penalized and we cannot tolerate victimizers thinking they can hurt the careers of people after they already crushed how they feel inside themselves that does it for me. thanks for watching. i'll see you back here next saturday and to keep the conversation going like us on facebook.com/politicians nation. and follow us on twitter up next, "meet the press" with chuck todd this sunday, temporary truce. a short-term funding deal to end the government shutdown. >> in a short while i will sign a bill to open our government for three weeks. >> democrats get what they demanded talks without a wall >> have i not been clear on a wall okay i have been very clear on the wall >> no one should ever underestimate the speaker. as donald trump has learned. wh

>> i will use the powers >> mr. trump hints he may declare a national emergency to get what he wants. >> i will use the powers afforded to me under the laws and the constitution of the united states to address this emergency. >> but after 35 days, what did president trump gain shutdown h president trump's approval ratings, and how do americans feel about where the c plus our brand-new nbc news/"wall street journal" poll what effect did the shutdown have on the president's approval ratings? how do americans feel about where the country is headed right now? my guests this morning, house minority leader kevin mccarthy, house democratic caucus chairman and republican senator marco rubio. also, the russia investigation a seven count indictment of roger stone details the most direct connection yet between the administration and wikileaks. >> i will plead not guilty to these charges. i believe this is a politically motivated investigation. >> joining me are, nbc news senior correspondent tom brokaw

hour, yamiche alcindor, white house correspondent for the pbs news hour, hugh hewitt and nbc news white house correspondent can kristen welker welcome to sunday, it's "meet the press. >> from nbc news in washington, the longest running show in television history, this is "meet the press" with chuck todd >> good sunday morning president trump knows who the real leader of the democratic party is now and he can't say nancy pelosi didn't warn him remember this? >> mr. president, please don't characterize the strength that i bring to this meeting as the leader of the house democrats. >> that was before she was officially speaker this week, the president learned all about that strength. first, when he backed down on giving the state of the union address this tuesday and then again on friday, when mr. trump gave speaker pelosi what she had demanded, a reopened government, talks and no wall. at least for three weeks that concession by president

trump came hours after robert mueller drew a clear line between the trump campaign and wikileaks when he indicted roger stone on seven counts. it was in short a very bad week for the president.ted before frs that indicates despite the drawn out shu we have a brand-new nbc news/"wall street journal" poll completed before friday's events that indicates despite the shutdown, the president's base has stuck with him mr. trump approval rating stands at 43% with 54% disapproving it's where it was a month ago, before the shutdown. obviously, we know other polls have shown a notable drop in that time. our poll found a notable drop in another category the right direction, wrong track numbers. they are the worst of mr. trump's presidency with barely a quarter of the country, just 28% saying that we are headed in the right direction. that's reflected in this word cloud of how people feel about the state of america now with words like wrong track, disappointed and disaster dominating the responses all of this was before friday's stone news and the end of the

shutdown that was widely seen now as pointless after 35 days of pain, frustration and anger, what did the president get that he could not have gotten on day one >> i am very proud to announce today that we have reached a deal to end the shutdown >> president trump spent 34 days insisting the government would stay closed until congress approved billions of dollars for a border wall. >> $5.7 billion for a physical barrier. $5.7 billion >> he is not negotiating with himself. he said $5.7 billion. >> on day 35 with his news sagging in polls, air traffic control stalling and some congressional republicans in revolt, he backed down at least for now >> president trump in retreat. >> unmistakably, a surrender >> the president gave in >> no one should underestimate the speaker as donald trump has learned. >> some conservative allies are calling the president a wimp, writing, trump blinks. >> he promised something for 18 months and he lied about it. >> it's clear trump did not come out on top

i'm not going to spin it for you. >> the president fired back. this was in no way a confession. if no deal is done, it's off to the races. the last reference, his threat to declare a national emergency if negotiators don't get a deal in three weeks >> obviously, we're going to do the emergency, because that's what it is, it's a national emergency. >> on friday, mr. trump's long time confidant, roger stone, was indicted and arrested charged with seven counts of lying to congress, witness tampering and obstruction. >> i will plead not guilty to these charges. i will defeat them in court. >> stone's indictment reveals the most direct link yet between the trump campaign and wikileaks. which distributed democratic e-mails that russian military intelligence stole from the dnc and the clinton campaign the indictment includes this notable sentence after wikileaks released stolen dnc e-mails on july 22, a senior trump campaign official was

