ucla, unr, washu and usf right here. we appreciate your hospitality. you've all been great. we're back in new york next week. until then have a great weekend. in the meantime, "deadline white house" with nicolle wallace starts right now. i love katy tur. it's 4:00 in new york. amid new evidence that "washington post" columnist jamal khashoggi was killed inside the saudi consulate in turkey, the trump administration doubles down on its relationship with the kingdom. u.s. treasury secretary steve mnuchin announcing today that he still plans to attend an investment conference in saudi arabia while other media companies and businesses cut ties with the kingdom until it offers more answers. this is "the washington post" reports that the turkish government has tapes of the killing of "the washington post" columnist. from the paper, quote, the turkish government has told u.s.

officials that it has audio and video recordings that prove "washington post" columnist jamal khashoggi was killed inside the saudi consulate in istanbul this month. that's according to u.s. and turkish officials. the audio recording in particular provides some of the most persuasive and gruesome evidence that the saudi team is responsible for khashoggi's death. but turkish officials are wary of releasing the recordings fearing they could divulge how the turks spy on foreign entities in their country. those officials said. and while members of congress propose sanctions in blocking weapons sales to the kingdom, donald trump stays focused on the bottom line. >> well, we have -- it's not our country. it's in turkey, and it's not a citizen, as i understand it. but a thing like that shouldn't happen. it is a reporter with "the washington post." and it's something like that should not be allowed to happen. i don't like stopping massive amounts of money that's being poured into our country. i know they are talking about

different kinds of sanctions, but they're spending $110 billion on military equipment and on things that create jobs, like jobs and others for this country. i don't like the concept of stopping an investment of $110 billion into the united states because you know what they're going to do? they're going to take that money and spend it in russia or china or some place else. >> and brand-new reporting on trump's longstanding business ties to saudi arabia dating back to at least the '90s, including, quote, in 2001, trump sold the 45th floor of his trump world tower in new york to the kingdom of saudi arabia for $4.5 million. and in his own words, trump makes clear just how much he likes the saudis. >> saudi arabia, and i get along great with all of them. they buy apartments from me. they spend $40 million, $50 million? am i supposed to dislike them? i like them very much.

>> here to help us sort through it all, ann guerin, one of the reporters on the story surroundisurround ing khassogi's disappearance. also phil rucker and robert jordan is with us today. he's now diplomat in residence at smu and author of the book desert diplomat, inside saudi arabia following 9/11. ann guerin, i want to start with you. you and your colleagues have done extraordinary reporting on the disappearance and what we believe to be the gruesome murder of jamal khashoggi. take us inside what you're reporting. >> thank you. what we're trying to find out is what exactly the turks have in terms of evidence of what happened inside the consulate. and what's going to happen to

that evidence as this case moves forward. the turks have been speaking in -- not in official capacity about things that they say they know happened inside the consulate. and as you alluded to at the beginning, those things are gruesome and point, unfortunately, to jamal khashoggi's dealt. we do not know for certain he is dead. we know it's been well more than a week since he went into the consulate. he's not come out. there's no evidence he ever came out. no evidence he's been heard from in any way, electronic or in person since he went through those doors. so the saudis have some explaining to do about what happened inside the consulate. and where this ties in with the u.s. administration is that we believe that the turks have now shared a fair amount of what they say they know with american

officials. and the question then becomes, what do the americans do with that information? >> anne, you and your colleagues reported on what appeared to be u.s. signal intelligence, intercepts that shows that u.s. intelligence agencies were aware of, they overheard or learned of conversations that revealed the saudis intended to lure khashoggi back to saudi arabia for the purposes of detaining him. do you have any reporting on how high up that intelligence went? >> we do not know for sure at this point. and i should say that it is a different thing to say that americans were aware of the potential for a saudi plan or hope to bring khashoggi back to saudi arabia, which he was a national of. and for them to lure him to a consulate in a third country and kill him. those are very different things.

