thanks for watching this hour of msnbc live. you can find me on twitter. now to chris. >> thank you so much. good morning. we start this labor day with a look ahead to a huge day on capitol hill. one that will likely impact the balance of power on the supreme court for decades to come. at this time tomorrow president trump's nominee, brett kavanaugh will be face to face with senators from the judiciary committee and there will be fireworks on a range of issues from portion to executive privilege. his nomination is critical for several reasons. in the short term, he could be a key vote on the question of whether president trump could subpoenaed or indicted by robert mueller. in the long-term, his

confirmation would not just shift the court to the right. it would also make chief justice roberts the swing vote, and he's a lot more conservative than justice kennedy. let me bring in jeff bennett at the white house for us. jeff, what do we know about how the sides are preparing? >> a white house official told us brett kavanaugh has done at least a half dozen prep sessions including mock sessions with interruptions. kavanaugh's been preparing for this since prep school. he was born in washington. he spent the vast majority of his career here working in the bush administration and now as an appeals court judge. the gop, the rnc in coordination with the white house, capitol hill, outside gop groups spending millions. going all in on kavanaugh. as for democrats we've been getting a preview of issues they

hope to use to derail his confirmation. abortion rights, presidential power, hillary clinton is adding her voice in a tweet she sent out today. she says this. happy labor day. there's no better time to talk about why workers' rights would suffer if brett kavanaugh who has hearings to a lifetime appointment to the supreme court hearing is tomorrow. it brings up anti-worker agenda to the court if confirmed, and we can add to that what joe biden, the former vice president and potential presidential candidate told our colleague exclusively earlier today. take a look. >> you are the former chairman of the jush di ri committee. what's your advice to the democrats? >> stay in the room. demand answers and keep pointing out they have not given the material expected by the committee. >> and he's talk act the fact

that the prargs is withholding some 100,000 documents related to brett kavanaugh's work in the george w. bush white house siting executive privilege. so even though republicans with their slim majority in the senate really have all the leverage here, you can see you both sides are really digging in for a fight. >> jeff bennett, thank you so much from the white house for us. i'm going to bring in chris wilson, a republican pollster and ceo of wpa intelligence. chris kafenas, glen kushner, and joe winebanks. joe, you don't support kavanaugh. make the case. what do you expect to hear from democrats tomorrow? >> well, i'm hoping they will ask questions that will show how he has disrespected precedent. he has frequently been criticized by his colleagues on the bench in their written

opinions both on the left and the right for having ignored precedent, for having driven decisions that he raises issues that haven't been raised by the parties, but that go to something that he wants to accomplish. and those are things that are not good in a supreme court justice where it is the final decision. no one gets to review it. we want to make sure that those kind of questions are asked and that we find out why we can't have all the documents so we can -- >> what do you think is in there? >> i don't know -- >> could it just be that these are things that go on between a president and people who are close to them and they have to be able to be protected? >> it is possible that there will be some privilege involved in them. i don't know. but we have a right to know. and until the documents are produced by the archives, which is not until october according

to the ar koois, and i'm not sure if that's true. if the government really wanted to produce them, i wonder if they couldn't make the effort and put enough people on it so those documents could be produced and the members of the committee could look at them. then we would know. we have a right to know what's in the documents. the republicans insisted during justice kagen's confirmation hearings that all her documents are produced. why are they changing the rules now? it's because that's what the republicans have done on all these issues. >> we heard joe biden saying democrats, stay in the room, demand answers, but the conventional wisdom is this nomination is going to go through. he'll be confirmed. what can the democrats achieve tomorrow? >> well, i think there's -- well, i'm not sure it's conventional wisdom he's going to go through. >> you think kavanaugh could be blocked? how? >> realistically, if you look at math, he's going to pass. if you look at terms of the

