going to win the election? i said, you get more votes than the other person. it's as simple as that. >> that's quite not that simple. you've got to give or take about 3 million votes. that's how you win. good morning and welcome to "morning joe." it's thursday, november 1st. joe is off this morning but along with willie and me, we have mike barnacle, susan delpercio, john pedoritz and jim van dehei. a lot to talk about now. five days from the midterm elections, president trump is doing everything he can to define the debate. yesterday, he tripled the estimated number of u.s. troops that he wants to go to the u.s.-mexico border to the number

of 15,000. more than the number of troops in afghanistan. you're talking about 10,000, maybe 15,000 active duty to the border, more than we have fighting isis in syria? >> it's very important. we have to have a wall of people, very highly trained people, terrific, dedicated patriots. that's what they are. you have cough caravans coming up that look a lot larger than isser reported. i'm pretty good at estimating crowd size and they look a lot bigger than people would think. >> despite holding more than 60 votes to repeal the affordable care act, including one followed by the celebration in the white house rose garden last year, the president continues to make claims like this tweet. quote, republicans will protect people with pre-existing

conditions far better than the dems. a complete lie. in illinois, former vice president joe biden responded. >> you have the president of the united states saying we guarantee you or whatever his phrase was everybody is covered with pre-existing conditions is covered. simply not true. they're either not telling the truth or they're really stupid. >> at the president's campaign rally in florida last night, which burst into a chant of lock him up about tallahassee mayor andrew gillum, the president reduced birth right citizenship which experts consider an explicit passage of the constitution to, quote, a crazy policy. and falsely argued that democrats support no border enforcement. >> tha vote for democrats is a vote to liquidate america's board ers and it's a vote to let

meth, fentanyl, heroine and other deadly drugs pour across our boarders. >> and this was this promise from the president 12 days ago. >> we are going to be putting in and are studying very deeply right now around the clock a major tax cut for middle income people. >> what was your time frame for that? >> i would say sometime around the 1st of november, maybe a little before then. >> a reminder, today is november 1st. nothing. finally, the president made this argument for his party next week. >> if the midterms for some reason don't do so well for republicans, i think you're all going to lose a lot of money. i hate to say that. i think you're going to lose a lot of money. >> so willie geist, he's flailing all over the place. whether it's racist-based

policies. i'll put quotes around that because a lot of what he's saying that has racist tones to it isn't even possible. and i don't even know where to again in terms of describing a president who wants to put 15,000 troops the size of the troops in afghanistan or less to a border to receive a caravan of men, women, children, babies, that is not even close to the border at this point. >> well, he wants to put america on a war footing on this side of the border. there are 14,000 troops, as you pointed out, in afghanistan. give or take. so about the same number, same deployment as he's looking for there. words are cheap. the tax cut was out there a week ago. where is the tax cut? we're a few days away from election day. there is a middle class tax cut to get people out to the polls. and mike barnacle, when he talks about the border, talks about ending birth right citizenship, these are things to be done with five days left until election

day, things to float into the atmosphere, things to rev people up. i hope he's not going to send 15,000 troops to the border and put them down there for a caravan that may arrive with a few hundred people in two months. >> if anyone would know that this is a scam being perpetrated by the president based on the fact that there's a dwindling group of truly desperate people still hundreds of miles away from the border, en route to the border, if anyone would know that it was a scam as well as a horrible and expensive misuse of the secretary, it would be secretary of defense mattis. and i would hope that we could get him on the record about the use of these troops on the border. john, i don't know about you, but the president of the united states in my lifetime, which is considerably longer than yours, i've never seen in -- i'm telling you, i go back to the '68 campaign. i've never seen the use of fear and division being employed by a

leader on a daily basis. >> what i'm struck by is how self-conscious it is. in other words, if you're going exploit division, you generally don't read the stage directions. it's like when he said in that interview with abc, you know, i'm really good at counting the, you know, crowds. that is a neolistic joke about the crowd during the inauguration. he's turning this into a comedy bit. i know we need more troops because i can see there's a lot more people in that caravan. if you look at this it's like he's going, hey, i'm stoking

fear. look over here at me, i'm stoking fear. which doesn't, i think, stoke fear. that's the interesting thing. when you do it that way, there's something totally fall about it. >> and -- >> i mean, these 15,000 troops, you could literally make the entirely opposite argument and they all individually will take one of the caravan members by hand and escort them across the border like a welcoming committee. >> and i would submit that that fear extends into vast numbers of people in the republican party, vast numbers of candidates who are so afraid to stand up and say, wait a minute. >> and it's amazing. think about a leader of the country that uses military force and debases the media in order to increase his political strength. you would say that could not happen in the united states of america. and right now, there are a lot of republicans out there who should be standing up.

if you're in a swing district right now, i would suggest you saying this is unacceptable. buying into this will only hurt you and you're going to lose because the turnout in swing districts in the congressional races are going to go against you. >> a new npr/pbs news hour poll conducted sunday to monday measured the national mood heading into the final week of the poll. 41% approve of the president's behavior and 52% disapprove. asked about the tone, 75% say it's gotten worse, 16% say it stayed the same. and on whether they fear the

tone in politics will lead to violence, about 8 in 10 voters say they are very concerned or concerned. 21% are not very or at all concerned. jim van dehei, axios is out with an exclusive clip with the president discussing the press. >> what scares the crap out of me is if you're saying enemy of the people, enemy of the people -- >> i have to fight back, you're right. >> no, but god forbid, you have people who listen to you and -- >> they like me more because of that. >> what if all of a sudden someone gets shot. i don't think you think i'm the enemy of the people, do you? >> i don't. but if you give me false reports, i would say that is not good for our country. >> but you are the most powerful man in the world. and if you say that word, enemy, enemy, and then people go on social media and they get themselves so jazzed up, there

has to be a party that is -- >> jim, it's my only form of fighting back. i couldn't be here if i did that. >> you won. you won the presidency. >> no, no, i did this before i won. >> that was a fascinating exchange there. what did you take away from it? >> you know what was most fascinating, throughout the interview, that was where he seemed most comfortable. he wanted that confrontation. he so believes that he is aggrieved, that he is like the victim of a media that's more powerful than him. and then he also concedes that i feel aggrieved, but i also feel like my base demands it. even if i didn't want to attack you, even if i didn't want to turn up the boil, that i have to. and i even asked him at one point, i was like, every other president when there's a terrorist attack or something, they try to turn down the boil. and it seems like you have an obligation to turn it up. and he basically says yes.

he says i have no choice. but he has a million choices and he keeps choosing escalation. and i do worry, profoundly, that something bad will happen as a result of this. i disagree with what john was saying earlier, that people get the joke and maybe they know this is just fear mongering. i don't think so. i think there's people at full boil and we're playing with fire. >> jim, i completely agree with you. and i will tell you that what you saw and how you are articulating it reflects what we saw during the campaign when we knew donald trump and actually spoke with him and went into his office and talked about the dangers of his birtherism. and he looked at joe as if joe would be in on the joke and he wasn't. and he said, you know, but it works. this is wrong. we said it on the air and we also said it to his face. here is the problem. you say he's most comfortable in

that pocket. he is. you know why? because he has no command of the facts, no command or understanding of what the constitution is about. he basically admitted to us that he doesn't read. he can't read. he takes things in mostly through hearing it, through watching it, through listening to it, through being a part of it. he has a command of playing the media. that is his sweet spot. that is exactly where he's comfortable because he can use evil ways of manipulating people's thoughts, their beliefs and tapping into racism with his command of the media. >> there is no doubt that -- it was actually a very frustrating interview until that point because when you talk to him about policy, he's sort of all over the place. >> doesn't know anything. >> at one point he said i'm going to break them up and the next point he's going to protect them. but when he gets there, it's

clear what he wanted to talk about on that day. of all the things happening in the world, he wanted to talk about his obsession with the media, with very specific media fishgs, where he is comfortable. that's why there's not going to be a point, we've already had a shooting. we've had their bombs being sent via mail. so it's clear he never feels like he has an obligation to tone it down. even people who disliked george bush, when things were bad and at a full boil, he knew he had an obligation to bring the boil down. he understands the danger when with you have dry kindling and hot tempers, that those two can spark something much worse than what we've seen. and that is the thing i would say to trump supporters. the stuff does matter. the words do matter. and if god forbid people take that enemy, enemy, enemy, what do you think people say about

they take that enemy? this isn't just my political opponent. it's somebody that maybe they have to be hit. maybe they have to be shot. that is the danger at the point at which we're sitting at. it's going to get worse. after the election, we're going to be talking about the republican establishment and robert mueller and the media again and it's going to be very, very similar terms. >> and you would hate for the democrats to have power in light of all of that. but i will just say it's not just dangerous, it's already happened. we're in a place right now where the president is deflecting from two major national events, one an attack on our democracy. the other a slaughter at a synagogue, the worst in u.s. history. the president pushes lies. he pushes lies with ease because he can control them because he can make the words up as he goes along. and that gives him a sense of

comfort. he doesn't need to know anything. he knows he can push a lie and try and speak ex temporary rainusly in a dramatic way and push things that tap into people. here he is actually continuing the soros caravan conspiracy lie. take a look. >> i wouldn't be surprised, yeah. i wouldn't be surprised. >> george soros? >> i don't know, but i wouldn't be surprised. a lot of people say yes. >> june, your thoughts? >> so i was struck by -- in your interview, jim, with trump that he got very relaxed. and you're saying, like with, this is terrible. you're ramping people up. and he was sort of like, come on, you know, like i wouldn't be here if i didn't do stuff like this. you understand. this is all part of the game. >> that's how he speaks. >> there is a kind of interesting -- it's a kind of like, all right, come on, let's

talk turkey here. you know i've got to do this. you've got to come to me and say don't do this and then i've got to do it and then the election will be over and we'll go do something else, something like that. it's as though he was trying to convince you not to take it seriously. >> yeah. you've got to watch his body language. it's almost like he relaxes. it's almost like you become on par with him and he just wants to have a conversation that, to him, is totally on the level. like he -- yeah, it's like, of course i have to do this. like look what the press is doing to me. look at how my crowds respond to me. i think at one point he's like, they like me better when i do this. people are like, you've got to cut this off. you've got to.stop the rhetoric. he's like, no, i'm winning.

what mika was talking about earlier, when you talk about sending 15,000 troops to the border which probably won't happen, when you run that ad where it's clearly scary, all these drugs are coming in, all these thugs are coming in, yes, some are coming in and a caravan is coming, but it's totally disproportionate to the response and the amount of attention that it gets. and this is different in politics. the only remote parallel that i can think of barnacle was talking about in his lifetime, in mine, in bush's days, there was always a concern that he was bringing up the threat of terrorism. but we had potentially imminent threats in different areas at different times. this really isn't that real. even if he's saying he's a better crowd size estimator than the rest of us, we've all seen the photos. but it's men, women and children, weeks away on a border

that's fortified already by two layers and you're going to send 15,000 in which is what you have in afghanistan where we're fighting terrorists and thugs in one of the most dangerous places in the history of humanity. >> so we're talking about tactics here, how the president is handling this going into the election. he's talking about the cara vva he floated the idea of a tax cut that ee.evaporated suddenly. the question is will it have some impact come tuesday? we see the rallies, with we see the energy, and we see them cha chanting lock him up talking about mayor andrew gillum. will they work with republican voters or just with that segment of republican voters that was already going to be at the rally chanting lock him up. >> if you're talking about republican voters going to the polls in swing congressional districts, it's going to turn them off.

