that wraps up this hour of msnbc live. i'm phillip mena. now it is time for "weekends with alex witt." >> thank you. see you tomorrow morning. good morning to all of you from right here at msnbc headquarters in new york. it is 7:00 in the east.

well co welcome to "weekends with alex witt." the questions over michael cohen claims. and what changed in the white house and if it was a face saving move. the president's visit to alabama and the decision to sign the bibles of survivosurvivors. new today, president trump is in mar-a-lago. he was scheduled to speak at a republican fund raising event. he will join other events tomorrow. before that, the president and first lady stopped in alabama where they toured the damage caused by tornadoes that killed 23 people. the president also stopping at a baptist church and signed several bibles. administration officials say they asked him to ougautograph he complied. the president sided with the former campaign chairman paul manafort before being sentenced to prison.

many believe that is a short sentence for the financial crimes. the president said this about what the federal judge in virginia told manafort. >> i feel badly for paul manafort. the judge said there was no collusion with russia. i don't discuss it. the only one discussing it is you. i haven't discussed it. >> to be clear, judge t.s. ellis did not say there was no collusion with russia, but manafort was not sentenced for crimes related to collusion. the president continued his efforts to undermine his credibility of former lawyer and fixer michael cohen. he had not asked the president for a pardon when he testified before congress. >> his lawyer said they went to my lawyers and asked for pardons. new today, 2020 democratic hopefuls are back on the

campaign trail. elizabeth warren warallied in queens and unveiled her proposal to break up the top tech companies. >> it is excellent for consumers. you are not getting something from amazon pushed out in front of you and a better competitor hidden back on page six. it also means the next good idea has a chance to moo toature. >> and bernie sanders told this to people in iowa. >> the president embarrasses us every single day. trump holds the working people of iowa and vermont in the country that he would stand with them. i know it will shock you when i tell you he lied. >> then senator kamala harris addressed how she feels about the president.

>> for the last two years, we have been watching that tv and throwing things at it. going through individual and group therapy. let's get beyond that. it will not only be about defeating this guy who is currently in the white house. it will be about fighting for the vision of who we are and can be. >> let's go to the white house. we have michael viqueira there who i hope never throws things at the tv when i'm talking to you. we did hear the president talking about michael cohen and his pardon request through his lawyers. the most stunning claim was issued on twitter. let's get to that. >> reporter: you know, nothing shocks us anymore when it comes to national politics and things happening on the ground of the white house. perhaps the president's lawyer and fixer of ten years, michael cohen, this public spat, now spilling out on to where else?

twitter. after the public testimony of michael cohen in public session and closed session before the house intelligence committee. now the acrimony coming forward. we heard the president talking about michael cohen disparage him on twitter now. the president says bad lawyer and fraudster michael cohen said under sworn testimony he never asked for a pardon. his lawyers contradicted him. he lied. additionally, he directly asked me for a pardon. i said no. he lied again. he also badly wanted to work in the white house. he lied. of course, michael cohen, in his open testimony before the house oversight committee said he did not seek a white house job and did not seek a pardon. that has been clarified by his lawyer lan any davis. wanting to talk about a pardon. after july, the beginning of july, he instructed lanny davis not to discuss it anymore.

he was not interested. that was after things went south. michael cohen, for his part, getting under the president's skin with a tweet. just another set of lies by potus. mr. president, let me remind you today is international women's day. you wmay want to use today to apologize for the dirty deeds you have done to women. you see cohen twisted the knife. he was by his side for ten years as his lawyer and fixer. bringing up those two individuals to whom the president allegedly paid hush money to through michael cohen. alex. >> we have seven directors? we have former fox news executive bill shine resign. >> reporter: bill shine. surprise coming to everyone quit on thursday night. we learned friday. going now to the president's campaign committee.