political reality of what you could do in the hearings which is point out and exploit the fact of his positions and decisions when it comes to women's rights, worker's rights, minority rights, health care issues, things that really matter to everyday americans, then you start maybe having a little bit of weakness among some key republicans like a susan collins or lisa murkowski. you have to have at least one republican crack under the pressure of saying this republican is not qualified. if you're right, conventional wisdom goes through. i'm not sure anyone on the democratic side is willing to move on and say yes, it's over before it even began. >> well, i wonder, do you think the administration shot itself or shot republicans in the foot with this last-minute decision to, i guess the friday night document massacre is the way that the minority leader put it, by sort of handing the democrats another thing to go after him

with? >> no. i don't think so. it's like a -- from a standpoint of what's going on, this is performance theater at this point. people are trying to hope there's some sort of a silver bullet or a gaffe that happens, and republicans and the administration has already turned over a half million documents. there's not a lack of documents regarding kavanaugh. the bigger issue, this is where i'd be interested in the attitude of what happened with joe manchin? what happens with democratic senators in trump states in which we produced data, wp intelligence that shows they could lose their election based on this vote? so how does he vote on it? how do others vote? that's what's interesting to watch over the next few days. not if he's going to be confirmed. he's going to be confirmed. anything else is playing for the democratic base.

if they don't vote for kavanaugh, it could cost them a seat in the senate. >> i want to get in glen. i think kavanaugh is generally considered to be an incredibly smart guy, credibly accomplished. he seems to have in some ways been training for this maybe since he was a teenager. look, there is an argument to be made that the president of the united states ran on this. he ran on the supreme court. he told those crowds over and over and over again this is the kind of person that i am going to put on the supreme court. he already did it once. he's going to do it he thinks a second time. what argument can you make? >> well, chris, i don't think it comes as a surprise to anyone that the president has made good on his promise to nominate a -- sort of an ideologically conservative person and judge to be the next justice. and i agree with jill that one of the most important qualities in a justice is sort of faith

and allegiance to the law not to be sort of interventionist. and faith and allegiance to the law means both faith of the precedent of the supreme court and to the constitution. and i know we were all keenly interested when we heard that judge kavanaugh had ar tickulated that he didn't think a sitting president should be investigated or indicted. >> let me read something he wrote in 2009. congress might consider a law exempting a president while in office from criminal prosecution and investigation including from questioning by criminal prosecutors or defense counsel. it's inevitably politicized by the supporters and critics. what are we going to hear about that tomorrow? >> probably quite a bit. i know these confirmation hearings often sort of involve nominees trying to artfully dodge questions. let's hope we have a full and fair discussion about it tomorrow.

i think there are two important take aways from that statement you just read. one, judge kavanaugh, this was an academic writings and statements. they weren't in judicial opinions. even more importantly, if judge kavanaugh said that congress should consider passing a law to protect the president in this way, then what we can infer from that is that the constitution provides no such protection. and that, i think, is an important point, because congress has not passed a law to so protect the president, so if judge kavanaugh is going to be intellectually honest and i have no reason to believe he won't be, then his position should be the constitution does not protect a sitting president from a criminal investigation or an indictment. >> jo, i want to play part of what kavanaugh said himself in 2015 about the possible question of how would he fare as a supreme court justy in the era of donald trump? here's what he said. >> sometimes there's even

working the ref before the game is played. working the judge before the game with tweets and blog posts and trying to put implicit or sometimes explicit pressure on judges. we have to tune that out. we have to tune out the crowd noise. we can't be buffaloed, influenced, pressured into worrying too much about transient popularity when we're trying to decide a case based on long-term principle. >> so should that give people encouragement who are concerned about judge kavanaugh? do you buy it, jill? >> i don't. and i don't think it gives me any comfort. i think we need to have a full and fair hearing as was just said that would give us some real understanding of him, but i think that his judicial record shows that he does not abide by that. that when he has a principle in mind, he goes after it whether the parties have raised the issue or not, and that is of

concern, because i think we do need impartiality and no prejudgment, and judge kavanaugh has already prejudged so many issues. he has expanded on them, and, of course, the issue about whether the a president can be investigated leads me to think he should have to recuse himself in any case involving donald trump because of what he has already expressed as his opinion on the issue. and because he's being appointed by that very person, possibly for that very reason. maybe that's the reason that he out of all the possible qualified people, and when you say qualified, of course he has intellect. that does not mean he meets all the criteria for a supreme court justice which would include some equity to fairness. >> thank you all. the three chriss will be here throughout the hour.

