>> it's my keepsake. >> how was it over there? >> it was good. incredibly high tech. they really -- they eave got it together ov there. people are great. now regarding the north and now she wears her jacket. >> it's humongous. >> i think was we talked about mplts north korea were happy that the president extended the olive branch, but -- >> were you able to get them on your cable system? >> as you can see we have an

msnbc distributor and also heidi is with us and associate ed door of the washington post and political analyst. >> and welcome back to the stage of pyeongchang. it's great to have you. >> how many olympic medals have jane won before the pulitzer? >> he won the silver but they took it away from him. >> well, we're glad to have you back. nothing has happened while you were gone. >> so midterms can be tufz for a party. and a president party. and that's thousand things are

shaping up for november. democrats are also more enthusiastic about this year's midterms. 57% of democrats say they are extremely or very enthusiastic to vote for congress this year. 4 43% of republicans said they are enthusiast enthusiastic. . you saw republicans get a bump over the past month, some suggested because of the tax cut. buzz that's been wiped away. in fairly dramatic fashion.

we can only guess but it's the major intervening event since the pa the parkland shooting. >> i guess you have to say that oowhat's responsible but i think that's the -- that could be the crucial thing. you know, if you just look at the -- at the voting population and the potential voting population out there, you know, frapgsly you've got a lot more democrats than you've got republicans and i think you've got a lot more anti trump than you've got trump out there and the question is who you've got to vote. and we saw in the special elections in virginia and new jersey this year that progressives were highly motivated to vote and they delivered some surprises and that could be the difference in november. >> you look at the people motivated to vote, it's been

women. >> and to run. >> to get out and vote in northern virginia. and alabama there is so many people motivated buzz black voting, turnout is high as it was during barack obama, younger voters and heidi, we're coming up on the end of february. we ask this question all the time. we'll keep asking the question, are they concerned about this? do they see a need to appeal more to forget about certain voters, but republican women, are they doing anything? >> well, what you're seeing at this retreat that paul ryan held where they delivered some of the

o soeberring news that the tax get can going to work its way, they're understood water and they're going to tell these chins how to run which is play to your district but does that really mean running against this president? we haven't seen indication of that. in fact, this party, we're going to look for some fuissures ther, but we're not seeing that. but the democrats are so motivated that for example we'riwe're seei seeing there, the candidate got more votes than trump did. but it was the enthusiasm we're seeing that manifest in poll after poll.

>> jean was talking about intensity, mike, there is an intensity, obviously on the democratic side. also an intensity against donald trump, you saw against george w. bush in foun six, but make, you look at the after fact of the action and just blind my being seen as blindly toeing the line of the nra or the republicans on capitol hill would be in the very districts that they're fighting for their lives for. the 25 dridistricts that hillar clinton won, that will balance on who the next speaker of the house is. >> it's going to be interesting to see democrats overplay their hand. they have intensity, they are

enthusiasm. they have millennials, all geared to get out and vote for a democrat but if they make the mistake of running on a constant base, trump, trump, trump, it's not going to be that's se. it's something going on in this country. there's a feeling that the country is fractured, that the country has to be brought together, they're going to have to address the issues because the economy is not an issue right now. democrats and republicans, they like it in the short term. i don't know how they'll play out h the course of the summer. >> often it's more about culture divides than it is about economics. the economy was great in 94. the economy was great in 2006. so usually that -- i will say talking to more and more

democratic leaders, democratic policy people who are concerned that the democrats have everything on their side but thaw don't have a unifying message and a lot of people concerned that hillary clinton was goupgs to lose in the democratic party are still saying they don't have a message for the common good. you've be been treated badly and you've been treated badly and this is what we're going to do and group c you're being treated badly and group d, and democratic strategists say if you even talk about how this democratic party ball cannizes voters that you're suddenly called a racist or you're shunned from the party. >> it's always been a question of all these movements that

we've seen that can push people into elected office or it's just a movement that changes us culturally but not politically. we've pushed so far to the left, where diane fienstein, a lot of republicans. -- >> can you believe that as much as she's gip to the democratic party for as long as she's given it to the democratic party on the local state and international level is insufficieinially level? and i think she's said a couple of things doing what any response rm senator would do and trying to find common ground and she's attacked for it. it's just -- i mean, democrats

are their own worst enemy. >> you know, california's different from other democratic states and i think that's not so much the issue as what you said earlier that they have the message when you look at successful democratic prts for example. when you look loot bill clinton and barack obama, they did enunciate a vision and they did find a way to speak more broadly and the big question is who is able to do that, to have the message needs a mess b jers or messengers. i think there are very good congressional candidates that are doing that in their districts and that can make the difference in november and so maybe, you flow, the real chal engs may be on the other side of

november. it's looking ahead to 2020. >> barack obama is the greatest example of his 2004 speech, one of the best convention speeches we've heard in a long long time. he didn't believe in a red state america, he believed in the united states of america. there you had a democrat who wasn't even trying to just talk about how the democrats should be unified. he was talking about unifying the entire country and that's something that's sorely lacking with these candidates and we see it in the republican party too, where there's one interest party after another. and again, we had robert rice on last week he had a book called common good. what's the common good for the united states of america that

the democratic message had other than group a has been afflicted by this. group c has been afflicted by this. if you want a party of victim hood and like he said, you can affect social change, but if you want to be like barack obama you try to unify the party and how to unify the country. >> they have to become kand date or candidates who can speak to the nation about a few simple themes. why is it that we seem to be losing this sense of community that we once had?

and he said we're going to lose if we can't get a common message. it doesn't just go one group after another. you tell them they're all victims vnd everybody's persecuting them. out of many, what's that message? >> but today that message that he delivered in 2004 is viewed

as not sufficient liz aggressive in protecting those groups so you say we have to be one united states of america, we're a couple of tribes in america. >> well, president trump hosted the governor os. the president promised e recently met with leaders of the nra and reported they could take quick action. >> i had lunch and i haptd to tell you, we've got to do something. it's to long now. we eve got to do something and we're going to do very strong

background checks, very strong. we're gong to do background checks, if we see a sicko, i don't want them to have guns and there was a time, even if they were sick, they are fighting and there's no bigger fan of the nra and these guys are great. they're going to do something. when sesee somebody that's sick when the police went to see them, they didn't have a good job but hi have reinstructions on what they can do. they got to have immediate access on taking those guns away. got to give immediate access. don't worry. you're not going to get any -- don't worry about the nra, they're on our side. half of you are afraid of the nra.

there's no worry. we have to fight them. that's okay. >> there are a few of those things that he mentioned that a lot of people would have loved to see after newtown, so if we have strong eck panhandled back ground greks, which question figure out a way for the country to take away those guns out of the way of these that are mentally ill, i mean, to me it sounds like a step forward. >> of course it would be a step forward and i think, you know, there are other steps, common sense steps that could be taken, and -- but sure, if we could do those things i think we ought to do them and do them now. i wonder however if the president heard when the speech last week at cpac when he was foaming at the mouth and basically saying anybody who

says we ought to do anything is a socialist who's trying to destroy america. and i think the -- you know, the members of congress who heard the president probably feel they have a lot of reasons to be afraid of the nra and until that equation -- now, maybe donald trump has the sort of stature or authority is in a position to buck the nra if he wants to but do you really think he's going to do it? i -- you know, one has to believe et when one sees it. >> if history is a guide he won't do it. he's bounced back and forth on dreamers. he talked about what he wanted to do and then he's pushed bah shiz on base. >> but i had a long conversation with on of the strongest people

i know on gun rights. it's fiercely pro second amendment as far as i know and we were having a talk last week and he says the meeting ground is where the nra already said the meeting ground is, they said they were find with bump stocks at first. why hasn't congress moved on the cornen bill? that haes fine. it closes a lot of loopholes, it makes background checks better. he supported stronger background checks and yet congress even with the president saying move, even with the nra saying move, like the president said they're so scared of their own shadow

they woempn't everyone do thing that the nra says to do. >> guess what? the fix mix as sect was a port of the bill back in 2012 that the nra helped kill so we cannot underegs mate the pressure and the iron fist that's happening with the nra. you look at what's happening here. we have a very short window in the aftermath of these tragedies that act and you read the faces of these lawmakers. joe mansion who really put himself out there coming from a red state, the last go around will not even commit to being a champion this time. he's got a tough election coming up, but it's very telling that the number two ranking

republican john cornyn will not back the fur arms and we' got profrou profound dysfunction t's a modest measure and they still have issues with due process and democrats who say they over not enough and we are left in the same darn position that we've been left in. >> the president says it's okay to fight the nra once in a while but it doesn't seem the republicans in georgia agree with that notion. dell is now facting backlash over its push to sever ties in the nra in the wake of the parkland school shooting. the bill which cleared the

state's house last week would eliminate the state tax on jet fuel potentially saifziving mils of dollars. on saturday the company announced that it would end discounted rates for nra members. a front runner and the state's race this year weighed in on the matter yesterday tweeting i will kill any tax legislation that ben gets delta unless the company reinstates its reslags with the nra. >> it's really remarkable. you look for an example like that when you want to how much somebody cows to a special interest group.

>> general lelectorates, they keep sticking their thumbs in the eye os of ge executives and they dept raising taxes in a way that general electric couldn't be kpcompetitive. and then there was a guy in the state legislature, and he says their guys want to go around on yachts during the weekend. we don't have to stay here, so general electric after being in connecticut for decades, it -- they moved to boston. delta airlines, i mean, delta, you could ptd be more right.

