welcome to "kasie dc." i'm kasie hunt. we're live every sunday from washington from 7:00 to 9:00 p.m. eastern. tonight, states plan to sue as the president readies for a legal battle over his declaration of a national emergency. plus, accused of lack of candor by federal officials, andrew mccabe has a lot to say on national television. and my interview with democrat julian castro on his campaign for president. we start with good news, major league baseball squads

reporting to spring training this week, yes, including my orioles. meanwhile back here in washington, a dispute over policy became a dispute over constitutional power as president trump declared a national emergency at the southern border. and now a number of states are preparing to file lawsuits, while the chairman of the house judiciary committee announced an immediate investigation. advocacy groups like public citizen are already out with lawsuits. so that's what's coming. but how did we get here? shortly after congress unveiled a deal to give $1.3 billion for just 55 miles of border fencing, the president announced he would find the rest of the money himself. that decision followed reports he was willing to blow up the congressional border deal on thursday just before the votes took place. "the washington post" writes, quote, by mid-afternoon, however, trump was back on board, agreeing to sign the legislation with the caveat he would also declare a national

emergency in an attempt to use existing governor funds to pay for wall construction. it was an option that republican leaders had urged him to avoid. but they eventually accepted it as necessary to escape the corner in which trump and his party were trapped. mcconnell promised trump he would encourage others to support the emergency in a bid to get the president to sign. and here's the majority leader talking about the prospect of an emergency declaration in sound bites that came just ten days apart. >> did you privately urge the president not to declare a national emergency? >> we have not had the procedure before because the national emergencies that have been issued in the past have not been contentious. i'm pretty sure this one would be. i've just had an opportunity to speak weapon president trump, and i would say to all of my colleagues, he's indicated he's prepared to sign the bill. he will also be issuing a national emergency declaration

at the same time. i indicated to him i'm going to support the national emergency declaration. >> and with that i'd like to welcome in my panel cnbc editor at large john harwood. washington bureau chief for vice news, shanna thomas. dnc communications director and republican strategist and msnbc political analyst rick tyler. thank you all for being here this evening. john, we knew on thursday this was a very, very anxious day for republicans on the hill. you could see it in their faces. i was surprised they weren't literally biting their nails based on what we were hearing. turns out it was worse that day the post report came out and said the president was this close to absolutely walking away. how does the republican party grapple with this decision now? because so many of them are already on the record saying, no way are we going to back this. >> mitch mcconnell was on the record saying it was a bad idea.

look, i think from a republican point of view, they are trying to manage this president, and it was sort of sad to see mitch mcconnell go to the floor like that and embrace a declaration that he criticized before it hand. but i think he came to the conclusion that was the only way he could prevent the president of the united states from driving the government toward another shutdown he might not be able to prevent with a veto override. i think republicans are trying to manage the situation. i talked to a couple of republican members of congress over the weekend, and one of them said look, it's going to be struck down by the courts, we all know that. let's just move on. so i think they're not willing to protect the separation of powers in this instance because the price of that -- standing up ahead of time and challenging the president might be a situation that would be even worse from their perspective. >> but for members of your

still-current faerparent, i fee like i should add that -- >> i believe in redemption. >> that may not happen. the courts may not strike this down. what position are we in here? >> and for trump, and only trump, it was the best last worst choice. when reagan wanted to reform social security he was getting hammered but worked out a deal with tip o'neill and declared american victory. that's how it's supposed to work. bill clinton couldn't get hillary care passed and he moved on. george w. bush couldn't get privatization of social security passed, and he moved on and took the defeat. trump can't take the defeat so he needed a way out. i think the republicans recognized by declaring it a national emergency, which is this is not, let's be clear, i don't think this is what the legislation was intended for. i urge congress to go back and tighten it up. it is not a national emergency. but now trump can say he got his

victory. let me mention this, when a candidate loses their core identifier as who they are as a candidate, as a person, it's over. and trump is a deal maker who never backs down, right? that's gone now. nancy pelosi's proved it three times. first on the state of the union, pulling that out from under him. >> and i know what i will ask now. >> and the the third. he found another way out and negotiating is not part of his skill set. >> politically he gets to take this saying i am trying to get a wall built for all of my constituents who want a wall built. he will get stopped in the courts probably but we have about a thousand lawsuits that will be filed or have been filed. he will say look at the liberals from california or somewhere else are trying to impede me for

what i want to do. it's not a bad 2020 issue for him. it's also not a bad 2020 issue for democrats as well. >> i disagree a little bit. donald trump is at 39% approval rating. right know he can't get elected. you have to be at least 49% in order to get elected. right now he made a move to satisfy his base. and so what's going to happen now is that the majority of the people don't agree with this, he don't agree with the national emergency, they don't agree with the border wall and instead of coming together and unite us and let's focus on ways to reform our health care system or issues people care about, kitchen table issues, he's put something on the table that will now divide us all. i think he's in big trouble if what he's worried right now is his base. >> are you worried about democrats potentially going too far? there was one point during negotiations they were talking about the number of beds i.c.e. could use in a given day and they quickly retreated from that, because it was clearly

hard to message -- some of the president's advisers said they did paint democrats soft on security. my own reporting quibbles with that. but from your perspective, where is the line for democrats who have to face a primary and then face trump in re-election. >> i think it proves we are willing to have that conversation and have that conversation at the table when it comes to that. but the majority of americans stand with us on all of these issues and that's why we won overwhelmingly in the midterm elections. right now we are on the side of the american people when it comes to all of these issues, just look at trump's approval rating. >> kasie, you want to go back to your question about republicans going foo tar. in the end democrats and republicans came together on this compromise. the president ran in 2016 -- >> good point. >> -- by trying to create an illusion he could accomplish

fantastic things on the wall and trade that other presidents were too incompetent to do. i interviewed him on that subject at that time and i said what are you going to do when people see you're in office and it's a lot harder and you're not the wizard of oz. he said you watch, i'm going to do it. democrats and republicans together, like toto, have pulled back that curtain and people can see that he's not achieving these great things. and that forces him into ever-grating contortions. we saw that in the news conference the other day. >> contorsion is a good word. >> i have built the wall. i have gotten more money than i know what to do with. i never needed the emergency. it was not a confidence-inspiring performance, let's put it that way. and people see it. there's a significant portion of the country, his base, they may not even believe what he's saying himself but they go along with it because they think he's on their side.