republicans or moderates will stay home or they will vote against the republicans because this is exactly the type of thing that turns them off. all of this bravado. it brings out the worst in trump to those types of voters. if you're talking about a senate race in a deep red state, like claire mccaskill, that's going to work with republicans to gin up their turnout. that's where the play is. but one thing i want to highlight that jim said, he said when the president replied, well, i have to fight back, it's my only way. it's like in the campaign. you're the president of the united states. you have a lot of things at your fingertips. you don't to rely on the media to give you the statistics.

but he just wants to play into that certain media base. >> so on the eve of the election, our democracy is under attack by a nationalist imitating the president's racist rants on refugees. here is where we really are. any other president, politician, or just decent human being would be horrified that this is how the 2018 elections are conclude canned. but not president donald trump. in fact, he's made it clear that he will exploit any opportunity, including tragedy and bloodshed, to seize what he believes to be an advantage. bombs sent to some of our most important national leaders, who all happen to be his critics. the most horrific anti-sematic murder in our history.

threatening republican control of congress because they slowed down his party's political momentum. he even wined that he wasn't shown proper respect at the pittsburgh memorial service. some didn't want him there. they didn't even want the president there. after failing the test of basic leadership and those two horrible crimes which happened in the past two weeks, he's now talking, again, like an autocrat in training, threatening to rewrite the constitution with his own pen using the great u.s. military like a king can's army claiming he will send more troops to the u.s.-mexico border to stop brown people, terrorists, that the number of fighters -- this is the number of fighters we have in afghanistan he wants to send there.

>> can i just point out -- >> those new polls from national public radio -- hold on, john. >> sorry. >> show america the truth. the rhetoric of this racist, heartless, soulless man will lead to more violence. yes, i said that. and a lot of americans believe it, too. they see what is happening to our country. this is a so-called leader with no shame. he doesn't care. he has no sense of decency, no sense of duty, and no limits. this is important for everyone to understand. no limits of what he's capable of doing to stave off any humiliation for himself. the humiliation that his desperate actions suggest is that he knows what's coming next tuesday. it could be bad for him. there could be subpoena power. there could be impeachment. he knows he is on the line and he will do anything to save himself. the question is what are we going to do?

what are democrats and republicans going to do? because if they want to check on this man, if you want a slight check on this man and his unrelenting race to the pb finish here to make sure he can continue destroying this country, you might want to vote all "d," even if it's not your party this time around. it might be worth it. john pedoritz. >> so we're saying that, you know, trump is doing what he can to gin up his base and, you know, go back to his core issues, right? if you look at the polls, there are dozens of districts that are going to decide control of the house that are one, two, three-point races. and most of them are not in core deep red places, but are in the suburbs and purple places. what is the political wisdom here.? is the political wisdom to start

ranting about, you know, the evil of immigrants on or would it be to be a uniter after pittsburgh? i would look at it this way. this is a horrible analogy. but governors all over the country have strengthened themselves in the face of national disasters by handling the national disasters well. pittsburgh is not a national disaster. it's a horrible mass shooting. but the president's calm, steady hand, a good speech comfortabling the nation, all of that, in those districts that republicans have to win in order to secure or maintain control of the congress, that is the smarter play, it seems to me. he has a one-point spread in -- >> you're kidding me. >> when? >> he isn't capable of doing that. >> i'm not saying that. i'm saying this is political malpractice on his part. he is shooting himself in the foot possibly because he needs

to get those people -- >> but they already wrote those districts off, john. those districts are gone. they've been written off by this administration. so let's shore up where we can and make sure the senate maybe pick s up a seat. >> the poll doesn't show they're going to lose necessarily. that's the point. >> i would just argue that at this point, look at him and look at what he's doing right now and vote on that. still ahead on "morning joe," steve kornacki is here with a ton of new poll s. plus the ad that encapsulates everything we just said. the president ramps up the fear and loathing five days before the midterms. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. (bright electronic music) - [announcer] powerful cleaning. that's what you expect from shark, and our newest robot vacuum is no exception. from floors to carpets, it tackles all kinds of debris, even pet hair, with ease.

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kornacki. author of "the red and the blue." let's start with arizona. polling is a bit mixed with the cnn poll has the democrat ahead by 4 points in the home stretch, 51% to republican martha mcsally's 47%. sinema also leads in the meris poll. but the fox news poll shows a tied race, 46% to 46%. meanwhile, the abc poll released a poll a little over a week ago which gives mcsally a seven-point advantage at 52% to 45%. what do you make in the disparity of that those polls? >> i do wonder if the date might have something to do with it. there was some indication that the circumstances politically have changed a little bit in a week. we were talking around labor day of the democrats having a significant advantage

nationally. we were talking mid observation, post kavanaugh, about the republicans closing the enthusiasm gap. states like arizona coming back into the mix for them where mcsally didn't just have a chance there, but was pulling ahead in states like that. and now maybe after the package bombs, trump's response to that, maybe after pittsburgh, trump's response to that, maybe in light of trump's decision to lean in on the caravan on these hot b t button cut tu button cultural issues, that could resort back to october where you might see something else. >> you susan mentioned missouri a couple of minutes ago. claire mccaskill and attorney general josh hawley are tied and that's no change from a month ago. claire mccaskill is sort of leaning into this trump policies

here. kavanaugh, the caravan, things like that trying to keep ourselves down the middle and a little to the right, even, to get some of those trump voters. >> in 2012, claire mccaskill was the luckiest politician alive. she was running in missouri, a state mitt romney had no problem and that's when her opponent made those comments about legitimate rape and she won easily. attorney general josh hawley hasn't made those self-destructive states. missouri has become that much more donald trump friendly. it's a state that trump won by 20 points. if hillary clinton had won in 2016, i don't think there's any circumstance that claire mccaskill is in the game in 2018. but she has that equalizing force of being the opposition in the midterms. >> it's pretty extraordinary to have a democrat, claire

mccaskill say when she was asked about the caravan, quote, i support the president 100%. >> and what's shocking about those numbers, they are 43/43 in that poll. they're not in the high 40s. that's where you would expect a close race to be with less than a week to go. is there something else in play that is keeping the 14% undecided? i find that shocking at this time. >> there are other polls that are showing the numbers higher out there. indiana we're seeing this, too. donnelley, the democrat, trying to hang on, too. with deni with donnelley leading with, you wonder, they don't want to vote democratic, but they're not comfortable with trump and that becomes the vehicle to express that. >> let's talk about joe donnelley. in indiana, the democratic senator has a seven-point lead

over republican mike brawn in the fox news poll. an nbc news meris poll shows 48/46 and donnelley up three points in a three-way race. donnelley will get support from president barack obama on sunday at a rally in gary, indiana. how does it shake out here? >> donnelley has been -- this is one of the surprises for democrats this cycle. donnelley caught a break in 2012, as well. he got elected to his first term in 2012 as mitt romney was carrying the state easily in the presidential race. he also had a republican opponent that year, richard murdoch, got himself caught up in a similar flare to todd aiken. a lot of people said this is a fluke victory. the fact that donnelley is not a solid lead, he has consistently

had a slight edge in the polling we've seen in this edge. now here we are in late october and we're continuing to see that. i think there is a scenario where donnelley hangs on there. >> would you agree that the pittsburgh murders are a high impact can, hard to measure factor in this closing days of the campaign.? >> potentially. and that's the way i'm looking at it. i'm looking at it in terms of that, in terms of trump's response to the bombings and in terms of the culture right now. i think -- and we'll see what happens next tuesday. but i think back to 2016 and how donald trump put it together at the very end and got just enough to get elected president. and he had his hard core base that was there the whole time and he seemed to add these reluctant republican voters. and i think the thing that we forget when we think back to 2016 is that in the closing days of that campaign, trump by his standards was a disciplined candidate. trump was not on twitter. they gave him a message that he was reading from it, these speeches that was, hey, you

know, washington is against you, i'm for you you. a lot more of a standard issue message. he was not getting distracted by these -- you know, getting himself into these flare-ups like this. and that lasted for about ten days of that campaign. my theory on what happens in those closing days is those reluctant republicans who found him distasteful saw just enough there to reassure him and to come home and to get him over the top. my question into next week was i think post kavanaugh, the kavanaugh drama brought those reluctant people back into the fold and you saw it change not slightly, but significantly. >> what about those -- like mccaskill and donnelley, what about those who see trump right now going out with a racist message and looking at those two candidates as perhaps maybe someone that can keep a check.

they may be democrats, but maybe they'll keep a check. >> that's clearly mccaskill's strategy right here. i don't want these democrats running things, but maybe, you know, maybe trump is too much. maybe she's independent enough. >> take up john's point from the last block, which is an interesting one. it's that president's strategy right now is actually bad strategy. but he's already got them. is it not bad strategy to focus on those swing districts? >> cough gnaw didn't change that.

republicans rallying. they still looked gone for republicans. those are the ones that came right back into the picture post kavanaugh. we had a positive, the sudden son valley of new york, trump won the district, but by only a couple of points in 2016. and the poll urster said they saw a number of people maybe not winning, but not getting blown out with. and i'm wondering, if you see that in a district, you have a uniform shift across the board, there's this whole vast mushy middle right there. on a additional day, democrats

are getting 50 plus. and a swing of two to three points is a swing of the pendulum. >> so you have races that are one or two-point races. if it's a wave, they all tilt uniformly in one direction. and it's hard. you can see how republicans may mitigate the damage in the house. but if there is a wave, it only goes democratic. that's disk to see, right? that was the question of whether trump had an opportunity to mitigate that damage. >> so steve brings us these polls that are reflective of something bigger in the country. a monmuth university poll puts

malanowski ahead. why is that -- >> this is a perfect example of what we're just talking about. this is west of new york city. this is very wealthy. this is where trump spends a lot of weekends. that is a moderate republican. leonard lance in new jersey. that goes way back in new jersey politics. he's done everything he can to position himself as a moderate seeming republican in the age of trump. but that is a district that went barely, but did go for 2012 with clinton. if your theory is that in the last week the way trump has leaned into the culture stuff, that he's going to turn off those sort of extra reluctant voters republicans need, that is exactly the kind of district you'll see it in. >> it will be one to watch. steve kornacki, thank you for