in the meantime, joe biden was out and about this morning. he told msnbc in a live interview that everything is at stake in these midterms. right now he's the guest of honor at one of the biggest labor day parades in what will also be one of the most important swing states in 2020. we're live in pittsburgh, pennsylvania next. you're watching msnbc. i was just finishing a ride. i felt this awful pain in my chest. i had a pe blood clot in my lung. i was scared. i had a dvt blood clot. having one really puts you in danger of having another. my doctor and i chose xarelto®. xarelto®. to help keep me protected. xarelto® is a latest-generation blood thinner that's... proven to treat and reduce the risk of dvt or pe blood clots from happening again. in clinical studies, almost 98% of patients on xarelto® did not experience another dvt or pe. xarelto® works differently. warfarin interferes with at least 6 of your body's natural blood-clotting factors. xarelto® is selective, targeting just one critical factor.

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brian's back? he doesn't get my room. he's only going to be here for like a week. like a month, tops. oh boy. wi-fi fast enough for the whole family is simple, easy, awesome. in many cultures, young men would stay with their families until their 40's. >> mr. vice president, what's your message about what's at

stake at the midterms in. >> everything. it's simple. everything. we're in a fight for the soul of america here. >> that was former vice president joe biden. you saw him here live this morning just before he began marching in one of the biggest labor day parades in the country. this is the third time in four years he's appeared at what is billed as such a big deal. it usually draws huge crowds. 60,000, 7,00,000 people show up for that. mike asked him that question. there he is along the parade route. what else did the vp have to tell you? >> reporter: well, chris, first, i'm sorry. i couldn't get the vice president to come back and be with us live a second time. he's at the front of the parade right now where it's going to be wrapping up, but the parade -- the day doesn't end with the parade. the vice president will be stopping by a number of picnics that happen with the different labor unions and some of the candidates here. this is the kickoff for joe

biden and the midterm elections. he's going to be one of the most active midterm surrogates. his staff is working through a lot of requests they have. the question is what about 2020? i have had the vice president earlier was this an audition, perhaps, for 2020? >> i've known these guys my whole life. i'd go anywhere with these guys. these are the guys that brought me to the dance. >> reporter: what do you think of the president's reaction to mccain's death and his silence? >> everybody knows who the president is. >> reporter: so, chris, there obviously he's not ready to dip his toe into the presidential waters yet. but i know talking to his aides, they've been very much planning with the possibility of a campaign in mind. it's ultimately going to rest in the decision that the president makes along with his family

sometime after the midterms. as you heard him say earlier, everything is at stake in the midterms. then the question is about bringing the country together like what we saw in the past week with the mccain services. >> this is the parade that's going on right now? >> yeah. we're right in the middle of it. it's happening all around us. we got -- >> i just -- >> every labor union in the city. >> my hometown parade in ohio, they just have, like, random trucks driving down the street. that's part of the parade. i love this about america. these parades. and what's the temperature there? how are people holding up? >> reporter: it's humid. it's in the mid 80s. believe me, a shout out to my great crew here, jarod and don what are bearing with me. keeping up with the vice president and the parade. >> yeah, that's a job. mike, thank you so much. i know you'll be with us throughout the day here on

msnbc. the trump administration set to begin new trade talks with canada this week. that's something the labor folks care about. but trump's trade war is already hitting workers across the u.s. including thousands in milwaukee. that's the home of harley davidson. up next, we'll hear from harley workers. what they want from the president right now. you're watching msnbc live. let's begin. yes or no? do you want the same tools and seamless experience across web and tablet? do you want $4.95 commissions for stocks, $0.50 options contracts? $1.50 futures contracts? what about a dedicated service team of trading specialists? did you say yes? good, then it's time for power e*trade. the platform, price and service that gives you the edge you need. looks like we have a couple seconds left. let's do some card twirling