most of the country can see that it's not working and that's why -- >> he's also broken the record for largest defendants, largest spending, largest federal government we ever had. he can announce all of those things but those -- he doesn't have -- to john's point like on trade, he has one trade deal with the south koreans. as far as i can tell, the one accomplishment it got done was american customers can't buy korean pickup trucks. and everything else is the same. nafta's not in place, the usm kraxt -- >> both of those deals were very incremental achievements. >> and it hasn't been ratified by the u.s., mexico or canadian parliament and is not likely to be. >> so "the washington post" writes today about this, quote, these endeavors underscore the except to which trump ands a allies are attempting to make 2020 a repeat of 2016 centered on a portrayal of the nation as undersiege from criminal immigrants and other dark forces

and reliant upon a die-hard base of older whites in rural areas. finish the wall is really finish what we started. it's about the trump presidency more than anything said one white house official. it's telling voters to stick with us, finish what we started as the democrats pursue the green new deal or medicare for all. shawna, how do you see the landscape in 2020 as different from 2016 in this strategy? clearly it was one that worked against hillary clinton but also right in the wake of president obama. >> well, i think one thing you have to realize is that especially 2020 also involves all of the republicans who have to republican for re-election. you had people like max thornberry of texas, ranking member is now of the house armed services committee, who basically before this hand was like please, president trump, please, please, don't go this national emergency route because i don't want to have to tell my constituents military construction money is being shifted from msg construction to a wall. he's actually created a weird

2020 problem for some republicans possibly. but i think less when it comes to the presidential election, the members of congress who are running this time, the senators, these democratic senators, he's basically set up a situation where they have something very, very clear to run against. and if everyone is right and his base is not enough -- if you're right and his base is not enough to actually win him the election, then all -- anyone who actually wins your nomination out of the 20, 25, 30, 35 or who actually going to run -- >> shawna, you're stressing me out. >> this is actually a really good issue for them. >> absolutely. but also i think i'm from texas, and a lot of my friends and family members are republican. they didn't think donald trump would actually move forward with the border wall. and they opposed this. so i think what is happening right now is that a number of republicans who are middle of the road don't -- aren't with him this time around.

why do you think beto o'rourke did so well in texas? trump isn't where he was in 2016. with democrats you're seeing great enthusiasm, if there are 20 people who run, everyone that comes out, you're seeing great enthusiasm with grass roots fund-raising. they're raising millions of dollars, which is huge for the democratic party. >> rick, do you view it that way? what will it take for the democrats here? >> that's a good question. new hampshire, iowa -- iowa, new hampshire in order, nevada, south carolina, grass roots states. joe biden is a great grass roots campaigner. but on march 3rd you have big money states, one is california, one is massachusetts, one is virginia and you can start naming people favored there. oklahoma is actually on the same day. massachusetts and oklahoma favors elizabeth warren, california for kamala harris. she may do well actually in south carolina. terry mcauliffe could do very

well in virginia and beto o'rouke on march 3rd also. all of those people can raise a lot, a lot of money. we will see if some grass roots candidate can emerge before march 3rd. >> my head is spinning. we have much more to come tonight. former fbi acting director andy mccabe is opening up about the russia probe in a book due out next week. "the washington post" greg miller got his hand on a copy and joins me next. >> later, brand-new reporting tonight from the last congressional race still undecided. we'll finally get an answer this week to whether there has to be a whole new election. and new analysis about how many absentee ballots were sent out and never returned. try alka-seltzer pm gummies. the only fast, powerful heartburn relief, plus melatonin so you can fall asleep quickly. oh, what a relief it is!

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another mueller friday, as mueller prosecutors win a new ruling to gag roger stone. in the case of paul manafort asking for a sentence of 19 to 24 years. sarah huckabee sanders has been interviewed by the mueller team. bill barr showed up for his first day as attorney general. >> he's now in charge of overseeing the investigation. >> enjoy your life. bill, good luck. >> it was, as can you see, a busy week of news surrounding the mueller probe. and all of that is to say nothing from the revelations of the "60 minutes" interview with former acting director andrew mccabe, including his game the

deputy general spoke to him about the 25th amendment following the firing of james comey. >> the discussion of the 25th amendment was simply rod raised the issue and discussed it with me in the context of thinking about how many other cabinet officials might support such an effort. >> rosenstein was actually openly talking about whether there was a majority of the cabinet who would vote to remove the president? >> that's correct. counting votes or possible votes. the deputy attorney general was definitely very concerned about the president, about his capacity, and about his intent at that point in time. >> how did he bring up the idea of the 25th amendment to you? >> honestly, i don't remember. >> the justice department is pushing back on mccabe's claim, writing in a statement, quote,

as the deputy attorney general previously has stated, based on his personal dealings with the president, there is no basis to invoke the 25th amendment nor was the deputy attorney general in a position to consider invoking the 25th amendment. this morning senator lindsey graham said he wants to get to the bottom of who's telling the truth. >> who's telling the truth, what actually hand? we're a democracy. people who enforce the law can't take it into their own hands and was this an attempted bureaucratic coup? i don't know who's telling the truth. i know rosenstein's vehemently denied it but we're going to get to the bottom of it. >> joining the conversation is "the washington post" national security correspondent greg miller, who obtained a copy of the book ahead of its release. first of all, having looked at the book, who do you believe, mccabe or rosenstein? they seem to be telling opposite stories? >> i think it's clear not only from mccabe but other reporting

there was a conversation about the 25th amendment and this is something rosenstein raised. mccabe describes rosenstein's behave n behavior in that moment is consistent with others described it to me. >> walk us through that. >> he was really -- after he ends up supplying the memo that is used to fire jim comey, rosenstein is aghast. he doesn't see this coming and reacts in a very emotional way. in the book mccabe describes these emotional conversations with rosenstein where he's asking do you think it would be okay for me to call jim comey and ask about setting a motion of special counsel? and others have had similar encounters with him. he clearly was really deeply troubled by how all of this was being pinned on him and how quickly things were snowballing. and i think it's pretty -- i think it's believable he raised this idea of using the 25th amendment. >> what's your sense from your reporting about how rosenstein evolve odd on that question?

what they're saying now is he dealt with the president and all is fine? >> yes, i think that rosenstein, like a lot of figures at the justice department and at the bureau have veered between being just stricken by what they see in the president when they encounter him or meet with him and then trying to find ways to accommodate him or coexist with him. and rosenstein has been in the coexisting mode ever since the sort of survival of this initial rocky patch with the president. >> but rosenstein has also expressed much greater confidence in public in his own position in this circumstance, which is consistent with what greg's talking about being knocked back, shocked by what happened early in the administration, but you notice that periodically over last several months he's been making statements. i'm not going to be intimidated by anybody. the justice department's going to do its job. that strikes me as someone who

regained his balance and decided that he was going to act in a way he thought was necessary to protect his both reputation and the justice department's reputation, and i think that is consistent with what greg's reporting has found about his reaction to events early in the administration. >> shawna, rosenstein is leaving now, leaving us in the hands of bill barr. how do you think that impacts this whole scenario? >> i don't think -- for a little while, we're not going to see what rosenstein's point of view is but i imagine rod rosenstein also wants to write a book, much like andrew mccabe. why wouldn't you? and then we will find out what really hand behind the scenes with that. this is the statement that you read before the department of justice has to put out, whether you believe it or not, they have to continue to support the president of the united states and that makes total sense. but rod rosenstein will either confirm andrew mccabe or he