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how do you feel about this election that's different from past elections? >> speaking, you know, with as a woman, i think we're all very, very angry at everything that the administration is doing and not doing to help and support us. so i know at least my large village is gender specific on their anger towards what's going on. >> joining us now, former governor of vermont and former chairman of the democratic national committee, howard dean. also with us is author lauren leader. she's the co-founder and ceo of "all in together." thank you both for being on. you howard, i want to start with

you. back up to 20,000 feet. how are democrats doing in the run up to the midterms, especially given the tact that president is taking in the final days? >> well, it's very interesting. all the races, those 80 races or whatever, a lot of them are are three-point rates either way. >> and are you surprised by that, howard.? >> no. the democrats are trying to run against a president who has a very powerful message of hate, basically, which could be effective at times like this when the nation has been turned upside down by this president. so i'm pretty optimistic, actually. these kinds of elections are usually determines in the last

three days. and i think democrats are a lot more energized, i hate to say, after the shootings in pittsburgh which is where trump showed his true colors. >> it's fairley difficult to watch. lauren, let's talk about women. we saw something very beautiful in the women's mars across the country, around the world. we see a large number of women running. we're seeing leadership happen. we're seeing an angry response. but my question to you is to make it the year of the woman, i would think we would need record numbers of women voting. are we going to see this? >> absolutely. there's been a lot this year made for women. the number of women running for office are historic and i think we may see some impressive

turnout voters being women. but i mean, even if all of the women win, we still barely break 30% in congress. it's really painful when you put it in context because we're over 50% of the college degrees. we're at 40 plus percent of the primary bread winners in the country. even with this record number running from office, we're still so far from true representation in government. i was sharing with the governor right before we came on, the united states is 96th in the world according to the world economic forum for the political parity of women. and we have dropped 40 places since 2014. most of us i think are shocked to hear those numbers. so it's a great start and i hope women turn out. i'm a little worried about millennial women. i think they're overwhelmed and

somewhat paralyzed by the current climate. and i'm concerned about their turnout. i think it will be better than it was in '16, but i think we're still not going to be where we need to be. >> lauren, i just want to follow up and then i'll happened nd it susan for the next question. but this would be the time that you would think we would step up in rord numberecord numbers, th would do it for us. are there forces pulling us back? >> you know, everywhere i go in the country, what you hear is the same thing. women feel they need better and more complete information to make their decisions. we've had a failure to education women around civics. women with really want to understand what they're voting for and understand the politics of the situation. we don't do a great job of

educating americans and help people understand what they're voting for and what the issues are. but, yeah, as the dynamics continue to change, we have wor. particularly for millennials who opt-out because they can't get their heads around of mailing in a voter registration page through the snail mail. in a lot of states they try to make voting easier. we need more and more women to step up. >> when those women's mars happened democrats didn't know if they were really going to be able to harness those people because they were angry at the system. they weren't necessarily all democrats, they were just angry. you have to kind of harness that energy. we did see women starting to run more. i guess what i'm trying to figure out or my question to both of you, one that has come up with a 50 state strategy for

democrats and how to get people to go out and vote and get that message out. but why are women scared, not scared, but they seem to hesitate more to run because maybe of personal issues or the ugliness of it. so i guess, governor, how do you do a 50 state strategy. >> is the second part of your question is more interesting. this is what's happening that most people don't understand in the democratic party. all these people coming in the party are not necessarily democrats. they don't trust the system. they don't trust anybody. they have democratic ideas. they want diversity. they believe immigration is a good thing. gay rights is the civil rights of this generation. they vote for us. they are resculpting the democratic party while they do this. the real juice in this election is coming from run for something or indivisible or swing left, color of change. that's what's transforming the

democratic party. they may not even be called democrats. the values are the same and they are great american traditional values in many ways. >> right. although i'll say i'm in the suburban districts that are so key to, you know, democrats winning the house, places like suburban new jersey and kansas city. i don't think those left leaning groups necessarily resonating with those women as much. it's a lot of what the guest in the earlier segment said is anger in general and looking for an outlet. we have sort of skipped overbey sick political education and engagements and gone straight to trying to convince more women to run for office. >> when you talk about 30%, if women don't run we'll never get to 50%. >> there are a couple of great organizations working very hard to mobilize republican women to

run. it's harder for them without a question. republicans struggle to want to invest just in women just for the sake of having more women. we do need more women on bolt sides of the aisle. fundamentally we have to show women political participation is a way to make the country better. overwhelming numbers of american women say if they wanted to make things better they are more likely to volunteer for a charity or in their schools than to see the political process as a way to make things better. the exciting part about this cycle is all these women who are now going washington have a chance to show that and show women across america we can make a difference. >> it's not a millennial women problem it's a millennial problem. there's a new poll released yesterday where only 31% of millennials say they definitely plan to vote on tuesday. for all the marches and hash tag, it doesn't appear -- we'll

wait to see if they show up but it doesn't appear they will do something about it. >> we don't know. that's what will determine what happens. i'm pretty sure we'll take the house. do we take it with 24 seats or 50 seats. young people, particularly women are going to make all the difference in this election if they show up. somebody made the point here, these are not necessarily liberals. there are people -- this next generation is somewhat libertarian economically. it goes across the board. you'll see young people showing up in places in kansas where we have two seats or iowa. if they show up we'll win. >> i want to go to john for a final thought, but before i do that i just want to touch on something that lauren brought up. lauren you talked about women wanting to be overprepared, know everything about the detail,

they are risk averse and sometimes keeps them from running or voting. let me make a very call out to women right now. the risk is not voting. okay. because the only reason why you might be voting if you don't know enough about the candidates this time around is if you want to check on trump. that's all you need to know. and if you want a check on trump, you vote democrat at this point. it's pretty simple. but the risk, again, is not voting. and you don't want to take that risk. i totally agree with women being risk averse in this election. john. >> well, so this is the question. you have to vote for trump or vote against but for democrats to vote against trump. but that cuts against, let's say the race in tennessee. there's a republican woman in tennessee, marsha blackburn. if you want more women in the senate, maybe you got to vote for marsha blackburn, no?

>> that's not what i was saying. i said you got to check on trump. you can vote against a woman if that woman is not going give you a check on trump. women don't just have to band together blindly. we band together to do something. right now women should be voting for a check on trump, because i think women actually have more of a sense of value and decency and at this point, i'm sorry i'm saying it, they are risk averse when it comes to human decency, when it comes to racism, when it comes to using politics of fear. this is something that addition deep for women, for mothers who are raising children, who are raising boys and girls to be better people. i'm not saying men aren't, i'm just saying women need to step up and stick to their beliefs if they want to check on trump voemt against the republicans and yes, it can be a woman. marsha blackburn, take a look what she said. take a look at things she said

in this election and tell me if hats the type of person you want in office right now alongside this president. howard dean, lauren, thank you very much. a day after he challenged the president's plan to do away with birth right citizenship by executive order, kellyanne conway's husband is at it again. plus we'll talk to the democratic nominee for florida governor, tallahassee mayor, andrew gillum. "morning joe" is coming right back. vo: you're feeling the squeeze.

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very, very important subject. in my opinion, it's much less complex than people think. i think it says it very loud and clear in the constitution that you don't have to go through the

process of whatever they are talking about. >> president trump's reaction to speaker paul ryan who said in an interview that the president obviously cannot end birth right citizenship by executive order. so why does he keep saying it? the president earlier hit back on twitter posting quote, paul ryan should be focusing on holding the majority rather than giving his opinions on birth right citizenship, something he knows nothing about. our new republican majority will work on this closing the immigration loopholes and securing our border. meanwhile attorney george conway who is married to kellyanne conway continued his public take downs of his wife's boss and even her own comments. in response to a "new york times" article detailing one of president trump's unfounded claims on immigration, conway tweeted quote, to say that

illegal immigrants are not subject to the jurisdiction of the united states is just drivele. were that true then the government wouldn't be able to arrest them. surely that's not the president's position. clearly he has no comprehension of the words he's using. welcome back to "morning joe" with us this thursday, november 1st, 2018. are the tax cuts here? no, never mind. that was just a lie. still with us we have msnbc contributor mike barnacle. republican strategist and msnbc political analyst, susan. and joining the conversation associate editor of commentary magazine and msnbc contributor noah rothman and the author of "the washington post's" new early morning newsletter, "power up," jackie. good to have you all on board this morning. so noah rothman, trump taking on paul ryan saying he has no right

to join this conversation. to that you say what? >> i say it's terrible politics. just about every time you've seen the president's job approval tank is when republicans are engaged in infighting. over the course of the last week we see another fight between president and his head of party in the congress, the speaker of the house. the chairman of the rnc say one of his conference members is basically a white nationalist, steve king. this sort of thing is only going to help make the kavanaugh effect to whatever extent it exists disappear. and for republicans who are facing a difficult environment in the next week that's a travesty. >> it's incredible. willie geist, it seems like this racist run to the end of this election could only get worse because things are tightening up a bit for the president. it will be too close if especially he stops and thinks

about the concept of democrats having subpoena power, having the power to impeach. i'm concerned we're going to see massive deflections in the days to come. >> he escalated yesterday. raising the potential number of troops he's willing to send to the border, five days to election day. the president now says he wants 15,000 troops to the u.s.-mexico border. more than the number of troops currently serving in average. that's a detail pressed on him last night by abc news. >> you're talking about 10,000, maybe 15,000 active duty military to the u.s. border more than fighting taliban or isis in syria. you going to do that? >> we need a wall much people, very highly trained people, terrific dedicated pitts. you have car vance coming up that look a lot larger than reported. i'm good at estimating crowd size. they look a lot bigger than

people think. >> the president talking about 15,000 troops to the border more or about the number in afghanistan in an active shooting war. another part of his argument as we head five days out the election day, the president continues to make claims like this one in a tweet, quote. republicans will protect people with pre-existing conditions far better than the dems. at the president's campaign rally in florida last night which burst into a chants about lock him up with tallahassee mayor gillum, the president talked about birth right citizenship as a crazy policy. >> a vote for democrats is a vote to liquidate america's borders and a vote to let meth,

heroin and other deadly drugs pour across our boards. >> the president making this argument for his party next week. >> if the mid-terms for some reason don't do so well for republicans i think you're going to lose a lot of money. i hate to say that. you're going to lose a lot of money. >> susan, you've been in the republican party for a long time. you would like to hold on to the house and senate. do the president's arguments which play directly to a certain segment of the republican party and a certain segment of conservatives work? are they effective in five days? >> no, they are not if you want to hold on to the house. simple. there are a lot of swing districts. there's a lot of republicans, over 40 republican house members retired this year. that's a lot of defense on those seats to protect them. they are only trying to take -- there's three democratic seats at play. this rhetoric by the president is horrible. but as much as i do like seeing

republicans in charge of government, and even all three, i don't like seeing this republican as president. and i don't like seeing republican house or senate that falls in line directly behind him. i want to see republicans who stand up to this president when he's wrong. and, you will recall, speaker ryan just showed up in the last week. i wonder where he's been all along because that's where we needed our speaker of the house to be. >> you know, i don't think i'm alone in this. this is so sad. this is so depressing, watching this race to the bottom led by the president of the united states who has lapped the field. he takes to the day each and every day in different states of this country to divide, to distort, to overemphasize the truly silly. we have a group, a dwindling group of desperate people, truly

