put the positive energy out, brother. i'm a knicks fan. i feel your pain. next time, you were setting it up. screaming at the tv going, chuck, no, no! >> we knew. here's the beauty of it, donny. the beauty of it. i'm trying to explain to my 10-year-old, you need the pain to enjoy the eventual championship some day. just ask the 109-year-old chicago cup fan.

anyway -- >> a good life lesson. you're a good dad and a good fan. >> trying. trying. my 10-year-old mike make it to 108. anyway -- it's the friday, the president punts big decisions to congress. tonight -- president trump ends subsidies for obamacare. >> it's step by step by step. >> does the president really want to blow up the aca or just make it look that way? we'll hear from both sides of the health care debate. plus -- decertifying the iran nuclear deal. >> i am announcing a change and full range of constructive actions. >> former cia chief leon panetta weighs in on the president's move. and later -- why i'm obsessed with too much of a good thing when the great american pastime goes way past all of our bedtimes. this is "mtp daily" and it starts right now.

good evening and welcome to "mtp daily." i'm chuck todd here in washington. for some, the overarching goal of president trump's first year in office so far, at least to those on the left, seems to be about taking a wrecking ball to obama era policies and today the president made two big moves on that front working to undo or unravel two of president obama signature achievements. one foreign, one domestic and setting off chain reactions ahome and abroad. just this afternoon, decertifying the iran nuclear deal pushing off much of the responsibility for the ultimate future of this deal to capitol hill. we'll dig into that later in the broadcast. former defense secretary leon panetta is coming up. we begin with a big jolt to the u.s. health care system potentially and definitely a bigger jolt to congress. it was ending key obamacare subsidies that help lower the cost of premiums for low-income

americans especially those in tough to insure marketplaces. the white house said it's taking away what they call a bailout for insurance companies that was done unlawfully by the last administration. >> that money was a subsidy and almost you could say a payoff to insurance companies, and what we have to do is come up with great health care. >> now, critics say this move could unleash instability on america's health care markets. the congressional budget office predicted this would spike premiums increase deficits and leave around 1 million more people uninsured. but the president disagrees and said today he had to do this, because congress had let him down. >> we're taking a little different route than we had hoped, because getting congress, they forgot what their pledges were. so we're going a little different route, but you know what? in the end it's going to be just as effective and maybe it will even be better.

>> but -- in president trump's world, everything is negotiable and sure seems he made this move today as a way to force democrats to negotiate further on health care. >> if the democrats were smart, what they'd do is come and negotiate something where people could really get the kind of health care that they deserve. what would be nice, if the democratic leaders could come over to the white house. we'll negotiate some deal that's good for everybody. the democrats should come to me. i would even go to them. >> but the democrats already are negotiating on health care, to months now. a bipartisan effort on health care call them fixes between senators lamar alexander, republican tennessee and patti from washington state working to keep subsidies out of pockets for folks who need the help.

cold water thrown on that today telling politico it would take a broader health care deal for the president to revive the health care payments. the fact is, we are getting mixed messages from this administration. one thing is very clear. with the announcements of iran and health care today the president at least for now wants to look like he's being tough and keeping his word. he wants to look like he's doing something big, but what he's really doing is creating a disruption and not completely killing what's already there and passing the torch to congress yet again making all of this their collective problem perhaps. joining me, republican congresswoman diane black of tennessee. she is among other things chairman of the house budget committee and a candidate for tennessee governor in 2018. congresswoman black, good to see you. >> thank you, chuck, for having me today. >> let me start with -- a politics question involving health care. is there a negotiation or not? what is your understanding?

i know it's taking place on the senate side and i know you have a good working relationship with senator 15alexander given you'r bone tennesseans. how much are you interested in what they come up with and keeping an eye on this? >> i'm a nurse by background, first and in the business of health care over 45 years and we're seeing at least here in the state of tennessee and i think across the country is that even though you subs sky premiums, the premiums may be low so someone can afford that, but when you have a deductible so high they can't afford to use their card, that really doesn't help. so these csrs if were working, doing what we needed them to do we probably wouldn't be having that much of this conversation right now. i have worked or at least talked with lamar alexander previously. right from the very beginning. over two years ago, about what we would do on a repeal and replace. obviously, that was something that we worked on at the beginning of the year because of my role as the budget chairman,