won't. >> how much credence do you give to the justice department's ig report? and how much doubt does that cast on mccabe's credibility? the one who said he may or did lie? >> it's around important thing to look at because it really did cast some doubt on his integrity coming out of this job. and his version of events, of course, in the book is at odds with the ig report on this matter. and in the book he basically tries to say, i was caught off guard and in this confusing conversation i didn't answer the right way, the ig report points to four specific incidents when he fails to answer that question clearly on his contacts or his involvement in bureau contacts with the press. >> and he's at odds with jim comey as well. >> and all of this interestingly is stuff he buries in the book. there's nothing in the book about his sort of disagreement with comey on this issue or the real fundamental tension and ongoing tension he has with rod

rosenstein. he depicts rosenstein as borderline unhundredthinged in aftermath of the comey firing but does not deeper. >> if rod rosenstein wants to write a book, he probably has a lot to write it. rick miller, thank you very much, rick tyler, shawna and john harwood, thank you for being here tonight. coming up, julian castro is standing by. democrats try to stand out in a growing field. "kasie dc" back after this.

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like campaign season. over the weekend 2020 democratic presidential hopefuls were all across the country making their pitches to voters in some of the early voting states. joining me now from san antonio is former secretary of housing and urban development and current 2020 democratic presidential candidate julian castro. their, thank you for being on the program tonight. >> great to be with you, kasie. >> i want to talk through some policy issues with you, starting with the border. there was a split among democrats on the funding deal that provided some new fencing

on the border. your brother, among those who voted no on that conference report. senator amy klobuchar, bernie sanders both voting yes over in the senate. where do you think the heart of the democratic party is? >> i don't think that most folks support more border fencing or certainly not a border wall. as you know, kasie, there are already 654 miles of fencing along a border that is 1,094 miles long and to the except somebody believes there may have been fencing needed somewhere, i think that's already been done. so i'm glad that you had a number of democrats that did not support this. i would also say we should take a step back for a second and recognize that this is a fake emergency that the president has called. a couple weeks ago his own intelligence officers submitted their report about threats to our country, national security threats, and mexico and the

southern border hardly made a blip on that radar screen. we have much more pressing issues in terms of threats or potential threats to our country than this. and it was very telling to me that the first thing that this president did when he got up there and started answering questions was said that he didn't need to do this. the fact is he just couldn't negotiate well with congress to get what he wanted, and he believes that he needs this wall to get re-elected, and so that's what he did. the next day, even though we're supposed to have this national emergency, he went down to florida to play golf. so it's a fake emergency. >> do you think that there is a problem of any kind with illegal immigration in this country? >> well, i think the united states, like any other nation in the world, always has to have secure borders, and the fact is today our border -- our southern border is more secure probably than it ever has been.

the level of apprehensions of people coming across the southern border is at a low we haven't seen, number we haven't seen since 1971. we know most of the folks who come here end up being undocumented don't come through the southern border, they actually overstay their visa. or come here in some other way. the president is not actually addressing the real issue here. of course, we have to have borders that are secure, but the better way to do this is, for instance, to invest in our ports of entry. i'll give you a great example of that. two weeks ago in arizona we had the largest bust of fentanyl ever trying to come across the border, 254 pounds. that didn't come through the desert, the middle of the desert or some remote place. a wall wouldn't have done anything about that. it came through one of our ports of entry with where trucks come through. we need to spend more on

personnel and technology at our ports of entry. >> some of your colleagues in the democratic party suggested abolishing i.c.e. is the way to go. do you believe in abolishing i.c.e.? >> well, the way i say this is if somebody means we're not going to have enforcement, of course, we're always going to have enforcement. if what you mean is should we do the enforcement differently from we've been doing, i agree with that. >> do you think it's to the point where this -- does this agency have so many problems it can't be fixed, it needs to be restarted from scratch? >> i think it needs to be reconstructed. they need to reconstitute that division. there were 19 people that worked in i.c.e. about a year ago, maybe nine months ago, that wrote a letter saying i.c.e. is not working. this is not just some political talking point or people with a partisan view. people who work in that department, that was unprecedented for 19 people to come forward that work in the division of the federal government.

i led one of our cabinet agencies but those 19 people said look, we can tell you that i.c.e. is not working. so we need to do something different. i agree with that. i think we do need to reconstitute i.c.e. and for people that are out there that are thinking, well, how is that -- is that somehow radical? the answer to that is no, we're always going to have enforcement but we need that enforcement to be effective. we also need that enforcement to respect human beings and i don't think we've gotten either effectiveness or respect of human beings that you should see from that division. >> let's switch gears and talk about health care, which is another topic that has already been at the forefront of this democratic presidential primary. you have endorsed medicare for all. do you believe that there is a role for private insurance, or do you think everyone should be on the medicare for all plan? >> well, i believe that

everybody who wants to be on medicare ought to be able to get medicare. what i don't believe is that the profit motive should fundamentally drive whether somebody is able to get health care when they need it. different countries do this differently. so to answer your question directly, i do think if somebody wants to have a supplemental plan or private plan, that they should be able to do that. however, nobody in this country should go without health care because they don't have the resources, they don't have the money to afford it. we have too many people that can't get good health care right now because they don't have the money for it and that's wrong. especially in the wealthiest country in the world. >> what do you think is a realistic way to make that policy a reality? how would you pay for medicare for all? >> i think we're going to have to do that in a number of ways during the course of this campaign. i look forward to proposing my own way to do that. as you know, kasie, there are a

number of different ways that are proposed by think tanks, folks in congress. i look forward during the course of this campaign to propose my own way to pay for medicare for all. >> would you consider a tax on the wealthy as elizabeth warren and some others in the party have outlined? >> oh, no doubt. no doubt. i'm convinced like i think a lot of americans are, whether they're conservative or liberal, that basically for the last 40 years what's been happening is that folks at the top have been -- the tax burden has been getting lighter and lighter on them and for folks in the lower middle cl middle class especially, the burden is getting heavier and their ability to get ahead in this country is getting harder and harder. i do think we need to look at ways that healthy corporations and wealthy individuals can pay their fair share, so absolutely i would. and again, i've taken a look at, of course, some of the other

plans that have been proposed. i think at the end of the day we're going to have to do a combination of those things, and i'm going to have my own plan during the course of this campaign, but it will include asking femme at t asking people at the top and corporations to pay their fair share. >> on foreign policy, some democrats have also questioned potential u.s. intervention in venezuela, and this administration's opposition to the maduro regime. where do you stand on whether or not the u.s. should be involved? what should the except of our involvement in venezuela be? >> i would take a step back and say that the united states has many people out -- as many people out there watching knows has a long, complicated fraught relation s relationship with my countries in south america. in fact, some of strong-men leaders have used the united

states as a kind of foil to gain popular support in their own country. the last thing that the united states should do is to step into the business of another country at a very fragile moment. i'm glad that maduro is not there. or that maduro, it looks like, may well end up losing the authority that he had. i'm glad to see that the people of venezuela are rising up and there was a protest just the other day that had more than 200,000 people there. but what happens in venezuela has to be determined by the venezuelans, not by the united states. what maduro was doing, essentially jailing political opponents, having a sham election, essentially cradling the economy there, people losing