directed to contact stone about any additional releases and what other damaging information organization one, wikileaks, had on the clinton campaign. >> how many people could direct a senior campaign official >> stone communicated with wikileaks through an intermediary five days later -- >> russia, if you're listening -- >> that same day, july 27, russian hackers tried to hack into servers in clinton's personal campaign office on october 4, stone told steve bannon, then the chief executive of mr. trump's campaign that wikileaks had a serious security concern but would release a load every week going forward three days later, wikileaks began selectively releasing clinton campaign chair john podesta's e-mails. >> the allegation that two campaign officials instructed me or inquired of me about wikileaks is false >> joining me now is the house republican leader, congressman

kevin mccarthy of california congressman, welcome back to "meet the press. >> thanks for having me back. >> on day one of the shutdown, the president had a deal in front of him that was essentially a continuing resolution for three weeks no wall. that's the deal he agreed to on day 35 what was accomplished? >> nobody likes to go into a shutdown one thing i -- if you look at winners and losers, i don't know why someone would celebrate a status quo i watched the pretty in every one of the meetings offer a reasonable solution. i watched then leader pelosi spend a new historic time on the floor of the house, eight hours talking about sda cra., we don' we don't have the daca solution solved we still have a problem at the border we don't have that solved. we have three weeks to go. i watched speaker pelosi and would not negotiate with anything i give president trump a lot of credit i put the american people before politics he said -- >> after 35 days for 35 days, what did he get >> i'm not celebrating getting something because what people are celebrating saying speaker

pelosi is strong because she got status quo that's not what the country wants. the country wants to find common ground the president made four different offers it was speaker pelosi said, i won't talk about anything. we have 35 days of speaker pelosi not negotiating the president finally said, this is too much. if you say you will do something else, i will open it up so the federal workers will be paid let's see where you will go in three weeks. >> that was her stance she will negotiate after you open the government. >> no. her stance was not $1 for a wall we're not going to do anything, it's immoral i don't believe that's where her members are as well. if you listen to her own chair of agriculture said give trump the money. her chairman of armed services says walls work. even her number two says, walls are not immoral. she's out of step with her own base >> in three weeks, the president is unlikely to -- do you really believe you are going to get a compromise that democrats will trade something temporary for something permanent? a permanent structure for

temporary relief for some of the folks? do you believe that will happen in three weeks >> if democrats have always in the past voted for some barrier and now they're not going to because it's being offered by president trump, that's politics that means we would have a crisis at our border if in three weeks they said before if you open it up we will negotiate, they won't. they are the ones causing the problem. they have changed the course of what they voted for in the past. speaker pelosi had voted for a wall and barrier schumer had voted for a wall and barrier. but now they will not? because it's president trump i think that's wrong >> the gang of eight that you guys in the house never brought to a vote did have extra fencing in it. i believe it was 350 miles of extra fencing. had $46 billion in border security what's wrong with gang of eight being the beginning of the negotiations >> last year i spent more than a month, every single day in my white house and we tried to come

office, with durbin, with steny, with the chief of staff of the white hous we tried to come together on an immigration bill it's one of the hardest things ever to do when i see a crisis on the border, 500,000 people illegally enter our country, when we were the most liberal bringing in a million new people every year, the way we should do it, i think this is an opportunity to not only solve a border crisis, but we have kids here dealing with daca they are both big issues, solve them right now. >> the only way to make it happen is if both sides are willing to buck their base >> yeah. indication >> is the president actually willing to buck his base he has never given an indication he is. he may call a national emergency. >> that is not true. the president is the only one who has been reasonable in these negotiations chuck, i have been in every single meeting i watched him. the president is the one who offered. this president is the one who at the state of the union went further on immigration than i have heard from a president clinton or even president obama. no, that is unfair it was only the democrats who would interject when the secretary of homeland tried to talk about the current crisis. they didn't want to hear it. they didn't want to negotiate.

they said nothing. it was the president that offered four different plans yeah it moved further than i think this party -- >> let me ask you this i want to play something from you in november of 2016. >> i love when -- >> i know you do because i think it's going to beg the question of what the heck took you guys so long take a listen. >> i put together the team actually with the speaker and others, our staff working on legislation now so when we are sworn in, not waiting unti when the president is sworn in, but at the very first week of january we are able to move the legislation needed to start building the wall. >> at the end of the day, why should democrats bail out your party that had two years to figure out a way forward here? you said you were going to have legislation ready to go in 2017. what happened? >> we did. if you look at the appropriations, we are building the wall right now a portion of it. we have to go -- >> why did he shut down the government