desperate people heading towards the texas border. he's committed to deploying at least 5,000 troops. at some substantial cost to the american taxpayer. the united states army along the border to do what? combat a group of basically homeless people? this is america? this is america? this is truly, truly sad. >> 15,000, that's the proposal. i guess the question, jackie, is whether or not any of this actually happens or if it's all a ploy. if it's all politics. if he's going to send even a single troop more than the 2,000 national guardmen and the border patrol that are already down there. remember the tax cut for the middle class he floated out there was supposed to be ready by today, haven't heard about that in at least a week. is he going push to take away birth right citizenship, knees he'll bump up against the constitution and take it to the

supreme court. are these all just cheap political tools that are going to evaporate come wednesday? >> i'm not sure any republican lawmaker would agree with the president that igniting a constitutional debate over birth right citizenship is a good idea for the republican party ahead of these mid-terms. with this week and all these spontaneous proposals really reflect, and encapsulate is the president is not driven by this greater political strategy but rather a set of principles, these inherent tenets that he's aed bied by for decades. my colleague and i took a look and skimmed through a few of his books yesterday and went through some of these at tte northweste. like lose the battle to win the war. all of this is a perfect explainer for the behavior we're seeing from the president not just ahead of the mid-terms but

at the two year mark of his presidency. >> kasie hunt has five states at play. she's looking at midwest states. she joins us this morning from milwaukee. what are you hearing? >> reporter: mika, good morning. one thing that's in focus here in wisconsin today is, obviously, the flap between the president and house speaker paul ryan. this is the kind of confrontation that the speaker has, you know, he's been criticized on the show for doing which is avoiding public confrontation with this president, basically at every turn and arguing hey it's more productive if i give the president a phone call. that spilled out in the open with this conversation about birth right citizenship and i'm interested to see if the speaker is going to answer any questions from the media who are out here today. my guess is he's going to try to dodge that in favor ever trying to help scott walker who is in some ways difficult race for

re-election. i want says a lot, i think, actually about the climate here because if anything based on who he is running against this should be an easier race for scott walker than other ones he's run but insteed he's at a real risk of losing. if that to were happen think about in a state like wisconsin and don't forget this is a place where hillary clinton was criticized for not going to. the great hope of the gop came from here. reince priebus now fallen. paul ryan slinking out of washington. and scott walker losing. those three were the future of the republican party and now basically potentially all going to be gone. it makes a statement about how this president has taken over his party. the other thing i would just add, mika, as well, is the divisive rhetoric coming from the president, the focus on cultural wedge issues. i've been out in these house districts most of which are interest in suburban areas.

if you listen to the candidates in those races they sound so different from the president. they are saying if you ask them if they support where the president stands on immigration they will say certainly we need to be worried about border security but i'm more concerned about deliverables. i said to one member of congress that i interviewed i said you don't sound a lot like the president on these caravan issues. he said i'm not the president. it illustrated what a tough box these candidates are in. one thing and i heard susan discussing this earlier on your air. yes, it's true they are trying to run a turn out strategy in these big red senate states that's why the president is going to them. but this election is nationalized. what the president is saying in missouri is showing up in chicago suburbs or suburbs of des moines as well. >> i'm interested to hear, you talked about the candidates running differently. what about the voters there in the state of wisconsin across the states where you've been. wisconsin went quiet, 21,000,

22,000 votes by a hair for president trump over hillary clinton. the voters there, obviously, made a decision that they wanted donald trump over hillary clinton. a lot of obama voters voted for president trump. have they changed their mind over the last two years? we talk about a strong economy and all those pieces but has the tone of the country, has the president's conduct changed their minds at all? >> reporter: i don't want to mislead our viewers. i just landed in wisconsin last night. before that we were in missouri, iowa and minnesota. we're doing a swing through the heartland to answer that very question that you raise, what has happened to these voters. my question today in wisconsin is going to be who shows up at these events. when you talk to the house speaker before about who came out to a trump rally in wisconsin it's people he didn't recognize. he's somebody who would know most of the faces in typically republican crowd. so a couple of things i've

observed from talking to voters. the democrats we talked to are incredibly fired up. they are treating this more like a presidential election. they are saying this is the most important time for them to vote. that is something that's a little bit different in many ways from 2016. obviously, hillary clinton had her core supporters but i covered that campaign in its final weeks and the vibe was entirely different. democrats are definitely fired up. on the republican side, i do think that, you know, to a certain extent the president's strategy ever making those voters feel an additional urgency to go to the polls is something he needs. they are seeing that in their numbers. i do talk to republican voters that say immigration is the top issue for them, not something you hear from democrats or from independents. i do think it's, obviously just a balance between whether or not those democrats are excited enough and i think that core question of people that could swing back and forth or perhaps independents looking for a slightly calmer political

atmosphere, you get some notes about as well. >> you've been out there in several states prior to arriving to wisconsin. can you speak to the point that the president has continually raised and said i'm on the ballot. this is about me. basically that's what he's been saying. in terms of him crowding out the local candidate for congress or whatever, how much is he dominating the political landscape in the states that you have been in. >> reporter: almost entirely he's dominating the political landscape. that's especially true among democrats who are enthused to go out to the polls. they were going to the ballot box because they want to vote against donald trump. this challenge and this an vile has been in place for the last two years and you see republicans navigate this with varying degrees of success. none of these republicans can win if the trump base and their own voters have been converted over to president trump in many, many cases.

they need those people to show up. they can win without something of a coalition that includes people who don't like the president. for the republican candidates in suburban districts they want this to not be about the president. they want this to be about other local issues. the one thing i will say, we talk about it somewhat in passing sometimes when we're looking at it from inside the beltway, health care is the issue on people's minds. identi i've been thinking about this. the economy is doing well. health care is a personal public health and also an economic issue because people are essentially saying you know my health care is take a huge piece of my paycheck. if that republican that ad is telling me is going to take away my coverage for pre-existing conditions, going hurt my mother, aunts, brother because they are suffering from any degree -- honestly we heard a

lot of sad personal stories about health care because democrats are messaging on that, yes, but it's real. >> that's why the governor of the state, scott walker is putting up ads talking about protecting against pre-existing conditions. kasie hunt in wisconsin, great job. we'll see you tomorrow. steve bannon has been making the rounds trying to rally president trump's base. unlike 2016 it appears fewer people are interested in bannon. a week and a half ago a republican fundraising dinner featuring bannon drastically cut prices due to demand. only 38 people showed up in staten island to hear bannon speak and watch his latest film. two days after that 200 people showed up for a rally held by bannon. none of the republican candidates in the area shoipd despite all receiving invitations. on tuesday, about two dozen people showed up for bannon's

red tide rising rally at a holiday express in kansas. that didn't include steve watkins who did not show up despite the rally being held for him. and whose campaign made a point ever saying hit nothing to do with the bannon event. bannon acknowledged the staten island gathering that he's done six events where just ten people showed up. steve bannon showing up in virginia as well, saying he's campaigning on behalf of dave brat, the brat campaign couldn't run faster in the other direction from steve bannon. >> not surprised. his instrumental utility to the trump base has waned. you mentioned this president seems very uncomfortable with this idea this is anything other than a referendum on himself. that's wrongheaded. the opposition wants to make a referendum on the president.

the pro side wants to make this a referendum on the party in congress. the president is saying i'm unilaterally going to strip the 14th amendment that allows for birth right citizenship. i'm going to do this. owes moving troops to the border. what does that have to do with congress? troops are prohibited from doing any police action. how is this going to rally republican voters to say i need republicans in congress when the president say i have a pen and a phone and i'll do this myself. it doesn't make any sense. the president is, if he's going make this a referendum, win or lose, it will be about himself and that's what matters not the strength of his people in congress. >> you think he knows what he's doing. >> fair enough. >> jackie, i want to close with you. and to noah's point, we're

looking at a moment in time, a moment in history where we have just endured an attack on our democracy with former president, vice president, top democratic officials and crypts of trump having pipe bombs sent to them. terrorist attack. and the worst slaughter against jews in america in history at a synagogue. a unifying message in light of those would not be a bad look for a republican president and yet today right now he's focused on 15,000 troops to the border and birth right citizenship. how is anybody supposed to understand exactly what he stands for or can you put it into words. what exactly is he doing? is this politics or is this truly him? what's truly in his heart? >> i think we've moved beyond the political realm here and this is simply trump being trump seriously and literally. >> then it's something i think

all americans need to think about and they need to read madeleine albright's book, because at this point we're talking about something very different. and i'm not saying this, you know, with my hair on fire. i'm saying this, because this is what we see. jackie, thank you very much. still ahead on "morning joe," the democratic candidate running in the president's new york city stronghold donald trump won the state's 11th congressional district in 2016. but can max rose flip it blue? he joins us next on "morning joe". if you want a car with driver-assist technology, get a ford. if you want waze and amazon alexa compatibility, get a ford. if you want a car that doesn't have any of that, get anything... but a ford. otherwise, you're gonna want a ford. ♪

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i am a techie dad.n. i believe the best technology should feel effortless. like magic. at comcast, it's my job to develop, apps and tools that simplify your experience. my name is mike, i'm in product development at comcast. we're working to make things simple, easy and awesome. look i'm running against dan donovan but he's not the only one doing a bad job. mayor de blasio acts like staten island doesn't exist. we need to get rid of all leadership in d.c., republicans and democrats. look around the traffic, the drugs.

what's the establishment doing for you? i'm max rose and i approve this message because it's not just donovan, they all got to go. >> new york's 11th u.s. congressional district made up mostly by the borough of staten island and some of southern brooklyn is new york city's only republican held district and the only part of the city to cast more ballots for donald trump in the 2016 election than hillary clinton despite registered democrats outnumbering republicans there almost 2 to 1. joining us now the candidate looking to take over that seat, an army veteran who served in average, democrat max rose. he earned a purple heart and bronze star for his service. max, great to meet you. you're in a pretty tight race against the inkincumbent. you're at 40%, donovan at 44%. what's your message. we saw a piece of there to republicans and democrats who vote republican out on staten

island. >> first of all, i trust these polls about as far as i can throw them. >> do you believe it's closer or less close? >> it's been close for a long time. irrespective of what any poll says, if you're looking at a poll now and rejiggering your strategy you're running an effective campaign but a campaign that's not ethical. the purpose of this is to build trust. we've been running now for 15 months. it's been a very consistent message throughout and a truthful one which is the people in my district and districts like it throughout the country have been failed by both parties. failed by entire political class that takes a ton of corporate money and lies quite frankly or very frequently doesn't do anything about infrastructure. nothing about the open side epidemic, nothing about gun violence. it's not just a matter of what we're saying but what we're doing. i'm not taking a cent from

corporate p.a.c.s. and as a consequence, you know, what we're seeing over the course of the next few days is more of the same. not something new. >> so president trump, popular on staten island the borough went for trump in 2016. he's done some things i want to ask you about justin last few days as a veteran of the war in afghanistan. he says he's going to send 5,000 troops to the united states border to stop this caravan as he calls it and yesterday said he might send 15,000 troops which would be about equal to or a little more than the troop force we have in average right now. is that a good idea? >> no. first off, i'm very much in favor and for strong border, i'm for a sound and effective asylum policy one that involves our courts being, you know, adequately funded. with that being said, think about it this way. 5,000 soldiers is double what we have in iraq and syria right now. if we have to scene 5,000

soldiers to the borders and keep in mind they cannot legally do anything with regards to domestic law enforcement, if we have to send 5,000 soldiers, there then that basically means that we don't have strong borders. we have to fund our borders. not something temporary. this is a political stunt through and through and it's just to grab people's attention friar an election. we should call it for what is it, a political stunt. >> do you think it's disrespectful to those troops toe use them as a political ploy? >> it's not a question of whether it's disrespectful or not. it's a question of whether it is effective use of our resources. we already have a military that is overstretched. let's actually focus on real national security policies. that's what should matter here. not politics. >> imagine the logistical nightmare and costs of moving 5,000 troops to the border.