you know, behind the scenes, it is a tough job. no question about it. it is not hard to discern what is happening ever since the president came into office. the day after the inauguration when sean spicer was trotted out to tell the straight up lies of the size of the inauguration crowd. you saw that. anybody in charge of messaging at the white house would beholden to the whims of the president. he has only had two press secretaries. he will look for the seventh communications director after bill shine. he lasted longer than anybody else. somebody calculated the number of scaramuccis survived. scaramucci was only here for a week or so. it is a tough job. now there is a question of whether or not the president will bother to replace bill shine as communications director here in the west wing. >> we will wait to see. thank you, mike. joining me now is kevin cirilli

and melanie zanona. good morning to you both. let's start with the bill shine situation, kevin. are you surprised as mike was saying as everybody else? >> no. i think maybe internally there was surprise. we in the media come to expect this. the bottom line is this is jump starting the 2020 presidential campaign cycle. he will still be working in the conservative media sphere. i also think it really is just a perfect illustration as the inside of the white house starts to materialize and trend toward preparation for wrapping of the mueller investigation. >> when did the tide begin it turning, melanie, for bill shine? some reports suggested the president never developed a strong rapport with him. i saw a roll call headline that suggested that he thought sean hannity sold him a bill of goods. >> my colleagues reported same

thing in him never building a rapport with the president. it is a tough job being in charge of messaging for the president and he thinks he is his own best messenger. they never got off to a great start. there was a high expectation for trump that he would improve the relationship with the media given that bill shine came from fox news. that did not happen. my colleagues reported he was concerned that bill shine was involved in lawsuits from his time at fox news. that could have played into it as well. i think that, you know, this is very significant for the white house to have a hole in the communication shop at a very important time. we have the mueller report coming, the potential emergency vote in the senate next week. they need that strong communication presence. >> you mentioned politico. the magazine. i want to turn to the

controversy on omar. i want to play what she told politico over what she said about obama. >> his policies are bad. many came before him also had really bad policies. they just were more polished than he was. i will talk about the family separation or caging of kids and people point out this was obama. i would say something about the droning of countries around the world. >> the interpretation of her comments, kevin, are what in terms of political implications? >> i'm having a hard time understanding the points that the freshman congresswoman is trying to make the past couple weeks. other than they are anti-semitic tweets and anti-semitic remarks.

now you have a situation where the progressive democrat is criticizing previous president obama and then she is blaming the media. by the way, our colleagues did not take her out of context. she is -- that sound bite speaks for itself. look, you know, i spoken with many democrats inside of the democratic party both staffers and the principle level who are absolutely enraged at how she has been communicating her message. she is not effectively making her points. if she is trying to criticize elements of israel, that is not the tone she is striking. this is a massive problem for her politically. a massive problem for her from a policy standpoint. i'm not sure that she is effectively making the points she wants to make. there is no question that speaker pelosi had a much easier time dealing with president

trump, alex, during the partial government shutdown than she has had to do with dealing with this anti-semitic streak of comments from the freshman member. >> melanie, this affects the congress member within her role within the party. there is a headline which reads the democratic party needs omar. it went on to say her remarks were one of the boldest criticisms she levelled against president obama. how will this play out? >> she was sent to washington to challenge the democratic establishment. this is what her supporters want from her. they want her to say what no one else is willing to say. i think back to her comments regarding israel. there is room to criticize israel without being anti-semitic. to kevin's point, you can make

the points without being offensive and without stepping on her own toes which she has done time and time again. >> knowingly seem to do. sorry to interrupt. >> is this a generational divide? >> no. >> i disagree. i think there is a generational divide in terms of how they are messaging it. with omar, seeing her come out on twitter and have the twitter spats with veteran members of congress instead of keeping it in the family which is what the democratic party is used to with the leadership. keeping it in the family and behind closed doors. these younger democrats are not afraid to stand up. >> okay. that's a wrap for this time, guys. good to see you both. thank you. in a moment, why michael cohen could be facing yet another perjury charge. anot her perjury ch arge sinex. eely fh vs my congestion's gone. i can breathe again! ahhhh!

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michael cohen lied about the pardon. >> i have never asked for nor would i accept a pardon from president trump. >> stone cold lie. >> cohen's lying his you know what off all over town. one perjury after another. >> he knew all about pardons. his lawyer said they went to my lawyers and asked for pardons. >> the president and his current attorney are trying to discredit michael cohen and the claim he never wanted a pardon. the president admitted he and

the former attorney tweeted over it. directly asked me for a pardon. i said no. joining me now is legal analyst danny cevallos. danny, let's get to all of this here. there is a question of timing here and what michael cohen was referring to when he testified versus the president. can you iron this out? >> it is hard to parse out what michael cohen will say at this point. his words were clear in the testimony. i have never asked for and i would not accept a pardon. if he is talking about i never asked for up to a certain date prior to which my attorneys may have reached out to the trump team and inquired about a pardon, that still doesn't sound exactly like what he said in testimony. which again was i have never asked for and i would never accept a pardon. michael cohen has gotten in trouble for making exactly these blanket statements. far reaching statements. call them bluster or puffy, but

