clerk gets to tell you who you ought to marry. hello again. speaking of things that are at stake, that do not belong to a single political party -- you know, the good news is, the condition of my soul is in the hands of god, but the iowa caucuses are up to you. >> apparently, it is not pete buttigieg's supporters taking notice of his surge. his critics, it seems, are also paying attention, as the south bend mayor rises toward the top of the democratic field. good morning. welcome to "morning joe." it is wednesday, april 17th. joe needed to be off this morning, but he will be back tomorrow with us, tomorrow morning. we have with us today msnbc contributor mike barnicle, contributor to "time" magazine and msnbc political analyst and former aide to the george w. bush white house and state

departments, alise jordan. communication strategist and political contributor, rick tyler. willie, that interaction that pete had with the hecklers, there were a few of them, it seemed like the audience made a space for it, and he brought it home. >> yeah. there was a heckler there. >> a little bit of mccain there. >> yelling about sodom and gomorrah, protesting that pete ambigui buttigieg was married to his husband. the reason he is doing well is he performs well every time he comes out. you can't come out as a mayor and reach the spot of third place without every time going on the stage, or every time he goes on tv, he performing. he'll be here tomorrow on "morning joe." >> rick tyler, i ask you about that moment. am i making too much of it? >> no. look, i think pete buttigieg, who knows who he is, he's

obviously put a lot of thought into these things. he anticipated people might say something, and he had something ready at hand. it's like great golf, right? it's how you handle these challenges that makes you a contender. he certainly is one. >> well, we're going to be talking a lot more about this. the justice department, by the way, is expected to release a redacted version of robert mueller's final report tomorrow. redacted version means a lot of it might be blacked out, that you can't read it. have you ever done a foia request, a freedom of information request? sometimes you get it back, and the whole thing is black. that'd be amusing. as we build up to the big reveal, it is important to let the viewers know, there may be nothing to see. there may be half of it to see. there may be a lot to see. president trump's lawyer, rudy giuliani, says the president's legal team is putting the

finishing touches on a rebuttal to the report. we'll talk about what we may or may not be seeing in the report this time. the buildup to the report's release might be weighing on the president though. it just might be. you see these patterns that sort of set in. or maybe it is bernie sanders. it could be bernie sanders getting under his skin. he's been tweeting a lot about monday's fox news town hall with the presidential candidate. trump tweeted around 9:00 washington time, many trump fans and signs were outside of the fox news studio last night in thethriving, thank you, president trump, bethlehem, pennsylvania, for the interview with crazy bernie sanders. big complaints about not being let in. stuffed with bernie supporters. what's with fox news? i guess -- does he produce by tweet, executive producer the show by tweet? >> yes. >> he's not happy that people who liked what bernie had to say. 11 hours earlier, trump tweeted,

so weird to watch crazy bernie on fox news. not surprisingly, brett baier and the audience was so smiley and nice. bret is so nice, by the way. now, we have donna brazile, the newest contributor, former dnc head. trump has ripped brazile for tipping hillary clinton off about a question before one of her 2016 debates with sanders. fair game. fox did not respond to trump's latest criticism, but bret baier reacted to the morning's tweet. thanks for watching, mr. president. we'd love to have you on a town hall soon or even an interview on special report. it's been a while. we cover all sides. fox, i think, is making an effort, and i think it is great, to open the doors to different points of view. we'll see if they're able to continue to do this, despite the president complaining in real time about their coverage. a lot of people look at fox as

his prone begpaganda swing. >> in the tweet, the language, now, we have donna brazile, talking about fox news. basically telling his story with the relationship and the netw k network. they're not totally celebratory of him, having bernie sanders, and he's upset. tom perez said monday the party is not reconsidering its decision to not hold a debate on fox news, but bernie sanders' monday evening town hall was the most watched event of the campaign so far, according to early data. perhaps with the high ratings on mind, president trump continued his focus on senator sanders in another tweet last night, writing this, i believe it will be crazy bernie sanders versus sleepy joe biden as the two finalists to run against maybe the best economy in the history of our country and many other great things. i look forward to facing whoever

it may be. may god rest their soul, says president trump. >> it's not right. >> at least three other democratic candidates reportedly are open to a fox town hall, including mayor pete buttigieg. his campaign strategist, liz smith, tweeting yesterday, stay tuned. i suspect that mayor buttigieg is the kind of candidate who will go to fox news. he's from indiana and can speak to the fox audience perhaps more than some of the more progressive candidates. >> i think it is great for the democratic candidates to do the fox news town halls. now, i understand the pr trepidation with doing one of the fox news debates after reporting that perhaps donald trump hood gottad gotten an ear preview of the questions. it's not fair if it is supposed to be a level playing field. >> one way to level the playing field is show up. if you have good voices going in there and expressing their points of view in an effective way, someone like mayor pete might be able to pull this off

beautifully. i think bernie sanders did great. he was believable. he was likable. he said things that the audience really wanted to hear. fox did a good job, having a diverse audience in there. that's called tv news. that's called covering campaign. giving all the candidates equal air time. so if democrats show up, i think the whole thing about fox -- i mean, it'd be smart on fox's part, but it would start to change, wouldn't it? >> i think the town halls are great. i understand the trepidation with the debate stage, when you have ten candidates and there has been credible reporting that one candidate had favoritism, like during the rnc campaign in 2016. but i think these town halls are absolutely fantastic. you can see how some of the ideas were resonating with the crowd that, would they have been obama/bernie voters and not obama/trump voters?

>> he is so far off the mark here, banning fox news. >> don't do it. >> you're running for president of the united states. isn't one of the basic ideas to reach as many americans as possible? this is one way to reach as many americans as possible. >> and to bring people together. i mean, one of the reasons why we're concerned about violence and about vitriol, rick tyler, is everyone is going to their corners, and the chief divider is the president. >> well, there's no doubt about it, mika. i mean, the president takes every opportunity to, you know, make things political. basically, he conducts himself with virtually no class. with regards to the fox news interview, i think that bernie sanders won over the crowd. i think that event was probably billed to fox news viewers, as he was going to hostile territory. it was most surprising to me,

how many people in the fox news audience, were willing to give up their private insurance and move to a medicare for all. that was surprising. that surprised me, and i think it surprised bret baier. i'll say this, when i was on the presidential campaign for ted cruz, there were a lot of people on the campaign who didn't want to do msnbc. i advocated for msnbc, one, to be honest, they gave us what i considered the most fair coverage of the three networks. you always want to reach out and look at the prbroadest audience. why cut off an audience? it doesn't make sense from a political standpoint. >> i know joe has talked about this, we love bret baier and martha, along with shep. fox has some good people. here's the moment. mike, you can jump in. the exact moment where bret turned to the audience and wanted to get their reaction on these issues, especially as it pertained to bernie sanders. take a look.

>> this audience has a lot of democrats in it. it has republicans, independents, democratic socialists, conservatives. i want to ask the audience a k question, if you can raise your hands. how many people get their insurance from work, private insurance, right now? how many get it from private insurance? okay. now, of those, how many are willing to transition to what the senator says, is government-run system? >> mike? >> well, that's a surprising display right there. to the larger point that we're talking about, fox news versus the democratic party, as odd as that sounds, if you're afraid of tucker carlson, how are you going to become president of the united states? go on to fox news. reach as many people as you can. show them that just because you have a "d" after your name, you're not ridiculously far left socialist or whatever. you speak to the common sense

needs and problems and attitudes of most americans. i can't understand the reluctance. >> i understand why some people wouldn't want to do an interview with sean hannity, who was an adviser to the president. >> it's different. >> we have evidence from bret and martha and shep smith, wallace. people will give you a fair shake. now, what was supposed to be a meet and greet for mayor buttigieg turned into a rally yesterday. more than 1 rksz,600 people cam. protesters did, as well. they stopped the mayor's speech when he mentioned his right to marry his husband. >> as somebody enjoying the first year of married life, i would say freedom is what is at stake, in the idea of a county clerk telling you who you can marry. >> remember sodom and gomorrah.

>> speaking of thing s -- hello again. speaking of things that are at stake, that do not belong to a single political party. >> pete, pete, pete, pete. >> you know, the good news is, the condition of my soul is in the hands of god, but the iowa caucuses are up to you. our marriage twists by the grace of a single vote on the u.s. supreme court. on this tenth anniversary of iowa breaking some ground in that regard, i would like to say, thank you. >> remember sodom and ga romogo >> we got it. promise you, we got it. remember the beauty of our democracy. everyone here gets the exact same voice and vote. >> okay. >> we watched a lot of political candidates. what do you make of his political performance? >> it's pretty good. he really does seem to have some of the "it" you need if you're going to propel forward. he stayed on his feet. clearly, it's something that he

was answering from the heart and has thought about. i didn't know -- i was educated this week through his interview with rachel maddow about his journey with coming out. i didn't realize he was closeted when he was serving in afghanistan, then came out after he got home, saying life is too short. it was a moving interview. you see how comfortable he is there with him. he seems like a person comfortable with himself. >> that is exactly it. he is thoroughly comfortable with himself. he is thoroughly human and approachable. when he was on with us about a month ago, i asked him off air, i said, what did you fear most, going to afghanistan or telling your parents that you were gay? he paused for a second and he said, wow, he said, you know, i was trembling, i was sweating. he said, i was so fearful. then he paused and said, but my parents were great.

one of those moments, you say, wow, this guy's got it. >> also, what he did right there in front of 1,000 people, he exposed hate with love. he did it beautifully. pastorally. he did it in a way that made you want to be there with him. i'm going to tell you, as much as the republicans completely misunderstood barack obama, and had no idea how to handle an african-american democratic nominee, they will not be able to handle this guy. because he is truly working from a good center and has the words and education and the articulation and the grounding to express it to people who even don't understand him. it's called depth. it's called moral compass. it's called faith. it's called love for america. he is going to be very hard to handle, if they try to take him on for something he is absolutely not embarrassed about.

in fact, he embraces who he is, and he embraces his god. this is the bottom line, the fact that that protester and republicans might have been watching, thinking, this is the moment he goes down, because everyone will expose his -- no. it's not going to happen. for an interesting exercise, let's compare addressing hate with love, mayor pete's reaction to protesters, to donald trump and how he conducted himself on the campaign trail with protesters in 2016. >> boy, if you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of them, would you? seriously. i will pay for the legal fees, i promise. go home to mommy. bye. you know, we do all have a first amendment right, and they really violate our first amendment right. what are you going to do, right? we're not allowed to punch back anymore. i love the old days. you know what they used to do to guys like that when they were at a place like this?

they'd be carried out on a stretcher, folks. like to punch him in the face. i'll tell ya. i mentioned food stamps. that guy who is seriously overweight went crazy. he went crazy. go home to mommy. go home. bye. go home to mommy. go home to mommy. tell her to tuck you in bed. nasty little -- i'll tell you, nasty people. try not to hurt him. if you do, i'll defend you in court. don't worry about it. >> it's a comedy show with the press until someone gets hurt. rick tyler, final thought on this. you know, i don't want to overstate the mayor pete moment, but it does sort of remind me of john mccain. on the campaign trail, he was confronted by someone calling barack obama a muslim, and he just said, no. there are ways to confront hate, and trump has one, and this young candidate has another.

