>> she backed up stormy daniels. if you missed that interview, you can get it now on apple podcasts. go to our podcast by listening for free with apple. here's how. look for the purple podcast icon on your phone. search "the beat" with ari melber and you will see it pop up. please check us out. you'll never miss a show. a programming note, i'll be in washington tomorrow as the supreme court hears arguments on the travel ban. check us out tomorrow and on the podcast. chris matthews "hardball" starts now. >> trump's people. let's play "hardball." >> good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington where we're awaiting the arrival of french president macron and his wife for the first state din ker of the trump presidency. earlier today they held a joint press conference where they

seemed far apart on the iran nuclear deal. ma kron is for it, trump isn't so sure. >> what we have to work on obviously with iran and the different, the p5 and our allies is to find a fair deal where we can fix the overall situation. >> there is a chance and nobody knows what i'm going to do on the 12th although mr. president, you have a pretty good idea, but we'll see. but we'll see also if i do what some people expect whether or not it will be possible to do a new deal with solid foundations because this is a deal with decayed foundations. >> we begin with the latest turmoil in the administration. the president today seemed to offer an off-ramp or a plank to walk on top admiral ronnie jackson, his nominee for secretary for veterans affairs. >> i said to dr. jackson, what

do you need it for? so we'll see what happens. i don't want to put a man through who is not aply person. i don't want to put a man through a process like this. it's too ugly and too disgusting. so we'll see what happens. he'll make a decision. >> are you saying, mr. president, that you will stand behind him? >> i would definitely stand behind him. he's a fine man. i'll always stand behind him. if i were him, actually, in many ways i'd love to be him. but the fact is, i wouldn't do it. i wouldn't do it. what does he need it for? >> admiral jackson who serves as white house physician has come under fire after a number of media outlets reported allegations of improper professional conduct. late today, the ranking democrat on the veterans affairs complete, jon tester of montana, addressed the allegations on npr. >> they've fallen in three different areas, improper

dispensing of prescription drugs, repeatedly drunk while on duty while traveling, and creating a toxic work environment. he is the physician for the president. and in the previous administration, we were told stories he was repeatedly drunk while on duty where his main job was to take care of the most powerful man in the world. that's not acceptable. we didn't initiate this discussion. this discussion came when we were notified by folks that work with admiral jackson, folks in the military about behaviors that are happening and we just followed up with as many leads as we could get. >> kansas republican senator jerry moran says admiral jackson deny dd allegations of a hostile workplace and said he never had a drink while on duty. that's a hell of a statement.

nbc news caught up with admiral jackson early today. >> you've seen the allegations, drinking on the job, overprescribing medications. are you saying those are categorically untrue. i'm looking forward to the hearings so i can answer all the senators' questions. >> the ig report about the allegations? >> no, there was not. >> how much -- formally announced as the nominee. >> thanks, guys. i appreciate it. >> you're going to continue this process, sir? >> senator tester and the republican chairman of the veterans affairs committee johnny isakson said they would delay the confirmation hearing it till later notice. labor secretary andrew pudster withdrew his nomination after scrutiny of his policies. michael flynn was forced to resign under the cloud of a russian investigation. rob porter home run allegations of domestic allegations.

tonight a senior white house official tells nbc news jackson met with the trump in the oval office late this afternoon described as a positive meeting. that official also says dr. jackson's record as a white house physician is impeccable. he has improved unit morale, received glowing reviews and promotions under republican and democratic preys and been given a clean vet from the fbi. i'm joined by kristin weller, robert costa, "washington post," national political reporter and senator richard blumenthal of connecticut. i want to start with the reporting from kristin. this doesn't stack up, impeccable record, everything's fine. no blemish on it. and yet, drunk on the job. from a number of sources including the senators, ranking democrat on the veterans affairs committee. serious charge in itself. >> ronny jackson denied those allegations, chris. white house officials say they're not true. as you pointed out, there are some lawmakers on capitol hill

who also say that's what they heard from jackson. i also spoke to a former obama official, a top official who said there was no indicationing that ronny jackson was drinking on the job. yet, there are these very serious allegations. i spoke with one official who said look, jackson has the right to defend himself and for his story to be told. and that's the bottom line here, chris. there's no indication he's planning to withdraw. he met with the president earlier this evening, a conversation described as positive. what you'll see now is a more robust effort from this administration to try to defend him. at the same time, you're right, these are serious allegations. and they do go back to some extent to that ig and this is semantics, it was an assessment ordered by ronny jackson and it looked into an issue he was having with a colleague. the assessment determined that there was a lack of leadership largely due to that back and forth with a colleague. but he stayed on in the obama

