i'm alex witt at msnbc headquarters in new york. we're tracking yet another hurricane threatening the united states. i'll be back at noon eastern. straight ahead, joy reid charts the white house chaos in the cabinet on "a.m. joy" right now. >> what's the storm? >> could be the calm before the storm. >> you're talking about iran? what storm, mr. president? >> you'll find out. >> good morning. welcome to "a.m. joy." donald trump is treating the possibility of war, even potential nuclear war like a tease for the next episode of his reality show.

what storm is he talking about? war with north korea? war with iran or the conflict brewing in his administration this week after secretary of state rex tillerson refused to deny an nbc news report that tillerson called trump a moron during a moment of frustration in july. a spokesperson for the state department later made a denial of the remark, but the damage was already done. nbc news reported that tillerson's non-denial enraged donald trump and widened the rift between the two. tillerson said this week he has never considered leaving, but axios is reporting that mike mom p pompeo may be a replacement for tillerson. there is also talk of a suicide pact, where tillerson, mattis and mnuchin agreed they would

all leave if trump attacks one of them. a mass exodus would only add to the chaos swarming around trump's cabinet. joining me are kirk bardella, david korn, perry bacon jr., and vivian salama. vivian, i'll go to you first on this. to get a sense of your reporting on tillerson, he will stay or go. if mike pompeo were to go, that would leave another vacancy if he moved into tillerson's spot. >> we've seen a lot of shuffling of the cabinet because we lost tom price, the health and human services secretary because of the wasteful spending allegations. so there's a lot going on at the same time. tillerson in particular we know that the relationship has been contentious with the president. he's outwardly criticized the president sometimes.

disagreed with him on certain policy standpoints. so that has basically -- what we saw this week is a manifestation of all of those tensions, where essentially the president last week contradicting tillerson, rex tillerson on his views on north korea that we should engage in diplomatic relations. went out on twitter and essentially down played the secretary of state's views on that. that began this cycle where tillerson was very frustrated. there was talks of him resigning. and this spilled over into the white house, because when nbc news reported a number of different things, including reports that tillerson had called the president a moron behind closed doors, that enr e enraged the president. he faced off with people in the white house, including his chief of staff, john kelly, to essentially do something about it.

and the tensions kind of circulated around his inner circle. so there's where we stand right now. there's a lot of talk of maybe mike pompeo stepping into the role of chief of staff if kelly were to resign. a lot of talk about who would be secretary of state if tillerson were to resign. this boils down to the fact that this administration is in turmoil. it's in a lot of trouble, that donald trump cannot lock down his closest advisers, and basically plow forward with his agenda. that's really going to hurt him moving forward if this continues. >> perry, let me go to you. i want to play bob corker, senator from tennessee, who interestingly enough has emerged as almost a moderating sort of voice about the administration. this is him talking about tillerson, mattis and john kelly and the role he sees them playing in the administration.

>> i think secretary tillerson, secretary mattis, and chief of staff kelly are those people that help separate our country from chaos. >> sarah huckabee sanders had this retort to that during her friday press conference. >> i think that the president is the one that's keeping the world from chaos. he has an incredible team around him that's helping him lead that effort. >> perry, nobody believes donald trump is keeping the world from chaos, moving past that. what do you make of that? corker's retiring. he can say that kind of thing. on capitol hill, is that the general sense that god forbid if kelly, mattis or those guys go, that all hell would break loose? >> less with tillerson who people are not as confident with, but certainly kelly or mattis f they resign, that would be a big thing on capitol hill. people do view them as kind of

reigning in trump, particularly on north korea and maybe on iran. keeping trump in a more established point of view. one thing to know, donald trump lives in america, watches television, reads the "new york times." so these stories about the fact that mattis and kelly are saving the country from donald trump, donald trump is consuming that, too. on thursday he said he's tired of the military boxing him in, giving him few options. he's talking about this idea that kelly and mattis are trying to run the country or run foreign policy instead of him. he does not like that. that's causing a tension, too. there's something about trump may be erratic and trump has different foreign policy views than kelly, mattis, tillerson. this is not about whether trump is a moron or not, it's about real foreign policy differences where on iran, for example, his staff does not agree with trump. >> to that very point, let's play general mattis being asked point blank whether or not the

administration should pull out of the iran deal, which donald trump seems to want to do. >> do you believe it's in our national security interest to remain in the jcpoa? that's a yes or no question. >> yes, senator, i do. if we can confirm that iran is living by the agreement, if we can determine that this is in our best interest, clearly we should stay with it. i believe at this point in time, absent indications to the contrary, it is something that the president should consider staying with. >> donald trump ran pretending he was against the iraq war, even though he's on tape saying he was for it. this idea was that he was the candidate that was going to promote peace. peaceful relations with russia. it would not get us into another iraq. here is he differing with his secretary of defense, he wants to be more aggressive towards

iran. donald trump's base which side of that equation are they on? >> you saw during the campaign and you're seeing it now how trump panders to them. he ran on that this isolationist, nationalistic, america first, american strength, he will continue to cater to that. any uniting is so opposite of the brand he ran on. he bucks the foreign "establishment" whatever that is. bannon was in his ear that whole time. that world view of america first, don't listen to the establishment, you can't trust them, they're against you. you see how he lashes out at the near notion that anyone controls what he does. he's almost rooting for these people to leave so that he can be unleashed. i thinks he's been restricted and held in by the command and control of the military, the generals, the cabinet, he's constantly trying to show them i'm the boss.

he wants to show he's in charge. >> before that, he was saying sth they should have their own way in afghanistan, they should be able do what they want to do. in your reporting, david, if thiscadre of norms were to go, we'll leave rex tillerson aside because he's not doing so great, if mattis leaves, who or what would replace him? >> i spoke to one republican who said eventually, who is not in favor of trump, said it's her position that everyone should leave except mattis. that mattis needs to be there to say no to whatever order might come that will lead from chaos to worse. a lot a lot of people in washington are rooting for mattis to stay on. kelly, tillerson they may be more ambiguous about. it's hard to imagine things

being more chaotic than they are already. you know, he tried to have reince priebus, john kelly, he couldn't keep bannon, his chief strategist in the white house. i don't think we can make a guess. there's one point i want to highlight that you raised in that wonderful opener, that's nine months into the trump administration, there's no nominee for the secretary of the department of homeland security. he's about america first, protecting america, he can't find the guy who said he could bring the best people into government, a person to nominate? the dhs in charge of protecting critical infrastructure, including election security. in case we're coming to another election, if russia is going to do more facebook ads, dhs is the lead agency on this. this shows the degree to which

he's not serious about governing. >> isn't it also difficult to find people of substance and people of experience willing to work with this president? >> there is that element to it as well. they've seen the controversy and chaos surrounding this administration, just a lot of back and forth, people leaving. so obviously even those who are willing to serve are nervous that it would just be too challenging of a role, or that it would hurt their careers moving forward. to the point we were saying, i was speaking to folks at dhs, they say there's nothing getting done because of the fact that they do not have a secretary. so many positions remain untilled. that goes for the state department and a couple other agencies. they cannot get basic memos drafted or basic things approved because of the fact that the usual line of -- the

administrative line that you have that would be doing these things and carrying out the basic day-to-days of this government are not present. it's starting to weigh heavily on the function of our government, our institutions in general. >> david corn, you know, tillerson may not be doing great job of state, but he comes from the world of condoleezza rice, the bob gates world, where would they draw replacements for kelly for did the h sshgdhs from? where do they get the replacements? >> there are republican congressmen who may want to head up an agency who may not be as nutty as sebastian gorka. i don't think in the land of 300 million americans they can't find one person who is not willing to give it a shot. there are career officials at the agencies who may take an appointed position. you have to think, we're beyond the realm of ideological debate.