15, 20 pounds, people starving, that's wrong. so i'm glad to see change there. but that change has to be led by the venezuelans, not, i don't think, by the united states. oftentimes if we push too hard, we actually get a response back from the people in those countries that counteracts what we would want in those countries. >> julian castro, thank you so much for a substantive interview, sir. on a lighter note i was pleased to learn that you and your brother saw the last "star wars" firm together. i appreciate having a fellow "star wars" aficionado on the show. >> good to be with you. >> thank you. maine governor paul lepage was a close ally of the president. when we come back, we're going to get a new scoop out this weekend about the amount of state money his administration used as a trump hotel. laritin and relief from symptoms caused by over 200 indoor and outdoor allergens. like those from buddy. because stuffed animals are clearly no substitute for real ones.

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a report published today in the portland press herald alleges former maine governor paul lepage and his staff spent nearly $22,000 in taxpayer money at the trump international hotel in washington, d.c. over a two-year period. that's according to receipts and documents obtained by the paper. the spending was first flagged by an employee in the state controller's office back in june 2017. an e-mail to a superior reads, quote, the governor and some of his staff are staying in washington, d.c. pretty frequently at the trump international hotel and the room

cost is way more than the allowed amount. it goes on, quote, he's not attending a conference of any type but is meeting with the president, testifying, meeting with lawmakers and others, et cetera. so the normal exemptions to state spending limits do not apply. the spending included reportedly 40-plus room with the most expensive costing $1,100 per night. we've reach oud tout lepage and his team but have not heard back. joining me now, staff writer from the portland press herald, kevin miller. kevin, thank you so much for being on tonight. >> thank you for having me. >> let's talk first about this story you all broke. this was taxpayer money, right, and this seems to be, according to your reporting, the suggestion that essentially lepage was trying to curry favor with the president by staying at his hotel. what are the potential consequences of that? >> well, no one necessarily is

saying the governor was trying to curry favor with the president but we're merely pointing out the governor is spending quite a bit of time in washington, d.c. and during those trips to d.c., he frequently used the trump hotel as his base for operating out of. as for the potential ramifications of that, there's actually a federal lawsuit pending right now which is looking at whether the president is illegally profiting from his hotel there in d.c. >> so let's explore that a little bit more. that lawsuit would suggest he perhaps has violated the emollients clause. how would the governor of maine play into that? >> the clause is the president cannot earn any kind of an income from foreign, state or government dignitaries. so the question now is that the

court will be looking at is whether these payments to the trump hotel, the trump hotel is owned by the trump organization, which is run by the president's children, whether these payments to the hotel constitute some sort of payment to the president, which would violate the ee momollients cause to the kosstution. >> constitution. >> what about lepage, does he potentially face any ramifications from your reporting? >> we're not suggesting anything in our reporting that he's done anything illegal. from our perspectives, it's more the optics of it. in maine president trump is a controversial figure, like he is pretty much everywhere else around the country. hillary clinton won this state by about 3 percentage points in 2016. and there are certainly a lot of taxpayers who would be offended -- who are offended by the fact our governor is choosing to patronize a hotel that provides profits to the

president and to his family. so like i said, we're not saying there's anything illegal going on from the governor's standpoint, but it does go to this question of whether the hotel, the fact that the hotel is owned by the president's family, whether that is some sort of violation of the ee moll uants clause. >> kevin miller, thank you very much for your reporting. when we continue, we have brand-new reporting on the last congressional race still under way. that's right, north carolina nine is still not decided amid accusations of fraud. and now nbc news has new reporting just out about how many absentee ballots were sent out and never returned. don't go anywhere. to make you everybody else... ♪ ♪ means to fight the hardest battle, which any human being can fight and never stop. does this sound dismal?

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three months after election day there is still one congressional race undecided. a hearing that starts tomorrow will determine the fate of that election in north carolina's ninth congressional district that remains empty amid that the political operative harvested mail-in ballots.

it will begin before the state board of elections that could lead to an entirely new election. joining me now from north carolina, great to see you as always, you have reporting on the number of absentee ballots that never came back? >> yeah, kasie, at the center of this entire dispute is absentee ballots and one person, mccray, hired by republican mark harris, to run this get out the vote campaign during the general election. on the eve of this hearing, nbc news has new reporting regarding these absentee ballots, our journalist, jeremiah, found there were 3500 people who requested absentee ballots, who never turned them in and never showed up to vote. the reason that's significant is because mark harris, the republican, is right now the unofficial leader in the race by just 900 votes.

when there's 3500 ballots in question, that could be a big deal. of course, that's just one piece of this larger puzzle and we will find out hopefully a lot more tomorrow, when the state board of election opens this long await hearing, kasie. >> what should we expect at the hearing tomorrow? how will it unfold and how long will it take? what should we expect to learn? >> it should be about two to three days is what they're expecting. the state board is going to reveal what they have found in their months long investigation into the 2018 general election. we also have the harris campaign in the democrat, the mccreedy campaign, who will call dozens of witnesses as well, including mccray dowlis, the person in the center of this investigation, who is going to be called to testify, and he is the one

running the absentee ballots. what the harris campaign is saying, the republican, telling the board, look, let's certify this race. we did not know about how mccray dowlis ran his get out the vote effort and the mccreedy campaign will say, this race is tainted and they need to call for a new election. we will find out at the end of this hearing, which will be tuesday or wednesday, if the board is going to certify this election or if they're going to hold a new election. >> leigh ann caldwell, thanks for your reporting and good luck the next couple of days. >> thank you. the very public return of former acting fbi director, mccabe. and joined by congressman brown, a retired colonel who won a bronze star in combat and deeply opposed to how billions of dollars in defense spending

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president trump declared a national emergency on friday. >> the president's plan is

already being challenged on capitol hill. >> the president united democrats against him, divided republicans. >> he didn't really need to do this. >> i didn't need to do this. how does that justify a national emergency? >> how is that not presidential overreach. >> despite what congress has given past presidents. >> the president is trying to take the power of the purse away from the legislative branch. >> should he have done it? no. >> raising the possibility of invoking the 25th amendment -- mccabe says there's no serious conversations. >> do you know those conversations have taken place? >> no. >> to the extent it was, it is very serious. >> it will be taken up by the senate judiciary committee. >> their own inspector general

said he lieded multiple times, three times under oath. >> if you ask me, these guys ought to be the ones in jail. >> welcome to the second hour of kacie d.c. welcome susan page, nbc news intelligence and national news reporter, ken, and washington anchor for bbc news, katty kay and carol lee. thank you for being here tonight. we are sifting through several revelations out of a "60 minutes" interview that just aired with former acting director, andrew mccabe. among one of them mccabe said the president sided with vladamir putin over his officials. >> the president launched into several related diatribes. one of those was commenting on the recent missile launches by the government of north korea.