administration serving as president obama's physician. so you heard president trump saying he's going to stand by him. but at the same time, giving him that will fascinating off-ramp so that's what we're all looking for. again, just to stress tonight, all of our reporting indicates he has no plans to withdraw at this point. >> let me go to robert costa. i want to ask you about that unusual thing that -- unusual statement the president said today when he was with president -- he seemed to be saying i've got this plank you can walk. i wouldn't take the heat from the critics and the media and the democrats. i'd walk if i were you. that doesn't sound like a vouch of support for him. >> talking to my source tonight inside of the west wing, they say the president clearly opened the door for dr. jackson to walk out of the confirmation process. but at the same time, he's not pushing the doctor out. he feels a loyalty to him due to the rapport and the relationship they've developed inside of the white house.

he does not have a viable person at the top of his mind should he move on from dr. jackson. at this moment, the white house is standing by him. >> let me go to senator blumenthal, it seems like president trump has come to office with a dearth of names, no binder of names, if you will, to quote mitt romney of people qualified and appropriate to serve in public service. he meets a physician who serves him at the white house and says oh, you could run this job. he's never run anything really and he's going to give him a job run agagency with 140,000 people in it or something. he doesn't know anybody. >> he comes to this office not only without knowledge of people who are dedicated to public service but also a disdain for public service, a maligned neglect, not a benign neglect for the veterans administration which is one of the largest agencies in our government. and they in effect disrespect for our veterans by nominating

someone who has been improperly vetted as have been, as you pointed out well, so many of his other nom nipz counted more than 20 nominees have been withdrawn for exactly these kinds of reasons. >> what do you make of this hurley burly approach to these nominations? he doesn't seem to do any vetting. if he's got a secret drinking problem, people know about it. he can be functional but everybody can smell it if it's a problem. >> keep in mind it, these profoundly and credible allegations were brought to us on the veterans committee. i'm a member. and our staff is now looking into them, investigating them. but the white house failed presumably to do its due diligence. and now it has to provide answers. so far, i'll be very blunt, it has stonewalled us. it has failed to provide that inspector general report from the navy. it has barred me as a member of the committee tote view the fbi

background investigation. and it's vetting failure and refusal to be forthcoming i think virtual dooms this nomination. >> let's go through the charges whether or not you believe they're credible based on testimony so far, drinking on the job, being drunk on the job repeatedly. >> drinking on the job and repeated drinking problems, certainly merits, requires investigation. >> where are you on that? >> i want to know what the facts are. >> you're not sure yet? >> the reason i am unsure and holding, with, holding judgment is that i want there to be a credible investigation, which so far the white house has failed to do. so the neighbor needs to investigate through the inspector general. we will investigate through our staff on the veterans committee. and the white house needs to do its job. >> second question, hostile workplace environment. did you get that kind of credible charges against him? have you heard it. >> we have seen it in the 2012 inspector general report. again, withholding judgment, we need investigation. we need to nope what the facts

are and correct this disservice. >> finally, because i see the pattern. you're not sure. but overprescribing of drugs is a serious charges. we have an opioids problem in the country over prescriptions. now the president's doctor has been accused of this. >> each of these allegations are profoundly serious. and they are explosive. i see no path forward virtually no, path forward to this nomination right now because of how serious these allegations are. >> kristin, back to you. i really count on you to get the straight scoop on this white house. as always, every night. how do we evaluate the president's short of predilection for picking it pals or family members, jared kushner becomes our mideast expert or his daughter travels to china and represents our country there. he seems to have a very small circle of people he knows. and would therefore give these responsibilities to rather than

going out to zip recruiter or somebody and trying to find the best people for the job. >> and in this case, chris, the criticism from the start has been that he picked ronny jackson because he was someone who he warped to, had a good relationship with, but remember that briefing that lasted for over an hour, that remarkable briefing which jackson gave the president a clean bill of health. the thinking is that the president thought he looked the part of being the va secretary despite the fact he didn't have any background in managing a major government agency like the va, the second largest agency that there is. i spoke with an advocate for veterans earlier today who said look, the issues go back to that. their frustrations go back to that point that he would appoint someone who doesn't have a background in that, which is so strilths trying to get this important agency back on track. it's something we've seen over and over again here at the white

