i look at joe, i don't know about him. >> if he looks young and vibrant compared to me i should probably go home. >> the push for impeachment. what a new poll says about what americans really want. >> plus sentenced. the russian woman who tried to infiltrate american politics finally learns her fate. new this morning, a poll just out shows a majority of americans now oppose calls for congress to launch impeachment proceedings against president trump. 56% of americans say congress should not begin impeachment in the wake of special counsel robert mueller's report. adam schiff addressing the dilemma democratic leaders are now facing. >> if we don't impeach him, that sends a message that this kind of conduct, this obstruction of justice, that this is non-impeachable. at the same time if we do impeach him and he's acquitted as he likely would be acquitted

then the message is those are not impeachab offenses. at the end of the day there's only one way to deal with this problem whether we impeach him or not is to vote him out of office. >> the numbers shows the president's credibility is taking a hit. 58% of americans believe he's lied to the public about matters under investigation by the special counsel. this as the president continues to blast that investigation. >> they tried for a coup. didn't work out so well. and i didn't need a gun for that one, did i? >> so there you heard the applause. here's former defense secretary and cia director leon panetta responding to what people are saying about that report. >> the president really treats the american people like we're all chumps, and that somehow he

can say whatever he wants, and that, you know, the american people will accept it. >> also this morning new questions about what rod rosenstein did to stay in charge of the special counsel's investigation. "the washington post" reporting that the deputy attorney general told the president quote i give the investigation credibility. i can land the plane. now a former chief spokesman at the doj under obama now questioning rosenstein's approach. >> the way to understand rod is that he's weak and always been wage. he was weak at the beginning of the investigation when he signed off on the comey firing and gave the president the excuse despite having read the mueller report why he fired comey. it was over the russia investigation. >> today president trump will be rallying in green bay, wisconsin as he skips the white house correspondent's dinner in d.c. for yet another year. meanwhile the secret service detaining the man who owned the phone anthony on the stage as the president walked out for a

speech at the nra's annual meeting. that 31-year-old denies throwing the phone and claim that someone actually stole it. let's get straight to the white house now. nbc's hans nichols. we're talking about rosenstein. when we talk about that matter what more do we know what exactly went down? >> reporter: morgan, good morning. we are learning this morning about what rod rosenstein told the president back in september when his loyalty was questioned. now a lot of this is coming from both the "new york times" and "washington post". this morning "the washington post" is basically saying rod rosenstein promised something to the president. i can land the plane. i give this investigation credibility. the question is, how far did he go? did he promise the president a certain outcome in the mueller investigation? we obviously don't have a direct transcript of this call. what we're doing is relying on "washington post's" reporting. they have people familiar with the matter. rosenstein was trying to save his job.

remember back in september the "new york times" reported that rosenstein had suggested wearing a wire. now on thursday night an event up in new york rosenstein admitted he was under a great deal of stress and pressure but also critical of the news media in this entire process. >> some of the nonsense that passes for breaking news news today would not be worth the paper it was printed on. if anybody bothered to print news these days. one question i have yet get from reporters is, is it true that you got angry and emotional a few times over the past two years. heck, yes. didn't you? >> reporter: now rosenstein made a couple of other remarks on thursday night. he was critical of the obama white house saying it was under their watch that this russian interference happened and also seemed to contradict the general view here at the white house that interference didn't tip the scales, the election and just a few facebook ads in the words of

jared kushner. he also said we just know the tip of the iceberg of russian interference in the 2016 election. >> all right. that was hans nichols. joining me now is congress reporter with politico and chief white house correspondent with bloomberg news. thank you both for joining us this morning. sara, let start with you. "the washington post" reports that rod rosenstein not only discussed the mueller probe with president trump but reassured him he gives the investigation credibility and quote can land the plane. sara how concerning is this? >> this is something that house democrats are certainly going to be infuriated by especially after the way we saw attorney general bill barr come out of the gate after the mueller report and he was showing so much support for president trump he was using president trump's exact wording to say there was no collusion. so the democrats were already highly skeptical of the way doj has been handling the situation and to have this report come out certainly going to be driving

