welcome to "kasie dc." i'm kasie hunt. we're live every sunday from washington from 7:00 to 9:00 p.m. eastern. tonight -- stop me if you heard this one before. congress just five days from a shutdown again. plus, just in, more of president trump's private schedules leaked from the white house. seriously. and amy klobuchar in, elizabeth warren, in. it's becoming a race of contrast as 2020 hits full speed in the falling snow. plus, yes, virginia, there is a crisis in your state.

top democrats refuse to resign as pressure mounts. we're going to talk exclusively with former republican governor bob mcdonald. but tonight we start with good faith negotiations, or at least those posing as such. first, there's amazon's ceo jeff bezos, who is accusing american media of blackmail and extortion after allegedly threatening to publish sensitive photos from an extramarital affair in the "national enquirer." american media calls those discussions with him, quote, good-faith negotiations. and then there's president trump's announcement on twitter that he plans to hold a second summit with kim jong-un, this time in vietnam. back in october, amid reports that the u.s. would maintain sanctions against the regime, pyongyang said the administration was, quote, responding to good faith with evil. in november, u.s. intelligence sources told nbc news that north korea is continuing work on its ballistic missile program.

and then there's capitol hill, where up until today, things seemed to be on track to keep the government open. but now we are seeing optimism fade over whether negotiations will reach a compromise that the president can sign. let's say that the hard-core left wing of the democratic party prevails in this negotiation and they put a bill on the president's desk with zero money for the wall or $800 million, some absurdly low number. how does he sign that? he cannot in good faith sign that. >> my sources are saying talks have stalled and if a deal is not struck, keeping the government open is in serious jeopardy. joining me msnbc contributor jeremy peters, associated press and white house reporter and msnbc political analyst jonathan lemire, former nrcc communications director matt gorman and npr white house corespondent and host of the

podcast, tam ra keith. thank you all for being here. when i left the hill at the end of last week, everything was hunky-dory, as long as the white house stays out of it, we will be fine. there will not be another shutdown. jonathan, now what i hear from both hill and administration sources, actually no, the white house is ready to potentially walk away from this over a completely separate issue than the border wall. it's how many people i.c.e. can detain at a time, and suddenly we're talking about a continuing resolution for a year and nobody has any idea whether or not that's even going to fly. >> that's right. there's no question talks have hit a snag. or in the last 24 to 48 hours there's been a real impasse over, yes, continued debate about funding for the wall. nobody thinks president trump will get $5.7 billion but there are 1 1/2, 2.5, whatever it might be. also detention beds and what i.c.e. means to the two parties. this has become an important issue for democrats who want

atto bollish t atto abolish the whole agency, and republicans say why compromise if he won't get the funding he so desires? and mick mulvaney, the clip you played, the chief of staff saying, of course, the wasn't doesn't want a shutdown but they're not willing to rule it out. if the president cannot get something he can sign, yes, the government can shut down or at the very least we have a continuing resolution and will do this all again down the road. mulvaney also interestingly said the national emergency, which some republicans, of course, don't want -- >> most even. >> again, the president is still going to keep that in his arsenal. he's not going to rule out using that. there's the third scenario where the congress gives him some money and then he tries to find the rest elsewhere in the government, perhaps the department of defense or elsewhere. that in itself may draw a legal challenge but that might not be so bad for the president, who wants that kind of fight as he keeps the issue alive. >> let's go back to the i.c.e.

question. i think that's an important one. when you talk to the administration, tameria, they frame this -- or at least they are in my conversations, a question about whether or not positive abolish i.c.e. entirely. they are essentially saying if you cap the number of beds, places they put people they detain, you're essentially abolishing our capability to do enforcement inside the country and that seems like an incredally -- like we're back to another incredibly emotional red line. >> right. and also in this debate that we've been now having for 45 days or whatever it is, there are a lot of strawmen and abolishing i.c.e. entirely are not what democrats are talking about doing. that is arguably a strawman that's been put up there. i.c.e. is something very sensitive for democrats. as much as they previously talked about the wall being immoral, they're taking in moral terms about the administration's policy on detaining people, rounding up people in the

country, illegally but who have been here a long time and haven't committed any crimes. the democrats on the hill are saying that they are trying to put constraints on the administration's policy of finding pretty much anyone in the country and detaining them for deportation. >> let's take a look at how some of the administration officials and lead negotiators framed this issue just earlier today. take a look. >> is it a done deal? no, it isn't. we could end up in a train wreck, which hand before. but i don't think anybody has an appetite for a government shutdown, and i think everybody wants to make sure our border is secure. >> we not definitively rule out a government shutdown at the end of the week. >> you cannot. >> i say 50/50 we get a deal. i hope and pray we do. >> so the glass is half full. >> it depends how you look at that, isn't it, senator? matt korman, what do you think republicans on the hill do in this situation?

>> call me an optimist, i think we're more so not heading for a shutdown than heading for one. mitch mcconnell's favorite saying is there's to education in the second kick of a mule -- >> or the third. >> or the third possibly. i think that's going to win out this time. >> i thought that too on thursday but listening to stuff this morning, i'm not sure i agree. >> i also think we will see senators, especially those in purple states up for re-election, collins, tillis, gardner, people who held their fire for the shutdown last time, even people like murkowski or connor who aren't up will be more vocal about preventing a shutdown. and again, maybe even a continuing resolution to some time, maybe break the log jam, i think that's the most likely scenario right now. >> jeremy, you agree? >> i think you're absolutely right. i'm hearing the same thing, there are republicans holding back, ready to unleech. but trump doesn't care. he didn't care about their re-elections. he doesn't care if he has a

republican senate or democratic senate. >> i think the question, if they came to a deal, they might ended up with a veto-proof majority but now that the deal is not in place, i don't think how they get there. >> this although i think speaks to a larger problem of the culture of the republican party, and this started with the shutdown in 2013 you and i both covered. >> yes. >> and think about how much our assessment of political damage that these things caused has changed since then. there were people in the party saying this is a terrible idea, with shouldn't do it. now they have to. the chief of staff of the president of the united states is saying, yep, we might have a shutdown and that's extraordinary. it shows the republicans have now become a party of fighting. they have to fight. their voters need to think the people that they've elected are fighting at all costs. that's such a huge part of trump's brand and why he was successful as a presidential candidate. and he's fighting but the problem is, there's really no way for him to win this fight in the way that he's explained he's

going to win because, remember, another part of his brand, keeping promises. it will be hard to keep these promises. >> and it's very clear the last shutdown damaged this president. which is why the next topic we will move on to is a little difficult. last sunday we reported on an ox oes scoop on how the president spends his days in the white house. it said according to leaked internal schedules, trump spent approximately 60% of his scheduled time during a three-month period in unstructured, quote, executive time. the white house was reportedly, surprise-surprise, displeased by the leak and is carrying out an investigation to find out who's behind it. >> it's not the content. it's the fact that someone within the white house spent three months collecting this information, which is really, really hard to do. and it also sheds light on the fact many people who work for us weren't hired for us. >> how close are you to finding out who did it? >> i'm hoping to have a resolution on that this week. >> so you're really close? >> yes, sir.