and at this point, we do not know that the u.s. had any advanced knowledge at all or even a whiff of it that this might be in the works in turkey. but nonetheless, if u.s. officials did know that khashoggi was sort of in their sights, so to speak, then that raises a question of whether it would have been a good idea even if they're not legally bound to do so, to have tipped him off. >> phil rucker, i want to ask you about some of the sound where donald trump says it's not a citizen. interesting approach. other presidents, democrats and republicans, have used the office of the presidency as a beacon for the protection of human rights around the world. i've never heard any past president describe a human as an it. and i've never heard any past american president talk about human rights abuses, which if

the turkish account is true, at a minimum, that's a generous description of what happened to mr. khashoggi, if it's as the turks describe. and any readout from inside the white house about the president's tone and posture on what could be the gruesome murder inside that turkish consulate of "washington post" columnist and american green card holder. >> i, too was struck by that statement and an alternative might have been he is a permanent u.s. resident which is the case. he works for "the washington post." the president has been pretty cautious the last few days about what he said in part because his administration has banked the future of its mideast strategy on saudi arabia. they see saudi arabia and its young crown prince who is very close to jared kushner, the president's son-in-law, as a linchpin in the strategy to counter iran and to bring about peace in the middle east and investment deals in terms of defense arms sales to saudi

arabia. this is a key component of the administration's strategy. it's the first country president trump visited on a foreign trip last may when he arrived with a grand reception. the sword dance, the fighter jets streaking through the sky, the red carpet and so forth. president trump has been very careful. he doesn't want to criticize the sau saudis until he has conclusive evidence that they executed the u.s. resident journalist. and the evidence is coming in, and it looks like this is what happened, but the president seems perhaps unconvinced at this point or perhaps he's taking the advice of those around him to just tread carefully and be wary of making any broad pronouncements or declarations about saudi arabia at this hour. >> ambassador jordan, i heard you say something that stopped me in my tracks. we're grateful to you for spending time with us this afternoon. this incident is more than a bump in the road. it's a category 4 or 5 diplomatic hurricane, one we'll

not get over easily. could you expand on that thought? >> sure. i think this is the worst moment in u.s./saudi relations since 9/11. i arrived in saudi arabia as ambassador a month after 9/11, and the question then was, are the saudis friend or foe? i think we've got similar questions going on right now. is this a regime that is descending on a slippery slope into authoritarianism, thuggishness and perhaps rogue behavior. we've got to seriously ask that question. i think the time has come for us to stand up and show some leadership on this issue. and, yes, it is, i think, a potentially serious rupture. now let's all remember we do need saudi arabia in fighting terrorism, in maintaining a posture against iran and other ways to be our ally. but it doesn't mean they have a blank check. and i think the time has come to

make that clear with the red line here and making it clear also that we're going to exercise some leadership in the region. >> a former u.s. government official described the difference between the trump administration's posture with saudi arabia and other administrations again, democratic and republican presidents who sought to do what you just described to have a functional and productive relationship with saudi arabia as being in what you just described, the lack of a backstop. that all there is, is love fest. all there is is projecting donald trump's name on the wall of a fancy hotel. all there is is the seeming transactional nature and spirit of donald trump and jared kushner's feelings toward saudi arabia and had its roots in their business relationships and it extended into a very shallow foreign policy. can you tick through the dangers of our posture with saudi arabia at a moment when saudi arabia is engaged in an extremely controversial war in yemen, at a moment when our relationships across our closest and most

reliable allies are strained at best, ruptured, your word, at worst. talk about the dangerous position we may be in terms of the shallowness of the trump administration's relationship with the kingdom. >> it appears the crown prince maumd bin salman has at least in his mind been given a green light to engage in any kind of behavior in the region that he wants. especially in stifling dissent. let's not forget that a year ago at the ritz-carlton, mbs' cousins, uncles and others were incarcerated with a number of saudi businessmen and shaken down for about $100 billion. this is the same ritz-carlton which they are now proposing to have this conference on october 23rd. i can't imagine a worse optic than having american officials participate in this pageant that they have orchestrated. >> can i press you on that, ambassador? do you think it's a mistake? secretary mnuchin said he'd be

attending that pageant as you just described it, and the saudis have gotten very good under this new young leader at pageantry. they came here and put on an american pageant. they took the american media by storm, the tech industry, hollywood. do you think it's a mistake that secretary mnuchin today announced he would still attend that conference? >> it's a big mistake. and my hope is that members of the private sector will take a lead from people like richard branson and others and decide not to go. the last thing we need is jamie dimon, schwartzman, david petraeus and others giving speeches to glorify this regime at this time. i think there is a great danger that this regime will fall into disarray. many of the senior members of the royal family have got to be aghast at what has occurred. and there may well be a question now as to whether this crown prince is suited to become king. >> ambassador, are you concerned having served as an american

