your fbi director said this was no hoax. he doesn't have that in him, and i hope the american people see that. you don't have to hand somebody a script to tell them to sympathize with people who have kids in the house and somebody just sent a pipe bomb to the house. >> as good a place to stop as any. thanks to kelly, jason, peter, a.b., jonathan. that does it for us. hi, chuck. >> that's kwiquite the lead-in there. thank you. good evening. i am chuck todd in washington. breaking news amid chilling new developments in a case that now involves at least 13 explosive devices targeting democrats and trump critics. a press conference at the justice department in washington wrapped up just a short time ago. officially announcing that cesar sayoc, a 56-year-old from aventura, florida, basically north of miami, with a criminal history dating back to 1992, has been arrested and charged with

five separate federal crimes connected to the assembly and mailing of those 13 bombs. today we learned that he has mailed devices to democrat senators cory booker's office in new jersey and kamala harris' office in california. sayoc is facing up to 48 years in prison. authorities did not discuss his motives at this afternoon's press conference, but folks his van and social media profile paint a person who trafficked in pro-trump and anti-media propaganda. his van was adorned with stickers reviled by the extreme right. some of his actual bomb targets were featured on his van as well. not just hillary clinton. that included the obamas, eric holder, cnn. numerous political and media figure that the president and conservative media have attempted to single out, including some at this network, including some at this table.

sayoc's twitter profile shows him attending trump rallies, cheering on chants of "cnn sucks" and posting conspiracies about the clintons' quote murder list. he liked pages called kill george soros. facebook has taken down the kill george soros page. as of just a few minutes ago, the kill all socialists page was still up. as i mentioned, both the attorney general and the fbi director were careful to dodge questions this afternoon about his motivations. >> why was he starring democrats -- targeting democrats? >> i don't know, other than what you might normally expect. he may have been -- appears to be a partisan. that would be determined by the facts as the case goes forward and i am not able to comment on that. >> reporter: that nasty political rhetoric might motivate someone predisposed to

violence might act out? >> we are concerned about acts of violence under any motivation. >> an uncomfortable debate about the state of our political rhetoric and the president's role in it. just this morning as investigators were actually closing in on sayoc, the president seemed to suggest that these bombs were a hoax designed to slow gop momentum heading into the midterms. it's a a conspiracy theory that his own justice department today totally debunked. some of his supporters have embraced it. the president spoke to reporters as he left for rally in charlotte, north carolina. he was a bit defiant. we will dive into the politics in a moment. the latest in the investigation. pete williams is at the department of justice. jim kavanaugh, msnbc contributor, clint van zandt, former agent and profiler, former assistant united states attorney for the southern of

district of new york also. pete, let's start with the investigation. i assume they are interrogating him now. i understand he is not being very cooperative. what more can you share on that? >> reporter: so, no and yes. they are not interrogating him now because he isn't being very cooperative. they questioned him under the exigent circumstances exception to the miranda rule. that's used in bombing cases like this where they don't have to give a miranda warning. they can still admit what he says if they are trying find out if there were other devices. he won't say, they are telling us, so they are not getting much out of him. that's one of the reasons why, you were talking earlier about motive, they don't know. at this point that's not the point of the criminal investigation. the point of the criminal investigation is to find out who did it. the why may or may not matter in the long term in the criminal case, although it may be important in the political realm. what they say is a very interesting detail, that just yesterday the fbi managed to

isolate a fingerprint on the envelope of one of the packages that was addressed to congresswoman maxine waters. the one that was intercepted at a congressional screening, mail screening facility in maryland. that fingerprint, they say, matched a fingerprint belonging to sayoc. his fingerprints were in the federal database because he has a criminal past in florida. secondly, they say, they found dna material on devices inside some of the packages, which they describe as a potential match to his dna, which they also have because of the previous criminal conviction in florida. so based on that, they say, that's the reason they got the probable cause warrant to arrest him. they are not learning much more from questioning him. you can be sure that they will soon search that van that you saw being hauled away today, that you saw the police and federal agents surrounding it and hauling it away. apparently, he was living in that van. he had lived in the past with his mother in gated community,