anyone who voted for trump should want a dhs functioning well should wanted a state department functioning. we don't have any of that happening now. i think it's a tremendous vulnerability for him that even the democrats are not fully exploited yet. >> do they want that? i don't see evidence that the trump base cares that they function. >> i said i think they should want dhs to function. >> i don't think they do. do you think they care about dhs functioning? >> i think they want less government. they like it when they see the bureaucracy, they see the problem with america is too much government involved in everything. if dhs is not staffed, they are more than happy to let trump run everything. that's the problem. >> and perry bacon, they don't

care enough to do anything about it. >> bob corker has been complaining all year that the state department is not staffed well, that will hurt us in diplomacy and hurt us abroad. that has not changed trump's plan at all. steve bannon said one of the goals of the administration was to deconstruct the federal government. we have lots of agencies outside of foreign policy that are understaffed. that's a feature, not a bug for donald trump. >> they're bleeding the federal government just as planned. thank you very much, welcome to the show. we'll have you back. congressman john lewis on how the congress needs to take a leadership role on guns. your brain is an amazing thing. but as you get older, it naturally begins to change, causing a lack of sharpness, or even trouble with recall.

thankfully, the breakthrough in prevagen helps your brain and actually improves memory. the secret is an ingredient originally discovered... in jellyfish. in clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve short-term memory. prevagen. the name to remember. our guests can earn a free night when they book at choicehotels.com and stay with us just two times? fall time. badda book. badda boom. pumpkin spice cookie? i'm good. book now at choicehotels.com

have courage. be unafraid. do your job. bring gun control legislation to a vote. we need it. we need it now. after a gunman opened fire on a crowd in las vegas killing 58 and injuring more than 500, democrats in congress are again attempting to buck the gop's inaction on gun control and push through legislation that would ban bump stocks, the accessory that allowed the gunman to fire on that crowd at nearly the rate of a machine gun. on friday i spoke to congressman john lewis about that and more. thank you very much for joining me. you were the principle speaker and one of several house members who held a rally on wednesday in capitol hill calling for tougher

gun control laws. we've been here before. we were here after newtown, you led a sit-in on the house floor calling for tougher laws. do you think we're reaching a turning point where something can get done? >> it is my hope we have reached a point where we will get some action on the part of the house and the senate. send a major piece of legislation to the president to sign into law. we have just witnessed too much. i've been around for a while. i witnessed the assassination of martin luther king jr. by a man with a rifle. i was in bobby kennedy's room at the ambassador hotel in los angeles. i've been campaigning for him. by watching television, watching him make his victory statement or speech, then shot down by a

guy with a handgun. we have to do something about the proliferation of gun violence. and as dr. king would say, the time is always right to do right. we must do right. we're losing more than 30,000 of our citizens a year as a result of gun violence. it has to stop. it must stop. i know in certain neighborhoods parents are afraid to send their children to school because of what could happen to them. >> congressman, you mentioned, of course, dr. king's assassination, bobby kennedy. after those assassinations, that did spur congress on to pass at the time meaningful gun control legislation. you cannot buy machine guns because there was gun control legislation that the nra supported. shipping guns through the mail

became illegal. is it time for the congress to turn against the nra since it has now turned against gun control? >> it's time for the congress to be brave. to be bold, to be courageous. i've said just a few days ago that we should be headlights and not taillights. we were called to lead. we must get out there and push. more than 90% of the american people, democrats and republicans wanted us to do something. we must not lose and just let them live in fear. not be afraid of the -- whether we will lose some votes here or there. that we will not receive political contribution. we have to do what's right. sometimes you have go with your gut w your heartith your heart,

soul. >> house speaker ryan threatened to sanction you and others if you repeated the sit-in. are you prepared to sit-in again in favor of gun reform legislation, and are you concerned about being sanctioned? >> i'm not afraid of being sanctioned or being arrested and taken to jail for engaging in non-violent action and peaceful protests. we have a right to protest in a peaceful, orderly, nonviolent fashion. members are not afraid. so we're prepared to use other steps, methods to dramatize the issue to make it real. to make it plain, to help educate and sensitize the american community. the people are ready for action. those of us in the congress, too

many of us are not ready. but i do think something will happen. it may take place on the senate side before it takes place on the house side. you mentioned the right to peaceful protests. i feel compelled to ask you about the proliferation of kneeling protests that have gone through the nfl, colin kaepernick started it, now it's sort of spread throughout the national football league. you had lebron james chastise the president of the united states for attacking players who choose to kneel. what do you think of the kneeling protests? >> so inspiring to see these young men standing with their owners and with managers and it's saying something. it's all right. it's saying when you see something that's not right, not fair, not just, you have to assess something. you have to do something.

guaranteed and protected by the first amendment to the constitution. people telling you don't do this, don't do that. we have a right to do it. some of these people in the '60s would have said don't go on the freedom rides, don't participate in the sit-in at the lunch counter. don't march in washington. don't mar frch from selma to montgomery. you have a right to march. it's protected by the flag. >> would a young john lewis if you were among those players, would you kneel at the national anthem? >> if i was on that court, with that owner, i would kneel with the players. a young john lewis would kneel. we may be kneeling in washington a few days to come. maybe on the floor of the house.

maybe in the rotunda, maybe on the steps of the capitol. >> i want to ask you one more question, yourself and eric holder the former attorney general of the united states have come together to fight another thing, with so much going on, that's the situation with gerrymandering. can you tell us your position on gerrymandering? there's a supreme court case being teed up. what are you and the former attorney general doing and what are your thoughts on gerrymandering? >> we have the question of how they legislate it, districts and lines have been drawn, not just at the federal level but also at the state and levels. ju we have too many politics today selecting voters, rather than voters selecting them. it's a good thing to make the political bodies much more democratic. >> congressman john lewis and

civil rights legend john lewis, always an honor to talk to you. thank you very much for your time. >> thank you. coming up, my panel weighs in on whether the tragedy in las vegas will finally move congress towards sensible gun legislation. stay with us.

we're watching developing news in london war car hit pedestrians outside the natural history museum. several people were injured. they have a person in custody. up next, the latest efforts to do something, anything on guns.