but i'm very disappointed that the senate hasn't come up with something. when the president talks about congress, i really wish he would acknowledge that house has done its work. it's up to the senate to do their work now. just do anything and gish it back to us to have a conference committee and get this taken care of. >> let me ask you this. i understand you have a disagreement on how effective you think the subsidies are. in what the president did today, is that going to make the health insurance market better or worse right now as the law stands? >> i think until you get rid of the individual mandates and the employer mandates that nothing's going to get better. let me give an example of that. >> so does this make it worse? i mean, i guess my question is -- we could -- whether you a, like obamacare or not, is it a good -- are you making the problem worse accelerating the problems unnecessarily? >> i don't think you're making it worse. as i said at the beginning of my conversation with you, we have

people all over the state of tennessee saying i want the exchange can afford the premiuming because i'm getting help but can't afford the deductibles and therefore can't begin to use my insurance. you got to take it more than talking about the isolated csrs. it's more than that. as long as you keep the mandates there and people can't get what they want for a cost they can afford i think you're going to continue to have this problem. >> i guess -- i feel like, though, we're in a cul-de-sac in health care. the president wants a new plan. the senate has proven it can't. you guys passed a plan that couldn't pass the senate. where are we going here? >> nothing can pass the senate. i mean, the senate couldn't even vote on a bill they voted on previously. they couldn't pass it. so where are we going? that's a very good question and i'm sorry i'll put it right back at the feet of my senators saying give us something. go to conference. work this out. let's get something, because you know what? the american people are hurting.

>> if premiums skyrocket, right? the cbo believes that we can -- we can disagree on whether it is pe effective or not. insurance companies are make going on the threat they'll pull out and perhaps playing a game of chicken with the government, but if they do this, is everybody going to sit there and let it happen or is there going to be a band-aid to make sure it doesn't totally unravel in 2018? >> i'd like to see the president run an executive order saying no longer are there individual and, individual mandates and employer mandates. just that, got that out of the way, we can actually start to let the market work. the market works everywhere else. i go to the grocery store, the market works. the market works in other places. and i think we need to let the market work. >> where is the market worked on health care, when you have -- not to get into a philosophical discussion, but when you have every doctor saying if anybody comes to an emergency room they'll treat them, it's not

a -- it's not a market that sort of -- that you're -- you're being forced into figuring out how to subs sky that free health care that nobody pays for at the emergency room. >> so let me tell you, chuck, i'll an emergency room nurse. there are people that came into my emergency room that i, the nurse, was the first to see them that i could have sent them to a walk-in clinic or doctor the next day because of a wall congress put in place to say, no, i have to treat everybody that walks in that emergency room. you took away our ability to say no. an emergency room is not the proper place and then put the burden on top of that saying you must do that. >> you would get rid of a law that mandates emergency rooms to see every patient that shows up? >> i would get rid of a law that says that you are not allowed as a health care professional to make that decision about whether someone can be appropriately treated the next day or to walk in clinic or at their doctor. we must treat everybody that

walks in whether a sore throat for a week. we must see them. that crowds the emergency room. it drives the cost of emergencies up. and so, yeah. if someone comes in from an auto accident, i don't want to ask whether they have insurance or not. i'm going to take care of them. but it crowded my emergency room where i work and disallowed me from using my good judgment skills of which i was trained to do and doctors are as well, and it's federal government saying you must, and you can't make those decisions. i think that was a poor thing for us to do. it's driven the cost of health care up and especially in the emergency rooms. >> all right. before i let you go, one of your colleagues in the u.s. senate, bob corker, and the president, certainly had a war of words this week. i'm curious of your reaction to it. >> look, i don't believe that we should be in the news calling each other names to be begin with, but i think the president is very frustrated with the congress, and not the house of representatives but the senate that we're not getting things

done and so i think that this -- this dialogue has occurred because of the lack of work that's being done in the state senate. >> do you think the president's criticisms -- you think the president'scorker were fair? >> i don't think thats the way to dialogue with one another. i don't dough that when i dialogue with him and put it on the front page of the newspaper. that doesn't help anybody. it's better done behind closed doors. there's an agenda. the president wants to get his agenda moving, we quickly promised to repeal and replace and haven't. he's frustrated. dodd/frank, 12 appropriation bills. there is frustration. >> spent a lot of time on health care. thanks for coming on sharing your views. good to talk to you. joining me kathleen sbeegiosbeeg io sebelius and i have a feeling she has a lot of opinions on