but most recently he was living in it. one of the big questions is, where were those bombs made? they will be going over that van in extreme detail, looking to see if they can find any evidence related to the case, and then of course they will be looking at his phones, his computers and seeing if that yields any evidence as well. >> he will not say right now if there are more bombs that were mailed, correct? and if that's the case -- >> reporter: correct. >> how confident are authorities that they have got, that at least nothing more is in the system? >> reporter: they don't know. i wouldn't say there is a high degree of confidence on that. there is a high degree of confidence no more will be going into the system they believe because they think he is the only one involved. now, they haven't completely ruled out whether he had help. but they say, basically, he's the guy. >> jim kavanaugh, christopher wray in his press conference says the bombs contained

energetic material that can be dangerous if subjected to the right combination of heat, shock, or friction. now that you have gotten a little more details about these devices, and i know you haven't been able to personally inspect them, how is he planning on detonating these things? you have a better understanding of that. >> reporter: craw. that's a lot of fancy bomb talk. i mean, they think it's an explosive material or incendiary material. it's a material that's going to burn or blow up. it's going to, you know, it's going to act when it's subject to shock, friction, or heat. that's just like dynamite, c-4, low explosive pattern. we get into a lot of fancy bomb talk. ieds. that was our inside baseball talk for 40 years. so it's fancy bomb talk. it's a bomb. it's a homemade bomb, basically. that's explosives or incendiary material. the first charge, i just read the complaint, the first charge is 18 usc 844 d. this was the bread and butter

statute of atf. the interstate transportation of explosives with the intent to injure, kill, or intimidate. under that statute, you just have to profits an explosive material. interstate transportation of explosives with the intent to injure, kill, or intimidate, clearly they were used interstate. this is coming from, i'm sure, the u.s. attorneys who hover with you during the complaint. these are the charges that they can easily prove right now. the intimidation. 1114 is assault on a federal officer, including mr. brennan, the president. if you shoot a federal agent, that's the same statute. so these are easily provable. the mailing statute. so it's smart. it's smart money what they went after, and the fingerprint. that's the solid evidence backed up by the dna. of course, his motive. motive all over the van, chuck. these cases, it's all over the

place. >> well, let me go to the profile of him. clint van zandt, you essentially, this feels like it fits exactly the profile you thought. a little bit older, loaner, white male, that sort of thing. he sort of ended up fitting the profile you were hinting at? >> we were talking. we suggested no more than 24 to 48 hours after we last talked that he would be in custody. so i think the authorities have been able to carry that off for us. this guy, he is going to have a psychiatrist who is going to work with him and talk with him. i think one of his relatives has hit the nail on the head. he describes this guy as a loose cannon, a lost soul who lived in his vehicle, who took showers at the local gym. he shot himself up with steroids. he involved himself with male strip dancers. you know, when you look at the

mentality of this guy, and again we're trying to understand if there was anybody else involved, it's hard to imagine anybody else would want to associate themselves with this guy. and so i think he could be fully capable of doing everything that he's charged with. realize that just this year i looked back on the internet. i found individuals who have built 20, 30, 40 pipe games that atf and local police had columb 1999 this almost 100 pipe bombs they had built. so there is a strong possibility that there are other devices out there. and i think, as jim and i are talking about, the question is where was he assembling? did he have a bomb factory inside of his van? was he using another location? that's one thing the authorities are still trying to find. are there bombs in the system? are they delivered someplace else? this investigation is not over with. it's not a slam-dunk case, but i

tell you and what. you have physical, you have psychological, you have investigative evidence on this guy. he is not a rocket scientist, but he sure scared the hell out of us this week. >> mimi rocca, why is he not being charged with attempted murder? >> well, i think as many people have said, this is a quick hit. these were the easiest charges to bring now. they are good charges. they are strong charges. attempted murder requires a level of intent that they just don't need to show right now. so why are you going to put that into a complaint? if i were betting i would say this is not all the evidence they have right now. certainly not all the evidence they will end up. this investigation is ongoing, and i think there is going to be a lot more evidence gathered. my guess is it's not all the evidence they have right now. they don't want to put all their evidence in the complaint because they don't want him to know what they have, especially if they were trying to question him. he is not talking?