>> he did not shut down the government let's be very clear. we were in the house in the majority we moved a bill to the senate. you know as well as everybody else in america, it takes 60 votes. schumer is the one who said no you put it on -- >> daca for the wall is what the president backed away from. >> no, no, no. we passed this at the end of last year. money for the wall, more money because we peer already building it we put another $5 billion in there. the senate had a different version. schumer said no. it got shut down then what happened the president stayed in washington the speaker then went to hawaii. the president stayed there to negotiate. we brought meetings down they said they wouldn't talk about anything we got into a shutdown that lasted longer than ever before the president made four offers that were reasonable >> not until after he shut down the government >> he didn't shut it down. >> he's the one that said he would be proud to own it who else did it? he rejected the senate bill to keep the government open. >> no. no the house had a bill the senate had a bill. like every other piece of legislation, it takes 60 votes in the senate. republicans don't have 60 in the senate

i think it would only be fair to understand that if it takes 60 votes in the senate, there's probably blame on both sides. >> let's talk about this in three weeks, when i think you guys pass something that keeps the government open -- i'm getting you guys don't have -- you don't want to you go through another government shutdown. a bunch of senators want to make it impossible to shut down the e government, senator warren has a bill never to cancel a paycheck again for a non-political appointee. will you support something like that >> i will go further you want to know how you will never have a shutdown again? let's not pay the members of congress and senate. >> that's the mark warner bill and the white house, right and all political staff. >> that's the bill that's the amendment i would offer. this only harms others think about this the president offered four different reasonable offers. speaker pelosi, then leader, has the record for the longest speech top the floor more than eight hours. about daca

he took two issues that are a problem and he wanted to solve it today you are trying to celebrate and say, speaker pelosi is some type of winner? that means status quo. that goes against everything we know and we want for america we want to find common ground and solutions. >> quickly, you have not appointed all members of the house intelligence committee on the republican side. >> i will next week. >> some people think you are trying -- it's helping to delay the transcripts that could get sent to mueller. >> no, nothing of the sort the reason why committees weren't appointed, the democrats were not organized they waited up till after the speaker race which republicans would never do to give us the ratios i have just met -- >> intel is the same ratio in fairness. >> no. we had negotiations with the speaker changing i just met with every single individual that i'm going to appoint on friday. it will come out next week >> kevin mccarthy, republican from california, good to see you. thanks for coming on. >> thank you for having me democrats have generally been careful not to taunt president trump too much after the shutdown ended they are making sure the public

knows they got what they wanted. >> we asked the president to open up government so we would have time to have a debate on the best way to protect our border democrats are committed to border security and we think we have some better ideas about how to do so that protect our border, honor our values and are cost-effective >> joining me is congressman hakeem jeffries. a member of the democratic leadership on the house side welcome to "meet the press." >> good morning. good to be here. >> government is open. president trump caved. democrats won this fight you heard kevin mccarthy say, you know what you won, you won status quo let me ask you this. in three weeks, how are we not in the same spot >> i think it's important to understand that the legislative branch at the end of the day are stewards of managing public money. we can manage it effectively or waste taxpayer dollars

we concluded spending millions on a medieval border wall would be a waste of taxpayer dollars we want to support a 21st century border security. we are willing to invest in additional infrastructure, particularly as it relates to our legal ports of entry which as you know, chuck, is the place where the majority of drugs come in we're willing to invest in personnel, in additional technology >> do you think a fence is medieval >> i think that from the standpoint of building a concrete barrier from sea to shining sea. >> he took that off the table. that's progress? >> that's progress hopefully, he will stick to that position that he has taken in the past, we have supported, as you know, enhanced fencing. i think that's something that's reasonable that should be on the table. i don't want to get out ahead of the process. because it's a process that has been put in place. we've appointed distinguished members of the appropriation committee. as you know, there are three types of members, democrats, republicans, appropriators i think the appropriators can get this done. >> it's harkening back to how we thought a bill was to become a

law. you come to a compromise let me ask you this. if that is something that doesn't have a majority of democrats but a good chunk in the house, it can get through the senate and that's what happens, can you imagine democrats in the house allowing a bill on the floor that a majority of democrats didn't support but could get some -- could get through the senate to the president's signature? >> the only thing i could imagine is making sure there's a bill that comes to the floor that's evidence based in terms of securing our borders. i think that has been our perspective from the beginning, along with the principle that shutdowns are not legitimate negotiating tactics when there's a public policy disagreement between two branchs of government >> you heard kevin mccarthy come out and essentially endorse a bill that would eliminate the bill to do a shutdown that would nonpolitical appointee government workers and he said, make sure the legislative branch doesn't get paid that's the mark warner bill. is that bipartisan compromise?

