oranges of the investigation. the orange is how it started. >> they can name it however they can, peaches. we appreciate it very much, tim apple. >> it is like word salad, seriously, from the president. he's bananas. good morning, everyone. welcome to "morning joe." >> oranges. >> what? >> he's oranges. >> a lot of oranges. >> wednesday, april 3rd. joe has the morning off. along with willie and me, we have contributor mike barnicle. national affairs analyst for nbc news and msnbc, the much long awaited john helman. i'll be so nice to you. >> how long? >> the next 30 minutes. then it is over. >> i have the timer running. she he's the executive prosuitedito "the circus." also, elise jordan.

great to have you back. sorry. thank you for joining us. >> appreciate it. >> also, heidi is with us. and national political reporter for axios, jonathan swan is with us this morning. we have a lot to get to, willie. >> we do. >> including a preview of president trump's 2020 message, hitting democrats on being socialists and, of course, going after the green new deal, along with warnings of voter fraud. the president getting wrong where his father was born several times. >> wrong country even. >> what is that about? what is he even doing? is it just bananas? >> it is one of his stranger lies. he stands to gain nothing from the lie. why make up where your father was born? not in germany but here in new york city, in the bronx. >> the grandfather was born in jer germany, that right? >> right. >> you think he was thinking of the grandfather? >> multiple? >> a slip. >> we have his solution to the border crisis, just rid of immigration judges who hear

migrant cases. bernie sanders' money haul and the latest with the accusations against joe biden. president trump is commenting on them. i just -- accusations? i don't know what the word is. descriptions of uncomfortable moments that, for some reason, are coming out right now, is the way i'd look at it. first, we go to the security concern at president trump's mar-a-lago resort, after a chinese woman was found on the property saturday with a thumb drive containing malware. according to court documents, mar-a-lago security was unable to verify zhang was on the access list. due to a language barrier, mar-a-lago believed her to be the relative of a member with the same last name, and she was allowed access to the club. once inside, officials say zhang told a secret service agent she was going to the swimming pool and handed over two chinese

passports as id. after several interviews, the criminal complaint says her belongings were searched, turning up four cell phones, a lab top, an external hard drive, and a thumb drive with malicious software but no swim suit. she was then arrested and charged with making false statements and for entering a restricted area. the "miami herald" reports she was headed to an event promoted by the south florida massage parlor entrepreneur, who sold access to the president's family. >> can't make this up. >> trump was in florida at the time of the breach, golfing at a different property, trump international. he returned to mar-a-lago hours later. the first lady and other members of the trump family at mar-a-lago when the incident occurred. the secret service says the agency, quote, does not

determine who is invited or welcomed at mar-a-lago. this is the responsibility of the host entity. the mar-a-lago club's management determines which members and guests are granted access to the property. this access does not afford an individual proximity to the president or other secret service protectees. trump also raised security concerns when, in the second month of his presidency, north korea launched a missile test while the president was hosting japanese prime minister shinzo abe at mar-a-lago. the president turned thet terrae into a makeshift situation room, discussing strategy as members snapped the photos. i don't get the connection of the two stories. i will say, the first one, about the person who breached security at mar-a-lago with thumb drives and cell phones, anyone here at this table have any concern that that actually could happen?

>> yeah. >> i've been to mar-a-lago. have you? it is not that big of a space. >> think about what the security service said about that. our job is to protect the president. we have nothing to do with who comes in and out of mar-a-lago. a woman could say she's there to take a dip without her swim suit, then make up an event not taking place. >> she has no swim suit? >> no swim suit with her. >> no. >> the only reason it was stopped is because a staff member at mar-a-lago noticed the event she talked about and said, that's not being held here tonight. she alerted the secret service. we don't know what her intent was. she had malware with her. this goes to the casual nature of the trump presidency with security, whether using personal cell phonephones, email, or jar kushner using what's app to talk to the crown prince of saudi arabia. >> that's a generous description. >> it was an introduction for you to take it. >> how about haphazard or incompetent or unknowing about

the dangers of, you know, using cell phones. the pictures we just showed, about that evening that, you know, mika told us about, the night there was a missile launch from north korea. guests from who knows where, you know, snapping pictures. it is ridiculous. >> the root problem is the proximity to the president by buying access. >> right. >> by being present at mar-a-lago, through an expensive membership, you are granted this entree to the closest advisers to the president. as we've seen, the president himself sometimes dropping by weddings, dropping by events on the grounds. >> yeah. >> so it's pay to play that ultimately is so corrosive by this just flagrant disregard for security practices. >> or there are meetings at mar-a-lago, jonathan swan, we don't necessarily know about it. i mean, it just raises questions. >> well, one thing that's really important to point out is just how much business, official

business, gets done at mar-a-lago. you know, i just recall that moment when trump turned mar-a-lago into an open air situation room. i mean, he was literally sitting at the table, people were having dinner on the terrace, open air. he's got the laptop open, and they're looking at national security information. the japanese are there. i mean, this was early in the administration. these are the scenes you see play out. we've never seen this before. you have the president in close proximity with club guests. before trump bombed syria, it was at mar-a-lago. he sits around the table and asks all his advisers, wilbur ross, should i do it, you know, the last round of it. it is not like this is just a vacation home. there's actual serious business and national security business being done there. just the other point of context here, it's interesting that it is a chinese national apparently who has been apprehended. this is a head of trump doing

what we all think and were told by sources who know, likely the bilat with president xi is going to be at mar-a-lago. is this for that? it raises questions about what preparation is being done ahead of a high take stakes and impor meeting at mar-a-lago. it is stunning. >> we'll follow this. this is all we know at this point. certainly, there are more questions to be asked. president trump spoke last night at the national republican congressional committee's annual spring dinner, hitting on themes that will likely be material for 2020. take a look. >> we have to make a decision. the theme for the next campaign. so we've been here, by that time, three, three and a half years, going into the war with some socialists. it looks like the only non sort of heavy socialist is being taken care of pretty well by the

socialists. i love the idea of keeping america great. what it says is, we've made it great, and thousand we'now we'r keep it great. the socialists will destroy it. we're doing great, but they can destroy what we've done. the green new deal, done by a young bartender, 29 years old. a young bartender, wonderful young woman. the green new deal, you know. it is cray zazy, i said, that ie craziest thing. you have senators, professionals who have been there a long time, white hair, everything perfect, and they're standing behind her and shaking. they're pet rified of her. we support the green new deal. if they deal me with the green new deal, i deserve to lose. hillary wanted to put up wind, wind. if you have a windmill anywhere near your house, congratulations. your house just went down 75% in

value. they say the noise causes cancer. you tell me that one, okay? you are the minority, i hate to say. that's not going to last long, i don't think. they blame me. i say, what the hell did you have to do with it? they said, trump wasn't running. we have to watch those vote tallies. i keep hearing about the election and the various counting measures that they have. there were a lot of close elections that were -- they seemed, every single one of them, to go democrat. if it was close, they say the democrat. something is going on. hey, you have to a little bit more paranoid than you are. i was in china making a speech. president xi, who is a strong man, i call him king. he said, but i am not king. i am president. i said, no, you're president for life and, therefore, you're

king. he said, huh. huh, he liked that. >> john helman, first, good luck, as i ask you to tackle that speech last night. >> yeah. >> the president also said, someone is going to leak this whole damn speech to the media. that was televised, so it didn't have to be leaked. >> it is like green meets youngman in the twilight years. >> there's the noise causes cancer theory, which is from the depths of the inter nnet. a wild conspiracy that isn't true. let's talk about the green new deal, elevating ocasio-cortez to be the face of the party and talk about socialism, talk about the green new deal. is that an effective strategy, to get out republican voters and perhaps to turn back some of the people in the middle who may have drifted away from him after voting for him in 2016? >> there's a lot of yardage between now and the democratic race and the fall of 2020. who knows how effective it will be. it depends on what happens to

the democratic nomination. how far was the party go to the left, and how far do they embrace these ideas? no doubt, the president thinks, on every objective metric the president is facing, a daunting situation, re-election. the socialist tag is what he is seizing on. whether he is able to make it stick, whether the party plays into his hands, whether there is as much resistance to the label and the substance behind the label as the president thinks, those are all, i think, questions that are out there. no doubt, a lot of americans don't like the idea of socialism, yet embrace a lot of socialist policies, from medicare to social security, which are basically socialist policies. we'll see how it plays out. that felt to me, i'll say, i've seen the president do speeches recently that felt much more aggressive, kind of table setting campaign, here's a preview of what i'm going to do on the campaign trail. that seems more of a piece to me with some of the other sound we heard from yesterday where the president seems a little

loosey-goosey. there's a little -- i was not kidding, some of the jokes s i heard him do better versions of it. yesterday, it seemed he didn't have a great day. didn't seem he was on his game, even by his warped standards. >> he is all over the place. he makes wild claims. there is a portion of the population that really likes that. i mean, you have to -- i can't help but to look at that sort of montage of his greatest hits from last night and think, who can go up against this? when you think of 2020, he doesn't have any boundaries. >> well, that's why i do think that campaigning already against socialism and that democrats are going to turn your country into sweden but without good benefits but paying all your taxes, that's really effective with middle of the road voters and hard core trump supporters who don't want to see their economic

livelihood upturned by this idea that trump is presenting. while not factually accurate, he is great at messaging it. >> if you listen to him, as we just did, and to john's point, he seems with each appearance, intent on cementing about 30% of the electorate. he doesn't go to anyone on the fence about his incompetence. none of that. you were with me two, three years ago, you'll be with me next year, and that's all i want. i'm happy. >> one thing he's right about is democrats have fallen over themselves to fall in line with the green new deal. a plan that is set out by the young congresswoman, ocasio-cortez. cory booker and others say, yes, i support the green deal. it is a litmus test for the primary. >> it scares trump, trump supporters, and the independent leaning, you know, more economic conservatives. it is something that is a fine line that democrats have to

balance as they want to push a new agenda forward, but not caving so far to the left wing of the party that they're going to repulse voters who say, oh, the economy is doing pretty well right now. we'll stick around. >> heidi, talk about that. yes, republicans can seize on the green new deal and mock it up all they want. democrats, they'll be focused on health care and making sure it is not taken away from american citizens. i think that might be a tougher sell for republicans. >> well, trump is certainly helping them in that regard, mika, with elevating the health care issue himself, promising this plan that he will unveil after the election. i also wanted to make a point on the green new deal. here's the distinction i see the candidates making. they realize science is on their side and, therefore, they can make a distinction and say, i'm for some version of a green new deal. the green new deal that aoc put

out was a concept. it was conceptual. it wasn't an annual plan. so that's where i see the candidates drawing the distinction. if they do that successfully, i don't think that it will be a liability. to your point, yes, i think they're going to be heavily focused on health care. what the republicans are going to do, and you see it here in stark display with the president, is to try to paint everything with that socialist brush. it's probably not been noticed yet, but let me just point out, the trump campaign and republicans are seizing on these problems that biden is having, cutting attack ads against him. republicans cutting attack ads already, this early, before the man has even announced, which shows you where they view the biggest threat to them. they want to elevate candidates, specifically bernie sanders, because they think that that is their best chance to paint a contrast between what they're offering and what they say is