fuel to the fire here and democrats will be seizing on this in the next several days. >> which is interesting. you hit the nail on the head when you talk about the skemt m skepticism. rosenstein was a witness in this investigation. could he have been compromised? >> in the broader sense of the wore it depends as to when we're going to hear from special counsel bob mueller testify before congress. look the calls up on capitol hill for there to be public testimony from the special counsel are only intensifying. lawmakers are set to return from recess this week. beyond that attorney general william barr set to testify publicly again for the first time before congress following the release of this report on may 2nd. so, i think that these questions are going to be asked of these officials. but i also think that poll in particular the majority of americans more than half of them saying they are not necessarily, you know, supportive of there being brought articles of impeachment as of now is

something that a lot of democrats are heeding to, including house speaker nancy pelosi. look she's a political referee. she's got to navigate the calls on the campaign trail and the calls within her caucus for there to be impeachment while also trying to manage policy initiatives that are set to be coming, being brought to the discussion. she's going to be meeting one-on-one with president trump this week, this week at the white house. speaker pelosi and president trump not talking about impeachment but infrastructure. >> sara, what are your thoughts on this. we're talking about pelosi becoming a referee. what does this mean for the integrity of the doj's investigation? is it compromised? >> well that's something house democrats will be trying to figure out, of course, as they go ahead. they have a lot of plans to bring in more witnesses, more officials, more former officials for a slew of hearings in the next several weeks but it's not year if they will get any of the witnesses they are asking for. it's not clear if bob mueller

will testify on capitol hill. these are the big questions that democrats have to wrestle with as they see these new poll numbers. that poll included 62% of democrats who do support impeachment. that puts a lot of pressure on pelosi from her left base. at the same time she's protaekt lot of moderate freshmen democrats representing seats that were formerly republicans. she has a lot of moderate democrats that she needs to protect and only about 36% of independents want to see impeachment go forward. that's the number she's paying attention to here. >> you talked about that 62 number but 58% of americans who say that trump lied, of them 19% are republicans. is that actually more than you would have expected? >> that number, it does show, there are, of course, republicans willing to support democratic efforts here. that might be the never trump republicans we've seen. not exactly clear. these are only the first poll numbers we've seen because of

the holiday weekend and some delays to get to andy poling here. so it's going to be a demographic we're watching closely. only 10% of republicans support impeachment. even if you have republicans say more than that number, 19% saying they believe that the president lied, only 10% believe that they think impeachment should go forward here. even in the republican party some of their numbers are split. >> kevin i want to go back to the point that sara was making about the numbers thinking the president lied. 58% of americans in that poll think the president has lied to the public about matters under investigation by the special counsel. so does this show us, kevin that people really aren't buying the administration's messaging in the wake of the report's release? >> yes. i mean look, you don't have to look at the polls. go to the dinner conversation of any political family around the country when folks are talking about the mueller investigation. to both points that both of you are making in terms of how this

would move forward the question for democrats right now is if they pursue impeachment and i want takes more than a year, virtually every source that i talk with that works with this white house says bring it on because it would last more than a year. there's no way that there would be a conviction in the senate, the republican controlled senate. then you're right up against the 2020 presidential. so you got republicans saying bring it on. you got speaker pelosi walking a very narrow tight rope. the folks who are out on the campaign trail. when i talk to staffers of the campaigns of senator elizabeth warren, bernie sanders, to some extent former vice president joe biden they say they are listening to the frustration of what voters feel and the mistrust they feel of the administration but very quickly i would add they are also listening on the policy issues, on medicare, on the environment, green new deal initiative, affordability for access to health care.

they are hearing those issues as well. and i think we can't -- we can't note that enough. >> it's interesting you talk about the frustration because also when i'm talking to voters you hear the frustration around the lack of authenticity. i want seems with these polls that's also what the voters are trying to tease out. who is authentic and who represents my interest. i want to thank you both so much for joining us this morning. thanks for waking up early. fears of socialism on capitol hill. what republicans plan to do about it in a new book. stay with us. also just a quick programming note. al shortstopton will sit down with the leading 2020 contenders. watch "not just black and white" tonight at 8:00 eastern right here only on msnbc. one hour pickup order?