>> yeah, absolutely, mika. and i don't really know what the purpose is. i mean, if you're going to -- if we want to start going down this road, i mean, we can look at the envy, green, lust, sloth, pride, you know. the president, i think he's mastered all of them. if he is trying to get the evangelicals to peel away, they ought to look at donald trump very closely. >> you know what, mika, too, the chant we heard, about sodom and gomorrah, is like a chant from a different time. >> right. >> yeah. >> by that, i mean, we had an nbc/"wall street journal" poll a couple weeks ago that shows fully 70%, 7-0, of all americans, not just democrats, not just progressives, but all americans are comfortable with a gay presidential candidate and, therefore, a gay president. you can chant it to a small sliver of the electorate, but it is falling on deaf ears in 2019 to many americans. >> he has so many other things to say about what he'd do, that this is not what he's running on. >> it is not a story. it is a side note to who he is.

>> i want to point out, then you can take it up, what the person said to mccain in that moment was not that he was a muslim, but he said it as if it was disparaging. mccain wouldn't have it. it was beautiful. >> it makes me -- that moment makes me proud of our country because you do realize how far we've come. just from the early 2000s until now, when it comes to equal rights for all americans. i think that the fact that we have a strong contender for the democratic candidacy for president who is openly gay and proud of it, and wants everyone to accept it as it is a non-issue, as it should be, it should not be an issue, and is so easily deflecting that kind of hate, it is just an impressive moment, i think, for our country. all right. we have a lot to get to. still ahead on "morning joe," house speaker nancy pelosi is again threading the needle between democrats in washington hyperfocused on the presidential

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by awesome experts store. it's a now there's one store that connects your life like never before store. the xfinity store is here. and it's simple, easy, awesome. if you go throughout the country, as i do all the time, people are concerned about their kitchen table issues. are they going to be able to pay the bills? 50% of the american people could not withstand a 50% surprise, broken car, broken water heater or whatever it is. that's what people are concerned about. i have not been one of these focusers on impeachment and the rest of that. let the chips fall where they may when we have the evidence and the facts. we'll see what comes forth. we'll see how much attorney general decided it was at his

discretion to redact. now, i'm an intelligence person. that's one of the places i was forged in the congress. i respect protecting sources and meth methods. i don't support hiding the truths from the american people. >> house speaker nancy pelosi keeping an eye on the release of the mueller report, while also suggesting that democrats have a lot more on their plate than simply focusing on the special counsel. of course, willie, we're waiting to see what is going to be in the mueller report. i think at some point, either a committee or the american people need to see the entire report at this point. i'm absolutely concerned that the big buildup to the reveal of the mueller report will be used by those who perhaps want to protect the president and whatever is in there, to sort of make it look like a wah-wah. i'm bracing people to understand that this may be very redacted. we may see nothing. we're waiting to see if we're going to see something. >> and the president has already

declared wah-wah when barr's report came out, saying he believed there is no collusion. >> that was untruthfully. the end of barr's letter quoted the report as saying, on the basis of obstruction, it was not an exoneration. that lie, which he was able to brand on the big buildup. everybody, don't get into an uproar. let wait and see how redacted this is. it may be a moment we have to wait longer for real information. >> i think speaker pelosi suggested there are two constituencies. there is the public and there is congress. congress can handle classified material, and it does all the time. they should see the full report. the concern, i understand, from the special counsel and the attorney general is it will be leaked out by members of congress. that's probably true. maybe the public doesn't need to see classified information. in fact, it doesn't, of course. there is a redacted report for public, but the intelligence should see the report. >> the whole thing.

>> here's what i'm wondering about the report, if we are to believe -- we've been told by the white house and the special prosecutor's office, that the white house has not been privy to the report. they have not seen the report. how is it that they have prepared, according to giuliani, a rebuttal? how do you prepare a rebuttal to a report that you have not yet read? >> you can't. honestly, whether it is donald trump's tax returns, sarah sanders is saying, you know, the congress isn't smart enough, there are more people, someone should let her know, in congress than devin nunez. we're good. somebody with smarts on the committees will be able to see what's going on, actually caring about the american people and not protecting the president. >> we just have to let that process play out. i, like you, think the expectations game has gotten completely out of control here. >> it is used by the president. >> it is used completely to his advantage. that is why i found nancy pelosi's tack in that interview

to be interesting. she's been politically savvy. i've been a harsh critic in the past of some of the speaker's actions, but she has been masterful over the past year. she's really trying to lead her party in the smartest direction politically approaching 2020, by saying, let's focus on kitchen table issues. let's not overhype. >> there's a lot of things, like health care. >> the back and forth used to be subtle, but now it is out in public between speaker pelosi and congresswoman ocasio-cortez. >> when we won this election, it wasn't in districts like mine or alexandria's, however, she is a wonderful member of congress. i think all of our members will attest. those are districts that are solidly democratic. this glass of water would win with a "d" next to its name. the 43 districts, we won 43 in the gain of 40, were right down the middle.

mainstre mainstream, hold the center victo victories. if we're helping the one in five children that go to sleep hungry tonight, who lives in poverty in our country, we have to win. >> you are contending with a group in congress. over here on the left flank are these self-described socialists. on the right, these moderates. >> whatever orientation they came to congress with, they know that we have to hold the center. we have to go down the mainstream. >> they know that? >> they do. >> but it doesn't look like that. it looks as if it's fractured. tough these wings, aoc and her group on one side. >> it's a few people. >> the progressive group. >> i'm a progressive, yeah. >> through clenched teeth. that's like five people.

>> casting the whole thing off as silly, with a look in her eye. >> it's been interesting to watch her manage this. >> civil war playing out. >> right. >> you have -- now, she is dealing with the democratic version of the tea party. you wonder if this is going to end up, for her, much like it did for john boehner, and he'll end up pushing for weed legalization, or if she'll be able to pull it off and control the party. >> we should never forget, when you're watching the speaker in situations like that, when questioned like that about issues like that, about the various members of the progressive wing of the party, you are listening to and watching nancy, the daughter of the former mayor of baltimore, maryland. she has elbows and knows how to use them. >> tough town. don't underestimate her. we have so much to get to. we haven't dug into the buildup to the mueller report. the next 24 hours, what we're expecting. still ahead, president trump

vetoes a bipartisan resolution to end u.s. vovrinvolvement in yemen war. turkey is eyeing a u.s. sanctions waiver. the latest following the devastating fire at the notre dame cathedral. we'll go around the world with richard haas, next on "morning joe." we call it the mother standard of care.

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> [ speaking foreign language ] french. presidential candidate pete buttigieg giving a message to the people of france in fluent franch. it translates, notre dame cathedral was a gift to the human race. we share the pain and also thank you for this gift to civilization. meanwhile, we're getting a sense of the devastation from the fire at notre dame cathedral.

the mayor of paris shared this image on social media, showing the, quote, desolate scene of charred timbers strewed about, and pews sitting in pools of water used to quell the flames. new video also reveals the major damage to the roof and inside the historic structure. french president emmanuel macron has committed to rebuilding the cathedral in five years. so far, donors have pledged more than 700 million euros for the efforts. joining us, author of "a world in disawrradisarray," richard, around the world, but first, notre dame. all the money pledged to rebuild, it seems it could take decades to get through the di s differences in opinion. i would say sum differenthe dif opinion left notre dame completely exposed to something

like that. nobody would want to touch, or in their words, vandalize the building by upgrading it. >> it is still a rare moment of paris and france coming together, at a time when the country is ripped apart. >> oh, yeah. >> it is interesting that macaromacron was scheduled to give a speech today, his attempt to appease the yellow vest movement. he put it on hold. there has been a time-out, a pause in french politics. again, the country has been ripped apart politically, economically, socially, because of terrorism. my guess is it will be a temporary pause. you know, hopefully that is the subject of debate. quite honestly, my concern is sooner rather than later, france goes back to the way it was, which is a divided country with an uncertain future. >> five years though, that is a tall order. >> the economics of french politics, i mean, the social safety net there, is literally falling apart. isn't that the nub of what is going on with the yellow

jackets' protest each and every weekend? >> the government can't afford the pension plans to so-called social safety net. there's pushback against taxes, things on fuel that are not based upon wealth or income. you have high inequality. you have relatively low economic growth. france, in some ways, is a microcosm of southern europe. we're seeing elements of it in italy. we're seeing the pushback in brit britain. this is a country that's really torn apart. >> their fear of immigration. >> absolutely. >> donald trump has vetoed a bipartisan measure to end american support of the saudi war in yemen, which we are co complicit in great human tragedy. fami famine, massive scale civilian casualties. what do you make of this move by donald trump, to invoke the 1973 war powers act? >> it is interesting. you're right, the yemen war is a humanitarian crisis and

strategic nightmare. there is the saudi-led coalition. the war is not going well. the saudis, after years of hoping for a military victory, are worse off than they were. iran is more involved, not less, in yemen. this is not so much a revoke of the president, but it is a vote of no confidence in the crown prince of saudi arabia, after the khashoggi murder. >> donald trump said he would not be intervening overseas. instead, it seems he is pollsteripollster i bolstering the worst of the saudis here. >> uncritical of what they did in lebanon to the prime minister, obviously in yemen. i think what you see is congressional, bipartisan pushback, which is interesting. the united states is not involved directly in the sense of something trohaving troops o no planes in the air. but we are complicit.

the saudis could not do this without us. it is not working in the long run. i'd argue this is bad for the stability of saudi arabia. >> mike? >> you know, richard, no matter what region of the world we speak about, it used to be, not that long ago, that america would approach that region with all of its issues, and with whatever our plans were with regard to the region, with some set of allies behind us. france was an ally. turkey was an ally. what does the current state of countries like turkey, the nato countries, the countries, with regard to their view of the united states and any alliance that was and our presence there now? >> most of the world, our allied relationships are fraying, particularly in europe. you see it worst of it. middle east is a little different. a lot of the middle eastern countries, israel, saudi arabia, didn't like the obama administration. they actually like president trump. they like the fact, for example, this administration doesn't pick on them when it comes to human

rights. president sisi in egypt is essentially going to become another president for life. turkey is different. turkey is formally an ally. let's be honest, they're not a partner. they're not an ally in any meaningful sense of the word. they accept american advance fighter planes, then buy russian air defense systems. uh-huh, can't have it both ways. we don't agree on iran. t turkey is closer to iran than we are. it says more about turkey than us, but i think the fraying of american alliances is in europe. that's what's important. these are our most significant allies that got us through the last 70 years. >> are we alone in the world? >> less predictable and reliable. the united states does not have to act in the world unilaterally, unlike a russia, for the most part, unlike a china, unlike most others. we're taking one of our inherent

strategic advances and essentially giving it away for nothing. >> north korea, talk of a third summit. what could go wrong? nothing, right? >> talk of summits is putting it backwards. it is a means to an end. diplomacy is an instrument, not an end to itself. i think the real question, mika, is whether the united states is going to continue to say, denuclearization or nothing, in which case we'll have nothing, or whether we'll enter a period of real dly real diplomacy. we could give sanction relief. north korea nor we were able to agree at the end of the hanoi summit. will we have real diplomacy? >> will we lose a major foreign policy cabinet secretary, head

of department, any time soon? >> another one? i don't think so. we have acting at the pentagon. mike pompeo seems comfortable at state. john bolton is comfortable at the white house. dan coats -- >> what's up with him? >> it is an imperfect job to begin with. >> how is the relationship? >> he doesn't have anything like the relationship mike pompeo had when he was head of the cia. i think at some point, that's possible. even more important, while he's there, this president is not using the intelligence briefing he's getting. at times, it is as if he is in the bleachers, and the game is taking place on the field. >> i remember when dan coats famously said he hadn't gotten a readout himself of what donald trump discussed with putin in helsinki. >> i remember watching that one. ahead, early fundraising, there's no guarantee of votes in 2020, but it could be a good indication of momentum. steve ratner has charts for that, next on "morning joe."