essentially socialism. the senator himself identifies as a democratic socialist. that is the person that they want to see on the ticket. >> there we go. >> bernie sanders' campaign announced he's raised $18 million in the first six weeks of his presidential bid. sanders' campaign says it has received almost 900,000 contributions from 525,000 individual donors, with the average donation being $20. that's down from $27 during sanders' 2016 run. meanwhile, fellow senator kamala harris raised $12 million. south bend, illinois, mayor buttigieg raised $20 million in the first quarter of 2019. the fundraiser totals are significantly smaller than the $25 million barack obama and the $26 million hillary clinton raised in the first quarter of their 2008 primary pbattle. jonathan swan, what do you think of the bernie sanders number, the total, and also the small donations, which has been his

strength? also, the fundraising of the field in general, who surprises you the most? >> goes without saying, objectively by any measure, it is stunning, if not astonishing. the numbers across the field are stunning. i mean, those numbers that you cited for buttigieg, bernie sanders, ckamala harris, it is very strong. those with joe biden are worried he'll struggle to compete in this environment where people can raise a ton on monf money o. biden will have to raise money the old fashioned way, going around the country and raising money. bernie and beto can just turn on the spigot. i want to highlight something heidi and mika were talking about, this notion that republicans are going to try to tar joe biden with the me too

movement. i would note two ironies there. obviously, the accusations against the president. also, that the president himself privately has disdain and contempt for the me too movement. he's told aides and people who visit him at the white house that it is making it impossible to hire women now. as a man, you have to be careful now. he expressed sympathy for steve wynn, the casino owner who got in trouble. trump privately has no sort of affection or respect for the me too movement. he also talks about his -- he calls it the famous mississippi speech, where he went after b blasey ford. he sees it as saving the nomination of brett kavanaugh. i'll be cure yious to see wheth trump himself is optimistic enough to go after biden on this issue, given what he actually thinks about the me too movement. >> yeah. i'm struggling right here because this is not a me too

story, is it? >> no, no, no. >> someone help me out. >> i'm not suggesting it is. i'm just saying, that's what they're appearing to do. >> this is the problem with this biden narrative that's out there. he is being painted and splashed across the headlines with me too, and sexual assault and sexual harassment being the central focus of me too, i thought. but if this is a career ender, this is someone who got a hug from biden, and he hugged someone and rubbed noses with them. i mean, joe biden is fun, nutty, and crazy, but nobody has accused him of anything sexual. sexually inappropriate or sexually harassing. nobody has. yet, here we are. we have the president of the united states jumping on it on stage. you've got politics getting involved. it just doesn't -- it doesn't feel right as news people or journalists or analysts. >> no. >> we just have to cover the story fairly.

there is no me too story here, is there? >> no. >> anyone want to say? >> no. you've got a potential candidate for the presidency of the united states, the former vice president of the united states, who has spent a career in politics doing nothing but trying to push the rights of women and the protection of women forward. >> mm-hmm. >> now, he's being threatened with a political death penalty. >> career assassination. >> for what? for being human. for being a human being. for being someone who touches people, not inappropriately. i can tell you a story about joe biden and take a couple minutes to tell. i won't waste your time, but it is who he is. in terms of helping people who are damaged, who are hurt, who are vulnerable. he knows what that's like. that's been his life. >> and i think, you know what, if you want to tell your story, lucy flores is a bernie sanders supporter. bernie sanders says they had nothing to do with this. i believe bernie sanders completely, but she is a bernie

sander supporter. she's involved in politics. she knows what this story is going to do at this time. >> sure. >> the other woman from connecticut also involved in politics. you make an announcement like that at this time, you are politically charging it. i don't think these women are stupid. i think they're smart women and know that. that's the only thing i have a problem with as we study this. i'm happy to talk about it. we should talk about it. we will talk about it further on the air today. but we need to make sure we're making clear what happened here and what he is being, i put in quote, accused of. because he is not accused of anything illegal or harmful. these smart women have said that. they're very smart. i would think they would understand the full context of these stories. we have a lot more politics to get to. now to some of the other stories we're following this morning. the senate commerce committee

says it will launch an investigation into whistleblower complaints surrounding credentials of federal aviation administration safety inspectors. commerce committee chairman roger wicker said numerous whistleblowers have alleged faa inspectors who inspected the boeing 737 max jet lacked training and valid certifications, and the faa may have been notified about the deficiencies as early as august of 2018. wicker said those inspectors' participation may have led to an inappropriate evaluation of the plane's flight control system, which is suspected to be the cause of both boeing 737 max fatal crashes in ethiopia and indonesia. the faa says it will cooperate with the committee's investigation. we'll bring in nbc's tom costello later in the show for his latest reporting. the florida man on trial for targeting president trump's

critics with mailed explosives say he didn't intend to hurt anyone. in a handwritten letter to the presiding judge, 57-year-old apologized for his actions, saying he intended to threaten but not cause harm. attempting to clarify when pleading guilty to federal charges. sayoc believed the pipe bombs targeting barack obama, hillary clinton, cnn, and others he built and mailed last october could have detonated. he said he never expected his devic devices, packed with glass, fertilizer, to work. he faces life in prison. actresses felicity huffman and lori loughlin are expected to appear in a boston courtroom today. both actresses will take part in a preliminary hearing with a dozen other parents for their alleged role in a college admissions scheme. the parents are charged with

conspiracy to commit fraud. they are not expected to enter pleas. however, a judge will set the conditions of their release. the justice department says the parents paid college admissions coach rick singer to help get their children into some of the nation's top universities with bribes, fake athletic credentials, and by rigging entrance exams. unbelievable. lori lightfoot won a resounding victory last night, becoming both the first african-american woman and openly gay person elected to be mayor of chicago. after waging a campaign focused on ending the, quote, broken democratic machine, the former federal prosecutor defeated tontoni preckwink preckwinkle, sweeping all of chicago's wards and winning with 74% of the unofficial vote. lightfoot is set to be sworn in as chicago's 56th mayor on may 20th.

still ahead on "morning joe," the chairman of the house intel committee, congressman adam schiff, joins the conversation. plus, former senior adviser to president obama, valerie jarrett, is here on set. last night, we sat down for a wide ranging conversation about politics, knowing your value, and her brand-new book. that discussion continues ahead. first, bill karins with a check of the forecast. >> good morning. a huge ocean storm is making for an ugly morning in cape cod, portland, maine. the wind chills are around 30 and it is raining. it is snowing in areas of maine. this is causing problems this afternoon, too. as the storm pulls away, the winds will pick up. wind advisories for 10 million people through the northeast. airports like new york city, boston, hartford, new albany. it won't be that cold, but it'll be very windy. the other areas of concern late tonight, some thunderstorms brewing in areas of oklahoma. could have large hail.

tomorrow, a severe weather risk for 4 million people, louisiana to arkansas and mississippi. large hail, isolated tornadoes. today's forecast, after we get rid of the storm in boston, it'll be a nice afternoon. temperatures in the 70s, almost up to 70 degrees in d.c. the midwest, we have a little rain late today in oklahoma city. tomorrow looks to be a nice day for much of the east coast, too. a new storm system with all the rain in the middle of the country. again, boston this morning, 31 degrees, raining. ugly morning. new york city, we avoided the big ocean storm. watch out this afternoon with those gusty winds. lady liberty looking fine in the harbor this morning. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. you've had quite the career. yeah, i've had some pretty prestigious jobs over the years. news producer, executive transport manager, and a beverage distribution supervisor. now i'm a director at a security software firm. wow, you've been at it a long time.

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flags about that process is speaking out. the house oversight committee voted aid long p ed along party yesterday to vote four subpoenas into the matter. one included former white house personal security director, carl klein, to testify before the panel about his role in approving appearances. klein said, in part, he wished to appear voluntarily, which the white house approved, but the committee chose not to allow that. in a contentious hearing yesterday, elijah cummings claimed klein had been obstructing the committee's request for information on the matter. >> the white house needs to understand that they cannot stonewall and stall this committee for months. then just offer us a general information about their policies. not when such -- there are such serious allegations of a risk to national security. >> now today, we're going to subpoena a guy who just

september us a lsent us a letter saying he is willing to come voluntarily. i've been here ten years. never seen anything like this. >> please. >> i haven't. >> you've done it. >> i haven't. >> this lady was scared. you hear me? she's scared. she's small in stature. she's already seen what is going on in the white house. she was scared to death. >> the woman chairman cummings is referring to there is the whistleblower who alerted congress about the at least 25 trump administration officials who received security clearances, despite opposite from her and her colleagues in the personnel office. she spoke to white house correspondent peter alexander about the humiliation she faced from carl klein in retaliation for her speaking out. >> what happened to you inside? >> the most recent suspension,

14 days unpaid. probably the worst ones is the retaliation against my disability. moving the security files out of my reach. not once, not twice, three times. moving other office equipment out of my reach. >> putting it on shelves you couldn't reach? >> yeah. definitely humiliating. >> how did that make you feel, to have that experience? >> humiliated. absolutely. it didn't stop me from doing what was right. >> why is this issue so important that you felt the need to speak out? >> the protection of national security is not a democratic issue or a republican issue, it's an american issue. we as security professionals owe it to make all our recommendations in the best interest of national security. >> it is america's national security at stake here, correct? >> absolutely. >> high leeidheidi, you were in hearing room yesterday, where we saw elijah cummings and jim

jordan going back and forth. to the larger point here, how close are they to finding more information about these 25 people that tricia newbold said got access against the advice of her office? >> the reason cummings is issuing this subpoena is because carl klein, he says, refused to come, despite several requests. when he finally did agree to come, willie, it was only after this whistleblower came forward. he set conditions, that he'd only speak generally about policy. this subpoena is an attempt to compel him to be more open and to actually speak about specific incidents. you saw the frustration behind cummings. there is a reason for that. if you listen to what he said, there are others like ms. newbold in the white house. this is something that cummings said yesterday during the hearing. he said, she's crying out. she's begging for us to do something. the way that we treat her is

something that's going to be watched by other people in the white house, other would-be whistleblowers. i thought that was notable. secondly, this has been really lost, in that this has been a bipartisan concern in the last congress, willie, on security clearances. there were letters that were written, signed on by both republicans and democrats. the difference now is that the democrats actually have the power to do something about it. they have the power to subpoena. that is a step that was not taken when republicans were in control, even though they too were concerned about clearances, going back to rob porter, the assistant who was kicked out because they found out he had domestic violence accusations against him. what we're seeing now with this reporting and with this whistleblower is that this is more akin to something that is systemic, with 25 people having been given clearances despite recommendations against it. >> you know, mika, watching that

interview with that young woman working in the white house, who clearly is afflicted with dwarfism, you have to ask yourself, who are these people? >> who are these people? >> who are they? they were th how were they raised? >> i can't believe that story. >> that's sociopathic behavior. >> unbelievable. >> this is donald trump's command climate. >> we've witnessed donald trump's cruelty throughout his presidential campaign and presidency. he is constantly demeaning to people, degrading of people, mocking a disabled reporter in the 2016 campaign. this comes from the head down. donald trump, i think, has demonstrated a kind of cruelty toward a variety of people across the spectrum. of course, the people who work for him take cues from donald trump. on the matter of substance, which story links back to what we were talking about before.

what is the commonality between this story and mar-a-lago, a reckless, wanton disregard for national security and national security protocols. the willy-nilly disregard for the professional services' decision about who should get security clearances and on what levels wreaks in the same way as, oh, let cell phones into the situation room. >> malware. >> eh, national security, the way it is supposed to be done, the protocols, the professionalism of the security apparatus that has figured out protocols to make sure the national security of the united states is maintained, the president doesn't care, nor does his administration. >> the mueller report, oh, the redactions are so important for national security. oh, yeah, tell me that, after you give anyone a clearance. >> to put it in the context of what we in the news business do for a living, we have these violations of national security, potentially dangerous violations of national security.