when you do it in front of congress, they call it perjury. >> it appears the president wants to harm the credibility of michael cohen. did the tweet do any legal damage to himself? >> did the president's tweet do damage to himself? >> yes. >> yes. possibly. he is saying that michael cohen is a liar. he is calling him a lawyer and his lawyers contradicted him and he asked me for a pardon. that implicates the president in considering a pardon. remember, that a pardon itself, the president has almost unfeetered power to grant a pardon. the pardon would be valid. there is an argument that cohen could not reject it if given. however, if it is done for an improper purpose. something akin to bribery or corruption, that may be two things that are bad for the president. number one, it could be a crime. number two, it could be an

impeachable offense. even if the under lying pardon is valid. >> i want to throw out something else. witness tampering. the president's lawyers discussed pardons for michael flynn and paul manafort. the president's use of the term pardon. is that a message or a warning to witnesses? would that be witness tampering? >> is the president's potentially dangling a pardon out for these folks to implicitly persuade them to give testimony or talk to investigators in a way that is favorable to him? it is possibly obstruction. with these obstruction cases and corruption and bribery and extortion, the challenge for the government is honing in on the improper purpose. the corrupt purpose. because these are things that can be done for proper purposes. the simple example is telling a witness. you have to testify. tell the truth, the whole truth

and nothing but the truth. the mere communication of a message to a witness cannot itself be a crime. the mere persuasion of a witness isn't a crime. it is when it is done with an improper or corrupt purpose. an example of that would be the president's own personal gain or preservation. >> let's get to paul manafort. lots of uproar of him given 47 months prison sentence. the team never asked for a sentence. there were guidelines in place for 19 to 24 years potentially. manafort has been held in prison after the prosecutors accused him of witness tampering. i heard you and other legal minds saying i don't know. we're thinking it will be less. 4 to 8 years. so you thought that. it went just shy of that in terms of under four years total. did you expect it to be that low? >> no.

i predicted anywhere from 10 to 15 years. i predicted a below guidelines sentence with his age range and other stats that the sentencing commission keeps the data and publishes it. the courts have a mandate to treat similarly situated defendants similarly. there may be a guidelines range in the stratosphere, the guidelines don't reflect the actual data. ever since the early 2000s, the sentencing guidelines are not mandatory. they are advisory. the judge calculates them, but the judge can depart from them and essentially give any sentence that the judge wants that is not absolutely insane or illegal. sometimes there is statutory minimums or maximum. there is not statutory maximum here. he gave a sentence well below, a

decade below what i predicted. >> and another sentencing this week for paul manafort as well. danny, thank you so much. the house debate over omar's remarks the w remarks. was she unfairly treated on capitol hill? one of her colleagues will join us next. one of her col leagues will join us next. if you have a garden you know, weeds are lowdown little scoundrels. don't stoop to their level. draw the line with the roundup sure shot wand. it extends with a protective shield and targets weeds more precisely. it lets you kill what's bad right down to the root while guarding the good. roundup sure shot wand. and to stop weeds before they start, also try roundup landscape weed preventer. roundup brand. trusted for over 40 years.

it appears to be a tale of two parties with the democratic caucus. hours after the anti-hate resolution vote, ilhan omar made headlines criticizing obama. we cannot be upset with trump. many of his policies are bad, but people who came before him had bad policies. they were more polished than he was. joining me to discuss the congress member representing washington, d.c. is eleanor horton. can i ask you what was your gut reaction when you heard those remarks? >> the latest from representative omar? >> the ones i stated. yes. >> i'm relieved. she looks to be an equal opportunity critic. i tell you, i think the product

of social media. when freshman, when i was a freshman and came to the congress, they said that freshman bide their time. they had to. no social media. you could only go to the floor to speak. she is used to speaking her mind. she speaks her mind from the far left against democrats as well as republicans. it was far more serious when she engaged in anti-semitism. when people hear her now, they are probably writing her off as someone who is young and inexperienced and doesn't understand how you are supposed to behave as a member of congress. in terms of her speaking her mind, that is what free speech is about. >> true. i want to pick up on one point you made in terms of a generational thing. i want to speak to what was written by "new york magazine" in response to her criticism of president obama. the magazine is asserting the