>> well, just out tonight, axios received for more of the president's scheduled from last week, after that first report came out. the schedules are not a full picture of how the president spends his time and there's a more detailed, tightly held version of the schedule. in a tweet this morning the president spun his executive time as a producting working period adding he, quote, probably works more hours than almost any past president. okay. who wants to take this? jonathan, it seems clearly they're going after this person. clearly this person is not afraid of being caught. >> no, this person -- the investigation began last week, this person is still leaking schedules this weekend. but your chaacting chief of sta goes on fox news and says we're going to identify this person this week and and then go on to say how hard it is to fire a federal worker.

make an attempt to fire the person and the leaks keep coming. there's a real sense of defiance here from whoever is leaking these. it must be pointed out about 400 people have access to this particular schedule. as you say, there's a much smaller pool that has access to a tightly held one. >> how small is that pool? kellyanne conway? closest people we know? >> senior staff. names watching the show would be familiar with. but the leaks here are clearly meant to embarrass this president. that's what this is about. yes, trump can spin it on twitter today saying it's mostly working but but there's been analysis after analysis done on the periods on the schedule are labeled executive time line up with majority of his tweeting time. so yes, undoubted will he he makes phone calls. white house staff pushed all of the white house reporters to say this is when he's calling this congressional leader or world ally but he's also doing what else we know he does, watch cable news. >> which republican leaders really love. >> people talk about schedules, it sheds some light, you spend

time with a couple of 4-year-olds, you tell them not to do something, and they will do it. look at them and tell them again, they will do it again. >> we have a toddler in the white house? >> something like that. these tell us it's much more about the acts than what it is actually in these schedules. >> think about what it says the level of respect that people have who work for this president. >> can you imagine anybody doing this with barack obama? >> absolutely not, they wouldn't. there are people there that went to work every day who felt like they worked for a man who was good and decent. >> or george w. bush. i'm not trying to make a partisan point. >> with the exception of extreme loyalists and that's a shrinking number every day in this white house, the people who work for president trump think he's a joke. >> there's a statement. >> that certainly is. it works the other way too, where there's a shrinking number of people the president trusts. and there are not many people around him who can get in his ear and convince him on things one way or another but he is convinced so much of the staff

is out to get him. >> and there's just something in what mulvaney said where you talk about how easy it will be to fire a federal worker, how people he didn't hire, he seems to be implying this is a career person and not a political person that came in with trump. >> interesting point. john lemire, you also write for the ap in his third year in office, trump is starting to air reruns, the reality tv star. you mention the upcoming summit with kim jong-un. trump was delighted the first summit received around-the-clock coverage for days, something he hoped to repeat last summer when he met with vladimir putin in helsinki. but trump saw the coverage take a negative turn as he refused to side with intelligence agencies in a post coverage news conference. aides counseled the president a second summit would not carry the same drama as the first and needed more concrete results but president trump urged them to

move forward before announcing it in this past week state of the union address, he insisted to advisers that the vietnam summit would still be must-see tv. and told one confidante that the idea of good versus evil would be irresistible. t tamara, this president thrives on this drama. the country has gotten used to it. how many seasons do they say it takes before people get tired of a reality series tv, they say six. this is only two. do you think they're getting tired of it? >> if this were a movie we would be in the part of a romantic comedy where things are going great but things have to fall apart before they can reconcile and be happily ever after. love letters exchanged and how great kim is. it seems the next step, we need more drama if this story is going to play out like a movie. >> where are republicans on this? are they comfortable with this?

>> it doesn't seem like it, at least when it comes down to election time. last time in 2018, people wanted to focus on individual races. they didn't want a big dawn and pony show with the president following them everywhere. one of the things i'm waiting to see is how the president 00 deals with the tensions of democrats on the trail. all of the democrats who used to cover him 24/7 will split their time as well. he's used to distracting. when he doesn't like the news coverage, distracting getting out of it. i remember when i worked for jeb, ted cruz wins i'd wa and he becomes canadian. we couldn't ee it with the shutdown with the government workers being out of work, he couldn't get out of it. he painted himself in a corner. i'm curious if that will happen this time. >> something tells me the media will still cover trump. >> i agree with you. we will see. its still very early and we're getting a lot of 2020. a lot more to come senator debbie stabenow will join me.

plus, what in the world is going on in virginia? first, do the 2020 elections truly begin this week? democrats blanket early primary states as elizabeth warren and amy klobuchar launch they're campaigns. we will talk about where the democratic party stands. atic pag our first house, sweetie? yeah, i thought doing some hibachi grilling would help take my mind off it all. maybe you could relieve some stress by calling geico for help with our homeowners insurance. geico helps with homeowners insurance? they sure do. and they could save us a bundle of money too. i'm calling geico right now. cell phone? it's ringing. get to know geico and see how much you could save on homeowners and condo insurance. get to know geico and see each day justinuld at work... walk. and after work. he does it all with dr. scholl's. only dr. scholl's has massaging gel insoles that provide all-day comfort. to keep him feeling more energized.

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>> are you going to put your best foot record? >> by god, when are you going to know the answer. >> are you in or snout. >> never snafr. at this point i am not. >> all systems go at the moment. >> the serious answer is soon. >> sunday, at boone island in minneapolis, you will find out. >> i stand before you to announce my candidacy for president of the united states! >> i stand here today to declare that i am a candidate for president of the united states of america! . >> to fight or unite? that is the question for a crowded field of 2020 presidential candidates. senator amy klobuchar and senator elizabeth warren both launkling their campaigns in the freezing cold. klobuchar talked about grit with her snow-drenched audience

braving frigid temperatures in minneapolis. warren came out swinging against the president in lawrence, minnesota. and both made their backdrops a central character as they tried to separate themselves from the 2020 landscape. >> everyone who's traveled here to lawrence. >> we are gathered here today on this beautiful mississippi river. >> on january 11th 1912, a group of women who worked right here at the everett million discovered that their bosses had cut their pay, and that was it. the women said enough is enough! >> the mississippi river, all of our rivers, they connect us to one another, to our shared story, for this is how our country was founded, with patriots who saw more that united them than divided them. >> families that were already going to bed hungry, had to make

due with even less. they were cold, they were under attack, but they stuck together and they won. >> i don't have a political machine. i don't come from money, but what i do have is this -- i have grit! i -- i have family, i have friends, i have neighbors, and i have all of you who are willing to come in the middle of winter! >> i'm just going to say, props ali vitaly, who was there for nbc news. i would have died in that weather. props to amy klobuchar for that. but we showed the two women talking about the places they're from but the reality is, they sort of represent different paths for the democratic party. amy klobuchar is trying to occupy this icann back to the

midwest, more centrist, optimistic way of looking at things. elizabeth warren on the progressive side, you can see she's taking the angry at the establishment position. who do you think wins out? how do you think this plays out? >> you're exactly right. they're both trying to mold their candidacies around left populism but by different ways. elizabeth warren has a serious plan about taxing the ultra wealthy in this country, not only tax their income but value of the property they own, everything from like art to their homes and things like that, i believe. so you have that playing out, while at the same time you have someone like amy klobuchar, who won't go quite that far and is testing whether or not the democratic primary electorate is willing to go for somebody who may not make all of the liberal activists crazy but will argue that, okay, i can actually win a general election where i don't think elizabeth warren can.