we have the inhumane cruelty of the white house staff putting materials on shelves for this young woman not to reach them. what are we talking about? joe biden hugging someone. we have lost our perspective. >> well, that's a lot driven by this president, who decenti tdes people and gets them used to his lies, which happens daily. coming up, george conway repeatedly questioned president trump's health, while his wife, kellyanne conway, came to the president's defense. the "new york times" writes, we're stuck inside george and kellyanne's marriage. that's just not where we want to be. that's ahead on "morning joe." everyone's got to listen to mom. when it comes to reducing the sugar in your family's diet,

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joining us now, chief national correspondent for the "new york times" magazine mark, out with a new piece, "we're all stuck inside george and

kellyanne's marriage." do i want to read this? >> you totally want to read this. >> it is a fascinating dynamic. george conway is a brilliant man. i know kellyanne is really smart. i just wonder how she does what she does. because i know she doesn't like trump. i've heard her talk about him on the campaign trail after being on "morning joe." she'll take off her mic and say, i have to wash my hands now and, you know, i've got to go throw up or whatever. she clearly made it clear that she was just doing a job. >> well, this whole thing doesn't feel right. i mean, we have these old chestnuts in washington about, hey, isn't it cool that odd couples come together, you know, democrats, republicans, putting politics aside, getting married? it happens all the time. >> then they leave the republican party. >> whatever it is. these are both republicans. like so much inside this administration, it's just, what is going on here? they're publicly feuding.

the president jumps in. this is totally normal, right? >> no. >> it's become a template for some of the larger divisions that have been sewed around this administration. >> from the beginning of this, when the first "washington post" story came out, my read on it was cynical. they are positioning themselves to be post administration on a speaking circuit, have a cable show. this is obviously made up. that was my gut about it at the time. >> me, too. >> what's your view now? >> you know what? it still could be that. i mean, look, for as much as we talk about them, for as much as people -- this continues to be a speck sceptical, it makes their reconciliation tour after this is over more lucrative. >> sure. >> are we trained to be cynical, building a brand over something quirky? >> absolutely. >> speaking as the author of

this town, there is cynicism that gets into your view. >> i love life. i love america. >> what is your read more specifically on kellyanne and how she does it, to mika's point? the president has publicly insulted her husband, and she's come out and supported the president. >> supported her man. >> over her husband. how does she do that? >> if you were to ask team george on this, they'd say, look, kellyanne joined a cult. she is all in to this cult, the personality around donald trump, where everything is subsumed by your loyalty. look, i don't go to work in the white house every day. it could be a real spell he casts over certain people. >> no. >> it might not be. either way, you're going to be judged by your public persona, how much you defend the president. you have a choice to make. even if your president comes out on the other end, that's how it'll come down, even when tv cameras are on. >> i know george conway is a

corgi fan, like i am, and i hope it's okay. it's all about the corgis. >> he is all in, all day on twitter, with very specific analysis and criticism of the president. last night, he was re-tweeted a psychiatrist, talking about the president using the term "oranges" instead of origin over and over, and almost diagnosing it. >> what was the diagnosis? >> it was not a slip or error. he said, i haven't tweeted or studied professionally the president but -- >> he is very well steeped in the dsm of all of this. >> goes deep. >> what is also interesting, some of his tweets are extremely personal about the people who stand by him, not a big jump from talking about his wife. yeah, again, they could be giggling about all of this while we talk about it. >> yeah. coming up, we now know why

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. i always talked about germany. i mean, germany, honestly, is not paying their fair share. i have great respect for angela, and i have great respect for the country. my father is german, right, was german. born in a very wonderful place in germany, so i have a great feeling for germany. >> what the -- wait, he went into in-depth detail about his father being born in a place in germany? >> it is fair to say, his father is german, heritage is german, then he went all the way with it and said he was born there. he was born in the bronx. >> confusing his father's birthplace with his grandfather's perhaps? it is something he's done several times before.

take a look. >> we ought to love the european union. i was there many, many years ago, meaning my parents were born in the european union. my father is from germany. both of my participaents are fr eu. don't forget, both of my parents were born in eu sectors, okay? i mean, my mother was scotland. my father was germany. >> you're a birther. how do you not know where your parents were born? how can you get that wrong so many times? i'm just -- it's vexing. any thoughts, anybody? >> mark, you probably have this. >> am i overblowing this slight mistake? >> i was born in germany, so i can speak to this. no, i mean, it is curious. it is not kind of a standard variety lying necessarily. what do you gain from it? >> right. >> it is strange. >> like what he said was, i mean -- he has these asides.

i'm german, my father was german. >> born in a lovely place in germany. >> something you can bring up in a conversation. it is almost as if he wants it lyrically, the phrase, to include a kind of, you know, falsehood in weird ways. i don't know. i don't quite know where it gets him or what he is trying to do. >> i don't think we've ever seen anyone on the world stage with such a five-minute window of attention span, where if he thinks in the moment saying his father was german, a blatant lie is, is going to gain him praise, he'll do it. >> heidi, what are you looking at today? >> the house judiciary committee is going to be voting on subpoenas for the mueller report and underlying documentation. that is a process that could take months to play out in court. what this really is is a shot across the bow to attorney general william barr to be more transparent. democrats are concerned they'll get a heavily redacted report. we'll see if that shows any

movement. but the presidencedent, they sa congress gets all of the information. that was the case both with the starr report and with watergate. congress then can decide what the public sees. >> jonathan swan, what are you watching? >> president trump is aggressively campaigning against his own chairman of the federal reserve, jerome powell, more aggressively than at any point. every meeting he's been in the last couple weeks, he's brought him up. late last year, we have reporting according to two people who discussed it with the president, considered firing powell and replacing him with kevin pwarsh, who was on trump' short list before he selected powell. trump is trying to publicly pressure and berate him into cutting interest rates. obviously, the federal reserve prizes its independence. it'll be interesting to see how jerome powell navigates that. >> all right. jonathan and heidi, thank you very much. mark, thank you, as well.

coming up on "morning joe," we'll talk to the chairman of the house intelligence committee, congressman adam schiff, as the president changes his tune on releasing the mueller report. remember, we haven't seen it yet. plus, the difference between me too and the allegations against joe biden. we're hearing from house speaker nancy pelosi. > and donald trump dares to weigh in. "morning joe" is back in a moment. welcome to fowler, indiana. one of the windiest places in america. and home to three bp wind farms. in the off-chance the wind ever stops blowing here... the lights can keep on shining. thanks to our natural gas. a smart partner to renewable energy. it's always ready when needed. or... not. at bp, we see possibilities everywhere. to help the world keep advancing.

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how do you really pronounce his name again? >> it's pete buttigieg. >> okay. i got it. pete buttigieg. >> no, pete buttigieg. >> i see. you're saying pete booty-sheish. >> no. pete buttigiebuttigieg. >> we got it. pete butterscotch. >> buttigieg. >> billy bob thornton. >> buttigieg. >> blue-ber-ry. >> repeat after me. butte. >> butte. >> et. >> et. >> geg. >> this has been the roots

mispronounce buttigiebuttigieg. >> i feel the pain. i'm mika brzezinski. oh, hi, mika. >> i feel you. >> i have willie geist and john helman. the host of "politics nation" and president of the national action network, reverend al sharpton. co-host of "amanpour and company" on pbs, alysia. and professor of history at rice university and contributing editor at "vanity fair," douglas brinkley is with us. author of "american moonshot." we'll get to that. >> thank you. >> reverend al, i was at an event last night, going through

the candidates. when buttigieg came up, someone made a loud, like, yeah. new york city, they knew who he was. he had an excitement. >> he does. it is, to me, very surprising. >> yeah. >> coming from south bend, which is a relatively small city, no national explosion. he's raised $7 million. he's resonating. >> he's resonating. >> the action convention, he is coming in, and we're getting as much response from our delegates wanting to hear what he has to say as anyone else. he is really resonating. a lot of it, i think, happened on this show, because the more he talks, the more it seems that his authenticity comes out. i think that people miss that people can feel you before they hear you or believe you. he is very impressive. >> it is interesting, this time right now, douglas brinkley, in history, because there's a lot of concern on the democratic

side that whoever the candidate is, needs to be someone who can beat trump. yet, people keep looking at someone like mayor pete. i wonder if because the candidate running against trump has to be tough, smart, able to do the job, but also has to be a good person. >> look, it reminds me a lot of how george mcgovern got the democratic nod in 1972. everything was anti-nixon. you couldn't be harder against nixon. >> right. >> it moved the party to look for a different kind of leader, a different candidate. right now, i don't know who could predict who is the democratic nominee. i think if biden gets in, he'll come in strong. i think bernie's people are there behind him. i'm interested in who is the third lane candidate. someone like amy klobuchar right now. senators not high in the polls, not raising a lot of money. >> so many good candidates. >> might go for someone like cory booker. he killed it. i thought he did amazing on a

town hall last week. everybody is reconsidering the full pack. >> you know, it is interesting, talking about pete buttigieg, there is a thing, is he tough enough? i'd like to see trump challenge buttigieg, who had a glide bath fr path from harvard to oxford, any path, and he chose to go serve. >> i can't believe people i knew are old enough to run for president. but people are hungry for a new candidate. there are a number of candidates in the field who can full till t fulfill the need. he is talking about a vision where we can go. if there is something other candidates can take note of, that's something. in general, they're all doing a great job of expressing not just a response to trump but a vision for where they see the country going. >> defining themselves.

>> you know, one of the important things, taking over what willie said, a tough take on trump, you know, as an old boxing fan, i learned, don't fight the other guy's fight. it is a mistake to out trump trump. what you have to do is do your own fight plan, and it'll trip trump up. i think some of the mistakes that were made by the republican opponents and the republican primaries is they tried to go tit for tat, rather than raise the level of discussion, deal with the issues and concern of people. talk over trump. what he's saying is nonsense. if you make sense, people will choose something better. clean glass is always going to be chosen over dirty glass if you give them the option. >> i think alisia is right, it is not about trump but ideas. they'll disagree with what he says, but they won't do what

marco rubio tried to do at the end of the primary, become trump, when it didn't fit who he was. >> i saw beto o'rourke. he went, boom, positivism and almost beat ted cruz. taking the upbeat angle, he has a crack on it. 2020, you have to have a woman on the ticket for the democratic party. 100 years of women's suffrage much movement. kamala harris or, you know, senator amy cloeb chaklobuchar, don't win, they'll be on the ticket. >> interesting you're not mentioning elizabeth warren. a lot of them are first out of the gate with strong policies. universal child care. harris talking about an increase in teacher pay. castro just yesterday coming out with a very robust immigration plan. all of that, i think, laying the

groundwork for a primary that is really set to talk about policy and vision for america, as much as donald trump. >> john helman? >> yes? >> oh, hello. let's move on then. let's talk about -- up thought y you wanted to jump in. the question, biden, whether he'd need a woman on the ticket, given everything he is confro confronticonfron confronting right now, which i'm struggling with as a journalist and a woman supportive of the me too movement. two women have accused joe biden of touching that made them feel uncomfortable. according to the "new york times," caruso, a former college student and sexual assault surviv survivor, accused b ed biden of resting his hand on her thigh, even as she squirmed to show discomfortable. he also hugged her too long. this reportedly happened at an

event on sexual assault at the university of nevada atl las vegas three years ago. another woman, d.j. hill, said while she and her husband stepped up to take a photo with the vice president in 2012, biden put his hand on her shoulder and started dropping it down on her back, which made her very uncomfortable. biden stands by his statement, that he has been affectionate, but never intended to act inappropriately. axios reports that people around biden believe that advisers to bernie sanders are at least partly behind the claims in an anti-biden campaign. the suggestion is strongly denied by the sanders camp. meanwhile, who of biden's potential democratic opponents and the speaker of the house were asked to weigh? >> if biden chooses to run for president of the united states, i imagine this is a conversation he will be having to have with

the american people. >> i believe them, and i respect them being able to tell their story and having the courage to do it. >> do you believe that the vice president should enter this race? >> he'll have to make that decision for himself. i wouldn't tell him what to do. >> is it disqualifying? what is your reaction to that? >> i don't think it is disqualifying. i think disqualifying is what your intention is. he has to understand in the world we're in now that people's space is important to them. what's important is how they receive it, not necessarily how you intended it. >> john helman, i'll put you in the first very uncomfortable position. how do we -- what is exactly the story here, do you think? is it a political story? is it a me too story? >> well, i think it is a

political story for sure. i think your notion earlier, that these attacks are -- these stories are coming at a certain time. their timing is not coincidental. it is also the case that joe biden has faced a rough road in his pre-candidacy, where questions have been raised about his long record on where he has been in places where the progressive base of the democratic party is no longer fully comfortable. on questions like crime policy, questions like race, on questions like broader questions about women and gender. these questions have been raised systemically over the course of the last six weeks or so, as he's been getting ready to get in or not get in. so i think what he is confronting is a political story, for sure. there is no doubt his opponents, some republican perhaps, some democratic perhaps, are driving a lot of this coverage. i have no doubt about any of that. it is also a generational and socialist story.