democrats like omar on not her. they have taken a great chance on self reflection. >> what? >> the democrats are not nihilis nihilists. they have taken a chance on the party and it is an opportunity for self reflection. >> if you are talking about representative omar, i'm not sure if she is making herself reflect. she is speaking her mind. her mind is at great odds where most democrats are. >> let's go to the resolution vote which passed by a margin of 407-23. the president calls that vote a disgrace and said the democrats are anti-israel party. speak to that. was there any sentense of politl loss because of the vote? >> let me correct the president. there's a reason that most jews

in the united states are democrats. democrats are not about to reject israel and that vote certainly did not indicate that. that vote was virtually unanimous. what happened within the party is that once we began to represeimand people, everybody e out of the woodwork. because we are such a diverse party, what happened was that if everybody had a beef based on prejudice, democrats saw no reason not to put it all in the same pot. especially since we had already spoken out once very strongly against anti-semitism. that is at the core of who we are as democrats. >> might there have been a way to address this?

nancy pelosi potentially burying this particular resolution? it seems to have given fodder to the president. does that concern you? >> it really doesn't because we expect that from the president. i think when the president accuses democrats of being anti-semites s accuses democrats of being anti-semites anti-semites, he has no credibility. he has said thing that are anti-semitic, but heaven knows he said things that go in the face of discrimination and against various groups beginning with charlottesville. >> let's get to the elections. ethics bill there. h.r. 1. democrats passed that along party lines on friday. kevin mccarthy called the bill a massive federal government takeover to undermine the integrity of the elections. >> does it undermine the

integrity of the elections? they should have independent committees that decide on gerrymandering? so you don't have gerrymandering by democrats or republicans? as far as i'm concerned, most important part of h.r. 1, the first time, it endorsed findings for the district of columbia from willing to admit there were other important sections of the bill. this was a pro-democracy bill. this was an expand democracy bill. the first time we looked closely at american democracy and if we are as really democratic as we think we are. h.r. 1 says you have a little distance to go. the country always had a little distance to go. this is a country that was expanded and created on slavery. we always have been expanding

democracy. that is what h.r. 1 does and all power to h.r. 1 for endorsing state hood for the district of columb columbia. >> eleanor holmes norton, good to see you. we have are a round table discussion with david gura here in studio. what's going on? >> we will have a great conversation about loyalty. this has been in the conversation the week. senator bernie sanders signing a pledge to the democratic party. you had reportedly in "the washington post" the senate vote coming up here on the president's national emergency. he is taking names. there is a piece of rick tyler. you talked to him before. gop strategist. the story about him and the role he played in the campaign in mississippi. the white house took a very keen interest in that. when they noticed rick tyler was

on the campaign, the white house called the candidate in mississippi and he was told get rick tyler off your campaign or the president will back your opponent. rick tyler did leave that campaign. we will have a conversation of the degree of the demands for locali locality. >> i guarantee you he will give you something quotable. he is always very open. david, see you shortly. thank you. it is a startling increase of migrant children separated from their parents. how it happened and what will be done about it next. the sentencing paul manafort made headlines this week, but laugh lines on the talk show late night circuit. >> you know you are in trouble when the only time you get out of jail is to go get sentenced

to more jail. >> so many of trump's people are headed to jail, it's going to feel like a high school reunion. >> i don't know if manafort has heard his lesson. his first question was does the jump suit come in ostrich? >> the good news for manafort. the sentencing is behind him. he can get right back to work on completely creeping out his cell mate. na wo bscribe to a car the way they bscrsubscribe to movies. we don't follow the naysayers. ♪ ♪ not this john smith. or this john smith. or any of the other hundreds of john smiths that are humana medicare advantage members. no, it's this john smith. who we paired with a humana team member to help address his own specific health needs.

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can you tell the american people this is not a manufactured crisis? this is a legitimate national emergency? >> this is a legitimate national emergency. this is a twin crisis. we can do better as a country. we have to have a system to protect vulnerable nations. we can protect communities. >> department of homeland security kirstjen nielsen te testifying on wednesday. last night, a federal judge ruled against the trump administration. saying all migrant families separated at the border may be included in the class action lawsuit against the federal government. this includes families separated before the zero tolerance policy came into effect. joining me now is the professor of the lbj school of public affairs. 6:30 in the morning. thank you forg getting up early with us. i appreciate that. >> good morning, alex.

