parents on the border, he calls phony stories of sadness and grief in an event to designed to refocus the debates on the dangers posed by immigrants, donald trump today held an event with families who have lost loved ones to crimes committed by people in this country illegally. >> you know, you hear the other side. you never hear this side. you don't know what's going on. these are the american citizens permanently separated from their loved ones. the word permanently being the word that you have to think about, permanently. they're not separated for a day or two days. they are permanently separated because they were killed by criminal illegal aliens. these are the families the media ignores. >> trump's attempt to change the subject and move the media away from disturbing images of children detained at the border comes as his aides try to walk back their support of the family separation policy. here was jeff sessions yesterday

in an interview. >> it hasn't been good and the american people don't like the idea that we are separating families. we never really intended to do that. what we intended to do was to make sure that adults who bring children into the country are charged with the crime they've committed. instead of giving that special group of adults immunity from prosecution, which is what in effect we were doing. >> that is exactly what they intended and jeff sessions' comments are a complete reversal of his stated policy goals when he proudly and brazenly announced the policy that began this nightmare. >> if you are smuggling a child, then we will prosecute you. and that child may be separated from you as required by law. if you don't want your child to be separated, then don't bring them across the border illegally. it's not our fault. our policies that can result

in short-term separation of families is not unusual or unjustified and it's really a very short period of time. i would cite you to the apostle paul in his clear and wise command in romans 13 to obey the laws of the government because god has ordained the government for his purposes. >> i'm no expert, but i think the bible comes down pretty hard on lying. joining us to discuss today's developments some of our favorite reporters and friends, joining us from the washington post, white house bureau chief phil rucker, former u.s. attorney joyce vance is back with us and with us at the table the rev al sharpton president of the national action network and host of politics nation here on msnbc. john heilman is back, msnbc affairs analyst. let me start with you because i follow you on twitter and i saw you just responding in real-time to what you saw today, the sort

of contrast between the president with these families who suffered tragic losses of their own, but an effort to try to change the immigration debate that has engulfed this white house and this administration over the last ten days. >> you know, the losses that these families have suffered are tragic and they are individual tragedies. no one would ever make light of them. we went through in my family the murder of my father-in-law and it's a pain that you feel with you every day. but the problem that we see when the president brings these families out to justify his immigration policies is that equally innocent young children are being separated from their parents as though they are somehow to blame for the criminal acts of others. and we know because virtually every study tells us that populations of people who have entered this country illegally are far less likely to commit crimes and violent crimes than are the entire population of american citizens. so, this is really sort of a

solution or maybe it's an answer in search of a question that doesn't exist. >> john heilman, let me show you one of the president's favorite morning hosts this morning trying to label these kids as somehow other than us. this is brian kilmeade. let's watch. >> these aren't our kids. show them compassion, but it's not like he's doing this to the people of idaho or, or, or texas. these are people from another country and now people are saying that they're more important than people in our country who are paying taxes and who have needs as well. >> yeah. >> i was just watching some of the old world war ii footage of americans liberating camps. i mean, the idea that america doesn't look out for other people's kids is just nauseating. >> of course yes, that's certainly true. it's also -- of course there is literally no one in the united states of america who is saying

that these children are more important than american children. not one person. that's brian kilmeade just talking crap on television in support of the president. no one is saying that. all anybody -- the children of america are of paramount importance. that has nothing to do with whether or not it's effective, moral, acceptable, in any way tenable to be taking the guilt-free children, innocent children, stripping them away interest their parents and throwing them into detention centers or jails. they're totally unrelated arguments and he like the president, and as fox news often does, is trying to change the subject and still somehow turn this immigration issue, which is what they want to now talk about, the evils of immigration, still try to turn this into a winning issue for the president. it is, at the end of this week in which for a brief moment we thought there might be a moment where the president was slightly

chastised by the outrage felt not just among democrats and moderates, but many, many, many millions of republicans, turns out the president is a shameless and repulse i haive on this que as he was on monday. >> rev, it does seem to indicate there is some acknowledgment there is a hole that needs to be dug out of. to see all of them go to this effort to change the subject, to see fox news, which is basically an arm of this trump white house com shop, it's not like these are our kids. this is not our problem. it seems that there is some recognition that they have done themselves some harm in some corner. >> i think that clearly they are trying to dig themselves out of a hole, but it takes the height of insensitivity to use families who have lost loved ones to be your shovel to dig yourself out of a hole that you put yourself in. first of all, all of us -- i agree with what was said. all of us hold in high esteem

