hour here at msnbc. stay tuned for "politics nation" with reverend al sharpton. ♪ good evening and welcome to "politics nation." tonight's lead, donald trump's legal picture is as cloudy as it's been during his presidency. and according to sources, even he's worried that his luck may have run out. as trump associates go down and talk of impeachment ramps up, look at it this way. as of today, trump is under criminal investigation for his campaign, his transition, his inaugural committee, his private business and his presidency. after an uncharacteristic social media silence, he returned to twitter hours ago, insisting

that, quote, never in the history of our country has the "press" been more dishonest than it is today. stories that should be good, are bad. stories that should be bad are horrible. many stories like with the real story on russia, clinton and the dnc seldom get reported. too bad. end of quote. the desperation is especially justified, because in the past week michael cohen was sentenced to 36 months in federal prison for various charges related to his actions as the president's former personal attorney. and today we learned more about where the president allegedly fit into those actions. we also learned that federal prosecutors are investigating charges that middle eastern nationals tried to curry favor with the trump white house by

donating through proxies to the record breaking haul that funded the president's inaugural committee. and former trump national security advisor, michael flynn awaits sentencing tuesday for lying about his contact with russian agents after a federal judge this week ordered all documents from flynn's fbi interview be turned over for review. joining me now, amy tarkanian. republican str and david brock, founder of media matters for america. amy, let me start with you. the political sky and maybe legal sky of the president appears very cloudy at this point.

as a republican, at what point do you feel many of those that are in your party and the senate in others start to say, wait a minute, this is too much weight to bear. >> well, that's a very fair question. and there are many moving pieces. we would need to take a look at each one of those items that you listed at the top of the show separately. we cannot put them all in one big lump of being overwhelmed situation. so you've got possible criminal activity. you've got possible civil activity being broken. you have people that are s surrounding the president that have been found to break the law. but again there has been no collusion found dealing with russia. none of that that you've listed really involves the president

himself. it's the others like michael flynn that was caught lying. that deals with flynn. >> michael cohen has said he was involved. pecker from national enquirer -- >> cohen also said he would take a bullet. he lied. >> michael cohen has a conversation on tape between he and the president discussing a transaction that did occur. so you can't say these are just statements. he has a tape that we heard him and the president talking about three transactions. >> the president personally financed his own campaign. so we're walking a fine line here. so were these financial transactions that were paid through the campaign finances or through his personal finances? but everything was paid from personal finances. >> i don't know that's a

distinction that makes a difference, because whether he paid it personally or the campaign, if it was for the campaign, it's campaign-related if he, in fact, made payments. because he didn't want his campaign embarrassed or disrupted or voters to look negative. that is in fact a campaign-related item that should have been disclosed and that is above what you're allowed to do if he did it through another party. >> correct. this was a direct effort to cover up something and hold it back from voters. and it's not only casting lenlt legitimacy on his president, but we've known that the trump administration and the trump orbit is corrupt. we've known that for a long time. what happened this week was veering into criminal behavior. i'm one who thinks we start to see some republicans break. not yet. but you already started to see a few fissures.

you saw on fox.com referencing this criminal behavior, not trying to cover it up. they need to remember that nixon's support held until it collapsed. i think this is very serious. and it does get to collusion. if you look at the documents closely, russia is in there. they say that cohen is cooperating at the core of the investigation, but the whole ball of wax is russia. these payments to women are terrible and possibly criminal, but we're really going to russia. in the butina filings also there's discussion that her boyfriend says the nra was the link between russia and trump. >> butina is who plead guilty this week. >> that's right. >> the russian national, plead guilty to essentially being an unregistered foreign agent. and in those documents her boyfriend, it says, suggest that

is the nra could have taken foreign money from russia, put it into the trump campaign. who knew about that, who were the liaisons? did trump himself know? because as we know, trump seemed to know an awful lot. he is in the room when these payments to these women were being made. >> democratic congressman adam schiff earlier today tweeted, quote, we're going to do our job and follow the facts wherever they lead. at the end of the day, we need to know that the president of the united states is acting in the national interest and not for another purpose. that's what the american people expect of us and what we must deliver. this is adam schiff, who's going to now be in a senior position in the house saying this. does that spell to you that come january, when the democrats take the house, there's going to be a lot more coming forward and a lot more of these people being called forward as we see where