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looking at 2020, first quarter fundraising totals are in for all the democratic presidential primary candidates. providing evidence of momentum among a growing field of hopefuls. joining us now, former treasury official and "morning joe" economic analyst, steve ratner. let's talk about the money means, what it really shows, and who is ahead. >> three good questions. >> great. >> polls are hard to make sense of at this stage, and money counts. this is americans -- >> isn't money the gauge at this point? >> exactly. >> explain why. >> i think it tells you something because these are people essentially voting with their money. many are individuals making small contributions. let's start with the q1 fundraising totals, all out now. there is a fair amount of, i'll call it, gamesmanship going on, where some candidates transfer money from other accounts, this and that. when you pull the money apart,

bernie sanders has really done an extraordinary job. he's raised $18.2 million in the first quarter. we'll talk later about where the money came from. he obviously had the advantage of having been there before. he had lists and things like that. nonetheless, pretty extraordinary. then you have kamala harris, a newcomer to the field, raising $12 million, also a surprisingly good number and a number with a lot of momentum for her. after that, you have, interestingly, two newcomers. you have beto o'rourke and mayor pete, who both did very well, raising $9 million and $7 million respectively. what's also interesting is of that, it kind of really starts to drop off sharply. it is interesting that elizabeth warren, who many people thought would be up there, raised only $6 million. she would say, part of that is i wasn't taking large donor gifts from the $2800 checks. nonetheless, he's far down the list. a number of other people whose names have certainly been in the press and been out there have

actually been less successful. amy klobuchar, cory booker, and kiersten gillibrand. it is a disparity between rich and poor so far. >> are there money surges we're looking at specifically that show momentum? i mean, we've heard mayor pete raised a lot right after his announcement. are there other candidates that are showing -- and bernie, obviously. >> well, bernie was there from the beginning. >> wow. >> mayor pete and beto o'rourke came in later and, therefore, we'll have to see how q2 does. . a lot were raising money for the exploratory committees before they announced. there is gamesmanship in those, too. >> do you have the repeat donors, the small donors, do you have a chart for that? >> what do you know, mike, here it comes, right now. let's look at the small donors. this is also really important, is who is writing and motivates to get behind their candidate? once again, bernie leads the

pack at 84%. in fairness to all the rest, he had a list, he had a name, he had a history, and he knew how to do this. elizabeth warren, though she didn't raise that much total money, because of what i said before about the large checks, she came in at 70%. our two sort of new faces in town, with all the appeal that goes with it, mayor pete and beto o'rourke, are the next two. then it goes off a cliff. as you get down to the second part of the group, kamala harris was at 37%. amy klobuchar was 35%. then you drop down to kiersten gillibrand at 17%. cory booker at 16%. >> is money important as a proxy for political support, or is money important as something you can buy things with? how do we understand this? >> well, first and foremost, it is something you can -- money you can buy things with. you have to run a campaign. we can talk about the spending, some of them are spending more. in my mind, at this stage, with polls not meaning a heck of a lot, the fact that you have so

many small donors. when you see the fact these are small donors, not rich people on park avenue, writing the small checks, i think it says something of their commitment. >> they have the ability to repeat and keep donating. once they become invested in a candidate. i do think the fundraising numbers, big picture, show kamala harris is perhaps not getting as much attention as the money that she's raised. but it is from majority large donors, in the sense she's only at 37% of donors less than $200. however, those are large donors who are going to continue to probably stay with her campaign throughout the duration. >> then, let's look at trump. >> so this is interesting. >> this is big. >> this is really unusual. if you look at what's been going on through the last few years, un un

un un un unbeknownst to many, president trump began raising money for the smaller checks you can raise, as well as money you can raise through victory committees and through super pak pacs and things like that. he's raised or received, through the end of last year, so not even q1, up to $68 million. he's spent most of it. a lot on digital, building the digital expertise that many people think helped him win last time. if you run down the list of his predecessors, all the way from obama back to bush 41, you can see that virtually none of them did anything during their first two years in office, including raising money or spending money. >> rick tyler, what does this tell us? >> well, i think it is interesting on the democratic side, kamala harris is clearly getting a lot of large check. she also comes from california. bernie sanders is a well-established fundraiser, running for president before. i think the big news here is beto o'rourke, and particularly

pete buttigieg. on the republican -- but i want to say this about money, i think it is very interesting, that second chart that steve showed is most important to me. it shows small donors means grassroots support, right? large donors don't necessarily mean grassroots support. i'll give an example. in 2016, jeb bush had raised over $100 million for a super pac that would support him before he announced. he know jeb bush really never got off the ground. so, yes, consultants love money, and it buys a hot of thilot of particularly advertising. it also buys digital, which is what you see the trump campaign doing. digital, like any advertising, only works if you have a message. it is really unclear to me right now what donald trump's rational for his re-election is. what is his message? we understood what his message

was, make america great, the wall, everything that worked. populus economics, which now bernie owners. donald trump proves he doesn't when he passed the tax bill that they passed. what is the message going to be for re-election? i don't know yet. >> it'll be about brown people. it'll be about race. >> socialism. >> it'll be about fear. it is going to be about anger. it is going to work, to an extent. that's why the democrats, steve, and let me know if you disagree, i mean, you've watched this closely from many angles, as a reporter, but also being married to someone who is very involved in politics, then being on this show. what do the democrats need to do to compete? that is hard to compete against, to an extent, especially with those numbers. >> i agree with all of you about trump's message, but remember,

trump was incredibly effective on the digital side last time. a lot of that money, i showed you he is spending now, he is spending to build a digital operation. democrats, primarily because there are 15 or more of them, are frankly doing nothing. there is a problem on the digital side with the democrats. there is a problem on the messaging side with the democrats, as you've all said. no one has been able to reduce what they're for, with possible exception of bernie, you know, to something that people can comprehend. it is hard to comprehend a 20-point plan. there is an enormous amount of angst with my friends in the democratic party right now, about bernie's strong lead not just in the money but also the polls. >> two things. i think trump has slightly more of a message than you're suggesting, because of the tax cuts, because he's wound down america's involvement in foreign wars. i think that will play. i think the democrats made this, to some extent, a vote about their own fitness. issues about socialism. issues about taking away private health insurance from 175

million americans. i think, you know, if this is a vote about trump's fitness, it is one thing. if it is a vote about democratic fitness, it is something very different. so far, the democrats aren't doing as well as they should. >> one thing, you can look at this chart, both charts, and you can sort of whittle the field right there, projecting forward. >> yeah. >> in less than a year, there's going to be two primaries almost back to back, texas and california. you'll need enough money by the end of this calendar year to participate in both states. you'll have to go up. >> mayor pete's earn rate is impressive, like 10%. thank you. ahead, bernie sanders reaches out to fox news viewers. president trump doesn't seem happy about it. he needs to call his network. steve kornacki and john hallman will join the table. plus, we're joined by former cia director john brennan. what we can expect from the mueller report, which should be out tomorrow in a redacted form. we don't know how much of the report we're actually going to

get. we're looking for it. "morning joe" is back in a moment. moment ♪ ♪

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sometimes you spend weekends with divorce dad. that feels like it is fun, but then you get sick. that's what america is going through. we're kind of living with divorced dad. >> that's one way to put it. i know some really good divorced dads though, so i don't know. welcome back to "morning joe." it was a good try. joe will be back tomorrow, as we countdown to the mueller report, which will be redacted. still with us, we have former aide to the george w bush white house and state departments, elise jordan with us. republican communications strategist and msnbc political contributor, rick tyler. joining the conversation, national affairs analyst for nbc news and msnbc, john heilemann. professor of history at tulane university, walter isaacson is with us. senior adviser at move on.org and msnbc contributor, careen john pierre. and correspondent for msnbc,

author of "the red and the blue," steve kornacki is with us. great to have you all on. great panel. the justice department is expected to release a redacted version of robert mueller's final report tomorrow. now, we're going to talk about what we may or may not be seeing of the report, inside the report, this time around. but in the leadup up to it, th president has been tweeting about monday's fox news town hall with bernie sanders. he tweeted 9:00 p.m. washington time, many trump fans and signs were outside of the fox news studio last night in the now tlif i thriving, thank you, president trump, bethlehem, pennsylvania, for the interview with crazy bernie sanders. big complaints about not being let in. stuffed with bernie supporters. what's with fox news? huh. 11 hours earlier, trump tweeted, so weird to watch crazy bernie on fox news. not surprisingly, bret baier and

the audience was so smiley and nice. very strange. now, we have donna brazile. that's a reference to the network's newest contributor, former dnc head, donna brazile. trump has repeatedly ripped brazile for tipping rival hillary clinton off on a question before one of her 2016 debates with sanders. senator sanders' monday even special on the network was the most watched town hall event of the 2020 campaign so far. it got big ratings, according to early data. perhaps with the ratings on his mind, president trump continued his focus on senator sanders in another tweet last night. quote, i believe it will be crazy bernie sanders versus sleepy joe biden as the two finalists to run against maybe the best economy in the history of our country and many other great things. i look forward to facing whoever it may be. may god rest their soul. oh, my gosh. i just want to point out, the

president himself, who never watches, but he might notice there were tons of people pouring into the fox studio because they love bernie, not trump. oh, what's happening at the trump network? steve kornacki, you tweeted yesterday, sanders favorable, unfavorable numbers with democrats in the latest morning consult is 74% to 16%. there's the scenario where he starts winning primaries next year and where, instead of rallying to stop him, dem voters mainly start falling in line behind him. talk to me about the reality of the most underrated candidate in the democratic party, even though he is a, you know -- >> well, yeah, he is not a registered democrat. >> exactly. >> as critics like to point out. i think that is the question with sanders as you look to 2020. certainly, if you look at the, i don't know, commentator class, the professional strategist class, the folks you're more likely to see on tv talking about democratic politics, you'll pick up on resistance to bernie sanders there.