he's families who have a lost loved one, but what does that have to do with separation of other families? he's mixing an issue that has nothing to do with the other. >> right. >> for him to shamelessly do that -- >> right. >> -- because of what he did, i think is the add and manipulate their pain. secondly, when you have someone saying that they're not our children, but he very carefully says they're not from idaho or texas, he's really sending this whole racial signal that i've been saying from the beginning, which is why i went yesterday to mcallen, texas, with an ecumenical group. we're not saying that about canadian children. we're not saying about people that come here illegally from other countries. we're saying that about children from south america, central america, mexico, and the caribbean because he's not saying that about everybody. he's saying that about distinct people who are stopped at that border. are we standing at the canadian

border saying, if we find any of y'all coming in another way, we're separating you from your children? no, because they wouldn't tolerate that. and most of donald trump's base wouldn't tolerate seeing white children treated like that. >> don't give them any ideas, though. we might start incarcerating canadian children next thing you know if the president sees some political advantage to that, that could be next. >> chris made this point and we mentioned on this program there is a racial through line through the lowest moments of donald trump's presidency. charlottesville, the muslim ban, inadequate inept and ongoing tragedy in puerto rico. >> yeah. look, this is -- i've said this all along. this is white nationalism. it's not about being a bigot, it's not about i don't like you here. this president and his administration said we want to change the demographic future of this country. we want to keep brown people out, we want to have the brown people here afraid or terrorized or wanting to go home. we want to limit where people can come from. 87% of our refugee re-settlements from europe have

been done this year. we're six months in. 87% of europeans have been re-settled here. it's a problem when you have asylum seekers at the border who traveled 10,000 miles through dangerous -- some of which were caused by our administration if you look at the coups in honduras. some of what these people are fleeing have to do with our policies south of the border but they don't want to take responsibility for that. >> phil rucker, your paper has done an incredible job covering this story. i want to read some of your reporting that created confusion by the executive order itself. you guys write, reversal on migrant families deepens confusion over trump's immigration order. in scenes reminiscent of the botched muslim ban, federal agencies were left to interpret the sudden changes ordered by the white house the day before and figure out how to implement them. the family separation system that that's been planned and tested over 1e6r8 months vanished at the president's pen with no stated plan to reverse its effects. >> yeah, that's exactly right,

nicolle. there is really a sense of chaos within the federal government as the different agencies and there are several agencies involved here, try to figure out how to implement this order and how to change this policy that went into place a couple of months ago. and it all seems to be driven by the president's desire to see this as a public relations issue. he's been bothered by the news media coverage of the family separation policy and that's why he rushed that executive order two days ago and signed it to try to say that he would be keeping these families together. it's much more complicated when it comes to implementing the policy. one thing, nicolle, you mentioned the angel moms, the parents who have lost children to the crimes of illegal immigrants that the president had at the white house. he's been using them since the very beginning of his presidential campaign. i was at that rally in phoenix when he was in trouble for those immigration remarks and macy's was dropping his line of clothing and it was a huge issue. and he used these parents,

brought them into the forefront to try to say, look, i was right at the beginning. some of these illegal immigrants are murderers, are criminals and so forth. and it's been a bit of a crutch for him all the way through. >> i want to read you something, heim man, that the baltimore sun reported today that sort of picks up on what phil and his colleagues reported. immigration agents have sent dozens of children to maryland. i believe the post has reported there are 13 states right now that we know of where separated children are being held. others are being held in dormitories in anne arundel and baltimore county. many children come with little information. one is 18 months old, several are too young to speak to their new care givers or help social workers track down relatives who could take them in. lawyers are trying to figure out how to put together asylum claims for 6-year-olds who don't know why they fled their countries. >> yes. well, so, i think we talked about the ways in which this is similar to the muslim ban. there are a lot of ways in which