this leads? >> yes. and essentially what the house is going to do is their job. i think we can all agree in the past two years that the current house, republican-controlled house, has not done their job. their job is to provide oversight of the executive branch and they failed to do it. i find it astonishing because the republicans for a long time have said they are the party of law and order. yet, when you see indictment after indictment, guilty plea after guilty plea, all of a sudden now they want to split hairs. i look forward to these investigations. i think as americans we all must know exactly what happened and get down to the bottom of it so we can understand what happened with russia. then of course there are also a whole host of other investigations that this house failed to do, such as what happened in puerto rico, what's going on at the border. there are so many things they have failed to do in terms of

providing oversight of the executive branch. i look forward to that. >> let's put the president as a personality aside for a minute. as a republican who served in congress, doesn't it disturb you that we may have a president that had some dealings with russia, dealings with the saudis? i mean, the allegations alone, doesn't that disturb you as someone who served in this country's congress? >> i apologize. i have not served in congress. it would be nice to have that title. i'm a former state party chair. >> i stand corrected. but even so, as one that was a party chair of that party, doesn't it disturb you that the titular head of that party has been accused by people he hired, he selected. and he said i only select the best. they're saying he did this.

>> it does bother me. i want to stake ittake it a ster with adam schiff's tweet. it is important that we have full confidence in our president. on the other hand, let's look at general flynn, who was caught lying. he was ambushed basically by the fbi, who once again, that's another government agency that we should trust as americans. we have bigger problems, i think, on our hands than we realize. >> so if he's ambushed, david, that means that justifies telling a lie? >> no, no, no. it does not. >> this is the deep state conspiracy. >> yeah. i don't know what that means. >> this is meant for an audience of one which is donald trump who's attacked the institutions like the fbi of being corrupt and biassed. flynn is playing for pardon. >> even if he was, that justifies therefore --

>> no. >> even though he was notified they were going to come see him, even though he knew he was going to be interviewed, but that justifies him saying things that are not true? >> no technically a lie is a lie. >> you don't agree with rudy giuliani? >> i don't. >> just checking. >> it's been reported he was not given the choice to have legal counsel at the time that the fbi -- >> here's a man who says i don't want to talk until i have counsel. >> no, of course it matters. there's still a process that has to be followed through with. if you lied or didn't lie, there's still a process. >> there is a process, but what he said -- >> he said he didn't -- >> we know he lied. >> he said he didn't need an attorney present there. i think that it is astounding that a sitting national security advisor, 33-year veteran, former

lead of of an intelligence agency all of a sudden is, oh my god, i'm not sure what to do when the fbi shows up. you have got to be kidding me. it's not convincing. it's not even credible to make that sort of argument when you're talking about someone of this stature. he's so sophisticated. he was not your average joe. >> correct. i completely agree with you. but there's still a process. >> it's not convincing and it's not credible. >> let's hold it right there where she agrees with you but it's still a process. first, senator sherrod brown is one of the many potential 2020 candidates for president. he has ideas on how best democrats can defeat president trump. (chime)

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♪ welcome back. i caught up with another democrat whose name has been thrown around as a potential contender for president in 2020, ohio senator sherrod brown. i started by asking him about the push for a new criminal justice bill. thank you for joining us, senator brown. let me ask you first about the first step bill, the criminal justice reform act that some are

pushing bipartisan, supposed to go to a vote before the end of the year. what is your position on it and what do you forecast? >> first, i'm speaking right now to someone who has been leading the charge on this for decades literally on criminal justice reform, on sentencing reform, on prison reform. this is called the first step act because it is only a first step, but it really, really matters to our country and i've been a strong supporter. not as long as you have, reverend sharpton, and not as aggressively as you have, but strong supporter for years. it's the first step act and it is the first step. mcconnell has been shamed into scheduling this on the floor next week. it's bipartisan. it should pass with a strong vote now that we've got mcconnell actually to put it on the floor. after we do this, after we get a presidential signature, we should be looking at the second