house, chris. >> dr. jackson, admiral jackson made his first public appearance whether he fielded questions from reporters on trump's physical back in january. here he is making an incredible statement about the president's genes. >> being with the president on a day to day basis what has been impressive to me, he has a lot of the energy and a lot of stamina. some people have just great genes. i told the president if he had a healthier diet, he might live to be 200 years old. i don't know. he has incredible genes. i just assume. >> robert, what do you make of that report from 23 and me? there he is, the genetic wonder of this president, can live to 200 if he stopped eatingham burgers. that's an unusual medical assessment for a presidential physician. >> unusual and those are also familiar words for a long-time watchers of president trump, incredible, stamina, genes.

these come from the vernacular of the president. clearly that they have some kind of close relationship they both share that kind of language. they've developed a of relationship beyond a professional doctor, patient relationship. that's part of why he was chosen for va secretary. when he was in the oval tonight, dr. jackson, he and the president talked through this challenge ahead. all the issues that are clearly there. but because of this bond, the bond that you saw at that white house lectern, it continues on, it plods on, this whole process. >> let me ask you, senator, about this trying to be very nonpartisan, i will say there. is part of the problem that the democrats are holding up nominations or is it the nominations all suck? so many bad nominees for so many positions they deserve to be held up? this seems to be a real problem with filling positions right now, not just the judiciary but in the executive branch of the government.

>> if you go down the list of nominee who have been withdrawn, the secretary of labor it, and office policy and management nominee, the fdic chairman, these are major positions. the secretary of the navy, the secretary of the army. the objections were fact-based. they were real conflicts of interest. real lack of qualifications in this instance, as has been said, again and again and again, the agency that has the largest management challenges in the united states government has received a nominee who has the least experience in management. and so apart from all of these very profoundly important and credible claims from men and women in uniform who have bed is side by side with this nominee, there's also the lack of real experience and expertise. >> despite the turnover, president trump has frequently

praised his cabinet and his administration. let's watch. we have a lot of smart people. one thing we've learned, we have by far the highest iq of any cabinet ever assembled. >> there are those saying it's one of the finest groups of people as a cabinet. we're very proud of it. we have a phenomenal team of people. a great group of talent. >> kristin, how would he have saesd the iq average of his cabinet? i'm being a little bit sarcas c sarcastic. how does he know what the iq is of his cabinet? >> well, it fits in with so much of the rhetoric we've heard from this president and it goes back to candidate trump, chris. this is how in part he won his way to the white house. but look, when you look at the reality of his cabinet, it's struggling. of course, va, the incoming va secretary, if he were to be confirmed would replace david

shulkin, who, of course, resigned amid a cloud of controversy. scott pruitt now under a microscope, ben carson had his own issues. it seems as though the heat has sort of gone down when it comes to ben carson. certainly scott pruitt of the epa is someone we routinely ask about and continue to drill in on some of the details of some of these concerns about his spending and ethical questions. so it is -- it does stand to reason that the president really trying to overcompensate for some of the controversy swirling around him in regard to his cabinet. >> sometimes i think i'd love to somebody like trump selling my car for me. on the other hand, i would never buy a car from him because he wouldn't believe all the special items on the car that he was selling. anyway, the epa administrator, scott pruitt is also facing a ruinous week set to appear thursday before a set of house

subcommittees amid a crush of stories about potentially unethical behavior. today "the daily beast" reports that the white house offered to help prep pruitt but that the epa turned down the request. one source characterized the response to the white house offer as get lost. yesterday account west reported while pruitt still had the support of the president, he has acquired a reputation as unresponsive and unwilling to take advice or instruction, defiantly insisting he has done nothing wrong and that trump supports him. robert, you're my interpreter of the president. i know you have a relationship with him. what is this story about pruitt? does he want somebody to deregulate because that's what he sold in the campaign and he will put up with the guy's obnoxious abuse of position, everything he spent money on, the secret telephone room, incredible security staff of 20 some people, first class travel,

all the expenses? he's not an imporer but he acts like one. his epa director. >> there's the white house reaction to pruitt and then there's the presidential reaction to pruitt. the white house people inside officials i talk to, they're an paud by some of his conduct. they wouldn't mind if he stepped down or if they phished him out in the coming weeks. president sees in pruitt a loyal figure who connects with the conservative base because of his deregulatory agenda. for that he stays, he hangs around to use a phrase the president tells to aides. let him hang around because he's loyal. >> i go back to my charge. i'll say it again, he runs the white house and the presidency. and he runs the american government like a royal family with his kids, with all the perks they get and the jobs they get like he's a member of the romanoffs and picks cronies for top jobs. it is a strange style royalist form of government which we