>> could the lieutenant governor of georgia, when delta decides to put their hub in cincinnati, like you're being -- to be polite, you just need toe talk to the people of connecticut because when little state legislators like that and i'm going to call him that, because that's what connecticut had. they have these legislators who move and our economy in connecticut is shattered. >> mutt the text up against if you could. it's the last line, corporations cannot attack conservatives and expect us not to fight back. so if you're a member of the delta board, if you're the ceo of bell delta, if you can get a message we're going to do dallas sand ask them what are you going

to do for snus that ooes a lot of jobs. >> maybe we'll goat back to cincinnati. we'll flit our hubs between cincinnati and dallas. maybe we'll put it somewhere in charlotte. charlotte does a pretty good job with u.s. airways and there was some second hematogun rights people. >> you say wait a minute. delta is a private business, they shouldn't have government coming in. those are clear thinking small government gun rights loving people. >> conservatives i saw yesterday were saying i agree with you. i don't think the nra should have to suffer for what happens in florida but the idea that it's conservative for a member of government to lean on a private corporation and force them to do something is not

conservative. >> and leaning in and getting in on your association, what groups you decide to associate yourself and it's not like they're punishing the nra, they're not taking away a discount. they're not goying to be giving the nra a discount, which is like, you know, fed ex has a right. if they want to keep sthafr sweet heart deal with the national rifle association, you know, fed ex is choose to keep their sweet heart deal, but then americans have the light to say, you know what? i'm not going to ship be fed ex anymore. >> they're not government institutions and they have a rielgtd to have whatever relationship they want to have. so if i were the city fathers

and mothers of charlotte or nash vul or any other potential hub in the south ii'd be make ago phone call. >> and by the way, you know what they say in the south. >> what do they say? >> where do you go after you die? >> hartsville. you make your connection there. >> although there are multiple chick fil a's in that airport. >> how are you toing to find you gate. >> still ahead on morning joe, a conversation until now. >> they can split it up. i love it, but man, i'm telling you if other georgia representatives want to follow that guy's president, please,

look what happened with general electric and a bnch unch of li s liberals, we'll move to boston. >> no polling shows persons have more trust in bob huler's investigation than they do in president trump's investigation of collusion. you're watching morning joe. we'll be right back. no, please, please, oh! ♪ (shrieks in terror) (heavy breathing and snorting) no, no. the running of the bulldogs? surprising. what's not surprising? how much money aleia saved by switching to geico. fifteen minutes could save you

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a new report claims that john kelly does not think highly of ivanka trump. a source tells c, in n kelly rz

m remarked that she is playing government. once disregarding her child tax credit as a pet project. that complicated the senior add sigh sore played out yesterday in an interview with nbc. peter alexander sat down with her for a wide ranging exclusive interview. he asked about the wide ranging accusers. >> think it's a pretty inappropriate question to ask a daughter if she believes the accusers of her father when he has afrmtive liz stated that there's no proof to that. i don't think that's a question that u you would ask my other daughters. i believe my father, i know my

father so i think i have that right as a daughter to blooifz my father. >> van ka trump east has positioned herself as a voice inside the white house. so if that's tiffany trump sitting across alexander, you could make a debate. buzz if she has positioned herself, has an office, it's supposed to be the forefront on women's issues there's nothing unfair about those issues. >> thinky you go back and you think that they didn't ask chelsea clinton those questions but when bobby kennedy had those questions he had to answer a

bunch of tough questions so what's interesting about these two stories is they line up about what john kelly's chief argument seems to be against van ka trump which is choose one, do wow want to be daughter and son-in-law or do you want to be full time white house staffers who work around the clock and dentd jed around the world whenever you feel like it, that's the resentment that has apparently grown inside the white house. >> it's understandable. you can't have it both ways and frankly that -- either watching that interview again, it sort of reeks of entitlement. right? i'm entitled to be one thing one minute and how dare you request ask me a question of someone of

the wegs wing of the white house. she represents the administration, not just her father but the united states on international trips and wants to be taken seriously as a public official. and you have to answer questions and i think it's unacceptable that you take that sort of attitude that you can't ask me questions because it's my dad. if you want itz to be your dad, again thet get out ovz the white house. >> a and lot of people are asking why -- why did you send that person to talk to south korean leaders about what is the most pressing national security issue of this presidency. >> i mean, you're right, joe, but she's there representing the president of the united states in that theeter of potential

conflict. you're what, an hour within the border of north korea and this is just the nepotism factor here is one thing, the idea that both i van ka and her husband jared who doesn't have a security clearance are in and out of the oval office, sometimes auz senior advisors, according to your sources this has just got to be adding to the constant hourly burden that john kelly is carrying here. >> and now as you see the president has shifted more of that burden to him with the issue of jared's security clearance. he saws it will be up to you john kelly, knowing that he is in an impossible situation because jared is not there in terms of his deep well of experience of middle east issues or working in mexico. he's there simply because of his

blood relations so based on what do you provide this man with a waiver? that is put on to john kelly's shoulders but to the issue of ivanka as well, she's not just an advisor to her father but her portfolio was built upon being a champion for women. and so this question in particular has particular residence given that this country now is in a place with the me too movement, no those issues are front and center and so it's a doubly proepuate question because of the debate we're having in our country right now. >> and john kelly in the report even derides at her child tax credit, so apparently the friction really is between john kelly and ivanka trump and jarred kushner and we've heard

that ivanka and jared had been trying to push john kelly out. >> she came in there to fight for women. the whole thing is clearly a joke. just like melania's role on suber bullying which an insult to woman. >> melania trump continuing to talk about cyber bullying when the suber bullying. >> it's beyond comprehension. >> when you have her husband saying that a new york senator actually implying that the new york senator would be willing to do sexual favors for campaign donations, and a thousand other attacks against women, you -- and other people on twitter,

people that are -- he considers weaker than him, that's -- that's cyber bullying. >> and more insulting to women, they've been given fake jobs. >> she needs to call out the president, or just choose, if you want to continue saying it's okay for him to attack with his twitter feed and online, that's her choice. eha has to live be but don't say you have to be a champion of cyber bullying and ivanka can't play the daughter card if she's the top diplomat. >> she's the top because there's no ambassador to south korea. >> and as you say ivanka can't have it both ways. if you're a white house senior advisors, she's tough snuff u

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jha i kboot . i got to watch some deputy sherries. they way they performed was frankly disgusting. they were listening to what was going on, the one in familiar he was early and then you had three others that probably a similar deal a little bit later but a similar kind of a thing. you know, i really blaef you don't know until you test it but i really believe i'd run in even if i didn't have a weapon and i think most of the people in the room would have done it too. buzz the bay they performed was really a disgrace. >> president trump yesterday

criticizing the deputies in the blow ard -- broward county deputies remained outside of the building. and the sheriff's deputy said his client did nothing wrong and that sheriff scott rushed to judgment without all the facts. the lawyer ace sames says mr. peterson wishes she would have prevented the untimely passing of those that day. however, the allegations that mr. peterson with us a coward are pat tent i untrue. his actions on that day were appropriate under the circumstances and that the video together with the eyewitness testimony of those on the scene will kpan rate him of any subpar performance. in announcing peterson's rez --

resignation, i think we all need to wait. >> you've been saying wait, don't pass judgment of the depp advertise that was waiting outside. certainly the officers that showed up were waiting i think many others were agast that the president claims he would run in without weapons when he had a chance to actually fight for this country and he chose. >> reporter: like a lot of people did to have five deferments on the day that he graduated from an ivy league school, the new york times reports that 40 american troops were killed in action. today he walked across the stage

and later said that his own personal vietnam was having a lot of sex in new york city avoiding aids. so would donald trump have run in there? nobody ever knows for sure, but he certainly knows that given his history unlike bob mueller who actually went out of his way to serve this country and got shot and was highly decorated,donald trump again the chance reason. >> as with everything trump, this is exhausting. just unpacking the statement that we jaus saw, the president delivering yesterday is exhausting from the get-go. somebody should tell maybe general kelly whould tell donald trump that you don't win the medal of who honor. it's awarded you for courage

beyond belief in battle. the other aspect of it is the only thing that donald trump can be prooun to run into are things like a lunch over the weekend with juan la pierre. the third element here calling the deputy in florida a coward, that's going to play out. that's one day, one event, one situation where one police officer, a deputy sheriff thaz been seen apparently on a fill nl outside the school. we don't know what happened but to pin this whole thing on one deputy sheriff when there's such a chain of incompetence aloenings the way, multiple 911 calls. >> i will say regarding broward, the entire broward county sheriff's department, you look at all of the missed calls, all of the missed times, you look

at -- again, apparently three more awaiting outside while gunshots were going off, after -- even after they'd left and children were inside bleeding out, you obviously have a culture problem inside that sheriff's department where those deputies were outside coral springs officers came in and were like what the heck are you guys doing? and i keep going back to 9/11 and the faces of those firemen walking up those stairs as people were walking down knowing they would not see the light of day again. >> it's interesting to see law enforcement experts to a man, the first rule is you've got to go find the guy, you can't sit and wait because you can't know how long it's going to go on. but it's not president trump

throwing this deputy peterson under the bus, it's the ver riff, from the get-go, the sheriff has pinned this on know contacts with the home of the shooter, cnn now today reporting there were 45 actually contacts with the home. >> oh, my lord. unbelievable. >> it doesn't matter if it's 23 or 45, there were red flags but even the man at the top of the broward county sheriff's department, not just the man at the top of the white house, is throwing this peterson in front of the news and pushing him front and center to say it's him and him alone and that won't be the case when we look into that. >> they need to investigate that department from the top to the bottom. i'm glad the florida governor has the fdle looking into it and investigating it. what about the day of the shooting was abhorrent enough but all the clues missed. but all the clues missed -- they weren't even clues.