i think nancy pelosi is saying something important, which is that, you know, the reality is, for a younger generation of women, some of these issues related to men and their personal space, even though all these women are being very clear. they're not accusing him of sexual harassment or sexual assault. they are saying that they felt, in some way, uncomfortable, and their personal space was violated in a way that, apparently, what we're seeing is for a younger generation of women, is not okay. so i think if joe biden is going to get into this race, like all of those, his fellow democrats said in that sound we played, kamala harris said and kiersten gillibrand said, he's going to have to engage on this topic. not just put out a written statement, he'll have to have a conversation in which he addresses this stuff and puts it in some kind of con ex-ttext th makes an important part of the democratic base feel comforta e comfortable, if he is going to be successful in the party as it is today. >> you asked earlier if this was a me too story. i don't think it is. we have to recognize it is happening in the me too era.

>> right. >> that means the environment has shifted. the culture has shifted. in some ways, i think you can reposition this as an opportunity for biden to confront. the pictures are on the internet. videos are on the internet. a lot of this is stuff people knew and would say about him. he was a very touchy guy, and he was going to have to grapple with it as a part of this. i think the bigger point is that there is a larger question of whether or not his policies over time are aligned with where the democratic party is today. i think that particularly underscores his treatment of anita hill during the hearings. i think it underscores the way he has evolved on the question of choice. it may push those issues front and center in a way it would have not. >> douglas brinkley? >> i would advise joe biden to have lunch with anita hill. if he runs, i think he has to have a moment like jack kennedy did, when he had to put his catholicism out there and talk about it. or barack obama with reverend wright. maybe go to a women's group, a large conference of some kind,

and talk about his life and his marriage and how -- what women have meant to his life, women mentors in his life, and say, look, i realize what nancy pelosi said, the personal space. i've been a hands on politician for decades. >> very hands on. >> i'm not going to do it anymore. and control himself on the campaign trail. he's got to go big and apologize. >> yeah. i mean, i'm not going to do it anymore. i mean, it's not who he is. i am really torn about this. reverend al? >> i think it is a political story. whoever is out front is going to be attacked. i think that the story for joe biden is that a lot of the culture and policies have shifted. a lot of what was considered marginal or even extreme in the '90s and '80s have become mainstream in the democratic party. when he did the crime bill, many of us, including i, was marching against it. now, it is the accepted

mainstream position on incarceration. bernie sanders also voted on the crime bill. there has to be a readjustment for a lot of people. the adjustment of the culture, how we regard everyone as equals and their space. we just saw in the third largest city in this country, chicago, a black gay woman elected mayor. >> yeah. >> that was not thought of 20 years ago. i think we need to do all the reassessment, not only joe biden, of how we respect people in terms of how they see themselves. >> yeah. >> not how we see them. how they see their space. i don't think that it was harassment because the lady said that. i think it is his way of behaving. it is like church at the end of a service, ministers have to check how we behave now. people are not props. people are people and are demanding the respect of their space. i think all of us need to take a biden moment and look at that.

>> this is a direct quote from lucy flores, just for the benefit of the viewers. she's talking about her allegation against joe biden. quote, i don't believe it was a bad intention. i'm not in any way suggesting i felt sexually assaulted or sexually harassed. i felt invaded. i felt there was a violation of my personal space. that's the same allegation we saw this morning, where the woman during the photograph felt his hand went too far down his back. we have to take those seriously. can't make people feel uncomfortable, man or woman. the voters will have to decide whether that is disqualifying. do you wipe out a legacy, a career, and a guy who you think could beat donald trump, based on what we've seen so far? >> yeah, the part that worries me is sort of the side of me too that feels like it is about taking down careers. he did that? he's out. let's not investigate it. get him out. >> where do you see the takedown here? we watched two of his would-be opponents at the beginning say, yeah, i mean, he can jump in

this race. this isn't disqualifying. >> well, i think, and especially in the case of the first two, these are women who are very politically -- in fact, they go to political events, go to politics, support candidates. lucy flores supports bernie and has a picture of herself on instagram with bernie with his hand on her back. did bernie ask? look, women should be heard. i think many cases, most cases, because most women would never come forward with a story of sexual harass or harassment if they didn't believe it happened. but in this case, it wasn't sexual harassment or assault. we listen. we can question. you know, women don't have the end of the story here. they're a part of the story. >> i think you're right to question it, and no one has fought for women, to have their space and respect for than you have. >> absolutely. >> you're right to question it. i have to say, and as one who has questioned bernie sanders, i've gained a lot of respect for

him, has integrity, i don't believe bernie is behind it. >> i don't either. >> i don't believe he would allow his people to do it. i've gained a lot of respect for him the last two years. >> i think bernie sanders is an honorable man. >> i do, too. >> and would not do this. >> right. >> i think a smart woman, a politically active woman like lucy flores would understand the magnitude of her story, if she does it out there, and would understand that the narrative would immediately fall into the me too wave. all of a sudden, it'd be a flurry of attention about joe biden being creepy or sexually weird, even if she clarifies at the end that, well, it wasn't that bad. if it wasn't that bad, why say it? that's my question. i'm not attacking the victim here. she says she's not a victim. what is it? >> mika, i'd give you a homework assignment, a novel by sherwood anderson, winesburg, ohio. it was the most beloved teacher.

he'd touch the pupil's shoulder, and they drove him out of town because of the touching. this is an event going on with joe biden now. he is going to have to recognize that they're after him with pitch forks. all sorts of people in the democratic party. >> i'd offer a counter. >> to sherwood anderson? the greatest novelist in american history. >> to this question of political strategy, which is, what does lucy flores herself stand to gain from coming forward and saying this? for a person who hasments of her own, who was a state legislator in nevada. she knew there was a calculated risk, that joe biden's handiness is the top of her google search. if you look at this in the most generous light, it is saying to other women, hey, i had a situation where i felt uncomfortable. perhaps you did, too. i want to create enough space as a person who has some proximity

to power, to allow you to tell your story, too. if there are no stories, and no one felt uncomfortable, move along. if not, at a minimum, there is something that has to be answered for. >> what would the answer be? this is a man who has hugged millions. >> i think he's answered it as best you can. original statement was about the best you can do in saying, i did not recognize this. it was not my intent. now that i have recognized this, i'm going to re-evaluate my behavior moving forward. from here, i'm telling you, it takes a pivot into policy. that's what the conversation actually will become about. >> he drapes his arms around men, too, joe biden. everywhere he goes. >> that's the thing. >> i walked up now -- >> thousands of times. >> yeah. >> i don't know what the answer to that question is. there are gains. people have different interpretations as to what they can get out of a situation. i don't want to attack lucy flores, saying she was trying to get something out of this. i'm saying that she is a very

intelligent woman with a political mind, and that she is well aware how these things blow up. there definitely -- she wasn't saying this so hopefully it'd be in the back page of, you know. come on, be honest. >> i see your point. this opened up a conversation. i just am curious if this conversation would have happened regardless, and if it was -- i mean, just in the moment that we are living in, that this was going to be -- especially as other people have said, he is right now polling as the front runner in a race he's not even in. you know that in some ways, that puts you in the strongest position and the most vulnerable position. all of this stuff was going to come out. >> i think -- >> and the stuff -- sorry. go ahead. >> nancy pelosi, to a lot of democrats, has it right, is it is not disqualifying, what we know right now. we don't know if there are other stories out there. he ought to enter the race, as we expect he will, and the voters get to decide. if they think he is creepy, if

they think he is too old, if his generation has come and gone, the voters decide that. that's america. >> he has more experience. >> right. >> we'll see. back to your top point, does this mean that a woman needs to be on the ticket, i mean, not only the women running we can look at. look at a stacey abrams, who is also speaking for us this afternoon. >> wow. >> there are a lot of abled women. the time has come that we need to have a woman on the ticket. it is up to them if they want a man to run as second to them. >> stacy abrams is going to be on "morning joe" tomorrow. we're going to get back to this topic with vallerie jarret later in the show. she'll join us on the set. douglas brinkley, "american moonshot," big book for you, the

latest. john f. kennedy and the space race. >> why did kennedy put so much money going to the moon? it'd be $180 millibillion in to terms. what are the reasons? i track it back to world war ii with von brom and the nazi frontier bombing. we brought the nazis into the united states. they were in fort bliss, texas, huntsville, alabama. warner von brom builds the rocket that takes us to the moon. kennedy had -- if fdr had the dam, and eisenhower had the highway system, we had the spin-off technology of moonshot

scans. >> before we get to the meat of it, the moonshot was coined scu runs in the 1950s. that's trivia. putting this in the context of the cold war, which you do in the book, sputnik goes up in '57? >> '57. >> that's really the impetus for this. >> eisenhower says, calm down, everybody. we're doing fine. we'll have an up kreincremental approach to technology. the soviets didn't want to race them. jack kennedy says, the missile gap, we're losing the cold war. in 1960, when kennedy runs against nixon, one of the deb e debates, kennedy says, you had a kitchen cabinet debate, and you said america is the best in appliances. i'll take my tv in black and white, thank you. i want to be number one in rocket thrust. another moment with nixon, he said, if you are president, i see a soviet flag on the moon. i want the american flag on the

moon. once he becomes president, the soviets put one up. america has the bay of pigs. when shepherd goes up, we put the first astronaut in space, it was a ratings ba ratings bananz. we had kennedy's astronaut core. in the end, kennedy continued to be the great salesperson for nasa. we spent about over 4.4% of our federal budget on nasa in the '60s. now, it's, you know, 1/3 of 1%. >> it is amazing how quickly it happened, actually, in the space of time. he makes this announcement in '61. eight years later, we're on the moon. >> when he made the famous announcement to congress joint session, everybody at nasa i talked to, all the engineers, we have no technology. what mootshot? we have to start from scratch. they had to invent it at this breakneck speed, and do mercury

to gemini to apollo, all the steps to accomplish that goal. this summer will be the 50th anniversary, july 20th. i did the official world history of neil armstrong for nasa. he was a man who didn't like the media. i talked to him for over six hours before he died about his feelings about the moon and how it connects to aviators and the korean war and the like. it was a world war ii -- really, ap apollo 11 was the last world war ii event. late '50s, the microchip computer. all of that came together with john f. kennedy. the mercury astronauts, the famous mercury seven. we had six missions under kennedy, all successful. >> the book is "american moonshot," john f. kennedy and the american space race. douglas brinkley, thank you. alisia, you need to come back. i want to continue this

conversation. >> she's good. >> thank you. >> reverend al, we'll be watching the network convention this week. ahead on "morning joe," the chairman of the house intel committee is standing by. democratic adam schiff joins the conversation next on "morning joe." i believe this nation should commit itself to achieving the goal before this decade is out of landing a man on the moon and returning him safely to the earth. earth. ults with moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. with tremfya®, you can get clearer. and stay clearer. in fact, most patients who saw 90% clearer skin at 28 weeks stayed clearer through 48 weeks. tremfya® works better than humira® at providing clearer skin and more patients were symptom free with tremfya®. tremfya® may lower your ability to fight infections and may increase your risk of infections. before treatment, your doctor should check you for infections and tuberculosis. tell your doctor if you have an infection or have symptoms such as: fever, sweats, chills, muscle aches or cough.