what's been happening today. all right. let me ask you this -- you heard the congresswoman there, particularly on the risk corridor issue. address her concern that basically says, look, that's nice of her subs skies the insurance, but the deductibles are so high that they haven't been useful so it hasn't worked. what would you say in response to her? >> well, i'm -- i'm fairly stunned by that last interview, chuck, to hear a health care provider say we should repeal the federal law that allows mandates that hospitals treat anyone coming through the door is stunning, and to hear the congresswoman say let the president issue an executive order contrary to the law that's in place is fairly stunning. but maybe she doesn't understand what the costs sharing subsidies are. they are specifically to lower deductibles and co-pays for the lowest income individuals in the marketplace. so if she thinks deductibles are

too high, if she thinks that people can't afford them, repealing the help that individuals get from the federal government to pay those subsidies seems to me to be total contrary to her belief. we might need more help, do more people need help paying out of pocket costs, you bet? should regulators spend more time and energy trying to lower these insurance costs? you bet. but repealing the help that's currently in law, in place, for out of pocket costs doesn't seem to me to advance the congresswoman's concerns. >> i'm curious philosophically the larger question. do you believe our health care system can essentially be a free market system? that it could be sort of -- you know -- obviously we got into the emergency room law repeal that sort of complicated our debate, our back and forth on that, but specifically, if you did take that away can it be a free market? >> health insurance is not a

free market. let's start there. i think the notion that without any rules, without any oversight insurance companies will make choices that advance particularly the needs of people who need the health care the most, older, sicker, disabled folks, is just not accurate, and frankly, we've had the free market in place, in this for individuals, for small business owners for decades. every idea that the republicans are bringing forward, every idea in what president announced yesterday in his executive order rolling back these subsidies is the old market. this is what has been tried and failed. you split people into who promises never to get sick and who will get sick. you charge match higher rates. you don't provide coverage. that's what the free market looks like. >> let me ask you, one of the

reform ideas the president pushed. i'll be honest i paper i sit here and say i don't understand why there isn't more agreement on this which is this idea of allowing associations, allowing plumbers to get together, and essentially get their own health care plan that would allow some, you know, some -- why is there such vehement disagreement -- is it simply due to the regulatory aspect of it, or could you come up with a way to allow this and have it, and be supportive of it? >> sure. you could allow it as long as they operate under the consumer protection laws. so i was an insurance commissioner for eight years. we had a lot of associations providing health plans to their memberships as way, frankly, to increase membership. that didn't know much about health insurance but wanted more members. the problem is, you need consumers to be sure that there's money in the bank to pay the claims. a lot of them didn't have reserves. they didn't have the

wherewithal. you need the rates to be enough to collect to make sure the companies don't go bankrupt and theed association health plans to actually pay the claims they say they're going to pay and offer the benefits that they tell members they're going to offer. i can't tell you how many calls we had in kansas from consumers who would say, i bought health insurance. i can't get my claim paid. i just got notice that my company went bankrupt, and i got a wife in the hospital. what do i do? and what we would say to them is, we're really sorry. we don't have oversight over that and can't regulate it. call the 1-800 number at the department of labor and hope they respond. >> last question for you, and i'm curious. because you've been a governor, you've been an insurance commissioner and you've been hhs secretary. >> i'm just an old lady. >> no, no, no. but so much experience in this particular -- is single payer something that you could viably

imp innoce implement in our system. forget ideologically. you've been on the front line. is a something that could be implemented real linkly? >> there's no question that medicare right now and what a lot of people talk about is medicare for all provides benefits to 53 million americans and 11,000 people a day are turning 65. it's a big system. has contracts with doctors, hospitals, drug companies across this country. medicare also operates part directly fees paid by the government, part of it is private companies. about one-third of seniors choose private companies. so there is no one size fits all. it's a package of benefits. government oversight. very low overhead. that's a good deal. that's what everybody wants and i think that's what we should strive for. universal coverage with the lowest overhead possible. >> what you're saying is, no single payer? >> well, to me it isn't the question of who pays.