essentially the president said he did not believe north koreans had the capability to hit us here with ballistic missiles in the united states and he did not believe that because president putin had told him they did not. president putin told him the north koreans don't actually have those missiles. >> u.s. intelligence was telling the president what? >> intelligence officials in the briefs responded that that was not consistent with any of the intelligence our government possesses, to which the president replied, i don't care, i believe putin. >> what did you think when you heard that? >> it's just an astounding thing to say. >> carol lee, you have done quite a bit of reporting here at nbc news that has taken us behind the scenes of meetings like the one that andrew mccabe just described. what's your reaction to what head to say there?

how does it fit into the pantheon of this president questioning his intelligence officials and where would you rank it? it seems pretty severe. >> i think it should rank if not almost at the top, very close to the top in terms of things the president has said in terms of national security, foreign policy and talking to his advisors and challenging them and saying he believes others over them. this is the president of the united states saying he believes a very significant piece of the dealing that the u.s. has with north korea, believes vladamir putin, the leader of russia, over his own intelligence agencies. this is something we have seen the president do publicly. the fact he's doing it privately in a meet like this over such a significant issue is really jaw dropping. this also comes -- part of what's so significant about that

is the president is trying to cut a deal with north korea to get rid of its nuclear program. if he doesn't believe some of the fundamental things about north korea's nuclear program, that is inherently problematic in terms of getting to any sort of deal. this is coming out, the president will be facing questions about it. this revelation is coming out just before he's set to meet in the next 10 days again with the leader of north korea. i found that to be one of the most significant things andrew mccabe had to say. i will also add it's not inconsistent with some other things we've seen the president do, particularly we know according to some reporting in the "washington post," the president, according to his interpreter during a meeting with putin, when putin said he didn't interfere with the election, he said i believe you and runs counter to everything

intelligence says the president said. >> this seems like the most fundamental -- or one of the most fundamental problems facing the united states, one of the reasons why this conflict with north korea, this current cold conflict has unfolded the way it has and apparently the president doesn't even believe it. >> here's the question we don't know the answer to. why does the president choose to believe or choose to say he believes vladamir putin over his own intelligence agencies on things including north korea's capabilities, and also interest interference in our election? why is that? that seems to be the construction of the issue we've been wrestling with since the campaign, when we first began to hear president trump speak in such unusually positive and rosie ways about russia in general and vladamir putin in particular. that is a nut i hope we are able to crack at some point. >> katty, can we lay out how

russia's interests are laid out in the broader international picture these comments matter? >> increasingly, the russians have been involved in sanctions to north korea. particularly in the last year they stepped up their effort in that respect as president trump took on these negotiations with chinese and north korea, we have seen the russians are running oil to the north koreans and energy supplies to north koreans. they are trying to get theirselves with a place at the table in terms of the north korean let the, as they have seat at the table in the middle east now, part of putin's efforts to extend his reach beyond his own. the other thing about these comments to mccabe is why would he say this to the acting director of the fbi? why would he tell him, even if he doesn't believe his intel community over putin, he can't

possibly be a stooge of vladamir putin because he wouldn't say it so publicly. seems extraordinary, right? >> a fantastic point. a theme run through this entire interview, mccabe is asked what was the predicate for opening a counter intelligence obstruction. >> pause. i want to run this why they decided to launch this counter against probe into the president. >> what was it specifically that caused you to launch the counter intelligence investigation? >> it's many of those same concerns that caused us to be concerned about a national security threat. the idea is if the president committed obstruction of justice, fired the director of the fbi to negatively impact or to shut down our investigation of russia's mall lined activity, possibly in support of his campaign, as a

counter-intelligence investigator, you have to ask yourself, why would the president of the united states do that? all those same sorts of facts cause us to wonder, is there an inappropriate relationship, a connection between this president and our most fearsome enemy, the government of russia? >> so, ken, you were saying, now that people have gotten a chance to see that. here's what he says his rationale is. it makes perfect sense but disappointing because it was in plain sight. he told lester holt he fired comey because of the russia investigation on his mind and asked to put in the memo explaining why comey should be fired, put russia in the memo. to katty's point, would you do that if you were secretly trying to obstruct justice to make the investigation go away because you were a stooge of vladamir putin? that is exculpatory.

and the things trump said are very disturbing and raise questions about his judgment. now, we're two years later. the question is, what has mueller actually learned about whether there is a financial or counter-intelligence question? is the president compromised by russia or just has horrible judgment? we don't know. >> this is not the venue we would learn what mueller has, the way we would find out about that. maybe we ought to wait and see. >> i think there is this question, kasie, if you were a spy too the russians, would you go around saying to people, i trust vladamir putin over the cia and fbi? >> probably not. i would like to think not. i would like to think i would be a better spy than that. >> unless it's a trick. >> unless it's an elaborate hoax. >> mccabe didn't even hint there was other evidence i can't discuss on 60 minutes. he basically said we opened the investigation because of the things he said publicly, interesting to me. >> carol, what's your take on

this investigation? >> what's extraordinary, this question was asked in may of 2017, and that question has yet to be answered still now, when the president is in the oval office, obviously conducting foreign policy and being president of the united states. the question of why, i think, is also something that hovers over all of this investigation. why did the president take certain actions he took. why did the president's closest advisors lie about their contacts with russia. we all sit here and are batting around the question of why and we don't have any answers yet. that is something that i think most everybody hopes will happen in the next, whether it's weeks or coming months because this question whether the president -- the fbi is asking the question whether the president is somehow compromised or working for the russians, i think there's increasing pressure for mueller and his team to answer that question, along with the other questions of why, including whether the

behavior of the president's advisors, whether it's michael flynn or others. >> kasie, you raised a really good question, though, the question where does russia fit in the context of north korea. we can ask the question, why does president trump say about vladamir putin? is it nefarious or bad judgment? we should be looking at the consequences. and the consequences of this relationship already within two years of the trump presidency, russia has benefitted from this. secured a position in syria and gotten a place at the table and continued to meddle in the elections. we should not just look at the why, i think, but also what are the consequences, some of the sanctions rolled back on some of the oligarches, that happened already and benefits them. >> as we watch this next clip, remember andrew mccabe, there are questions about his credibility, an ig report said he lied under oath on multiple