is this something we could see happen, at least the never have a shutdown act >> kevin mccarthy is a good man. but that seems to me to be a gimmick. the most important thing is we never hold hostage hard working public servants. >> do you want to legislate that >> we should take a hard look at making sure we don't pursue shutdowns as a means of trying to extract leverage, whether that's a democratic president or republican president >> let me go back on what i was trying to get at the republicans infamously had a speaker of the hou rule called the hastert rule, that referred to the idea of the house speaker of the house that had his own that if a majority of the majority party didn't support a bill, they would never put it on the floor. do the democrats -- the new democratic majority have that same -- is there going to be a verse of an unofficial rule like that >> we haven't taken that position we have taken a position we want to work in a bipartisan way and in particular on behalf of our for the people agenda. we said, we're going to fight hard for lower health care costs, to increase pay fornditi

infrastructure plan. we want t everyday americans, strengthen the affordable care ability. a trillion dollar infrastructure plan, it will create 16 million good paying jobs republicans, democrats, even the president has supported the notion that we have to fix our broken infrastructure. >> you didn't quite answer the question you haven't decided whether that will be a rule or not. >> we have not had that discussion in caucus we have discussed proceeding in a strongly bipartisan way on issues of importance to the american people. >> i want to have you see if you can respond to something that speaker pelosi said in response to the roger stone indictment. take a listen. excuse me, let me put it on screen in the face of 37 indictments, the president continued actions to undermine the special counsel investigation raised the question, what does putin have rhetorically on the president politically, financially? she asked that rhetorically. at what point do you think it's appropriate to begin the impeachment proceedings? >> it's not right right now. we have a responsibility t

serve as a check and balance on an out of control executive branch we take that responsibility seriously. however, we're not going to over investigate, we're not going to overreach. we're going to make sure we focus on the issues of importance to the american penal. that's why elijah cummings is having a hearing this week on how we can lower the high cost of prescription drugs. that's why the chair of ways and means is having a hearing on protecting people with pre-existing conditions. >> i think congressman cummings is starting an oversight investigation on security clearances, that seem to have some connection to the mueller probe. >> as i mentioned, we are going to take that responsibility seriously. i think the american people want to see checks and balances we are a separate and co-equal branch of government which don't work for donald trump. we work for the american people. >> let me ask you this i'm going to put up a tweet of yours. you have been referring to the president not as the president in your tweets you refer to him as individual one. here is one from last week for decades, individual one made a living stiffing his workers and contractors. now he is doing it tole 00,000 federal employees and contractors. and continue o

we must end reckless trump shutdown and continue the fight for the people you refer to him as individual one. it's something having to do with the mueller probe. you called him the grand wizard. it seems -- you are a member of leadership what's that line in your mind -- why should the president negotiate with you if you name call him i know he name calls why should he negotiate with you? >> it's colorful language. i think the president is going to have to own his pattern of behavior that has taken place, not year after year but decade after decade i believe we do need to find a way together to move forward, democrats and republicans. in fact, chuck, as you know, i was able to work with if administration on criminal justice reform democrats, republicans, progressives and conservatives and left and right i think we can move forward. >> do you regret your language >> i don't regret the use of the language i think we need to move forward. america is a great country we have come a long way on the question of race we still have a long way to go at the end of the day. we're a nation of immigrants

some voluntary, some involuntary. i think it was dr. king who said, we all came on the same -- different ships, but we're in the same boatright now i think that's the way to proceed. >> hakeem jeffries, new member of the house democratic leadership, good to see you on the show when we come back, mitch mcconnell is fond of saying there's no education in the second kick of a mule. what about the third what has president trump learned? the panel on that and the stone indictment is next great news, liberty mutual customizes- uh uh - i deliver the news around here. ♪

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which i apply to my life and my work. at comcast we're commited to delivering the best experience possible, by being on time everytime. and if we are ever late, we'll give you a automatic twenty dollar credit. my name is antonio and i'm a technician at comcast. we're working to make things simple, easy and awesome. back now with the panel. hugh hewitt, back now with the panel. hugh hewitt, yamiche alcindor, kristen welker and nbc news senior correspondent, tom brokaw you're special too special senior, all those things >> i didn't want to be the kind of special -- isn't that special? i am -- >> i prefer -- >> i'm unqualified in terms of being senior. >> fair enough i always prefer grand pooh bah as the official title for you.