in medicare, for instance, the government pays a portion. private citizens pay a portion. >> yeah. >> and some of 2 it by private companies some public companies. they compete. that's what we need in the marketplace. >> secretary sbebelius, i leave it there. i'm not sure you think single payer is viable but close. leave it there. thanks very much. good to have you on. thank you for sharing your views. >> thanks. nice to talk to you. we're going to continue this conversation. those are two fascinating interviews that went there. that with the panel. later talk with former cia chief and defense secretary leon panetta about the president's move on iroan. keep it right here. ...it starts a chain reaction... ...that's heard throughout the connected business world. at&t network security helps protect business, from the largest financial markets to the smallest transactions, by sensing cyber-attacks in near real time

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welcome back. senator susan collins of maine will remain senator susan collins of maine until at least

2020. she announced her decision not to run for governor next year in and unusually well attended chamber of commerce meeting saying her role in the senate was too critical to give up. moderate republicans like collins are an endangered species in the u.s. congress and her decision to skip the race may not just been an keeping her important voice in the senate. despite popularity, would have had a hard time winning governor. the outgoing governor may have liked that. maybe made a national debate. not making a gubernatorial campaign fun. more in 60 seconds. ♪

this is a story about mail and packages. and it's also a story about people. people who rely on us every day to deliver their dreams they're handing us more than mail they're handing us their business and while we make more e-commerce deliveries to homes than anyone else in the country, we never forget... that your business is our business the united states postal service. priority: you ♪ welcome back. it's time for the panel. all right. you guys heard the interviews. let me start with the larger question here, matthew, since it

was ideological. diane black was making the case let the market work and when i said, well, i don't think the free market works anymore in health care because of the emergency rule law, she said, yes, that's a problem. can there ever be a free market in the health insurance? >> there can be. people have written how you would get something like that, and unfortunately we're nowhere near it, and -- >> a long way. medicare is a big problem of this, by the way. >> and change obamacare to repeal, replace and move it in a slightly, not necessarily a free market direction but a consumer directed one. the consumer bearing more cost but also more choices. we're a long way from that in america today. >> where's this headed? i feel in the short term here, there's going to be a lot of people really worried about the consequences of these actions, and a bit politically panicked. where's this going? >> i think this is going to this idea you're going to have people attacking the very, i guess,

sav sanctity of life. and taken back, as a reporter taken back by the fact, end that people have to be treated when they go to the e.r. someone who's written about this, a woman i interviewed going to the e.r. for decades, not because she didn't want insurance, she couldn't afford it and was sick and that was the way she did it. i think that there's going to be an idea, you have democrats accusing republicans of being cold hearted and republicans saying, okay. if you really want to help everybody, how are you paying for single payer? the age old question of the two parties in general. free market or taking care of anybody without actually having the money to do it, i think that the debate we've had over the last nine months about the affordable care act and what it should be repealed and replaced with is actually underscored that most people in america do not want a kind of complete free for all, free market health care system, or a free market

insurance system, because they really do believe that health care -- >> realistic. >> but there is -- you know, they believe health care is a fundamental right. there is an unwillingness on the part of people to say, whoa. my pre-existing conditions. you know? pry those out of my cold, injured hands. and so the willingness to make those kinds of fundamental changes, i think, is not there. and the president has set us up for yet another debate about that. >> i was going to say. when it comes to health care, all health care politics is personal. right? everybody applies their own personal experience and therefore, this is the way the law has to be. let me ask this -- will these subsidies, dead forever, matthew, or the president's way of saying, congress, you want them, pass them and i'll sign the law? >> a carrot for democrats to come to agreement with trump how to change obamacare. the issue, though, is really

cost. cost of health care. especially cost of health care for the people on exchanges. a very small number of people in the country. >> two types of cost. cost's health insurance but the cost itself -- haven't talked about that. the cost of the actual health care. hospital costs. >> how do you lower costs? trump's executive order yesterday, his attempt to start doing that. when you look at focus groups of trump voters, among all issues they raise, the high cost of health care. so he has to be showing that he is addressing this issue, even if congress can't get its act together in order to keep his base solidified. >> i get that. that enmmeans he'll sign anythi. sort of what you're saying. sign any law. >> he's been very open about that. his dig at rand paul yesterday saying, signing ceremony, senator paul. you're here. i can't believe you're here, with this reform. you weren't there with me when trying to do it legislatively and now has to resort to his plan --