it's tough enough to move a platoon. let's go to staten island. >> okay. >> you walk around staten island. are they talking about troops at the border or their health care plans and how long it takes them to drive to work. what are they talking about? >> running for office is not an episode of t"the west wing." what they do talk about is their deep frustration with the failure of government. people have two hour commutes on staten island. some of the longestcommuting times in the country. kids are afraid to go to school, afraid of gun violence. that's what they are frustrated by and tired of hearing these bullet points in regular campaigns during get out the vote strategies and then being ignored thereafter. they really want to see politics change in this country.

you know the reason why i'm running is because of those frustration, but also because six years ago my vehicle hit a bomb in afghanistan. i was medevaced to kandahar medical base. a general said five years ago you would be dead. the reason why i lived congress allocated money to put armor under my truck. they solved a problem. people in my district god bless them want that to be the story of this country and can it be for much larger problems. >> max, nancy pelosi could take the gavel back in a couple of months. she said the democratic caucus can't just investigate everything, can't just pass statements of principle that have no hope of getting through the senate much less the president's desk. they want to do some bipartisan compromise legislation. even at the risk of making donald trump a successful

president, well positioning him for 2020. will you support nancy pelosi. >> let's take a step back. i'm not supporting nancy pelosi for speak. i don't believe she will be the speak. there are many candidates across the country echoing my sentiments. after the republicans took back congress in 2010, mitch mcconnell stood up and he said our number one objective is to make sure that president obama does not win re-election. that was not only wrong, that was unamerican and i refuse to be that type of elected official. when you think about the things that donald trump ran on, if you put aside the racist stuff, he co-opted a democratic populist agenda. if the president actually wants to start working on those things rather than just talking about them during election season, i'll be the first to raise my hand. what i will not do, what i

refuse to do, what i don't think the patriotic thing to do is in 2019 to just start thinking about 2020 and the presidential election and my re-election. that's wrong. once again we'll be ignoring people's problems in districts like mine. >> max rose in a tight race in new york's 11th district challenging the republican incumbent. thanks for being here today. >> this was an honor. >> "morning joe" reached out to republican dan donovan. we hope to schedule him for an interview before election day. two messages in the waning days of the mid-term race. >> let's stand together against rhetoric that pits us against them. as governor, our most diverse state in america sets an example as the most united state in america.

>> he wants to apply for pardon for the felony he committed. attempted murder. >> we'll talk to the democratic nominee for governor in florida, mayor andrew gillum who was on the receiving end of lock him up chant. here we go.

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>> andrew gillum can't work. he's running on impeaching the president. for what? you know, i don't know what he's thinking about impeachment. i mean this is a guy that took bribes from an undercover fbi agent. took money from a lobbyist. did favors for the lobbyist. maybe we should impeach gillum as mayor of tallahassee. [ crowd chanting lock him up ] >> that's the crowd at president trump's rally in florida last

night. erupting in chants of lock him up while republican gubernatorial candidate ron desantis spoke about his opponent on stage. the democratic nominee running for governor in the state thereafter, tallahassee mayor, andrew gillum joins us now. thanks very much for being on the show this morning. so, i guess i want to ask you to respond to those chants, and to those claims made on stage by your opponent. is this the kind of thing you expected when you decided to run for governor? >> well, i have to tell you, mika, first of all, good morning. i missed last night's rally. i was taking my three kids through the neighborhood trick or treating. my kids prefer treats not tricks. it sounds like they had a little bit of trickery last night. but listen, this is more of the same of what we get from this president and from my point mr. desantis. from day one he's gone completely to the gutter on this

campaign not talking to voters what he wants to do, what he wants to achieve but rather trying to distract them with side shows. you probably have seen even our debate stages every opportunity he's had to talk to florida voters about what he wants to do for them. he has not stood up to that opportunity and i think that's been a lost cause for him. i believe we'll win this race for governor because we're talking about tissues that matter and are giving voters something to vote for and not just against. >> the president has called you a thief. ron desantis has used some racist overtones in his language as well. but let me just ask you about the actual issue and the hamilton tickets and the fbi investigation. any errors in judgment in that situation that you can clear up? >> yeah. let me first say, if the president called me a thief, if i'm stealing anything it's hearts and minds. we'll win that race because of that reason. on the issue as i said all along

i had zero tolerance for corruption. i'm not under fbi investigation and neither is my city. what we've done is aided them all the way along. hamilton has again been a side show, and yet my opponents has, i believe, failed to stand up, talk to florida voters about what he wants to do. he would prefer to distract us. he refused to talk about the $145,000 in travel receipts of public money that he still won't make available to the public. he has taken money from overt racists and anti-semites and deniers of the holocaust and won't return that money and using it instead to run false advertisements against me. every single ad mr. desantis has run in this race that includes my name has been rated as false. as far as i'm concerned he lacks what is the number one qualifier for someone who wants to be governor and that's a governor who will level honestly with people.

he failed that test and that's one of the reasons why he won't win this race. i'm sure you've seen the report in the tallahassee democrat that shows you took a flight, private travel to and frarks round trip flight back in 2016 from tallahassee down to st. pete. you put it on the mayor's expense account because you said you were there on city business. these new records indicate while there you met with potential donors as you considered whether to run for governor in the state of florida. you attacked the source of this as being an ally of ron desantis. you were meeting with donors down there or purely city business? >> well, let me first say that wasn't city government campaign funds. those were funds set up after my race to aid me in me doing my job. i met with folks who were assembled, discussing with me affordable housing issues. i met with other state leaders

including charlie crist and other amazing leaders in our state. i did not raise any funds. the only exchanges there were exchanges of idea. another side show. another distraction. i tried very hard not to address these things from their frame. what our voters need to know i served in government for 15 years without a scar to my name. only when i decided i wanted to run for governor for the state of florida did these folks come from the extreme right attempting to paint me as something i'm not. the reason i won my race overwhelmingly for mayor of tallahassee is my community trufrpts me. i won the democratic primary because my voters trust me. i'll win this race for governor because the people of florida trust me. >> so just to clarify the flight to and from st. pete was that paid for with city money? >> it was not paid for with city money. >> what was it paid with?

>> it was paid out of my office account, which is left over campaign contributions. you're allowed to move into an office account that you can then use and there's very little guidance on i want but to aid you in whatever way you deem appropriate and carrying out your responsibilities, helping to inform your positions, and in this case it was used appropriately and there has been no source, no ethics determination and certainly no legal conclusion that would suggest i had done anything wrong or inappropriate. >> mayor gillum i'll assume florida is no different than most other states and people in florida are not a whole lot different than people in other states, they are interested in things like health care and traffic and children's schools and better education. but given the tone, the tenor of not just your campaign but campaigns throughout the country this fall, this political season, is there anything about your campaign, about your rhetoric, about things that you

said and done in your campaign that you regret? >> not at all. in fact, i think we've run a campaign that should be modeled. we have focused at every turn and again i would just reference people to the two public debates that were held in this race. every time i was asked a question about my policy ideas, we offered those up. we gave concrete proposals as to what we would do with regard to health care, expanding access to medicaid. my opponents would not even cop to the fact that he voted over a dozen times to repeal the affordable care act. telling a cancer patient when asked how they were supposed to get access to health care they can go thing in room. there's a lot of differences in public policy that my opponents and i have. on that issue alone i find him disqualified for the office. i don't know why you would deliberately work to keep people from gets access to health care.

i haven't taken any punches from my opponents. when my opponent went into distracting areas like race and like stoking stereotypes claimed basically on the color of my skin we called him out for it. there are not two sides of this thing. you either see people as who they are, your treat them in the humane way that we deserve, or you don't. you either give people something to vote for or you don't. you either use this hyperbolic rhetoric in your campaign or you don't. my opponent has failed to do that all along the way and last night's example of a campaign rally is just one other way in which you see that they are not trying to convince voters to vote for them they are trying to

convince voters to vote against me. >> i'm from new york. one of the highest tax states in the country. i hear often new york erosion are going down to florida because of the tax system there. you have said that you are willing to increase corporate taxes to pay for some of your programs. how do voters from florida know you're not going to take this to a personal income tax or even further increase than what you've already said the corporate tax rate? >> yeah. let me be clear. it's a good question. first of all, i oppose an income tax. we don't have a state income tax. the governor of state of florida couldn't impose an income tax on the people of the state of florida because the state constitution prohibits it. on the corporate tax rate, 97% of businesses in my state pay no corporate taxes. 3% of companies in the state of

florida, wealthiest 3% of companies in my state pay the corporate tax rate. same 3% that walked away under the trump tax realignment with our money. so what we said you can keep 5.3 billion but we want a billion of that to come in to the state of florida and pay teachers what they are worth. my teacher's salary is 45th lowest of all 50 states. state of florida can't be a cheap date and think we can rise to the highest of our potential. we're 40th out of 50 in quality public education. this is a win-win. we want you to invest one sixth of what you got in taxpayer money back into the state of florida so we can train your future workforce. i think that's a sound idea. and i think that we can build consensus with our corporate partners to move in that direction and again last i checked the corporate tax rate in florida is lower than that of the state of louisiana, yet

boston us have the same mcdonald dollar menu. we're going to build a state based off strengthening our infrastructure and our talent in the state of florida. >> mayor gillum i think i can call you a young man. what do you say, mayor gillum to young voters. we had a poll out here at nbc news that only 31% of millennials plan on voting for sure. they are definitely going to go out and vote. p. you provide a contrast in your state as a young man. what do you say to those voters. we've seen hash tag, people out in the street. we've seen a lot of energy. what do you tell those voters to get them out in five days >> we have to engage people in a real and authentic way. young people won't show up and vote for candidates who have never come and asked for their votes. one reason why i've done college tours particularly in my campaign both in the primary and the general is because i knew as

a young person, closely involved and following politics that a lot much times folks didn't come to us, they didn't talk to us. they thought of us as campaign volunteers. participants in the process. what i've tried to do is respect young voters in this campaign, go to them. ask them for their support. many of these folks want to create change. they want to be a part of change. they haven't been convinced politics is the best way through it. what i said you can't tweet about it, snapchat, facebook about it and not be about it. the best way to be about it is to show up and cast your vote. i said they are counting on you not to show up, to keep yourself out of the process. they think are you about moments, not about movements. this is your time. if you are serious about making an imprint on the kind of country you want to create, on the kind of state you want to live in, you got to get involved in the process, voting is one way to do it. beyond that, it's staying

involved long enough to hold epresident-elected officials accountable. >> i should point out ron desantis a young man, he's only 40-years-old. >> yes. >> yeah. mayor andrew gillum, thank you very much for being on the show. >> thank you. >> "morning i don't" has reached out to ron desantis' campaign multiple times and the campaign has thus so far declined. they say no. ahead, we will look at a high profile governor's debate the georgia race is cancelled after republican brian kemp drops out. but you wouldn't know that from his explanation. we'll have the fact check just ahead on "morning joe." [ music playing ] i'm a musician about to embark on a concert tour.