fine. that's his right. you know, they are still going to get more evidence. my guess is they will be able to show that intent. frankly, even if they don't, these are significant charges. he is eligible to be charged. he is being charged here in the southern district of new york. but there are other counts that could be brought in other districts. he is facing a heck of a lot of time in prison as is. >> he is probably never going to see the light of day as a free man? >> i would guess that's right. >> jim kavanaugh, talk to me about this interrogation issue right now. he is not being cooperative. he won't say how many more he made. he is not being helpful here. obviously, i know you have run into this before. clint, you have run into this before. starting with you, jim, give me some ways you think, you know, in your experience how long it takes to crack somebody like this. >> well, in the first part, as a commander on a case like this where the guy is not talking and i am worried about more bombs, what i am going to be doing is driving the agents into his

computer because i want all the purchase records of how many of these digital alarm clocks did he buy and how many do we have? how much length of pipe did he buy and how much do we have? and how much, you know, we will get a search warrant. i want you in there with a tape measure measuring that pvc pipe in the garage. i want to measure -- we know how much is in the bombs and how much is left and how much isn't and how many timers did he buy? do we have them all? are there two sitting on the bench and he only bought 15 and we have 13 bombs and two on the bench? i will feel better. i will be driving that first. like mimi said, look, i kind of always like these smart-alecky guys who want to be the tough guy and all that kind of stuff. you know, some of those guys really are not that smart because you got so much evidence on the guy. you really don't even need him to talk. i mean, you have his fingerprints, his dna, his bomb

factory, motive on his van and targets. okay, fine, don't help us. it's not necessary. there is many cases where, if the guy doesn't talk, you can't get anything. this is not one of those cases. but the main focus of the fbi, the atf, the postal inspectors, the police, is public safety. driving it in, is this the end of that bomb campaign. that's what they have to drive today. >> and, clint, profiling him and maybe his associates, obviously they want to see not necessarily obviously want to see if he had any help, but i assume they will try to talk to anybody he interacted with on a regular basis and find out more about him and see if any of his associates are helping him? >> yeah. they are going to put together a wiring diagram of this guy based upon his cell phone, based upon his credit cards, his activities on the internet. realize this is a guy who used five, if not six, different

aliases to post on the internet. but again to get a chance to talk with him, this is someone who has spent the whole week trying to get our attention. now is the time, you know, if we get a chance to toalk with him, we say you have tried to get our attention all week. you've got it. you have one chance. you can tell america why you did this. you don't want to be written off as some nut, do you? you have done it for a reason. tell us what that reason was. meantime, we will be looking at his vehicle, his license plate. we will look at every time he has passed any type of license plate reader. we are going to be following his credit cards. we are going to see why his iphone has beeped at the last month or two. there is going to be this tremendous map that will be laid out and it's going to follow every movement he's made, walking, driving, talking on the internet. so we can put all of this together and see what this guy's life has been like the last now months, maybe the last few

years. but realize this is a guy who like 15 years ago got into an argument with somebody with the power company and said, oh, if you don't do what i want, maybe i should throw a bomb at you. so for at least a decade and a half he has been thinking of bombs as a conflict resident la resolution method. >> you guys were credible partners all week long. frankly, you took us to this midnight and, frankly, foreshadowing almost to a "t" who this person would be. mimi, thank you for the legal perspective. it's going to be in your court soon. for now, thank you all. pete williams had to start working on the news. much more on our breaking news ahead. 11 days until election day. a weir of fear, loathing and lies on the campaign trail. now this? how does it play? we will be right back. failure l? ♪ the beat goes on. it looks like emily cooking dinner for ten.

