just to the make a point or intimidate mr. nunberg. a lot was discussed. we'll be reporting next week what we learn about it. that does it for "the beat." i hope you have a great weekend. "hardball" is next. >> big deal. let's play "hardball." good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. it's been a dizzying 24 hours for the white house with developments on multiple fronts. first, the story of the president and the porn star. president trump's personal lawyer used his trump organization e-mail days before the 2016 election to arrange to pay the adult film star, stormy daniels. then there is the curious case of former trump aide sam

nunberg. earlier in the week, he stormed cable news to say he would not cooperate with robert mueller's investigation despite a subpoena. well, today, cameras were rolling as he did arrive at the federal courthouse in washington prepared to talk to a grand jury. and finally, the dramatic announcement last night president trump had agreed to meet with north korea's kim jong-un within months hours after his own secretary of state told reporters we're a long way from negotiations. all the more startling, the announcement was made by south korea's national security adviser at the white house to brief officials on his recent talks with the north korean leader. shortly after 5:00 p.m., president trump popped his head into the press briefing room to tease a major announcement on north korea. catching white house staffers off guard. two hours later, the south korean national security adviser told reporters kim jong-un is committed to denuclearization

and will refrain from any further nuclear tests. >> he expressed his eagerness to meet president trump as soon as possible. president trump officiated the briefing and said he would meet kim jong-un by may to achieve denuclearizati denuclearization. >> president trump will accept the invitation at a place and time to be determined. trump tweeted 30 minutes after that, kim jung un talked about denuclearization with the southian representatives, not just a freeze. no missile testing by ng during this period of time. sanctions will remain till an agreement is reached. meeting being planned. itude sarah huckabee sanders offered a more cautious message insisting there won't be a meeting till north korea takes

concrete actions. watch her. >> they've made promises to denuclearryize to stop testing and we're not going to have this meeting take place till we see concrete actions that match the words and rhetoric of north korea. >> reporter: is there a possibility these talks with kim jong-un may not happen? >> they've got to the follow through on the promises that they've made. we want to see the concrete and verifiable action on that front. >> is it possible that could not happen? >> there are a lot of things possible. i'm not going to sit here and walk through every hypothetical that could exist in the world. the president has accepted that invitation on the basis that is we have concrete and verifiable steps. >> well, as senior administration official later told nbc news, there's no new conditions such as inspections being added to the talks. it goes back to what was said last night. denuclearization is a long-term goal. bill richardson is a former

ambassador to the u.n., he has negotiated with the north koreans in the past. susan page. bill richardson, governor, thank you so much. you were the first name i thought of this morning. tell me, what do you make of this? >> well, i'm confused. i came out yesterday saying that this summit was a good idea with a lot of risks, but i commended the president because we need a game change ker, a hail mary pass in a korean peninsula that is very, very, very tenuous. and very tense. now, with this had new statement by the white house press secretary, i'm confused. what does it exactly mean? denuclearize before the meeting? concrete steps. >> that's been overruled. bill, in the last few minutes, they've said ignore huckabee sanders. we're going back to what was said last night. the meeting is to establish a

denuclearization. it doesn't come before the meeting. >> that's good. but at the same time, you know, the secretary of state obviously was not consulted. he's in djibouti in africa. he should be back. what the president needs to do, get your act together, white house. get the white house and the pentagon and the state department especially on a coherent strategy. what do we get before the meeting? because the white house press statement, i'm glad it's been corrected, is very confusing. he's not going to denuclearryize before the meeting. we'll be lucky if he does at all. >> are they going to have cupcakes at the meeting? pler susan, your paper went to bed before this i noticed last night, before this. you go to bed at 3:00 in the afternoon? >> we're a digital publication and online all of the time. what do you make of this?