>> i can beat donald trump. in fact, elizabeth warren actually raised this as an interesting question though, in some ways wondering whether it would be president trump in 2020. take a look at what she had to say after her speech. >> you mentioned you think the president may not be free. can you expand on that more? >> how many investigations are there now into him? it's no longer just the mueller investigation. they're everywhere. and these are serious investigations. we will see what happens. we need to get the mueller report back and make it public so everyone can see it. the answer may be another investigation comes to maturity before then. >> is she realistic the president may not be in office? >> i think democrats have been saying this since approximately january of 2017 but anything is possible.

she took a phrase from the president. she said we will see what happens. it could just be she was trolling the president of the united states a little bit because there's no doubt he's going to react to something like that. >> matt, what's your take here? and also, i think we have this instagram photo from donald trump jr. as well we should i think mention. this tweet from the president that referenced -- there it is right there on the screen -- just an absolute tragedy and donald trump jr. writing praise of his father there. matt gorman, how does this -- i mean, first of all, does the president doing this, what kind of impact does it have with republicans? should it draw condemnation? second of all, are these attacks on elizabeth warren, we saw documents this week in her handwriting herself calling her an american indian, will this hurt her candidacy in the long run? >> i don't know about candidacy but it dogging her in a real

way. she thought she could put this out in front of of it but there's more documents out there. the more i see elizabeth warren, the more i'm convinced she should have run last time. it seems the democratic field moved towards her and the field with klobuchar is more open. amy klobuchar makes me mer nervous with everybody beating everybody up on the left. when i worked for mitt and jeb, democrats would sit back and wait. i feel that way now as a republican with everybody fighting on the left. >> real quickly, i want to talk about a column you wrote about beto o'rourke, you say to run or not to run? that is the question. there's a less polite way to say what he needs to do in your estimation. >> yes. >> how has his 2019 been so far? >> not so great. it's been probably the worst of any contender out there i think. he's not used to the fact in 2018 you can beat not ted cruz and gobble up support. when you're running against

folks like klobuchar and harris and others, you need political talent and get people to vote for you and not just against the other guy. i needs to spend more time being himself and less time finding himself. >> and certainly this two-month odyssey of finding himself is something you can imagine president trump having fun with on twitter or the campaign trail. >> i'm surprised he hasn't had more fun yet. mr. it's coming. right now his focus seems to be on elizabeth warren, yes, he tweets last night the potentially offensive reference to the trail of tears but more than that, the pocahontas comments all the time and he's telling advisers day after day that's who he wants. warren is his ideal candidate. >> yes, this is the person he wants to fight. he feels like he matches best against. and her announcement in lawrence, imagine this, where i went to high school. >> very nice. to your point, the president seemed to express regret in that lunch with anchors perhaps he did too good of a job taking lawrence elizabeth warren too early. gentlemen, thank you all very much for being here tonight.

before we go to break, we want to take a movement to remember two love-serving members of the house of representatives. we learned earlier republican congressman walter jones of north carolina died today on his 76th birthday. jones was first elected to the house in 1994 and would go on to serve 12 terms. he gained fame trying to achieve what he called penance for his vote on the iraq war, reportedly signing 11,000 letters to dead service members since 2003. and this week we also said did bye to the former dean of the house, democratic congressman from michigan, john dingell. a world war ii veteran, dingell was the longest h-serving congressman in american history. he a 59-year run which he served under every president from eisenhower to obama. he was a champion to the auto industry, exposed government corruption and helped write most of our nation's environmental and energy laws. he was instrumental in passing medicare legislation and when it

came time for president obama to sign the affordable care act into law, dingell was by his side. he was also known for his incredible wit and pretty incredible twitter game. some of our favorites, quote, 99% of you don't even deserve 140 characters. thanks. quote, staff is not informed me of what a kardashian is. i'm only left with more questions. quote, we should have all just stared at the eclipse. and, quote, everything's a balance beam when you're 90. he dictated a farewell op-ed and signed off, with this final tweet, quote, the lovely deborah is insisting i rest and stay off of here. but after long negotiations we worked out a deal where she will keep me up with twitter for me as i dictate the messages. i want to thank you all for your incredibly kind words and prayers. you're not done with me just yet. congressman dingell died at his home in dearborn, michigan, of pos state cancer at 92 with his

wife by his side. speakers at his funerals will include bill clinton, joe biden and john boehner. and i would also like to add he was a lifelong michigan fan. go blue! when we come back, i'm joined by former governor bob mcdonald to talk about the shambles that is virginia politics and the hunger for leadership. ip and after work. he does it all with dr. scholl's. only dr. scholl's has massaging gel insoles that provide all-day comfort. to keep him feeling more energized. dr. scholl's. born to move. -morning. -morning. -what do we got? -keep an eye on that branch. might get windy. have a good shift. fire pit. last use -- 0600. i'd stay close. morning. ♪ get ready to switch. protected by flo. should say, "protected by alan and jamie." -right? -should it? when you bundle home and auto... run, alan!

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on the very first day of

2019, governor ralph northam of virginia signed four proclamations. one declared 2019 a year of reconciliation and civility and sought to commemorate the 400th anniversary of the first enslaved africans brought to virginia. northam joined a group called virginians for reconciliation, whose goal was to spend this year with community outreach to, quote, accelerate the healing of racial divisions. so much has hand since then. northam says he won't resign and so far neither will the attorney general over scandals surrounding blackface photos from their college days. and then there's lieutenant governor justin fairfax, now accused of sexual assault by two different women. he says he had consensual sex with dr. vanessa tyson and meredith watson, both women say they're willing to testify at impeachment hearings if need be. fairfax is calling for an investigation and says he will clear his good name. he said, quote, it is obvious that a vicious and coordinated

smear campaign is being orchestrated against me. i will not resign. joining me now is former republican governor of virginia, bob mcdonald. he's also a member of the group virginians for reconciliation. governor, thank you so much for joining me tonight. take a look at what governor northam had to say if his first interview just this morning. >> virginia needs someone that can heal. there's no better person to do that than a doctor. virginia also needs someone who is strong, who has empathy, who has courage and who has a moral compass. that's why i'm not going anywhere. i have learned from this. i have a lot more to learn. but we're in a unique opportunity now. >> governor, do you think that ralph northam is capable of healing the commonwealth, or do you think he needs to resign? >> you know, my conversations with the governor, i told him i think that really is a choice that needs to make, does he think he can restore their trust

that's been breached by this revelation about his yearbook? and does he think he can maintain the leadership with his cabinet and his staff? i think after a week of staying out of the public light and talking to a number of people, i think he's concluded that he can. i think we believe we're a nation of second chances. we believe in redemption and reconciliation and doing better today and smarter today than we were yesterday. i think -- i'm just saddened for our state. the mother of presidents who cradle democracy and now we have this horrific insult to african-american citizens all around the state, and i think the governor has reflected and believes he can still lead. >> what do you think these blackface photographs, the incidents governor northam has described as well, what do they say about governor northam's character? do you think they say that he is a racist?