it's similar. the authorship stephen miller being behind it, the racism of it. they're very similar in one key respect, the administration is as incompetent as ever. if you taken sid iousness and add it to incompetence. >> racism. >> racism is part of the insidiousness. i factored that in. you're going to get chaos and that's what we have right now is chaos. it's chaos again, around children who are blameless and are being put in this position where they are being treated really as with no due process. and they are being treated effectively as less than human. always one more thing to say. one more thing. >> please. >> we're not still -- said this morning, these are still being treated like black sites, these dee essenti detention centers. they are public facilities paid for by american tax dollars that american journalists are occasionally allowed to enter but no cameras have yet been

allowed inside of. we are still locked out, the american media, covering these things in the open way we cover every other public facility in american society. it is outrageous that we cannot hold this system to account now that we know about it. now that we know the addresses of some of these places, they're still saying, no, you cannot come in and shoot this stuff with your cameras. ridiculous. >> let me ask joyce vance a legal question. when you have a suspect, even if they're suspected of terrorist activity, if they're in the southern district of new york, they're allowed to meet with their lawyers. they're allowed some sort of legal rights. these are children too young to explain why they might have been seeking asylum. these are children who are not sure of their language skills. who is advocating -- how do you operational ize emotional support, medical care, and legal advocacy for an 18-month-old? >> you know, this is the difficulty that agencies on the border are struggling with.

and many people who are well intentioned like social caseworkers will be overburdened. the immigration system on the border was already stretched tighter than a wire. now it will be broken beyond repair and there won't be adequate services. the whole idea that we walked into this and that jeff sessions when he implemented zero tolerance had no plan for reunifying their children with their parents, these kids with their parents, the whole idea that there was no plan and now in the middle of what's a resource crisis for the government as well as an incredible human crisis for the kids and their parents means this will be dysfunctional for the foreseeable future. >> that was the plan. this is what steve bannon said. chaos, they want this to be chaotic because that frightens supposedly people from coming to this country. also the goal of so much of this administration is to -- >> do you think the images are what they wanted people to see? >> i think it works both ways. we have to remember that there

is a section of this country, 40 something percent of people which won't admit to it in polls, who like this who say i don't want these kids here who want them terrified. they want this to go down. you look at what melania did, right? i'm playing this both ways. it's linguistic and communications gymnastics. on one hand i'm going to go down, i'm going to play to the libs. i'm going to put this on my jacket. >> that's not 47% of the country that want -- they're not. there's not. >> yeah. they deal with this administration you have no problem with that. >> get beyond the point she just made, and that is that if they had had a plan, as they said, to later reunite them, then why can't they just escalate the plan now? because there never was a plan. >> exactly. >> to reunite them. they didn't care about it. all you have to do is accelerate it now. and when we were there yesterday

in texas and the first lady came, they denied clergy visits. i'm there with monsignor sullivan and rabbi -- mobsters, gangsters, mafia dons get clergy visits. these are 18-month-old babies you can't even pray with when you have this bible-fru mping attorney general. what you want to do by and by when the morning came, attorney general, why can't you do it now? because there never was a plan. they didn't see these people of having value. we were going to break them up and whatever happened to them in life, that's what happened. and that's vicious. >> phil rucker, let me get you back in on this. do you have the sense -- i mean, there was some reporting yesterday that the pentagon was getting prepared, they were ordered to prepare to house 20,000 immigrants on army bases. do you get a sense that this e.o. halting the practice means

there will be no more children separated? or do you get the sense they still feel this could go either way and they're preparing for the numbers to swell again? >> i think, nicolle, it could go either way. the bottom line is we don't really know. there hasn't been a clear directive from the administration of exactly how this is going to be implemented and executed. there is also -- and we haven't gotten to this, but the legislative piece of this is a huge question mark right now. the house republicans don't have the votes to pass what they thought earlier in the week was going to be sort of a legislative fix to this problem. and that's been punted in part because of something the president said on twitter this morning about delaying until the midterm elections. and so the bottom line is you have all these agencies preparing different contingencies but there is not a clear directive from the white house about exactly what to do and exactly how this is all going to shake out and how you reunite these families. they're not being reunited right now. >> all right. when we come back, a new front in the case for collusion

against donald trump. this time with the owner of the national inquirer who reportedly sent copies of articles and the cover for approval prior to publication. also ahead, the hunt for the lost trump tapes. comedian tom aarrnold works to enlist michael cohen in his campaign against trump. he joins us at the table. and donald trump's summer of love for dictators and thugs continues. next stop, russia. the president's national security advisor heading to moscow. stay with us. oh milk. am i willing to pay the price for loving you?