♪ if you have moderate to severe ulcerative colitis or crohn's, and your symptoms have left you with the same view, it may be time for a different perspective. if other treatments haven't worked well enough, ask your doctor about entyvio, the only biologic developed and approved just for uc and crohn's. entyvio works by focusing right in the gi-tract to help control damaging inflammation and is clinically proven to begin helping many patients achieve both symptom relief as well as remission. infusion and serious allergic reactions can happen during or after treatment. entyvio may increase risk of infection, which can be serious. while not reported with entyvio, pml, a rare, serious brain infection caused by a virus may be possible. tell your doctor if you have an infection, experience frequent infections, or have flu-like symptoms, or sores. liver problems can occur with entyvio. if your uc or crohn's medication isn't working for you, ask your gastroenterologist about entyvio.

entyvio. relief and remission within reach. ♪ hey grandpa. hey, kid. really good to see you. you too. you tell grandma you were going fishing again? maybe. (vo) the best things in life keep going. that's why i got a subaru, too. introducing the all-new crosstrek. love is out there. find it in a subaru crosstrek.

>> can you be more specific about the president's position on bump stocks? would he be open to legislation banning them? >> as i said yesterday, we want to be part of that conversation. we want to gather more information. we'll continue to do that over the coming days, and that's the current position.

it hasn't changed since yesterday. >> momentum is building on capitol hill for a new piece of gun control legislation, a ban on a device that can turn a semiautomatic weapon to the nearly automatic version that the las vegas shooter used to gun down 600 people in about nine minutes on sunday. on thursday the national rifle association weighed in saying the nra believes the device is allow ed allowed to semiautomatic rifles to function like fully automatic rifles should be subject to additional regulations. we are joined by howard dean and jean-pierre. howard, the nra did a stealthy statement where te mahey made i team like they'll have some movement on gun reform. they want the atf to do the

regulations. let me read you what the atf sent in 2010 summarizing the bump stocks intended purpose. it's intended to assist persons who's hands have limits mobility to bump fire an ar-15 rifle. in 2016 the atf sent another letter in which the firearm's chief branch offer said we find the bump stock is a firearm part, and is not regulated as a firearm under the gun control act and the national firearm's act. they already issued that determination. what kind of game is the nra playing here? >> the nra has become a far right extremist fund-raising group. i think they initially started out this way because this goes -- this is pre-trump, when they realize td the republican party would have to move back to the middle or they would be out of business.

so that's what they are, they are a right wing extremist organization. their positions have become ridiculous. i was actually endorsed by the national rifle association, every race i ran in vermont. i don't recognize this nra. so this is the kind of thing that -- i think if that's all congress does, it's useless. first of all, people will break the law and do it any way. second of all, you can kill almost as many people with a semiautomatic. i'm not in favor of taking guns away from hunters, but i'm in favor of making sure we have sensible, sane gun laws to stop this wholesale slaughter of the american people. >> that's an important point. nobody has called for gun reform legislation calling for taking away guns from hunters. i grew up in colorado. nobody is talking about that. do you think that part of the reason the nra has become so extreme is that they have competition? there's another group called the gun owner's group of america

that is further to the right than the nra. they issued a statement on this idea of bump stock legislation saying we see this as an item that is certainly protected by the second amendment and realistically they are already on the market, passing a law banning them won't stop guys like the creep in las vegas. they added he's a creep. that's nice. do you think their further extremism keeps the nra in line and refusing to do anything on gun control? >> i think everybody is trying to out far right each other. at the end of the day, it's up to republicans. republicans have to look themselves in the mirror and figure out are they owned by the nra or do they work with the american people or for the american people. i don't know how they can look at themselves in mirror after 20 young kids were murdered by gun violence and they did nothing. after two of their own were victims of gun violence, they did nothing.

we're living in an epidemic here. there have been 521 mass shootings in 477 days since orlando. they have still done nothing. 11,000 people have died alone this year by gun violence. nothing has been done. joy, there was a time where a man got on an airplane with explosives in his shoes, and what happened after that? we were able to -- now people have to take off their shoes before going through security and getting on a plane that only took one person. we are a country able to put a man on the moon. why can't we deal with this really important issue? >> you know, when she mentions one of their own, she talks about steve scalise, shot by a gunman. gabby giffords years ago was shot by a gunman. let's listen to steve scalise being interviewed by chuck todd

of nbc about bump stock regulations. >> if you talked to anybody about a week ago, most people including myself didn't know what a bump stock was. >> me, too. >> people want to rush to judgment. they have a bill written already. minority leader nancy pelosi said she already wants it to be a slippery slope. she doesn't want to stop at bump stocks, they want to limit the rights of gun owners. it's a bit early for people to say they know what to do to fix this problem. i know people are asking the atf go back and review their 2010 decision. >> do you think they should? >> i think they should and they are. >> i'm old enough to remember when james brady being shot moved ronald reagan to be in favor of some sensible regulations. that's not the case. this is a man who's a victim of gun violence himself and he's going to the nancy pelosi card. >> he went to the nancy pelosi card. he went to the slippery slope card immediately as well this is

less about -- the nra is relevant here, but this is an anti-gun law party, so the idea whether nra says anything different or not, it doesn't matter that much. i have a hard time seeing a bill coming to this house right now or this senate and being put on the floor and voted on and passing. like the dreamers issue, my guess is the ma jjority of the members of the house would vote for a limit on bump stocks, the same way they would vote for a dreamers bill if it was on the floor. the question is can it make it to the floor? i think steve scalise is in the leadership. that tells you something. the odds of a bill -- as we get further away from the controversy. republicans will move away from the issue and brush it off, move aside. they don't want to act on gun control. we know that for a long time.

it's because of where the party is now as a whole. >> you are in a unique position here. you worked at breitbart, you have a lot of connections to the country music world and that industry. we saw one member of the band playing when this horrific massacre took place go on record and say he's changed his mind. they had guns in their van, they were useless to them. does that kind of thing start to move the sort of republican base on this issue? or are they just fixed in place? bannon already said it's a non-starter. >> i think when you have people who are cultural figures to a lot of people who are a part of the gun community, move their opinion and say it's okay to change your mind. it's okay to want sensible reform. it has nothing to taking away rights. it's about protecting gun owners rights, it's about making sure crazy people don't have guns. as i talk to different artists in the country music community this last week, there's an appetite to have a thoughtful conversation about it. the idea that we have to choose

between having the second amendment and being safe, why do we have to choose? why can't we have both of those? that's what we should be striving for. a lot of artists are talking amongst themselves about expressing a desire for change to happen. every single person in that crowd could have had a gun. it would not have affected the outcome. this strikes closer to home. all of us know what it means to be at an entertaining event, we can visualize being in that situation. that's terrifying to realize. why can't we all get together and agree we need to do some common sense things, and it has nothing to do with taking away guns or infringing on second amendment rights. >> if more artists came out, would they get dixie chicked? would they get shunned? >> no, they have to do it together. they have to get together and have a show of support and force and do it in a way where it's