don't consider american. thank you. thank you for coming over. we continue ba to watch the north port coconfident white house. this is royal anyway to await the arrival of french president ma kron and his wife for the first state state dinner trump and the french president differ on the iran deal. macron's for it, trump's not sure. in fact,ive think he's against it. wouldn't trump's best case for scenarios be much like the deal that obama struck? containment may be the best deal we're going to get. plus, the big question for trump as the investigation closes in around him. will he pardon his fixer michael cohen? today he called that a stupid thing to ask. the democrats have a real shot to the win control of congress for next year only if they can resist too much talk about impeachment. it may not be smart to talk impeachment before the november election.

finally, let me finish tonight with trump watch. this is "hardball," where the action is.

you're looking at a live picture of the north portico of the white house the one facing the street where president trump along with french president emmanuel macron and his wife have arrived for the first state dinner of the president. let's watch this. ♪

>> present arms. this is a very elegant occasion, of course. sometimes it's right for a president to behavior in sort of a royal fashion. this is one. especially with the french. as he points out, president, our first allies in the world who helped us get our independence. and first lady looks elegant as always and so does the first

lady of france. there is a very impressive occasion right now, this moment. >> we'll be right back after that. after in. ank's favorite record. this is frank's dog. and this is frank's record shop. frank knowns northern soul, but how to set up a limited liability company... what's that mean? not so much. so he turned to his friends at legalzoom. yup! they hooked me up. we helped with his llc, contracts, and some other stuff that's part of running a business. so frank can focus on the beat. you hear that? this is frank's record shop. and this is where life meets legal. theseare heading back home.y oil thanks to dawn, rescue workers only trust dawn, because it's tough on grease yet gentle. i am home, i am home, i am home you might or joints.hing for your heart... but do you take something for your brain.

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it was a terrible deal. should have never ever been made. we could have made a good deal or a reasonable deal. the iran deal is a terrible deal. >> it's a bad deal. it's a bad structure. it's falling down. should have never ever been made. but i will say, if iran threatens us in any way, they will pay a price like few countries have ever paid. >> welcome back to "hardball." french president emmanuel macron used his state visit to lobby president trump to stick to the iranian nuclear deal a deal trump called insane and ridiculous. the one glimmer of hope the president refused to say what he

would do next month when he has to recertify the deal. let's watch him on that. >> there is a chance and nobody knows what i'm going to do on the 12th although mr. president, you have a pretty good idea, but we'll see. i blame congress, i blame a lot of people for it. but it should have never been made. and we're going to see what happens on the 12th. >> well, while trump plays coy on the nuclear deal, he's raising high hopes for the one with north korea. he told reporters today the man he once derided as little rocket man was now behaving honorably. let's watch. >> we're having very, very good discussions, kim jong-un was -- he really has been very open and i think very honorable from everything we're seeing. >> president trump explained today what success in north korea talks would look like.

take a look. >> on north korea, you said you believe in complete denuclearization, what does that mean exactly? >> it means they get rid of their nukes. simple. and nobody else would say it. be very easy for me to make a simple deal and claim victory. i don't want to do that. >> i'm joined by chief foreign affairs correspondent andrea mitchell and bobby ghosh. andrea, i want to talk to you about this. i know the people who spirted the iranian deal said if you didn't deal with iran on getting a way to contain their nuclear weapons program, the alternative would be probably something like a strike, a military strike because there's really -- we've gone the routes of sanctions. the world was behind us with sanctions on this deal. without the world, there's no sanctions that will work. what's left on the table? but the president pretty much said that himself just today saying we're going to hit them like nobody's ever hit them. what does he mean by that?