occasions. here is mccabe's account about a bizarre conversation he had with the president about james comey. >> he said to me, i heard that you were part of the resistance. >> what did he mean by that? >> i didn't know. so i asked him. he said, i heard that you were one of the people that did not support jim comey, you didn't agree with him and decisions he made in the clinton case and is that true? and i said, no, sir, that's not true. i worked very closely with jim comey, i was a part of that team and decisions. >> did you have the sense you had given him the wrong answer? >> i knew i had given him the wrong answer. >> you weren't trying to hold onto this job? >> i wasn't willing to lie to keep it? >> what's your take away on that. >> a keen interest of that is one of the observations made andrew mccabe however anguished

he was about donald trump never found a voice to stand up to the president in their private interactions, even when the president insulted his wife. in the excerpt in the atlantic now, he describes how trump want god to the fbi after firing comey and convinced it was a popular move and he would be lauded there. and he didn't say, that's a bad idea, a lot of people like james comey and went along as he describes the meeting. and mccabe has been charged in a separate matter entirely related to russia. i don't believe his conduct in this matter has come under question. >> what do you find interesting about how he explained himself there? >> one of the things interesting, he seemed to interpret the conversation the president was having with him, the president wanting to get him on side. by putting forward his version of events, trying to get mccabe

to agree with him and take that up. if you recall, at the time, that was the narrative, the narrative the president is saying privately to mccabe in this meeting is the narrative the white house pushed publicly, which was that there were celebrations at the fbi, everyone thought this was a great decision over there and they didn't like james comey. it was almost as if the president was looking for an ally here. >> interesting. >> one thing that struck me is not that mccabe comes out as a big hero, even in his own book, one of the things that struck me was how panicked people inside the fbi and justice department were at this point, how per flexed they were about what was going on with the president of the united states and how unsure they were of what to do. the portrait of rod rosenstein is quite remarkable they have quite serious discussions about wearing a wire into the oval office until the general counsel, he say, had a heart attack and said, no, that's a bridge too far. >> indeed.

>> still to come, women running much different campaigns this presidential cycle and inside the journal of a former friend. and representative anthony brown and ask him if the national emergency will impact military readiness. military reas coiving with metastatic breast cancer, which is breast cancer that has spread to other parts of her body. she's also taking prescription ibrance with an aromatase inhibitor, which is for postmenopausal women with hormone receptor-positive her2- metastatic breast cancer as the first hormonal based therapy. ibrance plus letrozole was significantly more effective at delaying disease progression versus letrozole. patients taking ibrance can develop low white blood cell counts, which may cause serious infections that can lead to death. before taking ibrance, tell your doctor if you have fever,

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president trump's border wall will come out of budgets in the department of defense. according to the white house, $2.5 billion will come from counter drug operations and another $3.6 billion will be appropriate from military construction projects. when acting defense secretary, patrick shanahan was asked about that yesterday, he said nothing was set in stone. >> very deliberately, we have not made any decisions. we've identified the steps we would take to make those decisions. >> at this point, you have not determined the -- specifically a wall is required to meet that national emergency? >> there have been know determinations by me, so that's what i will be doing tomorrow. i just want to make a point of this. we are following the law. we are using the rules. and we're not bending the rules. >> join me now, democratic

congressman, anthony brown. he is the vice chair of the house armed services committee and a veteran as well. thanks so much for being here. >> great to be here this evening. >> let's talk about this president's national emergency. clearly, there are trade-offs being made. he will use defense department money to pay for this wall. is that going to impact military readiness? >> it absolutely will. this is a pure power grab. not only is he usurping congressional authority under the constitution but contra verting the will of the american people. the secretary was right. every decision will be a tough decision. this is what i mean. i've been hearing the last two years, general officers, senior pentagon officials coming to congress and making a strong case for every single military construction project we authorize and appropriate. to go back now and say they're not important and we will take

them away and fund a wall. talking about military housing, talking about air fields, military health clinics and schools. it impacts military readiness and quality of life for military families. >> do you think there will be specific areas, place, congressional districts that will find out about this and be up in arms about it? >> absolutely. when you look at the list of military construction project, they compete with one another. do you do a childcare in maryland or a school in kentucky. military communities will be up in arms. >> senator graham said on one of the sunday morning shows said he thought they were better off at the border. >> good luck making that case to the military families in kentucky, i absolutely disagree.

if he's talking about drugs in schools, i can tell you right now drugs aren't coming across the southwest border in the numbers the administration suggests, let's have increased drug detection at our lawful points of entry and pass meaningful gun violence prevention regulations. i think you will have parents up in arms when these types of decisions are made. >> is there any action congress can take to prevent this? is the administration using something of a loophole in finding these funds or are they just blatantly disregarding your appropriations decisions? >> the first thing we do is file a disapproval? >> have you spoken to the majority leader? >> i spoke to the leadership and chairman adler and will be filing a bill and i understand representative castor will be filing a bill. there will be several resolutions of disapproval.

we will get a majority in the house and senate. it will go to 1600 pennsylvania avenue and suspect the president will veto it and we will deal with that then. there will also be lawsuits filed by property owners in texas but the house in congress will file lawsuits. there will be a slew of lawsuits filed against this action. >> do you have constitutional concerns? speaker pelosi said this week if this sets the precedent, perhaps a democratic president could -- do you see this across the board? >> across the board. it never contemplated the president declaring a national emergency because he couldn't reach an agreement with congress. we've seen national emergencies declared in the wake of 9/11, president george bush, in order to pay for access roads and power lines for marines and

barracks in afghanistan. that's what was contemplated. not a president using this authority to circumvent the appropriations process. >> i want to talk to you about the emerging presidential primary. >> i'm not running. >> really? that's news. way to make some news here. the only democrat not running. i'm kidding. what is your sense of the direction the party needs to go here? >> amy klobuchar is out running a campaign talking how she is working with republicans and playing her midwest roots and kamala harris taking a different attack. what do you think the party needs to do to beat president trump. >> i think we need a robust primary. we will see probably, maybe 20 candidates and they will range from -- >> that might be a low estimate. >> that might be low.

the field will narrow and what issues are we focusing on. countering president trump and whatever he is doing at the moment, it will be solutions for healthcare and solutions for job creation and economy that works for everyone. >> is there a risk going too far left? >> too far left in this country and too far right. americans are in the middle and want to see congress govern from the middle. i really do believe that. >> congressman anthony brown, thank you for being here. appreciate it. >> thank you. still to come, inside the life of russian operative, maria butina. we will talk to a former friend of hers who spent time with her and paul erickson before everything changed. erickson bee everything changed (burke) parking splat. and we covered it.