>> i think both these leaders get something they want which is international acclaim, stature. for kim jong-un this is already a victory for him because he's going to meet face-to-face with the u.s. president. and you know, for president trump, this is one more example of his willing to be disruptive. this is not the way our policy toward north koreaing is usually developed and rolled out. this is something quite different and maybe it will come to a bad end. at least as governor richardson is one of the few people who negotiated with north korea in the past has said, maybe it's got the potential to shake things up. >> what was an alternative for the president once the word came through the north korean lead they are the dictator wanted to meet and was talking denuclearization and agreeing to end all his testing and showing good faith, what was the alternative answer? no, forget about it? >> the alternative answer is let's actually see you spend a couple months not doing missile

testing. consider opening up to weapons inspectors. that's do something that works towards. >> not in a million years he would do that. >> he's saying he is going to. let's see what happens. this is the challenge with diplomacy. welcome any type of move towards diplomacy. the challenge is kim jong-un is probably the more rational actor of the two. >> you mean that. >> we have a president of the united statesent who is a chaos agent. we don't know what he will say from one day to the next. we note that kim jong-un has always seen it as a mark of success to be seen side by side with the president of the united states as a legitimate state. he is banking on this to be not seen as a rogue terror threat. >> he doesn't get that the unless he deals. people. >> how he's going to get this other than he's agreed to it. >> if he pulls some number in hawaii or wherever they meet in the dmz on the 38th parallel and he pulls a tantrum and starts banging his shoe on the table or pulls some number that's not

serious, he doesn't get any respect, does? >> he just for the meeting itself even if he looks like a fool? >> well, i believe kim jong-un did this meeting for the following reasons. one, he wants to stay in power. he wants to be like his grandfather kim ill sung. secondly, i think sanctions are biting. they are hurting him. the chinese have done a little more. and third this chris, what he wants is to be an equal with the united states. of course, he isn't. but he's always said, and the north koreans when i've been there they always say the big powers in the region are not china, south korea. they're us, north korea and you, the united states. soapy think this meeting has to be carefully planned or it's going to be a disaster. it's got to be probably i would think in pan mun john so both sides can say this is the dms or in china. or in geneva. although i doubt jaeb because it's in europe. that's always been a neutral site.

i think it's important that this summit take place. things can't be going worse in that peninsula. i think the south koreans deserve the main credit for getting the summit with the north koreans and then brokering perhaps a summit with kim jong-un. kim jong-un has gone from a bomb thrower to being i won't say a rational actor, but a man with a plan that knows where he wants to end up. i think he's been underestimated. >> do you think he's willing to give up nuclear weapons? >> no, no, but i think it's still worth to talk to him about curbing their use. he's not going to dismantle them. he's got about 20. i think it's worth talking about missiles, talking about stopping research, stopping the work of missiles with the warhead that could hit the united states. conventional weapons. stop threatening south korea. there are 25 million south koreans. american troops in japan. and south korea.

i think there are a lot of positive steps. also, we've got three americans detained there. get them out. we've got american remains of our soldiers from the korean war. i got seven out in 2007 under president bush. we should push to get agreements on those soft power areas that i think might lead to serious reductions in their nuclear arsenal. they're going to have a price, chris. they're not going to do this for free. let's get ready. >> you've been through this whole -- what's on the table? would we recognize them? normalize relations if they get rid of their nuclear program or limit it? is that on the table. >> normally you have an ambassador conversation. we don't even have an ambassador. >> we'll accept the fact that they run that part of korea. >> this is so far beyond what the expectation of foreign policy and how we operate as an international community.

everythinging about foreign policy in this administration fits under that rubric right now. there's zero benefit to the united states for acknowledging north korea particularly this early. i argue there's zero benefit to the united states to dangle out a meeting, a confirmed meeting with the president of the united states. >> recognize north korea without nuclear weapons. >> we're better off with a north korea that feels under threat and that the united states has a top dog position, not when we're seen as equals. >> under obama, under w, they kept building nuclear weapons. that approach didn't work. why are you speaking with such confidence here? nothing worked before. >> the effort to denuclearize nok is a direct result of years and years of sanctions that have crippled the economy, hurt him politically in his own country. this is the fact that we are at a position where they are willing to negotiate they are the the ones throwing the hail mary pass is an opportunity for the united states. we should use it smartly and be

strategic. >> who gets credit for this coming together, obama or trump? >> a combination of every presidency before this. >> including trump. >> every presidency before this and south korea. >> including trump. >> you're not going to give him anything. >> no is, not this one because even the following day, his own administration is stepping on its own potential bold move. this was a bold move, do it. instead you have a white house press secretary gotten stuck with getting talking points from the pentagon, from the state department. >> i agree with you. what do you think about that? >> governor richardson said things couldn't be worse, they could be worse. one of the great risks on the peninsula is an accidental war because we have such a lack of trust. if you have a meeting that breaks down in mutual recriminations we could end up in a worse situation. >> i don't think the little guy benefits from that either. former governor bill richardson, thank you for coming on short notice. you were our first responder susan page, thank you both for