>> he means that if they carry out a threat that one iranian official suggested today to get out of the nonproliferation treaty if the u.s. backs out of this deal and to restart or start considering nuclear operations although they've always denied they were working on a weapons program, if they were to do that, he threatened to hit them with everything they've got. the important thing that i think happened today is that emmanuel macron through flatt flattery, persuasion, all of the bromance you saw, the kisses, the pats, the handshakes is arguing to not break out of this on may 12th, the next deadline and to consider expanding it, that germany, the uk and france principally want to try to the negotiate an add-on to extend the deal so that it wouldn't end in ten years to also expand it to include the ballistic missile component of iran's behavior which is now not part of it and also iran's behavior in yemen,

syria, in lebanon in the region. the counter argument has always been that that was the best that john kerry and team could get. that containing iran's nuclear expansion was good enough, that if they started to go down did the road of stopping their ballistic missile research and testing, that that would not work. the counter argument by donald trump and a lot of others is that they didn't try hard enough. so what you're beginning to see is a little crack in the trump determination to break out on may 12th in response to what macron is arguing that they should expand it, renegotiate it and try to keep everyone involved. >> what's your sense as an analyst as the chances if trump tries to add on whether to deal with the missiles or with the terrorism, whatever he wants to put the pressure on and try to deny the iranians the right to do, what are the chances they'll walk away from the foundation that was set by barack obama and the mullahs over threw already

killing the deal itself? >> i think if president trump is doing this in coordination with iran, with excuse me, with france, and with the other europeans, i think he's got a lot of leverage because iran wants the economic benefits and is not seeing the benefits it wants because of the uncertainty of trump an exelection and now these continuous threats to break out of it. there are a lot of world investors afraid to get involved and afraid to help iran with its economic advancement. so i think there is a lot of leverage if he works closely with the europeans and that's what macron is arguing. > let me go to bobby ghosh. it seems to me, thanks for coming on, as well. it seems to me that you can trash somebody else's effort and say we haven't stopped the long-term threat from iran in terms of weaponry. now he's dealing with kim jong-un. he recites his name like he's

playing a xylophone. he's not comfortable pronouncing his name. he's not comfortable talking about the guy. now he's going to somehow contain him. is the bar set now if he can contain north korea the way barack obama contained iran, that somehow that would be a success? i mean, you got to measure these things against each other. >> he's setting the bar much higher with north korea. he's saying he wants them to give up their nukes. that's never happened before. no country ha already got nukes has given it up. libya gave up a nuke program. south africa gave up a nuke program. they hadn't reached having nukes. the iranians agreed to give up their nuclear development program. no country that once it acquired nukes no country backed away. he's setting the bar for negotiations with north korea much higher than obama. >> do you fear when that bar is not reached we're going to attack. >> no, i don't think we can attack. it's not realistic.

they very nuclear weapons and a pretty tough regime running the place with no sense of responsibility for its actions. so no, i don't think attacking is an option. and so i don't get there business of setting the bar this high. and at the same time, saying, well, he's behaving like an honorable man. i have to assume that he was struggling for some other word and honorable popped into his head because that doesn't make any sense. >> i think he's in over his head. thank you very much, andrea and bobby. this is not a happy scenario. up next, president trump today says he's stupid to ask whether he would pardon his fixer michael cohen. is he protesting too much? it seems like a pardon is still on the president's mind. he's talking about jack johnson. scooter libby, sheriff arpaio. he likes to be known as a pardoner. that's helpful to his situation, don't you think? this is "hardball" where the action is.

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purchase president, what about michael cohen? are you considering a pardon for michael cohen. >> thank you very much. stupid question. >> welcome back to "hardball." that was president trump this morning telling a reporter that it's stupid to ask him whether he's considering a pardon of his long-time fixer michael cohen. however, there's plenty of reporting to show throughout the investigation, trump and his legal team have weighed the benefit of pardoning key figure

who's could be in legal jeopardy. last summer according to "the washington post," the president even asked advisers whether he can pardon aides, family members, even himself in connection with this probe. recently, the president has appeared to dangle, that's the key word now, the possibility of a pardon for cohen. in an unexpected move days after the fbi raid on cohen, trump pardoned scooter libby, the former aid to you dick cheney convicted of perjury and obstruction of justice in 2007. one of the prosecutors in the libby case tells yahoo news he believes the parred be was intended to send a message to mike cohen to stay loyal. i don't see any other logic to it, he said. joining me now is the carol pa lee zee, federal and white collar defense attorney. thank you for joining us. what seems on the surface to be a dangling operation could, it be anything else? >> it couldn't be anything else. fact is, there's explicable timing here before the fact is over the weekend the president went on a tweet storm and talked

about the possibility of eight posthumous pardon for jack johnson based on some conversation had he with sylvester stallone which happened about a month ago. the question is, what is this timing about? it goes to the michael cohen issue. we will know that the president he called michael cohen immediately after that raid on his home, office and hotel room and the question is, whether or not he essentially offered a quid pro quo, some type of agreement to offer him a presidential pardon if he didn't flip because the fact is, those tweets reference the prospect of michael cohen flipping on the president. so clearly that wasn't a stupid question. >> not at all because you're the expert and the lawyer. it seems to me that a symmetric warfare. robert mueller has all kinds of potential opportunities to bring charges before grand juries against say michael cohen or any of these other people involved in this caper.