impossible to black list a bunch of these artists all at one team. >> howard dean, similar question to you. you come from a rural state that has lots of gun owners. will it take people who are gun owners to come out and start being public the way that gabby giffords and her husband have in order to have congress have the courage to act? >> that's the best way to do it. having people appealing to the folks who are so concerned about their own gun ownership and so forth is one way. there's another way, that's votes. congress is afraid. that's the problem and the reason why coming is a fangress failure, they're afraid of their own failure and extreme ends so let's have the democrats run on a reasonable form of gun control. the numbers nationally are 60%, 70% that this is ridiculous what's going on. if we pick up a lot of seats on that issue, suddenly the

republican party will stop listening to the far right extremists. >> is the democratic party organized to do that? >> i hope so. i agree with howard dean. that's the direction we need to go to, but we don't need weapons of war on the streets of our country. we don't need military grade or asaumt weapsault weapons. you don't need that to shoot a deer. you don't need a bump stock for sportsmanship. people have said it's not reliable. you don't need these weapons out there. we have to -- it really sits in the republican party. they have the majority. it's up to them to say, hey, we're going to finally come together and deal with this issue. >> yeah. yet the first act that donald trump, one of his earliest executive orders was to make it easier for people ajude dadjudi mentally incompetent to buy

guns. that's what they're going their power. we'll see. kurt, perry, howard, karine, thank you all. coming up, rob reiner joins me for the latest on russiagate, and we check in with the mayor of san juan. more "a.m. joy" after the break. what powers the digital world. communication. that's why a cutting edge university counts on centurylink to keep their global campus connected. and why a pro football team chose us to deliver fiber-enabled broadband to more than 65,000 fans.

and why a leading car brand counts on us to keep their dealer network streamlined and nimble. businesses count on communication, and communication counts on centurylink. take 5, guys. tired of your bladder always cutting into your day? you may have overactive bladder, or oab. that's it! we really need to get with the program and see the doctor. take charge and ask your doctor about myrbetriq (mirabegron)

for oab symptoms of urgency, frequency and leakage. it's the first and only oab treatment in its class. myrbetriq may cause serious allergic reactions. if you experience swelling of the face, lips, throat or tongue, or difficulty breathing, stop taking myrbetriq and tell your doctor right away. myrbetriq may increase blood pressure. tell your doctor right away if you have trouble emptying your bladder or have a weak urine stream. myrbetriq may affect or be affected by other medications. before taking myrbetriq, tell your doctor if you have liver or kidney problems. common side effects include increased blood pressure, common cold symptoms, urinary tract infection, constipation, diarrhea, dizziness and headache. okay, time to do this! don't let your bladder always take the lead. ask your doctor if myrbetriq is right for you. and visit myrbetriq.com to learn more. listen up, heart disease. you too, unnecessary er visits. and hey, unmanaged depression, don't get too comfortable. we're talking to you, cost inefficiencies, and data without insights. and fragmented care, stop getting in the way of patient recovery

and pay attention. every single one of you is on our list. at optum, we're partnering across the health system to tackle its biggest challenges. . coming up, a 2012 fraud investigation into ivanka and donald trump jr. has come to light. what happens next? stay with us.

when heartburn hits, fight back fast with tums smoothies. it starts dissolving the instant it touches your tongue. and neutralizes stomach acid at the source. ♪ tum -tum -tum -tum smoothies! only from tums theseare heading back home.y oil thanks to dawn, rescue workers only trust dawn, because it's tough on grease yet gentle. i am home, i am home, i am home

anyone who calls it a hobby doesn't understand. we know that a person's passion is what drives them. [ clapping ] and that's why every memorial we create is a true reflection of the individual. only a dignity memorial professional can celebrate a life like no other. find out how at sanfranciscodignity.com.

so we learned this week that two of the president's adult children ivanka and donald junior came very close to being charged with felony fraud for their sales tactics in marketing the trump soho building to would be buyers. new york prosecutors were preparing a case against them in 2012, but it was dropped after

the manhattan district attorney overruled his staff just after getting a visit from donald trump's attorney, who had donated $25,000 to vance's campaign. joining me now is richard painter. i want to read a little bit of the background here on this case just for our audience. in the spring of 2012, this is the pro publica peace. for two years prosecutors in the manhattan d.a.'s office had been building a criminal case against them related to trump soho, a condo building. they were sending e-mails making it clear they were aware they were using inflated figures to market the building. in one of the e-mails, according to four people who have seen it, the trumps discussed how to coordinate false information they've given perspective buyers. they word that a reporter might be onto them.

donald junior spoke reassuringly to a broker who is concerned about the false statements saying no one would ever find out. how could that happened and they were not indicted or charged? >> it's very difficult to prove fraud, criminal fraud in real estate transactions. there's a lot of slick dealing in new york real estate. i used to practice law in new york and still actually am a member of the new york bar. unfortunately, there's a lot of slick dealing in new york. i have to say the trump family has a reputation for being particularly sharp in their dealings and they have for decades. proving criminal intent is very, very difficult in these cases. so i think that cy vance, who is very well respected as a prosecutor, probably made the right judgment call not to

pursue it. but it's very troubling that we have this level of dishonest dealing by people who are now associated with the president of the united states. and one of them, ivanka is now in the white house. i have to say this type of dealing would have been a disqualifier for anybody serving in the bush administration, the obama administration or any previous administrations. >> let's talk a little bit about the ethics. you mentioned cy vance. there's a timeline. in 2010 the office opens an investigation into ivanka and don junior. then in 2012 trump's lawyer donated $25,000 to cyrus vance's reelection campaign. in august of 2012 prosecutors drop the case. in 2013, kasowitz hosts a fund-raiser for vance and donated $32,000.

cy vance says this was a two-year investigation that never produced sufficient evidence to support a criminal prosecution. no outside attorney influenced my decision in this matter. kasowitz said i donated to cy vance's company because i was impressed with him as a person of integrity. those statements aside, is there an ethical problem here for cyrus vance? >> it is very difficult to prosecutor cases if you can't get buyers of apartment units to come forward and be willing to support a criminal indictment. that's critical. you need those witnesses. the campaign contribution system, of course, is a mess. we should not be electing prosecutors if they're going to have to take campaign contributions from lawyers.

the campaign contribution was returned because that's the policy of the office and most offices, that if the lawyer has a case pending before the prosecutor, the campaign process accuse needs to contribution needs to be returned. it certainly looks bad, but i think cy vance has a very good reputation in new york for making the right calls on these things. kasowitz and the trump family have whatever reputation they've got. i'm not going to comment any further. >> one of the things that hindered cyrus vance's case is that the settlement the trump soho team came to with the potential buyers -- they gave them back deposits but they had to sign an agreement essentially

not to cooperate with the prosecutor. the trump soho people may remember that name because one of the partners in it is felix s sater. he's pleaded guilty to racketeering. he's one of trump's business partners he pretends he doesn't remember. your thoughts on that? >> i remember from my time is new york city that donald trump after he didn't pay back the bankers and the bondholders on the taj mahal, he couldn't find partners in new york. new yorkers have an annoying habit. they want to be paid back. he had to go and get money somewhere. we don't know where, but we see a lot of russian names coming up. this is exactly what we need to find out, how much of the debt capital and the joint venture

capital in the trump empire is coming from the russians. that's what bob mueller needs to be figuring out. that's a real danger for our country. rob ry we don't know what we're dealing with. he calls himself the "snowman killer." he's completely insane. mister policeman, i gave you all the clues. by the time you read this i will have built a new snowman. the snowman. rated r.