>> you know, kasie, i thought a lot about that. i stood with him three weeks ago as we kicked off virginians for reconciliation. he proclaimed this the year of reconciliation and civility in virginia as he commemorated the 400th anniversary of this horrific event of enslaved african-americans coming to virginia. but the man i saw there making comments with empathy and strength just three weeks ago doesn't look like the man that's in those pictures, if that's him. we still don't know all of the facts. so i think he's been chasant and humbled and believes he's still able to lead. i think it says in his upbringing and maybe even people like me who grew up in largely white neighborhoods, didn't understand the incredible i sult to our african-american neighbors that something like that would do.

we've came a long way in the 35 years since that picture came out. but the reason we started virginia reconciliation is we have so much more to do to have a fully just and equal society where everybody is treated in the image and likeness of god. that's the way we're created. i think the governor's thought you about this last week and believes he can lead. >> obviously, this is something that's not just been confined to the governor northam. the attorney general of virginia also said he appeared in blackface at one point in his life. how pervasive is this among white residents, ambitious residents, perhaps, in virginia? have you yourself ever appeared if black ps face? >> no, kasie, i didn't even know what the term meant until a few years ago. i had not seen it. i had seen it on minstrel shows on tv maybe when i was a kid growing up. i have to say until these last couple of weeks, i had not thought deeply about the incredible offense that it means to black people because of the

abomination of slavery. virginia was the capital of confederacy, the place where the first african-americans came. we had this ugly legacy of jim crow and massive resistance, and hurt caused to other people by the insensitivity and lack of understanding among white people about what that means. so i think -- i know as tough as this sounds in this horrific situation, we find ourself in, i think god's given us a chance to really take a hard look at this and have a deep -- deep discussion, peeling back the onion about truth telling, about the history of virginia. we've come a long way, we have the fist african-american governor in all of the united states with my friend doug wild ner but we have so much further to go. and this will be an opportunity this year for repentance, for reconciliation, for forgiveness and find tangible ways to actually get things done that honor people of color in this state.

>> do you think that president trump has made having that conversation easier or harder? >> i think the general incivility and hyper partisanship and horrific tone of our politics in washington generally have -- >> with all due respect, the president has gone farther, what happened in your state in charlottesville, what he had to say about those protesters. >> yeah, i think his tone after charlottesville and the mistakes that he made then were hurtful to the cause and helping us to heal after charlottesville. i think the overall tone of both the president and, frankly, people in congress hurts the ability for people to be civil to get things done, particularly on these issues of race. that's why i think virginia especially after this incident the last couple of weeks has an ee nourm enormous ability to

lead. we understand the abomination of slavery and its legacy in virginia. because of that we will step up and have an honest dialogue and actually get things done to be able to honor people and have a civil, equal, justice society. that's the goal of virginia, reconciliation. i think the governor because he's been chastened and humbled, i think he feels he's in position to lead and i look forward to working with him on that. >> before i let you go, sir, justin fairfax, lieutenant governor of virginia, now has two women accusing him of sexual assault, one of whom has several people corroborating her story, saying she told them about what hand in realtime. do you think the lieutenant governor should step down? >> those are very, very serious allegations, when there are two people especially that come forward, it raises the bar. there definitely should be an investigation. we've all called for that. i do get concern though, kasie, about trying criminal cases in

the media, where you have -- >> should he be impeached? >> very little defense. there's a resolution to do that. i think the house will decide that. but i think people should be given that presumption of innocence. it's a fundamental american value. i think the allegations are not only sear orious, they're crimi. therefore a full investigation has to take place. if he believes now he is incapable of governing, he should step down. but ultimately, the people have decided they want these three men in office, and if they can't govern, they should do what's right by the people and step down. look, we're all people, we don't have perfect politicians, kasie, and i hope an investigation will get to the truth of what's going on there. >> former virginia governor bob mcdonald, thank you so much for being here tonight, sir. appreciate it. when we return, i'm joined live by senator debbie stabenow. . you should be mad at forced camaraderie. and you should be mad at tech that makes things worse.

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ahead of a short and very busy week, i'm joined by democratic senator from michigan, debbie stabenow. senator, it's great to have you on the show tonight. >> it's great to be on this show, kasie. as a woman with michigan roots, we're so proud of you. i say michigan twice because i know your university of michigan and i went to michigan state, but you must be happy. you have them as the top of the big ten right now. >> you know, knock on wood, it's been at times rough for some of the other sports, but you're right, things are looking up. thank you again for being here. i will give you a go green. all in the family. >> all right. all right. >> let's start with the governor shutdown. you're a member of democratic leadership. where do you see this -- how do you see this unfolding? are democrats absolutely unwilling to move on this question of detention beds? do you think it's going to sink

the whole compromise? >> first of all, people have been working all weekend as you know, and even though there haven't been formal conference meetings in the last number of hours, people are on the phone talking. and what we want is what makes sense, what people tell us that is needed to be able to keep our citizens safe and to make sure that federal workers don't have their wages held hostage in the process of this. and so there's a way to do this as it relates to the detention beds to make sure we're talking about serious criminals and doing things in a way that make sense and, by the way, the biggest thing that i would be doing is comprehensive immigration reform. but in the context of this budget, what we've got to do is continue to focus on republicans and democrats negotiating, i believe, that we will be able to come together on legislation that makes sense, that funds of

government going forward, the rest of the government and the president needs -- -- need to step back and let that happen. >> are you confident the government will not shut down at the end of the week? >> kasie, i wish i can say yes. when we buy 100 senators, 100-0 pass unanimous concept in december to keep the government services going, we didn't know at the time that the president was going to change his mind and decide not to support that. at this point he has said he would support whatever was agreed to by democrats and republicans. now we hear this weekend maybe not. so here's what i know. i know that members on both sides of the aisle and congress do not want a government shut joun shutdown. if we get an agreement that doable, then it's up to us. if the president has something on his desk and wants to veto

it, we have to outride the veto. because it's not fair to the workers being held as hostages. >> let's talk about the 2020 primary, your former mid-wirn senator amy klobuchar, standing in quite the blizzard, i might say -- >> looked like machine machiich >> exactly, that she's running for president. she in some cases represents a more centrist view of the primary. one of the main fault lines has been this question about medicare for all. i know you've been working on a medicare-related bill, sherrod brown, i guess he's not an officially declared candidate, but he said he doesn't think medicare for all could pass. what is the legislation you and i are pushing? how is it different than just straight medicare for all? >> kasie, i'm excited about this because i really believe this can pass, and it's a very important piece of universal health care coverage. and this is allowing people at age 50 to be able to choose to

buy into medicare and pay a premium and be able to have medicare coverage. i don't know how many times i have heard from folks that either got laid off, had to retire early, off, had to retire early, that told me they were holding their breath to get to medicare at 65. we know when you're above 50 you're likely to have higher healthcare costs to use more healthcare. having this be available as a choice for people, to be able to buy into a system, we design it in a way that doesn't affect at all the premiums and benefits of those 65 and older on medicare, but people would be having all the benefits of current medicare and pay a premium and be able to be covered. >> senator, one other thing before i let you go here, this week we lost the dean of the house, john dingle, who of course, a legend in michigan politics, beloved by his wife,

debbie dingell still serving in the house. i wondered if you have any memories you wanted to share about congressman dingell. >> he was a lion of public service, as you know, in michigan as well as across the country. we all know about the legislative pieces he's been involved in, medicare, for instance as well as passage of the affordable care act. what gets a smile out of my face when i think about john dingell is being in a parade with him. memorial day parade with john dingell, he and debbie always there. walking and later years riding in the back of a convertible. in the end for john, it was about people. always about his people, as he said. he was in public service for all the right reasons. he is going to be greatly missed. senator debbie stabenow, always great to have you here.