>> we'll learn a lot more. >> coming up later this morning white house communications director hope hicks is set to testify before the house intelligence committee investigating russia's election meddling and according to one republican on the committee, quote, drama is likely. >> i don't even know what that means. >> what does that mean? .

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. heidi przybyla, thanks for being on today. what are you looking at coming up today? >> mika, guns is such an intractable issue, i'm looking to presidential leadership on this and, frankly, what trump is not doing. yesterday he talked a little bit about background checks, nothing specific, nothing on the age limits that he was discussing previously. the attorneys general from around the country are in town, not meeting with them and instead saying he's going to work with the nra. so i'm not too optimistic that anything is going to happen of substance.

thank you, heidi. president trump says he's willing to fight the nra to get new gun restrictions. we'll talk to two members of the senate judiciary committee. democrat chris coons and sheldon white house. plus, conservatives versus the party of trump. what is the future of the conservative movement exactly ten years after the passing of william f. buckley? "morning joe" is coming right back. proud to call our own. experts from all over the world, working closely together to deliver truly personalized cancer care. expert medicine works here. learn more at cancercenter.com i'm all about my bed. this mattress is dangerously comfortable. when i get in i literally say, ahh. america loves the leesa mattress. we have more five star customer reviews than any other mattress of its kind. this bed hugs my body. today is going to be great! order now, and get $125

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>> it is important as adults we take the lead and the responsibility in helping our children manage the many issues they're facing today. this means encouraging positive habits with social media and technolo technology, even limiting time online. i'm asking you to join me today and commit to promoting values such as encouragement, kindness, compassion, and respect in our children. with those values as a solid foundation, our kids will be better equipped to deal with many of the evils in our world today such as drug abuse and addicti addiction and negative social media interactions. >> well. >> as the parent of four children and two younger children i could not agree more

but the context is bizarre. you have the president of the united states who's bragged about saying the most hateful bullying things with his twitter fe feet, saying a new york senator would be willing to trade sexual favors for him for campaign donations. he tweeted about the person sitting next to me about having a facelift and bleeding. he talked about megyn kelly bleeding. we could talk about john mccain, him tweeting nasty things about john mccain and attacking a man who's fighting for his very life right now. we could go down the list while donald trump is getting his five deferments. >> so that was the first lady. >> donald trump is getting his

five deferments, john mccain was getting the hell beaten out of him with injuries that he would carry with him the rest of his life because he refused to leave the hanoi hilton until everybody with him left the hanoi hilton. it's -- kindness and compassion? i'll tell you what, the lack of shame. andrew sullivan wrote this about democrats in the 1990s and bill clinton, the complete lack of shame that infected bill clinton, the white house, and the entire party, he called it the death of shame. >> she was speaking with the spouses of american governors. mike barnicle joined the report. we have columnist for the "wall street journal" peggy noonan and

pulitzer prize winning historian jon meacham, his new book the soul of america, the battle for our better angels will be published in may very, very good timi timing. >> john, i know you don't -- just like preachers don't like listening to other preachers because think think they can do a better job than other preachers -- >> i love watching preachers in the audience. >> i know you know exactly what i'm talking about. >> they're like this, they're thinking i can do better. this chernow guy, you think he's sort of -- >> oh, come on! >> a passing phase. >> flash in the pan. >> have you read "grant" yesterday? >> i think i've read his books which are all fantastic. >> you're lying, you don't feel that way about him. >> i do. i honestly do.

>> right before the civil war, about 1860, it's extraordinary this sad, miserable life that this man led, the depression that inflicted him, he was in these outposts and all he wanted was to be with his wife and children. he was seen as a slob, slovenly, a drunkard and yet time and time again everybody that knew grant said he had the effect of being the guy that was slouched in the corner and then when you needed somebody to show more strength and more character and more power and more grit than anybody else suddenly this man transformed. he and lincoln saved our union

but what -- you look at both of these men who had lives of failures and isn't it roarkable -- i will say this -- that that's who god chose to lead our country through its most difficult time. >> it's one of these things that if you believe if providence or fate, it's the most remarkable thing. lincoln was no one's choice to be a savior as you say and as ron chernow writes and one of the great american stories is that euleulysses grant who coul stand the smell of blood in his father's tannery was selling firewood on the streets of st. louis with two years or so before he became the most important general arguably in the modern i a. >> kicked out of the army. kicked out of the united states

army forced to resign he's selling firewood on the streets of st. louis, he's seen as an abject failure and when abraham lincoln can't find a general to use their troops to win the war, this man who again also wouldn't even go hunting because he hated the thought of killing living beings went and did what it took to win that war. >> and there has been something remarkable in the american experience that we have managed to find the people we needed at the moments we most needed them and whether it's washington who was able to overcome the doubts of the framers about the presidency, one of the reasons they were willing to leave that ambiguity in the office is they knew they were looking at the first president in the room there in philadelphia with them and they were willing to trust him to do that ch.

people can accuse us of being sentimental or hokey but these flawed leaders at difficult moments have come to power and have led us and brought us to a better place than we were before. that's an observable fact. >> and mike the same thing happened in britain. winston churchill was perceived as a disaster by most of the establishment. john and i always joke about. when he's right he's right but when he's wrong, my god. and yet the man saved civilization. >> i would submit there's a come thread to everything you have

said about leaders and everything that jon meacham has just said about leaders and it's th this, they arrive like a miracle, like a flash of sunlight on a stormy day and they are almost to a person people who understand several elements of life that affect everyone who is normal in this country. they understand loss, what it's like to be hurt, to be damaged within their own lives, within the framework of their own existence. peggy, i don't know about you but there's a common thread that has stood out to me for years now thinking about all the great people who have led us. lincoln, grant, fdr, jack kennedy to a certain extent. they've all suffered losses that -- before they arrived on the scene to minister to this country and, oh, my god, do we need someone like that today. >> yeah. >> peggy noonan, thank you.

>> well said. can i just say for a second, jojon meacham when billy graham came on and he was quite beautiful, encompassing the guy, the moment, the career. as for what we're talking about, i have noticed in history sometimes people can tool along in obscurity until a disaster happens and they have within him the exact talents for disaster. so it's an interesting thing. there's an old saying -- the hero comes when he is need ed. when our belief is pale and weak there comes a man who is bright and shining and everyone around him reflects some of that glow

and stores some up against the day that he is gone. isn't that pretty? a hero comes from need. >> a hero comes from need. and i do believe in good's providence over this country. i always have read too many stories about people like general grant who rises to become president grant who takes us through reconstruction and as frederick douglass says did more to liberate black americans than anybody other than lincoln. >> that's in the chernow book, very much. >> that's why we have to teach our children. >> we've had 240 years of exceptionalism. we've made so many mistakes and yet we've listed ourselves up,

we've dusted ourselves off and we have, though it's been an uneven path, we have continued down the path of justice. >> a hero comes from need which is why melania trump is here to talk about cyber bullying right now. this is the moment she has chosen this spotlight. the timing of it, of the first lady stepping into the breach is interesting. there's an increased spotlight on her relationship with the president. >> so you're saying that you're -- you're saying she may have been trying to distance herself from the president? >> i think this is something where she has said before the election this is going to be a cause she was going to champion which has led to eye rolls across america considering the biggest sicyber bully is the on she is married to. but we are seeing her now -- their public appearances together have been few and far between in recent weeks. this obviously comes amid the backdrop of revelations about two different women coming forward, two different former playboy models suggesting they

had affairs with the president and there was alleged hush money paid to keep one of them quiet so it's interesting this is a moment where the first lady has decided to step back into the spotlight, whether it's a conscious empt to break with the president remains to be seen but it's interesting she's trying to assert her own issues. >> that's an interesting point of view. in the past hour we've seen a soundbite with ivanka trump saying it's inappropriate to ask her any questions about her father that might be challenging in any way because she's the daughter and then we see melania trump taking to the podium on cyber bullying. what do you make of this? >> well, with melania trump it seemed to me -- you know her remarks were perfectly helpful and anodyne and not harmful. it's good to tell kids not to be a cyber bully. i've admired in a way the stoic distance she often keeps from her husband. she -- it would have been

sharper if she had said "and let me be frank, the president is a man who has not always betrayed the high standards i am speaking november this area and i think everybody would have laughed and nodded like, yeah, he really hasn't. in the case of ivanka, i did think she answered the question by saying i don't think your question should have been asked, that have been been said, i'm a daughter, i trust my father, i believe in my father so that's where i am. i suppose that's all she can say and that's what she said, i didn't think the question was inappropriate. it was the kind of question journalists ask, this is a big question, it's bubbling out there about the charges of the women ivanka has come forward as family and staff and as a standard bearer for the family and an american representative