diplomat in saudi arabia, can you talk about the messages sent by an american president in terms of what an american president says about the prerss what an american president says about other dictators, other thugs. john mccain thought kim jong-un was a thug. president trump has nothing but praise for him. others have described the young crown prince the way you have, but never donald trump. can you talk about serving as an ambassador when the american president says things about the american press, calls them enemies of the people and lavishes praise on dictators? >> well, it certainly encourages that kind of authoritarian behavior. during my time under president trump george w. bush, he developed a positive personal relationship with king abdullah. i spent time with them at summit meetings in crawford and sharm el sheikh egypt. the two genuinely liked each other but also when president trump had a hard message to deliver to king abdullah, they

would respect each other and king abdullah would pay attention because he spoke with authority. i think we're losing that sense of authority here, and we're governing by sound bite, governing by tweet and certainly leaders around the world are going to roll their eyes and do what they want to do at this point. >> tim o'brien, i want to turn to the president's financial ties to saudi arabia because it -- there's extraordinary investigative journalism. you've done a lot about if about donald trump's businesses. then there's donald trump in his own words saying i like them very much. i've sold them $40 million, $50 million apartments. "the washington post" reports in early 2017, a lobbying firm working for the saudi embassy reported spending $270,000 on food and lodging at trump's hotel in downtown washington. the general manager at trump's hotel in manhattan's central park west said after two down years, revenue had gone up. one reason, general manager prince sanders wrote, a last-minute visit by the crown

prince of saudi arabia. >> you know, the post and david and o'connell did a nice job parsing. there's two separate sets of issues. there's donald trump going broke in the early 1990s, and he sells two of his prized assets. his yacht and a landmark hotel, the plaza hotel, to one of the wealthiest saudi investors. trump had to sell it. the banks needed to unload those assets. bin telal is one of the sheikhs who the crown prince put in a brief imprisonment. you have to wonder if that long trajectory what was on donald trump's mind. the second set of issues are the more recent financial relationships. they bought an entire floor of trump world, of the trump world plaza for their mission of the

united nations. more recently they've been patronizing the hotels and all of this reflects back on the issue that dogs the administration. are they making good public policy or doing things that pad their wallets? that raises the specter of jared kushner who has been trump's lead ambassador to the middle east and especially to saudi arabia. there's been speculation as to whether the people who were put in the hotel and imprisoned by the crown prince, if he got those names from u.s. intelligence sources that jared kushner passed along to him. what was kushner's goal in doing that? kushner at the time that he was lobbying both sources of money in the middle east, china and russia was desperately trying to bail out a skyscraper the family was in debt for on fifth avenue. trump himself would be very hard pressed to locate most middle eastern nations on a map. they've been full bore on -- >> i've gon that movie before. i know how it ends. >> this is all coming back to

haunt them. they've got conflicted, an appearance of conflicts and possibly the reality of conflicts in everything they're doing there and they're in over their heads on foreign policy. >> let me pick up on one thing you said and ask phil rucker. this question of sharing intelligence, not understanding what u.s. intelligence is, this is something donald trump has done. he shared with the russian foreign minister sensitive intelligence. i believe it was israeli intelligence. but there are questions -- are they running around trying to button down -- are they trying to get their hands on a fact pattern, whether it's trying to understand what u.s. officials knew about the saudi crown -- as anne gearan points out, detaining khashoggi and lurg him back to saudi arabia is different from dismembering him in turkey. are they trying to understand what the president knew and when he knew it and what jared knew and when he knew it? are they trying to follow the chain of command of what the intelligence agencies knew about the crown prince's designs on khashoggi? >> we at "the washington post" are certainly trying to get

answers to all of those questions and do not have them yet. it's difficult to piece this tombline together. and i'm not confident that the u.s. government, as of right now, has a complete timeline in terms of what happened at the consulate, what was sort of picked up when and what they knew about this plot as it went along. it's unclear, for example, as anne gearan was saying at the top of the show whether those intelligence intercepts the u.s. had reached the highest levels of the government. whether the president's intelligence briefer shaird that information with him or with jared kushner or with john bolton, the national security adviser if it reached that level. we don't know that yet. we'll perhaps soon find out and that will provide a lot of information for us to determine whether this was something that the government sort of let go on without intervening in any way. >> mr. ambassador, let me ask you, does the act as described by the turks of luring khashoggi to the consulate, murdering him