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in our next hour, elizabeth warren launches her campaign. amy klobuchar launches hers and cory booker hits the road in iowa, just another weekend in the 2020 campaign. congresswoman lucy mcbath joins me live after the questioned attorney general matt whittaker. our producers watch the sunday shows so you don't have to. you. the top of your car? moderator: mm-hmm. it helps you see dangers around the vehicle. what is that? various: wait, wait, wait, what is that? oh, my... (mixed shouting) man: these are big alligators. moderator: so who's getting out first? (laughter) get 0% financing for 60 months on most equinox models. or, current gm owners can get $3,500 total cash allowance when financing with gm financial. find new roads at your local chevy dealer.

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we begin with the chaos in virginia's government. >> political chaos in virginia. >> scandals playing in virginia. >> do you still think the governor needs to step down? >> i do. >> it's not clear to me how he can do his job. >> yes, i have thought about resigning. >> i think she should go. >> i'm not going anywhere. >> negotiations to avoid another government shutdown. >> congressional investigators are closing on in on a border security deal. >> i'm hopeful. >> the talks have stalled. >> not positive but hopeful. >> i don't know where the democrats are. >> of course we're ready to put more money in border security. >> we could end up in a train wreck which happened before. >> we cannot definitively rule out a government shutdown the end of this week? >> absolutely not. a government shutdown is still

on the table. >> i say 50-50 we get a deal. i hope and pray we do. >> the glass is half full? >> depends how you look at that, isn't it, senator? >> welcome back to "kasie dc." with me this hour, phillip rucker. and from moveon.org, and pierre and from atlanta, the editor of "the resurgent" eric erickson. a few moments ago, amy klobuchar added her name to the long list of democrats running for 2020. now, it's matter of which vision will prevail. klobuchar touted her grit campaigning in snow and freezing temperatures and will talk about what's at stake. >> there are insidious forces everyday trying to make it harder for people to vote, trying to drown out our voices with big money. it is time to organize, time to

galvanize, time to take back our democracy. it's time, america! time to pass a constitutional amendment to overturn citizens united and get the dark money out of our politics. it is time to stop discriminatory actions by restoring the voting rights act. >> here is senator elizabeth warren yesterday putting a twist on a familiar theme from president trump in 2016. >> because the man in the white house is not the cause of what is broken, he is just the latest and most extreme symptom of what's gone wrong in america. a product of a rigged system that props up the rich and powerful and kicks dirt on everyone else. this is the fight of our lives,

the fight to dream what is possible and an america that works for everyone. >> then, there's the looming question of how left is too far left for the field? an idea that president trump is already focusing on. >> here in the united states, we are alarmed by the new calls to adopt socialism in our country. tonight, we renew our resolve that america will never be a socialist country. >> phillip rucker, i want to start with you for the reporting perspective how the president and his advisors are thinking about this looming campaign. that sort of gave us a clue how they will try to frame the next year. >> kasie, they will be looking

for the democratic candidates to go as far left as they seem to be going in these early stages of the primary campaign and tag the entire party as the party of socialists and extremists and make it so clear by the time the democrats produce a nominee, that person is seemingly disqualified by the middle of the country and the people who voted for trump. i don't know if that will work. clearly, you will see trump trying to interject himself to paint these democratic candidates as extremists and socialists. >> eric, let me get you in on that very question. do you think it will work for the president to paint these candidates this way and further down, against whom is that argument more effective in the democratic and who will it not resonate with? >> i almost expect the president to do what he did against claire mccaskill. she targeted him as if he was the republican nominee as though

he was and they said, oh, she's the person she's scared of. i expect you expect to see it more further to the left candidates, elizabeth warren and brown and kamala harris, making it look as if he's scared of them going as far left as possible. he does seem to think the voters he lost in michigan and wisconsin and iowa, more moderate blue collar voters will come back to him after 2018 if they're that far left. >> kareem, i'm interested in your response to that. how does this play out for democratic candidates when polls are showing voters, yes, in many cases support certain policy ideas progressive but want somebody who can beat president trump. do you think the most progressive candidates on the democratic side might be able to beat this president? >> i think they might be able to. a good chance. what we see in three months is very different than six months

from now. in november of 2018 what we saw was a very -- large turnout, democrats taking back the house, democrats taking back those upper midwestern states in those gubernatorial races. it was really impressive because of stuff like healthcare, healthcare being a number one issue. we have to remember what we're seeing with democrats right now is very reflective of america. we have five women in the race. two african-american, one latino and one lbgt american. klobuchar was in a blizzard and had a large crowd. >> i think those people are crazy but impressive. >> elizabeth warren had a large crowd. we had kamala harris that had 20,000 people show up. the energy and base is there and

that's what matters. we'll see what happens down the road. >> let's go to des moines, iowa, first of all, i hope it's warmer than it was in minnesota. nbc's vaughn hilliard, has been following many candidates canvassing the state. i'm happy to see you're in a warm and toasty studio. that makes my heart happy for you. >> that wasn't the case all day, kasie. >> i believe it. what are you seeing on the ground in iowa as this campaign gets under way? what are the differences you're picking up on between these democratic candidates? >> look, kasie, over the last week i've been with three candidates in iowa, sherrod brown last weekend and cory booker friday and saturday and elizabeth warren at two events today. one thing to remember about these candidates they're humans, right? you see a different energy in the way they relate to people. sherrod brown leans up against the wall as he listens to folks and cory booker, it seems like a

sunday church service every event you go to, whether in a big hall or small living room. then, you have elizabeth warren who came in and was trying to extract a lot of energy out of people from frustrations out of bill oil corporations. you have that contrast. i mention they're humans because the humans react to the president in different ways. i want to play you the contrast between elizabeth warren and cory booker this weekend and how they directed their attention to president. >> by the time we get to 2020, donald trump may not even be president. in fact, he may not even be a free person. >> if we try to fight donald trump on his turf, not only will both of us get muddied but the country suffers as a result. >> everyday, there is a racist tweet, a hateful tweet,