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d welcome back. president trump is on his way to a political rally in charlotte, north carolina. he briefly spoke to reporters at the white house before he left and said he bears no responsibility for the alleged mail bomber's actions. take a listen. >> no. not at all. no. there is no blame. there is no anything. if you look at what happened to steve scalise, that was from a supporter of a different party. you look at what happened on numerous of these incidents, they were supporters of others. >> reporter: could you do something differently in the way you ep gauge? >> no, i don't think so. i think we are running a great campaign. the republicans had tremendous momentum and this happened where all that you people talk about was that, and rightfully so, it was a big thing, rightfully so, but now we have to start the momentum again. i think the republicans have tremendous momentum when you think of young kavanaugh, when you think of all the things that have happened, and hopefully we

are going to go on to a great victory. i could really tone it up because, as you know, the media has been extremely unfair to me. >> reporter: how? >> and to the republican party. i think the media has been very, very unfair in terms of the republican party and the way it's been covered. >> that just happened. joining me is geoff bennett, nbc news white house correspondent, hugh hewitt. of course, an msnbc contributor. i am not surprised that that's -- as always, he said the quiet part out loud. >> it's a well established ritual at this point. the moment is called for president trump he does it up to a point. he read from scripted remarks today. he called for an end to political violence in the american discourse. and then as his eyes and mind strayed from the teleprompter he

painted himself as a victim of political hostilities. he asked a rhetorical question, who has it worse than me? you saw on the south lawn the president speaking to our kelly o'donnell suggesting he has no role to play in any of this. we saw the white house, before this florida man was apprehended, they telegraphed what their strategy is, to say the president is no more responsible for someone doing something like this than bernie sanders was given the shooter in the congressional baseball field shooting was a bernie sanders supporter. >> i find that to be -- that's fine. i think that's accurate. but then the next step. >> yes. >> which is, you know what? some people may misinterpret my hyperbole. >> here is where i am going to d disagree with the president. i was sick last week so i listened it a lot of cable. the insinewation that the president would like or encourage violence was omni press ent.

i have one standard. it was articulated. angry obsessives are dangerous. everybody in politics has to do with a mind towards the angry obsessive -- we see them in the rallies. i don't want to park next to those vans. >> you are like, no. >> six lanes over, please. but that a part of our political landscape. i think the president reacting there is very simply the honest reaction of someone who thinks he has been fingered wrongly for the male stripper steroid enrag enraged crazy guy in florida. >> it's hard for me to believe any other president would have acted that way. that's all. you may believe everything -- he may feel all of those feelings. >> but still. >> the inside part on the outside. >> a couple of things on this. in terms of what jeff said, he never gets to the point where he follows the traditions, the conventions of how you expect a president to act, i think it's more than that.

he never does the right thing regardless of what the traditions and conventions are of being a president. he never does the right thing. he never takes a higher road. there are two former presidents that were targeted with pipe bombs. i can't -- i have worked for both of those presidents. i can't imagine either one of them not calling and checking on someone, making sure they are okay, showing empathy and concern. we got none of that from this president. and who i appreciate you are trying to throw everybody into the same bucket, but that's an impossible thing to do. this president has incited violence. he has, you know, people at his rallies, he talks about punching people in the face. he throws people out. you know, this is how he won the presidency. the politics of fear. there is no equivalent in the democratic party. >> there is a man screaming in a restaurant at -- >> screaming at a restaurant