in korea. she was open to these questions. if she was surprised, she should not have been and it won't be the last time she's asked. >> the first lady occasionally gives these -- as if a wink to america to say i hear you, i see you. she did that yesterday when she talked about the never again kids from parkland and she said you have a voice, you deserve a voice, she said i've been heartened by the things i've seen you do and the things i've heard you say. remember, a lot of them are railing against her husband, against president trump and the republicans and the nra so every once in a while she looks into the camera and you can see she's saying "i hear some of you." >> but when she does, her eyes seem to be cries for help. >> well, we don't know about that, mike. >> do you feel there's a hostage tape? >> i can tell you this, when that when mike barnicle goes down a certain path telling stories that willie and i's eyes

are crying out and we start blinking. >> i just start crying. >> joe, though, you did raise a really crucial issue about all of this, the lack of teaching our own story in our public schools, teaching our own history tour. >> we have to and because we're americans, we focus on our failings, it's what we do and it's what i love about the country is saying we are sufficient tough on ourselves and it's almost seen as jingoistic to talk about god's divine providence, whether you believe in that or the exceptionalism of this country to have people like abhinge lincoln and general grant rise at this time out of obscurity from the most humble backgrounds and save -- grant had all of these spoiled brats with him at west point. his father shoved him into west point and he had all of these

spoiled brats that looked down on him, some of those generals were the same ones that abraham lincoln is if you're not going to use your army can i borrow. and grant was the one. this humble man. time and again that does happen. we ought to teach our children that without fearing we're being too jingoistic, i think. >> and i hope it is taught. we should be tough on ourselves. the way you make progress is being self-critical and trying to improve and we have. >> this country has the highest ideals and to live up to those ideals is -- takes a constant struggle. i think that's a good thing but if we want to jump back to melania trump. i've thought that of the whole family she has the best grasp of

reality, of the lives of ordinary people, so i agree there's something of a wink in what she was saying and doing and leaving it out there. she has common sense. i think she's pretty bright. >> i've had campaign people -- >> she's really nice. >> -- over the past year and a half say her instincts were far better than those around her and if donald trump had listened to her he would not be in a lot of the trouble he's in right now. jon meacham where are we right now a couple of weeks after parkla parkland. everybody is going to be a defining moment. people have been attacking kids.

kids that experienced shootings, don't attack kids, i say to my friends on the right. but is this a sea zmang change? is this what we started seeing in 1964 and 1965 regarding vietnam? >> i would put it in a slightly different historical tradition but it goes to the point you're talking chant as fdr used to say quoting his old headmaster, there's a line in u.n. affairs and it goes down sometimes but the trend is upward through the ages. the story is not just presidents but presidents who marshall the field of protests and inspire them. sometimes they're leaders of it, sometimes they're instruments of it. the great american reforms have taken a long time.

abigail adams wrote "remember the ladies" but it took until the '20s to get suffrage. it took us centuries from appomattox to the voting rights act and when you look at a timeline and that kind of thing, the civil rights movement, you wonder how could this have been a problem. how could it have taken a censutury to have lived up to t not only the declaration but the explicit language of the 15th amendment which grant announced. how is that? i think this shooting on the issue of guns in america will be one of those incidents -- and i think it will be closer to the end towards sensible reform than not. and i think those young people at parkland may be the moral equivalent today of the kids that dr. king and dr. abernathy

and others were working with. i think it may take longer but this will be on the timeline. the only counterexample of this, i think, is the really rapid shift of opinion on marriage equality which happened in almost eight or nine years. you look at president obama in who in '08 ran against it or was not in favor of it and then read his statement when the supreme court decision came out which is a great piece of almost american scripture. things can happen fast but more often than not they happen slowly. >> and you look at the age we're in, not only 24/7 news cycle but social media age and peggy i remember the first time i saw ronald reagan on television on the national stage in 1980 with my father and he said "look at that guy. that guy has been talking into cameras his whole life. that's why he's so good at this. look at that guy, we're going to

win this year, joey." we've seen all of these children -- i call them children because i've got children their age, i've got children older than them. >> babies. >> in fact, i call anybody under 50 a child but you look at them, they have grown up -- >> in the face time generation. >> with snapchat, with instagram, with talking into their phones. and they are so eloquent and with social media -- >> unafraid. >> everything moves so much more quickly that i wonder how long it takes for this change to move. >> well, i happen to think we are after this event of, what is it, two weeks ago now? we are in a watershed event. this really is going to change the gun reality in america. it changes how people think. here's one of the reasons. we're now 20 years into the school shooting era.

it has been terrible. one of those kids who was at parkland said in a news conference afterwards "this all started almost 20 years ago." a he said he was 18 and never been allowed to feel safe parents in america whether they have guns or not guns, we're not going to let this go. we're not going to say it's okay we send kids to school in the morning and don't know if they will be harmed and kids aren't going to say it's okay i fear i'll get shot. something about that incident ended a new era. and of course the kids are extremely media savvy, extremely confident, they're used to having a voice, they're used to saying my voice is as good as yours, mr. senator, mr. congressman. so they are startling and they've had a real impact but the biggest impact, quietly at

home in america in the morning, mom and dad being worried and thinking this must stop. >> no more. >> and hearing the kids. i've -- i don't know anybody that has children that i haven't talked about and they feel it and peggy i've been talking about again when you look at younger americans, more pro life because they can see the 3d imagery and it doesn't matter what politicians on the left and right say, social interest groups on the left and right, it's what parents see day in and day out when they see their child in the womb and it's the same thing here. when parents hear children being scared to go to school and having bad dreams. >> going through lockdown days. the one distinction i would make through the examples that john gave which were women's suffrage and voting rights act, those

were granting a right. guns in the eyes of the second amendment defenders, you're trying to take a right away from them. >> except these kids want the right to go to school without being afraid. >> right, but if you're talking about guns, that's a difficult one. >> except for the fact that anybody that reads the constitution and knows the constitution knows that having military style weapons is specifically not protected by the second amendment as interpreted by this conservative court. >> jon meacham, thank you very much. >> thank you, jon. and by the way, we'll get you and chernow together. i've heard he's not that bad of a guy. >> any time. >> can i ask you -- what musical has anybody written -- when is the andrew jackson musical coming? >> oh, my god. >> no, no, you haven't heard about the george h.w. bush rap musical? do you know how hard it is to find words that rhyme with martini? >> exactly.

>> we'll wait for it. >> wasp, the musical. >> we'll see you opening night, mika. >> wear your boots. still ahead on "morning joe," a bipartisan group of senators spent the last week trying to reassure foreign allies that relations with the u.s. aren't changing for the worse despite some of the comments the president has made. senator chris coons was one of the lawmakers on that trip. he joins us next. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ♪ ♪ ♪

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when only certain people can get it. let's fix that. let's give this guy gig- really? and these kids, and these guys, him, ah. oh hello. that lady, these houses! yes, yes and yes. and don't forget about them. uh huh, sure. still yes! xfinity delivers gig speed to more homes than anyone. now you can get it, too. welcome to the party. new developments in the deadly escalation in the syrian civil war. russia has ordered daily five hour humanitarian pauses in the syrian government's onslaught of a rebel held suburb of damascus. russia says it will set up an evacuation for civilians in the area. joining us now, a member of the judiciary and foreign relations committee, democratic senator chris coons of delaware.

senator coons is just back from a trip overseas where he met with key allies about the situation in the middle east. senator, good to have you on. what did you hear from those key allies. >> well, mika, senator graham of south carolina led a bipartisan delegation for republicans and three democrats. we went to jordan, israel, greece, met with foreign ministers, prime ministers, in the case of jordan the king. we heard significant concern about the escalating violence in syria. i'll just remind you, it's vladimir putin's russia that has made possible the butcher of damascus, bashar al assad staying in power and opening a window for iran's revolutionary guard forces and for hezbollah to gain a foothold throughout syria. we went to the golan heights in israel and observed actions on the ground in the near distance right up against israel's border by both isil, which still has an active pocket there in southwest syria and assad's forces backed

up by iranians. our israeli allies, our jordanian allies, are deeply troubled by the day i don't sch and how close it's getting to the borders and our allies are interested in tighter, closer security partnerships and in having a clearer path forward. president trump has led a number of core allies to question the forcefulness and clarity of our commitment because of his statements and budget which proposed a dramatic cut in humanitarian aid and in the state department and usaid. i think it's important that we showed a bipartisan message of support for our key allies in the middle east. >> senator coons, it's willie geis geist, if i can hop across the globe for a bit. i just spent the last month in south korea. there's a concern about north korea and a direct attack but there's a pool of concern that the president of the united states may at some point launch a preemptive strike into north

korea which would lead to strikes into seoul and across south korea. is that a reasonable zmrn wheco? where is the president and the policy vis-a-vis north korea? >> there has been real debate about whether to pursue a so-called bloody nose strike against north korea. i personally think that would be very risky. i think in north korea you've got not as much a regime as a cult of personality where kim jong-un urchss that anything that diminishes his credibility is a direct assault on his regime. and so one of the things i worry about is that our president who has a candidate said he would aim to be unpredictable has succeeded in being unpredictable for our regional allies so my concern is that japan and south korea who would bear the brunt of any counterattack don't know where our president is going. we don't have ambassadors in a number of key countries. we don't have an ambassador in jordan, we don't have an ambassador in south korea so

it's hard for the sometimes unpredictable messages put out by our president to be deciphered by our core allies. >> senator, jonathan lemire. i know you've been overseas be the major topic at home is the issue of gun control in the wake of parkland. what do you think? is this a moment where things could change? . what sort of legislation and measures do you think have a chance of getting through both parties of congress and getting to the white house? >> yesterday i had a chance to visit one of delaware's high schools and to hear from 500 high school students. the number one issue they wanted to talk about was gun safety, gun violence. what it's meant to them to have grown up in an environment where they go through school lockdown drills, active shooter drills and their angry insis tense that we in washington listen to them and take action. i've been talking to republican colleagues on the trip i just mentioned and last night and this morning about what bills we can introduce that have a chance

of moving forward, i remain hopeful that we will take up and vote on common sense bills that will strengthen the enforcement of existing laws and put in place new laws but the political reality is harsh and when the kids in delaware asked me yesterday what can we do to be more effective in lobbying congress for action i said don't change the subject, don't go away, stay at it. keep coming, push us because what i saw when i was in israel at the cnn town hall of high school students from parkland confronting currently serving senators was compelling, very powerful and i expect we will act if the people of america and particularly the teenagers of america hold our feet to the fire and insist we take action. >> senator chris coons, thank you for being on. good to see you. coming up, not that long ago many republicans would not have defined the gop as the party of trump today you hear very few still willing to say that. what has changed? that's ahead on "morning joe."