after torturing him and dismembering him is that the kind of act that would take place without the crown prince's knowledge? >> absolutely not. this is not a bunch of keystone cops out on a freelance operation. he had to have known about it. >> mr. ambassador, we hope you'll continue to join us and share your insights. we're grateful to have you. anne gearan, thank you for your reporting. and phil rucker, as well. is robert mueller finally getting his interview with donald trump in writing? new reporting that says his lawyers are working on answers about donald trump's ties to russia. and the georgia governor's race heats up amid charges of voter suppression and a brand-new lawsuit. the race is a dead heat. and how do donald trump's public appearances this week in the face of a deadly hurricane and a growing diplomatic crisis stack up in the history books? we'll ask an expert to weigh in. stay with us. a wealth of perspective. ♪ a wealth of opportunities.

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donald trump's lawyers have reported the received written questions from special counsel robert mueller and a source familiar with the matter tells nbc news the legal team is currently at work preparie inin answers. but pay attention to the wording of the report. you won't see the word obstruction anywhere. the questions are focused on the issue of whether the trump campaign colluded with russia during the 2016 presidential race. however, the source stressed these questions are a refined version of questions that have gone back and forth between the two sides for months. back in april "the new york times" published dozens of questions mueller wanted answered. most had to do with obstruction but there were a few on collusion. questions about the trump tower

meeting the miss universe pageant, the sudden rnc glat form change that made it way more favorable for russia, trump's business interest in russia and a few about wikileaks and julian asage. trump was asked yesterday about the prop of an interview with the special counsel. >> mr. president, there's no collusion, but there's no conclusion either. so -- >> that i can't help. >> are they intentionally laying out now, and is there anything -- and have you thought again about sitting down for an interview or written questions or any type of hybrid approach there? >> well, it seems ridiculous that i'd have to do it when everybody says there's no collusion, but i'll do what is necessary to get it over with. >> joining us is former u.s. attorney joyce vance and with us at the table, the rev al sharpton, host of "politics nation." president of the national action network. and careen jean pierre. joyce, let me start with you. why would the mueller team be allowing written responses and

written answers. do you think they're trying to button things up or more with them viewing him as a target? what's behind the mueller side? >> it's really interesting that they seem to have bifurcated the inquiry that they are insisting on an interview on obstruction but they've submitted some questions or at least so we've been told on this issue of collusion. we have to remember that everything we know about this comes from trump's lawyers. we have no idea if this is the same way that mueller's team views what's going on between the two sides. so it's important to keep that caveat in mind. but this looks like it's just a way of keeping the dialogue going. written answers, they may give some interesting bright line distinctions like, no, i didn't know anything about collusion, but they really won't be worth much more than the paper they're written on in terms of evidentiary value. >> it seems like, though, joyce, what they could be inching toward is trying to have something on record. we know they have binders and

binders of transcripts from the dozens of people who have already been through and answered questions about contacts with russia. they have paul manafort as a cooperating witness who has told them we would expect everything they want to know about how that platform change went down in cleveland at the republican convention. they may or may not have spoken to don junior. they've spoken to paul manafort. they have other people who have answered questions about everything on that list. the trump tower meeting. michael cohen who has pleaded guilty and is cooperate with anything and everything the federal government wants to do vis-a-vis donald trump. it would seem even written answers could trip up someone like donald trump. >> so i think you're right. there are two reasons that law enforcement likes to speak with witnesses or with people that are involved in an event. one is to get information. they have plenty of information here. the other is to create accountability for people involved in criminal act. the best way is by having someone testify under oath in a

grand jury, and if they're lying you can prosecute them for perjury. i don't think written questions will have exactly that same force, but i suspect these questions will be very carefully designed and there will be an effort to create some accountability. by the same token, the president's lawyers know the game being played here and they'll be careful to put a lot of caveats and possible outs into anything they submit in writing for the president. hard to see whether this will give mueller the sort of evidence he'd need to move forward against the president, if that's what he has in mind. >> it's so interesting that we've arrived at this place, not because the president has been exonerated in any way, shape or form. we've arrived in this place because everyone around the president said publicly what they've said to him privately which is you can't meet with mueller because we know you'll lie. >> i think that should be very disturbing to the american people. that even his closest advisers and lawyers are saying that we