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we provide you the information so you will dig safely. an update on tropical storm gordan that's lashing south florida. it could be a hurricane by the time it makes land fall on the gulf coast. our meteorologist joins me now live. what's going on, michelle? >> this is strengthening fast. as of the latest advisory, it became a tropical storm. here are the statistics on gor don. it's southwest of miami. winds at 45 miles per hour. the hour bands gusting higher. southern miami, heavy rain and a rough day. here's the path for gordon. it's moving west, northwest at 17 miles per hour. by tuesday 8:00 a.m. 60 miles per hour. getting close to hurricane strength there. and then as it moves to the

west, northwest at 7:00 a.m. on wednesday, land fall. heavy rain along the coast. as we look at what's happening right now in terms of radar, we're looking at heavy rain bands. that's why we have tropical storm warnings in place along the western coast of florida, the southern part of florida, we're getting hammers. we'll see the heavy rain falling tuesday into wednesday. certainly watching this over the next several days. we could see flooding rains there. this is radar right now. we're looking at heavy rains. the darker colors, the yellows, the oranges, the reds, even lightning strikes indicating heavy rain. parts of southern pennsylvania, the case all throughout the day into tomorrow and the concern shifts off to the gulf coast. certainly something we'll watch over the next several days. >> michelle, thank you. it's trump versus trunka. trump taking aim at richard

trumpka after criticism. >> unfortunately to date the things he's done to hurt workers outpace what he's done to help workers. >> the president firing back on twitter saying trumka represented his union poorly on television this morning. it's easy to see why unions are doing so poorly. workers are raising concerns about the china and nafta negotiations with canada. right now milwaukee, wisconsin union members are marching in the labor fest parade. we're there. what are you hearing from folks about the impact of the president's trade policies and what is on fire behind you? >> reporter: yeah. this is the sign of a parade. i want to introduce you to iron workers local union float. this is a congressional

candidate, randy bryce. he's one of the union members. he's a democrat looking to take the place of paul ryan in ja janesville. labor fest is about to get started here. i want to introduce you to a union member here from the local member here. tony, what do you do and why do the trade tariffs, what is the concern for your line of work in milwaukee? >> what i do is i'm the business manager for iron workers local 8. i represent -- >> yeah. we've lost the microphone there. should we take a break? we're going to try to fix that, take a break, come back on the other side. we'll be right back. i don't keep track of regrets.

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trade war that the president has engaged in currently. i wanted to talk to tony. we're part of the iron worker's local union. tell everybody what you do and why do the tariffs have an effect on you? >> i'm the business manager of the local. i represent all the workers that go to work on a day today basis. what that recoveries from wisconsin in the upper peninsula in michigan. what we do is we erect buildings. we put machinery in. we do a lot of heavy lifting type of work. if manufacturers aren't ready to go out and produce products, our members are not going to work. >> because of the increased price of the steel? >> on a global level, yes. what i think will happen is any type of machinery you need to put into a facility is going to have to be made out of steel, and when it is, if manufacturers can't afford to purchase that new equipment, they're not putting up new buildings. >> thank you, tony.

chris, it's not only the likes of the steel workers. over the last several -- iron workers, excuse me. it's also the likes of whether it be the dairy farmers and the cheese producers, cranberries have been tariffed. this is the highest producing kren berry state in the country. you have tissue companies that have been tariffed. there's the question when you look at the lines of impact of businesses, it goes to harley davidson who is going to increase production overseas as opposed to in wisconsin. they're estimating about $55 million in losses because of the increased price of steel and aluminum here. >> thank you, vaughn at the parade in milwaukee. back with me chris wilson and chris kofenas. chris wilson, as i listen to the iron workers, and we've been talking to a lot of folks who feel the same way about the president's trade policies.