your expertise. coming up, trump's lawyers are reportedly looking to strike a deal with the special counsel. it the president will agree to an interview as long as mule ter wraps up his investigation. fat chance. who thinks he's going to agree to these terms? plus what, does putin think before president trump? megyn kelly just returned from interviewing the russian president. and the president's lawyer michael cohen used his trump organization e-mail while arranging a hush money payment top adult film star stormy daniels. sounds like he was working at the trump tower. and trump's decision to meet with kim jong-un shows he wants to do things his way even if that means leaving everyone else in the dark. let me finish tonight with trump watch. this is "hardball," where the action is. ♪ [screaming & crying]

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denuclearize. it's been a busy week. and the special counsel's russian investigation on monday, we were introduced to this guy sam nunberg. what a character. the form he ever trump campaign aide who said in nine different interviews on prints and tv interviews that he would refuse to comply with a grand jury subpoena from muler. after that media spectacle, he said he was backing down and did cooperate with the subpoena testifying today. there he is going to testify before grand jury for seven full hours. i think the whole thing may have been a bluff. most memorably, he said on monday he thinks special counsel robert mueller already has the goods on president trump. >> they probably have something

on trump. trump did something pretty bad. i would assume. >> what? >> i have no idea but they have something. >> do you think they were more interested in trump related to the criminal hacking which occurred and stolen e-mails or in relation to all stoeshl media. >> something with his business. >> wow. meanwhile "the wall street journal" is now reporting trump's lawyers are seeking the deal they hope will bring the probe to be an end they say. according to a person familiar with the discussions, "the president's legal team is considering telling mr. mueller that mr. trump would agree to a sitdown interview based on multiple considerations including that the special counsel commit to a date for concluding at least the trump related portion of the investigation." one idea is to suggest a deadline of 60 days from the date of the trump interview. well, a trump attorney tells nbc news the report is totally false. it comes after trump's legal team has repeatedly promised that the investigation would soon be over. first they said it would end by

last thanksgiving, then crist, then the beginning new year. i'm joined by an expert who can be see through all the vines, ken dilanian. this is nonsense. you know, first of all, i have no idea that he -- you you have some evidence what they've got on trump and then he says i have no idea what it is. is this guy worth listening to? nunberg? does he know anything? >> the most interesting thing he said he thinks they're using him to build a case against roger stone. >> the domino thing, get roger, you get manafort, get flynn, get the president. >> yeah, he seemed -- and also, he's telling us he believes they have something on donald trump related to his businesses. it was cryptic. >>ing whatting about this manafort guy walking around in leg irons? two electronic legs. >> one for virginia, one for d.c. >> use your into you yigs.

is that to make the guy feel good about spilling the beans. >> that was his choice. he fought consolidation of the two cases. he's facing a total of 30 years in prison. >> and wearing two chains. >> two ankle monitors. that sentence is the guidelines. so i can't imagine him not pleading. lee experts are saying this is a really strong case against him. either he thinks he's got a pardon or we'll see a plea at some point. >> he's going to be like the count of month i cristo. >> this week we learned about iraq prince, the unofficial advisor to the trump transition. a meeting he held with a russian oligarch in the say shells is appears to be unraveling in new reporting. a cooperating witness has told mueller the meeting was set up in advance so a representative of the trump transition could meet with an emissary from moscow. people familiar with the matter say there's evidence showing the purpose was to establish a back channel between the incoming administration, that's trump's crowd, and the kremlin.

prince however, told the house intelligence committee in november he only had a chance encounter with the russian out there and that he was not representing the incoming administration. if you lie to congress, that's a felony, right? >> absolutely. this is really interesting. >> they've got erik prince now. >> well, depends on the strength of that evidence. they would need a lot. they have a transcript of prince under oath saying i was just at this meeting by chance. i wasn't even representing the trump campaign. i came to meet with the uae folks. it's fascinating. this guy george nader who is now cooperating with mueller is an interesting character. you know what this shows? this investigation is expanding. >> of course. >> we've reported that. >> it's an octopus. >> it's now about jared kushner's meeting with uae people. it's incredible. the idea they're going to do a 60-day deadline -- >> will trump get nis his nobel prize for peace before it happenses? just kidding.