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you know reliable support when you have it, and that dependability is what we want to give our customers. at comcast, it's my job to constantly monitor our network. prevent problems, and to help provide the most reliable service possible. my name is tanya, i work in the network operations center for comcast. we are working to make things simple, easy and awesome. jerry nadler thought the concept of giving the starr report was absolutely something you could never do. when it comes to the mueller report, which is different on our side, that would be something that he should get. it's hypocrisy, and it is a disgrace. i will say this, look, there was no collusion. there was no obstruction. they were very disappointed.

i don't know what they were thinking because they all know. i guarantee you, they go into a room, between nadler, schiff, and the group, and they laugh like hell at how they've kept this thing going for two years. they laugh like hell. we went through two years of the mueller investigation. we have -- i mean, not only that, you read the wording. it was proven. who could go through that and get wording where it was no collusion, no nothing? this thing has gone on for two years. really, it started long before that. it practically started from the time i came down the escalator. this was a whole plot. i hope they now go and take a look at the oranges, the oranges of the investigation, the beginnings of that investigation. >> what's going on there? >> well, it's his favorite fruit, i guess, oranges. he likes to refer to it.

>> this is the thing i was talking about earlier. he didn't have a great day yesterday. >> no. >> the oranges of the investigation. >> he said the oranges, then the oranges, then he got to the origins. then he got confident and tried origins again and said oranges. three out of four, oranges. >> just weird. >> tired in an existential way. >> something is on his mind. the president yesterday calling for the investigators to be investigated, and to look at the oranges. "politico" notes president trump has unmistakenly reined in his previous zeal for releasing the report publicly, which he first telegraphed last week while claiming that mueller had totally exonerated him, which the report says it is not a complete exoneration. a senior administration official told "new york" magazine that while white house staffers celebrated the probe's end, many want to, quote, put this behind us, with a fear trump has

oversold his explanation. today, the house judiciary committee is likely to authorize a subpoena to get special counsel robert mueller's full report from the justice department. democratic chairman jerry nadler may wait a few days before sending the subpoena to attorney general william barr in hopes of avoiding a court battle. joining us now, chairman of the house intelligence committee, democratic congressman adam schiff of california. congressman, thank you very much for being on this morning. good to see you. >> my pleasure. >> will the american public see the mueller report? when is that going to happen, and how will it happen? >> yes, the american people are going to see the report. they have every right to. it was their taxpayer dollars that went into bob mueller's work. he spent two years undertaking that investigation. now, it appears the president is completely changing his tune. i think he realizes that the barr summary, this four-page summary by his hand-picked attorney general is about as

good as it is going to get for him. it doesn't go through the evidence on either the conspiracy or the obstruction issues. the american people have a right to see it. indeed, i think they have a need to see it. we're going to have to fight if we have to. barr testified at his confirmation that he would be as transparent as law and policy allow. well, law and policy allow that whole report to be released. he should be going to court to seek the court permission to release grand jury material, not seeking to redact it and fight the congress from getting it. >> mr. chairman, willie geist. good to see you this morning. i think we all, at this table as journalists agree, we'd like to see the full report, as well, and be able to sift through it and see what evidence is in there and what evidence may not be in there. do you believe the attorney general, william barr, maliciously is misinterpreting the special counsel's report here? >> look, i don't think that he has misrepresented the ultimate conclusions in the report. although he is a very careful lawyer.

we won't know until we get the report just what those conclusions mean. what were the elements of proof that bob mueller couldn't find? was it an issue of whether they were conspireing with the russian government opposed to russian individuals? or was there insufficient proof of an actual implicit or tacit agreement? how does the special counsel explain those interactions between the trump campaign and the russians? perhaps most important on the obstruction charge, did mueller intend for this attorney general, who applied for the job by talking about how bogus the obstruction case was, did mueller really intend for him to be the decision maker, or did he intend that to go to the congress, as in watergate? so these questions and much more will be before us until we see. i don't think he affirmatively is trying to misrepresent. i do think that we are seeing the most positive interpretation that this hand-picked attorney general could give. >> do you accept the fundamental

conclusion in that four-page letter, that there was no collusion between the trump campaign and russians? >> i accept mueller's conclusion, and i assume barr wouldn't misrepresent this, that he could not prove beyond a reasonable doubt the crime of conspiracy s conspiracy. as i said, there is evidence of collusion and corrupt co-mingling of work between the trump campaign and the russians. i fully accept that as a prosecutor, he couldn't prove beyond a reasonable doubt that crime. as you know, because i've made this distinction on your show, i said there was ample evidence of collusion in the record. whether bob mueller could prove the crime of conspiracy beyond reasonable doubt woup ld be up him. i'd accept his conclusion, and i do. >> were you wrong, now that you've seen the summary of the special counsel's report? >> no. i think what you see in the public record is direct evidence. when the russians, through an intermediary, offered dirt on

the clinton campaign as part of what's described as the russian government effort to help the trump campaign, and donald trump's son who played a pivotal role in the campaign who says, if it is what you say it is, i'd love it, and sets up a meeting to receive it, it is direct evidence of collusion. >> why do you suspect, mr. chairman, robert mueller, after two years of investigation, couldn't reach that conclusion himself? >> we won't know until we get the report. even looking at that fact pattern, mueller could conclude that the trump campaign didn't know that this was, in fact, the russian government, even though it was portrayed as the russian government, or that the dirt they got during that meeting wasn't sufficient to prove beyond a reasonable doubt conspiracy or these other interactions with other russians, with kilimnik, believed to be linked to russian intelligence, maybe there wasn't a sufficient link that could be proven by beyond a reasonable

doubt between kilimnik and the russian government. we won't know until we see the report. there is no explaining away the eagerness of the president, that he demonstrated publicly, to have russian help, pay russians. if you're listening, hack hillary's emails. there is no doubt that the russians did hack the democratic emails. there is no doubt about how the president touted the wikileaks releases. all of this is in the public domain. whether it is criminal or not, as i said the other day in committee, it is deeply unpatriotic, unethical, and corrupt. >> congressman, what does the committee do if the report comes to you and it is so thoroughly redacted that there is really not much involved publicly? things you've been mentioning, what steps do you take? >> well, you know, then we have to go through with the subpoenas and the court fight to make sure that we get that information. i also want to point out, it is not just the report. in our committee, the

intelligence committee, our paramount interest is in the counterintelligence investigation. that's how this all began. an investigation by the fbi into whether the president or people around him were acting wittingly or unwittingly as agents of a foreign power or under foreign influence. whether they were acting because of financial incentives, like moscow trump tower. that may not even be part of this report, but that may have the most impact in terms of national security going forward. >> are you going to call bob mueller to testify? >> i think it is inevitable, bob mueller is going to have to testify before congress. i would think that he will probably be needed before more than one committee. we'll have an interest in his testimony or others on the issue of the counterintelligence findings. the judiciary committee, maybe the oversight committee, as well, might have interest in other aspects of the investigation. in the intel committee, we have a statutory requirement that the intelligence community, fbi,

brief us on any significant counter intelligence. it is hard to find anything that rises higher than this investigation. >> thank you, chairman adam schiff. coming up, boeing's 737s are still grounded, and congress is demanding answers. we have a report from tom costello. before break, an update on the pennsylvania's special election. in a bellweather district that donald trump carried by six points, the democrat has flipped the seat in the pittsburgh suburbs with a seven-point victory in a district held by republicans for most of the last 50 years. we're back in a moment. val, vern... i'm off to college and i'm not gonna be around...

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welcome back to "morning joe." beautiful picture of the united states capitol. it is 7:44 in the morning. the senate commerce committee will launch an investigation into whistleblower complaint s

surrounding the yes dcredential aircraft safety inspectors. we'll go to tom costello. >> reporter: good morning. there are faa whistleblowers who are telling congress that the very people who should have been inspecting and certifying the max for flight, that they themselves may have been uncertified improperly. we get new information about the final seconds on board the ethiopian airliner. at boeing field near seattle, 737 maxes stack up on the ramp with nowhere to go. now with the global fleet grounded, congress is demanding answers about the faa inspectors who helped certify the max. telling the acting head of the faa, congress has received information from multiple whistleblowers alleging insufficient training and improper certification of faa safety inspectors. the concern, that poorly trained

inspectors may have led to an improper evaluation of the mcas anti-stall system suspected in the fatal crashes. the faa chief and information secretary were grilled about why it took so long to ground the max. >> the faa didn't feel they had any information which would warrant the grounding. >> reporter: and the multiple investigations into how the faa certified the max. >> the faa welcomes external review of our systems, processes, and recommendations. >> reporter: meanwhile, the max fleet is lightly to remain grounded for weeks or even months. boeing was originally expected to release a software fix for its mcas system this week. it now says it'll take several more weeks. a software flaw is suspected of forcing both the ethiopian and indonesian jet liners into a fatal plunge. once boeing releases a software upgrade, the faa promises

rigorous scrutiny. it won't be enough to get the max back in the air. boeing will have to regain the trust of the faa, the world's airlines, and regulators. >> given the intense focus and interest on these two accidents, the software fix may not be enough for the faa to show the world that it is ready to put the airplanes back up in the air. >> reporter: back to the reporting from the "wall street journal," suggesting the crew of the ethiopian airliner did, in fact, turn off mcas, that'd suggest they followed the protocols laid out by boeing and the faa. the question therefore is, why did they turn that back on again? it appears they were struggling to control that flight and control the pitch and didn't understand what was happening. willie, back to you. >> clearly. tom costello, thanks so much. still ahead on "morning joe." >> mr. president, what do you think nato has accomplished? >> i think many things they've accomplished, but i think they also stand for a signal of truth and of strength. we have a great leader. >> as we mark 70 years of nato,