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canceled after republican brian kemp pulled out, so he could campaign alongside president trump. now the debate had been scheduled for this sunday at 5:00 p.m. it was originally agreed upon by the candidates six weeks ago. but on monday, president trump announced he would be holding a rally for kemp in ma con, georgia at 4:00 pm p.. on tuesday, kemp backed out citing scheduling conflicts. the station organizing the debate once secretary kemp pulled out at the last minute, the candidates could not agree to a new time. yet, in a statement, kemp went on to claim it was his democratic opponent stacy abrams who cancelled the event. so, willie, i need to dig deep into your star wars archives. is this a jedi mind trick? >> it's not a great jedi mind trick. i don't think ob1 would sign off on this mind trick.

>> he wouldn't? >> okay. again the cheapening of words a thing happened, i'll say the other thing happened and hope nobody notices. again that race is air tight and will be among the fascinating to watch a woman seeking to be the first african-american woman ever to be governor in this country against the sitting secretary of state. it will be a fascinating race? i'd say choosing a racist rally over a debate says everything you need to know about a candidate. still ahead the president gives a long and winding answer, when asked if he's kept his campaign promise to never lie. we'll play that for you. plus, trump defends his fiery rhetoric against the press claiming it's his only way to fight back. we'll have a heated exchange with jim vandehi of axios. "morning joe" is coming right back. thank you. how many kids? my two. his three. along with two dogs and jake, our new parrot.

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with drones to assess home damage sooner. and if a flying object damages your car, you can snap a photo and get your claim processed in hours, not days. plus, allstate can pay your claim in minutes. now that you know the truth... are you in good hands? i have a 6-year-old grandson. he says, grandpa, how are you going to win the election? i said, you get more votes than the other person. it's as simple as that. >> that's quite not that simple. you got to give or take about 3 million votes. that's how you win. good morning. welcome to "morning joe." it's thursday, november 1st. joe is off this morning. along with willie and me, we have msnbc contributor mike barnical, republican strategist and msnbc political analyst

susan del percio is with us. editor of commentary magazine, contributor of the "weekly standard" and columnist of the weekly post john deaderis and from axios jim vandehi is with us. five days from the mid-term elections, president trump is doing everything he can to define the debate. yesterday, he tripled the estimated number of u.s. troops that he wants to go to the u.s.-members can border to the number of 15,000. more than the number of troops serving in afghanistan. it's a detail, but abc news pressed him on last night. >> reporter: you are talking 10,000, maybe 15,000 active military to the border? more than we have fighting the taliban and afghanistan, more than we have fighting isis and syria? you will really do that? >> it's really important. we have to be a wall of people, fairly highly trained people,

dedicated patriots. that's what they are. you have caravans that look laernl, i'm pretty good at estimating crowd size. they look a lot bigger than people would think. >> despite holding more than 60 votes to repeal the affordable care act, including one followed by a celebration in the white house rose garden last year, the president continues to make claims like this tweet. quote, republicans will protect people with pre-existing conditions far better than the democrats. a complete lie. in illinois, former vice president joe biden responded. >> yeah, the president of the united states saying we guarantee or whatever his phrase was, everybody come income with pre-existing conditions is covered. simply to the true. they're either not telling the truth or they're really stupid. >> at the president's campaign rally in florida last night, which burst into a chant of "lock him up" about tallahassee

mayor andrew gillum, the leading democrat for governor the president reduced birthright citizenship, which experts consider an explicit passage of the constitution to quote a crazy policy. and falsely argued that democrats support no border enforcement. >> a vote for democrats is a vote to liquidate america's borders and it's a vote to let methanol, heroin and other deadly drugs pour across our borders. >> and there was also this promise from the president 12 days ago. >> we are going to be putting in and are studying very deeply right now around the clock a major tax cut for middle income people. >> reporter: what was your time frame for that? >> i would say sometime around the 1st of november, maybe a little before then. >> a reminder, today is november

1st. nothing. finally the president made this argument for his party next wee week. >> if the mid-terms for some reason don't do so well for republicans, i think you all are going to lose a lot of money remember i hate to sigh. that i think you will lose a lot of money. >> so willie geist, he's flailing all over the place, whether it's racist-based policies, i'll put quotes around that, because lot of what he's saying which has racist tones to it isn't even possible and i don't even know where to begin in terms of describing a president who wants to put 15,000 troops the size of the troops in afghanistan or less to a border to receive a caravan of men, women, children, babies, that is not even close to the border at this point. >> he wants to put america at a war footing.

that's 15,000 troops, there are 14,000 troops in afghanistan give or take. so about the same number, same deployment is what he is looking for there. as you say, words are cheap the tax cut was out there a week ago, where's the tax cut? we are a few days away from election day. >> it doesn't exist. >> before election day to get people out to the polls, there is no tax cut. mike barnacle, when he talks about the border, talks about ending birthright citizenship, these are things to be done with five days left until election day, things to float into the atmosphere, things to rev people up. i hope he's not going to send 15,000 troops to the border and put them down from with a caravan that may arrive in two months. >> if anyone would know this is a scam being perpetrated by the president, based on the fact there is a dwindling group of truly desperate people still hundreds of miles away from the border, en route to the border,

if anyone would know it's a scam and a harmful and expensive misuse of the military, it would be secretary of defense mattis, i hope we can get him on the record about the use of the troops at the boarder. john, i don't know about you, but the president of the united states in my lifetime, which is considerable. it's longer than yours. i've never seen -- i'm telling you i go back to the '68 campaign, i've never 18 the sues of fear and division being employed by a national leader. that's what he is, by virtue of the fact that he's the president of the united states, being used on sometimes an hourly basis. i've never seen it. >> what i'm struck by is how self-conscious it is, in other words, you are not going to exploit fear and division, you generally don't need the stage directions. it's like when he said in that interview with abc, you know, i'm really good at counting the

you know crowds. so that's like -- that's a neolistic joke about the crowd counting issue at the inauguration. he's turning this into -- it was like a comedian's bit. you know, i'm really good at counting crowds, so i know we need 15,000 troops. because i can see there is a lot more people in that caravan. if you look at that and think about, it's like he's going, hay, i'm stoking fear. look over here at me, i'm stoking fear. which doesn't i think really stoke fear. that's the interesting thing when you do it that way, there's something totally false about it. >> yeah. >> i mean these 15,000 troops, they could literally, you could make the entirely opposite argument and say i'll escort each individually, we'll take a caravan member across the border like a welcoming committee.

>> i understand that steers into vast numbers of candidates who are so afraid to stand up and say, hey, wait a minute. >> it's amazing. think about a leader of the country that uses military force and debases the media in order to increase his political strength. you would say that could not happen in the united states of america and right now there are a lot of republicans out there who should be standing up, if you are in a swing district right now, i suggest doing an ad straight to camera, this fear this happening is unacceptable. i will stand up against it. because that may help you win if you are in a swing district. buying into this will hurt you and you are going to lose, because the turnout in swing districts in the congressional races are going to go against you. >> let's take a look at how this is playing with the public. a news hour marist poll measures the national mood of registered voters conducted sunday through monday in the wake of a spree of political violence measuring the national mood heading into the final week of the campaign. in the poll, president trump's

job rating among job ratings stand at 41%, 52% disapprove. asked about the tone in politics since trump was elected. 75% say it's gotten worse, 16% believe it's stayed the same. 7% say it's improved. given choices on who they blame for the lack of civility in politics, 42% say the president. 28% say the media. 18% democrats in congress. 17% said congressional politics. eight in ten voters say they are very concerned or concerned about fear in politics. so jim vandehi, axios out with an exclusive trip with him discussion his rhetoric with the press. let's listen. >> reporter: what scares the crap out of me is when you say enemy of the people, enemy of the people, how do they fight back. hold on, god forbid that you got fer vent supporters, they love

you, listen to you, enemy of the people. they like you, what happens if all of a sudden someone gets shot? someone shoots one of these reporters? i don't think you think worthy of the media people do you? >> i don't. if you gave me false reports, i don't say that good for the country. >> you are like the most powerful man of the world, if you say that word enemy, tens of thousands of people go to a stadium to listen to you, people go to social media get so jazzed up, i'm scared someone is going take it. >> it is my only form of fighting back. i couldn't be here zbhu. >> you won the presidency. >> no, i did this before i won. >> so jim it's about the fight. that was a fascinating exchange with president trump there. what did you take away from it? >> you know, what's most fascinating is that throughout the interview, that was where he seemed most comfortable. he wanted that confrontation. he want -- he so believes that

he is agreefbd, that he is like the victim of -- aggrieved of a victim that is more powerful than him. he concedes i feel aggrieved, i also feel like my base demand it, even if i didn't want to attack you or turn up the baltimore, that i have to. i even asked him at one point, every other president when there is a terrorist attack or something, they try to turn down the boil. it seems like you have an application to turn it up. he doesn't say no, he says, yes, i have no choice. he has a million choices. he keeps choosing escalation. i do worry profoundly that something bad will happen as a result of this. i disagree with what john was saying earlier, that people get the joke and maybe they know this is fear mongering. i don't think so. i think there is people at full boil and we're playing with fire. >> jim, i completely agree with you. i will tell you what you saw, how you are articulating it, reflect what is we saw during

the complain when we knew donald trump and actually spoke with him and went into his office and talked about the dangers of his birther-ism. he looked at joe as if joe would be in on the joke, he wasn't, he said, you know it really works. you know, it really works, i got to do it. it works. we said, no, you don't have to do it. it was wrong. we said it on the air and also said it to his face. here's the problem, you said he's most comfortable in that pocket. he is. you know why? because he has no commands of the fact what a policy is, of the understanding of what the constitution is about. he basically admitted to us that he doesn't read. he can't read. he takes things in mostly through hearing it, through watching it, through listening to it being a part of it. he has the command of playing the media. that's his sweet spot. you are absolutely right. >> that is exactly where he's comfortable because he can use