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it's been a no good very bad

week for donald trump's fixer michael cohen and it may have just gotten a lot worse. the washington post reporting today that the national inquirer shared stories about trump with cohen before publishing them both during trump's presidential campaign and after he became president. as aaron blake writes for the post, quote, to the casual observer this may seem like a media eth exstoics story but it worse than that. because of trump's control over and cohen's involvement in the inquirer's alleged hush money payments. it shows the pressure on cohen to flip could be at an all-time high and as cohen rubs elbows with tom arnold, a man who has vowed to bring the president down, whom we will talk to in a couple of minutes, the panel is still here. joyce and phil are still with us. joyce, talk us through the legal significance of this, what looks like collusion between the president, his fixer, a man rudy

giuliani described as funneling money through, and the national enquirer. >> one piece of legal significance is whether the entire course of conduct constitutes an illegal campaign contribution. candidates like trump have to report all of the assistance that their campaign receives. if there is an exchange of something of value here, in this case suppressing stories about the president or putting out what in essence are ads for the campaign at no cost, then that's the kind of information trump would have to report on campaign filings. and if this is intentional and if there is a pattern of this kind of conduct, it could rollover into the criminal arena and, of course, we know southern district of new york is already investigating cohen for criminal campaign finance violations. so it's hard to tell right now where this is headed. it doesn't look good for either cohen or the president. >> and, phil rucker, this is another piece of extraordinary reporting in your paper today.

what i found most surprising, joyce is talking about how they may have stumbled into -- and i say stumbled because everyone always describes that campaign as so crippled by incompetence, but we don't know that that was the fact. but your paper describes conduct that was ongoing, that even after donald trump was president there was still this practice of sending articles and covers over for approval. >> that's right. and it's pretty extraordinary. and just to make sure everyone watching understands, that is not normal. [ laughter ] >> journalists get fired for sharing -- for sharing their stories with sources for approval before publication. if i were to do that i would not have a job at the washington post any more so it's highly unusual. it speaks to the way -- the relationship, rather, that trump and michael cohen had with the national enquirer. it really raises doubts about the reporting and raises legal questions joyce just got into. >> john heilman, let me show you

some of the headlines another country has justifiably been consumed by the tragedy of the border. this is michael cohen's week in review. michael cohen just drop a hint about flipping on trump? cohen quits rnc gig. michael cohen wants trump to pay his legal fees. and the publisher of the national enquirer in probe. his legal problems are mounting as i understand from family and friends to do some sort of deal to avoid jail time. >> there's never been any doubt in my mind how this was going to end up. if you look at the southern district doing what they did, this extraordinary and incredible thing. we have to go back to the beginning. the raid itself on the personal attorney of the president of the united states. what the standard was to get that warrant was off the charts high. they knew he committed crimes before they walked in the door. they almost had to prove that to get the warrant. so they now are engaged in this broad wide ranging criminal investigation that is going to yield indictments and probably going to present michael cohen with a choice of spending the rest of his life in jail or

cooperating. there is almost no one given that choice and someone who everyone who knows michael cohen says for all of his many defects is he loves his family and has been treated like crap, i use crap now twice on the show today. has been systematically crapped on by donald trump over the course of the whole relationship -- i'll do it again in a moment. that guy given the way he's been repaid for his loyalty, given the dirty business he's done for donald trump now facing potentially decades in jail and wanting -- how does he not end up cooperating with prosecutors? it just does president make any sense to me there is any other outcome. >> we're going to talk to tom arnold in the next block. let's put up this picture of him with michael cohen. on a public mission on behalf of vice news to unearth some of the tapes, some of the tapes from the apprentice, and other tapes in which donald trump reveals his true self. we get a view into that on