afraid that you don't have the capacity to tell the truth. so why risk it? lawyers usually say be very careful. don't talk without a lawyer. but to say don't talk at all, that you are beyond our even prepping you should frighten the american people. >> and this is -- the president's legal team, there has been turnover. there's been disagreement publicly. ty cobb and john dowd. most have forgotten who they are, except for the political junkies among us. one thing they all agreed upon, john dowd says in bob woodward's book. he said woodward reports that john dowd, the president's former lawyer in the russia investigation said he's a bleeping liar. he couldn't testify because he's a bleeping liar. he's made perfectly clear that the president will never sit down for an interview. i'm told it's because he doesn't think he could get through it

without perjuring himself. >> then you hear from the prrkts i can do this. i'm happy to talk in front of -- to mueller and his team because he thinks, in his mind, he thinks he can get away with it because he's this entertainer kind of go-getter and company man. >> salesman. >> that's the word i'm looking for. but i think for me, hearing the story, it really dives into how it's going steadfast. it has been quiet, right, because -- >> they don't leak. >> they don't leak. and it makes you think, what's going to happen after the midterms? will it be the winter of mueller? it's quiet but they're moving and they're getting in there. and so the other thing, too, that's really interesting, as joyce said, all of this is coming from the trump team. so we don't really know. we have to have a little bit of a caveat there. so what's going on? is there really collusion? is mueller -- does he have more

collusion than we think? is he done with the obstruction? is that all tied up? and so he's moving on to something else. it does bring up a lot more questions than answers. >> you are one of the rare people who has dealt with donald trump under oath in a legal capacity. talk about donald trump under oath. >> his lawyers have very good reason to believe he's a pathological liar. we deposed him for two days in december 2007. i was at "new york times" at the time. he sued me for a biography i wrote about him. he had to sit with my attorneys under oath. and in the process of that, we caught him on more than 30 occasions having lied about various aspects of his personal life, his business life and his public life. i think his lawyers look at a document like that and they know they have a disaster on their hands. the last thing they want to do is have donald trump sitting in a room live with bob mueller because it won't go right. not only will he probably purger

himself, he also can't help but self-agrandize. the last thing you want a witness doing under oath is bragging because it goes into areas you don't want the witness to go into. that's the first problem. the second thing is that i think the mueller investigation has more parts to it than we understand. there's a silo that's probably about collusion. there's a silo that's definitely about obstruction. and there's possibly a third that goes to high crimes and misdemeanors. getting into financial transactions, quid pro quos around issues with russia. and mueller head given indications through subpoenas and witnesses that he's looking at all three of those but nobody knows what he's going to pursue specifically. >> joyce, i'm told by a source close to the president that the thing that unites emmitt flood, don mcgahn, rudy giuliani and some of the president's legal friends outside the white house is they'd all lay their bodies down and said over our dead body will donald trump testify. what do you think the approach is to the answers? do you think he's even involved

or are they being drafted for him? if he were a normal person is that allowed? can you perjure yourself in written answers? how does someone like donald trump respond to written questions? >> this is a lot more like interogato interogatories than like the way the criminal investigative process works. i've never used written questions to a subject or a target in a criminal case simply because they never balk at talking to the fbi and if they do, you send them a subpoena and they end up in front of the grand jury. this procedure has no antic antt in criminal practice. i think that would not be his skill-set. >> you made me laugh with the word serious, joyce. >> i go back to that tape you played at the start which i've heard several times now where the president is saying,

everybody is saying that there's no collusion. and he doesn't seem to realize that it's not everybody who is going to make the call here. it's going to be bob mueller and a federal grand jury. so his responses could ultimately be important, but you know, prosecutors rarely talk to targets in front of the grand jury. it's not unusual to not have that testimony. they don't need it. >> it's a great point. everybody is nobody and bob mueller is everybody. the georgia governor's race is one of the closest races in the country. and today democrat stacey abrams is calling on her opponent brian kemp to resign over reports of voter suppression. we'll bring you that story next. e psoriasis or psoriatic arthritis, little things can be a big deal. that's why there's otezla. otezla is not an injection or a cream. it's a pill that treats differently. for psoriasis, 75% clearer skin is achievable, with reduced redness, thickness,