something really dark and ugly. >> they're going to say, oh, gosh, more candidates talking about love and hope, oh, my god, how are you going to beat donald trump with that? >> kasie, what you just heard was corey book appealing to that hope into the heart what he called defiant love and what you heard was elizabeth warren here today, that comment about president trump perhaps not even being a free man, that was in the first three minutes of her first speech here this morning. the question is, going forward, how does one react. cory booker made it clear how he's going to do it. elizabeth warren has so far been the target of the president being called pocohantas and past comments about her native-american heritage. what do iowans want and feed off of? how do you get that energy and turn it into activism on the candidates' behalf? >> did you get a sense any candidate is ahead of the other,

any excitement more for one candidate than the other? >> i should be very specific, there was not one individual at these events, not one iowan who said they're sold on any candidate. you heard all of them open the door and say, this is early, our responsibility, 360 days left to the iowa caucus. there is energy, to be clear. but can somebody like sherrod brown or one of the western governors roll in? the energy is high for likes of cory booker but you have to keep that up for 12 months. that's a lot. >> god bless. the texture is interesting and so thank you, vaughn hillyard in des moines. >> meanwhile, senator klobuchar suggesting she has at some times been abusive and cruel to members of her staff and impacted her ability to attract

campaign staffers. >> senator, some of the headlines this week talked about you are a pretty tough boss. what's your reaction when you see some of those headlines? >> i love our staff. look at this incredible event they put together. yes, i can be tough and push people, i know that. i have high expectations for myself and high expectations for people that work for me but i have high expectations for this country. >> what's your take on what we just heard there from amy klobuchar? >> she has to answer that question i'm sure a couple more times. reporters will ask her how does she treat her staff? i'm a former staffer of many different elected officials. it is important how you treat your staff. that truly truly matters. she will have to continue to answer that question and be tested. at the end of the day, voters will decide if she's the person for them.

>> obviously, phil, this is something that bubbled up right away, something that has been part of mostly rumor. people have been careful what exactly they have reported but there is a perception this is a toxic work environment. how do you think that impacts her ability to be a presidential candidate if she can't attract some staffers. >> she needs to figure out how to address it and did that today in that interview. it will be a problem for her campaign. she's not the first politician to deal with staff issues like this and reputation for being a hard boss. president trump is not exactly a warm and loving manager to his staff either and it doesn't really affect the way his voters view him. there's a chance klobuchar can attract a lot of support among voters despite this or because of this. maybe people will see her as a tough boss. she has to figure out a way to address it and move past it and

have people thinking about other aspects of her candidacy and not just the personal comments from her staffers. >> they clearly thought they needed to get ahead of it having her thank the staff at the top of her speech. let me go back to something vaughn hillyard told us from iowa, that elizabeth warren said about the president might not even be a free person. several democrats running for president already, many others, and usually, they're pretty careful to say they're not at that point. elizabeth warren seems to answer that question by saying we have to wait for the mueller report. she seemed to, frankly, go way past this question, straight to this president might be in jail. i'm curious, your take and how that might be read. >> none of us are talking about the native-american issue, and talking about this.

well played by elizabeth warren to get it changed to something else. what conservative republicans myself found out in 2008 and going back to 2012, you've got all the democrats running the left so someone can run up the center like john mccain in 2008 or to the left of mitt romney or mitt romney to the left of everyone in 2012. if you have 2 billion or so democrats running like the republicans did in 2016 they all crowd on one side someone can go around. elizabeth warren saying something like this hoping to drown out everyone on the left. i still think democrats will have someone running closer to the center while they crowd each other out. >> what was your take on the elizabeth warren line? i was struck by it. >> i was struck by it. one thing to say he may not be in office by 2020. the other to say he will not be a free person. there's no evidence that will be happening over the next few

years. possible, sure, but i wonder if she wasn't trying to bait president trump to engage with her and have a back and forth. clearly, it's the kind of comment trump will be bothered by and might be tweeting in the morning. we'll see. something else. >> to erik's point, make get us off the pocohantas. >> she was able in 2016 to get under his skin, did that very well. he went after her and she would slam him back. it was a little out of character for her because during her exploratory committee travels she didn't really bring up donald trump. it was about policy, putting out the wealth tax and other things. it was surprising. it might have been because he attacked her 24 hours ago and might be responding back to. >> it will be an exciting year. still to come, is congress on the brink of another shutdown and the prickly dynamic between

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multiple sources tell us at nbc news border negotiations have stalled and another government shutdown is looming as a real on. that represents a dramatic shift from the end of last week when lawmakers from both sides of the aisle were sounding optimistic they could reach a deal tomorrow. just listen to the change in tone from senator richard shelby. >> i think we're on a positive trajectory course now after meeting with the president and

vice president. i believe we have some latitude to hopefully conclude this. >> i think the talks are stalled right now and hoping we can get off the dime or later in the morning because time is ticking away. >> the main sticking point is this number of additional beds to give by i.c.e. for those coming across illegally. they think it is better to let asylum seekers and others be released while awaiting their proceedings. and letting republicans know this is about interior enforcement. democrats want to cap the number of people they want to put in beds they can apprehend inside the united states, and they're arguing that would put more criminals back out onto the streets. phil rucker, it seems like from the conversations i've had there is a line in the sand about

this. the administration is equating this to the push to abolish i.c.e. the rhetoric is back to the highest possible points on this and led us to the last government shutdown. what's your source from the white house side how this is all going? >> first, a reminder, this debate is more than the dollar figure for how much money would be appropriate to build the border wall, a complicated negotiation that involves this as well. the white house is expecting a deal. president trump has given some instructions to senator shelby what he ex-folks have presented to him this week. they're also prepared to move forward with a national emergency declaration by the president which would trigger these executive powers to basically reallocate existing federal dollars towards that border wall without congressional approval. that would be a big deal

politically but spark a lot of legal challenges but is what the administration is setting to do but may happen next week if there is not a compromise with negotiations. >> it's said it could cause a revolt by the senators. >> i'm surprised lindsey graham is in support of this. it's a terrible idea to do an emergency declaration. i told the white house myself. he would get nothing opposed to compromise with democrats where he could get something. if this is his legacy he wants to get something. emergency declaration in addition to terrible precedent, it would get stopped by a judge and he would get nothing. why bother. >> what's your sense? clearly, democrats are willing to give on border money, on the