twitter but there is more before his political career began. what do you think michael cohen was thinking when he posed for that picture? >> i think he knew -- all of this is a sort of subtle messaging back and forth. >> is it subtle? is it subtle? are we like -- >> tom arnold is not that subtle. >> at this point the guy is like, look, i'm about to flip on you, right? and i think this is what's interesting also about some of this reporting from this week. there's only one puzzle piece left, right? he's already in trouble for the supposedly campaign violation of paying stormy daniels. if there is a catch and kill story that the enquirer had, we're going to run this story and michael cohen said no, he paid someone to shut up and not release the story, then he's under the jail at this point. >> don't we have that already, joyce, in the karen mcdougal story? wasn't that karen mcdougal's story she's now told publicly? >> right. >> it really is her story, you know, and they make these promises to her about what

she'll get and none of it comes to fruition. that story hasn't gotten enough coverage and there is obviously this pattern that i think the point here is that if there is still more to be uncovered, if the national enquirer was doing more catch and kill, this could mount up in a very negative way that could have repercussions up on the hill. this could at the end of the day provide a basis for impeachment as much as it could for indictment. >> rev? >> i think that the whole question of the enquirer goes back to what has already been said with this lady saying that this was the understanding. this was part of the core of the investigation into michael cohen. but it also speaks to you can't have michael cohen on one side saying, oh, no, i did this for the president with stormy daniels and he didn't know about it. well, then, were you bringing the stories to the president that you killed or he didn't know about that either?

at this point he's put in a position -- i agree with john. >> there is no way -- most people that know the president, he was a master of the micro. there is no way he didn't know about the cover. >> there's no way he didn't know who was the elevator operator in trump tower. i'm talking about somebody that knows him and that everybody in any of us, pro or con, that had good or bad meetings with donald trump met with michael cohen. michael cohen was like his therapist. he's the guy when you walked out angry because he wouldn't do whatever it was, he was the comforter to all of us on the long ride downstairs and why this guy was as belligerent as he is. >> one of trump's many binkies. here's the thing. as bad as all the catch and kill is, as bad as all the stories are, there is a small percentage cohen did on donald trump's behalf. it makes it much worse than what we know about the campaign finance violations potentially. but when the totality of what he's done in all of these foreign countries, making all

these dirty deals, all the money that passed through hands, this is going to be just like a little sliver of icing on top of a big giant nasty cake. >> ooh, nasty cake. >> a cake made of -- >> all right. i'm sorry for him, everybody. when we come back, imagine what kind of trouble these two could make if they joined forces. we'll ask comedian tom arnold about his hunt for the trump tapes and his effort to enlist former trump fixer michael cohen. stay with us. managing blood sugar is not a marathon. it's a series of smart choices.

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is he still your friend? is he still your friend? >> i haven't spoken to michael in a long time. >> is he still your lawyer? >> he's not my lawyer. >> not in i more? a i always liked michael and he's a good person -- do you mind if i talk? you asked me a question, i'm trying to answer. >> just wondering if you worried he's going to cooperate with federal investigators. >> i did nothing wrong.

>> he's not worried, but should he be? maggie haberman categorize the the trump cohen relationship a couple weeks ago. it doesn't seem like it is an entirely amicable relationship. she wrote, for years mr. trump treated cohen poorly. threats of being fired with interviews with a half dozen people familiar with the relationship. keeping that in mind, we wonder what was on the president's mind when he saw this tweet. cohen standing with actor tom arnold who just so happens to be starting up a new show on vice land. here's that trailer. >> donald trump saying, quote-unquote, grab them by the [ bleep ]. >> talking about 16-year-old girls in their underwear here, okay? >> spewing racial slurs from celebrity apprentice. >> trump denies any involvement with prostitutes. >> don't worry. tom arnold is on it. and i'm tom arnold. >> and joining us right now --

>> oh, my gosh. >> how do you know donald trump? >> i met him probably 30 years ago. i did an hbo, roseanne, did an hbo special at the trump castle. i'm not sure that's the first time we met. knowing people from new york, but i got to know him there because i had to do business with him. he ended up in the special, shocker. and then he would come on my sports show, i'm sure he came on many shows here. and i went to the play boy mansion with donald trump. i wasn't the creepy guy to visit karen mcdougal. affable, decent -- you know, he was a guy, you know. and then things changed when, you know, he decided to run for president and the birther thing. that was kind of the end of our -- that was definitely the end of our relationship. >> what's your mission now? >> my mission is to get him out of there because he's so incompetent and so dangerous. and every day, you know, this