one of the big unanswered questions through the investigation has been why president trump continues to show such niceness toe putin? megyn kelly put that question to vladimir putin. she put it to him himself as part of a primetime special on nbc tonight called "confronting putin." let's watch. >> let me ask you about president trump. anytime he says anything about you, it is supremely differential. never a harsh word for you. if you look at the way he speaks about members of his own party and his own staff, never mind other leaders he frequently personally insults them. why do you think he's so nice to you? transi don't believe he treats me personally with reservence. he's an experienced person, a businessman within vast experience and he understands if it is necessary to establish a cooperative relationship with someone, then you have to treat

your current or potential partner with respect. otherwise, nothing will come of it. i think this is a purely pragmatic approach firstly. secondly, despite the fact that he's a first-time president, still he's a quick study after all. and he understands very well that this level where we are engaging in mutual accusation and insults, this is a road to nowhere. and if you have noticed, i always treat my colleagues not only in the united states but in europe and in asia with unwavering respect. >> meghan, thank you for joining us. great get as we say in the business. i like to ask the same question after a big interview. what didn't we see? was there is something about this kg b's aspect? he's a little guy. he's 5'6", weighs about 150 pounds. he looks like a guy who has been in torture rooms. he knows what it is to terrify somebody. your thoughts?

>> first of all, i like your name for our special better than our name. put putin it to putin, i like that a lot. what was surprising this time was just how kind he was when the cameras weren't rolling. you know, like a gentleman. and he can appear extremely polite, thoughtful. he offered us a grand tour of the grand kremlin which we took and took our cameras there too so the audience will see that to know. a charmer is how he wishes to be -- to project. what you see in putin is what he wants you to see. then you get him in front of the cameras and he's this fiery combative leader we have seen so many times. >> w said that he could see into his soul. what did you make of that? maybe that's what he was talking about, the charm. the attempted charm. >> absolutely not. putin you see in putin what he wants you to see. the man was in the kgb and knows

how to manipulate people. his whole life he spent doing it. even when we were there the last time he spent time off camera telling me about his love for his children and his mother. i'm a mother of three young children. he's very smart. you get the impression he's the smartest man in every room. so you know, you should not try to outwi tt putin. that's note going to happen. but you can as i did in this interview, try to box him in a bit because i have facts. and with all due respect to the russian president, he wasn't telling it the truth about the matters that i was examining him on. and we knew that. he knew it and i knew it. it led to -- there was almost a silver back gorilla thing going on between the two of us where we were looking at each other. he knew i was coming with facts but he's slippery. this time i was able to actually show him, this is what the indictment says. this is what the e-mails say. this is the proof that ties you to this person and so on.

and we really got into it. >> it the old marxist lennon mentality, you don't be the truth. you serve what serves the state. you also asked him about president trump's twitter habit. let's watch that exchange. >> dourve read his tweets? >> no. >> do you ever tweet? >> translator: no. >> why not in the. >> translator: i have other ways of expressing my point of view or implementing a decision. domd is a more modern individual. >> would you say he's more colorful than you are? >> translator: perhaps. >> well, that was an easy one. >> that was actually a moment of levity. >> is there a bromance between these guys? do they like each other or is it just rivals as simple as that? >> i wouldn't go that far. i would not say that putin likes trump. did i not glean that at all from him. i do think -- i did green perhaps he has something on donald trump. if you watch the special

tonight, you'll see perhaps what that might be because we've done a lot of research. it's not just vladimir out putin it's a lot of experts who you understand it them and the relationship between the two. when i was asking him why do you think donald trump never says anything under kind about you ever, it's more than at the admires this russian strongman. there's a very good chance putin knows things about donald trump that mr. trump does not want repeated likely. >> is it the dossier? >> just having done the research we did for this piece and this investigative report, i think it has to do with money and trump's early years dealing with the russians back in the '90s, his facilities here in the united states and i asked vladimir putin about that, as well. it's pretty comprehensive. i did want to tell you, i gave it to him pretty good on election interference. you'll see him dance a bit. can you imagine i did get a question in about the shirtless putin and what's up with all

that? >> i'll let that you have that line. >> i did think it's interesting, you've gone into something with your questioning and your sense of interpreting it that maybe the sam nunberg guy who has thrown out that thing this week there's something on the business end. >> as i watched nunberg and erik prince and all of this, keep in mind, all of this, all of this ultimately links back to vladimir putin. that's why we're talking about manafort and flynn and nunberg and all these guys. it's because of what vladimir putin did in our presidential race and let me tell you, what he's planning to do in '18 and '20, as well. when you listen to him talk, you don't get the impression the man has been chilled in any way from his robust approach to our elections. that's because we haven't done anything. we've done nothing to push back after his interference. >> wow. meghan, great thing. megyn kelly big get. thank you so much. everyone will be watching tonight. watch more of the exclusive interview with vladimir putin