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president trump stepping up his attacks on democrats this week, doubling down on his unsupported claim that robert mueller's investigation started because of democratic opposition research. >> i really say, now we have to get down, because this was a coup. this was an attempted overthrow of the united states government. these are sick people. these are sick, sick people. so let's see what happens with mccabe and comey and brennan and clapper. they were in on the act. and let's see what happens and let's see how high it goes up. the biggest problem with the

mueller report he didn't mention any of this. he didn't mention strzok and page and mccabe and comeyen and the lies and the leaks and the overthrow. all right. so joining me now is jake sherman co-author of "the hill to die on the battle for congress and the future of trump's america." he's a senior writer for politico. thank you for being with us. let's get right into it. the president is vowing to fight all subpoenas from house democrats while accusing former top officials of attempting a coup. what exactly, jake, is his end game here? how are those accusations really going to affect the power dynamic between him and congress? >> i don't know what his end game is because it's not a sustainable position for the administration to say i'm going to ignore actions from congress, all subpoenas, all requests for testimony. i'm not sure how long he can sustain that and what his plan

is here. he he can try to take it to the court. most administrations, frankly, at least pretend that they are going to cooperate with congress and then don't. or do it in a limited accepts. so it's impossible to understand what the president is aiming for. furthermore if he want legislative accomplishments he has to in some way cooperate with congress. >> when you speak about congress what about the effect for congressional republicans. do the findings of the redacted mueller report shift the political calculations of congressional republicans in anyway? is there a threat of not having the president's backing? is it still a factor for those republicans up for re-election. >> no. overall republicans believe that the mueller report or at least they say the mueller report has exonerated the president and frankly they believe it exonerates their behavior over the last two years which has been to protect the president and not investigate him, not conduct oversight when they were in control of congress. i think they benefit politics

have swayed in their favor. >> what about the other side. what's your take on the divisions among democrats surrounding impeachment. we heard so much chatter about it. is it inevitable or expected they may overplay their hand? >> it's possible they overplay their hand. i think impeachment as i think in the last hour was discussed, there's a clip of adam schiff basically saying it's a really tricky political calculation for them. obviously, the president would be acquitted because the senate is held by republicans. so for at that lot of democrats they are banging their head against the wall and not something they want to do. >> let's talk about this division. you interviewed the president after republicans lost control of the house and he expressed relief thinking it might be more workable for him now i can say folks let's go. give me legislation. if we like it we'll work on it. was this the usual boasting from the president or did he think it would be easier to work with a

divided congress? >> far be it for me to get in the president's brain too much but he did say that. he did believe that republicans were too nit picking. he believes, he thought, he said that democrats would be able to give him bills and he would say yes or no, sign it or not. this was actually a real narrative coming out of the white house for months during the campaign season. republicans and the white house kept saying over and over again the senate is what matters, we're is going to lose house to and it's not that big of a deal and it was befuddling. now the president is facing a barrage of investigations that threaten to swamp the last two years of his first term and impact his re-election. it was stunning to hear how little he cared about it at that time and even after the fact. >> speaking of stunning i have to admit one of the most interesting parts i found, you spoke with mitch mcconnell and he's promising his constituents

if he's re-elected and continues to be the senator majority leader he'll block legislation that he teadeems as socialist. what about his own power. how the president has affect ed him being able to do his own job? >> mitch mcconnell have found many ways to navigate the trump presidency to his advantage. we detail this in the book. he reshaped the federal judiciary for decades to come in a conservative way and has used the president's kind of lack of understanding of washington and his, the fact that he's new to town to take over that process and that's been very advantageous for mcconnell. mcconnell has really used this presidency to achieve what he wants. it's been stunning to see him. it was never illustrated more than the kavanaugh episode which he worked with the president