itwhat's possible.nk rethink the experience. rethink your allergy pills. flonase sensimist allergy relief uses unique mistpro technology and helps block

6 key inflammatory substances with a gentle mist. most allergy pills only block one. and 6 is greater than one. rethink your allergy relief. flonase sensimist. ♪ the infamous trump russia dossier is back in the news. members of special counsel robert mueller's team traveled to meet christopher steele, the former british intelligence officer who put together that 35-page document alleging trump/russia collusion. it contains some salacious and very personal claims about donald trump's actions in the runup to the 2016 election. trump has denied the allegations. on wednesday richard burr said that when it comes to the dossier, the investigation has hit something of a roadblock. >> as it relates to the steele

dossier, unfortunately the committee has hit a wall. we have on several occasions made attempts to contact mr. steele to meet with mr. steele to include personally the vice chairman and myself as two individuals making that connection. those offers have gone unaccepted. >> three sources dispute that characterization by senator burr. one source close to steele said that in late september steele relayed to washington through an associate that steele, in fact, would be happy to meet with burr and mark warner of virginia. joining me is rob reiner. also david corwin of mother jones. we've had not only those three sources, but we now have a senate committee response to the

nbc news report saying, the committee has made multiple requests to meet with mr. steele over the last nine months, including out reach to his attorneys. we remain open to any credible offer to meet with mr. steele. what do you make of it? >> this is very confusing. there's some kind of disconnect here. clearly steele is saying he'll make himself available. there must be some reason why maybe the terms of the meeting are not agreeable to both sides. but i don't know, quite frankly, why that is. >> do you have any sourcing on that, david corn, as to what this disconnect is? both of these people cannot be right. >> that's true. we know a couple of things that are informative here. steele has met extensively already with the fbi and shared his memos and talked to them about his sources. so the fbi has long been in touch with chris steele even before robert mueller took over the investigation. we also know he's being sued,

steele, in england and they also want him to testify in a case in florida, a suit against buzzfeed. he may be somewhat reluck tanct talk to committees and he may be thinking more of the house republicans or the judiciary committee where there are lots of leaks and they're using -- it's a complicated point -- republicans are trying to make the steele memos an issue in saying that it was the product of democratic fund-raising or russian disinformation. and because the fbi used it as part of its investigation of trump, that poisons the fbi investigation. so they have been gunning for him. maybe he didn't discern a difference between the house republican approach, the senate judiciary approach and that of the senate republican intelligence committee. now that he's made clear that he will talk to them, probably in england, not here, i hope that

burr comes back and says we've worked it out. >> that is a key point. if you listen to burr, he keeps harping on the committee would want to know the sources of his information, who he talked to and also who paid for that information. >> right. they are the intelligence committee, after all. they can go into a skiff and that is classified information and they are bound by law not to reveal classified information. so they can receive that. they have the capability of receiving that. and as david just pointed out, the fbi has already received that and so has robert mueller. so that seems to be worked out. the one thing that david mentioned, that they're trying to skew this as being a democratic attack on donald trump, but what we know of this dossier or the genesis of it is that it was for republicans in the primary to go after donald

trump. >> yeah. it's kind of hard to make that case. on the issue of the trump dossier, there have been some things in it that have already checked out. we know it did talk about a plot to get into the election and to skew it in the direction of donald trump. there are some things in it that are unverified, the question of whether there was an actual conspiracy or cooperation from the trump campaign. i would imagine this dossier was incredibly useful to bob mueller. >> i think you're absolutely right. the other part that disturbs me about the dossier is the fact that this information was so readily available. what concerns me is we're talking about mueller, we're talking about an investigation into something that occurred a year ago. what are the russians doing today? when you think about 2016, the reality is with this information that came out in the dossier, this was somewhat known. why weren't we able to stop this before the election? why wasn't there ability to go

and say this stuff is happening, what can we do to stop it? we seem to be completely blindsided by this. we've been oou outmaneuvered by russians. i don't see anyone saying how do we fix counter intelligence. >> it's happening now. that's the reason we formed the committee to investigate russia, because this is a national security issue. whenever our country's been attacked whether it's pearl harbor or 9/11, we've always come together. this is the first time we are not doing anything to protect ourselves nap's because we have a president who -- i think there's a confluence of things here, but he's basically somebody who has been compromised and who's worried about the legitimacy of his election. he is not taking a position to

do what the president is supposed to do, which is to make us safe. we are not being made safe. there's no emphasis on trying to bolster our national security in 2018 and 2020. >> the fact that he was the beneficiary of this -- by the way, republicans are starting to realize that part of the information that the gleaned by the russians was used against his primary opponents. do you think that donald trump does worry about his election and was the beneficiary, that essentially we're standing down as to what we'll do going forward? >> he's been uncooperated. he fired the people who investigated him. he fired comey. there should be an investigation into obstruction of justice. i think the gop realizes that if the election was tampered with, which seems quite obvious, that

they as a party are affected and that the legitimacy of their vote might be affected. i think a lot of them are reluctant to get into this, because it effects not only trump but local and state elections, et cetera. this is not just important for what's happened in the past. it's important for what's happening now. and it's important for what's happening in 2018. if we don't have any kind of real cyber security, good faith investigation of espionage, conspiracy for cooperation, then we're never going to solve this problem. we're going to be questioning the integrity and legitimacy of all our elections going forward. >> you have in the mother jones report there's a difference of opinion to the senate intel leaders. ron widen is disputing this idea from richard burr that he said he could guarantee there was no hacking of the machines.

>> at the press conference the committee held, he said he can guarantee that whatever russian meddling there was, it doesn't affect the vote tallies. i spoke to ron widen, a democratic member of the intelligence committee. he said, you can't say that. there's no forensic analysis or paper trail. we haven't finished learning what the russian campaign or covert operation entailed. we're now discovering over a year later there were facebook ads. we don't know what happened with twitter or google. we do know the intelligence committee put out an assessment saying that the e-mail hack and release efforts that targeted hillary clinton were part of a much wider campaign of information warfare. we don't know how wide that was and it could well be that probing state voter registration

systems -- we're all part of something much faster. it's really important not just what mueller does, but that you have honest and effective criminal investigations to let us know. it's unclear whether that's going to happen, joy. >> you're trying with the committee to investigate rush to synthesize this all in one place. when i talk to people about this case, there's so much information and it's all so different -- you've got facebook, the hacking of the dnc. how the you put it into a narrative that people can actually understand so they know how important it is? >> we tried to be a compendium, to put it all in one place so they can see the history of what russia has been doing since the cold war and on. we see the key players. we discussed cyber security. we also have the breaking news of the day. it's all about trying to secure our countery. we don't even have a head of