$1.6 billion originally and the white house was giving on this. they're now saying this is their line in the sand. >> it's incredibly troubling. we have to remember, there are real people tied to this. if donald trump decides to, let's say, shut down the government again a second time. the last one was 35 day, the longest government shutdown we've ever had. we saw people, long lines on food lines, we saw people deciding between medicine and food. we saw people not able to pay their rent. that's really the question here. is he willing to do that again and hurt hundreds of thousands of people, really, millions of people, you think about their families and how much does the domino effect, how much other people it affects there. it's really troubling. it seemed as if you showed earlier, there was an agreement, we had shelby talking about it, i think we've come to a place

and he goes to the white house and all is changed. it seems like democrats and republicans can do this on the hill but donald trump needs to come around. >> my sense was they did have good meetings with the white house around thursday or so and got flexibility on border money. at camp david over the weekend, it became clear this ice bed question was the real sticking point. let's talk about elpass so. the president is going there monday, there is a dueling beta o'rourke pro el paso. how much on el paso is about beta o'rourke and his 2020 campaign? >> a good question. i will be on that trip tomorrow. the white house officials i talked to about this trip said it has nothing to do with beta o'rourke. >> do you believe them? >> in a way, i do. they created actually a huge

opportunity to for beta o'rourke. and the reason they're going is the low crime rate and physical fencing barrier and trump wants to make the case the walls work and fencing in el paso has lowered the crime rate there. that's not entirely true because the crime rate is already low before the fencing went in and been one of the safest cities in the united states for two decades now and one of the reasons beta o'rourke and other leaders are going to do this truth program to counter trump's rhetoric they call a demagogue with the actual facts of crime history. >> phil raises a good point. this is one of the easiest things to disprove. you can put the crime rate in el paso on a chart and look when they started building the wall. they started building the wall after the crime rate fell. is the president making a mistake with that? >> when has this stopped the president? >> fair enough.

>> he will make this a really big issue. frankly, it does give beta o'rourke a chance to shine in a way he doesn't otherwise. i don't think the white house minds that because it adds one more person left of the democrats to start fighting. >> thanks. >> thank you. coming up next, we dig into the slew of trump probes coming up on the horizon and look at new reporting on one of his most aggressive adversaries in the house. we're back after this. we're back after this. uh-oh! guess what day it is? guess what day it is! huh...anybody? julie! hey...guess what day it is? ah come on, i know you can hear me. mike mike mike mike mike... what day is it mike? ha ha ha ha! leslie, guess what today is?

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an economic miracle is taking place in the united states and the only thing that can stop it are foolish wars, politics or ridiculous partisan investigations. if there is going to be peace and legislation, there cannot be war and investigation. it just doesn't work that way. >> that was president trump tuesday at the state of the union. this was his acting chief of staff, nick mulvaney on sunday.

mick mulvaney. >> does the president recognize congress has a legitimate oversight role in addition to its legislative role and it's an aggressive legislative role? >> he's saying, look, you have a choice, we can work together on legislation or spend all your time doing investigations. it's not reasonable to do both. not reasonable to expect the president to work with you monday on a big infrastructure bill and tuesday have them punch you in the face. >> perhaps you should visit the republican house under president obama. the president's claims says it is tantamount to harassment. and rich burr said his committee so far could not conclude there was any collusion between the trump campaign and russia. during the trump conversation, former assistant attorney general, during the obama

administration, elliot williams and national reporter, mike. i want to start with you since you were there for a lot of this, there were plenty of investigations of president obama, or at least his administration while he was also managing to work with congress? >> absolutely. and i worked in legislative affairs helping to manage that relationship, so here we are. hillary clinton testified for 13 hours on benghazi. there was fast and furious, a list of investigations where they made it quite difficult to get the job -- the work of the american people done. never once did anyone at the administration use the terms "presidential harassment." it's a ko equal branch of government. this is part of divided government. sally yates, my former boss used to say, i welcome congressional oversight because it helps me do my job better and what the american people need. this motion that merely having

hearings or investigating the process is harassment and foolish is over. >> one difference is they were not investigating barack obama personally, possibly because of his lack of business entanglements. how much of this war and investigations -- is the president able to separate, say, looking at scott pruitt and his misuse of federal funds into the inquiries into his own personal businesses? does it's squall late to him personally or anger of the whole thing? >> certainly, it will escalate as it gets to the president personally. this is not a president known for nuance or gradations. he will view any investigation into any aspect of the administration as a personal attack from the democrats in congress. looking at corruption by scott pruitt or other cabinet officials he will see as an attack on him. >> mike, i want to talk about the reporting you have out

tonight first on our air here. you're talking about rape between adam schiff for whom president trump has an unsavory nickname, president trump tried to claim this week he didn't know who adam schiff was which is not the case. why does that matter? >> i think the kids called that sarcasm a little bit of shade early on. we have two personalities that could not be more different. we have a lot of committees on the hill. just about every democratic chairman wants a piece of trump oversight. a lot of big personalities. jerry nadler we saw on friday tangling with donald trump back to their time in new york politics where he was opposing his buildings. for some reason president trump directed most of his ire to schiff this week. we have a president who likes to watch a lot of cable news and adam schiff we appreciate this,

is often on cable news. an important fact to hear. adam schiff, as chairman of the intelligence committee, former ranking member has a former head start. there was a russian investigation that happened in the last congress. he knows where the gaps are and where he wants to pick up and expand that investigation. we saw them on day one take a big step to help robert mueller in his investigation including don junior and his son. we heard that don junior may have lied to congress and potential avenue for another crime. he is somebody he sees talking bad about him on tv he doesn't like but somebody who will be one of his biggest adversaries. >> people i talk to say in private, they hear from the president when he sees them on television. do you see what happened might backfire, the fact they slid so

far back that perhaps another bipartisan committee might not have been as partisan on the president at this point. >> it was a striking moment when schiff came out after the first meeting. in 2017, adam schiff and devin nunes were standing side by side to announce a bipartisan investigation. things went down hill quick and nunes is shooting back against schiff touting he will use the attention he has as chairman to advance his own political career. devin nunes is conducting his own investigation, continuing his line of inquiry of the fisa abuses he thinks the justice department was doing with president trump. there will be a lot of sparring between those two. >> very interesting. please, read mike's new piece on nbc news. thank you all very much. when we come back, i'm joined live by democratic

congresswoman lucy mcbath and she had a front row seat with matt whittaker. and potential legislation that could change gun laws and a deeply personal issue for her and her family. sonal issue for and her family they customized my insurance, so i only pay for what i need. i insured my car, and my bike. my calves are custom too, but i can't insure those... which is a crying shame. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ every day, people are fighting type 2 diabetes with food,

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but she might not be sweatpants cool. not quite ready to face the day? that's why we're here with free hot breakfast. book at hampton.com for our price match guarantee. hampton by hilton. welcome back to "kasie dc." this thursday, valentine's day, marks one year since the high school shooting in hark land,

florida. 17 students and staff members were shot and killed that day, parkland, florida. making it one of the deadliest shootings. congresswoman lucy mcbath lost her teenage son to gun violence in 2012. this coming saturday, the 16th, jordan would have turned 24 years old. his death is what moved her to run for office. this line from a tweet during her campaign summed up her candidacy. i intend to show the good people of georgia 6 what a tough determined mother can do. joining me now is congresswoman lucy mcbath, vice chair woman of the gun task force. thank you for being here. >> thank you for having me. >> let's start with what wasn't said at the state of the union, the president of the united states not talking about gun violence even in a year it is ever more clear this is still an