evil ways of manipulating people's thoughts, their beliefs and tapping into racism with his command of the media. >>. >> reporter: there is no doubt. it was actually a frustrating interview until that point. when you talked to him about policy, he's all over the place. >> he doesn't know anything. >> reporter: we were talking on google or amazon, i'm going to break them up. the next point i'm going to protect them. it's clear what he wanted to talk about on that day of all the things happening in the world, he wanted to talk about his obsession with the media. >> where he's comfortable. >> reporter: specific media figures, where he is comfortable. that's why there is not going to be a point. even if things get worse. we already had a shooting, these bombs sent via mail. it was clear he will never feel like he has onab obligation to turn it down. >> he doesn't care. >> even people that disliked

george bush. then things were bad, they were at a full baltimore. he knew he had the obligation to bring the boil down. he understands the danger when have you dry kindling and hot tempers that those two can spark something much worse than what we've seen. >> that is the thing i would say to trump supporters, the stuff does matter, the words do matter. if god more bid people take that, enemy, enemy, people think, oh my god, this isn't just my political opponent it's someone maybe they got to be hit, maybe they got to be shot. >> that is the danger at the point we're sitting at. you know what, it will get worse. after the election, we will not be talking about caravans. we will be talking about the republican establishment and robert mueller and the media again, it will be in very, very similar terms. >> you would hate for the democrats to have power in light of all of. that but i will just say, its not just dangerous. it's already happened. okay.

we're in a place right now where the president is deflecting from two major national events, one an attack on our democracy the other a slaughter at a synagogue, the worst if u.s. history. we will talk about both of those things, the synagogue and the mail bomb plot targeting the president's critics. plus what donald trump said again about george soros. you are watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. newest robot vacuum. it powerfully cleans from floors to carpets, even pet hair, with ease, and now for cleaning surfaces above the floor, it comes with a built in shark handheld. one dock, two sharks. the shark ion robot cleaning system.

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i believe the best technology should feel effortless. like magic. at comcast, it's my job to develop, apps and tools that simplify your experience. my name is mike, i'm in product development at comcast. we're working to make things simple, easy and awesome. welcome back to "morning joe." we have been talking all week about the not so subtle messages aimed at george soros. the president just doubled down. . >> i wouldn't be surprised. i wouldn't. i don't know. but i wouldn't be surprised. a lot of people say yes. >> john, your thoughts? >> so i was struck in your interview, jim, with trump that

he got very relaxed and you're saying like this is terrible. you are ramping people up. he was sort of like, c'mon, like, i wouldn't be here if i didn't do stuff leak this. you understand. this is all -- >> exactly. >> -- a part of a game. there is a kind of kneelism before, c'mon, let's talk turkey here. you know i got to do this. you got to come to me say, don't do this. i got to do it. the election will be of. we'll go do something else, something look that. it's as though he was trying to convince you not to take it seriously. >> reporter: yeah, you've got to watch his body language. it's almost like he relaxes. it's almost like you become on par with him. he just wants to have a conversation that to him is totally on the level, like, yes, of course i had to do this. look at what the press is doing to me, look at how my crowd responds to me. at one point they like me better

when i do this, i asked him, i heard the kids, a bunch of friends saying, you got to knock it off, cut the rhetoric. he's like, no, i heard it all. i'm winning. it's been working for me, i got here this way. that's how he feels. he feels differently. almost every day now it's a rant for somebody against trump. what we are talking about, micah was talking about earlier, you talk about sending 15,000 troops to the border. when you run that ad, i'm sure you will show later. it's a scary, all these drugs are coming in, all these thugs are coming in. yes, a caravan is coming. but it's totally disproportionate to the response and amount of attention that it gets. and this is different in politics. the only remote parallel i can think of barnacle wack talking in hit lifetime in mine would have been definitely when bush was president, there was always concerns he was politicizing

terrorism. at least the threat of terrorism was real. we really had intelligence reports saying there were potentially imminent threats in different areas at different times. this really isn't that real, he's saying he's a crowd size estimator than the rest of us. we seen the photos. maybe it's 4,000 instead of 2,000. it's men, women, children, weeks away on a border that is fortified already by two layers. you will send 15,000 in, which willie mentioned is what have you in afghanistan, we're fighting terrorists, thugs in one of the most dangerous places in the history of humanity. >> we are talking about tactics here, who you the president is handling this going into the election? he is talking about the the caravan, sending troops, ending birth right citizenship? he flowed the idea of a tax cut that evaporated suddenly the question is, will it have some impact come tuesday? we see the rallies the energy. we see them chanting, lock him

up. talk about mayor andrew gillum running in the state of florida to become governor there. will they work with republican voters or just with that segment of republican voters that was already going to be at the rally cheering, lock him up in. >> it depends on which republican voters you are talking about that go to the polls and kriswing in congressil districts. they will stay home or vote against the republicans because this is exactly the type of thing that turns them off. all of this bravado. it brings out the worst in trump to those kind of voters. if you talk about a senate race in the deep red state that like claire mccaskill or some others -- and nevada, for example, where it's purple, trump is staying away. so in a red state, that's going to work with republicans to really gin up their turnout. that's where the play s. one thing i want to say that jim said i find so surpriseing is he said, that when the president

replied, well, i have to fight back. it's my only way, like in the campaign. you are the president of the united states. you have a lot of things at your fingertips. do y you don't have to rely on news networks. can you go to the folks who have it. who can give you real numbers on the caravan. he wants to play into that certain media base. >> how does all of this impact the vote? steve kornacki breaks down the key senate sides, including arizona and missouri. >> that is next on "morning joe." ♪ at last,

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joining us now, national political reporter and author of the red and the blue steve kornacki. good morning. >> good morning. >> let's start in arizona, polling data mixed in that arizona race, a cnn poll has kyrsten sinema ahead by four points in the home stretch, to republican martha mcsally's 47%. he leads by six points in the

nbc marist poll. it shows a tied race. both of those polls were completed on monday. meanwhile, the abc 15 poll consistently favored mcsally released a poll conducted over a week ago, which gives mcsally a 7-point advantage at 52-45%. so what do you make of that disparity in those polls in. >> i do wonder the date you see might have something to do with it? there is some indication, we were having this discussion in this segment. the circumstances politically have changed in a week. we were talking around labor day of the democrats having a significant advantage nationally. we were talking mid-october, post-kavanaugh about the republicans closing the enthousandsiasm gap. states like arizona coming back into the mix for them, mcsally didn't have a chance there, but was pulling ahead in polls and states like that. maybe after the package response, trump's response to that, maybe after pittsburgh

trump's response to that maybe in his decision to lean in on the hot button coltural issues the last few days, maybe things are shifkt back to where they were in early september. so that could account for the kind of disparity you might see in arizona, where our poll will show one thing arc week ago, you poo it see something else. >> susan mentioned democratic senator claire mccaskill and attorney general josh hawley tied. if you watch this campaign closely, i know you have been, is sort of leaning into some trump policies here, kavanaugh the caravan, keeping herself down the middle and to the right each to get some trump voters and hold on to her seat. >> she is in a different -- remember 2027, claire mccaskill was the luckiest candidate alive, she was in missouri. that's when her republican opponent made comments about

quote legitimate rape. she was able to win easily. she has a much more disciplined republican o.in the josh hawley this year. he has not made those self-destructive mistakes. meanwhile, missouri, between 2012 and now has become that much more republican friendly, states that donald trump won by 20 points. so she's sort of running -- in some ways, look at it this way, if hillary clinton hadn't won in 2016, i don't think there is any circumstance claire miscass sill is in the game. she has the force of being an opposition party in the mid-term. you see she is running into strong head winds otherwise. >> it's extraordinary when mccaskill is asked about the caravan, she says i support the president. >> they are 43 and 43, they're in the high 40s. that's where you would expect a close race to be with less than a beak to go. is there something else in play keeping a 14% undecided or

moving around? because i find that shocking at this time. >> yeah. it varies, too, there are other polls that show the numbers higher. indiana we are seeing this too. donelly the democrat trying to hang on there. there is a liber that inin indiana getting 5,% of the polls. you worry with donelly, some of these states, are republican voters using the third party candidates the sort of reluctant, they don't want to vote democratic and aren't comfortable with trump, that becomes the vehicle to express that. >> let's talk about joe donelly. he has a seven-point lead 45 to 38% which libertarian lucy brennan takes 5%. a marist poll shows donelly ahead by two points. 48-46. donelly up three points in a three-way race. coming up on "morning joe,"

republicans pre condition has largely been what they want to wipe out. obamacare. but there has been a different message in the lead up to election day. we will talk about that and what it means for american's health care coverage next on "morning joe." [ music playing ] so lionel, what does being able to trade 24/5 mean to you? well, it means i can trade after the market closes. it's true. so all... evening long. ooh, so close. yes, but also all... night through its entirety.

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you remember well into the campaign you made a promise, you said, i will never lie to you. so can you tell me now, honestly, have you kept do that promise every time? >> i try, i do try. you say things about me that are not necessarily correct. i do try. and i always want to tell the truth when i can, i tell the truth. sometimes it turns out to be where something happens it's different or there is a change, but i always like to be truthfu truthful. >> that was president trump speaking with abc news last night. now, earlier in the show, wie

told you about the president's tweet claiming that quote republicans will protect people with pre-existing conditions far better than democrats. it's a cynical condition after kavanaugh and health care is the most important issue for most voters. since 2008, the average family's health insurance premium has increased 55% and our next guest writes in a new issue of "time" magazine about the health care voters. national correspondent for "time" hayley sweetland edwards joins us along with one of the country's leading senior correspondent for voy sarah cliff. hayley, i'll start with you. who are the health care voters and are they able to separate facts from fiction in this election? >> the health care voters are almost everyone, actually. if you -- in these polls, poll after poll shows that an

overwhelming number of democrats, the majority of independents and women of both parties, regardless of race or affiliate or a party affiliation say that he can heck is their most important issue. this is just very widespread. this is not just one state. this is not just one group of people. and i think that they are being bombarded with an enormous amount of misinformation and obfuscated information. after trump's tweet, there was this outpouring of democratic candidates saying, hey, how do you reconcile that tweet with trump's -- the trump administration filing a court filing if june saying. >> yeah. >> in texas asking to specifically get rid of the protections for pre-existing conditions in the aca. >> are you talking act his tweets, where he says i will always protect pre-existing conditions? >> exactly. he says i'll always protect