week with the children being ripped from their parents, i mean, he's obviously a racist and he has racist people around him and he is cruel and he lies and just the trauma that he's putting on all of america every day. and he's just changing everything about who -- what we are as a country and it is so unsafe, what america represents. you know, eventually it's going to be china and russia on our borders. i know it seems crazy, but he's just changing everything about the fabric of our country. but it's just god awful. you know, i'm glad my friend michael cohen is with us. >> so, did you get -- i want to put up -- i want to ask you two questions. i want to start with the idea of tapes. we've got footage of the access hollywood tape. this came out before election day and people voted for him anyway. so, what is the power -- what is on the tapes that you're going to release on your -- >> it didn't say anything about

donald trump. this president -- he's been on tape. the substance is available to the public already. should be disqualified for a guy to rent a car. he started day one by calling and faking his own voice to say his father had given him his money and he was really a billionaire. >> right. >> he's done -- he's admit today walking into miss teen universe pedram entitl pageants to see them naked and bragging about that on howard stern. it's just horrible and that and, you know, the tape that i heard, he uses the n word and he calls his son eric the r word for people with, you know -- it's disgusting, sexual harassment things to the women on the set of the apprentice, shocking mark burnett allowed that. when i confront the mark burnett personally face to face, first he showed me a picture of his

kid, donald trump's ring bearer on the phone. these racist things, i can't give you the footage you want. donald trump wants that footage, too, and i'm not giving it to him either. but there are ways to get it. gloria allred has a client who a judge says you have to get it. my thing is i'm not going to quit. i'm not going to quit until he's out of office. he and his family are awful grifters. if people see a day of him on the board room set of the apprentice and seen how incompetent he was, without people propping him up and lying for him and covering for him, then they would have been oh, my my god, no, he can't be the president. >> even his friends will say the idea he was this titan of business and people voted for a businessman is such a scam. he was talent. he was -- no offense -- >> no, i agree 100%. i shouldn't be president. oh, my god. >> the idea he ran the successful business and people

thought they were voting for a successful businessman, he could transfer those skills to the government was a scam. >> right. people in new york knew. he couldn't have been the city council man in new york. he would have never won, mayor or representative or the governor of new york. the only thing he could have won from new york was president of the united states because people of new york knew him. so, that's scary. so, what mark burnett sold was this guy on the apprentice, this fake guy to middle america and people from iowa oh, my god, he's donald trump. he's this genius. the thing about him, he said that barack obama wasn't born here, he's an illegitimate president. the problem -- there's a million problems with him doing that. first i was born in a small midwestern farm town like barack obama. my grandfather looks just like barack obama's grandfather. oh, my god, if barack obama's grandfather was alive, he'd be like -- that's why he took it so personal. my grandfather had to defend me a lot, too. the irony is donald trump is an illegitimate president. he did not win the election

without help from russia. you will see this. and he knows he's illegitimate. every time you mention it, he freaks out and that's karma. >> that's your theory. i want to ask you, though, about what happened yesterday. let's put this picture up with you and michael cohen. i want to ask you to get to the answer to these two questions. one, how did this meeting come to be? and two, what commitments to michael cohen make, if any, to hed helping you? >> two things i can tell you. michael cohen and i have run into each other six times. >> six times, that sounds like more than just running into each other. >> i'll say -- >> what are you saying, you plan to see each other six times? >> i will say we are -- the first -- our first relationship involved lawyers and involved trump and the white house and russia. and i will tell you that --

that's all i can tell you. you will see. and it was -- we were on opposite sides of the -- we were adversaries. >> legally? >> yeah. >> were you someone he paid hush money to? >> no, no. there was somebody that he tried to get to hush that they -- >> i have a picture of you with felix saider. is this another link in your ties to donald trump -- >> that's interesting. >> here you are with a funny and kind friend felix sader beautiful long island home. we shared stories about new york real estate, visiting our beautiful friend -- you're being too cryptic for me. you can't just dangle out russia, michael cohen, felix sader and michael cohen what is it about? >> ultimately it's about getting -- i mean, let's say some of these people are cooperating with -- >> mueller. >> yes. >> okay.