does -- >> 18 u.s.c. 51 -- >> we can talk about that. we are talking about the president of the united states. are you saying you don't -- >> incendiary behavior -- >> agree this man has -- >> one standard. incendiary behavior by any public official -- >> i will make sure that nobody screams at a democratic rally "lek 'em up" or -- >> what about the guy in mcconnell's face? >> for screaming -- >> and throwing his food? >> i think it's wholly inappropriate. nobody should act that way. i think you're right. nobody should act that way. that is a constituent or whatever you want to call him, not the president of the united states. >> susan collins getting an envelope with ricin? >> right. that's wrong. >> it's everywhere. >> i want to say -- >> but who do you think incites that violence the most? >> doye not blame the president at all. >> you don't blame -- >> everyone uses this rhetoric these days, especially -- is no, they do not. >> yes, they do.

>> and don't you agree there is a different standard for the president of the united states -- >> there is a -- >> wouldn't you want your president to have a -- >> and jeff might have been there with the young black kids who were all at the white house when -- >> all right. i'm going to play a clip from that. clip number one. take a listen. >> we must never allow political violence to take root in america. cannot let it happen. and i'm committed to doing everything in my power as president to stop it. and to stop it now. stop it now. >> and if that was the period, i think it would be a strong point. and then this happened. >> i get attacked. i think i -- maybe more. maybe. maybe more than anybody. i don't know. i can do the greatest thing for our country and on the networks and on different -- it will show

bad. they will take it back -- it's fake news. but they will -- no matter what, i won't use examples. today is just sort of a very special day because we caught somebody that hopefully that will all pan out to be 100%, but it probably will. >> putting the bomb stuff in quotes this morning. he's got to change something. >> you know, actually, i thought that second quote was perfectly fine. he has an audience there -- >> he is playing to the audience? >> and it's political -- >> this is a good day do that? >> i think what happens now is if the media continues to attempt to link this to trump that his hardcore supporters get harder and their vote turns out more solidly. if democrats could control the networks, they would walk away because if they pile on to the president as being culpable for this angry obsessive, david french piece again, they will add to his -- >> that checks out. part of the reason the president

reacts like this is because it's not sort of in his dna to accept sort of the pass torell aspects of the presidency. he believes it works. he believes he is at his political best when he is on the attack, on the offensive, doing battle with enemies whether real or perceived. in this case one of the perceived enemies is a news network who woo network who was on the receiving end of one of these pipe bombs. >> look, the interesting thing is the supporters and how is this going to play 11 days out. interesting sound. this is outside some supporters that we talked to outside of his rally today. >> just because somebody has a trump sticker on their car doesn't mean they are a trump fan. you know? he could, you know, it doesn't mean nothing. >> barack obama probably -- hillary clinton probably saying hers to herself. >> reporter: you don't think these guys sent these? >> no, probably not.

>> reporter: why not? >> they probably had it done. they may have paid him to do it. >> there is radical people on all sides. there can be people that are problem creators. they create problems like people on the left can create people on alt-right create them. >> i think i heard something about it being bernie sanders supporter, you know. there is so much news going on right now that people don't know what to believe. so they stick with what they know. >> to my friends in the conservative movement, weigh as a trump supporter and he sent the bombs. there isn't any doubt. nor is there any responsible republican to say anything other than that. >> well, that's not exactly true, hugh. there have been over the last couple of days lots of republicans who have said that this is some sort of a hoax. and -- >> i want a name. >> and -- >> i want a name of a responsible republican who said that. >> well, one of the president's sons was re-tweeting a lot of

tweets who said that. >> there were a couple of them in the eastern -- candace owens one of them. lou dobbs on fox news suggested this was a hoax. the president today on twitter putting bomb stuff in quotes. >> the bomb in quotes goes to what chuck was talking about in the first segment with our experts. the bomb talk rather than go there, it's an explosive device. bomb is explosive. i don't think anyone should underplay the threat was taken for real in the white house and in fact what ray said and jeff sessions said is what every responsible republican said which is we will find, prosecute, convict and imperezen for life. >> my fainal question. here is what i concluded from this conversation. this incident is not going it tamp things down. it's going to make it worse. anybody disagree? think it's going to get worse? >> you know, i don't know that you can make it worse. the way you make it worse is for one ever these bombs to actually go off, and that would be a real tragedy. i think at moments like this you count on your president to tamp down the rhetoric and tamp down