the question i have is, how deep does that go to the grassroots of the party? that's why the national poll, i think, may be significant, just in terms of it is a baseline for sanders of measuring his good will with grassroots democratic voters. if you take those names off the screen you're looking at right there and say, which one is sanders and which is biden? you might have problem telling the difference, in terms of their favorableabiliility and unfavorability with voters. if some have issues with bernie sanders, don't think he is electable, don't want him to be the nominee, they may be able to drive the negatives up. in the past, you talk about the candidates in democratic primaries, one might be president now, but who you call factional candidates, brown in '82, they didn't have a polling profile that looked like this going to the races. they had high negatives with democratic voters. if he gets on a roll early, wins the iowa and new hampshire, there is the scenario where a

lot of democratic voters are less resistant to getting on board. >> i think we need to stop -- i'm not saying you're doing this, steve, but i think people in the pundit class, they need to stop thinking about him as a factional candidate. he is, among the candidates we see, other than joe biden, the only one who has run for president before. he was the runner up the last time around. he got 13 million votes, as we all know, and gave hillary clinton a run for her money. he is factually correct that the mainstream of the democratic party has moved in his direction. now, embraces -- there is a reason he has the numbers. on a lot of issues, it is not that he is a factional candidate, he is where the mainstream of the electorate is. he is the only candidate out there right now that, today, has the resources to compete in 50 states. he can go all the way to the end. almost won the iowa caucus last time. crushed hillary clinton in the new hampshire primary last time. you know, i think he is going to

have fierce opposition. there are a bunch of people. it won't be a cakewalk for sanders, but there is no world in which he is not a totally obvious democratic front runner today, for reasons that are not fluke i c fluky. it has to do with where the party is now. >> there are reasons we've not touched on enough on this show. i want to show walter isaacson and the table here, everybody involved, the moment with pete buttigieg. we're not doing it right now. something happened yesterday where he showed up somewhere, then all of a sudden, it was a rally and there were 1,500 people. this is a guy who can galvanize a crowd and own a difficult moment. it was about him and a protester coming after him for being gay. we'll get to that in a moment. it is his performance that everybody is talking about, his smarts. careen and then john, bernie sanders is good. have you seen him perform? did you watch the town hall? he connects with people.

he makes a lot of sense. he's funny. he's likable. young people love him. yet, sometimes, i feel like when i look at people from the democratic establishment or the dnc, whatever, and bernie's name comes up, they cringe, look down, and don't want to talk. what's going on? >> i think they're reliving 2016. they cannot make the same mistake they made with bernie sanders in 2016. >> maybe he's good. >> and not take him seriously. >> right. >> he is good. we should take him seriously. we see that in his numbers. he actually has a grassroots movement around him. we talk about iowa and new hampshire. there is such loyalty for him in those states. >> you can't buy that. you can't hand it down. >> not at all. >> you can't be entitled to it. it just happens. >> it is. he is tapping into it once again. he has moved the democratic party. just in the town hall yesterday with fox, they mentioned medicare for all, and the reaction to it -- >> the crowd went wild. >> it was surprising. he hasn't moved the democratic party on issues that are not

popular. college, medicare for all, those were things bernie sanders was talking about four years ago. >> on the performance level, if you covered the 2016 race and went around, he has an unusual performance skill, in the sense that-- >> they want more. >> that gives him a sense of authenticity. in 20 16, if you totaled the number of people who turned out to sanders' rallies versus clinton's rallies, he has the ability to draw and electrify a crowd. there are no comparisons between the two. we're seeing people like mayor pete, who does have performance skills. there are others in the race who have performance skills. beto o'rourke. other people are very good on the stump. bernie sanders is not to be diminished in that area. he electrifies thousands of people on a regular basis. >> we've been delinquent, actually, on following that story, once again. now to the moment i

mentioned with mayor pete buttigieg. what was supposed to be a meet and greet turned into a rally yesterday. for whom does this happen? let me tell you, donald trump. hold on one second with the video. in the runup to t-up to the ele donald trump could walk on any street in any town, and within six minutes, there would be 200 people around him, having him sign books that they happened to have or t-shirts or hats or whatever. this guy got a crowd before he was even running for president. he would step out on fifth avenue, and there would be 200 people from all over america around him, wanting to be close to success, to the trump brand. donald trump does that. this guy apparently does it, too. it's all coming from a very different place. more than 1,600 people came out to see pete buttigieg in des moines, iowa. he was supposed to do a little meet and greet. look at this. now, he is taking part in a full-fledged event. then that event was interrupted twice by two anti-gay

protesters, saying really mean things. could have been a really horrible moment. at least one of them showed up to two of buttigieg's events yesterday, stopping his speech when he mentioned his right to marry his husband. take a listen. >> as somebody very much enjoying the first year of married life, i would say freedom is what's at stake in the idea of whether a county clerk gets to tell you who you ought to marry. >> remember sodom and ga ror go >> speaking of things -- hello again. speaking of things that are at stake, that do not belong to a single political party. >> pete, pete, pete, pete, pete, pete, pete. >> you know, the good news is, the condition of my soul is in the hands of god, but the iowa caucuses are up to you. our marriage twists by the grace of a single vote on the u.s. supreme court. on this tenth anniversary of iowa breaking some ground in that regard, i'd like to say,

thank you. >> remember sodom and gomorrah. >> we got it. i promise you, we got it. remember the beauty of our democracy. everyone here gets the exact same voice and vote. >> okay. walter isaacson, i feel like we just saw something really important there. what do you think? >> i do think pete buttigieg, as you all have said, and you, mika, in particular, is somebody i've known for a long time. both went to pembroke college, which is part of the oxford system. i've admired him for a long time. you spotted the fact that he would really take off. i think what you're able to see with him, and with bernie sanders, is somebody with a voice that's starting to resonate and go deep. i'm interested that buttigieg is now going to do a fox news town hall. i think the ability to take it to a fox news town hall, that sanders showed so well he can

do, when we watch buttigieg be heckled, we realize he can probably do that, as well. i find that one of the most amazing phenomenon of this race, boy, he is an attractive, smart, thoughtful candidate. it'll be interesting to see if he's much more than just this month's flash and he can really become a top tier, sustained candidate. >> before we move on, steve kornacki, his fundraising, does it say anything to you? are we not in an area where it is breaking through and you're seeing, wow. >> look, the money is impressive and goes hand in hand with the media coverage you've seen, with the move up in the polls. i think the question that walter just posed there, about, look, if you're the mayor of south bend, a city of a few thousand people, you've exceeded expectations in your campaign. if the question is, can he take the next step and become a

contender for the nomination, here is the early warning sign you're seeing in the polls. it's this, the support he is attracting right now is, if you look at the national polls, it comes disproportionately from white voters, wealthier voters. when the income level hits $100,000 in the polls, his numbers take off, doubling, tripling. it comes from college educated and self-described liberal or very liberal voters. that's a profile we have seen before in democratic primaries. >> interesting. >> you can go back to gary hart, to bill bradley, to howard dean. the one thing all of those candidates have in common, they got traction at some point in the primaries, failed to cross to lower income voters, and they failed to cross over to african-american voters. there has not been a democratic nominee for president who has failed to win the black vote since michael dukakidukakis. since then, every democratic nominee has broken through. including john kerry in 2004, winning the black vote in primaries.

pete buttigieg, right now, there's a lot of energy and media attention. maybe it is resonating with a certain type of voter there. it is going to have to expand. >> is there a challenge with the african-american? >> yes. >> explain it to me. >> that's with everybody, right? you have to be able to -- >> specifically for mayor pete. >> right. mayor pete has been multi-layered and multi-dimensional, speaking in his truth. he is in his moment right now. campaigns is about timing. he's there. the problem that he's going to have is he has to expand that base, as steve rightly laid out. you cannot win this democratic primary if you don't overwhelmingly win the black vote. after iowa, after new hampshire, it becomes much more diverse. you have south carolina, nevada, texas, and california, as part of march 3rd, super tuesday states. you have to be able to get out of, you know, just that comfort zone or the people who come to you naturally, and really speak to black voters. >> a mountain. >> it is. >> to layer in a level of

complexity, which i think you'll agree with, one of the things that's happened in the democratic party is there has been a huge segment of the electorate that was not a factor in the dukakis era, hispanic voters. in 2008, hillary clinton dominated with hispanic voters. obama dominated with african-american voters. the non-white vote split, and they had their coalitions. one of the questions for mayor pete and for all the other white candidates is not -- it is certainly, they have to connect with black voters, but there is a larger question. all of them will have to connect with some substantial piece of the non-white vote. with this big a field, it is going to be complicated. would you have to win the non-white vote or get a substantial minority? obviously, doubly complicated by the fact there are a bunch of non-white candidates in the case, which a lot of candidates in the past didn't deal with. no doubt, if your support is all white, you won't be the nominee. >> the other complicating factor, where else is pete

buttigieg getting the support? liberal and very liberal. look at the coalition not just of black voters but hispanic. the non-white component of the democratic party, if you look at the recent survey data, is the most conservative in moderate, self-identified. buttigieg right now, and we say he is doing well with white voters, doing well with self-described, very liberal voters. the folks who are most likely to call themselves moderate or conservative are non-white. >> to that point, i remember in 2016, in the run up to the november election, going around and doing focus groups. it was interesting, talking to democrats of color, and how their concerns were more kitchen table concerns than what you'd hear from your more liberal activist class. i think that's something that threading the needle there is going to be more difficult. the ultimate victor will be someone who can address those concerns. elsewhere on the 2020 campaign trail, last night, senator elizabeth warren drew a crowd of 1,500 people to an

airplane hangar in aurora, colorado, where she discussed her new proposal,reinstating protections rolled back from the trump administration. meanwhile, beto o'rourke became the first declared democratic candidate to campaign in virginia, making five stops across the commonwealth. finishing at uva in charlottesville last night. and joe biden will go to boston tomorrow, where he will rally with striking supermarket workers. elizabeth warren joined the same group on the picket line last week. in south carolina yesterday, biden delivered the eulogy at the funeral of his long-time senate colleague, fritz holoings, taholo g hollings, talking about going

from being a sfor civil rights. >> he knew how to get along when we needed to. he knew how to change, as well. he changed. he learned. as he learned, he changed. we have hope that we can learn from the past and build a better future. >> walter isaacson, i want to talk about joe biden and what he brings to the table. of course, at the eulogy, he also talked about hollings being there at his lowest moment and his highest moment. of course, talking about when he lost his daughter and wife in a car accident many years ago. there are so many different turns and evolving moments in biden's career. he is, bar none, the most experienced candidate, is he not? what are the challenges you think biden faces at this moment in history? >> the ones you just described.

he's the most experienced. i think he is one of those really great guys who has a good heart, is out there. he's got a long history in which, as he said, about fritz hollings, he's evolved and changed. so have i. i'm getting old, too. i don't believe the same things i believed 20 years ago. that is not a perfect recipe though for running in the democratic primary. there are many votes, whether it was on criminal justice, even on civil rights, in which joe biden took a while to evolve. some issues, on gay rights and gay marriage, he evolved faster than others in his party, including barack obama. it is not great to have people will able to pick out things you said 20 or 30 years ago. on the other hand, i think the cycles of american history have always been, especially in times of turmoil, you look for somebody totally different.

you know, trump, who is the most different from trump? it is probably not joe biden. you know, joe just can't -- but somebody like a pete buttigieg, he is just -- he so throws trump off the stage. trump feels like an old, weird dude. you have somebody fresh and new and smart who can, from his heart, say something about, thank you to the french nation for what you did with notre dame. from his heart, talk about his marriage to somebody who is heckling him. so i think, in some ways, a pete buttigieg is the true contrast to this kind of, you know, oily, old, weird uncle that is now the president. >> biden is doing well in the polls though. i mean, he's up at the top, right? >> yeah, he is. he hasn't even jumped in yet. >> hasn't jumped in. >> we'll see what happens. >> it is an interesting choice. he's strong.