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the xfinity store is here. and it's simple, easy, awesome. . we've worked together in getting some of our allies to pay their fair share. it's called burden share. the united states pays for a very big share of nato, a disproportionate share. the relationship with nato has been very good. the relationship with secretary general has been outstanding. >> that's president trump yesterday against nato secretary general, who was in washington for nato o's 70th anniversary. joining us now former u.s. ambassador to nato, and former state department spokesperson, nicholas burns, a professor of diplomacy and international relations at the harvard kennedy

school of government and president and ceo of the atlantic council fred kemp. ambassador burns, i'll start with you. forgive the rudimentary question, but i think at this time in history, it's important to ask about the value of nato, what it has meant in the past, what it means today for the united states because the president often speaks about it as if it's a financial transaction from which we need to extract more and pay less. >> i think a normal president would have answered your question yesterday. this is a big moment, and we rely on our presidents to speak up for us. a normal president would have said thank you nato for 70 years of alliance. thanks for staying with us in the cold war. thanks for helping us win the cold war. thank you for 9/11 when you came to our defense and you're still in afghanistan with us, and i remember that, i was the american ambassador at nato on 9/11 when the allies came to our defense in invoking article 5. a normal president would have said thank you for helping us

defeat the islamic caliphate in syria and iraq. thank you for being with us on counter terrorism missions in africa and the middle east, but donald trump yesterday basically said you're not paying enough, and oscar wilde said the definition of a cynic is he knows the price of everything and the value of nothing. he didn't stand up and represent what the congress believes, republicans and democrat, nato is still vital. nato is in afghanistan with us and these are our best allies of the world, and the president has been so small on the global stage and so be littling of his alliance, it really is extremely disappointing when we should be celebrating this alliance this week. >> ambassador burns, you have a new op-ed out with general doug luke, and you write that nato's biggest problem is the lack of leadership from donald trump. we know that that probably just isn't going to change. donald trump has not embraced

the idea and concept of nato, and he's unlikely to suddenly come in with robust support. what can be done in the interim by policy makers who actually are concerned about protecting and preserving the nato alliance in the long-term? >> the am bobassador and i say our "washington post" op-ed that congress needs to step up. congress is stepping up. there's remarkable bipartisanship on nato. very strong support from the majority leader mitch mcconnell as well as the speaker nancy pelosi. you're going to see that today when yen stoltenberg gives his joint address by congress. i think congress invited him to make the first joint address because they understand that donald trump has been so weak on nato, so we call on congress to pass legislation that would stop the president from reducing the american military troop strength in europe as part of our nato

mission, stop the president from even trying, and i know this sounds outlandish, but the president has mused about it, taking us out of nato. congress is united and the american public is too. the chicago council shows 65% of americans favor nato. it's the president who's out of step with the american people and congress on this. >> fred, can you assess the damage, if any, of the president's inaction on nato and his inability to recognize its historic mission. >> well, nick's a dear friend and i respect him a lot on this. he and doug who wrote this piece are members of the atlantic council board but i actually disagree with him. i think the president has done nato a favor by focussing a real debate on nato, and i don't think we'd be all rallying around nato and its importance, the importance of allies of the united states had he not been president who has raised more questions about nato than any previous president raised

questions about whether we would come to the collective defense. stoltenberg is the first leader of any multi-lateral organization to speak to a joint session of congress. that wouldn't have happened if congress hadn't sprung into action. the storm of offense. this is all happening as sort of reaction to trump. trump has been an anecdote to the complacency around nato, and if you look at on the ground in europe, nato defense spending in europe is up 40% in the trump presidency. we have a new brigade there. we haven't moved a tank out since 2013. we have defensive weapons from ukraine we never could get during the obama administration. is it troubling the way trump has talked about nato and thought about nato, yes, but has it stirred a debate, and this is in answer to your question, has been positive for nato, i think it has. >> and fred, i'm sorry to do this to you, but a brief time here, but nick was talking about on september 11th, article 5 was

invoked, they were there immediately, our nato allies and now the president of the united states is saying, i don't know. >> you know, i talked to a senior member of congress yesterday and he says that -- and he talks to the president a lot. he says the president has moved on nato. you see it yesterday. he's got enough problems. and the i said, well, what if he doesn't stand by an article 5 violation, in the baltics, nothing would bring congress faster to an impeachment action. i don't think the president is going to go there. i think nato will long outlive the trump presidency. the challenge for nato is can we take it global. we have a new era of global competition and can nato adjust itself again to take on issues. >> 70th anniversary of nato is tomorrow, the atlantic council's fred kent, ambassador nicholas

burns. good to see you thank you. >> thank you so much. a security breach at the mar-a-lago's resort. how a foreign national was able to make it inside with malicious software. plus, president trump hits democrats in what could be seen as an opening act for his reelection bid. we'll have remarks to republican donors on the green new deal among other things. "morning joe" is back in two minutes. ings "morning joe" is back in two minutes. yep, this too, and this, please. even long hair and pet hair are no problem, but the one thing i won't have to clean is this because the shark's self-cleaning brush roll removes the hair wrap while i clean. ♪ - [announcer] shark, the vacuum that deep cleans now cleans itself. you might or joints.hing for your heart... but do you take something for your brain. with an ingredient originally discovered in jellyfish, prevagen has been shown in clinical trials

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at national, i'm in total control. i can just skip the counter and choose any car in the aisle i like. so i can rent fast without getting a hair out of place. heeeeey. hey! ah, control. (vo) go national. go like a pro. now go and take a look at the oranges of the investigation. the oranges how it started. >> they can name it whatever they can name it. peaches peaches. >> we appreciate it very much tim apple. >> it's like word sally from the president. he's bananas. good morning, everyone, welcome to "morning joe". >> he's oranges. >> he's got a lot of oranges. it's wednesday, april 3rd. joe has the morning off, along

with willie, and meet, we have mike barnicle, national affairs analyst for nbc news, and msnbc, the much long awaited john hammond. i'm going to be so nice to you. >> for how long. >> 30 minutes. >> and also with us contributor to "time" magazine, msnbc political analyst, and former aide to the george bush white house and state house, elise jordan, and nbc news national political reporter heidi, and national political reporter for axios, john swan is with us this morning. we have a lot to get to. president trump's 2020 message last night, hitting democrats on being socialists and of course going after the green new deal, along with warnings of voter fraud. the president getting wrong where his father was born several times. >> wrong country even. >> what's that about? what is he even doing or is it

just bananas. >> it's one of his stranger lies because he stands to gain nothing from the lie. why make up where your father was born, not in germany, but here in new york city, the bronx. >> but the grandfather was born in germany. >> but the father wasn't. >> i'm thinking manhattan, just a slight slip. maybe more than a slight slip. >> okay. also we have his solution to the border crisis, just get rid of immigration judges who hear migrant cases. bernie sanders money hall and the latest with the accusations against joe biden. president trump is commenting on them. just accusations, i don't know what word is. descriptions of uncomfortable moments that for some reason are coming out right now, is the way i would look at it. first we go to the security concern at president trump's mar-a-lago resort after a chinese woman was found on the property saturday. with a thumb drive containing malware. according to court documents,

mar-a-lago security was unable to verify that zang was on the access list due to a language barrier. mar-a-lago believed her to be the relative of a member with the same last name, and she was allowed access to the club. once inside, officials say zhang told a secret service agent she was going to the swimming pool, and handed over two chinese passports as i.d. after several interviews, the criminal complaint says her belongings were searched, turning up four cell phones a laptop, an external hard drive and a thumb drive with malicious software but no swim suit. she was then arrested and charged with making false statements and for entering a restricted area. the miami herald reports that zhang was heldaded to an event, headed by cindy yang who ran a

business selling access to the president and his family. what the heck is going on. trump was in florida at the time of the breach. golfing at a different property, trump international. he returned to mar-a-lago hours later, however the first lady, and other members of the trump family, they were there when the incident occurred. the secret service tells "the washington post" that the agency quote does not determine who was invited or welcomed at mar-a-lago. this is the responsibility of the host entity. the mar-a-lago club's management determines which members and guests are granted access to the property. this access does not afford an individual proximity to the president or other secret service protectees. trump raised security concerns in the second month of his presidency north korea launched a missile test while the

president was hosting shin as club members stood by watching and snapping the photos. i don't get the connection there of those two stories. the first one about the person who breached security at mar-a-lago with thumb drives and cell phones, anyone here at this table have many concerned that that actually could happen. i have been to mar-a-lago, have you? it's not that big of space. >> and think about what the secret service said about that. our job is to protect the president. we had nothing to do with who comes in and out of mar-a-lago. you have a woman, for example, saying there she's taking a dip without her swim suit to make up an event that's not taking place. the only reason this was stopped is because a staff member at mar-a-lago noticed the event she was talking about, and said that event is not being held here. she alerted the secret service. we don't know what her intent

was. we know she had malware with her. this goes to the casual nature of the trump presidency with security, whether it's using personal cell phones or e-mail or jared kushner using what's app to talk to his buddy, the crown prince of saudi arabia. this stuff ought to concern people. >> that was a general description. >> it was an introduction for you to take about it. >> how about half-assed or incompetent or not knowing about the dangers of using cell phones, the pictures we showed about the evening, the night there was a missile launch from north korea, and you know, guests from schenectady, who knows where, snapping pictures, it's ridiculous. >> but the root problem is the proximity to the president by buying access, by being president at mar-a-lago through an expensive membership, you are granted this entree to the closest advisers to the president, and as we've seen,

the president himself sometimes dropping by weddings, dropping by events on the grounds, and so it's pay to play that ultimately is so corrosive by this just flagrant disregard for security practices. >> or there are meetings at mar-a-lago, jonathan, swan, that we don't necessarily know about that just raises questions. >> one thing that's really important to point out is just how much official business gets done at mar-a-lago. i just recall that moment when trump turned mar-a-lago into an open air situation room. i mean, he was literally sitting at the table. people were having din r ner ate terrace. the japanese are there. this was early in the administration. these are the scenes you see play out. you have the president who had never seen this before in close proximity of club guests. before trump bombed syria, it was at mar-a-lago, he sits

around the table and asks all the advisers, should i do it the last round of it. it's not like this is just a vacation home. there's actual serious business and national security business being done there, and just the other point of context here, it's interesting that it's a chinese national apparently who's been apprehended. this is ahead of trump doing, and we all think and likely the with president xi is going to happen at mar-a-lago. it raises questions about what preparation is being done ahead of a high stakes and important meeting at mar-a-lago. it's really stunning. >> we'll follow this. this is all we know at this point. certainly there are more questions to be asked. president trump spoke last night at the national republican congressional committee's annual spring dinner, hitting on themes that will likely be material for

2020. take a look. >> we have to make a decision. the theme for the next campaign, so we have been here by that time, three, three and a half years, we're going into the war with some socialist, and it looks like the only non sort of heavy socialist is being taken care of pretty well by the socialist they got to. i love the idea of keeping america great because what it says is we have made it great and we're going to keep it great because these socialists will destroy it. we're doing great but they can destroy what we have done. the green new deal, done by a young bartender, 29 years old. a young bartender, wonderful young woman, the green new deal. you know, but it's crazy, the first time i heard it, i said that's the craziest thing. you have senators that are professionals that you guys know that have been there for a long

time, white hair, everything perfect and they are standing behind her. they're shaking, they're petrified of her. we support the green new deal. if they beat me with the green new deal, i deserve to lose. hillary wanted to put up wind. wind. if you have a windmill anywhere near your house, congratulations, your house just went down 75% in value. and they say the noise causes cancer. you tell me that one. >> good luck as i ask you to tackle that speech last night. the president also said someone's going to leak this whole damn speech to the media. that speech was televised. it didn't have to be leaked. >> it's lithere's the noise cau cancer theory which is from the depths of the internet, a wild conspiracy theory that obviously isn't true. let's talk about his approach to