could this be a recipe for democrats winning black blue collar voters? >> time will tell. first, i am a free trader. i have a little bit of discomfort in terms of what is president is doing. having said that, you give credit where it's due. he's achieved success in renegotiating with mexico. i think there's a little doubt he's going to achieve success with canada and give us a better deal than what we had before with nafta, if it continues and i think you'll see the policies reverse itself. you'll have more free trade. it's the same success with germany which gives me hope he'll have similar success in europe. the one outlier is going to be china. china is not a free trade nation. others have free trade, so you're changing policies. in washington like everything trump does, there's a different approach. the rhetoric is different. the diplomacy is different. there's a lot of people who have made their careers on trying to

do what he's now achieved who have discomfort with it because they have this sort of -- the obama administration, let's be nice and hope real hard and maybe they'll be nice and cut the prices. that didn't work. this is working. it's like other things that trump does, it's just nontraditional, but when he achieves success, you have to give him credit. >> chris, whoever runs against president trump on the democratic side is going to have to win back voters in places like wisconsin, ohio. is chris wilson right? is the president making strides that will ultimately keep them on his side? >> well, i would say that he's -- the president is clearly trying to appeal to those blue collar voters that were critical for him to win in those industrial states. if you look at a recent pew poll among folks with lower income noncollege degrees, they favored tariffs and the president's

policies by about 14 points. it was 52 to 38 versus a significant swing the other way for folks with college degrees. there is a, if you will, a bias when you look at this issue, and this is why i think traditionally it has been a really powerful issue for democrats. the president is clear he trying to co-op this. i think it's one of the more complicated issues. at the same time you can have tough on trade, i think the president's policies because of his unpredictable nature of his negotiations, it's creating an instability on the market and economy that's not only adding inflationary pressure but hurting the workers he's trying to help. in terms of politics, this is where i think this issue becomes really complicating. i think democrats shouldn't see the ground of being tough on trade and tough on foreign actors when it comes to trade to the president or anyone else and the notion that somehow we should do that simply because the president is arguably acting

tough on trade is a very bad political strategy. >> we have more to talk about. stay with me. the next big test for democrats, jfk's old stomping grounds. i'll talk to people in the seventh congressional district. why this race is one the entire country will be watching, next. how can we say when you book direct at choicehotels.com

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tomorrow it's going to feature one of the most fascinating primaries of 2018. the massachusetts 7th in boston. it's one of the most liberal congressional districts in the country. donald trump barely got into double digits there. in this race, it's progressive versus progressive. what will make the difference when boston city council member faces up against the incumbent? here's the latest in my ongoing series, dems divided. >> wild turkeys are loose in one of boston's neighborhood. presley doesn't let it stop here from the job at night. >> i'm talking to voters. >> reporter: she's running for

congress, stunning the establishment to her challenge of the fellow democrat for the seat once held by john f kennedy. >> for those thinking we're doing something disruptive, good. >> reporter: her modern message delivered the old fashioned way. meeting workers on their way to work. and where they live. >> oh, come on, my fellow concord yan. >> reporter: a self-proclaimed hugger in an intraparty brawl. except unlike the other rising star she's often compared to, she's not running to the left of her opponent. >> i've been on the forefront of fighting the trump agenda from day one. >> there's no reason she should be running against you. >> reporter: there's also a progressive record. >> i don't know what could have been more disruptive than what i've been doing including the

support of maxine waters and others. everybody who runs will tell you they're the best. my job is to tell you what i do. >> reporter: but like new york's 14th, there's a potential to be a shocker because of demographics. a once predominantly white district, now majority minority. you and your opponent are alike on many issues. what's this race about? >> i think this requires us to be bold. >> my mother did not raise me to ask permission to leave. >> reporter: suddenly the massachusetts 7th has become one of the most watched races this year. a great microcosm of the rest of the country. >> is this the moment within the party? is it a party where the party

needs to be more representative? and how much does loyalty matter? >> reporter: key questions for voters in one of the bluest parts of the country. >> it's time for somebody who is going to bring a new perspective n. >> experience and seniority he'll have when the democrats take over in november. >> reporter: and since one has run unopposed for a generation, there are no reliable turnout models. meaning a typically dull midterm is now looking wildly unpredictable in boston. back with me, chris wilson and chris kafenas. this morning "the new york times" said capuano is in the political fight of his life. being a progressive is not a

reason to vote for someone. in a district like this that voted 13% for trump, it's part of the basic job description. she's arguing this is a minority/majority district and she reflects what this district is and where it's going. is that something the democratic party needs to look at? >> absolutely. >> will voters look at it? >> possibly. it's really tough in a district like that when you don't aim the at night, you've probably not had good polling. it's tough to poll in a district like that. what is the turnout model when you're talking about two progressive candidates? but there's a generational shift that happens in politics at various point. we're going through one right now in a lot of ways. we saw it in the last presidential elections. the desire for a new voice, a new direction. irrespective of whether they are that distinct.