>> we will start with what happened last night. that was judge dana sabraw of the southern district of california did not rule the administration needs to reunite the families. was there a stage set for a federal judge ruling on that? >> there is. also keep in mind that judge sabraw has been a key actor in the story of family separations. especially during the summer ruling this could not happen. stage is set for a hard look of family separations. not separating parents from children, but other separations that have been going on and amnesty international did a fabulous report. documented another 5,000 to 6,000 children separated out from grandparents or siblings or other family members. that doesn't get officiallily cou officially counted as family

separation. there aren't sufficient documents to establish that parent/child relationship. we are not just talking about the 2,700 children separated during the july peak of zero co tolerance. we are talking about 2,000 to 3,000 separated since trump came into office and 5,000 to 6,000 separated out because of these logistics in terms of the policy. we are talking about maybe close to 10,000 children separated from their families. >> overall, what do these rulings do for the families separated at the border? must they be reunited? do they have the class action lawsuit potential to gain something? >> let's say best-case scenario, they rule they have to be reunited. the real question, alex, where is the support coming in? monetary and logistical support

to reunite the families? the government is not providing resources. here is where organizations such as aclu and other non-profit organizations have stepped in and paid for flights for parents to come up from central america and up to the border and turn themselves in and ask for asylum and ask to be reunited with their families. we saw 27 families brought up from central america from the non-profit organizations. yes, maybe a ruling might help clear the way with the bureaucracy. in terms of physically getting parents who have been sent back to central america to reunite with their children, that is a much bigger effort and one the government really is not doing anything about. >> particularly to the point that the government doesn't keep accurate numbers on how many families have been separated and children still remaining in custody. it is mind numbing when you think about it from that

perspective. just one single family not counted. let's talk about customs and border protections. they released the numbers with 1,076 crossing the border without authorization last month in february. this is the highest number in 12 years. can the border security handle this influx? >> what an irony, alex. remember president trump campaigned on i'm going to solve the undocumented immigration problem and lower the numbers. we are seeing a record high number. this has to do with the fact that these folks are getting frustrated. they cannot seek asylum at port of entry because of the metering president trump put in place. they are so desperate and frustrated. they are trying to go at it through crossing between ports of entry which is dangerous. they are turning themselves in to border patrol. we are seeing similar numbers to

those we saw during the george w. bush administration, but we're comparing apples to oranges with the immigrants. they are an lsylum seekers. usually it is men coming to the united states to work. we are sear this paradigm. this is not easy. we have record number of immigrants coming over, but because they cannot be sent back automatically, we have record numbers detained. >> thank you, victoria. we will see you again soon. it was a solemn occasion in the tragedy, but was it appropriate for the president to sign bibles? that's next. si gn bibles? that 's next. 's next. we don't follow the naysayers. ♪ ♪

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♪ conventional wisdom says you can't make a 400 horsepower sedan, that's also environmentally conscious. we don't follow conventional wisdom. ♪ ♪ new this morning, unusual sight as the president visited alabama to survey tornado damage. the president met with survivors and praised fema during a stop at a baptist church. while he was there, he signed bibles and other items while shaking hands and posing with supporters. we see him signing a bible there.

let's bring in the former white house aide to obama. and senior adviser for moveon.org and former white house aide to president george h.w. bush. joe, give me your reaction. was there anything about that which left you uncomfortable? >> yeah. i wouldn't do that. i wouldn't be inclined to do that. i'm a pastor. even as somebody in politics, i would not be inclined to autograph somebody's holy book. i wouldn't have done that. i was uncomfortable with that. maybe the folks that got their bible signed weren't. >> true. they wanted it. i found it interesting he was signing the front of the bible. the cover of the bible. what pen does that? i guess he had a sharpie. >> right. >> you think with the books he sold, you would know you open it

up by a couple of pages. will, you worked for president obama who responded to his share of natural disasters. what was your take? >> from christians, the bible is a sacred book, and i'm of the opinion that only jesus should be signing a bible. he'd have to come back down. i just think it was disrespectful, but if people wanted it done, that's up to them. it's nice he's down there helping and signaling federal support, but it stands in stark contrast to the wildfires in california where he blamed local government and obviously in san juan and puerto rico where he attacked the mayor and was slow to respond. so he seems to be selective in where he was going to help, too, which is also a problem. if he took climate change seriously, maybe we couldlessen some of these dramatic hurricanes and wildfires. that's what i'd like to see him do. >> you'll have to come back and talk about that because that's a whole hour and then some in