>> yeah. also, the huge dividing line, and we saw this a little in 2016, it is age. poll democrats, 45 and older, biden is cleaning up. 45 and under, there's sanders. >> not in the race. hard to know what will happen if joe biden gets in the race. to be fair, there are a lot of people who are also stark contrasts to donald trump who we have not been talking about. kamala harris, amy klobuchar. i can make a list. every woman in the field is a stark contrast to donald trump. again, mayor pete is having a moment, but there are a lot of democrats who would be a pretty stark contrast to donald trump. >> steve, careen, thank you, both. coming up next, our next guest knows a thing or two about redacted documents. former cia director john brennan joins the table ahead of tomorrow's release of the redacted version of bob mueller's russia report. "morning joe" is back in a moment.

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nbc news has learned that house intelligence committee chairman adan schiff and ranking member devin nunez sent a joint letter last month, asking for a briefing from special counsel robert mueller. according to the letter, which was obtained by nbc news, they also asked for access to all materials obtained or produced by the special counsel's office, trying to understand how this all came together. joining us now, former cia director john brennan. he is a senior national security and intelligence analyst for nbc news. also with us, former u.s. attorney for the northern district of alabama, and msnbc distributor, joyce vance. okay. we're getting ready. we're 24 hours away from seeing what, joyce, exactly? >> i think we all have to be cautious about not getting inflated expectations of what we'll see.

>> correct. >> you know, we expect a large document, something that will take time to process. it may also be, likely will be, that it is heavily redacted. it'll take some time to piece it together. i think we'll get some glimpses into the mueller report. i'm not sure that we'll have a fulsome understanding of the process. >> director brennan, are there legitimate -- i mean, a lot of people want to see the full report. nancy pelosi talks about the american people seeing the full report. sounds good. i'd like to see the report. are there legitimate reasons for large amounts of redactions in this report? >> well, i make three points. first, a lot depends on the guidance attorney general barr gives to the redaction team. it'll be his decision, what comes out. he can say, make sure nothing gets out in the four categories he's pointed to. or he could say that the congress and the american people deserve to see as much of this report as possible. the redaction team will either lean heavily or lightly, as far as the redactions. two, i find it hard to believe bob mueller and his team didn't

anticipate there would be this clamor for the report, and would try to at least minimize the redactions there. third, if we see a lot of roller brushing, is what they call it in the redaction business, of pages that are totally blacked out, paragraph upon paragraph, i think it reflects then the guidance that was given by barr, and i think there will be legitimate cries of coverup. >> how much do we know, for sure, that mueller's team put together summaries, a summary or summaries, that could be released to the american people? >> i think we know nothing for sure. >> okay. >> i think, as joyce said, we have to wait until things come out tomorrow. i do think it is important that bob mueller has an opportunity to talk to congress about this. congress deserves that. >> mike barnicle? >> joyce, we have been told repeatedly, specifically by the attorney general of the united states, he's implied that the white house has not been shown the report. they have not seen the report. i have been wondering, as an average, stupid person sitting

out here -- >> you're way above average in this department. >> rudy giuliani says they have prepared a rebuttal. how do you prepeare a rebuttal o a report you have allegedly not seen? >> this is a perplexing issue. nothing in my legal career has prepared me for responding to what i haven't heard. you can anticipate. the real question that troubles me, and one of the things i was taught as a young lawyer, was to shut up when i was winning. if this report, in fact, clears the president, why is there any need for a rebuttal? >> heilemann? >> do you think, director brennan -- it seems to me we are now going to have -- this is going to be not so much -- we're going to learn some things from the redacted report, but we'll really learn what the contours of the fight ahead are about congress's desire to try to get the entirety of the report and the underlying evidence. where do you think, as you see

what the dynamics of that fight is going to be, what the kinds of legitimate claims the white house and attorney general will be making, about why certain things should never be allowed in the public? if you're on the intelligence committee and congress, in theory, you should have access to the highly confidential material. they see it all the time. >> the white house might not have seen the document, but large portions might have been read to it, giving the white house an opportunity to respond. >> that's why you're the cia director. >> secondly, the committee's jurisdiction on the hill have every right to see as much of this report as possible, with maybe the exception of ongoing investigations, in terms of making sure that that is not going to be compromised. from a source standpoint, the intelligence committees, and judiciary committee, they have a right to see as much of this as possible. that's why i think they'll make a strong push, and they have a legitimate right. the attorney general and white house said they're not going to

invoke executive privilege, as far as keeping something back that the white house wants because of executive privilege concerns. source and methods, you know, the issue of privacy of peripheral individuals, i can see congress and the american people don't need to know, well, who said this. they want the substance. >> right. >> what is it the special counsel's team learned about, both from the standpoint of collusion, working with russians, as well as obstruction of justice. >> again, it is going to be redacted. we're not going to see the entire report tomorrow. but tomorrow, portions of the mueller report will be released. walter isaacson, the fact that a rebuttal is in process, it leads me to believe that perhaps this president has an idea of what's in there and wants to get ready with his branding opportunities. secondly, do you think certain committees will see the full report? i mean, as history plays out, there are processes in place where some people can see the

full report. >> yes, i think that the attorney general barr and mueller, if brought before the committee, can say to them, okay, here's why this was redacted and what it was, and do it in a safe way, so that it is not compromising methods, or for that matter, violating privacy. i assume it could be done right, if people of good faith try to do it. but if you don't mind, i have a question i'd love to ask director brennan. >> go ahead. >> which is, the fact that the thing that has been left unclear by the attorney general barr's summary is whether or not there was obstruction of justice. i would like the director to say, what are you going to be looking for in the report over the next day or two that helps you figure out whether you think obstruction of justice was committed? >> the issue of obstruction of

justice, whether it will be redacted or not. it is clear, at least the snippet, one sentence included in the barr report, said that this was not an exoneration of donald trump. there is a basis then to make that determination or to not go forward with an indictment. i do believe that, in fact, bob mueller is not the person to overreach. i think he was recognizing that the department of justice policy is not to indict a sitting president. i think it is important for us to see as much as possible, so we can understand exactly, what was the basis for bob mueller's decision, not to go forward with either an exoneration or some type of charge? >> as we close, there was this "the new york times" piece on gina haspel, did you see it? >> i did. >> it talks about how she deals with trump. people have difficulty. a lot of people have laughed. there is a lot of acting secretaries and administrators. they say a career case officer trained to handle informants, she has relied on the skills of

a spy. good listening, empathy, and ability to connect, making sure her voice is heard at the white house. she's been proved to be an adept tactician. how is she doing in your job? it is a difficult job, to say the least. i can't even imagine the pressures as you're navigating a relationship with president trump and your responsibilities. >> gina has great interpersonal skills. some people may say they're spy skills, but it is getting along with people. an intelligence professional knows the business well. i think she's been able to deal with the madness of this administration in a professional way, trying to make sure the intelligence assessments, intelligence information is at least being presented. i don't know if it is being heard and absorbed, but she's doing a good job. the cia personnel are glad she's at the helm. >> joyce vance, 24 hours from now, what are we expecting? what should we not expect?

>> you know, i think we should all take a deep breath. before we get into hot takes, trying to draw one sentence out of this report, this is a good moment for americans to act responsibly and belie the myth and stereotypes about the way we were misled on facebook or other spoesh social media platforms. let's read it, figure out what it says, and have the conference the country should have. >> john brennan, thank you so much for being on this morning. joyce vance and walter isaacson, thank you, both, as well. still to come, the mueller report aside, there are the ongoing congressional investigations into the administration. next hour, we're going to bring in a member of the house judiciary committee. plus, when it comes to 2020, all eyes are on the presidential election, but there are a number of serious senate races shaping up, as well. we'll take a look at one of them ahead on "morning joe." don't tell your mother.

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welcome back to "morning joe." it is 41 past the hour. 34 u.s. senators face

re-election in 2020, but only two republicans represent states that voted democratic in the 2016 presidential election. senator susan collins of maine and senator cory gardner of colorado. joining us is a democrat aiming to unseat gardner, former secretary of state under president obama, deputy, and in the colorado senate, formerly serving in john hickenlooper's cabinet in the department of higher education. you are not qualified. seriously, you need the go back and do a little more. i hear a lot of former obama staff members, cabinet members, who are running for office, who are going out there, trying to make a difference. you're one of them. >> yeah. i think there's been a number of people around the country who have, particularly in 2018, a lot of the seats we saw flipped out of the 40 seats that flipped. a lot of them were candidates

who, like me, had a record of public service, but not in politics. particularly in foreign policy or national security. you had locklin in michigan. >> incredible. >> spanberger in virginia. kim in new jersey. we saw others around the country. crow in colorado, who has a record of service but never had been in politics. i think what we found was voters responded to these national security democrats who voters could see both the record of public service that had defined their lives, as well as the fact that when you represented our country abroad, or when you served abroad, you have a sense of what it means to see institutions fall apart. you have a sense of why american values matter in the world and why they matter so much here at home. >> dan, nice to meet you. i'm curious, you've got -- before you could get to cory gardner, you'll have a crowded

primary field you'll have to get through out there. you have about as many democrats looking for this seat as there are in the democratic race for president. just talk a little bit about how you -- what that field looks like and what sets you apart from the democrats, who you'll have to beat first before you go up against the incumbent? >> sure. look, i'm running against cory gardner. it is hard to know where he ends and trump begins these days. it is a real disappointment because when he auditioned for this job, when he interviewed with the people of colorado, gardner said he'd be a moderate voice in washington and an independent voice. instead, he's folded over and over again for donald trump in the last few years. i'm running against cory gardner. there is a primary. one of the things i bring to the primary is a record of public service without a record in politics. across america, people are interested in seeing a fresh face. they respect a fresh voice and a voice that comes from a record of service. i would also be the first openly gay man in the u.s. senate if i won.

i think that, for some people, is a historic thing. for me, it is a personal thing. growing up in colorado, when amendment 2 passed, being a gay man in politics, i bring a sense of imp tempathy to it. bringing empathy to politics is something that gives me the ability to understand the voices that i hear around the state. >> what's been your sort of reflections on watching mayor pete deal with this same issue, i think with ease almost? >> yeah. >> incredible time right now. >> it is an incredible time. you know, one of the things i say is, anybody who has lived the life i lived can't afford to be cynical. i mean, i grew up scared, in a conservative place, that i would never be able to live a happy life, much less a public life. now, i've been able to serve my country, represent president obama as a u.s. ambassador overseas, and do that with my

husband by my side. i mean, it was unthinkable. >> the russians tried to get you expelled. >> russians tried to get my fired. in fact, when i arrived in vien vienna, one of the other ambassadors said, the russian ambassador has been saying the new american is 36 and a homosexual. imana amanaged to use both of t against him in the months that followed. i think what mayor pete is doing is impressive. i hope what people see, to the point they see something in common, is not that we both happen to be openly gay. >> i think that's the point. >> yeah. >> for both of you, i don't -- i think of your candidacy and your policies and your experience and everything that you have done leading up to this moment. perhaps making you extremely qualified for the position. >> you know, you've got an impressive resume. >> really. >> you've overcome any fear you had growing up about what your life was going to be about. i'm going to ask you about an issue that is not national really in scope. it is in one sense, but it is so

local. when you were in the department of higher education in colorado, how do we go about getting children, 10, 14 years of age, instead of memorizing things, to think about things? >> when you talk to employers today, what they say is what we need are the soft skills, the critical thinking, the ability to reason, to work in groups, et cetera. i think, you know, this is one of the questions that will define whether we can seize the opportunity of this moment. i think, you know, going back to mika's question about the similarities between me and mayor pete, i hope that what people see is not only that we're both openly gay but we have a sense that this is a moment where we decide whether we're going to rise and meet the challenges or take the silver linings of this difficult time that we're through and create the foundation for a new american century or not. i'm confident that we will and we can. i think figuring out how to see education as a national security issue, as an issue that is central to whether or not we

succeed in the 21st century. the 10 and 14-year-olds in colorado you were talking about will be competing with 10 and 14-year-olds in johannesburg or anywhere else in the world when they enter the work force. they need the skills to compete on a global playing field. we need to make sure they have the skills and we keep the playing field fair. >> you'd go on fox for an interview, right? >> i would go on fox for an interview. >> dan baer, thank you very much. up next, there are a lot of problems facing our country. congress is supposed to help solve them. why do we need a problem solvers caucus? we'll bring in two members of that group who are trying to come up with solutions to some big issues, like immigration, infrastructure, and health care. that is next on "morning joe." we call it the mother standard of care.