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breaking news. 15 people are dead in sri lanka after troops raided a safe house for islamic militants that was linked to the deadly evide lly bombi bombings. the suspects opened fire. six children are among those killed. right here at home the truck driver arrested in a fiery crash that killed four people in denver will be in court this morning. 28 cars were involved in thursday's pileup after the semi-truck lost control while coming down a hill. police in california say an iraq war veteran who drove into a crowd of pedestrians did it

intentionally because he thought they were muslims. eight people were hurt in that crash. the driver now faces attempted murder charges and may be charged with a hate crime. the calendar says it is spring but hey look there's a winter storm that's headed for the midwest and that spring snow is expected to hit the dakotas and parts of iowa, minnesota and wisconsin including milwaukee and madison metro areas. also new this morning hundreds of students and staff members at two california universities remain under quarantine amid a growing measles outbreak. molly, what's the latest? >> reporter: two of california's biggest universities are still under quartantine and health officials are trying to reach as many people as possible. more than 1,000 college students and staff members have been told stay-at-home this week in one of the largest quarantine orders in state history. >> if you're not immunized

that's the risk. >> reporter: the message is loud and clear. >> we definitely know we have more people who knows not to be immunized. >> reporter: the head of the cdc and surgeon general all agree on one thing. >> they have to get the shot. this is really going around now. >> reporter: tift biggest outbreak since the cdc declared measles eliminated in 2000. 695 cases so far this. 38 students infected all cat state and los angeles. >> i remember when i got the email i called my mom. did you hear. there's a measles outbreak here on campus. she was shocked. >> reporter: this is the bolter hall. it's back open. this is the building where the infected students took classes.

they contacted about 500 people both students and faculty in case they have been inside the building at the same time. the case in los angeles stem from two carriers who arrived here on international flights. officials trace their moments and those that couldn't prove their immunity were forced into isolation. >> you're not getting vaccinated you'll get sick. >> reporter: the cdc say it's more than probably 90% of univaccy natured individuals exposed to the virus will contract measles. measles is one of the most contagious viruses on earth. now with the blanket quarantine over those cal state students specifically this morning still in effect they warned anyone who done obey the legal order to stay-at-home in isolation off public transportation they will be prosecuted. they are not messing around. >> that's nbc's molly hunter. back to washington and the white house. vowing to stand in the way of newly launched congressional investigations including several

by the house oversight committee. right now the president is suing over subpoena for his financial records. senior adviser steven miller will not testify about white house immigration policies. and the top justice official won't testify about adding a citizenship question to the 2020 census unless his lawyer is present. the administration prevented a former security specialist from facing questions about how he handled white house clearances. joining me now to unpack all of this, a member of the oversight committee, congresswoman kellie. first and foremost a lot of these trump legal battles they can extend well into 2020 and i want to play something that you said to our colleagues over at "morning joe". let's take a quick listen. >> we talk about fines. talking about actually putting people in jail. that are not cooperating. and i think that if we have to go to that extreme we should go to that extreme. i don't think anyone wants to do that. i can't tell you how that would

happen but i just know it's a tool in our tool box. >> so what, in your opinion, would actually be the tipping point to sending officials to jail? >> i think at the end of the day if they didn't cooperate, if they never showed despite the subpoenas, despite our asking, despite fines. as i said yesterday no one wants to see that happen but it's time that, you know, we need to put country over politics. republicans need to join us. and finding the truth. we owe that to ourselves. we owe that to the american citizen to really, as you said unpack the truth. >> when we're talking about the truth here something we cannot escape is this speculation and this chatter around impeachment. do you believe that the president has committed an impeachable offense? >> i think that 90% of me believes that. i mean i haven't seen the

unredacted mueller report but i think that, but i do agree, with speaker pelosi, we need the investigation, do thaergs, do that first and see where that ladies us not jump right to impeachment. and especially as you're polls have said the american people really don't want to see that. i'm counting on the ballot box to remove donald trump next year. >> so relying on the ballot box and not impeachment. >> unless there's something that comes up that i don't know about. >> that we don't know about. okay. you're also on the front line. you're out here. you're talking to your constituents. you're trying to do your job every day. is this talk impeachment hurting your ability to do your job. are you afraid this talk of impeachment will overshadow the policy ideas you're trying to put forth >> back in my district with my constituents we're talking about