i'm not sure there's much of a difference on the major policy issues between these candidates. >> no, then a they'll say that. in fact, when you talk to people who support each candidate, they have nice things to say about the person they're not going to vote for. so chris wilson, senator elizabeth warren was at a breakfast with cap uano this morning. >> you give democrats power in washington. you give us back the house and the senate, and democrats will be there for unions and for workers across this country. >> and yet this n this case with a 20-year democratic incumbent, she has not endorsed either candidate. >> profile is encouraged by senator warren. this is what we went through on the right in the republican party in 2010 and 2012.

they're having their own tea party revolution. there were a lot of people who lost their seats because they voted for bailouts, obamacare, but then you also had what you're talking about on the left with the democrats which was sort of an insider, outsider situation where people may have been the same but the outsider was able to beat the insider because they were the outsider. they had never run for office before. sometimes we recognized the mistakes. alaska lisa murkowski lost her primary but then won through a write-in situation. and some people have been nominated and are now becoming in the spotlight saying maybe that's not who we want as the face of the democratic party. even more interesting and what happens in the election tomorrow is the implications for 2020. does this mean that a white male can no longer be nominated by the democrats? what does that mean for a bernie

sanders and joe biden? i think the face of the democratic party is going to be defined by what's going on in these districts with the reelection of someone like ca capuono. >> yes. we have less than a minute left. we talk about the blue wave. if you look at the polls that have been done and what they show. presley crushes capuono with minorities and young people, but they traditionally don't vote. what is this going to tell us? do you think this is something to look at to say hey, maybe the blue wave is a real thing? those young people, those minorities aren't just going out and marching and holding signs but suddenly there is going to be a whole different model for who gets out and votes? >> i mean, i'm not going to read too much into a district that democrats are going to win irrespective of who the

candidate is. >> that would be more reason for people to not get out and vote. don't you think? >> i think there's two personalities. it's going to be the strength of their personalities and campaigns that determines whether they win. to the question of what are the indications of the blue wave. to me what's interesting is you see what's going on in texas, florida, where you have ted cruz in a conservative red state, really on the ropes, again, against a candidate that has come out of nowhere in terms of the generational shift democrats are trying to exploit. the american people want a different type of politics. it's playing out in texas, florida, arizona. this is why i think there's the strong possibility that a blue wave is growing. is it going to happen? it's still two months. i don't want to get ahead of myself. i would rather be in a democrat's position than a republican's position in november. >> we'll talk again i'm sure between now and then. thank you both. up next, the catholic church

divided at the highest levels. two living popes caught in the global crisis over child six abuse allegations. we'll have the latest from ro n engulfed brazil's 200-year-old museum in rio. firefighters and museum workers raced to save historical relics. investigators are trying to determine the cause. you're watching msnbc live. he was a cutie! and if you go down, that's me, above him. you won best looking in your senior year of high school? somebody had to win it. my best high school moment was the day i walked across the stage. my dad...couldn't read real good, so, it was a milestone for me. ancestry now has over 300,000 yearbooks from all across the country. so go back to school with your family, and discover more of their stories. start searching for free at ancestry.com.