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i say merry christmas and god bless you. i strongly support president trump, our troops and ironclad borders. and i stand for our national anthem. if any of this offends you, then

i'm not your guy. >> that was brian kemp, georgia's secretary state of and the republican candidate for governor there. he's currently overseeing the election he's trying to win. now he's being sued by a coalition of civil rights groups who say the method his office uses to verify new voter registration is discriminatory. here's how "the washington post" describes it. the exact match law requires election officials to flag and pause any voter registration application if the identifying information doesn't precisely match the voter's information in existing records. even because of something as small as a missing hyphen or transposed number. although voters are not barred from casting a ballot they must take extra steps to verify their identities. take a look at who this is affecting. an investigation found there are more than 53,000 applications on hold at kemp's office. and 70% of those belong to african-americans. georgia's population is about 32% black.

kemp's opponent stacey abrams is demanding kemp resign from his post as secretary of state. but time is running short. georgia's deadline to register is tuesday. the midterms are in 25 days, and they are locked out in a tight race. abrams and kemp are statistically tied right now, according to a poll released yesterday. the panel still here. rev, this seems like it's not even voter suppression disguised as something else. >> no, this is blatant. first of all, you should never have the secretary of state who is over the voting process remain in office in any election that he's in. but on top of that, to have this guy kemp decide on how they are going to put, quote, on hold, people's registration and then 70% of them are black, that was researched by associated press. not one of the civil rights groups. this is the associated press.

and none of the plaintiffs. this is -- on top of that, to have kemp in charge of the process, it is as tainted as you can get. >> why wouldn't he recuse himself? >> the only reason you wouldn't recuse yourself is because you want to have this advantage, and you want to be blatantly out there saying, i'm going to do what i want, even if we have to change the rules. even de santos said i'm going to leave what i'm doing in congress and run against gilliam in florida. this guy kemp has not even done that when he is directly involved in the voting process. so he would -- i mean, jim crow would blush if he would see this guy kemp. >> it seems to me that we talk about the trump effect. one of the effects of trump seems to be this disregard for, we don't know that he broke the law, but disregard for the norms. the norms is if you're the secretary of state and you're

running, you'd recuse yourself perhaps from that election. >> and he's -- he tried it a couple of months ago with the closing of the polls. and he lost there. so it's been a constant thing with kemp. he's not stopping. and the race is really close. stacey abrams could potentially become the first black woman elected to governor in a southern state, which goes -- plays into the new south we've been hearing about. but i do want to step back for a second. this voter suppression has been going on across the country since the -- since 2013 when the voting rights act was gutted. and we saw this in 2016 as well in north carolina, even in wisconsin. there were voters disenfranchised, and they were people of color. so this is a new play by republicans since 2013, and it's unfortunately very successful. the one thing that was really great to see is in alabama. alabama had a voter i.d. law but they came -- they got over it, right? 98% of women who came out, black

women who came out and voted. and they were able to educate people and let people know, this is what you do if you are turned away to vote. >> sometimes i lie in bed trying to decide if the trump administration is more sinister or more incompetent. i wrestle with it until i fall asleep. i never really land on an answer. it would appear that trump and jared kushner are trying to have a position on criminal invest reform. they're trying to play in that space if you will. it would seem that having someone running under the banner as a republican operationalizing the disenfranchisement of 70,000 african-american voters would be in direct contradiction to his efforts to play in the space of criminal justice reform. the white house could call this guy. he mentions the president in his ad. why doesn't the president call him and say back off. >> let me relieve you of your burden when you go to sleep. next time you can say it's both incompetent and sinister. >> is it a tie?