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solvers congress. we've got a democrat and republican. getting along here. we've got problems. you got answers. tom, go, what's the point of the caucus and what will you get done? >> we've got 20 democrats and 20 republicans trying to find common ground with each other. i think people in america are hungering for people to just solve problems. they're sick of everybody fighting with each other about everything. the problem solvers is trying to find common ground. we work on big picture issues and some small things as well in the right now we're focussed on infrastructure. >> brian, some of the problems are huge like people are scared they're going to lose their health care. how can you guys find common ground on this now? >> good morning. yeah. as tom said, any functional relationship in our lives whether it's personal, bids, or financial is a product of phenomenal and listening more

than lecturing. the history if you look back, hasn't been around too long. they started off originally with noncheck issues. we dove deep into gun safety and infrastructure and health care. immigration. tom's done a phenomenal job on that. those are the big issues we're trying to take on. we're making big progress. >> immigration, you're one of the few democrats -- we have a problem at the border. what's the solution with the problem solvers? >> peter king and i did a piece in the new york times a couple weeks ago. we said -- i've been focussed on this issue for 25 years. peter king has been from the other perspective from boarder security. in order to solve the immigration issue, we have to protect the people, the dreamers and the tsp recipients and family members and give them a path to citizenship while at the same time we need border security and we need to try to stop people from coming into the

country illegally. it's a little bit of both. we have to work together to find common ground or we're not going to get anything done. >> rick has a question. >> congressman, as you know the heart of obama care is at stake in the courts. if obama care is overturned by the courts as being unconstitutional, what is the problem solvers caucus's answer to that? i haven't really heard a republican answer for a replacement to obama care since it's been implemented. on the democratic side, i only hear about government solutions or government-run solutions or government options. what is your solution if obama care is overturned? >> well, right now the focus of -- i'm sorry, brian. go ahead. >> yeah. so tom and i have had the same exact position on this. we both believe in the individual mandate and we both voted together on the floor of the house to speak with one voice as the house of

representatives opposing that texas court's decision. there's a number of things we can do. this was the first issue we took on last congress repealing the 2.3% tax on medical devices. allowing for interstate competition. >> you know, we've agreed that with obama care what we need to do is mend it, not end it. there's a lot of great things about obama care, but there are still problems. if people could work together, we could make obama care better than it is right now. but the idea of repealing and getting rid of it altogether doesn't make any sense. we're hopeful it will be a court decision like that. >> you guys are part of a -- i want to get up to the 30,000 feet here, the problem solvers caucus. it seems like in the age of donald trump when you have a a president who has not focussed on being a problem solver. a lot of times he gets in the

way of people like you. talk about in this next year and a half when the president is in office through reelection and then we'll see, what it's been like to have to deal with a president who in some respects as embodied a kind of antithetical approach through the world than the ones you embody. >> it's a big challenge with every tweet changing, the news cycle, everybody scattering with him changing the topic. it's the president and also democrats and republicans, people that are the extremes that are not talking to each other to try to understand where we can find common ground. both sides have this problem. the president kexacerbates it. most people are normal people. they just want us to work together and solve the problems. they don't want people yelling and screaming at each other all the time. >> brian, do you feel the same way? i think you might be in a more difficult position navigating the president's policies and this message? >> yeah. no. tom, and i talk all the time.

the most productive meetings are our problem solvers meetings. the problem we face in the country is not democrat versus republican. it's sent richl versus extremism. tom and i the last time we were on your show was during the child separation crisis. we heard and saw the same things. tom and i respect each other as human beings. we came up with a mutually agreeable solution. that's the way it's supposed to work. that's what the american people want, i believe. >> tom and brian, we welcome this. thank you very much. come back. >> good to see you. >> good seeing you. >> happy with the phillies last night. >> 14-3. >> my god. look at this. it's spreading. it's infectious. coming up based on his tweets which are not infectious and they're kind of boring. yesterday he was like no collusion. just like randomly. anyhow, president trump appears to be frustrated with senator

bernie sanders getting all the attention on his favorite channel fox news and people just pouring in wanting to hear what bernie has to say at his network. does it mean he views bernie as a legitimate 2020 competitor? plus actors, athletes, entrepreneurs and world leaders. time has the most 100 influential people. we have our own influencers at the inaugural ascend summit on may 10th in new york city. a you can get your tickets at knowyourvalue.com. while you're there, so much going on on the website. i'm giving up sugar for a month. i'm dying. i'm shrivelled up. there is a real conversation happening online on our social media channels. speak up and get involved and join me on may 10th at the

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with humira, control is possible. as somebody very much enjoying the first year of married life, i would say freedom is what's at stake in the idea of whether a county clerk gets to tell you who you get to marry. hello, again. speaking of things that are at stake that do not belong to a single political party, the good news is the condition of my soul is in the hands of god, but the iowa caucus are up to you. apparently it's not pete buttigieg's supporters taking note of his surge. his critics, it seems, are also paying attention. as the south bend mayor rises toward the top of the democratic field. good morning and welcome to "morning joe." it is wednesday, april 17th.

joe needed to be off this morning, but he will be back tomorrow with us, tomorrow morning. we have with us today msnbc contributor mike barnicle, contributor to time magazine and msnbc political analyst and former aide to the george w. bush white house and state departments alise jordan. msnbc political contributor, rick tyler, and willie, that interaction that pete had with the hecklers, there were a few of them. it seemed like the audience made a space for it, and he brought it home. >> yeah. there was a heckler there yelling about protesting the fact that pete buttigieg is married to his husband. he had a line. it was extraordinary. the reason he's doing well is because he performs like that every time he goes out. you can't come out of nowhere as a mayor of a city of 100,000 people and reach the spot around third without every time he goes

onto a stage or every time he goes on tv he performs. he'll be here tomorrow on "morning joe" tomorrow. >> yeah. rick tyler, i asked you about that moment. am i making too much of it? >> no. look, i think it's -- i think pete buttigieg who knows who he is. he obviously put a lot of thought into these things. he anticipated that people might say something and had something ready at hand. it's like great golf. it's how you handle these challenges that makes you a contender, and he certainly is one. >> well, we're going to talk a lot more about this. the justice department by the way is expected to release a redacted version of mueller's final report tomorrow. i should point out a redacted version means a lot of it might be blacked out, that you can't read it. have you ever done a freedom of information request? sometimes you get it back and literally the whole thing is blacked out. that would be quite amusing.

as we build up to the big reveal, i think it's important to let the viewers know there may be nothing to see. there may be half of it to see. there may be a lot to see. president trump's lawyer rudy giuliani says the president's legal team is putting the finishing touches on a rebuttal to the report. and we'll talk about what we may or may not be seeing in the report this time. the buildup to the report's release might be weighing on the president, though. it just might be. you see these patterns that sort of set in. or maybe it's bernie sanders. it could be bernie sanders getting rnd his skin, because he's been tweeting a lot about monday's fox news town hall with the president candidate. trump tweeted around 9:00 washington time, many trump fans and signs were outside of the fox news studio last night in the now thriving thank you president trump bethlehem, pennsylvania with the interview

with crazy bernie sanders. big complaints about not being let in. what's with fox news? does he produce by tweet, sort of executive produce the show by tweet? he's not happy people liked what bernie had to say. 11 hours earlier trump tweeted so weird to watch crazy bernie on fox news. not surprisingly brett baier and the audience was so smiley and nice. very strange, and now we have donna brazile. she's the former dnc head. trump has ripped her for tipping hillary clinton off about a question before one of her 2016 debates with sanders. fair game. fox did not respond to the latest criticism, but brett bair reacted. thank you for watching, mr. president. we'd love you on a town hall

soon or even an interview. it's been a while. we cover all sides. fox is making an aefrt and i think it's great to open the doors to different points of view. we'll see if they're able to continue to do this despite the president complaining in realtime about their coverage. a lot of people look at fox as his propaganda wing. >> it's interesting if you look at his language in the tweet he said now we have donna brazile, talking about fox news, telling the whole story of his relationship with that network. now that they weren't celebrating president trump by having bernie sanders, he believes, he's upset with fox news. meanwhile tom perez said monday the party is not reconsidering the decision not to hold a debate on fox news. bernie sanders's monday evening special was the most watched town hall event of the 2020 campaign so far according to early nielsen data. perhaps with the high ratings on his mind, president trump

continued his focus on senator sanders in another tweet last night writing it believe it will be crazy bernie sanders versus sleepy joe biden as the two final is to run against maybe the best economy in the history of our country. may god rest their soul says president trump. now, at least three other democratic presidents reportedly are open to a fox town hall including pete buttigieg. his campaign strategist tweeting yesterday, stay tuned. i suspect that the mayor is the kind of candidate who will go on fox. he's from indiana. he can speak to the fox audience perhaps more than some of the progressive candidates. >> i think it's great for the democrat candidatesed to the fox town halls. i understand the trepidation with the debates after the reporting that perhaps trump got

a ve view of the questions. that's not fair to any of the candidates if it's supposed to be a level playing field. >> but i think one of the ways to level the playing field is to show up. i mean, if you have good voices going in and expressing their points of view in an effective way, someone like mayor pete may be able to pull it off. bernie sanders did great. he said things the audience really wanted to hear and fox did a good job having a diverse audience. that's called tv news. that's called covering a campaign. and giving all the candidates equal air time. so if democrats show up, i think the whole thing about fox -- i mean, it would be smart on fox's part, but it would start to change, wouldn't it? >> i think the town halls are great. i understand the trepidation with the debate stage when you have 10 candidates and there has been reporting, incredible reporting that one candidate had favoritism, like during the rnc