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maria butina is speaking out for the first time since pleading guilty to acting as an unregistered foreign agent on behalf of russia. back in december, butina admitted to being directed by a russian official to infiltrate

political circles and one of her targets was the nra. in an interview, she said her goal wasn't espionage but improve relations between the u.s. and russia noting all her efforts were carried out in plain sight. adding, if i'm a spy, i'm the worst spy you could imagine. we're getting a window into butina's time in the u.s. through the lens of a former friend. in a piece she wrote, she said she met butina in 2015 through republican operative, paul erickson who went to college with her mother and dated butina. she took a trip to disney world with her family and on two occasions the couple attended parties at his home in new jersey. in the run-up to the 2016 election, the talk turned political and paul dismissed any talk of commission and said he dismissed it as a conspiracy

theory ises. suddenly all of paul's offhand remarks about russia seemed less like guesses and more like good knowledge. more on what erickson's friends have to say. now, a former friend of maria butina, alena. thanks for being here tonight. what an odd experience to have. >> it really is, looking back. >> walk us through, how much of this, obviously, hindsight is 2020. we're looking back, she has come into the spotlight. what were the clues along the way? you referenced erickson talking about russia. what did he say about it that caught your attention? >> he would be talking about russia because maria was from russia and often talking about what her life in siberia was like and growing up in russia was like and why she formed the right to bear arms and russia was part of the conversation. when i started to realize

something was off was because i didn't know anything about them other than where we were together in the moment, when we spent five nights together at disney world, we rarely spoke about their life outside of disney world. that's not a normal thing to do with friends. normally you talk about your lives and that didn't really happen. >> they must have been able to build trust quickly or get to the point they were so friendly with your family. how did that play out? >> definitely. i have never to this day met anyone as charming as paul erickson. we met him in 2009, by the end of the day, it was like he was our best friends forever, he was so charming. when he brought maria into our lives, she was a fast friend, too. she was very charming. >> you opened the piece detailing this dinner you had with "the new yorker" writer, and he seems to look at you and say, this is very suspicious, no? >> yeah. >> walk us through that. what about her? what was she like that made him pick up on that.

>> that was a bizarre meeting. we had dinner with paul and maria and my parents. maria's deal was not clear, a student, russian woman studying at an american university. gay was very fixated on why she was a single beautiful woman and couldn't get a date. medium, i knew she was dating paul erickson. she did not know that. that was the elephant in the room. she was an interesting figure and had almost a stage presence to her. your eye was drawn to her because you didn't know what her deal was. i could tell he was trying to figure out what her deal was as did i, just knew that he knew a little more than i did. >> you write about the trip to disney world saying, quote, speaking of disney, i got back from the five night extravaganza with my family and maria and paul are dating and progressively held hands as time went on.

strange, but whatever works for u.s. spies. a source close to paul erickson said the joking was warm and u.s. spies are not one and if you are one you don't broadcast the facts. true friends won't desert her or seek publicity at her experience. what's your take on that? >> my take on that, i haven't spoken to maria since 2017 when she came to my sister's graduation party. we fell out of touch as our lives became very different. my family would joke paul was in the cia or something to do with espionage because he was so mysterious. we didn't know what he was doing. during that trip, we were joking. >> the speculation wasn't they were russian spies? >> no way. we thought they were american agents a very long time. >> where does this investigation stand overall.

how does maria butina play into the broader picture or is it reemingly random aside? >> it's actually a little bit unclear. she's cooperating. where that goes, we don't exactly know yet. then, you have the separate case of eric erickson, which is removed from that. i'm curious whether you or any members of your family have talked to any investigators about things that you saw or heard, you know, i know you mentioned in one of your pieces that your parents had been duped out of money by eric erickson. what kinds of conversations have you or members of your family had with federal investigators? >> i know there's an ongoing investigation happening now. i know my parents have been in touch with investigators. i'm not involved with that, more of "the chronicle"er of the fundusny trips. i believe my parents are speaking to or have been contacted by investigators. >> about her or him or both?

>> i believe about him. >> very interesting. we should note it's paul erickson, not eric erickson. >> sorry. >> an easy slip to make. what's your view? >> one of the interesting things about this case, she's not accused of espionage or being a spy, an agent of influence, doing russia's bidding and burnish their image and infiltrate republican party circles. in that piece you referenced and you also wrote about it, a legendary intelligence reporter, makes the case the evidence really isn't there for that and he portrays her as a simple innocent russian student trying to build relations between the two countries. i want to ask you point-blank, do believe that or do you believe in fact she was doing russia's bidding in the united states? >> let me put it this way, everything she was accused of doing were things she was always very transparent about. nothing surprised me. everything she did lined up with what she and paul told me they were always doing like wanting

to bridge the united states and russia and form good relations. i've seen the americans, that isn't what the spice, the americans do. it's so different. i don't know what she did but it isn't typical spying, i don't think. >> right. >> all right. elena, thank you very much. thank you both as always for your great reporting. when we continue, amy klobuchar taking a much different approach on the campaign trail than the rest of the pack. could it work? next. k? next -morning. -what do we got? -keep an eye on that branch. might get windy. have a good shift. fire pit. last use -- 0600. i'd stay close. morning. ♪ get ready to switch. protected by flo. should say, "protected by alan and jamie." -right? -should it? when you bundle home and auto... run, alan! ...you get more than just savings. you get 'round-the-clock protection.

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the field of 2020 candidates was all over the country this past weekend, particularly new hampshire, iowa and south carolina. amy klobuchar took a slightly different approach and tone. let's see if you can detect the theme. >> minnesota, iowa, north dakota, this came out of the midwest. i certainly see it in the grassroots politics in states like minnesota and wisconsin and iowa, right? we know how to run a caucus in our states, right? i know that i can beat donald trump because i have won in the rural counties in our state, i have won every single congressional district, including michele bachmann, three times in a row. >> klobuchar chose a state for her very first campaign event

not one of the first primaries but known for campaign history. >> i am so pleased to be in wisconsin. i would mention first the challenge that we see in both minnesota and wisconsin of that rural urban divide, right? you hear about it a lot. what i decided to do in our state and all around this country when i run this campaign is go to places maybe we didn't focus enough on in the last few years. that includes our rural areas. i got the amendment through to make sure our farmers were protected under the margin protection program. that may not be a pretty sound bite for the national news. sorry, margin protection program. >> she later made her way to nearby iowa, just a 35 minute drive from minnesota. that's where klobuchar did something our producers have seen few other candidates do this cycle. >> senator kennedy, the republican from louisiana and i, have really the only bipartisan

bill in the senate to take that on. >> if we do that alone it saves $2.9 billion in a few years. that's a bill i have with senator grassley of iowa. as we go into 2020, this is a bill that senator langford, whose name has probably never been uttered at a democratic -- >> why? all those people she talked about were republicans, which seems to be not part of many of the other candidates' approach this psych untilment susan paige, what do you make of how she fits. this cycle. >> two things. let's generate new voters and energize african-americans and women that can make a difference. the other thing is let's go back to the states that we lost narrowly that elected donald trump in the upper midwest. >> let's reform the blue wall. >> that's right.