health care, we're talk about economic development, we're talk about gun safety, we're talking about the environment. some people talk about impeachment. a lot of people would like to see him go that support me but they also realize there's other things going on. and when we took back house to, we took back the house talking about health care and raising wages and infrastructure and those kinds of things. so we have to pay attention to that also. >> which is interesting because that's also what we saw when we were spread out throughout the country talking to people during the mid-terms. you have in your district people in urban areas, rural areas, what do you think the ratio is? are they more concerned with the president and what he's doing or are they localizing the issues and saying no i care about what's happening here in my district on the ground. >> my district is urban, suburban and rural. they are concerned about the president and still can believe he's the president or they don't like what he's doing. but they have to face their every day needs around health care, around having a job,

having job skills, education. you know that's something that's local and they have to deal with every day. so just their quality of life is what people are looking at. >> they are also aware some of these things when it comes to their quality of life they are being affected by washington, the decisions coming out of the white house. >> definitely. >> i want to play you a piece of sound that the president just said yesterday. can we click on. that for a minute, please? >> i let everybody testify. there's never ever been transparency like this. no obstruction, no collusion. total transparency. the history of our country there's never been a president that's been more transparent than me or the trump administration. >> i cannot get past this issue of transparency. this is what we hear as reporters from voters. they want to talk about transparency. they want to talk about people shaking up the machine. how do democrats in your position confront trump's

messaging while also not overplaying their hand when it comes to things like we talked about impeachment? >> first of all, and i respect the office, but he lies so much. what he just said is a lie. he's not transparent. and he's not honest. but i think that, you know, we have to be able to walk and chew gum at the same time. yes we have to do the investigations and hearings and those kinds of things but we also have to prove to the american people, to our constituents, we know how to govern and move this country forward. i think we've done that. we've shown in the first 100 days with some of the things that we've passed like the background check bills, and hr-1 dealing with ethics, and violence against women's act, so we are moving. we're really multitasking, passing what we need to pass, and it's very difficult since the senate is not, you know, passing anything, and doing our

investigations. we just have to keep doing both but it's very important and we don't have a lot of time that we prove to the american people that we know how to govern and move this country forward. >> all you congressional leaders on both sides of the aisle have your work cut-out for you. let's talk about why sorry seems to be the hardest word for joe biden right now. is it his achilles heel? we'll break it down. that's coming up next.

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ten detailed acts of obstruction of justice. robert mueller's report lays out a roadmap for impeachment proceedings against this president and challenges congress to do its job. i'm tom steyer and we can't let this president destroy the public trust, break his oath of office and get away with it. congress has to do its job and hold him accountable. please call them at this number. tell them to get going.

fresh scrutiny of 2020 candidate joe biden after his recent talk with anita hill. biden is asked about that conversation which his campaign said came over the phone in recent weeks after anita hill told the "new york times" i can't be satisfied by simply saying i'm sorry for what happened to you. i'll be satisfied when i know there's real change and real accountability and real purpose. here's what joe biden had to say. >> i'm sorry she was treated the way she was treated. i wish we could have figured out a better way to get this thing done. i did everything in my power to do what i thought was within the rules, to be able to stop things. >> i think what she wants you to say is i'm sorry for way i treated you not the way you were treated. that would be closer. >> but bu, but, i'm sorry in th

way she got treated. if you go back to what i said and didn't say, i don't think i treated her badly. >> all right. so joining me now is information ceo of the dnc, also the former executive director of emily's list and adrian cohen a "boston herald" radio host. with those comments coming from joe biden will they go far enough for democrats if not for anita hill? >> well i think there's two pieces to this dialogue. the first obviously is between the vice president and between miss hill and i think we have to take her at her word in terms of an apology and what feels authentic and sincere to her and the timing of that. i think she's owed an apology and we can all agree on that. but the second part of this is, how do you run for president in 2020 in this new era, in this moment and the vice president has a 40 year history that's going to be looked at and talked about and this is one piece of

that. i think miss hill is not wrong. i think he's continuing to work on that. i think he's probably got still more work to do. i don't think we can forget what we're up against here which is a president accused of sexual misconduct by 23 women. his cabinet is down. half of the women have left. we have to understand so the dynamic we'll be facing and the vice president has some work to do and i think we'll see that work along trail over this next year. let's not forget what we're up genes. a president that's shown himself to be anti-woman not just in his presidency but over the last 30 years. >> you say he's shown himself to be anti-women which a lot of biden supporters would disagree with. >> i'm talking about the president not joe biden. the president has shown himself.