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joining us from washington -- >> go ahead. i was talking from alex. >> editorial director for the "washington examiner" hugo

gerden, thank you for being on. >> thanks for having me. >> hugo, thanks so much for being with us. i want to talk about the state of conservatism. we were talking about people invited and especially about le pen being invited. how -- i wonder where is the conservative movement when they invite somebody to speak who actually supports socialist policies on one hand but also says she wants to be like her grandfather who was fond of nazis. >> i think conservatism is in a dangerous and precarious place and president trump was elected ladgely because he put himself on the side of people who referred to as the forgotten man, people who felt their voices were not heard and who wanted to take on the establishment which they felt were more concerned about wall street than main street and they

wanted loose immigration and allowing low skilled workers to come in. because our politics is so rancidly divided at the moment and there are some people on the conservative side that they feel have to back president trump by any means that come to hand so you have cpac seeing someone like marine le pen and thinking oh, she's a populist, she's taking on the establishment and she's also got harsh words to say about immigration therefore she's our ally. this is a terrible mistake because she has absolutely nothing to do with conservatism and you had the head of cpac describing her as a classical liberal which is ludicrous. >> not even close. >> not even close. she's a national socialist. and not only does that come with the or shorrible racial baggaget is associated with that, but it's a socialist movement that's

more left than right, against free trade, against market economics. there's nothing in common here and it starts making conservatism and american conservatism intellectually incoherent so it's not a place american conservatives should be going. >> peggy, this forum that ronald reagan spoke at, bill buckley held court at, bob novak held court at, one of their stars was the national front that supports the government taking other and the nationalization of industry, reducing the work week to 30 hours. you name it, socialist -- >> european pollism wipulism. >> socialist policies. >> and called out very wonderfully i thought by mona charen on that issue. i keep, though -- one of the great subjects for me the past two years has been cpac seemed to me -- i guess i should note this -- like an old remnant of

the vibrant, alive and intellectually acute conservatism which n which you and i were involved 30 years ago and 20 years ago. cpac just didn't seem that. it seemed older, crankier, literally darker every time i watched one of its speeches. it was like in a dark room with people feeling beleaguered, not confident, but my great question, i think let me throw it out, by great i mean the big question for me is where did donald trump come from? in the old republican party, in the old conservative movement, the one we were all very young in, he would not have been a possibility but since then the past 15, 20 years we've had two major wars, very frustrating and painful. we have had the crash of the american stock market.

we have seen america's standing in the world seem diminished by those two things. that to me is where donald trump came from and i think those events, the wars and the crash changed the conservative base and the republican base and it's all up for grabs now and conservative intellectuals should not waist their time saying trump is a barbarian, a vulgarian, i hate him. they're saying what did we do wrong, how did we screw up, how can we wrestle from these circumstance circumstances policies that will help our country? >> to answer in a rather glib way, where did he come from, he came from the democratic party, he was a democrat. >> thank you. >> they don't want to hear that. they hate when you tell them that he was a life long democrat that gave more money to democ t

democrats. chuck schumer, nancy pelosi, hillary clinton. you name it. >> he is not a conservative so it's not a surprise to find he's -- in the past he's been basically a new york liberal, a liberal democrat. i think the point peggy makes about where did he come from and where did the republican party go wrong has a mirror part of it. what happened in the democratic party that made someone like donald trump acceptable and a champion for the republican part y par party. . the democratic party seemed stove a lot of people, blue-collar workers, to have abandoned them. they seem to have signed with the elite which most viewers would think was traditionally the side of the people who the republicans would side with so there was this vast number of voters out there to be scooped up and what donald trump recognized in states like michigan and wisconsin and

pennsylvania that there are people unrepresented who are taken for granted by the democrats and hillary clinton took for granted, she didn't even go to wisconsin, that's where donald trump came from. >> hugo gurdon, thank you very much. two things, kids, if you're running for president in the future, one, don't skip going to wisconsin and, two, don't call working class americans deplorables, that's just -- don't do that. try not to insult -- >> enough snark. when it comes to the russia investigation, a new poll finds more americans trust bob mueller than donald trump. we'll talk about that with senator sheldon whitehouse next on "morning joe." and the wolf huffed and puffed...

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new polling from "usa today" and suffolk university shows

americans have more trust in special counsel robert mueller's investigation than they do in president trump's denials of collusion. 58% now say they have a lot or some trust in the mueller investigation. that number some trust in the investigation. that number is way you. 57% say they have little or no trust in president trump's denials. that's up, as well. 42% say russian meddling affecting the outcome of the 2016 election. 44% say it did not. three-quarters of the country believe russians will continue to try to meddle in the u.s. elections and 6 in 10 say the president is not doing enough to respond. let's bring in a member of the judiciary committee. democratic senator sheldon white house of the rhode island senator. it's always good to see you. we have more of a series of indictments. plea deals, as well, mixed in there. what do you see that is happening in the country now that more and more americans

believe that bob mueller is on the traright track? >> for one thing, it shows reasonableness and san thety are not dead in america. i think it shows the professionalism of the mueller investigation. they have not been making a lot of noise. they have been steadily going about their business. the indictments that they brought down have been exceptionally well founded. you can just read the indictment and see exactly what they're talking about into very high levels of detail so the documents themselves are very convincing. ask, again, he's not making, you know, big promises or statements. he's just going about doing his job. so i think if you put the professionalism and coolness of the mueller investigation against the hot headedness and bombast of the trump folks, it's a good comparison in favor of mueller. >> senator, it's jonathan lamere. we're seeing these poll numbers where the special counsel's credibility is up despite him being under attack. for months now from certain members of the right and are you

concerned enough has been done to safeguard the special counsel in case there is a movement despite increased public stand to go try to dispose of him? >> well, i think we need to pass the two pieces of legislation sitting in the senate yew dishary committee that have had their hearing and simply need a markup date for us to get moving on them in order to assure a higher level of protection for him. we are hearing our republican colleagues say that would be a bridge too far, but how many bridges too far has trump crossed already with the republicans lining up behind him on the other side of the bridge. so i think we do need to pass those bills and we do need to continue to protect mueller, although this polling information showing public support, i think, is going to be hemf helpful and at least discouraging to other efforts to demean hill. these efforts to attack the mueller investigation and create public distrust if in it, that's flying awful close to the flame.

because all it takes is for somebody to have admitted somewhere along the line that the purpose of this exercise is not just to shift public opinion, but to influence the opinions of the members of the grand jury. and then this whole scheme falls into the obstruction of justice category. >> yeah. that's exactly what i wanted to follow you about. do you feel like with these measures that we see from the president and those around him, is this -- do you feel like these countermeasures, the attacks on bob mueller internally are something that bob mueller looks at? >> i think he would be foolish not to. essentially, all of the elements of obstruction of justice, of an attempt to influence or obstruct a grand jury are there. what's missing is the question of was it their the intent to influence that grand jury. and that intent can be de-decembered. you can have circumstantial evidence that produces it. or you can have direct evidence. and who knows what mueller may

have in the way of direct evidence of somebody having confessed somewhere along the way, hey, guys, let's do this. this will make those grand juries think twice about indicting our guy. so, senator, when i hear you talk about that as i'm explaining, i'm thinking devin noness. >> one of the biggest questions out there in washington, d.c. right the now and has gone unanswered and whose answers to the extent that they've tried it have been shallow, nondenial denials has been this. what were the communications, either between the trump legal team or the white house, and e nunes house republican committee staff with respect to the drawing up of that phony document that they put out. if there has been a collusion between the white house and the house republican staff, that puts a whole new cast of light on that whole operation. and their refusal to answer any

of those questions, to me, is very telling and very damming. >> senator sheldon whitehouse, thank you very much. fascinating questions. >> that you can. >> jonathan, thank you, as well. still ahead, republicans in florida threaten to punish one of the state's biggest businesses all to protect the nra. we'll explain that, plus jonathan turley testified as a constitutional law expert in the clinton impeachment hearings. his new piece in this morning's washington post examines if donald trump can be indicted while serving as president. turley will be our guest. and the ground is fertile for democrats to retake congress dmt upcoming midterms, but do they have a winning message or any message at all or a messenger?

they can still blow this thing. what would our founding fathers want us to do about this president? i'm tom steyer, and when those patriots wrote the constitution here in philadelphia, they created the commander in chief to protect us from enemy attack the justice department just indicted 13 russians for an electronic attack on america. so what did this president do? nothing. he's failed his most important responsibility - to protect our country. the question is: why is he still president?

welcome back to "morning joe." it's tuesday, february 27th. with us, we have veteran columnist and msnbc news mike barnicle, heidi, and msnbc political analyst eugene robinson. let's start this hour with the

upcoming midterms. that's how things are shaping up right now. democrats hold a 16-point lead over republicans on a generic ballot according toen a cnn srs poll. 38% said they would vote for the republican, down 6 points. democrats are also more ebb thus aftic about this year's midterms. 57% of democrats say they are extremely or very enthusiastic to vote for congress this year. 43% of republicans said they were extremely or very enthu enthusiastic. >> and we're still a long way off. in a lot of polls in the president's approval ratings also in this generic ballot test, you saw republicans get a bump over the past month. some suggested because of the tax cut.

but that's been wiped away. in fairley dramatic fashion, we can only guess, and it is just a guess since is parkland shooting. >> i think that could be the crucial thing. frankly, you've got a lot more democrats.than republicans. and the question is who is motivated to vote.