this. he doesn't reconcile that with hissed a many instration's full frontal attack precisely on those in the aca. i think voters are left in this middle ground trying to figure out who is actually going to protect our health care? who is going to lower our premiums? >> so, sarah there are certain voters who are frightened. i met a voter with diabetes who held out her diabetes medications and said this is $2,000. i don't know what i'm going to do. i guess my question is, how do you separate fact from fiction? and are republicans truly the party that wants to save pre-existing conditions as they continue to either convey or say flat out? >> yeah. it really is hard to navigate fact from fiction right now. you see a lot of republicans, not just president trump, also candidates like josh holly in missouri talking about how they

are going to protect pre-existing conditions. what they don't tell you is they are pursuing a lawsuit right now to end protections for pre-existing conditions. they are trying to gut that the part of the affordable care act. president trump has backed different versions of the obamacare repeal that would weaken productions for pre-existing knls. so there is a lot on the line with americans with diabetes or any sort of condition. this is polling from the family kaiser foundation that finds 14% of americans say pre-existing conditions protecting them are their most important issue in this election. so i think it's important voters understand what is at stake here. >> that is not easy where theit tweets we see from president trump and ads from republican candidates. >> these are astonishingly shameless declarations from governors running in office to participate in obamacare, putting on with my an no music in the background and their arms

around the elderly, i will always protect pre-exiting conditions. when we talked about the polling, far and away it's more important not like the caravan and things that distract us and distract some voters. are they dissatisfied with the affordable care act? because we already had this big overhaul of our health care with obama? is it that it's not working for them in. >> i think that's a part of it the affordable care act was wildly successful in many ways. it provided 20 million people with coverage largely under the medicaid expansion, through the exchange, 8 or 9 million get insurance. most get federal subsidy for insurance and they end up paying almost nothing every year. for those people the law is working great. but there is a large chunk of middle income america that doesn't qualify for those federal subsidies. they are subject for, subject to

as mika said, these 55% premium increases, the fact that deductibles have tripled over ten years. tripled. and that has far surpassed wages. so, you know, when we talk about just basic pocketbook issues for middle income american families, health care is the issue. >> so, sarah let's talk about that particular group of people hayley was just referencing. it wasn't that long ago in this culture of ours, political culture, economic culture that families would set aside so many money per week or per month for their children's college education. now the bite out of there paycheck for health care costs is such that they can no longer do that. is there any potential solution for those families? >> so i think you actually see democrats talking a lot about this as you see this growing support on the left for moving towards the medicare for all system. i think what we're looking at is an america where we don't use

more health care. we go to the doctor less than people in canada or in europe. but when we go to the doctor the prices are incredibly high. i wrote a story last year about a patients who paid $25,000 for a single mri. that's not something you would see in another country. and so i think that's why you see all this energy on the left, you see republicans still talking about obamacare repeal. on the left, there is a lot of discussion should the deposit be more involved? should we have a health care system like most other where the government regulates the prices. i think that's why, each though we have this major overhaul with the affordable care act eight years ago, there still is this energy to do more. it is all about these really high prices. >> yeah. hayley, on that point, i think we have actually, it's fair to say that republicans really don't have any answers for rising health care costs the democratic response as sarah said is essentially one range or

the otherf expandings medicare. essentially a buy-in or a medical care for you'll. the obstacle seems to be the outlays to providers. in california, we had a buildout, it will cost $400 annually. in vermont, it's been reduced to a statement of principles, because they can't get past the fact as bernie sanders has in his plan you have to reduce by 40% the outlays to care providers, that invites triage, lower quality of care and the public doesn't want to compromise there. so what is the democratic solution? how can they bridge that gap? >> i think you have really identified a primary problem that it does require a complete overhaul. from the voter's perspective, we are starting to see that recognition. it isn't as sarah said just democrats two are actually getting on board with medicare for all. you see about 70% of the country a majority of all voters of both parties. a slim majority of republicans. >> that includes a slim majority of republicans who are in favor of more of a public option now.

maybe not a full blown medicare for all. but on a state level, state legislatures are looking at a medicaid buy-in, of course a state-run program, which is potentially cheaper, potentially sustainable on a state level. but what's clear is as you are saying, can you not have the current system we have now without this just increasingly skyrocketing costs. we really have to sort of rethink it from the bottom up. sarah, before you go, you are the host of the podcast, the impact. and the new season, the first episode of the new season starts tomorrow. tell us about it. >> yes, so this is a show about a local experiment, the most interesting politics experiments happening all across america. i live in washington, d.c., where i am sure all you know things are really gridlocked. it is just not true when you go to city government and state government, there are so many innovative sometimes whacky

things. so we are going out looking at those, at seattle giving every single voighter $100 to donate to cannabis, south carolina doing innovative stuff to save baby's lives. if you are looking for good news stories about people doing real new policies, this might be a podcast for you. >> sarah cliff. thank you very much. hayley sweetland edwards, thank you as well. the new issue of "time" beyond hate is on sale tomorrow. up next, we'll talk to the democrat hoping to make history in vermont's race for governor. keep it right here on "morning joe." making my dreams a reality

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joining us now, christine hall qift, the democratic nominee running for governor in the state of vermont. welcome to the show. it's great to have you on. let's get right to it. you have a fascinating personal story. but i want to hear about your campaign. you left your job, you resigned as ceo of the vermont electric cooperative to run for governor. what's the message of your campaign? >> i should tell you, the reason i left my job is because i believe nationally our democracy's running is hanging by a thread. we have a republican who is following the exact same tactics as the national party. being explicit and forward as the national party would never get you elected as a republican.

we have basically a passive governor. and for vermont passivity equals complicity. >> what are you hearing from voters in terms of what's concerning them the most in the political atmosphere that we are in right now? sometimes we here in the media can get focused on president trump but we're hearing from across the board, across the nation, that this really is sort of an election over health care, over pre-existing conditions. what are you hearing from voters? >> well, i think what i'm hearing from voters is this election is a referendum. it's a referendum around the direction of our country and our state. you know, what's exciting for me, i'm feeling the same way we felt before the primary. and, you know, i'm getting a lot of republicans who are calling meg to say they're supporting me and they're supporting me for two reasons. one is i actually have a plan to

grow our economy. and the other thing is they don't like the tone of the republican election here. >> so is this to an extent about voting for a check on trump? >> i think it's a voting for a check on trump and a check on the republican agenda in general. when i talk about the republican agenda, you know, our governor says, you know, we have to wait for the federal government to solve climate change. i'm talking about leading a north american solution. our governor told the voters if they want medicare for all or health care for all, don't vote for him. i think health care costs, when i look at our retirement, health care costs are the biggest threat we have. our governor and the republican -- national republicans are kicking the can down the road. i feel bald becaud because my gn

is worse off than my generation. it's a very selfish agenda. >> susan. >> hi, good morning. you mentioned medicaid for all. you talk about a check on the trump administration. but you're running for governor of vermont. you also have a lot of really expensive proposals. you have taxpayer funded elections. connect every home, business, with fiber-optic cable, increase education spending. you have a lot in there that all sounds really good but as a governor of vermont, how do you plan on paying for it? >> well, you should know that's the republican rhetoric as know -- >> no, it's a question, it costs a lot of money. >> hang on, let me answer your question. let me answer your question. connecting every home and business with fiber on the plan that i have actually costs less than the way it's done today. infrastructure costs are built into your bill. i have a plan that's going to cost less than today. when it comes to medicare for all, we're all paying for that.

we're paying 18 cents of either gross domestic product dollar on health care. the other -- european countries spend 8 to 9 cents and cover everybody. we're already paying the most expensive health care cost in the nation. medicare for all is significantly less expensive. in vermont, we spent 31 cents of every health care dollar on administration costs. it's cheaper to get medicare for all than any other system they've proposed. >> i see increase in spending. why are you going to have the funds? as governor, you have to balance a budget. how are you going to provide all the services, whether it's education or the economy, all the growth things you talk about, how will you fund it without raising taxes? or will you raise taxes? >> let me also point out the republican agenda to get private schooling is more expensive. everything the republicans are

proposing is more expensive. >> ma'am, that's just throwing rhetoric around. i asked for a real answer. >> we connect every home and business with fiber-optic cable and a plan to grow our economy. we have to put more food on the table. otherwise, we're just fighting over the scraps. there's a big contrast here. i have a plan to grow vermont's economy so we have more revenue to do what we need. i know how to keep costs down. i ran an electric utility. we kept our rates flat for five years. a good business person knows you can cost control yourself right out of business. so a good business person has a plan to grow the economy. what we're seeing here nationally and locally is a tax, tax gimmick, saying no new taxes. because we're kicking costs down the road. >> all right, christine

hallquist, thank you. just for our viewer's information, "morning joe" reached out to governor phil scold's campaign to have him on for an interview and so far his campaign has not responded. time now for final thoughts. noah rothman, we'll give with you. >> yes. i mean, i'm struck by that interview. susan did an excellent job probing that issue. single payer is the watch word of the day on the democratic side. seems to be everybody appreciates this is a statement of principles. it's the state's legislature which stripped language from this bill saying they could do this but it's just not feasible. we're not getting to the nuts and bolts of what the democratic approach is. they better have better answers than this. >> susan. >> we've talked about a lot of issues, whether it be taxes or health care. i wish that's where our debate

was in the final days of this campaign. instead, i feel it's unfortunate we'll see donald trump continue to try and really stir the pot and use racist rhetoric. >> yes, mika, you know, we spoke about this earlier today. you know, in the course of an election campaign in this country, it's such a great country. such a wide diverse beautiful landfilled with people who work hard. to see it degenerate into the state that it's come to now based on race and divisions of the country, led by the president of the united states, is truly, truly sad. >> well, with that, i'd like to end on an up note. we talked about heavyweighty issues this morning. i think the story of the day was one halloween costume last night worn by a young man named emmitt. that is mike barnicle's grandson

dressed for halloween as mike barnicle. that's a mike barnicle costume. how old is he? >> almost 8 months old. >> your take on the costume which i believe he's nailed here. there it is. he'll got the blazer. the press pass. he's got the sneakers on which mike wears every day. there are a couple thoughts. >> he's a very good guy. >> honestly, you guys look exactly alike. he's beautiful. >> except he has more hair. >> that's true, he does. okay. well, mike, you look great. before we close, gosh, that was such an up note and so hopeful but i think about that baby and all babies across america and mothers across america. and i pray that you take a look at this president and his behavior during this time of national crisis. during this time of danger. and in the wake of a synagogue slaughter and a terrorist attack

on our democracy. i hope you vote for a check on this president. that does it for us this morning. stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now. >> thanks so much, mika. happy halloween to you, little emmett. good morning, everyone. i'm stephanie ruhle. five days away from the big midterm elections. we've got brand-new poll numbers that show just how tight tuesday's elections are going to be. while president trump hitting the trail for a final campaign blitz and his message is clear. >> national emergency covers a lot of -- they can't invade our country. it almost looks like an invasion. it really does look like an invasion. >> the caravan is an invasion? >> yes, i think so. >> no, it doesn't look like an invasion. celebrities turning out in droves for candidates across the country. we're live in georgia where stacy abrams is hoping an "o" can bring her a "w." >> our country depends upon