epidemic across america. what do you say to the president? >> i think that was a huge oversight simply because we know the violent culture we're living in, no one is immune to it. we have over 100 people in this country continue to die senselessly every single day. i kept sitting there expecting to hear something about gun violence prevention or the state of the culture and he never did. i thought that was a huge oversight on his part, particularly because i intend to make sure that i'm working on the front lines of this issue while in washington. >> i want to ask you about that. i've covered this issue as a reporter on capitol hill, from the time of the terrible tragedy at sandy hook, when there was some momentum to try to do something about the gun laws, and it failed in the wake of that terrible tragedy. what have you learned since coming to congress about how this might unfold in the democratic house and whether

anyone thinks there is a realistic opportunity to make changes to our gun laws? >> i think we're in a very interesting time in our nation right now. when, for the first time in about a decade, we're actually now having hearings, we're having hearings that i get to sit in on with the judiciary committee, hearings on gun violence. that hasn't happened for some time. i think just that serves as an indication of the movement we're building and consciousness of the country that people will no longer stand by and watch these senseless tragedies happen every single day. over 100 people a day are continuing to die. the hearings are packed. i myself sat on the other side. i, too, can remember being in these hearings and judiciariry bi -- judiciary bill mark-ups being a mother and victim of gun

violence, how the united states government legislators were not willing to pass safety measures on existing gun laws. now that i'm sitting on the other side, helping to enforce these policies, definitely, change is coming. >> you're from georgia, historically a red state. there is an a lot of rural areas that are particularly conservative. but it's one that is clearly trending towards more purple. how do you argue or how do you explain your position to people who are from the rural parts of your state who say there shouldn't be more gun restrictions? how do you reassure them about their gun rights while still arguing your position? >> well, i always must preface that i am a strong supporter of the second amendment. my father was a hunter. my oldest nephew was a sniper in the marines, so i am not against people being able to arm themselves and protect

themselves and their territories. i want people to be able to hunt. i want people to be gun enthusiasts. it's not about that. but with owning guns comes great responsibility, responsibility to use your guns in the correct way. so that's what i always try to tell people is i want you to be able to use your guns. i'm not against you using them, but have some -- we have to have some common sense measures placed in our existing gun laws to balance being able to use our guns responsibly. >> your son, jordan, was of course lost to gun violence and it would be his birthday here coming up. >> yes. >> what do you hope other parents would take away from your loss? and what do you hope jordan is thinking as he perhaps sees his mother now in congress? >> i hope that he would be proud of me.

i'll be actually working on his 16th birthday. i know that everything that he -- that i wanted him to be is what drives me now to continue to work on behalf of others. what i want parents to know is that they have to have some sense of hope, that the culture is the way that it is right now because it has run amuck basically for the last 25, 30 years, it's been unchecked. but now there's a whole movement of people galvanized to make sure we're protecting our families. i do want them to have some sense of hope. there are a lot of gun champions working with me on the hill now and i'm happy to work on their behalf. chairman nadler is working diligently to make sure we continue to have these discussions and hold the country accountable for making sure we're keeping people safe. >> congresswoman lucy mcbath. thank you very much for being here tonight. >> thank you.

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. a new poll shows democratic voters are prioritizing electability over values as they consider which candidate to

support in 2020. 56% of democrats prefer someone who would be a strong challenger against president trump even if they disagree with that candidate on most issues. and if you hear a family member or friend or neighbor cite that poll or one like it. as the campaign season continues. washington post reporter ben terrace warns they may be suffering what he calls pundit itse itis. >> have you been worrying at ab candidate's electability talk about polling. ability or looking at electoral maps. have you ever said i really love elizabeth warren but i can't vote for her because i don't think she can win? if you answered yes to any of these you may be suffering from pundititis. a virus born out of the 2016 election that mostly targeted

democrats. people unable to fall in love with a candidate because they --. where does it co-from? after hillary clinton's surprising loss to president trump in the 2016 election democratic voters couldn't help but try and make sense of it. many spent hours watching cable television listening to the pundits. >> comey's letter was instrumental but he didn't tell her not to campaign in wi. >> they sought answers but instead they caught the bug. when considering who to support a lot of voters are trying to figure who will play well in the mid west or trying to decide if the country is ready for a female president. even when sitting on their couch sufferers talk like on an nbc set. the as sad ailment. one whose only cure is vote for who you love. at least the person you like the most. nobody really know whose is electable. especially the pundits.

very cute. this tends to come i at thanksgiving primarily as well. thanks very much to ben for that. we're going tweet the link to his full piece in the washington post. you can follow us an twitter at "kasie dc." t "kasie dc. but with esurance, just snap some pics and you could get back on the road fast! well, not that fast. this editor made this commercial fit in 15 seconds. when insurance is simple, it's surprisingly painless. (vo) the only network to win in all four major awards is the one more people rely on. choose america's most reliable network on the best device: iphone. get iphone xr on us when you buy another. better things than rheumatoid arthritis. before you and your rheumatologist move to another treatment, ask if xeljanz xr is right for you. xeljanz xr is a once-daily pill for adults with moderate to severe ra for whom methotrexate did not work well enough

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frank robinson is a man who leads by example. his wife said he believes in rules and he respects the game.

reveres the game. baseball fans across america would tell you the feeling is returned. in game we love few names will ever command as much respect and esteem as the name of frank robinson. that was prosecute george w. bush awarding the presidential medal of freedom to the great frank robinson who died this week at the age of 83. as a player he was a force of nature. and the record books frankly speak for themselves. rookie of the year. mvp in both leagues. winner of the triple crown. 586 career home runs. five league championships. two world series titles. after his career ended he became major league baseball's first black manager. he'd go on to win manager of the year in both leagues. robinson once said, i had one thought in my mind every time i did something in this game.

i'm trying to make it better for kids that are coming after me. and that is exactly what he did. amazing legacy for my orioles baseball and our country. before we go. let's talk about what you are watching in the week ahead in politics. phil what are you looking for? >> we're paying so much attention to the border wall fight and whether the government is going to shut down. it is also a big period for foreign policy for president trump. he's got a summit later this month in vietnam with kim jong un and we'll see if there is some development there in the nuclear talks. >> corrine? >> i'll be watching the government shut down. in particular the dynamics between the republicans on the hill and the white house. in particular the senate. because they clearly have, the republicans have the majority. and they have said they don't want do see national emergency declaration. they don't want to see another shut down and many in purple states are going to be really concerned what happens at the end of this week. so will they be able to stop that? >> and i'm watching i'll be up

on the hill this week tracking all of that. thank you to koky roberts. that is tamara keith's dog. watching "kasie dc" for tonight. that is going to do it for us tonight here on "kasie dc." back next week from 7:00 to 9:00 eastern. up next. joe biden, michelle obama, facebook and michael flinn back-to-back. for now good night from washington. \s kp \s kp >> could joe biden have defeated donald trump? >> oh, i don't know. >> this is the great what-if. >> i say to democrats and republicans and independents alike. >> don't sell this country short, folks. >> joe biden has spent a lifetime as a political power player. >> he just had encyclopedic knowledge of foreign policy. >> one thing i know about joe biden, this is a guy i would take on a long patrol. >> he celebrated triumphs. >> i accept your nomination to run and serve with barack obama!