but i'm an old flintstones kid anyway, let me put up headlines some conservative news organizations, trump lost the shutdown says the american conservative trump caves. national review, trump blinks. erick erickson writes this in "usa today." this is the weakest moment of president trump's tenure in office nancy pelosi looks like the commander in chief of donald trump. hugh, you have been hearing from the base, i'm sure how bad is this for the president? >> not that bad. this is very premature tom and i will remember that joe frazier won his first fight with muhammad ali and lost the next two. we will remember that they went 41 out of the scheduled 42 rounds this is the first round of a 42-round fight i point out that the president's approval rating is now higher than ronald reagan's was at this same time in his presidency. 40 points lower than george h.w.

bush during his presidency i looked at your word cloud. it says, sad, no compromise. what i heard from your guests is there the potential to go big and solve not just daca but everything >> kristen, you are at the white house. he is ready to buck -- he got so defensive saturday morning no no no no. it's not a cave. >> right the white house is defiant, this was not a cave the reality is, he knows his base is not going to be happy unless he gets funding for the wall if you talk to a lot of allies they say we don't see how this ends in any other way other than a national emergency because he can't shut down the government again. here is the lesson i think for president trump. he went into this fight without any strategy, without any plan every day the president, the white house, they were looking for an off ramp, instead of trying to execute something they had already planned out very carefully. i think they are right now huddling and trying to figure out how to do it better.

and the bully pulpit he didn't do it right in this case >> you will recall, everybody that knew trump for a long time said he actually enjoys not having a plan. i want to put up some quotes he goes up to the battle and plan b quote is damned is damned. tom, a month ago we were asking the question, who is the leader of the democratic party. i want to put up some quotes from people that weren't always so supportive of nancy pelosi becoming speaker again aoc, speaker pelosi doesn't mess around tim ryan, who challenged her, she's definitely up to the task. and grateful for our champion in washington, speaker pelosi i think democrats have a leader. it's nancy pelosi. >> the fact is that going into this last election -- i have known her a long time. she is obviously a very smart woman. i wondered whether she was the best image for the democratic party. a lot of people said, she knows how to run things on the hill. i think she demonstrated that this past week donald trump treated federal employees like poker chips this time, his father wasn't around to bail him out i think that hurt him more, by the way, than people realize that was a whole crowd of people out there who were probably

voted for him, suddenly, what they do is get their job jerked out from under them. a spoke to a senator who said it creeped into agriculture, because this time of the year the farmers are dealing with government agencies to plan for next year's crop there was no one home to do all that the damage was really more systemic than a lot of people realized, chuck. >> the one piece of agreement i'm getting from everybody this morning is, i think they're going to eliminate the shutdown. i think the legislative momentum -- the good news about getting nothing for 35 days might be that. >> this is the longest shutdown in history, 35 days. people were i think at a fever pitch. the fact that the airports were starting to really show signs of stress i think was just the beginning of what we would have seen i was talking to a federal worker this weekend who said, monday, people might not have showed up to work. thousands more people would have been, i cannot do this anymore i want to think about the fact that we talk about president trump not having a plan. let's think about what he did for 35 days.

he had a prime time special. he went down to the border he then was possibly disseminating misleading information about the fact that there were drugs pouring in, our country was being invaded. all of that -- after all of that stuff, the president -- the polls are showing that the president was the one being blamed he was on video because of chuck schumer saying, i will own the shutdown >> is that the lesson for the president? bully pulpit for him is starting to no longer be useful >> i think that's the question right? part of the strategy -- you heard leader mccarthy speak to this they will try to pick off some democrats white house can't name any he named a few there's a lot of skepticism about that strategy actually working. look, he didn't deliver that prime time address until halfway into the shutdown. a lot of his allies say, if he had started off in the weeks before hand really selling this, really trying to make his case that would have helped the question is going to be about semantics with this

potential compromise they are looking for. can they find a word or phrase that allows him to declare victory on the wall and democrats as well? >> this isn't a one story town in the middle of this three weeks, roger stone happens friday let me put up -- the people in and around the trump campaign that have pleaded guilty or been indicted it's a who's who of people around this president manafort, gates, stone, cohen, flynn. george papadopoulos. that doesn't help your bully pulpit abilities either. >> no. especially given his image whenever he goes on television i have known him for a long time he has been dealing in the kind of the frenetic fringe of the republican party and making himself out to be more than he really is. i watched him the other day. kind of a stage with his beret and everything. i thought the perfect person to play him is marty short in some kind of a stage play. >> they have steve martin to do it on "snl" last night his partner in crime there roger stone is one of these people that you are -- sometimes you think, did he insert

himself? but then again he knows stuff about donald trump that nobody else does. >> the supreme court takes judicial notice of what's happening. the trump campaign was taking judicial notice of what stone was saying that indictment does not support bu but does not preclude real collusion. we have to find out who campaign one and two is, and i think they're going to jail along with roger stone. >> the campaign official -- rick gates smells like one of them. he may be cooperating. >> absolutely. i think it chips away at the white house the president's argument this doesn't touch him. pause strewn throughout that argument and i think you're right >> all right pause there. on the other side, i want to talk about broken washington when we come back, i will be joined by a member of the senate intelligence committee, senator marco rubio of florida >> "meet the press" is brought to you by charles schwab, own your tomorrow. oh! ♪ ozempic®! ♪ (announcer) people with type 2 diabetes are excited about the potential