reform the blue wall and not the medicare new deal, but demonstrating you can work with republicans. while she's doing this, i'm sure, as a political thing, she also has a record on the hill of actually working with republicans across party lines. >> there were several quoted in "politico," i don't know, i might be sinking her presidential chances by saying this about senator klobuchar. >> what's your take on which one of these roots will work? >> klobuchar made the argument shortly after the mid-terms it was the midwest that came roaring back in 2018. that was going to be the heart of the democratic party if they will win. klobuchar's problem is -- she may be right, you have to focus on wisconsin and the midwest but you have to get through the primaries first. is that her strategy for getting the nomination. it may be right. he won in those three states, michigan, wisconsin and pennsylvania. that is a much tougher sell,

that route through that. >> you're traditionally right, the primaries are dominated by liberal voters. the energy in the democratic party is on the left but all of it is on defeating donald trump. there is a huge debate about how can democrats not blow the opportunity to defeat donald trump and deny him a second term. that would be to the advantage of someone like amy klobuchar who can make the case, i am someone who has a better shot than somebody talking to you about things that is the most aspirational agenda, i have the better chance of winning in november. >> particularly if the white house argument is democrats are socialists and will take their jobs away and look what happened in new york, they turned away 25,000 jobs. you can see the white house already writing that story for&about democrats being socialists that don't care about people's jobs.

that's where she might be appealing. >> and where howard schultz says she is this centrist. who else might be? joe biden? >> governor bullock, looks like he will run. joe biden also takes a little bit of that center lane. sherrod brown is a pretty liberal guy but on some issues like healthcare he has taken a pretty centrist position. and we are sorting out how this enormous unprecedented field will find its way. >> what's your take on sherrod brown? susan brought him up. i've seen three, possibly four candidates raise the phrase, dignity of work on his posters from the beginning. >> dignity of work and heartland economics. >> he is trending more conservative and managed to hold his own as a democrat and has that appeal for him.

sherrod brown more than amy klobuchar has less name recognition around the country. she is fun. don't estimate the appeal of klobuchar on the stump, she makes people laugh. we all know that, she's witty. that can help. >> i've known her behind the scenes and she is. that's a good trump. coming up, president trump talks about saving america's image abroad since he was on the campaign trail. up next. ext.ing emot affects you physically. go for your annual check-up and be open with your doctor about anything you're feeling. physically, and emotionally. body and mind.

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i want to turn now from the view from abroad. from the outset president trump made clear one of his priorities was to restore u.s. standing abroad. >> we are a country that's in serious, serious trouble. we have incompetent politicians running our country. we have stupid people making decisions. we're the laughing stock of the world. our military is going to hell and you guys know that. >> two years into his term the president believes he's made major progress. >> we're not the suckers of the

world. we're no longer the suckers, folks. and people aren't looking at us as suckers. we're respected again as a nation. we're respected again. >> yesterday vice president mike pencen theed attended a international conference in munich germany and brought greet s from the president. >> i want to thank all of you for senator lindsay graham for leading this delegation. and to them and to all of you i bring greets from a great champion of freedom and strong national defense who's worked with these members of congress to strengthen america's military might and to strengthen the leadership of the free world i greetings from the 45th

president of the united states of america, president donald trump. >> even sent out a written copy of the speech writing "applause" after that line you saw pence deliver. all of this over uncertainty amid western alliances. sergei lavrov said we see new cracks forming and old cracks deepening. katty kay that was quite a momentum at the munich security conference. >> i've heard it several times and it is painful every time. made more so by the fact he builds the president up as this -- he doesn't just say donald trump and known applauds. he builds him up as a chancellor of freedom and still nobody applauses. and then -- causing rifts in traditional ally asks gets a standing ovation. the europeans have had two years now. they know this is happening and

i think what was initially a we'reness, how do we treat him? do we try and schmooze him. flattery? is that going to be more effective. sense of confusion but we'll try everything to carry on this with relationship it's turned into hostility and anger and a root around this issue of russia. that russia's been allowed to cause dissent and some of that permission has come from the white house. >> and quickly to set the stage for our viewers who may not be familiar. the munich security conference is an institution that historically that the u.s. has attended and held u. how do you put in the context? how should people read that moment. >> there are two big security conferences in the course of the year. one is secret and hush hush and the munich is is the big public one. been going for decades. this year a record number of americans at the conference. many of them were members of the congress who feel easy about the prosecute's foreign palace. >> including nancy pelosi. i saw a tweet with her embracing

angela merkel in contrast to the trump administration with the former chancellor --. standing vegas when said we'll be back. but even when trump leaves office we don't automatically return to the previous. >> of course. when we return what to watch for in the week ahead. huh...anybody? julie! hey...guess what day it is? ah come on, i know you can hear me. mike mike mike mike mike... what day is it mike? ha ha ha ha! leslie, guess what today is? it's hump day. whoot whoot! ronny, how happy are folks who save hundred of dollars switching to geico? i'd say happier than a camel on wednesday. hump day!!! get happy. get geico. fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more. you won't find relief here. congestion and pressure? go to the pharmacy counter for powerful claritin-d.

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and keep the public safe. pg&e wants you to plan ahead by mapping out escape routes and preparing a go kit, in case you need to get out quickly. for more information on how to be prepared and keep your family safe, visit pge.com/safety. before we say good night we have to say goodbye to one of

our dearest friends on this show. kendall brightman was one of the very first producers hired on "kasie dc" in 2017. bright and she's responsible for most of the dad jokes and beyonce gifs on that account. go kendall. more than that she's one of the creative and essential voices behind this show every week. we are going to miss kendall very much and wish her the best of luck as she moves abroad. >> because bernie sanders announce this week? maybe? >> i forgot about that. i covered bernie in 2016.

it is going to be a long campaign. >> -- difference between the white house and democrats how to handle the situation. >> i am headed up to new hampshire this week because congress is finally in recess. interested to know from you, who vu you been impressed with so far in the democrat field. >> camera harris is get huge crowds. pitching something to seems electable and governable and maybe people will like that. field is still big. -- interviewed couple times last week. still impressive. only 39. maybe the field is so big there will be a breakout candidate. >> does bernie sanders completely shake up the whole field? >> i think less so than he thinks and wishes. >> that's it for us from "kasie dc." up next msnbc's "headliners." a special hour on amazon ceo

jeff bezos. but for now good night from washington. \s \s jeff bezos is the wealthiest man on the planet. and the undisputed king of e-commerce. >> jeff is thomas edison. jeff is henry ford, only i think better. >> but for a change the headlines aren't about his public company. they are about his private life. >> stunner from the richest man of the world. >> a brilliant businessman blinds by a tabloid bomb shell. >> the tech giant says the national inquirer and its owner david peckerer trying to blackmail him. now he's