>> okay. any trump supports would say the same thing. i want to go back to this four year history. biden was questioned about women who accused him of unwanted contact. >> here's the deal. i have to be and everybody has to be aware of private space of men and women. look, i'm really sorry if they, what i did in talking to them, trying to console, that, in fact, they took it a different way. >> i'm sorry i invaded your face. >> so i invaded your space. i'm sorry it happened. but i'm not sorry in the sense that i think i did anything that was intentionally designed to do anything wrong or be inappropriate. >> adrian, the big question is, is this enough? are you sensing a theme in his response to these women and to

anita hill? >> yeah. i believe, you know, it was a non-apology and basically that's going hurt him because it's going to turn into a protracted apology tour and instead of moving forward and talking about his positions and what he wants changed in america, should he be elected, he's now going to -- we're going backwards 28 years ago. >> we heard him kind of addressing some of those pest there. also when it comes to republicans, are their hands tied when it comes to the debate on this one? i mean especially when it comes to as we heard president trump's own history? >> no, not at all. first of all, i have to push back on some things that were said. president trump has empowered more women. it's a powerful executive positions in his administration that he's not getting credit for. gina haskell made history as the first woman as the head of cia.

also look at the unemployment rate for women. it's at a historic low. so that empowers women by giving them financial opportunity and ability to achieve the american dream and achieve financial independence. that should be applauded by all women. so i don't think he's anti-women whatsoever. he's done more for women in the past two years than president obama did in eight. look at the poverty rate under president obama for women. i hold that up against president trump any day of the week. so i want to say that. but with respect to the allegations of sexual misconduct against president trump, 99% of these allegations are false. they are unsubstantiated. show period one woman that can prove he did something wrong? i would like them to come forward. look what happened with -- >> where are you getting the 98% of those allegations are false. where is that coming from. >> show me one that's actually true that's been substantiated

and corroborated. show me who they are. and, you know, look at joe biden. there's just -- anybody can go to the internet and find a laundry list of him touching young women and girls inappropriately. that will hurt him in the me too era. he better tread carefully because if he wants to dish it out to president trump bush >> vice president biden is no predator. those'ses don't exist around him. we need to be careful about this. that does not exist around him. i think that as we move forward through this campaign all democrats including vice president biden but every single democrat that's running has a better record in support of policies that support women, in supporting and uplifting women. in terms of women in trump administration a lot have left. we tuned culture that's there right now. i welcome that debate to have -- welcome that debate in the next year and a half which party will be better for women. this election will be decided by women. this is a really important

debate to have. >> i want to jump in here for a minute bus also, i appreciate your response. adrian i want to go back to something you said about this unemployment rate. remember we talk to trump surrogates and supporters. if he's talking about black people. first thing he says is look at this unemployment rate. he takes credit for this low one employment rate. is there not a difference between policy and rhetoric? where do you draw the line, adrian? if you're saying i'm having these policies that you claim are supporting women and some people are claiming it supports african-american you hear this rhetoric many say is very problematic. how do you, why do you put more weight on the alleged policy than the rhetoric? >> well we just have to look at the facts. if you look at the bureau of labor statistics, the unemployment rates for women and african-americans are historic 50 year low. president trump created over 5 million new jobs.