itself. and california is constantly running up against him. but i want to ask you about trump supporters and the fact that they want this president to sign their bibles. what's krour tayour take on tha? it's fine they want to, but what does it say to you? >> it seems he has been put on a pedestal, which is quite bizarre. i don't think any of us has heard of a president signing a bible. so it is bizarre, and the way that he's been elevated, i mean, in the v a wa way that's clearl troubling to the signing of a bible. but i will say this, alex. look, my heart goes out to the people in alabama. they suffered and went through a devastating tornado, many of them losing everything and losing loved ones. so i do want to say that, you know, he was down there, he was comforting folks, which is what a president would do, and if that's what they wanted to do, then, you know, good for them.

but it was bizarre. i've never seen anything like that before. >> yeah. bigger picture here now, joe, i'll start with the president's visit to alabama, the timing as "the washington post" is reporting trump is losing ground on top priorities to curb illegal immigration, cut the trade deficit and blunt north korea's nuclear threat. setbacks that complicate his planned re-election message. you look at the february jobs numbers coming in significantly below expectations. how does this affect the president's message for 2020, joe? >> well, this was a bad week, a very bad week, of course that jobs report yesterday was a shock to a lot of americans. it came in way under the expected number of jobs that were to be created, expected 180,000 and we only saw 20,000, that's a big disappointment, especially for a president who talks about the economy and the strength of the economy. wages are up, which is a better

thing, but this has been a very bad week. certainly, what's happening with north korea is not good, and this just is a very bad week. it's hard for him to stay on message as a can-do president when you have these kind of things happening. >> this weekend there's been a success of bad weeks if you want to look at it all together. on the left, elizabeth warren called for a breakup of google, amazon, facebook, and here's how she's explaining that push. take a listen. >> what this is about is about competition. it's about all those little businesses and start-up businesses and entrepreneurs who want to put their products on amazon or on google and who are at an enormous competitive disadvantage. >> is this a sparked political move by creating particular targets because she's continuing to take on big money?

>> it's an attempt at what's happening in this country. wages are down. people are working for less. it's harder to make it. i don't think it's the right strategy. if you're going after these tech companies on privacy, making sure people's information is kept safe and making sure they're following the rules, that's great, but i don't think it's necessarily the right way to go about it by creating these boogeymans and fear, chwhich ar the tactics that trump used. i'll all for holding them to task. i don't think it's the right route. i think you can talk about innovation and supporting small businesses and entrepreneurs without setting up this construct of a boogeyman, and you can talk about wealth and equality without talking about boogeyman. so i don't think it's the right strategy. i understand why she's doing it, but it wouldn't be my approach. >> carinkarine, this is with jo hickenlooper, a new entrant into the race, talking on "morning

joe" yesterday. let's listen. >> would you call yourself a proud capitalist? >> oh, i don't know. you know, again, the labels, i'm not sure any of them fit. >> i'll break it down even more. do you consider yourself a capitalist? >> again, the label, you know, i'm a small business person, so that part of the system you would call capitalist, i get it. >> so do you consider yourself a capitalist and does capitalism work? >> well, i think i don't look at myself with a label. >> well, joe didn't let him go on that one, that's for sure. but did he go as in hickenlooper, did he go too far trying to sidestep the capitalist or capitalism label? are democrats really trying to buck that? >> i think, alex, that was one bizarre back and forth there. look, democrats should not be

afraid of the word capitalism. even elizabeth warren, who is one of the most progressive candidates in this race, said she is for capitalism. i think it's not the word. it's the definition of the word. it's what are you doing with the policy. what are you proposing? is it capitalism only for the wealthy? then, yeah, that's a problem. but if we're talking about having policies for everyone, whether it's raising minimum wage, where they're saying health care is a right, whether it's saying that, you know, you believe in college affordability, that is what we're talking about. and democrats should not be afraid of that. >> okay. that's a wrap this time, guys. joe, karine, will, thanks for join us. >> i how you say my name. >> it's a beautiful french name. >> that's how my mom says it. >> good to see you all. it might be a test of loyalty on capitol hill and the implications could be far reaching. that's ahead.

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