homeland security here. >> yeah. >> i mean, this is like -- you know, we're just in the wild west here and we have to take care of ourselves. we don't have a president protecting us in this new war battlefield which is cyber war. >> i know that frustrated you because we don't have a plan for 2018 and 2020. >> that's right. i can't say this loud enough. we should focus on trump, we should focus on the investigation. but the reality is that vladimir putin hates democracy. this was an attack against democracy not just against the united states but in germany, the u.k. and trafrance and now spain. i can tell you there's one person who doesn't care about what bob mueller finds. that's vladimir putin. he is moving on. their hate for democracy stands. his intent to come after

democracy stands. and he will find other avenues to do this. if we don't get our head in the game, this is just going to happen again. >> it does seem there is not a great deal of dread and fear of russia particularly among republican voters here. >> you can't feel it. >> they're acting as if they are completely assured of their win in 2018, which is interesting given that so many of their policies have been condemned and broadly unpopular like trumpcare. trump's numbers are very low. he's at a 32% approval rating. i think why they're so confident comes with efforts to basically rig that election. trump has been collaborating with russia since he got into office. he gave state secrets to russian visitors back in may in the oval office. he met with putin twice privately at the g 20. he has been continually

committing these acts. i fear next year we will be doing a similar retrospective of everything that happened in 2017 that was not dress addressed at time. >> are you worried about this election, rob? >> i am. we can't feel this. it's not like a bomb dropped somewhere. this is a very insidious kind of attack. great civilizations last anywhere from 250-300 years. we're at 241 right now. this thing is eating away at the fabric of our democracy. unless we with hair on fire -- and i don't have much hair. we have to really focus on this because our democracy is at stake stake. make no mistake about it. >> it's asymmetrical warfare

which is why putin uses it. we have an open media system. we're much easier to manipulate. we're very vulnerable if we don't band together. >> france figured it out. just sayin'. up next, i talk to the mayor of san juan and the us representative from the virgin islands. discover card.

hey. what can you tell me about your new social security alerts? oh! we'll alert you if we find your social security number on any one of thousands of risky sites, so you'll be in the know. ooh. sushi. ugh. being in the know is a good thing. sign up online for free. discover social security alerts.

we are also praying for the people of puerto rico. we love puerto rico. and we also love puerto rico.

>> wow. well donald trump may get a kick out of pronouncing puerto rico, but the situation on the island and the u.s. virgin islands is no laughing matter. as of saturday, only 10% of puerto rico has power and just over half the island has access to drinking water. these metrics, so important for monitoring the process of recovery efforts, have now become harder to find. fema removed these stats from its page on hurricane maria, replacing them with ones that make the donald trump administration look good. fema officials deny they took down the stats in order to try to hide the lack of progress. >> we'll include that on our website. i think that website you're referencing is focused more on the federal response, but there is certainly no intention to take it down. >> because it was curious because it was there and all of a sudden there was more favorable data. >> that's not the case. >> okay. >> in fact, just because the

data is getting better doesn't mean we're trying to manipulate it. >> mm-hm. as of now a few of the metrics have reappeared on the fema website. jo madam mayor, i'm going to go to you on this first. the trump administration took down some of the statistics that we've all been using to try to measure the progress of the recovery efforts on the island. what we do know is as of october 7th, only 7% of the island had power. 44% have cell service and 55% have potable water. >> thank you for the opportunity and my greetings to the congressman. he was kind enough to be in san juan last week.

it's not the statistics. i keep hearing all about statistics. well, it isn't about that. it's about human lives. i had yet the mayor of a town who said, look, we haven't seen of anyone trying to pull up our electrical system. we don't have enough food, we don't have enough water, we don't have any baby supplies. so the municipality of san juan shared some of what we got. the mayor of a town right in the path of where the hurricane's eye hit said, look, i just don't have enough. that's why i keep talking about a robust and continuous supply chain of aid. we are doing much better in that sense because we're getting a lot of private donations. whatever private donations san juan gets, we share with

everyone. i had a conversation with the office of the president of the dominican republic. they are sending 14 containers full of food and provisions to san juan to be dealt with in san juan and also for us to distribute not only for the dominicans that live in puerto rico but for the entire population. that is one of three shipments they are going to be sending. we have gotten stuff from new york, miami beach, from california, from san diego. the realities -- there's a line of a few good men, the movie, that says you want the truth? you can't handle the truth. that's exactly what is happening. yesterday around 9:30 in the evening i had a very good conversation with assistant secretary from homeland security. he seemed to be a man that's a

doer that is not here to listen to what has been told from an air conditioned building but to be out in the field and fill that gap. based on the people that died the day of the hurricane is a gross misunderstanding of what a humanitarian crisis is all about. i have to say i do not know -- we have an american flag in the colise coliseum. we have it right smack in the middle and it is a testament to the will, the power and the generosity, especially of the people of new york city. so many brothers and sisters that have come to help and that are doing all they can and are helping because it's not getting boots on the ground. it's making sure that the boots that you have here, the people that you have here have what they need in order to make a

difference. >> and as -- >> it sounds kind of fishy, don't you think? >> it does. there is obviously a great deal of love between new york and the island of puerto rico because there's so many people here who are of puerto rican extraction. when you hear the president of the united states and his administration focus on how many fema people they deployed but you hear the mayor of san juan saying they're not in the right places and then when you hear the president mocking an accent and laughing about puerto rico, what do you think? >> this is not a comedy show. this is a real humanitarian crisis that going on our third week continues to unfold. i was there in san juan with carmen and i saw her respond to a hospital where the generator went down and 41 patients were

there, 11 of them on life support. by the time we got to the hospital, the ambulances were lined up to take them out to other hospitals. that's the kind of action we need on the ground. i'm going now to northern manhattan for a relief effort and later to the bongs. bronx. the entire city is coming around to support puerto rico. we're doing a better job than the federal administration. >> that's sad. >> the people in new york city are doing a better job than the administration. >> celebrities are being very proactive. where is congress in this? is there going to be a bill to deal with puerto rico's debt? there's talk maybe this crushing debt should be the done away with. congress could help. what is congress doing? >> i came out with a ten-point plan which includes mediate funding. we didn't do it last week. we have to do it this week. we're going on the third week of this crisis. municipalities have paid close

to over $180 million towards the debt. we should return some of that money and put a moratorium on the debt. if the fat cats in washington want their money back, they better make sure puerto rico gets back on its feet. otherwise they get nothing. this is important not only for the fiscal health of puerto rico, but for saving lives. this crisis continues to unfold every day. >> saving american lives and people should just remember that is what this is about. and now i want to bring in representative of the virgin islands on the phone with me from st. croix. the untold story here, look at what's happened in the

devastation in puerto rico is there's also been devastation on the virgin islands, which we don't hear a lot about. >> as you're aware, i've been coming back and forth home to the virgin islands, st. thomas, st. john and st. croix and also racing back up to d.c. as we're working on these supplementals and other pieces of legislation. yesterday i came down to st. croix with vice president pence. i think we got a really good over view of the progress that's made in the virgin islands and the work that still needs to be done. my conversation with him on the plane in our briefings was that while we have been devastated -- you know, both of our hospitals gone, four schools gone, lots of damage to other infrastructure buildings, ports and never mind people's homes and lives, that we were already operating at a