chance act. we should be looking at ban the box that i worked on with cory booker and others for years. president obama did an executive order that way. that was a start but it's never as important as passing a law. we know this is a problem that's afflicted young particularly men of color and beyond that, but especially men of color. it's about time congress acts. >> and it will bring some relief to a lot of people. i wanted it to go further, but it is appropriately named first step. after some moving around that we didn't know if mcconnell would push it through, it looks like it will go to vote. let me ask you in your capacity as a member of the senate finance committee, we're hearing the president making all kind of noise about the wall and that he's going to shut the government down if he doesn't get the money for the wall. now, i might have been missing

something, but i thought mexico was paying for the wall. now he's saying to democrats and republicans in the house and the senate, you've got to come up with the money for the wall. what will happen? will you and others push to come up for some compromise money for his wall, or will you risk the government shutdown and what will that mean to government workers? >> well, we play it straight. i mean, the president -- it was embarrassing for us as a country to watch the president's childish rant last week. it made me proud of chuck schumer and especially proud of nancy pelosi standing up to him, because she's female, just the way he treated her was particularly outrageous, but it's what you'd expect from this president. no. if you shut down the government -- the president of the united states, the commander in chief, the ceo, if you will of this country, that he's willing to shut down the

country, that he said he's proud of it, tells you a whole lot about him. the country doesn't agree with a shutdown. it means tens of thousands of border agents and fbi and customs officials would either be laid off or would work with no pay during that period. it's always an attack on federal employees. that's what this president does. it's also an attack on the country that you think shutting the government down is an appropriate thing. we do not want to build this wall. the country doesn't want to build this wall. i take a back seat to nobody in border security, but you start with not snatching children from their families, not gassing those kids, those babies, those adults, period. you don't do that. you do real border security with technology and agents and helicopters and all that you need to do. but we're not going to give him anything close to 5 billion dollar to build the wall that

most of the country doesn't want and i dare say most senators in both parties -- the republicans are not willing to stand up to him, but i know the overwhelming number of senators don't want this wall either. they think it's ineffective and wasteful of tens of billions of taxpayer dollars. it should be used for so many things, for head start, for cleanup of lake erie, all kinds of things. >> as we wind down this year, you have proven a democrat who has taken very progressive stands, can win in the midwest, can win in a state that is vitally important. what is it that a hot of people don -- lot of people don't get about the ability to go beyond the progressive label or

conservative. you're not bound by a label and had a very successful campaign and the results were successful in terms of returning you to the senate. >> thank you. the last time i actually was in your presence, as you remember at the national action network, the work you do at the russell office building, which should be named the kennedy office building, but that comes later, was talking about that. it shows, if you're a progress, you can win as a strong progress in a state like mine. trump carried my state by eight points, but you could turn that around -- if you love your country, you fight for the people that make it work. that's whether you punch a clock, work for tips, work on a salary, whether you're raising children, whether you swipe a badge. it means standing for the dignity of work. you do it without compromise on civil rights, without compromise on women's rights, without

compromising on lgbt rights and you do it without caving to wall street or president trump. if you stand for the dignity and work and you honor people that work regardless of their jobs, but you respect it and honor it and with that comes health care and decent wages. fundamentally, if you work hard in this country, you ought to be able to have something to show for it, you ought to be able to get ahead. talking like that and governing like, that it works whether you're a physical therapist in providence rhode island, whether you're working in a restaurant in sacramento or whether you're a steel worker in dayton, ohio. that message rings true and wins elections and is the template and the blueprint for governing onward. >> we're hearing people saying sherrod brown should run for president in 2020. what does sherrod brown say?

>> well, i don't know yet. i didn't dream of this my spire life. my wife and i were pretty overwhelmed to win this elect n election. talking about dignity of work during the campaign, advocacy for workers without compromising on civil rights and women's rights and lgbt rights. we're thinking about it. i've got to decide in the next couple months. what at a minimum i want to happen is my message of dignity of work, i want other candidates to begin to adopt that message because it's the right way to govern and the right way to win elections in those swing states along the great lakes, the heartland, the industrial midwest, really the key to replacing donald trump. everybody's goal in every democratic candidate who i know and i know most of them, the goal of all of us is how do you

beat trump, how do you get this country in a different direction, because we can't afford four more years of this person in the white house, period. >> well, senator sherrod brown, we thank you for being with us. >> we'll do it again. >> we'll certainly be watching as the new year unwinds. thank you so much. >> thank you, reverend sharpton. up next, president trump is calling on the american people to revolt. i'll tell mr. president what i think about that idea in just a moment. fidelity is redefining value for investors. introducing zero account fees for brokerage accounts. and zero minimums to open an account. we have fidelity mutual funds with zero minimum investment.