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there's been a dramatic new twist in the scandal with the catholic church. donald wuerl confronted by parishioners as he asked for prayers by pope francis. he's been facing calls to resign since a scathing grand jury report reveal abuses during his time as head of the pittsburgh diocese. more from keir simmons. >> reporter: this morning, infighting at the highest levels of the kath clicatholic church. two weeks ago, pope francis was charged without evidence of covering up for mccarrick that he sexually abused minors nvd adult seminarians for decades. now archbishop vigano who made those accusations against the pope is questioning the ponts i pontiff's honesty.

he was the papal ambassador during the pope's high-profile trip to the u.s. in 2015. during that visit, pope francis met with kim davis, the controversial county clerk from kentucky who was jailed for refusing to issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples. according to "the new york times," a chilean abuse survivor said pope francis told him he did not know who kim davis was prior to the meeting and felt vigano was trying to sabotage his trip to the u.s. telling cruz, i was horrified and i fired that papal ambassador. over the weekend, firing back saying the pope was lying. claiming he allegedly had briefed pope francis ahead of the meeting. others in the church questioning vigano's motives. >> no question that archbishop vigano is a disgruntled employee. now most whistleblowers are disgruntled employees so we had to investigate what he had to

say and look into it. >> reporter: other catholic leaders are also taking heat for the abuse scandal rocking the church. cardinal donald wuerl heckled during a sunday mass. >> shame on you! >> reporter: wuerl served as the bishop of pittsburgh and was accused in an explosive grand jury report of mishandling clergy conduct. >> i ask for your prayers for me for forgiveness in any of my errors of judgment, for any of my inadequacies. >> reporter: for today, keir simmons, nbc news, london. also this morning, "the washington post" has an in-depth look about how pope emeritus is firing up those who aren't fans of the sitting pope. here's the headline. pope benedict in retired seclusion looms in the opposition to pope francis. one of the reporters on that story, "washington post" rome bureau chief chico harlan joins us from rome.

this was a fascinating article where you suggest that in some ways, just having apope ameritus is emboldening them. >> this was talked about at the time pope benedict abdicated. we were seeing the church push into unprecedented territory. no playbook for what an ex-pope should do. you had a remarkable stylistic difference between benedict and his successor. and benedict has made, i would say, a very calculate and concerted effort to withdraw from public life. and to avoid these problems best as he can control. based on what we know. still, he has become kind of, i guess you can say, a flag or gathering point for some segment of traditionalists who look to him almost the way you might --

you would see republicans or democrats look toward an ex-president with this mix of nostalgia, but also this sense that maybe on the inside of the vatican walls there is a guy who believes as we do. they don't know it, but they really think it. >> of course, pope francis continues to face criticism. some people believing he's not done enough in the face of a sexual abuse crisis in the attorney general's report that came out in pennsylvania. is the pressure building so that there actually might be something more from this pope, or is it going to be status quo? >> i'm writing about a story on this -- on these lines right now. >> give us a preview. >> the preview is that what we can say is he's under more pressure than probably at any other point in his papacy to do something. and it's not just uttering statements or revealing details. one interesting thing to look at is that the u.s. bishops have been considering calling in an investigation. vatican led with the help of

some lay members into how this cardinal, theodore mccarrick, was able to rise up as people presumably turned a blind eye. now what would it be like for the vatican to investigate that when there's a not-so low likelihood the fingers could point right back at the vatican. what do they do? release documents the way some are hoping. do they make major reforms? there are all these questions coming up. and i would say that, you know, how the hope addresses the details and facts of this letter is just one in a long list. >> fascinating stuff from "washington post" rome bureau chief chico harlan. thanks for being with us today. >> okay, same. thank you. thank you for watching this hour of msnbc live. have a great labor day holiday. coming up right now, more news with kasie hunt. >> good to see you. good afternoon to all of you. happy labor day. i'm kasie hunt in washington, d.c. we start with the supreme fight.

tomorrow, one of the most cons kwen consequential hearings of the trump presidency. what can they do to fight the supreme court nomination of brett kavanaugh. trade war politics. the president gearing up to rework one of our biggest trade deals, nafta. so far, not off to a great start. how it will affect people in key states like wisconsin to vote come november. and biden is back. what he said in a pittsburgh parade about his own political future and his message for the democrats ahead of the midterms. >> we're in a fight for the soul of america here. it's about time we restored dignity into work and start talking to each other like we're civilized and deal with one another with respect. >> we start with the politics guiding this week's supreme court nomination hearings. brett kavanaugh's missing paperwork as well as his opinions on abortion