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president trump is staking his reputation with his base on immigration. he is hinting he could declare a national emergency if there's no deal for wall funding in three weeks. if this week taught us anything, it's that the art of the deal president may need to adjust his expectations the last time congress was close to a bipartisan immigration deal was 2013 the so-called gang of eight tried an failed to get it done two republicans who were in that gang still remain in the senate. lindsey graham, who said it would be the end of the trump presidency if he doesn't get a wall built, and my next guest senator marco rubio of florida welcome back to "meet the press. >> thank you >> we went through 35 days the president signed a deal that was the same deal available to him on day one, other than the end date of february 8 to february 15. what did this shutdown accomplish >> well, hopefully it teaches everyone that shutdowns are not good leverage in any negotiation. i think it's important to separate tactics from the policy aims here.

there's missed opportunities in all this we could have had an extension of tps, a huge issue for people here in florida, the haitian community. we could have had a three-week extension for nicaragua -- three year extension, i'm sorry, on that daca, three years of certainty it's better than what they face right now, which is a waiting for a court ruling and what the administration is going to do. hopefully, over the next three weeks, some of the elements can become part of what we do. most important of all, i truly believe that if the president can get strong border security that satisfies his -- what he wants, it unlocks the opportunity to do other things on immigration that we need, like figure out something reasonable with the people that are not criminals. that have been here a long time. but we've got to unlock that it begins with border security that's one of the reasons why i think it's so important that we get something done that he's satisfied with so we can move on to the other issues that he's personally expressed a willingness to be involved in.

>> the gang of eight said you need to lead with border security michael bennet was very impassioned about this during the week i want to put up here, the 2013 bill had this. it doubled the number of border patrol agents, 350 miles of new fencing, universal e-verify nd system, new electronic visa tracking system and the deal was the border security measures go in immediately the adjustment to immigration status for various groups would be phased in. didn't you guys have the model is this deal worth taking off the shelf and making some minor adjustments? >> i think there's elements of it that we can the problem was it was done in one big piece of legislation the more stuff you put in a bill, the more reasons someone can find to be against it. >> some argue the other way, senator. make the bill bigger and, yes, okay, there will be things you don't like, but that's the only way to get some things you like. >> well, i mean, that was the

theory that was pitched to me as to why we needed to do one big comprehensive plan so we did. and as you saw, it didn't work one of the arguments was border security will never happen but the legalization part will there's no doubt it's a tough issue. people looked at it in 2013 and said, this is easy, we're going to do it this way are figuring out how difficult this is. but ultimately we have to deal with it. i believe that as you said, what the president wants is but a fraction of what that bill in 2013 did on border security. if we can get something done that satisfies it, i am confident the president is prepared to move forward on a bunch of other parts of immigration reform that people didn't normally associate with him or his white house we have to do that part first. >> you have said you are opposed to the national emergency option in three weeks, i know you have no appetite on either side of the aisle for another shutdown so if that's the only way to keep the government funded, he goes national emergency, how defiant are you on this option will you fight the president on this or not? >> i don't think it's a good idea i think it will be a terrible

idea i hope he doesn't do it. >> would you fight him on it >> sure. because i think it's important -- look, i don't think we'll have to fight. i'm not sure they will do that it's an option they looked at. you are at the mercy of a district court and ultimately an appellate court. it may not withstand if you look at some of the other rulings we have seen. the other is the precedent it sets it's not a good precedent to set in terms of action it doesn't mean i don't want border security. i do i think that's the wrong way to achieve it it doesn't provide certainty you could wind up in a theatric victory at the front end and not get it done. the best way to do it is to have a law that funds border security so we know it's going to happen. >> i want to turn to venezuela and ask you -- first of all, it's interesting the new york times calls you the ouster in chief today. let me read you one part of this and get you to respond the administration has given no indication of a clear plan to protect the united states embassy and its personnel against possible retaliation while mr. rubio insists there are unspecified contingency