tonight at 10:00 eastern. 29:00 central on nbc. and up next, nbc news has learned michael cohen used his trump organization e-mail, get that? while arranging that hush money to stormy daniels. 130k. is there a crime here? is this something mr. mueller is going to go after? is it a crime that can put this guy in jail and make him talk a lot? this is "hardball" where the action is. for the first time. trying something new can be exciting. empowering. downright exhilarating. see for yourself why chevrolet is the most awarded and fastest growing brand, the last four years overall. switch into a new chevy now. current qualified competitive owners and lessees can get this 2018 chevy equinox for around $199 a month. chevrolet. find new roads.

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welcome back to "hardball." over the past few weeks a slew of stories relating to film actor stormy daniels have continued to plague this president. today in an nbc news exclusive we learned michael cohen, donald trump's personal lawyer, used his trump organization e-mail as he made arrangements to pay that $130,000 in hush money to stormy daniels. nbc has also learned that stormy daniels' earn attorney at the time address correspondence top cohn as special counsel to donald j. trump. didn't do it on his own. cohn back in february told nbc news "neither the trump organization nor the trump campaign was a party to the transaction with mrs. clifford." of miss clifford rather. and neither reimbursed me for the payment. either directly or indirectly. paint to miss clifford was lawful and was not a campaign contribution or expenditure by anyone. in an opinion piece published

two days ago, the government watchdog group common cause argued opposite to that. by faying to report the payment as a campaign expense, the trump campaign violated multiple federal disclosure laws and depending on the source of the $130,000 paid to daniels, the payment may also have been an illegal contribution. the president's press secretary has denied allegations of an intimate relationship between the president and daniels. for more i'm joined by katie phang. i guess a lot of people watching are wondering, does this mean that robert mueller, the special counsel looking for any crime by trump involving the 2016 election certainly in that much wider orbit than that but in the target zone, was the law broken by someone paying $130,000 to this person to keep quiet about something that would hurt his campaign and the payment made a week before the actual election makes it look like a campaign

related event? your thoughts about the exposure as you lawyers say, exposure of mr. trump here? >> well, exposure seems to be a word bandied about a little bit when it comes to daniels as a porn star. to your question, chris, anybody remember john edwards? he got indicted for doing exactly the same thing, taking campaign contributions and money to basically silence his mistress so as to influence the outcome of the presidential election that he was running for. so is that we've got going on here? >> but that was a hung jury. that wasn't resolved in court. that jury couldn't decide. bunny said she just liked john edwards and did it as a favor and didn't see it as a campaign contribution. that's her point of view the. >> here's the thing. it begs request the question. ep michael cohen said he took out a home equity line of credit to put it in an llc account to be able to pay off stormy

daniels. why? why is he randomly paying $130,000? now you have a problem. people like the fec is interested. the house judiciary committee sent a letter to michael cohen and two other gentlemen saying you might want to explain why you gave this money and by the way, there might be tax issues because the tax treatment on this money would trigger other violations of federal law. so michael cohen's now opening a huge pandora's box because he keeps on opening his mouth and keeps on trying to give excuses that don't have legal viability in terms of being credible. >> just to make an argument against it, is every aid you give, every contribution to a candidate a campaign contribution? you can say i drive his kids to school or anything that helps him. i helped his wife carry account groceries home. is anything a contribution to the well-being of a candidate a campaign contribution? >> here's the thing. it has to be a reported in kind contribution. there's a certain valuation amount that gets triggered.