>> you look at the people motivated to vote. there are so many people motivated to vote, turn yoeout for black voters is as high as it was. and heidi, i'm just curious here. we are coming up on the end of february. we ask this question all the time. are republicans on the hill, especially in the house? are they concerned about this? do they see a need to appeal more to forget about certain voters. but at least suburban republican women. are they doing anything? >> what you're seeing at this retreat that paul ryan held,

where they delivered some of the sobering news even though they're optimistic that the tax cut is going to work its way. they're under water in a number of critical districts. so they're going to tell these republicans how the underdog party always runs which has played to their district. but does that really mean running against this president? we haven't seen any indication of that. after the tax cuts, we were going to look for some fissures there and we're not seeing that. how is that a strategy going into this when the democrats, women, are so motivated. for example, we're seeing in virginia with this race that ed gillespie there, the gubernatorial candidate, got more votes than trump did. but what made the difference? it was the enthusiasm among the democrats. we're seeing that manifest in poll after poll and this party

definitely, i'm not seeing any indications of there being some kind of a grand plan to try andover come that. >> gene was talking about intensity, mike. there is an intensity, obviously, on the democratic side. also an intensity against donald trump. but you saw against bill clinton in 1994, you saw against george w. bush in 2006. but, mike, you look at the after effect of the parkland tragedy and where republicans would be most affected by inaction than by just blindly being seen as blindly toing the line of the nra or the republicans on capitol hill would be in the very sdrifdistricts that they'r fighting for their lives for. the 25 districts that hillary clinton won that has republican members that will tip the bam on who is the next speaker of the house.

>> it's going to be interesting to see. they have women all geared out to vote for the democrats. but if they make the mistake of trump, trump, trump, trump, it's not going to be that easy. there's something going on in this country. there's a feeling that the country is fractured, that there's a -- that the country is in need of an emotional fix, that the country has to be brought together, that the country is divided. they're going to have to address these issues because the economy is not an issue right now. >> right. >> people like this tax cut. democrats and republicans. they like it in the short material. i don't know how it will play out over the course of the summer. >> again, but in off-year elections, often it's more about cultural divides than it is about economics. the economy was great in '94, bill clinton got hammered.

the economy was great in 2006, george bush got hammered. i will say, i'm talking the more and more many dlic leaders, democratic policy people who are concerned that the democrats have everything on their side, but they don't have a unifying message. and a lot of people that were concerned that hillary clinton was going to lose in the democratic party are saying still, they still don't have a message for the common good. it's for this the group, you've been -- you know, you've been treated badly, group a, and the democrats are going to take care of you. group b, you've been treated badly and this is what we're going to do to take care of you. group c, you've been treated badly. and group d and so many democratic strategists say that if you even talk about how this democratic party bulkaniz with es voters instead of reaching for the common good of all americans that you're suddenly called a racist or you're

attacked and you're shunned from the party. >> i think it's always been a question of me too, never again, all of these movements we've seen can coalesce and collect votes and push people into elected office or if it's just a movement that changes us culturally, but fought politically. you look at what's happening in california with nancy pelosi and dianne feinstein being pushed so far to the left where dianne feinstein is now being -- she's a donald trump/george bush republican according to her opponents. >> can you believe that? that dianne feinstein, as much as she's given to the democratic party for as long as she's given it to the democratic party on the local, state and national level is insfushtly liberal for california politics. >> it's identity politics. >>s that's all you need to know. >> she said -- i think she said a couple of things over the past year and a half doing what any responsible senator would do. and desperately trying to find common ground with republicans.

and she's attacked for it. democrats are their own worst enemy. >> california is different from other democratic states. all the states. that's not so much what you said earlier. the unifying message. when you look at successful politics, when you look at bill clinton and you look at barack obama, they did enunciate a vision, a more unifying vision. and they did the find a way to speak more broadly. and the big question is who in the democratic party right now is able to do that the, to have, you know, the message needs a messenger or messengers. i think there are very good democratic congressional candidates that are doing that. >> right. >> in their districts.

and that can make the difference in november. and so maybe, you know, the real challenges and maybe on the other side of november. it's looking ahead to 2020, who is that messenger? >> and barack obama is the greatest example of what you're talking about where his 2004 speech, one of the best convention speeches we've heard in a long, long time where you said he didn't believe in a blue america, he didn't believe in a red state america. he believed in the united states of america. there you had a democrat who wasn't even trying to just talk about how the democrats should be unified. he was talking about unifying the entire country. and that is something that's sorely lacking with these candidates. and we see it in the republican party, too, where there's one interest group after another that republicans hunt down. democrats, hunting down the same votes. one after another after another. and, again, we had robert rice on last week. he has a book called the common

good. what's the common good for the united states of america, that the democratic message has other than group a has been afflicted by this, group b has been afflicted by that, group c has been afflicted by this. if you want to be a party of victimhood and party of affliction, like willie said, you can affect social change. but if you want to be like barack obama, you figure out how to unify the party and how you figure out how to unify the country. >> they have to come up with a candidate or candidates who can speak to the nation about a few very simple themes. who are we? why is it that we seem to be losing this sense of community in this country that we once had that held us together? and the idea of, you know, who do we want to be going forward? >> and it's a buzz word for conservatives, but it is true,

willie. identity politics. it will be the undoing of democrats in 2020 if not 2018. and, again, they can shoot the messenger all they want. this is the reality. this is what democrats were saying behind the scenes, whether it was bill clinton or joe biden or barack obama, all the other people saying in august of 2016, they were all very nervous. they were all panicking. they were all saying this campaign team in brooklyn doesn't get it. >>o biden with us and the bar in philadelphia used the exact same. >> and rendel. >> and rendel. >> saying we're going to lose if we can't get a common message. it doesn't just go one group after another. you split them up, tell them all they're all victims and everybody is percent cuting per. >> but today, that message that

barack obama delivered in 2004 is viewed as mushy and saccharin and not sufficient in protecting those groups. so if you talk about we all have to be one united states of america. the feeling now is that no, we're a couple of tribes in america and it's our duty to protect the members of our tribe. still ahead, president trump is now speaking a lot about guns. what he told the nation's governors at the white house yesterday and what they told him back. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ♪ i feel like fire ( ♪ ) the 2018 cadillac xt5. ♪ worship me beauty, greater than the sum of its parts. get this low-mileage lease on this cadillac xt5 from around $329 per month. visit your local cadillac dealer. ( ♪ ) ♪ worship me

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you know what's not awesome? gig-speed internet. when only certain people can get it. let's fix that. let's give this guy gig- really? and these kids, and these guys, him, ah. oh hello. that lady, these houses! yes, yes and yes. and don't forget about them. uh huh, sure. still yes! xfinity delivers gig speed to more homes than anyone. now you can get it, too. welcome to the party. president trump hosted the nation's governors at the white house where they discussed school safety in the wake of the florida school shooting. in the meeting, the president promised executive action to make bump stocks so difficult to purchase they would be, quote, gone. he also emphasized the need to fundamental institutions tore people making violence threats like the florida school shooter and he revealed that he recently

met with leaders of the nra and believes they would take quick action the to support new gun restrictions. >> i had lunch with wayne lapiere, chris cox and david leman of the nra. and i want to tell you, they want to do something. and i said, fellas, we have to do something. it's too long now. we have to do something. and we're going to do very strong background checks. very strong. we have to do background checks. if we see a sicko, i don't want them having a gun. and, you know, i know there was a time when anybody could have. even if they were sick, they were fighting. and there's no bigger fan of the second amendment than me and there's no bigger fan of the nra. these guys are great patriots, they're great people. and they want to do something. they're going to do something. when we see somebody sick like this book guy, when t this guy, they went to see him,

but they don't have immediate access to take those guns away. we've got to give them immediate access. don't worry, you're not going to get any. don't worry about the nra. they're on our side. half of you are so afraid of the nra. there's nothing to be afraid of. if they're not with you, we have to fight them every once in a while, that's okay. >> gee with, that's interesting coming from donald trump in a republican president, but there are a few of those things that he mentioned that a lot of people would have loved to see after newtown. so if we have strong expanded background checks, if we figure out a way as a country to take guns out of the hands of those who are mentally ill and shouldn't be having a gun, that sounds like a step forward. what do you think? >> of course it would be a step forward. look, i think there are other steps, common sense steps that

should be taken that go beyond that that the nra would hate. but, sure, if we can do those things, i think we ought to do them and do them now. i wonder, however, if the president heard when la piere spoke last week at cpac, when he was foaming at the mouth and basically saying anybody who says we ought to do anything is a socialist who is trying to destroy america. and i think that, you know, the members of congress who heard the president probably feel they have a lot of reasons to be afraid of the nra. and until that equation, maybe donald trump has the sort of stature or authority or is in a position to buck the nr are a if he wants to. one has to believe it when one sees pit. coming up on "morning joe,"

georgia republicans tell delta air lines to back nra discounts or else. how tax breaks are now being leveraged in a battle with the gun group. that's next on "morning joe." last years' n was a success for choicehotels.com badda book. badda boom. was a success for choicehotels.com this year, we're taking it up a notch. so in this commercial we see two travelers at a comfort inn with a glow around them, so people watching will be like, "wow, maybe i'll glow too if i book direct at choicehotels.com". who glows? just say, badda book. badda boom. nobody glows. he gets it. always the lowest price, guaranteed. book now at choicehotels.com