options he will not reveal, analysts say the administration does not seem prepared with a plan "b" in case the leader there, nicolas maduro, and holds on to power and fightsfights. the united states is poised to recognize mr. guido as the interim president. do you want this administration to use military power if necessary to back up mr. guaido? >> let me answer that in three parts. number one, i'm not th ouster in chief or anything like it the credit belongs to the venezuelan people. they have taken to the streets this is their movement this is about them they are courageous and facing the threat of imprisonment number two, the decider here is the president who has never needed convincing on venezuela do i offer ideas sure he has a team around him he has never needed convincing he has raised it with me, the issue of venezuela, more than i raised it with him i haven't had to raise it with him. he cares about this. as far as the analysts saying

how would they know? the trump administration is not going to publish a plan, here's what we'll do to keep our folks safe i can tell you i have been in contact with the state department and the people in charge of this and they do have a plan and they have several contingencies to plan on the most important, no harm should ever come to the diplomats. mike pompeo was clear about it yesterday. as far as the military option, i can only tell you this this applies to venezuela anywhere in the world. the united states has always had the right to defend its national security and national interests with the use of force if necessary. i'm not saying that's what's going to happen here i'm not specifying anything. that's not my decision to make i'm telling you that the preferred outcome here is that maduro leaves and they call the election and they elect someone democratically that's what i want kwquick question on wikileaks. >> i want to ask you one quick question on wikileaks.

you stood alone among your party in 2016. let me play a clip for you from october of 2016 where you pledged never to use anything that came from wikileaks take a listen. >> i personally will not be talking about any revelations that come about solely as a result of wikileaks. our intelligence officials who are not partisan people have told us this is the work of a foreign intelligence agency. what i would say to my republican colleagues, some of why what be disappointed, today it's them, tomorrow it could be us >> if you work with wikileaks, are you working against america? >> look, i don't know if everybody had the same idea i did or had access to the same information i did when i said that suffice it to say, it should be clear by now -- i think it should have been clear to people a long time ago that wikileaks and others like that could have been tools of foreign intelligence used to divide america. i believe anyone cooperating with them wittingly or unwittingly is doing the work of a foreign intelligence agency to harm us.

i know what you are getting at with roger stone and all that. i can tell you -- frankly, i mean this in truth, not in a spirit nastiness, the media was unwitting in this, too the media reported breathlessly on a lot of the revelations that were leaked that we know were now the product of the work of russian intelligence. all of us need to be wiser -- when we see this from a third party source that we don't know who it is, we have to be careful we are not doing the work of the russians or some other intelligence agency that is trying to undermine us. we all need to be wiser to that -- about this moving forward. >> should it be a crime working with wikileaks >> that's a good question. i think certainly if you're wittingly doing it, it should be considered as such you're participating in the work of a foreign intelligence agency one of the keys they do is they are unwittingly. it's not like they have sign at the front door that says we are an instrument of russian intelligence or being used by russian intelligence for this. that's why i supported the special prosecutor we will have all the facts and we can render judgment it's a big mistake, trust me, to

jump to any conclusions until mr. mueller's work is done >> senator marco rubio, republican from florida, thanks for coming on and sharing your views. good to talk with you. when we come back, as the democrats eye 2020, they areo navigate differences likely to find themselvesers forred to navigate the differences among their own voters they are more divided than you think. the three paths for democratic candidates in 2020, that's next. (gasp) (singsong) budget meeting! sweet. if you compare last quarter to this quarter... various: mmm. it's no wonder everything seems a little better

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welcome back data download time we will use our new poll to look at divisions within the democratic party up ahead of the 2020 race that will explain how the primary breaks down. we have democrats under 55 without a college degree it's a diverse group democrats under 55 with a college degree they are whiter and more upper middle class the other third, democrats over 55, think of them as the old guard. it actually loosely divides up a third, a third, a third. they have different views on border security and nancy pelosi we will focus on what they are looking for in a presidential candidate. our first group is evenly split on whether they want government to keep shaking things up and make major changes or whether they want more competence and a steadier approach. in both of those other groups, majorities believe we need economy tension a competence and a steadier approach more so than somebody to shake things up this could shape the message of shakeup candidates andifier fort

experienced candidates like elizabeth warren and say joe biden. there is one unifier for the democrats. they all dislike president donald trump kind of like republicans and obama. you'll recall that see if that's enough to keep the party from fracturing. when we come back, the country hasn't been this divided since the '60s what might compromise look like? coming up, "end game" brought to you by boeing, continuing our mission to protect, connect, explore and inspire. i'm ken jacobus and i switched to the spark cash card from capital one.