>> i don't think you have to choose between the two. where they are on prison reform is largely driven by jared kushner being outraged about how his father was treated when he went to prison. it's a very narrow space of this. in both voter suppression and this isn't just voter suppression. this is racially charged voter suppression and jerrymandering. you have the undoing the 20th century's efforts to get rid all of these heinous abuses of the 18th and 19th century. donald trump has opened the door to people being comfortable wearing racially charged machinations or raw racism on their sleeve because of the way he responded to charlottesville. because of his own history in new york and elsewhere of using race as a very divisive tool and self-aggrandizement. this isn't even about partisan

politics, these issues, or ideology. it's about who we are as a country and what's a civilized way to discuss these issues. and the extent to which trump personally and the people around him have torn that up. >> kanye west dropped an f bomb in the oval office while thousands of residents of the florida panhandle picked through the wreckage of their homes and lives. donald trump talked arm sales when asked about the disappearance of a u.s. resident at a saudi consulate. and fox news stopped carrying maga rallies. was this week one for the history books or more of the same in trump's america? we'll try to answer that question, next.

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i've heard a lot of names. i've heard ivanka. how good would ivanka be. the people that know, there's nothing to do with nepotism, but i want to tell you, the people that know, know that ivanka would be dynamite. elizabeth warren. oh, i hope she runs. i hope she runs.

then we can finally get down to the fact as to whether or not she has indian blood. her mother says she has high cheek bones. i could go on all night but i want to get the hell out of here, okay. because i thought i was coming to iowa. and i say this, and i mean this. the democrats are the party of crime. that's what's happening. they are the party of crime. >> it's not our country. it's in turkey, and it's not a citizen, as i understand it. he can speak for me any time he wants. he's been a great guy. a smart cookie. smart. he gets it. >> in case you missed any of that, kanye west is now permitted to speak for the president of the united states. ivanka is great but donald trump doesn't want to talk about nepotism. elizabeth warren's high cheek bones say something about something and he was mad he wasn't in iowa. michael beschloss is here to help us sift through the week that was. he just released a new book that is amazing and remarkable.

i'll admit i haven't finished it. it's called "presidents of war." you're here to do what rachel does for me every night. you're the tower. talk in this landing. what happens next? >> oh, what happens next is, i think we're looking back at this week historically. i think there's a possibility that what will loom above everything else is this seeming atrocity that happened in that saudi embassy in turkey. you know, for the first year and a half, there's been the shadow over donald trump and his administration about whatever relationship he's had with the russians which we should know even more soon as mueller begins to speak, presumably after the elections. there's a possibility that there will be similar scrutiny now to the relationship between donald trump and the saudis. and you have to assume that if the democrats are elected next month, at least in the house, and have powers of subpoena and investigation, they may begin to look at that relationship in a way that will not necessarily do

the president a lot of credit. >> i agree with you, but i want to press you and i want to understand why you think it's the case. do you think it's because donald trump set a tone as the american president where reporters are enemies of the people, where dictators are lovely, great, wonderful people with a lot of promise, or do you think it's in the transactional nature, that even as president, his public statements often blur the lines between his business dealings, his condo sales and u.s. -- >> absolutely. all of those. all of those things. as usual, you've said it perfectly. all i can do is agree. and the other thing is that, you know, we've got to know how much of this huge, closeness between trump and the saudis is because he had this business relationship that goes back many years and maybe hopes of doing even more business in the future whether as president or after his presidency. but, you know, what he said in the oval office when someone asked him about what happened in turkey and he said it's not our country, what other president in

modern times would respond to something like that? would ronald reagan with his views of human rights have said something like that? it shows you how far we've come from other presidents for most of our modern time. >>times. >> we talked about that, at the beginning of this show, that he didn't, i mean just the dehumanization of the columnist, of jamal khashoggi, he called him an it yesterday. and you think back george w. bush ended his presidency with an approval rating in the 30s and i appreciate a lot of people didn't appreciate his foreign policy but no one questioned his valueses. >> no one doubted his commitment to human rights and freedom around the world. i can't imagine him saying something like that. or sending his secretary of state as planned to a financial conference, in the country which, you know, was involved in the incident we're talking about. president bush would not have done that. >> we gloss over the

obliteration of norms. they're usually headline, people handing us papers. the development of the mueller investigation. the outrageous statement of a country. and talk about the obliteration of norms. they were people, they were still looking for survivors and rescue missions under way in the florida panhandle yesterday, a battleground state with this politically craven president and donald trump had kanye west in the oval office yesterday. where are we? >> we are in a place where the president doesn't feel he needs to show that he has any empathy for people who are suffering or any sense of responsibility to get them out of their predicament. you know, yes, it is symbolic, symbols have meaning. for a president to have a political rally while those people are suffering down in the track of hurricane michael, and for the president to have that meeting with kanye for reasons that god knows what, i can speculate about those, not exactly the most serious incident of state craft that has taken place in the history of the oval office, the message