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for my weekly memo po president trump, this week his former fixer michael cohen was sentenced to jail for lying to congress. he admitted to paying hush money to two women before the 2016 elections on behalf of trump. but the president isn't worried about losing his job. he told reporters this week, quote, it's hard to impeach somebody who hasn't done anything wrong and who's created the greatest economy in the history of our country.

i'm not concerned. no. i think that the people would revolt if that happened. let me tell you what i think about that call for revolt. mr. president, you've made a lot of accusations. you've said lock up hillary clinton, but you never said the people may revolt. you said barack obama was not born where he was born. actually questioning his nationality. but he never suggested people revolt. it is down right irresponsible to even suggest that people would revolt after there are lengthy investigations and your friends, your soes yaassociates say you did wrong and you should be held accountable. by the way, mr. president, the people have spoken. have you heard of the midterm elections? there was a political revolt at the polls and it sunk your party in many states around the

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talk to your doctor about xarelto®. ♪ welcome back to "politics nation." when one door closes, another one opens at the white house. interior secretary ryan zinke announced earlier today he will leave the trump administration at the end of the year. while last night we learned that office of management and budget

director mick mulvaney will be the next white house chief of staff after john kelly departs in january. for more, let's dig into this with our panel. this moving around is not unusual in the second year of an administration, but when you look at the people involved, zinke who contracted a firm in puerto rico that to say they botched it up would be an understatement. they had no track record. he's been accused of spending $130,000 to replace three door

settings. you have another member of the administration when a 7-year-old child is found dead, they blamed the parent, saying the parent shouldn't have brought them here. a 7-year-old kid is dead. i mean, the kinds of people that has been in this administration has been insensitive on many occasio occasions, to say it lightly. >> yeah. i think it's been corrupt and it's been inkoccompetent. this is the third cabinet official, after price, after pruitt, to go down. there are 12 investigates against zinke. clearly he was trying to get ahead of the democrats taking control of congress with their subpoena power to really find out the extent of the corruption there. on the white house chief of staff shakeup, it's embarrassing that president trump had to take a deal for mick mulvaney to only be acting chief of staff. who's an acting chief of staff? and he's keeping his day job,

apparently, at the omb. this is a recipe for chaos at the white house. >> as you deal with the dysfunction, what does it do about the stability of the country when we're dealing with very serious issues, foreign and domestic? >> exactly. i've said this many times before. the white house is a temp agency. it's a revolving door. it does not bode well for the stability of the country, because we need a government to function. in fact, i've been talking with some people that i know who are not into big government, but they've acknowledged over the past two years that we do need a government to function properly. we need a government to be there to ensure that if there's a calamity as what happened in puerto rico, that they know what they are doing, that they're competent. >> wildfires in california, mass shootings. >> exactly. we need them to do what it is

they say they're going to do. we have our tax dollars going to the government to ensure that we're safe, if there's a calamity that actions can be taken to make sure that we're safe. it does not bode well for the stability of the country, both domestically and internationally. >> amy, there are republicans that are able, that are competent and are capable. i know some are probably surprised to hear me say that, but it doesn't seem to be the kind of republican that trump brings into his circle. it's sort of like he only wants those that will not argue with him or disagree with him. isn't it bad for your party and for the nation to have less than the most capable and efficient people helping to run government? >> i actually think mick mulvaney was an excellent choice. >> he's only temporary though. >> he could also become

permanent. >> or not. but go ahead. >> fair enough. sometimes people learn things the hard way. maybe that's the way our president learns. i am very excited about mick mulvaney filling this position, temporarily, permanently, whatever it may be. i know that a number of republicans are very confident with this choice. my husband is very close with senator rand paul and some of his staff members. he spoke with him yesterday and congratulated them on the choice. they actually used the words tremendous. >> are they comfortable with how the president treated jeff sessions? are they comfortable with any number of people that the president has disparaged, omarosa, the list goes on. these are people that fought for him, defended him, stood for him and he trashes them on twitter. >> sure, but we're talking about the sheaf of staff and mick mulvaney. >> no. i talked about zinke. i talked about how he was going