campaign in 2016, but i think that these town halls are fantastic, and you can see how some of those ideas were resonating with the crowd that -- would they have been obama bernie voters and not obama/trump voters. >> tom perez is a good guy. i like him. he's so far off the mark here banning fox news from the democratic debate. you're running for president of the united states. this is one of the basic ideas, to reach as many americans as possible. this is one way to reach as many americans as possible. >> and to bring people together. i mean, one of the reasons why we're concerned about violence and about vitriol is because everyone is going to the corners and the chief divider is the president. >> there's no doubt about it. the president takes every opportunity to make things political. those things that -- he basically conducts himself with

virtually no class, and so -- but with regard to the fox news interview, i think that bernie sanders actually won over the crowd. i think that event was probably billed to fox news viewers as he was going to go into hostile territory. it was surprising to me how many people in the fox news audience were willing to give up their private insurance and move to medicare for all. that was surprising. that surprised me, and i think it also surprised brett baier. you take every vehicle. when i was on the presidential campaign for ted cruz, there were a lot of people in the campaign who didn't want to do msnbc. i advocated for msnbc to be honest. nbc gave us the most what i consider the most fair coverage of the three networks. so you always want to reach out and look at the most broad audience and why cut off an audience? it doesn't make any sense from a political standpoint. >> i know joe has talked about

this. we love brett baier. fox has some good people. here is that moment and then mike can jump in. brett turned to the audience and wanted to get their reaction on the issues, especially as it pertained to bernie sanders. take a look. >> this audience has a lot of democrats in it. it has republicans, independents, democratic socialists, conservatives. i want to ask the audience a question if you could raise your hand here. a show of hands of how many people get their insurance from work, private insurance? right now how many get it from private insurance? okay. now, of those how many are willing to transition to what the senator says, a government-run system? >> mike? >> well, that's a surprising display right there. but to the larger point that we're talking about, fox news versus the democratic party, as

odd as that sounds, if you're afraid of tucker carlson, how are you going to be president of the united states? go onto fox news. reach as many people as you can. show them just because you have a d after your time you're not ridiculously far left socialist or whatever. that you speak to the common sense needs and problems and attitudes of most americans. i can't understand the reluct t reluctan reluctance. >> i understand why some people wouldn't want to do an interview with sean hannity. but we have evidence from brett and martha and shep smith and chris wallace and bill hemmer, you can go on and on about people who will give you a fair shake. now what was supposed to be a meet and greet for pete buttigieg turned into a rally. more than 1600 people came out to see him in iowa. his speech was interrupted twice with anti-gay protesters. one stopped the mayor's speech

when he mentioned his right to marry his husband. >> as somebody very much enjoying the first year of married life, i would say freedom is at stake in the idea of whether a county clerk gets to tell you who to marry. >> hello again. speaking of things that are at stake that do not belong to a single political party -- [ chanting pete ] . >> the good news is the condition of my soul is in the hands of god, but the iowa caucuses are up to you. our marriage exists by the grace of a single vote on the u.s. supreme court. and on this 10th an verse niver iowa breaking ground, i would like to say thank you. we got it. remember the beauty of your democracy. everyone here gets the exact

same voice. >> okay. >> we've watched a lot of political candidates. what do you make of his political performance? >> it's good. he does seem to have some of the it that you need if you're going to propel forward. he stayed on his feet and clearly it's something that he was answering from the heart, and has thought about and i didn't know -- i was educated this week just through his interview with rachel maddow about his own journey with coming out. i didn't realize he was closeted when he served in afghanistan and came out when he returned home and said life is too short. it was really a very moving interview, and then you see how comfortable he is there with himself. >> coming up on "morning joe," aoc may have a megaphone, but pelosi has the numbers and the gavel. we'll talk about the push and pull among democrats on where the party is headed. "morning joe" is coming right back. ♪

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if you go throughout the country as i do all the time, people are concerned about their kitchen table issues. are they going to be able to pay the bills? 50% of the american people could not withstand a a broken car or broken water heater, whatever it is. that's what people are concerned about. so i have not been one of these focusers on impeachment and reports and the rest of that. let the chips fall where they may when we have the evidence and the facts. we'll see what comes forth. we'll see how much the attorney general decided that it was at his discretion to redact. now, i'm an intelligence person. that's one of the places i was forged in the congress. i respect protecting sources and methods. i don't support hiding the truth from the american people.

>> house speaker nancy pelosi keeping an eye on the release of the mueller report while also suggesting that democrats have a lot more on their plate than simply focusing on the special counsel. and of course we're waiting to see what is going to be in the mueller report. i do think at some point either a committee or the american people need to see the entire report at this point. i'm absolutely concerned that the big buildup to the reveal of the mueller report will be used by those who perhaps want to protect the president and whatever is in there to sort of make it look like wawa. i am bracing people to understand that may be very redacted. we're waiting to see if we're going to see something. >> and the president has already declared wawa when william barr's report came out. >> and that was since the end of the letter quoted the report as saying on the basis of obstruction, it was not an exoneration. so that lie which he was able to

brand on the big buildup so everybody don't get into an uproar, let's wait and see just how redacted this is. it may be another moment where we have to wait longer for real information. >> i think that speaker pelosi suggested there's a public and congress constituencies. the congress can handle classified information. it does all the time. >> i found pelosi's tact to be interesting. she's been quite politically savvy. i've been a harsh critic in the past of her actions. she's been masterful over the past year and is really trying to lead her party in the smartest direction politically approaching 2020 by saying let's focus on kitchen table issues and not just overhype. >> there's a lot of them like health care. >> there's a back forth that used to be subtle. it's in the open between pelosi and coarse coaralexandria ocasi.

in pelolondon the speaker did t. >> when we won the election, it wasn't in districts like mine or alexandria's. she's a wonderful member of congress, but those are districts that are solidly democratic. this glass of water would win with a d next to its name, but the 43 districts, we won a net gain of 40 were right down the middle. mainstream, hold the center victories. and if we're going to be helping the one in five children in america who goes to sleep hungry at night and lives in poverty, we have to win. >> you are contending with a group in congress over here on the left flank are these self-described socialists. on the right these moderates. >> whatever orientation they came to congress with, they know that we have to hold the center.

that we have to be -- go down the mainstream. >> they know that? >> they do. >> but it doesn't look like that. it looks as if it's fractured. you have these things, aoc and her group on one side. >> that's, like five people. >> no. it's the progressive group. >> i'm a progressive. yeah. >> through clenched teeth, that's five people. >> also casting the whole thing off as silly just with a look in her eye like really? >> it's been interesting to watch her manage this. >> civil war playing out. you have -- now she's dealing with the democratic version of the tea party, and you wonder if this is going to end up for her much like it did for john boehner and she's going to end up pushing for weed legalization, or if she's going to be able to pull it off and control the party. >> we should never forget when you're watching the speaker in situations like that, when questioned like that about issues like that, about the

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> [ speaking nonenglish ]

>> presidential candidate pete buttigieg giving a message to france in fluid french. it translates in part to notre dame cathedral was like a gift to the human race. we share the pain but we also thank you for this gift to civilization. meanwhile we're getting a better sense of the fire. the mayor of paris shared this image on social media showing the scene of charred timbers strewn about and pews in pools of quarter used to quell the flames. new video reveals the major damage to the roof and inside the historic structure. french president macron has committed to rebuilding the cathedral in five years. so far donors have pledged more than 700 more euros for the effort. joining us now president of the counsel on foreign relations and author of the book "a world in

disarray" richard haas. we're going to go around the world with you. first, notre dame. all the money that's been pledged to rebuild, so me i seems like that could take decades to get through all the differences in opinion. i mean, i would assume that differences in opinion left notre dame completely exposed to something like this, because nobody would want to touch or maybe in the words they'd see it as vandalize the building by upgrading it. >> it's still a rare moment of paris, france coming tot at a time the country is so ripped apart. it's interesting macron was scheduled to give a big speech today. his attempt to appease the yellow vest movement. he put it on hold. there's been a pause in french politics. again, the country has been ripped apart politically, economically, socially because of terrorism. my guess is it will be a temporary pause, and hopefully that is the subject of the

debate. my concern is that sooner rather than later france goes back to the way it was which is a divided country with an uncertain future. >> five years, that's a tall order. >> the economics of french politics, the social safety net there is literally falling apart. isn't that the nub of what's going on with the yellow jackets' protest each and every weekend? >> the government can't afford the pension plans, the so-called safety net, things on fuel not based upon income. you have relatively low economic growth. france is a microcosm of southern europe. this is a country that's really torn apart. >> their fear of immigration? >> absolutely. >> richard, donald trump has vetoed a bipartisan measure to end american support of the war. the saudi war in yemen which

we're come poliplicit in, such tragedy. what do you make of this move by donald trump to invoke the 1973 war powers act? >> it's interesting. you're right. the yemen war is a humanitarian tragedy, and a strategic nightmare. americans -- the war is not going well. the saudis after years an years of hoping for a military victory worse off. iran is more involved in yemen. this is a rebuke not so much of the president though in part, really of saudi arabia. it's a vote of no confidence in the crowned prince of saudi arabia after the journalist's murder. >> it seems like he's bolstering the worst of the saudi impulses.

>> we've given an embrace uncritical of what they did in lebanon to the prime minister in yemen. and i think what you see is congressional -- bipartisan, it's interesting. the united states is not involved directly in the sense of having troops on the ground. we're not flying planes in the air, but we're complicit. the saudis could not do this without us. t not working in the long run. coming up, it's the time 100 issue. the magazine breaks down the most influential people of the moment, and we'll break down the list straight ahead on "morning joe." d on "morning joe. it was here.