the raw emotions across this country. unfortunately, we don't have someone who can do that for us. >> i think the feedback loop and where the president responds it our coverage and our coverage responds to him, that adds to the polarization and that makes it worse. >> this is the trap we are in. the media, our job is to cover the president. we don't do anything. it's not our fault he keeps doing these things. we cover the president of the united states. stay with us. up ahead mainstreaming the extreme. the cycle of american conspiracy theories. ♪ he'd be proud of us. a family business should stay in the family. see how lincoln's insurance solutions can help protect your family, your business and everyone who counts on you, at lincolnfinancial.com

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welcome back. something president trump said to "the washington post" this week. quote, there is no proof of anything, but there very well could be. okay. that could be the quintessential trump bait-and-switch. admit there is no evidence that criminals and middle easterners are part of that caravan. toss the stink bomb out there. richard hoffstetter wrote one of the most influential essays. in it, he wrote that paranoia and politics wouldn't matter so much if it only affected emotionally disturbed people. but he added this. it is the use of paranoid modes of expression by more or less normal people that makes the phenomenon significant. that was written in 1964. today there is an entire media

ecosystem devoted to amplifying and mainstreaming the extreme. birtherism, voter fraud, new jersey celebrating 9/11, the climate change hoax, liberal mobs. a conspiracy virus is being spread not just by the likes of rush limbaugh and alex jones, but by the man at the top. every one of those discredited claims has been pedaled by the president of the united states. does he believe them or is he cynically exploiting the fear of his supporters? i don't know. there very well could be. so, that goal you've been saving for,

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could you tell us plainly why was he targeting democrats? >> i don't know. other than what you might normally expect. he may have been a part -- appears to be a partisan, but that would be determined by the facts as the kay goes forward and i am not -- case goes

forward and i am not able to expound on that. >> we know the suspect posted photos of a trump rally he attended and his van was covered with pro-trump stickers and a lot of sort of anti-media and democratic politicians stickers. nine years ago there was a controversial federal report that was warning of the dangers of right wing extremism. according to the author, the economic down turn in 2008 going into 2009 and the election of the first aventura african president present -- it created a firestorm on capitol hill the. darrell johnson wrote that report as a senior domestic terrorism analyst for the department of homeland security. mr. johnson, thanks for coming on. >> thank you, chuck. >> so you have seen today's news. is there any part of your report that you wrote in 2009 that, if

law enforcement had it today that might have prevented this? >> i don't know about preventing it. we sounded the alarm in 2009 that due to the economic downturn and unprecedented election of having the first african-american elected this would serve as a decrout. boom for extremist groups on the far right. anti-government groups, white supremacists, people that don't want to be u.s. citizens, sovereign citizens. >> this was -- the report was criticized, some republicans on capitol hill thought it was ene encroaching on speech to say what's wrong with criticizing the president. what line did you draw between normal criticism versus extremism? >> there were two points of criticism. one was the fact that we pointed to returning military veterans coming home to a downturn in the economy, not getting the health care that they deserved, and

that they may be susceptible to revu recruitment by the groups. they would actually be targets of recruitment because of their military training and leadership. so that was one controversial point. the other, as you pointed out, was the vague definition that we had buried in a footnote that talked about, you know, people that opposed abortion and illegal immigration and were anti-government in general. taking that definition out of context, i could see where there was confusion, but within the scope of the document violent extremism, criminality, terrorism. that's where the message got lost is when that mischaracterization occurred. >> for about four, five years during, let's say, sort of the rise of, as al qaeda was broken up and saudisis formed and thers a concern about radicalization of muslims in the united states,