on moving to certain people in other parts. >> sure. secretary zinke has a lot of investigations going on. it's probably wise for him to move on so he's not under the spotlight and under the radar the way that he is. plain and simple, it's probably a smart move on his part. >> the president has a lot of investigations going on, but i'll let you go there. let me ask you this, less than 24 hours ago the federal judge in texas ruled that obamacare is unconstitutional, leaving americans wondering what might happen to their health care. remember, today is the final day of enrollment for 2019 benefits. just moments ago, a reaction from former president barack obama himself on facebook saying, quote, that's why it's so important for you to know that last night's ruling changes nothing for now. as this decision makes its way through the courts, which will take months, if not years, the

law remains in place and will likely stay that way. so president obama, the author of the affordable care act known as obamacare, says go register, you have a few hours to enroll. do it, nothing's going to change. but the politics of this, the town hall meetings that republicans were bombarded at in republican areas when people felt they were going to lose their preexisting conditions and the health care, this ruling does not help them, david. >> no. i think it's a terrible ruling for republicans even though it's a republican judge. as you said, in town hall after town hall, in paid commercials, all through the fall republicans claimed they were trying to protect preexisting conditions. but as republican states that are behind the effort to undermine obamacare, it's republicans in the congress who changed this law to allow this decision.

i think this is a terrible step for republicans. democrats, of course, their signature issue, the reason we have this revolt of democrats because voters voting for health care. obamacare is terribly popular now. >> amy, let me sit back and let you talk. the republicans said they would come up with their own health care plan. they were against the affordable care act. president was against it in 2016. he says we're going to come up with our own health plan and no one will be in jeopardy of losing their health care. we're two years in. what's the plan? >> that's a very good question. i know that a number of republicans would actually like to have that repealed and start over. >> but what's the plan? >> well, they would like to have all democrats and all republicans go back to square one. >> so we should stop people's preexisting conditions be covered? >> no. republicans are actually for preexisting conditions. that's a scare tactic.

>> are we saying go -- >> now, because i'm not an attorney, i did type this up. >> i'm not either. i only play one on television. >> getting back to the court ruling from texas, so in 2012, the supreme court held that obamacare was constitutional. remember that there were two parts to this ruling, which is really important. the first part, it was found unconstitutional to impose a mandate that americans were required to buy insurance. step two, a majority of the court held the individual mandate to a constitutional tax penalty. so president trump's new tax bill, they eliminated the tax penalty. >> which is why the ruling -- what did they do? >> what she said is correct. >> which means if they had not removed the mandate, he would not have been able to make that move. >> correct. >> and the republicans did that? >> right. >> even though they are for

preexisting conditions -- >> allegedly. >> -- they removed the mandate that would have had that go forward. >> right. >> now 19 republican attorneys general and this white house supported this particularly ruling in texas and they were in favor of it. but your question, i think is an important one, because republicans have controlled congress for years now. they have had so many opportunities to come up with a plan. . if they didn't like the affordable care act, they had so many opportunities to come up with a plan that's better. so i don't understand how it is. the fact that they haven't come up with a plan, the only conclusion you can glean from that is they just want to get rid of it because obama did it. because if you really cared about providing health care for americans, you would have come up with a plan by now. >> i have to leave it there.

thank you. always good to have you, david. up next, the democrats just weeks away from taking the house. could the question of impeachment be the first item on the agenda? the last member of the judiciary committee for his insight. be right back. ♪ the new capital one savor card. earn 4% cash back on dining and 4% on entertainment. now when you go out, you cash in. what's in your wallet?