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the president says it's okay to fight the nra once in a while, but it doesn't seem the republicans in georgia agree with that notion. delta is now facing backlash in its home state over its push to receiver ties with the nra in the wake of the park.land florida school shooting. conservative leaders in georgia's senate are voting to block a lucrative tax break bill for the airline unless it fully rein-tates its relationship with the gun rights organization. the gun bill which cleared the state's house last week would eliminate the state tax on jet fuel potentially saving the atlanta-based company tens of millions of dollars. delta is one of several companies to abandon its relationship with the nra after the school shooting on saturday. the company announced it would

end discounted rates for nra members. georgia's republican lieutenant governor casey kagel weighed in on the matter yesterday tweeting, i will kill any tax legislation that benefits delta unless the company changes its position and fully reare instates its relationship with nra. corporations cannot attack conservatives and expect us not to fight back. >> it's really remarkable. >> wow. >> you look for an example lot of like that when you want to prove how much somebody cowtals to a special interest group. general electric kept get -- >> exactly right. >>. >> these legislators said, general electric will never leave. they kept sticking their thumbs in the eye of ge executives and they kept raising taxes in a way

that general electric couldn't be competitive. and general electric said if you keep doing this, we're going to have -- they said you're not going to leave. and then there was a guy in the state legislature, one of the leaders, that said oh, general electric just doesn't want to pay higher tax because their guys want to go around on yachts on the weekend. did you know general electric's board got together and said we don't have partners here and we don't have to stay here. so general electric, after being in connecticut for decades, they moved to boston. delta air lines, i mean, delta -- >> you couldn't be more right. >> delta can -- to the lieutenant governor of georgia, what are you going to tell your voters when delta decides to put their hub in cincinnati? you're being -- i'll be polite. you just need to talk to the people of connecticut. because when legal state

legislators like that, and i'm going to call him that, because that's what connecticut had. we had legislators that pumped their chests out and threatened general legislators to move and the economy in connecticut is shattered. >> the suicidal line in the guy's text, put the text up if you could, corporations cannot attack conservatives and expect us not to fight back. so if you're a member of the delta board or if you're the ceo of delta, you can get a message to lieutenant governor of georgia either publicly or privately, we're going to go to dallas and ask them, what will you do for us? we're going to make dallas our new hub instead of atlanta. that's a lot of jobs. still ahead, is it possible to impeach a president but not possible to indict one? you law professor jonathan turley says no. >> one more pay.

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i hate to be a bad republican, but i don't think congress ought to be limiting the scope of -- it has to be relevant, obviously. we can't ask her about something that happened in high school. we're investigating what did russia do, with whom did they do it, what was the u.s.'s response and disseminating classified information. that's the scope to me. if she was part of the campaign, we ought to be able to ask her about adam schiff's allegations of collusion. >> it's a member of the house intelligence committee congressman trey gowdy speaking about the questions that will be allowed when hope hicks appeared before the committee for the first time later this morning. a source with knowledge tells nbc news there has been no agreement on the scope of questions like there was for former chief strategist steve bannon. joining us now, msnbc's chief legal correspondent host of "the

beat" counting it down every day at 6:00. ari melbourne. >> he has this dick clark thing. he rates guests that come on. >> also with us in washington, law professor of george washington university, jonathan turley. he's out with two new columns. one on what the rick gates deal really means, the other on whether president trump can be indicted while serving as president. and professor fturley got a cameo mention in one of president trump's tweets this morning. it says, quote, i've been skeptical about the collusion and obstruction claims for the last year. i just don't see the evidence in terms of the collusion. it's all a bit implausible based on the evidence we have, quoting jonathan turley on fox news. we'll let you address that. >> i just learned it for the first time when you read it. >> congratulations. >> and i think everyone is

entitled to a presidential tweet in this administration. i'm glad mine finally came around. >> as presidential tweets go, you got off pretty easy. >> just ask mika. this administration, everybody gets a tweet. so jonathan, just to follow up on that and not even being devil's advocate, it's just obvious, but you don't know and i don't know, willie, nobody knows what evidence is out there. only bob mueller knows that, right? >> right. well, we do know that we haven't had a nexus established in any of these filings in terms of collusion. now, that is, i think, a significant point, but it's not the endpoint. obviously, there may still be evidence out there. the premise of one of those columns is that the pressure on manafort may represent a strategy to go to the person most likely to be colluding. that is when paul manafort has a

long history with russian oligach forces. and mueller is shaking manafort pretty hard to see if he can force a plea. >> and, in fact, jonathan, if there is a case to be made on collusion, most likely, bob mueller would find out after getting gates to plea, after leaning in on manafort and then following that path, right? >> it is. although as you know, i'm very skeptical about the suggestion that there is a collusion case to be made against the president or even an obstruction case on the evidence that we have. >> can i ask you, again, how do you know that, though? not to put you on cross-examination on the stand, but we don't know what bob mueller knows. we don't know what is out there. >> this is when i do a wolf and say i can't hear you.

no, the -- what we do have, and i think to be fair to the white house, is that we do have a year of indictments, plea agreements, what are called speaking indictments that give narratives. they conexpectusly don't include any type of nexus or suggestion of collusion. does that mean that there's no evidence? of course not. but i think that you have to give the white house its due. there has yet to be evidence establishing that strong nexus. >> well, from what we know at this point. but apparently this is going to go on for some time. let me ask you, jonathan, i've asked you the question before. one of the things i've been surprised by is how people have written articles over the past six months saying, oh, you can't indict a president. oh, you can't -- there's just -- there's no -- there's no supreme court decision suggesting as much and there's no reason to believe that this court would rule that way. that's another great unknown. how would anthony kennedy vote

on -- in a split court on that question? >> well, i think that is the question, joe. this has been a long standing debate among law professors. and there are very good arguments on the other side from academics that say they just don't believe that a president can be indicted, that the exclusive way to remove a president is to use impeachment and then indict hill. and all of us agree that that is the preferred process. where i disagree is that there is this implied sweeping immunity. i think that's a very dangerous thing. constitutional interpretations can expand rights, the 14th amend is an example of that. that's a natural process. but when you start to read into the constitution, massive immunities like this one, it's a very dangerous process. >> and it undercuts the belief in america that no man is above the law. that said, artie, i see bob mueller. i could be completely wrong, but from what i've been told about

bob mueller, he's a lot like john roberts was in the obamacare case obamacare case, which is, okay, you want to overturn obamacare, that's fine. don't ask us to at the court to do your business at the voting booth. and he said this. if you want obamacare thrown out, vote against it. it's the same thing from bob mueller. he's going to find out everything he can find out about trump, but he's not going to do violence to the political system. he'll get his evidence, he'll indict who he indicts. but if they want to throw the president of the united states out, he will refer all of the information to congress and let them decide. >> yeah. i think he's very tough. i think that bob mueller, throughout his record in history which we know something about is someone who follows the facts aggressively, but not wantonly. not beyond what they show. professor turl he ey mak y make

arguments. he tweeted with you because he agrees with you or agrees with a quote of you. but i will point out respectfully one potential logical hole in the case that the professor makes, which is if bob mueller hasn't said something, does that mean it hasn't happened? i think that was part of the logical implications. bob mueller has not done anything with the indictments. doesn't matter whose e-mails. they happened in this case to be podesta's e-mails. we know that was a federal american felony. there has been zero indictments on it yet. all that tells me is they either haven't found the people or it's coming later. it doesn't tell me that it doesn't happen. so there's a lot of questions here about the events, what's been charged, and what ultimately will be determined. >> no, i -- >> i'm sorry. >> please be aerudite.

willie and i have been sitting here for a decade now. he's never called us aerudite once. >> and not just ari. no one. >> nobody has called us that in part because we don't know the meaning of the word. but it sounds pretty. call us that, that would be great. >> john, just a point of information. if a president, a sitting president were indicted. what happens then? does he continue being a president, though under indictment, or does the indictment itself trigger some action? >> no. he continued to be president. impeachment is about the office. indictment is about the individual. if you want to get an indicted president in office, you get the government that you deserve. >> a president will not stand trial at least in a single term

if he's indicted. it simply takes too long for that. but other people in the constitution, including federal judges, can be indicted in office. the current illinois governor is an example of that. >> why don't you just name just about every governor in illinois over the past decade. >> right. good point. >> by the way, willie and i's legal defense fund, still there. >> numbers are low, but we believe we'll get to our target. >> all because you wanted to give health care to kids. >> his heart was too big. >> so, ari, it seems to a lot of people watching the moves of bob mueller, they see, perhaps, obstruction of justice as it relates to the president of the united states, but not yet evidence of collusion.