$130,000 pursuant to a settlement agreement that michael cohen, the llc and this dennis son guy who we know is donald trump is implicated we know this is hush money paid to stormy daniels to keep her quiet. now we're going to go back to the litigation. we're going to figure out where had goes. here's the problem for michael cohen and for donald trump and here's the problem for the trump campaign and here is why mueller might be interested. through the course of the discovery process, you're going to have depositions. you're going to having discovery requests and bank statements turned over and you know that mueller is the key guy to follow the money. so here's the essential question, chris. where did that money come from? did it really come from a heloc? if it was think all of rules of professional conduct michael cohen is in violation of in his home state of new york where he is a licensed attorney. >> the attorney general of new york might be interested. this president can't pardon his own behavior in new york state.

thank you. you followed it all the way. thanks so much, katie fang for being our expert. up next, president trump's go it alone approach. he's willing to rely completely on his own instincts even if it puts him at odds with everyone around him his experts, secretary of state, national security adviser. they were all ignored yesterday when he went to town on this north korean gambit. you're watching "hardball." nav. i do outrank my husband, not just being in the military, but at home. she thinks she's the boss. she only had me by one grade. we bought our first home together in 2010. his family had used another insurance product but i was like well i've had usaa for a while, why don't we call and check the rates? it was an instant savings and i should've changed a long time ago. there's no point in looking elsewhere really. we're the tenneys and we're usaa members for life. usaa. get your insurance quote today.

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nobody knows the system better than me. which is why i alone can fix it. >> welcome back to "hardball." that was president trump at the republican national convention

in 2016 claiming he was the only person who could fix america's problems. trump put his go it alone strategy on display this week first with his move to impose new steel and aluminum tariffs then to meet with north korean leader kim jong-un. time and time again he made it clear it's his own judgment alone that matters. >> i'm an outsider. used to be an inside to be honest with you, okay? i know the inside and i know the outside. and that's why i'm the only one that can fix this mess, folks. >> nobody is going to be able to do the kind of things i can do. but let me tell you, the one that matters is me. i'm the only one that matters because when it comes to it, that's what the policy is going to be. you've seen that strongly. >> "the new york times" petr bake irrights whether it's middle east peace or trade agreements trump has repeatedly claimed he can achieve what has eluded every other occupant through the force of his

personality. so far little to show it. could north korea be the exception? there's one crucial variable at play this time around. and we'll get to that next with the "hardball" roundtable. so, that goal you've been saving for, you can do it. we can do this. at fidelity, our online planning tools are clear and straightforward so you can plan for retirement while saving for the things you want to do today. -whoo!

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recent openness to talk? >> me. nobody got that. i think that they are sincere. the sanctions have been very, very strong. and very biting. and we don't want that to happen. so i really believe they are sincere. i hope they're sincere. we're going to soon find out. >> president trump was joking about his role in opening nuclear talks, you could say, the decision to september kim's offer was trump's alone. just a short time ago trump tweeted the deal with north korea is very much in the making and will be if completed a very good one for the world. time and place to be determined. let's bring in the roundtable. clarence page from the chicago tribune did, gibson from the rioters news service and gabe a political reporter for politico. where are we headed? >> not toward the apocalypse i hope. >> what do you think? >> this is something that trump really wants. he doesn't know very much how to

get there, but it's going to take longer than he thinks though. he's already conceding that. and this is just an opening something kim jong-un wants. i can't help but think like a lot of people do that kim is just waiting to get into a room with trump and roll him. >> if little kim decides he's going to make an ass out of himself before the world, i don't see how that's a victory for him. if he pounds his shoe on the table like khrushchev, doesn't he need a resolution to look good? >> donald trump is learning in his time as president that negotiating as the chief executive is not the same as negotiating the price of windows whenever you're building a new hotel. it's a lot more complicated and comprehensive than that. you can't just have one meeting where you say, yeah, you're going to give me a good price? ip we'll let everyone else work out the details and we'll call it a day. that's what he's used to. there's a ton of variables that could make this look different

or feel different. he's already seeing his own white house walk back some of the things he's said. >> but they were talked back themselves an hour later by the white house. >> already more complicated than that. >> the thing to watch here is not what's going to happen when the meeting happens, it's what the rhetoric out of the white house and some of our allies across the world including asia is over the next few weeks. there was a lot of consternation when it came out. >> chinese don't want peace in the peninsula there. >> forget the chinese for a second. even the members of the president's own administration don't necessarily like this. let's not forget he clashed with secretary of state tillerson over the north korea issue before. >> i don't care about the bureaucratic problems. are we going to end the nuclear threat from north korea and will this get us there. >> what's he willing to give up. >> he wants to travel the world and live like a normal world leader. >> with the draw of u.s. troops. >> he wants to be recognized. he wants to be guaranteed we