>> the president verbalizing every thought, bubble, ever. >> and talking about the fact president trump would sign almost anything given to him and in ways is looking for wins. looking to look busy. someone also looking at immigration, looking at infrastructure, whether or not those things actually happen, i think he's happy to sign things that make it look as though he is telling congress what to do and he got this. wait a minute. the person who comes out looking good in this week is president trump. he's saying, congress couldn't get their stuff together. i'm a republican, but still angry at the fact these people you elected haven't passed, repealed obamacare like i told them to do. won't use a legislative tool that i told them to use and as a result mitch mcconnell and paul ryan are looking like you're not taking action and the president's trying to do his best. >> do you believe these cost-sharing subsidies are truly gone? >> i don't think they're gone. i think there's going to be an enormous amount of pressure on congressional republicans to save themselves from what the president did, because the

consequences of losing these are going to hit their constituents. so i think there's going to need to be a way. i actually think it strengthens democrats' hands to get a deal, because i think the republicans know they're going to be blamed. >> interesting. you think democrats will go to the table? do you think democrats walk? does anybody think democrats walk or stay? i don't know. i'm not sure of that. >> a question whether people actually feel the brunt of this elimination of a subsidy to an insurance company. right? this might raise the costs -- >> insurance companies disappear from exchanges. >> exchanging get they are own subsidies written into law. president trump addressing a constitutional question about, jackl jackl lue deciding -- >> pause the dlofrgs. sti conversation.

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dial star-star-audible on your smartphone to start listening today. welcome back. president trump has called the iran nuclear deal "the worst." he said it's "incompetently drawn and a horrible embarrassment to the country" and today threatened to terminate the deal but he didn't. instead he basically punted the decision to congress. the president refused to certify

the agreement this afternoon warning the deal was just a short-term delay in iran's quest for nuclear weapons call it's iran a rogue and fanatical regime saying tehran violated the deal on several occasions and wa not honoring the spirit of the agreement. >> as i have said many times, the iran deal was one of the worst and most one-sided transactions the united states has ever entered into. this same mind-set that produced this deal is responsible for years of terrible trade deals that have sacrificed so many millions of jobs. >> france, germany and the uk also signers of this agreement. remember, it's not a deal between the united states and iran. in a joint statement, those countries put out critical of the president's remarks. russia called it "troubling." israel praised president trump's words as courageous. despite the president's bl 's b

today the deal isn't dead, putting it in congress' court, whether to attach new agreements or impose sanctions and essentially end the deal. >> a think we're going to take a look, john, at what happens. we're going to see what happens. see what they come back with. they may come back with something very satisfy to me and if they don't within a very short period of time i'll terminate the deal. >> we've seen in the past, just because president trump says he will follow through with something doesn't mean he fully will. we're going to talk about all of this after the break with former defense secretary and cia chief leon panetta. we'll be right back. (avo) when you have type 2 diabetes, you manage your a1c,

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welcome back. as promised, joined by leon panetta. his many former titles include director of the office of management and congressman, founder of panetta institute and walnut farmer and that's the title you will always have first and last.

correct? mr. panetta? >> yeah. you can use whatever title you'd like. i like the watt nulnut farmer o >> former secretary of state john kerry put out a statement on the president's remarks on iran and i'm curious if you share his anger that's in here, to be honest. it's a reckless abandonment of facts in favor of ego and ideology from a president who would rather play a high stakes game of chicken with the congress and with iran than admit that the nuclear agreement is working. pretty personal, pretty harsh. do you see this that way? >> well, i think it is a, a terrible mistake at a very dangerous time in the world. it's not to say that there aren't legitimate concerns here about iran, with regards to their support for terrorism, their development of missiles,

their general contribution instability in the region plus the desire to get a nuclear weapon. but what you have here is a situation where we've made progress on trying to restrain them from getting a nuclear weapon. and the real question is, how do you deal with these other concerns? and the problem is that the president has kind of rolled the grenade in the room had it go off, without having a strategy as to where we're going. the reality is that we now have a decertification of this agreement, and that they're not in compliance when they are, in fact, in compliance. we're out there alone without our allies. we have broken our word, and the bottom line here is we're throwing this whole mess to congress, which doesn't have a very good record of trying to deal with anything, much less the situation in iran. it's going to create a tremendous amount of confusion in a world that's already very dangerous. >> you were in the administration, obama