on the other hand, the president has the power to pardon. are they equally matched? can he match anything that the prosecutor throws at him and say okay, buddy, he's your chief witness. gone, i just pardoned him. or does that create another problem all together? i don't know. it looks like the pardon does solve his problem if he uses it audaciously, if you will. >> once he grants a presidential pardon, there goes michael cohen's fifth amendment right against self-incrimination. he could then be called in front of the grand jury to talk about other things. it's akin to prosecutes immewnizing witnesses. if you don't have the threat of criminal prosecution, you can't take the fifth. that's not to state new york state and eric schneiderman aren't putting things in process to move forward with a state. >> don't you have bad memory to play with? it seems once you're pardoned, you stop remembering. >> yes, but there are ways for

prosecutors to get at the old, i don't remember line. i mean, that can only get you so far. i don't think that a pardon -- politically, obviously, a pardon is going to set off alarm bells there. legally speaking, a pardon isn't going to help michael cohen either. again, there are taxi medallion issues here, real estate issues. those are state crimes, new york state crimes that i bet the sdny is being careful about not charging michael cohen with at this time. looking forward down the road to the possibility of a federal presidential pardon. >> thank you so much, carolyn polisi. please come back. with the midterm elections fast approaching, can democrats we sis talking about impeachment? he may rev up the base. he certainly will. is it smart politics for this november's election? you're watching "hardball."

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democrats have a real shot at winning back the house this november, i believe that by the way. and with control of the house in sight, some are invoking the "i" word, impeachment. a lot are. one prominent democrat is warning against using it as a campaign issue this year. chicago mayor rahm emanuel, a veteran of the obama and clinton white houses told axios "you don't just treat the policy standard of impeachment as a political tool." i couldn't be angrier at donald trump. you don't flippantly say we're for impeachment. over a third of the caucus voted for a resolution to debate impeachment proceedings. about a third of the caucus. the "new york times" reports some republicans are looking to energize their base over fears a blue wave would lead to impeachment. up next, one columnist warns pursuing impeachment could the have dire consequences. that's next for the "hardball" roundtable.

average lasagna? not in this house. 'cause that's no average family. that's your family. which is why you didn't grab just any cheese. you picked up kraft mozzarella with a touch of philadelphia for lasanyeah! kraft. family greatly. back to "hardball." should democrats regain control of the house of representatives in november, there's one word we might hear a lot of in the future. pretty soon. impeachme impeachment. "new york times" columnist charles blow warns trying to remove trump could have the opposite effect than the one desired and could boost his popularity and acquittal by the senate would leave an even more popular president in office. this is a tough one. david jolly, a former republican

congressman from florida. he doesn't talk like one. nancy cook, from politico and clarence is the columnist for the chicago tribune. is it smart or should they -- to talk impeachment now to rise up the progressive or left base to get him out, minorities included? if you get a democrat in that congress, we're going to get rid of trump. is that the smart politics this year. >> i think charles blow is right. what's the old line, if you're going to attack the king, you've got to kill account king, otherwise you're doomed. look what happened to bill clinton. they tried to impeach him. they did but didn't kick him out of office. his approvals went up and newt gingrich is out. this is what happens. trump will -- >> at the same time he was -- it's relevant information. nancy, smart move to go for the big "i" now if you're running for office in the suburbs of philly, a tough area you might

be able to pick up even though you're a bluie in a reddie neighborhood, is it smart to talk impeachment. >> you're not putting forward your own agenda if you're just going with the impieachment message. >> that's all anybody talks about, how much we hate trump. >> successful candidates will be able to talk about economic issues. >> we have a poll that challenges that thinking. democrats definitely vote for somebody who is for impeachment, 70% of voters already vote for a democrat that says they'll vote for impeachment. >> the democrats need to talk about the economic disparity and the republican tax bill and the republican health care plan leaves people behind. the anti-trumpers will be there. come january whether he democrats successfully take the house, you will see hearings within the house not specifically about impeachment but they'll bring scholars in to say what actions and behaviors.