>> and then if you follow me on twitter, that is a crazy guy and it's true. when this is over, you'll go, oh, my god. >> so, did michael cohen give you any verbal commitment or give you -- did his wife suggest -- >> michael cohen is a great father. he worked for this guy donald trump. many people like myself who worked for donald trump know he's a fool and he's terrible. he did his best. he cleaned up a lot of messes including karen mcdougal who i knew and her lawyer sued us, too. and all these -- running, running running, he got in over his head. he went to work and didn't -- his whole family missed him. now donald trump is like, who is michael cohen, what? he's not my lawyer. i don't know that guy. he's a nice guy. he's so full of it. finally he realized -- his wife helped him real eaize, i have t take care of my family. this guy is the worst. >> does that include flipping? did he tell you --

>> what do you mean flipping? >> is he going to cooperate with -- did he say nilg that made you think he's going to cooperate with prosecutors? >> he's going to do -- here's what i know. he's going to take care of his family, his country, us, the rest of us jews. donald trump is not. he's done. he knows donald trump -- donald trump does not care about him. he does not care about his family and it's over. he also doesn't want me -- he doesn't want to be harassed by donald trump because he is the president of the united states still and he probably has a bunch of dudes. but michael cohen is going to take care of his family and his country first. that's all you need to know. think about that. >> i've got two more questions for you. one, we know that what was seized from his offices included a lot of audio and recordings. did he promise to share those with you? >> to share with me? oh, michael cohen, first of all, does not work for vice. i want to make that clear. he's not getting any money.

he's probably broke -- i shouldn't say that. michael cohen did not make any promises with me. >> but you're working on it? >> he has all the tapes. in fact, some of those are -- my name is on those. >> my last question, you started out your first answer, you talked about your ex-wife roseanne. >> yes. >> how did she end up so far on the other side of the trump question from you? >> i don't know. we divorced 24 years ago. i think she got into -- like a lot of people in this country, you know. and i was talking to -- i spent a lot of time -- the last few months talking to her daughter and it happens in my family in iowa. we were talking about -- >> my parents. >> andy mccabe, the fbi agent. his mother-in-law is from iowa and his family and his wife, his brother-in-law is one of my best friends. she's a trump guy. people just get sucked in there. roseanne is full-on with the nazis and with the racist and -- just crazy, crazy, crazy.

i don't know how you get in there. i think mental health and trump putting that stuff, it's rigged. they're gentzler against us -- disseminate so much information. i did a deep dive into the information. it's not just fox news, but it's fox news and the internet stuff. and it's like a drug. and then donald trump is the king pen. he is perpetuating. that's why he has to go, too. he is the king pen of this drug ke keeping people sick in this country. >> we want to you come back when your vice special is getting ready to air. >> it's a series. i love you was you keep it real. people are like well, it's good politics. you're like, no, it's horrible for the country. >> we appreciate having you here. >> where is steve schmidt? is he okay? what happened to him? >> he's resting. he's resting up for all that eloquence takes rest.

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president trump returning triumphantly from singapore. president trump has now accomplished what no other american president has ever had the vision or the courage to even attempt. [ speaking foreign language ] >> only days ago president trump ushered in a new era of diplomacy. [ speaking foreign language ] >> this is something that many analysts and pundits thought was totally impossible. [ speaking foreign language ] >> the president's continued success in his every undertaking whether in domestic politics, international trade or foreign policy, president trump is standing taller than ever on the

world stage. [ speaking foreign language ] >> that was produced by our friends at the daily show on comedy on comedy central. i know it is the second time you have seen it today. but it's extraordinary. >> brilliant. >> when north korea is a capitalist paradise free of nuclear weapons and there is thriving free market media economy, those three guys, hannity, dobbs, perot, they could be big in north korea. >> they could be. >> could be big. >> what does it say, phil rucker, that that's where the parallels could be brawn? i don't think you could make a mash of any of the leaders in the uk right now meshing so completely with the commentary from north korea's state-run media. >> when trump was on the trip to singapore he watched some of north korea's propaganda state