administration, which this was in the midst of -- look, this was a deal that took years to put together. can you explain why the issue of iran's support of terrorist groups like hezbollah, why the ballistic missile issue? why some of the things weren't part of the agreement? you know, that's been -- the larger criticism from the president and those that have been critical of this deal is, it was too narrow. it allowed -- it took too many of the bad things off the table with iran. why did that happen? >> well, chuck, as you know, i wasn't in the administration at the time that the final agreement was made. >> i understand that. >> i think the best thing i understand is that our allies, and we had a number of allies there at the table. russia, china, germany, great britain, france, they were all present. and i think there was a lot of push back not to deal with these other issues but focus on the nuclear weapons issue, because

that was the primary concern. you know, i have the same concern about the fact that those issues were not dealt with, but at the same time, the fact is, they have abided by this agreement when it comes to nuclear weapons. what we need to do is get them to the table to discuss these other concerns. but the united states cannot do that alone. we've -- we cannot just walk away from the deal and somehow hope that they're going to do this. iran is going to say we broke our word. there's no incentive on the part of iran to come to the table, because they'll basically say the united states cannot be trusted. so in many ways we've undermyroned the one opportunity we've had to try to sit down with iran and deal with these other concerns. >> okay. but it does seem as if the president in his own way is simply asking, give me some leverage to go back and negotiate with iran. so i -- i understand that you may think it's too late. you may think it's already that this, you know, it's already

been undermined and all of those things, but what can congress do? let's assume they can do something here that could strengthen the president's negotiating hand without scuttling the deal. if you could design something, clearly the president wants to do this, what would it look like? >> well, i think, you know, senator corker has some ideas that i think make some sense. what you would try to do is to make very clear that we are going to hold iran to the terms of this agreement. we're going to enforce the agreement, and make sure that they're abiding by it, and if they don't, then we will apply sanctions. and at the same time, i think we would also urge that the united states use the leverage working with our allies. working with our, with the rest, the other countries in the world, to try to see if we cannot persuade iran to come to the table and negotiate on these other issues, but you have to do

it by retaining the agreement in place, because once we break that agreement, and tear it up, and break our word, it's going to make it very difficult to do anything in terms of improving our relationship with iran. >> quickly, i want to get your reaction to john kelly's debut at the white house podium. one way he described his job. >> i was not brought to this job to control anything but the flow of information to our president so that he can make the best decisions. i restrict no one, by the way from going in to see him, but when we go in to see him now rather than onesies and twosies we go in and help him collectively understand what -- what he needs to understand to make these vital decisions. >> all right. as a former white house chief of staff, who do you think of his description there? >> well, chuck, john has the right idea about what a chief of staff's job is.

he's chief of staff. he's not president of the united states. and he's not expected to be able to tell the president what to do. what he has to do is to provide the president with a full series of well thought out options, develop a policy approach, and then present that to the president for the president's decision. i think that is ultimately the test. whether or not you can have this president actually govern the country. that's going to be the test. not only for john kelly but for president trump as well. >> leon panetta, leave it there. leon -- go do some walnut farming. will you? i think that's what you wanted -- >> i will be, dealing with a different set of nuts out here. >> with that, okay. thank you and happy friday. when we come back it's really true you can have too much of a good thing. you are my hammer out there. don't let these young guys see you fold.

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277 minutes. 38 players, 14 pitchers, 12 pitching changes. regular replay reviews. and countless, countless, meetings on the mound. without the meetings, pitching changes, batting glove adjustments somewhere you'll find a three-hour gym. instead a nearly five-hour endurance test. took my son it game, a school night. special night and we had to leave in the ninth inning of a nine inning game. why? transportation and dilemmas. challenge to the baseball commissioner. watch that game again. minute by minute. if you can bear it. then do something. edit out the following or put in a pitch clock. don't let batters step out of the box as many time. limit times to the mound. cut commercial time. something, anything, please. all of us baseball fans beg you. you have a great sport, but time is not on your side. we'll be right back.