that senlzs is -- sends is i'm not taking these serious things seriously. that's what a president is supposed to do. >> it is such a good point. you mentioned the desk. and every time i see it. and maybe you can give viewers a history lesson. it is not that he chose to do something light. presidents have to balance the lighter aspects of their job, christmas party, entertainment, figures, who are important to american culture, with the more serious ones. it is this president's capacity to be tone deaf 100% of the time that made this kanye meeting so weird. >> and not only tone deaf, but you and i know, he has people around him who will tell him, mr. president, maybe that's not a good idea to do that, it is going to send a bad message, it is not going to help you. and obviously, he has discarded that advice. it shows a degree of lack of sensitivity. lack of empathy, that i can't think of with other presidents. and you wanted me to say one thing on the resolute desk.

>> please. >> that goes back to the 19th century. it was a gift from the british. frank roosevelt used for the fireside chat, jackie kennedy brought it to the oval office, every president has used it in the oval office almost unendingly except george h.w. bush and the result is, it is a reminder of the way other earlier presidents had behaved. so when president trump sits at that desk, with kanye west, and has a conversation like that, it shows him eagerly and conspicuously and defiantly flouting the traditions of the presidency that most americans feel strongly about. >> picking up the traditions of the presidency, what worries you the most about the early stages that we're in of this crisis with saudi arabia, that we may be in bed with a leader in saudi arabia, we may have made such a big bet on mbs, that we don't have the kind of leadership on the world stage to have any more

moral high ground to seek justice for jamal khashoggi. what are your concerns in terms of sort of the string of what presidents normally do and the position has enlisted in right now? >> everything that you and i might have said about donald trump's meeting with vladimir putin in helsinki, that he didn't seem to care about what putin did, and repeatedly gives an idea he doesn't care about putin's invasion of our elections, you know, other things that the russians have been doing around the world, that defy human rights, we are hearing the same kind of language from donald trump about saudi arabia. and that's going to have very big consequences. and the main one is i think at base, anyone's objections to donald trump, should not necessarily be ideological. people should feel they can agree or disagree but where he is different from all other presidents is on the question of democracy. is this a guy who is going to use his power as president to

dismantle certain basic pillars of our democracy in a way that may change this country conceivably forever, and one of those is for a president to react to something like what we've heard happening in turkey, what we've heard happening with russia, and say basically, i don't care, you know, america no longer stands for morality and human rights in the world, we're just going to let it be a war of all against all. >> i don't sleep anymore, so i should be done with your book by the end of next week. i hope you will come back and talk about that. >> that is so nice. i would absolutely love it. thank you very much. nice to be with you. >> nice to have you. >> thank you. and we will sneak in the last break. don't go anywhere. we'll be right back.

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hurricane michael has finally moved out to sea, but the historic storm has left its mark on the southern part of the u.s. at least 13 people are dead. more injured. and thousands of homes and businesses have been destroyed. roughly 2 million people lost power. hurricane michael will go down in history as the fourth strongest hurricane to make landfall in the united states. before we go, i just want to mention, politics nation is moving to a new time, 5:00, saturday, and sunday, and what have you got planned? >> i have senator corey booker tomorrow, for the first show, 5:00, saturday, and sunday, i am going to break down on how donald trump orchestrates things, with a lot of people miss, and you and the white house, and why was kanye west allowed to bring his cell phone into the oval office? no one is allowed to do that. so did they know some of what he was going to do yesterday? and did they help to accommodate

that? because he should have had not had his cell phone there showing pictures aside from dropping the f bomb. >> is that typical donald trump, constant stage craft. >> stage craft, i think donald trump is still, when you look at kid rock, you look at kanye rock, you still think he is booking artists for atlantic city casinos he ran, rather than running the united states. >> and we all know how that ended with. and kasie hunt is in for todd. hi. >> if it is friday, which way are the midterm winds blowing? good evening. i'm kasie hunt. in washington. in for chuck todd. welcome to "mtp daily." with 25 days to go, how baked