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welcome back to "morning joe." let's get a check on other stories making news this morning. more than a dozen denver area schools are closed today as the

fbi and authorities in colorado race to find a woman who is said to be infatuated with the columbine shooting. the 18-year-old traveled from miami to the state earlier in the week ahead of the 20th anniversary of the deadly mass shooting at that school. they believe she brought a shotgun and ammunition once she arrived. officials add that the threats were not directed at a particular school. prosecutors in the wide ranging college admissions scandal say actress felicity huffman should get prison time. court documents show prosecutors believe that huffman should get between 4 to 10 months behind bars for paying $15,000 to get one of her daughters unlimited time for her s.a.t. test. according to "the new york times" prosecutors plan to push for the low end of that range. and thousands of messages reveal that chicago prosecutor kim fox was intertwined in the

jussie smollett case. weeks after allegedly recusing herself. released after a freedom of information act request the unearthed messages show she painted him as a washed up celeb that lied to cops. fox also insisted that smollett's numerous felony charges were, quote, excessive in the case stacked against him. now to tomorrow's expected release of a redacted version of mueller's report. joining us now democratic congresswoman debbie mucarsel-powell. good to have you back on the show. >> good morning. >> what are we bracing to not see tomorrow? i think there's a drum beat leading up to the mueller report. sort of unavoidable because people would like to see anything more than what the attorney general summarized about the report. have you heard anything about

what we're expecting? >> at this point i haven't. i can tell you that we expect to get a full release of that mueller report, four pages of a letter that was released by attorney general barr was just not enough. and we don't know what's going to happen. we don't know what we're going to receive. but we are ready to take the necessary steps if we don't get the information that we have requested. and we have made it very clear that this falls under the jurisdiction of the judiciary committee. there's precedent for this. i want to remind my colleagues in the judiciary committee both democrats and republicans that when we requested reports, when we were conducting investigations under the nixon presidency, under the clinton presidency, that we were able to get all that information, and we must find out what happened during those 22 months of the mueller investigation. we expect to get all the

information in that report tomorrow, but if not, we are ready to take the steps we need to to find out what happened. and to get to the bottom of the investigation. >> all right. >> representative powell, if tomorrow seems to be the case, you're going to get a report or a copy, a version of the report that's going to be redacted quite extensively. what do you do then? terms of you just said we want to get the full report. obviously everyone wants the full report. we're talking about a pretty considerable length of time in terms of subpoenas, going to court. both sides, aren't we? >> yes. and unfortunately if we must use our subpoena powers, we are going to have to do that. and i wonder if it's just a tactic to delay releasing that information. i think that the attorney general has shown us that he has been chosen by this president for a reason, and it was very clear to me when i saw his testimony a couple weeks ago when he was making insinuations

that were false about spying under the -- during the campaign, it showed us that he was actually appointed for this position for a reason, and it is to protect the president. so we have to be very careful. i hope that we get the information that we're requesting. if not, we are ready to use our subpoena power to get that full redacted report. not redacted but the full report. >> congresswoman, i'm curious to stay on this topic, you've got various democrats with -- who have varying levels of enthusiasm for trying to make this issue, the issue of the mueller report, and the -- trying to get as much of it as possible into the public. making this an issue you have to grapple with for months as we get closer and closer to the 2020 presidential race. how concerned are you that as important as this report is, and i think we all agree it's super important the public see as much of it is possible, that it could

end up consuming a lot of time that democrats might in their political interest be better served talking about issues like health care, like the economy, places where the president is vulnerable and issues on which democrats have an advantage? >> yes. i'm so glad you asked that question. i was just yesterday having a conversation in my community in key west that although we discussed getting the full mueller report, that's not the main focus of the judiciary committee or the democratic caucus and the house of representatives, that we have been working. we started under a government shutdown for the first five weeks we were unable to get to work for the american people. once we reopened the government, one of the things we've done is introduced a bill that deals with lowering health care costs, protecting individuals with preexisting conditions. i have talked to my community every time i come back to my district about listening to different health care providers and listening to constituents that are concerned about the attacks, that the republicans

continue to conduct against the affordable care act, and i have the second largest number in my district, we have the second largest number of of people that get their health care through the aca. so when i'm here at home, when i'm meeting with constituents, when i'm meeting with community leaders, i am talking about bringing wages up. reducing health care costs. working for the people. and -- which is why it's not my main focus, and the judiciary committee also will be introducing having a markup for the dreamers and nps bill. we're talking about immigration issues. i'm always talking about what's happening in venezuela. it's one of the most serious issues in the western hemisphere. it is not my main focus or the main focus of the democratic party, but we have to conduct oversight. it's one of our responsibilities, especially in the judiciary committee. it's why we need the report. we need to find out what

happened. it's for i think the american people owe -- they're owed the truth and we have to have transparency. having said that, i can tell you that we are constantly working on the issues that we were elected to work on which is working on health care, dealing with the issues of climate change. i'm right here in key west and i've been touring different navy facilities because one of the things that they must do is to conduct a study on the resiliency of their structures. it's a matter of national security for us down here in key west. >> congresswoman, you just brought up immigration, and attorney general william barr has decreed that asylum seekers will not be allowed to post bail. and you just last week attempted to visit a government-run center for migrant children in your district where they were denied access. what can you tell us about your attempt with that visit and about your thoughts on attorney general barr's decision? >> we have the homestead

detention facility which is right now holding minors under the age of 18. about 1600 of them between the ages of 13 and 17. and when i heard that they wanted to add an additional 1,000 beds, i was extremely concerned, especially because i toured the facility in february, and i already had very serious questions to the department of health and human services. and i haven't received many answers. and one of the things i wanted to do was see an understand where they wanted to fit 1,000 more beds. we need to invest resources and make sure these children are reunited with family members, with sponsors, and we're not doing that. those kids are being held for months in this detention facility, and it has to give all of us just some pause that this detention facility and others around the country are being managed by a for profit company. if they were to add an additional 1,000 beds, it means we're paying the federal government -- the federal government is paying this company over $2.5 million a day

to keep children behind bars. behind fences. and when i heard that the attorney general now wants to keep asylum seekers, when they have every right to request asylum, it goes against everything the immigration attorneys and immigrant advocates are advocating for, and giving authority to dhs when we've already seen the issues that have come from this cruel policy, these cruel immigration policies that have been instilled by this administration. i am extremely concerned by what i heard this morning. >> totally agree. congresswoman thank you so much for being on. come back soon. >> thank you, mika. thank you very much. up next, what would hillary clinton say about nancy pelosi or warren buffett, about lebron james? that's the beauty of time magazine's annual issue. profiling the world's most influential people. we'll show you who is on the list and who is writing about

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departme department? >> the primary concern, mika, is reportedly on antitrust concerns. that is this deal, this merger, could be a threat to competition in the industry and potentially harmful to consumers. just to back up here, sprint and t-mobile are trying to get together -- this is the number three and four biggest wireless carriers in the u.s. verizon and at&t are one and two. "the wall street journal" is reporting the department of justice officials do have concerns. they don't have the final word here though. the situation is this game had been tried before. back in 2011 at&t tried to buy t-mobile. the obama administration blocked the deal. this is the trump administration's shot at approving it. and a new wrinkle is the companies are arguing if they get together, they'll have more scale to fight international companies on 5g, which is the next gen wave of high speed, low-lag wireless.

i also wanted to mention this gigantic story in business today and that is qualcomm and apple have settled their years' long dispute. why is this so important? this was one of the most epic rights ever over intellectual property between two behemoths. qualcomm is the number one supplier of mobile chips into iphones and everything e8s. it's seen as a big victory for qualcomm. stock went up 23% on word of a settlement. it will be a big deal in the market today. what does it mean for consumers, maybe those 5g phones can come faster because qualcomm does make those chips. now that they have a peace treaty with apple, maybe apple can produce them even faster. samsung is working on one that could be available this year. >> great. thank you very much. now to "time" magazine's 16th annual list of the world's most influential people. joining us is editorial director of the "time 100" dan maski.

thank you for being on the show >> good to be here. >> what you write about the people, some are intuitive and some are counterintuitive. what you got? >> there are so many pairings this year. you said the top 100 but we like to think 200 because as you mentioned so many writers themselves are intellectual. >> you have hillary, nancy pelosi. love it. >> hillary and nancy pelosi, hillary ran against pelosi in 2010 but since they they've both been so much, i thought it would be interesting to return to that. sally yates on bob mueller. there was a huge incident with the department of justice and she really says mueller is great at his job and he will do a great thing for the country and she's a big believer in him. >> beyonce and oprah -- >> beyonce and michelle obama, yes. that's one of the great bylines,

right? who better than beyonce to speak to michelle's trail blazer and michelle two years after leaving the white house has the best-selling memoir of the year and on track to becoming one of the best-selling memoirs of all time. >> and justin timberlake on tiger woods. >> there you go. >> you can imagine like pretty recently, that's one of our quickest turnarounds ever. as justin timberlake, it's one of the greatest comebacks in sports history. >> and the youngest person on the list -- >> 16-year-old greta sunburg, the climate change activist who really sort of captured international attention at davos and has been the force behind the youth-led climate change strikes. who better to be face of that movement than somebody 16 with her whole life to live. >> here's my favorite pairing, warren buffett on lebron. tell us why that makes sense. >> the best thing about "time 100" you can't be on the list for just doing one thing. lebron is not on the list for

being a basketball player but opening his school. warren buffett, who met lebron james ironically ten years ago when they were shooting on the court together talks about lebron is a great leader and role model and who better to praise someone's leadership skills than warren buffett. >> and "time 100" is always an exciting list to be on. >> i came in 101. just missed the cutoff. happens every year, just misses it. 101. >> was there a large debate before i dropped to 101? >> yes, it was a huge staff controversy. i was rooting for you. >> mike's always just on the other side of the bubble. >> you have elizabeth warren. she writes on aoc, i love that. >> sort of one progressive trail blazer to another and she says aoc is just getting started. >> chris christie on donald trump. does he draw the line again and live in both worlds? >> he does. >> oh, my god, i have to talk to him. chris christie, i'll talk to him right now. cut it out. it's one or another.

you can't have both. not in this world. and then there's republicans and democrats and trump-land. i don't know who the other is. you can't bring both sides together when there's this other weird side that we don't know what we're doing here because there's a lot of lies and misdeeds and untruths and un-american, unpatriotic, perhaps even trees us nous thin going on. chris, come on the show and talk about it. i digress. >> he talks a lot about -- he credits trump with the north korea nuclear incident. >> really? by what, not gaffing? okay. >> i will bet you jordan peel on spike lee is far more interesting. >> jordan peele on spike lee is a great peel. who better than jordan peele, who right now had a huge suck suss with "us." >> jordan peele, the new "twilight zone" reboot i think will be incredible.

>> rod rosenstein on the attorney general of the united states. >> yes. r rod rosenstein, he talks about how the rule of law will be secure under barr and, of course, with the mueller report coming tomorrow and barr releasing the summary, that's a very interesting time to be talking about his employment. >> leonardo dicaprio on jane goodall. >> leonardo and jane goodall have been friends over climate change. >> he's really into it. >> he is. and jane, wildlife con ver vaguvagu -- conservation. >> and tim tebow and joanna gains. >> tim was on their show "fixer upper" and talked about irinfluence, love they spread and homes they design and they're about to launch their new network, magnolia network. >> "time magazine's he most 100

influential people" is out now. dan, thank you very much. our final moments, quick, john heilemann, go. >> i'm telling you, huge mistake not to have barnacle on the list. if put him on the cover, duane johnson, other covers who have blown him off the newsstand to go crazy. >> he's trying to cover his tracks since he dropped a lot of op oppo. barnacle some. >> i'm anticipating tomorrow to a certain except but, not a large extent, because i'm sure it will be largely be redacted. i would hope everyone in our business would sit down and take the time to read what we can read before we start shooting off at the mouth. >> that's the thing, i would like to end the show with a message 0 our friends and colleagues who are covering the show and doing what they can and best work we're seen in decades. this is a challenging time. by the way, we will have tim ryan and mayor pete on the show. s this great to have positive,

uplifting stories other than trump. but as we cover this and get ready for the mueller report, it is being released tomorrow. we will be building up to it and wondering what's in it and wondering what we see, it will be redacted. it may not see a lot and we've got to take it as it comes. if the president is acting erratic, it may be he's very upset about what's in the report. it may be he's just erratic. that does it for us this morning. stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now. >> thank you very much, mika. hi, i'm stephanie ruhle with a lot to cover this morning. starting with 24 hours to go. the redacted mueller report expected to be released tomorrow but both sides have already prepared their responses. president trump's legal team already has a 35-page counter report, while democrats are set to issue a subpoena to get the full document as early as friday. and why is the fbi on a hunt for this 18-year-old woman, and