tv and remarked that he thought the anchor lady lady was saying such nice things about kim that he wishes the tv hosts in the u.s. would say those things about him. apparently he doesn't think the fox hosts go far enough. it's interesting. i think he would love to have state tv like that. >> it might be the only place where fox news comes up short. if you thought the meeting was divisive we are on the doorstep of another summit, this one with trump and vladimir putin. john bolton is headed to moscow next week to potentially lay the ground work for a meeting. everyone is still here. what do you think the president wants from vladimir putin? or do you think this is simply vladimir putin getting what he always wanted and intended from donald trump? >> i think it's a mixture of both. i think putin always wanted someone like trump that would advocate g 8, bring him back in,

rather than g7. >> he already got that, right. >> he already picked up a lot more than he would have ever gotten from probably anybody else. i think what trump wants -- let's put aside what he may not want out, and that's a big favor. i think that trump wants -- it was a contrarian. he wants to do -- if the whole world is going this way i'm going that way. >> is that it or is he paying back a debt? >> he's -- i don't think donald trump does anything that he does not get something out of. it's more than just his contrarian nature. that's where i'm starting. he has to see a tangible win for him. that means putin probably has some things on donald trump that donald trump wants to make sure they are on a good rapport. >> john mccain is on my mind a lot. he called kim jong-un a short fat dictator, murderous thug, he called vladimir putin similar things. not the short and fat part. he is skinny and often

shirlsless but also a murderous thug. how did we fall so far from the moral clarity of republican nominee john mccain to this guy's summer of love with kim jong-un and vladimir putin. >> it is a shocking thin. you don't have to go as far back as mccain, romney was mocked for saying that russia was our main geopolitical foe. you could have an argument about it but that was where the u.s. mainstream was from world war ii to donald trump. it tells you something about the hollowness of the republican party as an apparatus, as an organization. it was a hollow organization waiting to be toppled and laid bare and laid waste to by a figure of the particular kind of charisma, the racist, white nationalist sentiments that donald trump exhibits. he played to the cultural

conservetivi conservetivism. it was changing at the grassroots even though the elites were still there. donald trump said this party is not the party of mitt romney and john mccain anymore, i could take it over. and it turned out not to be so hostile. >> is the pro putin thing of any interest to people investigating russia's role in the 2016 meddling in our election? >> i'm sure they are going to watch this entire summit unfold with fascination. it is almost unimaginable that trump, who is is under investigation over his ties to russia will go and cow to you to pu -- tow -- cow tow to putin

suddenly . there is no doubt that prosecutors will be fascinated and that perhaps some video clip from this misadventure will play prominently in mueller's ultimate closing argument to a jury. >> let me follow up and ask you about the role that his national security team plays as witnesses. we know that bob mueller wanted to talk to the nsa director, wanted to talk to mike pompeo. wanted to talk to coats. he wanted to talk to all of these guys. what do you think he wanted to ask them? >> some of these individuals may end up being unwitting witnesses. i say unwitting in the sense they were involved with trump, heard his thoughts, perhaps they were asked to kill an investigation with flynn much like they did with mueller. they were bystanders drawn into the story. and as upright public officials they will cooperate with mueller, testify under oath, tell the truth or they will find

themselves in the position that others who lied to law enforcement have found themselves in, which is to say indicted. >> one thing to keep in mind is that thinks national security adviser h.r. mcmaster and deputy dina powell were in the oval office with kislyak and lavrov when he said i fired comey to relieve pressure. he was a nut job. they also could be witnesses in the obstruction of justice investigation. >> and trump revealing information he is not supposed to reveal. there are national security and legal issues with him trying to set this up. going back to the question, why is this necessary? putin has already gotten an amazing return on his investment. he got disruption amongst the west, the g 1k38 the g7 not happy with him, he has a president who diminished american bureaucracy abroad. our credibility is destroyed. at this point he is stomping on the rest of the world by meeting

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my thank to all of my friend who kept me company on this frolicking romp on a friday. that does it for our hour i'm nicolle wallace. "mtp daily" starts right now. hi, chuck. >> how are you doing, nicolle? you are banking extra time with me. >> you just scooched it. now it's seven, eight, nine. >> it's all on me now. i have been impressed. two in row. >> happy friday. >> happy weekend. if it's friday, it's borderline chaos. tonight, leading questions. president trump blasts undocumented immigrants. >> these are really hard core criminal aliens. >> but tells republicans don't bother trying to solve the issue for now. will anybody in the gop take the leadership reigns? plus, the central issue,