we need to stop illegal aliens coming across our borders. we need to repeal obamacare. we don't need to replace it. it's not just a swamp. it's a quicksand. and that's what we see in washington. we don't have leadership. we have followership. >> well, that was roy moore, he's a republican nominee in the alabama senate race, who beat trump's pick. here in d.c., ruth, your newspaper did a pretty big expose on his finances and you've done something. it clammed up roy moore. there was just some coverage today he cancelled some time with reporters that he was going to have, because he didn't want to address the allegations and the "post" store has a denyleia,

it's whether he is profiting off his foundations and charities and things like that. where does this go? it was interesting, he has not, he has not made the splash here that i thought he would yet. >> you know, the -- i think that roy moore might be in the same position with his voters and his base that maybe donald trump is with his, na'a lot of us saw, for example, the ""access hollywood"" tape and figured okay, that's it. you might see this kind of story about him essentially getting very large profits, which he has denied, by the way, right? he said he didn't take very much money from this charity, it turned out quite a bit, who is -- with whom is that going to hurt him? probably not with his base voters. >> you know, matthew, he's saying, it appeared to be the strategy is to stay in friendly environment u environments. this obviously is a very friendly environment to him. maybe that's a path to victory.

but is it a dangerous bass? the local media is getting a littleancy like he doesn't get any access. i understand trashing national media folks. but that's been -- that could bite him. >> he is running against a democrat who has his own problems, so i think that might ultimately work to judge moore's advantage, the question, of course, if he becomes senator moore, then it's much harder to dodge the capitol hill press core than it is to limit, avails on the campaign trail, so we might see the real deal starting next year. >> well, i assume, that's like the fearsome republican senators. >> they're really looking forward to it. >> what is he going to say that suddenly -- >> ted cruz might like it, then, office -- >> what did he say that i have to respond to? senator from tennessee or whatever? >> a capitol hill chaser is a capitol hill chaser. >> you call yourself the chase card. >> i place whack a mole and chase democratic senators. he will have a hard time.

i say it's impossible, you sit at these trainstration stati st three minutes i have your undivided questions and will scream questions at you. so if he has issues with his finance and actually gets to be elected an comes to the hill, he will have to answer those questions in a way that's way more broad than blanket discussions. >> i hate to throw this out with two minutes to go. i'm curious, one minute to go as my producer just said, but these are pretty troubling ethical charges and we saw, it feels that you are right the roy moore base and donald trump base, nothing, it doesn't matter if you prove, hey, he's morally questionable or he's ethically questionable. >> i think the price that the members of the party of trump are willing to pay to fundamentally disrupt and even destroy washington, d.c. is considerable. he's willing to follow it quite a bit, his personal baggage in order to get what they want. >> what if the price gets too

high? >> we haven't seen it yet. >> we haven't seen the price. the problem, of course, there is one thing to be ethical and have moral issues. it's one thing if you have all broken laws. it will put republicans in a bad space if they doesn't have to go to another election and see this person crash and burn. so there is that limit i would say for republicans. >> yeah, i think the real fair of this post, what if it actually triggers an actual federal investigation? >> let's remember, this guy twice got elected and was elected as the nominee. so he's got a lot of wiggle room. i'm not sure he will be fleeing you. he may be happy to spout off. >> the price people are willing to pay to disrupt this town. we have yet to see the limit yet. all right, ruth, thank you. up next on this friday the 13th, the end of the skyway to hell.

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well, in case you missed it, today is friday the 13th. maybe that's the reason for last night's washington national's loss to the chicago cubs that took place early this morning. after all the nats left men on base and baseball horrors aside, friday the 13th can make people nervous of some things like flying, not the passenger 666 to hell in the 13th hour of october 13th.

the flight from copenhagen to helsinki is a regularly scheduled flight. and it has flown without incident on friday the 13th 22 times in the past 11 years. not anymore, today was the last time flight 666 will fly on friday the 13th. in a tweet, they arranged they are re-arranging flight numbers and flight 666 to hell will end later tonight. it also flies from singapore would like to remind us all they have a flight from sin to hell. that's all for today, "the beat" with ari melber starts right now. ari, digest that right now. >> sin city is what that makes me think of. have a good weekend, chuck. >> thank you. donald trump makes two big moves today getting a lot of attention. a very political announcement on that iran nuclear deal, which actually changes nothing today the other is a huge action sabotaging obamacare and