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to impeach or not to impeach. those discussions are rumbling in congress as allegations potentially tying president trump to multiple federal crimes mount. he is now confiding to close friends that he is alarmed by the possibility, according to multiple sources. with democrats poised to take the house in january, could the question of impeachment purchase to the forefront? joining me now is tennessee congressman steve cohen, a leading democrat on the house judiciary committee that heard james comey's testimony last week. congressman, will impeachment be front and center in january when the new house is seated? >> i don't believe it will be front and center, as we want to

implement certain goals that we have for the american people and they elected us on, which is protecting health care and the affordable care act and preexisting conditions, which the republican governors brought a lawsuit that they were successful lawsuit where they were successful in texas to strike down on the affordable care act, and we want to support giving people pre-existing conditions and health care and working on the prescription drug prices and the awful ethics that have been going on, and clean up the swamp and creating jobs through a strong infrastructure build. impeachment will certainly be in the mood, and there will be hearings on things like on clause violations, and there will be efforts to protect special counsel mueller and all of those things have to do with impeachment, and the front burners will be making every day

lives better. >> i think we have to deal with intp infrastructure and health care, and we can walk and chew gum at the same time. james comey is come bag back next week, and why is he being brought back to the judicial committee? >> i don't think we learned anything and i don't know why he is being brought back. i think republicans on the judicial committee, and it's probably reflective of the republicans and most of the republicans in the house have an obsession with hillary clinton and her e-mails and trying to find some fault to take the focus off of what has been the most horrific actions by the president of the united states in being an unindicted coconspirator, and wing the erection

erection -- election by paying hush money. they are trying to take atechtion away from that and say there's some equal university with hillary clinton. there's nothing there, and comey made a point, there's nothing there and he did not see any reasonable prosecutor seeing a case and there was not anything there, and they want to continue beating a dead horse, and they seem not to be able to do anything different than that. >> you have known since i have known you throughout your congressional career very aggressive and fighting on issues like jobs and infrastructure and health care, and yet there has been criticism the democrats have not been that aggressive and have not fought. are we going to see a more aggressive -- a party that now has a majority that is really going to fight for the issues that they promised during the

mid-term elections, are they going to be more like steve cohen? >> i think they will be. nancy pelosi is going to be a our speaker, and she was responsible for the health care law passing and largely responsible for dodd/frank passing, and she's a liberal and cares about people and she knows people suffer and need help with the snap payments and they need help with head start and with jobs and job training, and these are all going to be priorities of pelosi's leadership in the house, and she's going to make the house of representatives great again. >> there's a lot of focus already on 2020, but i went to public schools in brooklyn, and 19 comes before 20. we are going to see movement

towards these issues in '19? >> the problem will be in the senate, i guess, and there are certain places where we will have unity, and that's going to be on jobs and the infrastructure bill, and trump is not wanted to come up with a good funding mechanism, but we are going to try and do that. he talked about a 25 cent gasoline tax, and that may be necessary. we have not had an increase in the gas tax, and i think the democrats will pass a good agenda, and it depends on what mitch mcconnell and the republicans do. they will be 48 democratic votes, and you have to get the bill to the floor so mitch mcconnell is a large part of it. he may see the writing on the wall and republicans want to win in 2020 and keep their majority and what is going to come out for mueller on trump is going to make it difficult for republicans to maintain their majority in the senate. it's a bad year for them. a lot of republicans are up and

some in difficult states, and more and more is going to come out. i think robert mueller has phone conversations taped by michael cohen and other information on audio tapes and i think the american public, even though 35% that are supporting him will say this has been the greatest swindler. >> thank you. my final thoughts. stay with us. i just got my cashback match,

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wilson passed. nancy wilson a great american artist, 70 albums, three grammys and brought dignity and pride. she sung to all americans and was accepted even while there was still jim crow laws in many states, yet she took the risk of standing up for what was right even at the height of her career, and was involved in the selma to montgomery voting march, and several civil liberty activities. when others take their god given

gifts and bless others with it and put their country above their career, that's what nancy wilson did. may she rest in peace. that does it for me. thank you for watching. i will see you book here tomorrow live with a brand-new show at 5:00 eastern. up next, "deadline: white house" hosted by john heilemann. >> aloha, everyone. i'm john heilemann sitting in for the one and only but absent today nicolle wallace. michael cohen once famously said to someone actually sitting at this table that he would take a bullet, in quotes, for donald trump. that was then. and now, the president's former lawyer and fixer is sending a message to his old boss. i know the truth. the feds know the truth and everyone else is about to know it, too. in his first interview since being sentenced to three years in prison, cohen undercut trump's legal argument in the case that appears increasingly likely to be brought against him in the southern district of new york.