is that your read of what we've seen so far? >> there is a question about whether that is enough and what you do in -- >> for collusion? >> no, whether even what he said is enough. because the law allows stupidity. the li the law allows negative and silly and terrible thoughts. you need more than that. so i do think what bob mueller is investigating is not only did donald trump admit to having russia on his mind when he removed the fbi director, which is bad and he said it on tv, but rather was there a larger and ongoing criminal conspiracy of obstruction and were other people involved knowingly. that's when it's so significant when you see someone like don mcgahn not only reportedly resist attempts to remove mueller, but make sure that everyone can read about it in the "new york times." because don mcgahn wants to make sure that people, including mueller's investigators, though

where he stood on legal issues of the day because he could have been involved in the crime. on the collusion side, we're talking about a national security espionage case. i don't think we're going to be ahead of the investigators and the spies. i think when they want people to know, we'll know if there's something to know. >> did you hear that? that was erudite. >> you had no idea what you were talking into here dropping that awesome word. thank you. >> thank you, gentlemen. >> appreciate it. by the way, last night, ari, while spinning out the hits, jonathan, also defined what the second amendment was and what the second amendment was not. it was fascinating. we hear so many people say i have a right to carry whatever gun i want to carry. of course, the supreme court -- can you briefly tell us, the supreme court continues to deny, sir, for all of these appeals, for one state after another after another limiting the second amendment. or limiting their interpretation

of what the second amendment does. so does the second amendment mean that places like d.c. and illinois can't stop people from having handguns in their homes the to protect themselves? >> i think what the supreme court has said in heller is this is an individual right. but they also said there are no absolute rights in the constitution. the late justice scalia acknowledged that. which means there can be reasonable limitations, just as there could be reasonable limitations on things like free speech. the question is, the range of those limitations and how much the supreme court is willing to tolerate. now, people have debated whether, for example, a state can outlaw an entire class of weapon. and the assumption is that some bands would be constitutional, but there's still a lot of law that needs to be written in this area. heller, even though this is a right that the supreme court says existed when the second

amendment was enacted, it's a relatively new right in the sense of actual case law. so we're all groping a bit in the dark here's as to where those limits are. >> well, and the court is keeping us there, too, obviously intentionally, because right now they seem pleased with heller, right? >> right. and there's various reasons. these justices count heads. they tend not to the grant certs to hear a case unless they feel fairley comfortable they can garner that fifth vote. this is a court in flux. and a lot of them don't want to put their money down on the table in another major post heller ruling until they feel comfortable with it. >> jonathan turley, thank you very much. we'll be reading your new column in today's washington post waiting for the next tweet from the president. thank you again, ari. we'll be watching "the beat" tonight at 6:00 p.m. eastern on msnbc. and coming up, exactly ten

years after a conservative icon passed away, we'll dissect what donald trump's presidency means to the conservative movement and where the conservative movement stands. that's coming up next on "morning joe." this is laura. and butch. and tank. and tiny. and this is laura's mobile dog grooming palace. laura can clean up a retriever that rolled in foxtails, but she's not much on "articles of organization." articles of what? so, she turned to legalzoom. they helped me out. she means we helped with her llc, trademark, and a lot of other legal stuff that's a part of running a business. so laura can get back to the dogs. would you sit still? this is laura's mobile dog grooming palace and this is where life meets legal.

at ally, we're doing digital financial services right. but if that's not enough, we have more than 8000 allys looking out for one thing: you. call in the next ten minutes... and if that's not enough, we'll look after your every dollar. put down the phone. and if that's not enough, we'll look after your every cent. grab your wallet. (beeping sound) (computer voice) access denied. and if that's still not enough to help you save... oh the new one! we'll bring out the dogs. mush! (dogs barking) the old one's just fine! we'll do anything, seriously anything, to help our customers. thanks. ally. do it right. in the award winning firing line was broadcast into millions of americans homes every week on

american television, beloved, controversial, hugely influential and conceived as a simple exchange of opinions. buckley described firing line as the only program on the air that gives to presidents poets a full hour in which to disclose themselves. >> wow. >> willie, you know, mika dated a member of the review -- >> is that true? >> editor. >> whatever happened? >> didn't work out. >> why you asking on tv? >> i think laura ingraham stole him or something like that. >> she wouldn't -- it was one guy. >> i was left standing in the rain -- it was not -- yes, outside the dartmouth review, crying, crying. >> do you know how many times i've heard -- i've heard this story so much -- >> -- on the review steps, waiting. it was the driving rain in the middle of the winter in hanover, new hampshire. it took two buses to white river junction. >> oh, my god, why did i bring

this up? >> it's as though it's right here, right on the surface. >> you know, they said of george harrison he could start talking about his past with the beatles when he was happy with his present, right? but apparently mika is still tortured by her past. >> but the review was so important, they were on deadline. >> today marks the tenth anniversary -- i'm sorry you guys had to watch this. it's been ten years since william f. buckley, the conservative right, passed away. with us now, the publication that buckley famously founded -- you want to intro e dues them? >> jack fowler joined us. and jay, good to have you both on board with us. >> so tell us about bill buckley and -- just first of all, your personal relationship with him what he was like. >> great. just great. if you knew him on print or television, you really knew him. he was like that. he was basically what you got in

public. hugely talented. dazzling. a real performer. funny. sharp. occasionally allall allally aa. just the sight of him makes me smile. >> you know, jack, you would also do the sort of things we did not see in cpac. one of the complaints was we should have conservatives debating each other on the future of the movement. buckley did far more, he would find somebody that, you know, he would get gor vidal and others and have these remarkable, heated at times, remarkable debates. >> gor was the one guy he didn't get. he was forced to talk to him. outside of that, loved to engage anybody, conservatives or liberals, to discuss and hone principles to argue for the cause, and he understood that it

wasn't in the discussion of principles that a conservative movement could and was formed. >> he wanted to be the opposite of what we're seeing with a lot of people right now. he did not want to preach to the choir as we say in southern baptist churches. he wanted to convert people to his view. he would debate norman maler and others who disagreed with him. >> he wanted to debate the best mind because he knew he was good at it. there was rough and tumble and sharp elbows. i sometimes say the show is called "firing line" for a reason. it wasn't all tea and crumpets. sometimes it was gentle. very few refused him. i think bobby kennedy did. bill was asked why. bill said why does baloney reject the grinder? >> oh, my god. >> almost anyone willing to come on his show.

>> jay, let me ask you, i never got to ask bill this, but i always thought that part of his project starting in the '50s and '60s was he understood that conservativism in the media mind was tagged as john birch soci y society, old-fashioned -- >> cranky. >> cranky. he thought no, i'll bill buckley, i'm going to show you that modern conservativism, the reagan/buckley wave, is aerodiet. it went to yale. it's ivy league. it has an expanded vocabulary. i always thought he was trying to show we're not dumb, i'm going to make me the cliche about conservativism, not the one that you have. >> you know, sometimes young white kids like me back then were sort of mocked about conservativism and teased and so on and we would say we got buckley, not so bad. let me tell you something, guys,

once penny nunen was a guest and hadn't arrived and bill said, these are his words, is our lady here yet? >> wow. >> wanted to say along that point, humor was important, and being a happy warrior was important. i brought two props i'm going to show. this is a replica of the first issue of national review. >> that's kind of cool. >> what's interesting is you'll never get me off that couch by maury r i isken who wrote "a ni at the opera" and other great -- >> hollywood conservatives. >> right. this is a face, even though it's another publication, "time" magazine in 1967 after bill sort of took the world by storm. it says william buckley, conservative can be fun. and i believe that is, in part, the legacy that we need to recall, as conservatives, being

a happy warrior, engaging to not only was historically center to building the cause but central to maintaining the cause. >> the obvious question, what would bill buckley think right now, watching president donald trump and also conservatives who he probably respected previously falling in line with donald trump? >> i hesitate to speak for him. you really couldn't speak for him then. you shouldn't speak for him now. i have very strong views. but bill was an honorable fellow. a man of integrity. a man of truth telling. he knew the political game. he wasn't naive. he wasn't little bo-peep. but he had high standards. and i think -- >> saying it not saying it. >> he was a practical fellow, bill, very practical when it came to politics.

not a purist. and i think he would probably say -- i think jack may agree, let's roll with it and try to improve it as we go a long. also we're a nation of laws, not men, nation of institutions. office holders, they come and go. the constitution is supposed to stay stuck. >> jack bower, thank you. >> thank you, guys, so much. >> is that it? stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage in two minutes with much more and the developing debate in congress over guns in america. have a great day. ♪ ♪ ♪

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hi there, i'm stephanie ruhle. this morning, background, checks and balances. congress gets back to work with a debate, a much needed debate, about guns, and that is taking center stage. >> the problem with gun violence in this country is too immediate for another delay, too severe for half measures. >> as first responders come under fire for inaction, the president, our president, says he personally could have done a better job. >> you don't know until you test it, but i think i -- i really believe, even if i didn't have a weapon -- >> entering the inner circle. white house communications director and trump confidant hope hicks heads to the hill for a closed door meeting with the house intel committee. here's a question, is this woman going to talk? >> anyone else comes in and they improperly claim executive privilege, we're prepared to go to court and insist on