deficit. and it is important for the federal government and congress, who have the responsibility of the territories, to step up and create parity and equality for the territories, both puerto rico and the virgin islands in the rebuilding and to really put us on a playing field that will allow us to be self-sufficient and gain financial maturity and self-sufficiency in this process. how do we not just rebuild, but how do we leapfrog the technologies and the issues of energy, space and time that have really kept us back from being all that we can be in the caribbean basin? and i'm hoping that that message resonated with him. he seemed to be very compassionate and concerned about the people that he met and the conversations that he had and we'll work from there. >> just to give folks an update, the great producers of this show did reach out to fema to try to get statistics on the virgin islands. we got that 20% of the residents

have power, 8% of residents in st. croix have power, 31% of cell coverage is operating territory wide. there's a boil water order in effect. the virgin islands are often ignored by politicians. this is the quote. they're not really on the radar, sally jewel said. when she would try to get members of congress to make note of issues in the virgin islands, she would be met with incred incredulity. >> everyone in the united states was talking about chip and support. there was language in there for puerto rico. they had completely forget lly

the virgin islands. >> i think we lost the congresswoman. very quickly before we go, is that going to get addressed? >> that should get dresseaddres. the virgin islands are forget . forgotten. they don't have the infrastructure even that puerto rico has. they got hit hard by two hurricanes. coming up, donald trump makes it harder for women to get birth control. color me surprised. and now, i help people find discounts,

like paperless, multi-car, and safe driver, that help them save on their car insurance. any questions? -yeah. -how do you go to the bathroom? great. any insurance-related questions? -mm-hmm. -do you have a girlfriend? uh, i'm actually focusing on my career right now, saving people nearly $600 when they switch, so... where's your belly button? [ sighs ] i've got to start booking better gigs.

one year ago today, donald trump's now infamous access

hollywood tape dominated the news cycle. that person in this tape is the current president of the united states. we're going to play it for you. >> on friday the woman's advocacy group ultraviolet played that tape on a 12-hour loop on the national mall. on friday the trump administration got their hands on something else, rolling back a birth control mandate. bet you didn't see that one coming, ladies. id, but d'ya thik our recent online sales success seems a little... strange? na. ever since we switched to fedex ground business has been great. they're affordable and fast... maybe "too affordable and fast." what if... "people" aren't buying these books online, but "they" are buying them to protect their secrets?!?! hi bill. if that is your real name.

it's william actually. hmph! affordable, fast fedex ground. i've always had that issue with the seeds getting under my denture. super poligrip free. it creates a seal of the dentures in my mouth. just a few dabs is clinically proven to seal out more food particles. try super poligrip free. ♪

♪ stare with me into the abyss ( ♪ )

on friday, donald trump continues his efforts to undo every obama thing. this time ending the obama era mandate that employers cover birth control as part of employee health plans. companies can now refuse to pay as long as they have sincerely held religious or moral

objections to doing so. this would, quote, provide relief to those who have been under the thumb of the federal government. i'll go around the table and get everybody's reactions to this. it's not exactly a surprise. it's not as if the republican party has not been pushing. marco rubio back in 2012 introduced a bill to do exactly what donald trump is doing now to say that women can't get birth control pills covered in their health plans. >> right. essentially you saw around 2010 a push by state legislatures all over the country, republicans pushing back against women's health care. i say health care because birth control is health care. and also they conflate abortion and birth control as if they're

the same thing. we're basing all of this on pseudoscience and this item that women should not be able to choose what they do with their own bodies and their reproduction. i really think we have to as women push back very hard. i think it's great that we had the women's march in january, but what are we going to do now that they're coming for our birth control? without birth control, you can't determine anything in your life. without that freedom, we're second class citizens. women everywhere and men who have sex should probably prioritize this issue so that we're not second class citizens. >> you have spent a lot of time interviewing people in the anti-abortion movement. is it hysterical or over the top to say that in the end, their end game is that they would like to see birth control be illegal? >> well, i think they've done a

really good job of setting this up as an issue that if you listen to the framing you hear from them, obama was forcing nones nuns to hand out birth control pills. they've managed to portray themselves as the oppressed minority. that kind of slippery slope is what we're afraid of. even if they don't want to ban birth control, we all know that a right on paper is not really a right. the reason these regulations exist in the first place is because we have one of the highest rates of unintended pregnancy in the western industrialized world. we know how to prevent unwanted pregnancy. that's making sure people have seamless continuous access to chr contraception they can afford.

we also had to step back and say the reason these regulations -- the birth control regulations were just one of many preventive care regulations. the point was to treat women's health care like other health care, like heart checkups, like testing for genetic disorders. it was supposed to be that this is a normal part of women's health care because it's an incredibly common part of health care. once you start poking holes in that seamlessness, you end up having a regime where women are not able to control this valid part of their health care. >> what you've seen on the other side, the push back against people who are upset about this rule change is, i don't see why i should have to pay for women's promiscuity. why should i have to pay for women to buy birth control pills? what is the answer to that? >> i don't know why i have to pay for men's viagra or penis pumps. i really want to quote civil rights icon fanny lou hamer who

famously said nobody's free until everybody's free. in 2017 america women are not free. this is a blatant massive discriminatory act against women's health care. birth control is health care. i feel like we're living in a real life episode of "handmaid's tale." since 2013 there's only been positive things that have happened since this obamacare provision was passed. unintended pregnancies have dropped. women saved $1.4 billion in birth control costs since 2013. i feel like the only clear objective the trump administration has is to systematically undo every one of obama's legacies.sentially what administration is doing -- they

have a big part of their base who are evangelical christians who want these laws passed. the attorney general released an order on religious liberty that critics say will allow just about anyone to discriminate against lgbt or religious groups to say they have sincere believes that cannot be questioned by the government. >> we will not allow people of faith to be targeted, bullied or silenced anymore. >> and i should clarify that i spoke about marco rubio's 2012 bill. his bill in 2012 would have allowed millions of women to lose birth control access. >> the problem with this is he really means christian. if we were talking about this in another context -- conservatives have decried and feared eed s e

sharee -- sharia law. they have an idealogical goal in mind to put women back in their proper place in society, which is not the freedom to determine when and how they want to have children. let's be clear on that. if this was muslims demanding that women do particular things based on their religion, donald trump would not be agreeing with that. he would not be in the rose garden saying those people were victimins of discrimination. you have to put it in the proper frame. this is about christianity. in this country, that's not what we were about. we were literally founded on the opposite of that. >> you have the aclu suing the state of california and massachusetts have filed lawsuits looking to block

trump's roll back of the contraceptive mandate. does it have a chance? >> sure. what they're saying is only health care use by women is being targeted in this particular way and that functions as a discrimination on the basis of sex. it's a tax on women. we'll see what the supreme court says. they have previously opened all kinds of religious accommodations. the trump administration decided that hobby lobby was not enough. they wanted to put it into regulation. this is just the beginning of the chipping away at birth control access. >> this is only for one particular branch of christianity that this is being done on behalf of. >> exactly. when extremists come into town -- and this is all over the world between christian extremists and muslim extremists. what do they do? they always go after women's rights. it's a very creepy and scary message about who donald trump is catering to. he's throwing red meat once

again to his base. and after the biggest mass shooting in american history, what is this administration's response? birth control? we need to be talking about gun control. it is so disturbing on so many levels that this is the administration's response and the timing could not be more troublesome. >> yeah. we cannot regulate guns apparently. >> but we can regulate reproductive organs. for your heart...