2020 and the green new deal, and elevating alexandria ocasio-cortez to be the face of the party and talk about socialism and the green new deal. is that a strategy to bring out republican voters and perhaps turn out people in the middle who may have drifted away in 20 2014. >> there's a lot of yardage, the fall of 2020. who knows how effective it will be. it all depends on what happens until the democratic nomination, going to the left and how they end up embracing ideas. there's no doubt the presidential thinks in every objective. it's a daunting prospect for reelection. this one thing trying to tag the democrats asing with too extreme, and the socialist tag is something he's seizing on, and whether he's able to make it stick. whether the party plays into his hands, whether there is as much resistance to the label and the substance behind the label as the president thinks, those are

epic questions that are out there. a lot of americans don't like the idea of socialism, yet embrace policies from medicare to social security which are basically socialist policies. we'll see how it plays out. that felt to me, much more like an aggressive kind of table setting campaign here's a preview of what i do on the campaign trail. that's seen of more of a piece to me as some of the other sound yesterday, where the president seems a little loosy goosy, and there's a little after. i was not kidding. some of the jokes, i've heard him do better versions of those jokes and some of the other things seems like he didn't have a great day yesterday. he wasn't particularly on his game even by his standards. >> he's all over the place. he makes wild claims, and there's a portion of the population that really likes that. i can't help but to look at that sort of montage of his greatest hits from last night, and think

who can go up against this when you think of 2020 because he doesn't have any boundaries. >> that's why i think that campaigning already against socialism and that democrats are going to turn your country into sweden but without good benefits, but paying all of your taxes, that's really effective with middle of the road voters and hard core trump supporters who don't want to see their economic livelihood upturned by this idea that trump is presenting while not factually accurate, he's great at presenting it. if trump had his eye on 2020, so did his democratic challenges, we'll break down bernie sanders numbers and joe biden's campaign. you're watching morning joe, we'll be right back. you're watching morning joe, we'll be right back. see that's funny, i thought you traded options. i'm not really a wall street guy. what's the hesitation? eh, it just feels too complicated, you know?

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welcome back to "morning joe "vermont senator bernie sanders has announced he raised $18 million in the first six weeks. sanders campaign has received almost 900,000 con bugtribution. the average donation is $20. kamala harris has raised $12 million in south bend indiana mayor, pete buttigieg raised $7 million in the first quarter of 2019. however those fundraising totals are significantly smaller than the $25 million barack obama and the $26 million hillary clinton raised in the first quarter of their 2008 primary battle. so jonathan, what do you think of the bernie sanders number, number one, the small donations,

which has been his strength, but also the fundraising field in general, who surprises you the most. >> well, it goes without saying, objectively by any measure, it's stunning if not astonishing, but the numbers across the field are stunning. i mean, those numbers that you cited for buttigieg, kamala harris and bernie sanders are all very very strong, and where it sets up a divide, and we have talked to people close to joe biden about this is that they're quite worried that he's going to struggle to compete in this new environment where he can raise, these people can raise a ton of money online, and neigh recognize that biden is -- they recognize biden is going to have to raise money the old fashioned way. it's challenging, frankly bernie, and beto can turn on the spigot. i want to return to something that heidi and mika were talking about that this notion that

republicans are going to try to tar joe biden with many me too movement. i would note two ironies, there are the accusations against the president and also that the president himself privately has disdain and contempt for the me too movement. he has told aides and people who visit him at the white house that it's making it impossible to hire women now as a man, that, you know, you have to be careful now. he expressed great sympathy for steve wynn, his friend, the casino owner who got in trouble. so trump privately has no sort of affection or respect for the me too movement. he also talks about his, he calls it the famous mississippi speech where he went after blasey ford, and he sees that as a decisive moment in the nomination, saving the nomination of brett kavanaugh. i'll be curious to see whether trump himself is opportunistic to go after biden on this issue, given what he actually thinks about the me too movement.

>> yeah, i'm struggling right here because this is not a me too story, is it? >> no, no, i'm not suggesting it is. i'm just saying. >> i think this is the problem with this biden narrative that's out there is that he is being painted and splashed across the headlines with me too, and sexual assault and sexual harassment being the central focus of me too, i thought. but if this is a career ender, this is someone who got a hug from biden and he hugged someone and rubbed nose z wis with them. definitely joe biden is fun and nutty and crazy. nobody has accused him of anything sexual. sexually inappropriate or sexual sexually harassing. here we have, we have the president of the united states jumping on it on stage, and we've got politics getting involved. it doesn't feel right as news people, or journalists or

analysts. >> no. >> we just have to cover this story fairly. there is no me too story here, is there? anyone want to say? >> no. you've got a potential candidate for the presidency of the united states, the former vice president of the united states, who has spent a career in politics doing nothing but trying to push the rights of women, the protection of women forward, and now he's being threatened with a political death penalty. >> that's right. >> for what? >> for being a human being, for being someone who touches people. not inappropriately. i can tell you a story about joe biden and take a couple of minutes to tell. i won't waste your time. but it is who he is in terms of helping people who are damaged, who are hurt, who are vulnerable. he knows what that's like. that's been his life. >> and i think you know what, if you want to tell your story, lucy flores who is a bernie sanders supporter and bernie

sanders says that they have nothing to do with this. i believe bernie sanders completely, but she's a bernie sanders supporter and she's involved in politics, and she knows what this story is going to do at this time, and the other woman from connecticut, also involved in politics. you make an announcement like that at this time, and you are politically charging it. and i don't think these women are stupid. i think they're very smart women, and i think they know that. and that's the only thing that i have a problem with as we study this. i'm happy to talk about it. we should talk about it. we will talk about it further on the air today. but we need to make sure that we're making clear exactly what happened here, and what he's being i put in quotes, accused of. because he is not accused of anything illegal or harmful, and these smart women have said that. they're very smart. so i would think they would understand the full context of these stories. coming up on "morning joe",

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house democrats are ramping up their investigation into the white house's approval of security clearances, as the whistle blower who raised red flags about that process is speaking out. the house oversight committee voted along party lines yesterday to authorize four subpoenas into the matter. that includes one for former white house personnel security director, carl kline to testify before the panel about his role in approving clearances. in a statement klein said in part he wished to appear before the committee voluntarily which the white house approved but the committee chose not to allow that. in a contentious hearing elijah cummings claimed kline had been obstructing the request for information on the matter. >> the white house needs to

understand that they cannot stone wall and stall this committee for months. and then just offer us general information about their policies. not when there's such serious allegations to national security. >> now today we're going to subpoena a guy who just sent us a letter who said he's willing to come here voluntarily. i have been on this committee ten years, and i have never seen anything like this. >> oh, please. >> never seen anything like this. >> i haven't. >> you've done it. >> i haven't. >> this lady was scared. you hear me, she's scared. she's small in stature, and she's already seen what has gone on in the white house. she was scared to death. >> the woman chairman cummings is referring to there is tricia newbold, the whistle blower who alerted congress about the at least 25 trump administration officials who received security clearances despite opposition

from her and her colleagues in the personnel office. she spoke exclusively to nbc news white house correspondent peter alexander about the humiliation she faced from carl kline in retaliation for her speaking out. >> what happened to you inside the eob. >> the most recent suspension, 14 days unpaid, probably the worst ones is the retaliation against my disability. so moving the security files out of my reach, not once, not twice, three times, and moving other office equipment out of my reach. >> literally putting on shelves that you couldn't reach. >> yeah. yep. so it's definitely humiliating. >> how did that make you feel to have that experience? >> humiliated. absolutely. but it didn't stop me from doing what was right. >> why is this issue so important that you felt the need to speak out? >> the protection of national security is not a democratic

issue or a republican issue. it's an american issue. and we as security professionals owe it to make all of our recommendations in the best interest of national security. >> it's america's national security at stake here, correct? >> absolutely. >> heidi, you were in the house oversight hearing room yesterday where we saw elijah cummings and jim jordan going back and forth. how close are they to finding information about the 25 people, tricia newbold said were granted security clearance despite the protest of her office. >> this is why you're seeing the subpoena. if that was a confusing exchange, the reason cummings is issuing the subpoena, is carl kline says has refused to come despite several requests and when he finally did agree to come, it was only after the whistle blower came forward, and he set conditions that he would only speak generally about policy, and so this subpoena is an attempt to compel him to be more open and to actually speak

about specific incidents, and if you saw the frustration behind cummings, there's a reason for that in that if you listen to what he said, there are others like ms. newbold in the white house. this is something that cummings said yesterday during the hearing. he said, she's crying out. she's begging for us to do something. the way we treat her is something that's going to be watched by other people in the white house, other would be whistle blowers, i thought that that was notable. secondly, this has been really lost in that this has been a bipartisan concern in the last congress, willie, on security clearances. there were letters that were written that were signed on by both republicans and democrats. the difference now is the democrats actually have the power to do something about it. they have the power to subpoena. that is a step that was not taken when republicans were in control. even though they too were concerned about clearances going back to rob porter.

the assistant who was kicked out because they found out that he had domestic violence accusations against him. what we're seeing with this reporting and with this whistle blower is this is more akin to something that's systemic with 25 people having been given clearances despite recommendations against it. >> coming up, donald trump isn't the only president in the book plugging business. barack obama just gave rave reviews to valerie jarett's new book, and she joins us next onset. morning joe is back in a moment. onset. morning joe is back in a moment. we're carvana, the company who invented

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welcome back to "morning joe", it's 38 past the hour, and despite his age, former vice president joe biden is continuing to win the age and ideology debate with democratic voters. according to a morning consult politico poll out today, nearly three and four democrats said biden's decades of political

experience makes him an effective leader. and almost half of registered voters also agree. meanwhile, six in ten democrats said that biden would keep the democratic party from moving too far to the left. we should note that this poll was taken after former nevada assembly woman lucy flores accused former vice president of making her uncomfortable for unwanted behavior. joining us now, the longest serving senior adviser to president barack obama, valerie jarett. she's the author of a new book, "finding my voice", my journey to the west wing and the past forward, and we did an event last night. >> we had so much fun, didn't we? >> the audience was a huge audience. >> good questions, terrific moderator. >> of course. did a facebook live. people were asking so many questions. they loved you. they love the book, and the concept of finding your voice is something i think a lot of women

can relate to. so let's dive into that, but first, since we're talking 2020, let's get your thoughts on what's going on. first of all, joe biden is he an honorable man from her experience? your personal experience? >> very honorable man, and i think he had it just right over the weekend that said, look, we're in a new day, and we need to listen to women's voices. i worked with him for eight years, i have an enormous amount of respect. i don't know a vice president with a closer relationship with the president of the united states, and he gave wise council and you talk about his track record, that's why president obama selected him as his running mate not once but twice because he brought an incredible track record of experience and expertise to the table. >> this is a presidency that had a lot of focus on women and promoting women, and bringing them up to leveling the playing field, the white house council on women and girls created by barack obama, headed by you, and was vice president biden in any

way an impediment to women getting ahead and equality in the workplace? >> as you know, mika, he was a big proponent of women, the author of the violence against women act. he was our leader as we try to combat sexual assault on college campus, an epidemic, one in five women are assaulted on campus, and instrumental, the white house council, he was front and center. >> did you find him generally respectful of women around the house white house and in the administration. >> absolutely. >> do any of the allegations we have heard give you any pause or what would you say about the way he carries himself and conducts himself? >> look, i think he had it right is that we should all listen, and the fact that i had a great experience with him doesn't mean that other people weren't a little uncomfortable and he said we should listen to those voices and women haven't felt empowered to speak occupy. that's part of why i wrote this book. we are in a new day, and we have to be mindful and listen. >> i'll ask a question of

greater substance in some ways, not that niece athese are not s issues, something that has been raised, what anita hill went through, in the clarence thomas hearings. it would be incompeteumbent on meet with anita hill, and apologize to her, there were people who made that suggestion previously. what do you think about that notion? do you think that vice president biden does have some work to do on the historical front where his record was not -- has been challenged by some as not being who willy -- wholly in line with progressive democratic ideals. >> i don't see any harm in engaging and talking through issues and that's what we heard him say last week. we do need to listen, we need to engage, and why not. >> there's so many other candidates and biden hasn't even announce sg

announced. >> we have an embarrassment of riches. we're so lucky to have a great field. >> we didn't even get to everybody. i was doing rapid fire with her, and i thought the reaction in the audience to buttigieg, i was surprised. >> it was overwhelming, there was applause in the audience. he's terrific. he's a great leader. i had the privilege of working with him in his position as mayor. he's a great candidate. >> and other candidates? >> a lot of them up there. five women running for president, that's unprecedented. >> and let's just go in there in terms of 2020 and your book. there are women finding their voice across the board. i think it's one thing, tell me if you disagree, that has been inspired by the trump presidency. women are fed up. and they're stepping up. we saw it in the midterms, we're seeing it here. i have never seen so many women running for president, have you? >> the day after the inauguration where inauguration where we had the women's march in washington. i have been heartened seeing so many women at state, local level. look at the record number of women elected to congress.

