. >> every night. they sit down, and i've been through it a few times now where you have sulking teenagers.

certainly not saying anyone is sulking these days, but we all go through it and it's great to be able to look them in the eye over dinner. >> i haven't entered the mind of a teenager. this is horrifying me. >> you are right to be horrified. >> the book is before you wake. life lessons from a father to his children. eric, thank you so much for coming on this morning. >> thank you. up next, we'll talk to a retired police captain. now running for congress. his unique perspective on the mass shooting in his hometown. next on "morning joe." kevin, meet your father.

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joining us now, former las vegas captain and also running for the united states congress. thank you for being with us this morning. you did 29 years in the department in las vegas. what did you hear and what have you heard this morning from your old buddies, old colleagues who were there on the scene sunday night outside of mandalay bay. >> thank you for having me.

i've been talking to some of the officers that were out there and i know exactly what they went through. when these shots started coming down, they're first instinct is to save lives, to shield people from getting shot again, to provide medical assistance and then run towards where the bullets are coming and find where the shooter is and stop him. eventually they put together a team of officers that went into the mandalay bay. this is something that we practice active shooter training on a regular basis, but not to this magnitude and i tell you what, god blez those officers. there will be stories of them saves lives out there and for them to take a team and go up 30 floors and take this guy on is heroic. >> and not to mention what

officers are doing on the ground. closing wounds, getting people to the hospital. can you take us inside that operation to identify a shooter. you're looking up. i imagine you're not quite sure what floor he's you're not sur floor he's on, getting yourself inside a hotel and encounters a man that's heavily armed. >> you train for stuff like this but it's mass chaos. people are unaring around, shots are kwoming down. you don't know where the shots are coming from. you finally figure out they're coming from the mandalay bay which is quite a ways away from this place. 's identifying the target and trying to get people over there to take out the target, take some time. but it's amazing that these officers, the ones that are actually running towards the danger and trying to help people out. and you know, our firefighters are doing the same thing, paramedics were showing up, ambulances everywhere going to the scene where the bullets are

being shot. they knew their lives were on the line but they got there to help folks out. they did a phenomenal job. this has been a tough time for the city of las vegas the last 24 hours. but you know, when people wake up this morning, i think the most important thing on their minds is to mourn the 59 that were killed in this incident and to really pray for the other 500 that are still injured, to get them safely out of the hospital, to get them home and back with their family member. that's the only thing we're focused on right now. >> captain anthony for 29 years you belonged to an organization, metro pd las vegas with a great reputation and now you're running, seeking a position in an outfit, an organization with a very low reputation. why are you running for congress and what do you propose would be different about you than the incumbent? >> well, i love this police department. i've been retired for the last

eight years. i spent the last eight years on the las vegas city council and i think this is a great opportunity for me to go to washington, d.c. and represent the state of nevada and try to bring a lot of decisions that are made in washington, d.c. back to the state. let the state handle a lot of these decisions, let the local government handle a lot of these decisions. those are the officials that are closest to the people where they get to actually talk to folks. instead of taking these decisions 3,000 miles away, i would rather they were made here in the state of nevada and the city of las vegas. we'll be much better off. that's really one of the things i'm going to focus on. and i want to support law enforcement on a federal level to make sure they have the tools -- just like today. to have an incident like this, they have to have the tools available for them to stop a shooter, to rinder aid, to have the training available to be table to do something like that.

>> stavros anthony, i'm sure we'll be talking again as you pursue a seat in the united states congress. thank you for being with us. much for coverage of the president's trip to puerto rico, ahead of his trip tomorrow to las vegas. "morning joe" is coming right back. sit if you can train oxford to sit... sit you can train yourself to cook with less oil. introducing new pam spray pump made with extra virgin olive oil. now you can pump instead of pour, plus get the superior non-stick you love. new pam spray pump.

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probably never find out who they are. they grabbed me by my legs, took her belt off and put a tur tourniquet on my leg. they were literally loading us on to the tow trucks. nobody cared what you looked like last night. nobody did. they wanted to save your life. >> final thoughts especially hearing from those victims. joe? >> well, peggy, there was no miracle last night. the president said there was a miracle. or two nights ago. there was no miracle but there actually was something that's become quite standard. a tragedy in this country but just as standard, americanis helping out. >> humanity. >> not caring what the person looked like, where they came from, what god they worship, what team they rooted for, what

party they were in. humanity miss in washington. >> we saw it in houston, in florida and we saw it last night, americans on the ground are very cool and they are better than those who put them down as hopelessly backward and nasty. >> clint? >> yeah. it's interesting that americans are moving forward in the right way without leadership. in the past we've turned to a president no matter who it is or a congressman or a leader. but they're doing it without being led this time. >> mike? >> you know, what that gentleman just said, nobody cared who anybody was in terms of people who received help and those giving the help. that's who we are. this is america. we're much more dock pacompassi helpful people. the mass killing, the man in the window 34 floors up, that's also

who we are sadly. >> there are people who in the space of one minute went to listening to jason aldean playing a song on stage to having their hands inside bullet wounds to stop people from bleeding out. what do you tell your kids? there is much more light than there is darkness. and we saw the light on a battlefield in the middle of the las vegas strips saving lives, whether they were first responders or people there to see a concert. >> something i texted my daughters yesterday, i didn't know what to say to them. they were asking me so many questions and i just said be really kind to somebody today. just do something kind for someone and stay off of the internet. final thoughts. >> that ice the resistance, not the resistance against a president or against social media, just against a coarsening culture. the greatest act of resistance

is kindness. showing kindness and you multiply that millions of times, you really do see a change. it sounds trite, it sounds small, but it is not. it's our best chance moving forward. >> that does it for us this morning. stephanie ruhle and ali velshi continue oush coverar coverage the scene. >> thank you very much. i'm ali velshi. >> and i'm stephanie ruhle. the deadliest shooting in modern american history. the number of dead is 59. at least 527 were wounded in the attack when the funman, stephen paddock fired from the windows of the mandalay casino into a convert crowd below. 23 firearms were found in pod dak's hotel room along with 19 more at