>> is this jerry nadler going to do this? >> here's why. they can have scholars come into the committee and a this is what impeachment would look like. democrats can say we're not quite there yet but guess what. all of us will be tacking about. >> i know you're a republican. you don't know the culture of the democratic party. there's the black caucus and a lot of progressives. that group of people will be damn screaming for impeachment by next spring. how do you hold them back and tell people from chicago your entire delegation from the city. >> it's not easy. there is a strong enough raent trump sentiment already in the party. you don't need to ginn it up. the party needs to reach out to people, those who vote ford obama and turned and voted for trump. you had what, over how many counties. >> i'm not used to people agreeing with me so much around here. we think exactly alike. the other ones you have to turn. the people who vote for obama,

including who voted for him the first time will be harder to get. they voted for obama after they knew he was a liberal democrat and stuck with him and then went over to trump. what's going on here? >> back to the point of impeachment, democratic strategists make the point that democrats should recapture the house and find evidence for impeachment and make sure there's evidence there or at least investigate before they go with that rallying cry. >> you read the book. >> dras have one. >> i never -- usually the panel is much more progressive than me. what i think is reasonable. you guys are outreasonabling me. the roundtable is sticking with us. you're watching "hardball." isn't top of mind. that's because they have a shield annuity from brighthouse financial, which allows them to take advantage of growth opportunities in up markets, while maintaining a level of protection in down markets. so they're less concerned with market volatility

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we're finally back out in our yard, but so are they. introducing scotts turf builder triple action. it kills weeds, prevents crabgrass and feeds so grass can thrive, guaranteed. our backyard is back. this is a scotts yard. we're back with the "hardball" roundtable. david, before you tell me what i don't know, are you running for lieutenant governor of florida. >> i got no comment on that. but --

>> that means you're running. i can read that. go ahead. >> everybody's. >> tell me your secret. here's something. democrats have to change 23 seats in the house to retake the majority. republicans right now are worried they're going to lose between 40 and 60 seats. here's why that matters. you can't recover in 2020. this would not only be loss for two years, it could be a loss for four. >> think ahead. >> here's something that i'll be watching. scott pruitt, the imbattled epa secretary has twos hearings on the hill. >> thursday. >> on thursday. i feel like when i've talked to people in the white house, that is going to be part of an audition to see how long he's going to keep his job. >> do you think the members of congress will be offend he's paying staff members more than they make up? >> i'm sure that will come up. >> quickly. that's what he did. >> well, what we know about the dnc, the democratic national committee suing russia and

republicans in the trump campaign and now trump and also roger stone is his old friend are both saying they're going to counter sue in order to get at the dnc files. but as we've seen in the past, president trump said the same thing about stormy daniels and michael wolff and all the women who have charged him. and i think he's bluffing. >> a day without hearing the name roger stone is a very good day. thank you, david jolly, future lieutenant governor of florida, nancy i cook and clarence page. we'll be right back. cook and c. we'll be right back. cook and cl. we'll be right back. today, 97% of employers agree

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trump watch, tuesday, april 24th, 2018. one of donald trump's problems as president is he doesn't know the kind of people who would help him be a good president. he brought along his family, for instance, i've joked about them being like the roman negatives. that's the way they behaved. they he doesn't have a family member to fill a job, he picks someone in his orbit. he didn't know anyone to be secretary of state so he picked rex tillerson, someone whose chief selling point was he gave trump a credible excuse not to pick mitt romney for the job. trump has had a hard time figuring out who he can work with. look at the traffic heading through the west wing. it seems like the tv showwest wing" with people rushing by all the time. sean spicer gone, rice priebus gone, anthony scare mew chirks gone. steve bannon gone, good.

omarosa gone. hope hicks gone, h.r. mcmaster gone. some were shown the door. some just split. if you can't make judgments about who to hire, how does he make judgments about vladimir putin or kim jong-un? we've already answered that question, haven't we? that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. tonight on "all in." >> i said to dr. jackson, what do you need it for? >> president trump suggests the man he picked to head the va should withdraw. >> i really don't think personally he should do it. >> as questions swirl about ronny jackson's past. >> are you saying those are categorically untrue? >> i'm saying i'm looking forward to the hearings. >> what it says about how trump is picking his best people. >> the cabinet is turning into a sad game of musical chairs. >> then. >> are you.