your joints... or your digestion... so why wouldn't you take something for the most important part of you... your brain. with an ingredient originally found in jellyfish, prevagen is now the number one selling brain health supplement in drug stores nationwide. prevagen. the name to remember. ♪ ♪ you nervous? ♪ ♪

♪ ♪

the jobs report just came out with numbers that the twe tweeter in chief probably won't post about. thank you so much. thank you! so we're a go? yes! we got a yes! what does that mean for purchasing? purchase. let's do this. got it. book the flights! hai! si! si! ya! ya! ya! what does that mean for us?

we can get stuff. what's it mean for shipping? ship the goods. you're a go! you got the green light. that means go! oh, yeah. start saying yes to your company's best ideas. we're gonna hit our launch date! (scream) thank you! goodbye! let us help with money and know-how, so you can get business done. american express open.

donald trump's twitter history includes no shortage of

dubious claims about president obama from his birth place to his record on the economy. which, by the way, included a record 75 straight months of job growth. and yet trump has been uncharacteristically quiet, silent in fact on the most recent jobs numbers under his own presidency, which as of friday presides over the first monthly job losses in seven years. now, economists explained that the 33,000 lost jobs are a temporary decline after the labor market took a hit caused by disruptions from the recent hurricanes, but a loss is still a loss, particularly for a president who ran as a job creator and repeatedly made this promise to the american people. >> we're going to start winning again, because we don't win anymore. we never win. we are going to win, win, win. you're going to call. you're going to say, mr. president, please, we can't take it anymore. we can't win anymore like this. mr. president, you're driving us crazy. you're winning too much. >> zerlina maxwell.

are you sick of winning it? >> i'm so sick of winning. i don't know what to do. health care, tax reforms, jobs. we're making america great. i'm sure every day donald trump is absolutely exhausted. if this interruption had happened can you imagine on obama's watch? the gop would be losing their mind. granted, we have to take into consideration as you stated irma and harvey, which obviously affected these numbers, but if this had happened on obama's watch the gop would be blaming hill even for the hurricanes. >> let alone hillary. if hillary clinton were the president and the job numbers went in this direction, you'd have the republicans screaming where are the jobs? >> absolutely. every single month they have been taking credit for good jobs numbers and you see no tweet when the jobs numbers are bad. it was obama that actually helped the jobs numbers be good this entire time. so of course they were taking credit for obama's work. now that it's gone down, they take no credit. you see no tweet, no bragging and sarah huckabee sanders is not in the white house pressroom

talking about the jobs numbers while she's lecturing the media on telling the truth and she lies every day. i just think that they actually need to do something. pass a bill, some legislation perhaps? >> that's too bad. you know what, the thing that's interesting too, at the same time that donald trump takes credit for job numbers he doesn't get credit for, is quiet when they go down, they're also going after health care which interestingly enough would also hurt jobs as well because so many jobs were created by the affordable care act, all the intermediaries that helped people sign up, they're not even working with them so they're actually doing things to actually make this worse. >> right. it will create jobs, it will reduce spending, but i think we have to step back and think how people like to say there's a tweet for everything when it comes to donald trump. obviously we could pull up a bunch of tweets in which he said that either the job numbers are illegitimate, they're being juked or they're cherry picking figures and saying that the economy is in the tank. let's step back. i mean facts are being weaponized, are being distorted.

we're living in a moment where we can't trust the president to tell the truth about what's happening or to acknowledge the reality. i just think we should stop and think about what a dangerous point we are in where we have to step back and say, wait, remember what you said before because we are so far down the road right now, it's easy to lose track of how the very truth has been weaponized. >> that's a very good point. during the obama administration you had donald trump and other people, other republicans claiming that he was lying about the job numbers, that when good jobs numbers would come out that it was just made up. we've just seen fema take data off of its website so that you can no longer find out how hurricane recovery is going. at what point do we worry that if a bad jobs number or batted economic number comes out that they will take it off the website and not report it? >> we should be worried right now. this is what happens in countries that are not democraci democracies.

this is what happens in dictatorships. not only do we have a president that tweets out fake news any time there's news that he doesn't like, but we're also having an issue where the public is having information withheld from them. why did fema do that? accurate statistics about lack of clean -- access to clean water, electricity being taken off the website. so it's not only about not liking the news that he's seeing, but it's also about access to complete information. it's very worrying and very troubling and we should be worried now. >> are democrats prepared to do anything about any of this? >> i don't know. i honestly don't know. but that's not really a shade to democrats, it's more so that i think every single day there's 25 different stories that are horrible that this administration is doing, whether to hurt people of color, hurt women, hurt poor people. so i think that it's hard to figure out where to aim your energy. but i think that democrats are focused on 2018. i think nancy pelosi is focused on fund-raising for democrats in 2018 and that's really the only thing we can do at this moment

to prevent some of this bad stuff from happening. >> hopefully women are paying attention, and you should. we're going to bring this panel back. and that is our show for today. thanks for joining us. join us for more "a.m. joy" tomorrow. in the meantime, keep it right here on msnbc. (vo) more "doing chores for mom" per roll more "doing chores for dad" per roll more "earning something you love" per roll bounty is more absorbent, so the roll can last 50% longer than the leading ordinary brand. so you get more "life" per roll. bounty the quicker picker upper.

remember that accident i got in with the pole, and i had to make a claim and all that? is that whole thing still dragging on? no, i took some pics with the app and... filed a claim, but... you know how they send you money to cover repairs and... they took forever to pay you, right? no, i got paid right away, but... at the very end of it all, my agent...

wouldn't even call you back, right? no, she called to see if i was happy. but if i wasn't happy with my claim experience for any reason, they'd give me my money back, no questions asked. can you believe that? no. the claim satisfaction guarantee, only from allstate. switching to allstate is worth it. good day, everyone. i'm alex witt here at msnbc world headquarters in new york. it is high noon here in the east, 9:00 a.m. out west and here's what's happening. breaking news this hour. a car rolls into pedestrians near a tourist attraction in london. police are trying to determine what happened. we've got a live report coming your way next. obamacare fix take two. president trump reaches out to chuck schumer on health care. what's behind the latest overture? calm before the storm, the president's cryptic phrase leaves everyone wondering, even apparently some who work in the white house. those details ahead. hurricane watch.