economically challenged muslims in the approximate middle eamid like you were trying to sound the alarm here. is there radicalization concerns that -- is there a specific group we should be worried about today? >> there certainly is. there is a wide variety of groups. when we look at domestic terrorism, we are talking about groups on the far fringes of the right, hate-based groups, anti-government groups. then we have those on the far fringes of the left like the anarchists and antifa. answer rights extremists and eco terrorists and anti abortion extremists. we have individuals that radicalize here in the united states. >> what are some of the tools -- i guess what are best practices to try to de-escalate, to try to keep more folks from being radicalized, whether it's this gentleman here or the crazy guy

that shot steve scalise? >> the government has been looking at this problem for a number of years. there has been a number of recommendations put forward, but none have really been put into practice. one is counter messaging. going out there. when someone is embracing a conspiracy theory that is totally untrue, to challenge that and to show the counter points to that and how that belief system isn't plausible or logical. so that was one thing. but the emphasis of this administration as well as the previous administration is to put resources and training, faith-based leaders in the muslim community to try to identify those who may have more radical views and to report those people to the fbi so that they could be monitored. >> is that a program that now we should be considering more than just in muslim communities and worrying about international terrorism? >> right. and so we come to 2017 and we're starting to realize that we need

to have some of these, you know, federal dollars going it organizations to combat the non-islamic extremists here in the united states. we actually had one organization called life after hate that was supposed to get a grant of several hundred thousand dollars. this organization or actually people who have left the white nationalist movement and realized all of the deception and all of the falsehoods that were in that movement. and so they set up an organization life after hate hoping to reach out to those disaffected white nationalists who are on the fence or may have vulnerabilities, to pull them out of the movement, and the funding was pulled in 2017 by this administration. >> this issue of nationalists is a buzz word. is that a trigger word with some of these hate groups? >> it certainly is. it's a term that has morphed recently. we used to call them separatist.

white nationalism is a term they use to dismiss the hatred and bigotry that is at the center of those things. >> the issue of social media being so pervasive, it seemed to me that all of the programs that i remember looking at and studying and reporting about to try to combat this isis propaganda, they didn't work. they really didn't work. so is social media just something that's almost impossible to combat when it comes to conspiracy theories? the far end of am radio was easy to isolate in the '70s and '80s. it's not easy now. >> yeah. certainly the advent of the internet and the technologies associated has compounded this problem and it has actually brought the extremist messaging into the privacy of people's homes. so, you know, a couple of decades ago when i was studying these movements, you actually had to go to a kkk rally on someone's property or, you know, know somebody within these

movements and have face-to-face interaction. nowadays people can come across this extremist propaganda and anti-government conspiracy theories in the comfort of their own home, privacy of their own home, and have anonymity. >> if you were asked to write had report today, would you change anything in it? >> i would not change anything. mine, obviously, we have had, you know, several attacks, you know, auto yeyear after year. i guess i would have a lot more examples to cite to back up the analysis. >> darrell johnson, i will leave it there. thanks for coming in. up ahead, a heated battle over civility. one of the most hotly contested senate races in the country. we'll be right back. ♪ ♪

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we got to turn down the temperature. >> obviously, that last voice was missouri's democratic senator claire mccaskill. last night was the third and final debate. they called for more civility in politics but neither showed much for each other, especially twhe it turned to president trump. >> we shouldn't be setting an example of the leader of the most amazing nation in the world thinks it's okay to lie all the time. i mean, just lie after lie after lie. >> have i supported the president? you president. i think the policies are good for the state. >> president trump won missouri by more than 19 points two years ago. remember when missouri used to be a swing state? we will find out if it still is. polls show it neck and neck with a slight haadvantage to holly. more "mtp daily" after the break.