we're at a point now where there's too many jobs, basically, we have more jobs available than people able to fill them. that's a good thing. that gives all americans choice and mobility. not happy at your job you can switch your job. negotiate higher wages. look at the fact wages are up for women, for all americans. so this is something that helps women. so many -- >> i'm hearing your point but i see jess shaking her head. i want to make sure we give the last word. >> let's talk policy for one minute in terms of policies that help women. we need an increase in the minimum wage. we need equal pay for women for equal work. these are things that republicans and trump administration don't support. violence against women. republicans consistently kill the violence against women on. joe biden has led on. we're happy to have that conversation not justin political rhetoric but on the policies themselves. you know the trump administration is no friends to

wlem it women whether it's about pay, position or how we treat women in this country. >> what's also interesting while we're talking mostly about joe biden and the president in this discussion is also going be very interesting to see how the 2020 field plays out with the number of female candidates who are also running and how that changes our conversation. thank you both for joining us this morning. so she is the only russian sentenced to prison in the false out from the mueller investigation but why was maria butina an alleged threat to america? we'll have that and more coming up next. it's just that it's... lavender. yes it is, it's for men but i like the smell of it laughs ♪

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legends aren't born, they're made. ti butina was sentenced to 18 months in president, alleging she worked to benefit the president in russia while working in the u.s. elections. joining me is danny ceballos. butina got credit for time

served but what does that tell you for her actions generally speaking? >> the judge gave butina the sentence the government was asking for, 18 months. it's in the range of sentencing guidelines even though the guidelines are a little hazy in this case because this is not an often-prosecuted crime. the reality is butina was not a spy. the government acknowledges that. in fact, all of the action she took on behalf of the russian officials in the russian federation would have been legal if she simply notified the attorney general. it was the failure toe notify that created her crime. 18 months, i guess as a defense i'm i'm somewhat biased, maybe a little high compared to what the defense was asking for but it was exactly what the government was asking for. >> you talk about this caveat about the failure to notify and i think that's a really important point. when you say it's a little bit high, she did plead guilty, so

should she really have served 18 months? would that have been a more appropriate sentence then say the nine months she will serve? >> she pleaded guilty. in addition she cooperated, she gave substantial assistance, which gives a potential unlimited reduction in the ultimate sentence, nonviolent crime. her defense attorneys had a solid ground to argue for a sentence, guideline range of zero to six months. even at six months then with the nine months already served, she would have been let out. so 18 months is a substantial period of incarceration, exactly what the prosecution was looking for, even though she had substantially assisted the government. >> but is there any lasting threat? i mean because what i do find interesting is she will be immediately deported back to russia at the conclusion of her sentence. what does that tell us about the concern the judge had about her being the u.s.? >> it's a fascinating issue. i had it come up in my cases

where a defendant is sentenced and immediately after that sentence, they are deported. so we're willing to spend the money to incarcerate this person but we're going to send them out of the country immediately afterwards. seems like we can save a few bucks and just minimize the sentence and send the person out of the country. really, the judge's hands are tied. this is the kind of conviction that results in an automatic deportation for somebody in butina's position, citizen status or nonstatus. she will be deported. that is the law. it's not necessarily a discretionary thing the judge imposed. that's the way deportation proceedings work after a crime like this. >> quickly, why not deport her right away? why not wait? >> as a defense attorney, i often wondered the same thing if the law required deportation. it's interesting our philosophy of criminal punishment requires we hold on to the person, pay to

incarcerate and house them for just long enough we feel the sentence is just and then we spend the money to send them back to their country. it seems like a large expenditure of money for punishment. but then again under the principles of punishment retribution, we must hold that person for as long as we deem it, society deems it necessary they pay their debt to the american public. >> danny, thank you as sauls for the good discussion and waking up to early this morning. appreciate it. next up, the $2 million question. we're talking about a hostage that north korea wanted the u.s. to pay. you seen my glasses? i've always had a knack for finding things... colon cancer, to be exact. and i find it noninvasively... no need for time off or special prep. it all starts here... you collect your sample, and cologuard uses the dna in your stool to find 92% of colon cancers. you can always count on me to know where to look.

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it's everything a small business owner needs. comcast business. beyond fast. that will do it for me on this hour of "weekends with alex witt." now it's time for "up with david gura." and candice is filling in. good morning to you, candice. sfloo > good morning, everyone. this is a special edition of "up with david gura." we begin with a report that rod rosenstein said, quote, he could land the plane when it came to the mueller