won't invade him. >> what's trump willing to give up is the question. a man who railed against. >> that's giving it up. to recognize north korea is not going to be popular on the right. >> he has to find success and what success means and what's a fair trade. he controls a lot of that image and discussioning. > the reason that i bring up the bureaucratic infighting, there is real substance aligned with that. whenever two leaders meet especially in situations like this it tends to be after months and months of negotiations with their teams. very clearly ha hasn't it this time or not in the way it traditionally does. we have to watch what's happening behind the scenes and in public what some of our allies say. that will give us real hints what this will look like. if that doesn't happen, there's a chance they sit down in a room with no cameras and we have no idea what he comes out of it. obviously kim wants to be recognized on an international stage. that's not ideal for trump but

we don't know what he wants out of this except for recognition he's sitting down with kim jong-un. >> don't they both want to avoid a war? >> trump wants a place in history. >> don't they both want top avoid nuclear conflict. >> i would hope so. there's interesting commentary how if she's talks fail, we go back to the default position which is already who your threatening possible strikes that -- or some type of combat. >> the danger of these talks coming apart is that it will make trump angrier and kim more unstable. the roundtable sticking with us. up next, they tell me something i don't know. you're watching "hardball." thank you. ♪ imagine if the things you bought every day... earned you miles to get to the places you really want to go. with the united mileageplus explorer card, you'll get a free checked bag. two united club passes. priority boarding.

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>> a chicago man. >> i've been covering him since the early '80s when he was disrupting jesse jackson's campaign and later became a litmus test around barack obama's campaign. now we're seeing on the right danny davis and various other folks. where we shook hands with louis farrakhan in the past. this is something we'll see. >> that's not going to defeat him. >> depends on the district. danny davis district won't make a difference. the swing districts you never know. >> jinger. >> the fight over tariffs is not over. american lobbyists are gambling on eu retaliation methods changing the president's minds. at the end of the day, these tariffs that the president has signed off on this week could end up being something he does a lot more talking than doing. >> what about peanut but thor? i was amazed. >> peanut butter, whiskey, that's a big one. >> they won't buy our peanut butter or our whiskey. it will disrupt the price in

america. >> i want to bring everyone's attention to a senate race. the one to replace jeff flake in arizona. bernie sanders is going out to arizona this weekend. he'll do a rally with two progressive congressman out there. i asked him what he thinks about the democratic standard bearer out there. she's conservative. said the party is moving too far to the left. doesn't like all of his ideas about free college. he said i don't want to talk about this. i'm not talking about the senate right now. there's clear tension there. >> that sounds like a smart move by hip. don't get in the wave a race you can't help. >> thank you. when we return, let me finish tonight with trump watch. you're watching "hardball."

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trump watch friday march 9th, 2018. president trump is aiming high. he's hoping to kill the nuclear threat from north korea and a high stakes meeting with the country's dictator. who among us doesn't want him to succeed or worry that it could fail leading perhaps to an even more heightened state of danger. in agreeing to parlay, trump is committing himself to a historic challenge, now the little boy president kennedy once imagined who throws his cap over a wall to force himself to climb over it. once having agreed to a meeting trump must contend with all the consequences. he's not the first president to trap himself into a contest that offers swift victory but also

colossal embarrassment or something worse. nixon went to china in '72, splitting the world's twos greatest communist powers and opening the door for us to beijing. jimmy carter invited and war sa bat and beginton to camp david. ronald reagan and mick cal gorbachev signaled the end to the cold war. before these events, there was one directly affecting korea. with 20,000 americans killed in the conflict, dwight eisenhower made this promise on the eve of the 1952 presidential election. i shall go to korea. within months of taking office, president eisenhower succeeded in brokering armistice on the peninsula that has sustained to this day. ike made that promise in '52 based on a unique track record. he dwight eisenhower was the allied leader who accepted the

nazi surrender seven years earlier. for donald trump, success in north korea would be less of a proven leader delivering on his track record than that of a nuclear stakes case of beginners luck. then again, what normal person isn't hoping it works. that's had for now. thanks for being with us. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. tonight on "all in." >> are you going to talk to mueller? >> i'm looking forward to it actually. >> reporter: new reporting the president wants a deal in return for talking to the mueller probe. then five days after defying the special counsel. >> they're trying to set up a perjury case againstologier stone. >> look who just showed up to his grand jury interview. plus, the white house blows off a republican investigation. reaction to the president's decision to meet with kim john-un and today's huge and historic loss for the nra as a gun control bill becomes law in