mayor of chicago is an african-american woman. i think that bodes well for our country. >> any favorite yet? >> too soon. i think we have to see how folks do, and how they take their message, and how it resonates. >> how do you think, especially the candidates who are women, what's the -- how do we take on trump? >> i think the way everyone takes on trump, and i don't think it's gender specific is to make your case to the american people for why you have earned their trust and should lead our country. it should be an optimistic vision that unifies the country. the advantage of the democratic party, we have a big tent. we have a lot of room for everybody, and i think that's the message that will resonate. >> kwwho in the democratic fiel do you think is putting out the most interesting policy ideas? >> i'm not prepared to say that yet. it's too soon. barack obama was trailing hillary clinton by 20 points at this stage in his race in 2007, and not everyone is in the field yet, although there's obviously

a lot of folks who say let's wait and see. we haven't had even our first debate yet. >> do you think it's important, valerie, a lot of people look at joe biden or male candidates and say they have to pick a female running ticket. females say we want to be at the top of the ticket. dou do you think it's important that a woman be the nominee and the next president of the united states. >> i'm not prepared to say it has to be a woman. i want whoever wins to care about gender equity, and every candidate in the field has made that an important part of their agenda, but i would love to see a woman involved and if she's not president, i want to see the cabinet full of women, and i think that's important that you hear more voices and you make better decisions when you're surrounded by people who don't have your same experience. >> i think it's condescending to oust the question, will you put a woman on your ticket. we don't need that. we're good, we can win on our own. thanks. but thanks anyway. appreciate the lift up.

history was made in chicago last night. >> it sure was. lori lightfoot, first african-american woman, openly guy has been elected by citizens of chicago, and i wish her the very best. >> big time. we've got it talk about the book. we're going to do a whole block on it on "morning joe" much more with valerie jarett ahead. a look at events we'll be watching today. house judiciary committee is set to put forth subpoenas to gain access to robert mueller's full report. members are said to mark up a resolution on the matter with a vote to authorize the subpoenas, also expected. 13 parents accused in a college admissions scheme are scheduled to appear in federal court in boston. actresses lori loughlin and fe lis it -- felicity huffman. and celebrations of the 70th anniversary of nato continue today, both vice president pence and secretary of state mike

pompeo will deliver remarks on events honoring the alliance. we'll be watching that as well. keep it right here on "morning joe." . we'll be right back with valerie jarett. l be right back with vale jarett run with us. on a john deere x300 series mower. because seasons may change... ♪ ...but true character doesn't. ♪ wow, you've outdone yourself this time. hey, what're neighbors for? it's beautiful. nothing runs like a deere™. run with us. save $300 on x330 and x350 select series lawn tractors. at participating john deere dealers. so let's promote our spring ftravel deals, on choicehotels.com like this: (sneezes) earn one free night when you stay just twice this spring. allergies. or.. badda book. badda boom. book now at choicehotels.com.

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we're all under one roof now. congratulations. thank you. how many kids? my two. his three. along with two dogs and jake, our new parrot. that is quite the family. quite a lot of colleges to pay for though. a lot of colleges. you get any financial advice? yeah, but i'm pretty sure it's the same plan they sold me before. well your situation's totally changed now. right, right. how 'bout a plan that works for 5 kids, 2 dogs and jake over here? that would be great. that would be great. that okay with you, jake? get a portfolio that works for you now and as your needs change from td ameritrade investment management. economy possible. i think mika for helping

moderate today and proving that on your show every morning that women are really the better half. joe's not denying it. he's not denying it. >> and he still doesn't deny it. that was president obama in 2012 speaking at the white house forum on women and the economy. it was an honor to be a part of that special day. and that message resounds more than ever today. women play a critical role in driving and reshaping the economy. we're nearly half of the workforce. we're the sole our co-bread winners in more than half of american families with children and parity starts with leveling the playing field for ourselves and for the next generation. getting equal pay for equal work. yesterday on equal payday, which i think should be every day, i put forth a challenge to all women to empower another woman you believe in. a man can do this as well, empower a woman. invest in her, speak up for her.

go to knowyourvalue.com to do this and advocate for yourself and others. send me your stories. tell me via twitter and instagram and facebook at knowyourvalue.com and share it with your friends using the #knowyourvalue. more now from valerie jarrett, who was there that day. you have helped elevate women and helping them become more of driving force in this economy. but it took a long road for you to get to the west wing, which you spent eight -- count them, eight -- who has spent eight years in the white house? who served eight years? any counselor to the president? >> no. >> nobody lasted that long. but valerie did. >> loved every minute of it. what an extraordinary privilege. >> i'm looking here and am very jealous you met bill francis. >> unbelievable.

that was a cool day. >> and the dalai lama. >> several times. >> so finding your voice got you there. talk about the book and why you chose this as the focus. >> so my daughter laura, when she was 30, interviewed me. the question she put to me is what would you tell a 30-year-old valerie jarrett? turns out i had a lot to say to a 30-year-old. then i thought maybe i have something to say to a 15-year-old valerie jarrett or 35? then i thought maybe i should just tell my story. i started out a very shy, young person. didn't trust my own voice. didn't speak up for myself or anybody else and was really wallowing in mediocrity in a big law firm and unhappy marriage. i think having a child look, i want to do something that will make laura proud of me. a friend of mine said why don't youtry public service? i joined the administration as a lawyer and never looked back.

advocated for people in chicago that i loved and didn't have a seat at the table and looked out for them. and in the process, i learned to keep after myself, which you and i talked about many times. >> this is what we do. we have been talking about it since the day we met and you inspired my writing the book, and wouldn't let me leave the white house until i committed to it. >> and then you did it again and again. >> many times. but talk about meeting the obamas and hiring michelle obama. what was it like when you met her? >> michelle robinson was referred to me by susan, and went on to become our chief of staff. she sent me a resume. terrific young woman. doesn't want to be in a big law firm, interested in public service. in walks michelle robinson, tall, elegant, hair pulled back and sees her resume on my desk and never mentioned a word in it. she tells me her story,

quintessential american story we know so well. i offered her a job on the spot. didn't have the authority but did anyway. wisely she demured. in a couple of days later i was talking to her and i said what do you think? she said my fiancee doesn't think it's such a great idea. i said what's his name and why do we care what he thinks? >> she said he's barack obama and he started his career advising and he has concerns and will you have dinner with us? and off to dinner we went. the rest is history. >> you described yourself as painfully shy. >> painfully shy. >> you go from being a young girl and painfully shy to literally be the top female adviser ever for a president and having a seat at the table with numerous world leaders. >> right. >> how did you overcome that shyness? did you ever imagine yourself in such a leadership role? >> absolutely not. i think i overcame it bust by

trial and error and keeping at it. i remember the first time i gave a speech it was the commissioner and planner for chicago. nobody told me it was for the city of chicago or i wouldn't have taken it. i started writing notes on a piece of paper. i was so nervous, i was perspiring, my notes became blurred, i started blushing. >> i hate it when that happens. i was very shy. >> but you know what, i got through that speech and did it again and again and again and eventually i got over it. sometimes we shy away from getting outside of our comfort zone and i got shoved outside of it really. >> i actually urge all women to do what you've done and put yourself through that pain. it's not comfortable for us. i sweat profusely in front of crowds. that's why you have to do it. no one is going to speak for you. you have to learn and feel that burn of the lights and people looking at you. you have to get through it. it's important. >> the reps and then becomes

natural. >> yes. >> i think one of the parts of your story, valerie, people don't know is you were born in iran and lived there five years. what were the circumstances that had your family there and how did that shape you? >> my father was a physician. when he was coming out of the army, he couldn't find a job at any of the academic centers around the country, earning a salary equivalent to his white count parts. this was the mid-'50s. so me and my mhe and my mom, ad said let's look outside of the united states. and they were offered the head of neurology and off they went. we didn't know anything about the country. we had much different relations with iran back then. they didn't speak the language or i don't think they had ever been in europe. halfway around the world they went. the point my father makes is taking that risk to go outside of the comfort zone, it caught the attention of the university

labs in london and from there the chicago of chicago medical center heard about his research and recruited him. he became the first black tenured professor in the division of biological sciences. so i think the lesson there is sometimes the shortest distance want to go is the longest way around. get outside of the comfort zone. i think early in my life when i was shy, i was clinging to the safety of my plan that i made in college. my plan that fell apart. and i had a hard time admitting it fell apart. when i finally did and i listened to the quiet voice inside of me and i joined city government, it's really where i found my voice. but it's uncomfortable to hear it. >> get outside. right. >> but the adventure, really is. >> her ten-year plan did not work out. >> we only have about a minute but i want you to tell this story, i think to go back to our earlier conversation, every presidential candidate right now as they're getting ready to go can learn something from the role you played in the 2008 campaign where you were -- had an important role as a

counterbalance to a bunch of people we all love but a bunch of white guys in suits, dan pfeiffer, robert gibbs. talk about the role you played in the campaign. >> i think what was important to president obama was surround himself with a variety of different voices. i was a gateway to parts of the community that were important to his base and acted as a bridge and surrogate and fund-raiser and a person who wasn't afraid to tell him exactly what i thought. i think he had that in spades and i was honored to play a part in two historic campaigns. >> also a female voice, other than his wife who was the main female voice in that very guyish culture that was the campaign. >> remember, he was raised by a single mom, lived with his grandmother, watched her struggle. married a really incredible woman and has two daughters. i think he's used to being surrounded by strong women. >> congratulations, the book is "finding my voice" and valerie

jarrett, thank you so much. that was so fun last night. valerie, it's not over between you and me. there's more coming. valerie is joining me at the ascend summit as one of the key notes on may 10th in new york. less than 5%, of course, fortune 500 ceos are women and ascend summit will be looking at new research on how to make meaningful change. join us for an unparalleled conversations to get women in ceo seats and on boards. go to ascendcommittee.com for tickets. see you there. and stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage now. >> good morning. i'm stephanie ruhle. we have a lot to cover, starting with the house judiciary committee meeting now to vote on subpoenas related to the russia investigation, including one demanding that attorney general william barr give them a full, unredacted version of the mueller report. while chinese citizen faces federal charges aft