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running a great campaign. people love what we're doing. they love what we're saying. the republicans had tremendous momentum and this happened where all you people talked about was that and rightfully so. it was a big thing. rightfully so. now we have to start the momentum again. i think the republicans have tremendous momentum. >> he also did a tweet similar to that. he says republicans are doing so well in early voting and this bomb stuff happens and the momentum greatly slows. republicans go out and vote. you thought this could galvanize republicans. i have to tell you, a ran into a voter. he was very acute in arizona, of all the places. who seem to like some of the president's policies and not the rhetoric. that's the voter i'm curious how

they react. >> it's a good question. the president, is nothing, if not transparent. he views everything through a political lens even an assassination plot and he is saying this bomb stuff has distracted from the republicans political messaging. i'm not sure how this will play. she he seems to think cast thanksgiving as a fight with the media works for him. >> i brought up arizona. here is martha mcsally asked about this. take a listen. >> can we talk about the things that matter instead of repeating the arizona democratic party press releases. it's ridiculous. do you have anything to talk about like the caravan or job opportunities. >> how would you, stephanie, play this in the last 11 days if you were working for a democratic candidate. how would you talk about this issue with voters? >> i think i would talk about this as a vacuum of leadership

and we need to send real leaders to washington and an argument for change. what you can see that show showed is they are desperate to get back to the immigration issue. >> it was working. >> i guarantee you he will try that at his political rally tonight. for them, there's a boogey man. donald trump has set the tone. you win politically by creating a boogey man. by running with the politics of fear. if i were working on a democratic campaign, i would talk about there's a better way to run this country. we don't have to demonize everybody to get what we want. that means good health care, protecting pre-existing conditions. new and better jobs. bringing the country together. i would not ignore the question about the vacuum of leadership and if i were running against

mcsally or somebody else, they're marching in lock step with donald trump. they might rally their base but those bases are set. you got to demonstrate some leadership to pull others over. >> there's a suburban voter, white, college, educated independent man. that didn't like how kavanaugh was treated and started to shift in one way. they have been hearing a lot at home and i don't like that tone either. how would you talk to that voter if you were martha mcsally. >> people who don't show up, secretary pompeo show up to talk a about china and prescription drug prices. i would go back to the issues that trump is delivering and winning the economy, economy. i would hope the democrats do, as we came into this show, nicole was talking to reverend al about impeachment.

that suburban voter, they don't want to hear that. >> i don't think you see democratic candidates out there in these competitive districts talking about impeachment. >> it's a cable news phenomenon. >> it's not something part of the democratic platform. there's a federal investigation going on. eventually we're going to have to talk about whether the president is going to be indicted or something worse. >> he's not stopping any of these rallierallies. it's going to be fascinating. he will say something at every rally that will trigger a reaction. it's like how could you do that here. is he going to run towards the flame or away. >> it best crystallizes the pitch he's making to his supporters about this whole immigration issue at large. to your point, he's trying to reach the establishment republicans who aren't as motivated by or driven by his

cultural pitch by talking about this middle class tax cut that he invented out of thin air but saying it will be a resolution. a resolution duh not make legislation make. he want them to go to the polls with a tax cut on their mind. >> a very lively panel. thank you for being that. disagreeing without disagreeable. we'll be right back. i landed. i saw my leg did not look right. i was just finishing a ride. i felt this awful pain in my chest. i had a pe blood clot in my lung. i was scared.

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is always tony's top priority. proposition 11 "proposition 11 is a vote to protect patient safety." it ensures the closest ambulance remains on-call during paid breaks "so that they can respond immediately when needed." vote yes on 11. over what this means begins. president trump lashing out at opponents, free press and complaining that this severe security scare could hurt his party's election chances. a comment drawing rebukes from all sides. an unusual message from a president, any type of president, on a day that would be a triumph of federal and local law enforcement activities. the authorities arresting this prime suspect in the series of explosive devices that were sent to cnn. 56 cesar sayoc arrested, a