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"end game" brought to you by boeing, continuing our mission to connect, protect, explore and inspire. >> back now with "end game." i think america feels like we all lost here. look at this word cloud. the state of america today, wrong track the biggest word. i joked on friday that if we have broken michael bennett, the mild mannered democratic senator from colorado, then everybody in the united states senate needs to ask how they are conducting themselves. michael bennett basically had his samuel l. jackson snakes on a plane moment on the floor of the u.s. senate. take a listen. >> it had $46 billion in border security in it. 46! not $5 billion for his rinky dink wall he is talking about

building. >> i think that's an incredible moment. it also is an example of how people were feeling i think all over the country. there were so many stories of families really trying to cobble together their last penny. you had this increasing feeling that the people that were part of the administration, including billionaire cabinet members, they didn't understand what were going on. wilbur ross' statements that he didn't understand why federal workers would go to food pantries i think really took the air out of a lot of people's lungs. there's been a growing gap between the rich and the poor in this country for a long time. it was really on display in that moment. i think him losing it on the senate floor was really a lot of americans saying, we can't take this anymore. >> i think it speaks to the fact that no one wins in a government shutdown. yes, everyone is saying the analysis is that the president caved and pelosi showed how strong she was. that's the politics. the american people don't feel that way. they are scratching their heads. they are wondering what all of this pain was for and frankly how it can be prevented.

that's why i think it's significant that leader mccarthy and congressman jeffries indicated willingness to support legislation to prevent this happening again. >> i didn't think you could widen the gap more until this happened. now it is completely gone. i told you earlier that i talked to the westerners who began by saying, like trump, like his policy. then they said, wish he would stop tweeting all of time. last time i talked to them, he is a clown, i can't stand him. but it's still the policies that we believe in. anywhere i go, republican, democrat, independent, why can't they find common ground? every community in america finds a way to build a school or to do something about downtown. here we can't do it because we breathe the same air and it's toxic toxic and how seriously people take their positions on

something. >> sad no compromise, the word cloud. go big and solve this. jared kushner is leading it. it's more important to shut down the maduro government than our government. donald trump is winning because of bolton and pompeo are winning. that's going to happen. that's going to bring us together. >> that is going to bring us together? getting involved in a latin american politics? >> absolutely. russia is against that. >> i understand. >> that will help. that will help. >> i think because there's going to be this committee of bipartisan leaders, there are what you are -- you will see people trying to talk about facts and maybe try to get on the same page. part of what that speech was about was this rinky dink wall is what he called it. i interviewed the mayor of mccallen texas. he said we don't need a wall. a wall is not going to solve our issues. there's an issue here with people not understanding that facts aren't being agreed upon.

>> the problem is in wyoming and south dakota, they think they need a wall. in texas and arizona, they don't. >> i know. >> right? >> a lot of this we don't want to talk about. the fact is on the republican side, a lot of people see the rise of an extraordinary important new constituency, hispanics, what will come here and be democrats. i hear when i push people harder, i don't know whether i want brown grand babies. that's what's going on. i happen to believe that the hispanics should work harder at assimilation. i've been saying for a long time that they out not to be codified in their community but make sure that all of their kids are learning to speak english and they feel comfortable in the communities. that's going to take outreach on both sides. >> congressman peter king in a conversation that i had with him spoke to sort of this remarkable moment in which we find ourselves. he says what has to happen, both sides need to ignore the fringes.

you have the far right and the far left screaming, yelling the loudest. to some extent, preventing compromise. >> there will be no compromise unless there's is a double layer fence 700 miles long. that's the minimum necessary. in exchange for that, regularization for 10 million people, not just daca, there's a big deal to be had. the extremists should be condemned. the fringe should be ignored. the base can get together. >> i would say we need to adjust what we think of as america. i grew up in miami where people speak spanish but the kids speak english. we think america can only speak english as if spanish wasn't part of america is troubling. >> we will leave it there. all spanish and all english. that's all we have for today. thank you for watching. we will be back next week because if it's sunday, it's "meet the press."

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what started with one job spread all around. because each job in energy creates many more in this town. energy lives here. i'm kasie hunt we're live every sunday from washington from 7:00 to 9:00 p.m. eastern tonight, the hangover. the government reopens, but the lasting impact will affect workers and families for weeks to come. i'm joined live by senator doug jones of alabama as the clock starts ticking to figure all of this out or shut down again. plus, get me roger stone, a man who has relished decades of dirty tricks, arrested by the fbi, and he's as defiant as ever i will talk to his