tv Weekends With Alex Witt MSNBC June 16, 2019 9:00am-11:00am PDT
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that is our show for today. thanks for watching. "am joy" will be back next saturday, 10:00 a.m. eastern. up next, frances rivera has the latest. >> thank you very much. good to be with you from msnbc world headquarters in new york. it is high noon in the east. 9:00 out west. welcome to "week jeends with al witt." why the president is calling the story virtual treason. >> yes, i did. you should read it too. look, article 2, i would be allowed to fire robert mueller because they were looking to get us for lies, for slight misstatements. >> new polls about the president and the distance between him and the democrats. plus, a new promise from democrats about closing the wealth gap between black and
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white americans. new today, a clear picture of how americans feel about one of the questions consuming washington. whether to start impeachment hearings. a new nbc news/wall street journal poll found overall 27% of americans say there is enough evidence to begin impeachment hearings now. that's a 10-point increase from last month. almost all the growth in support for impeachment came from democrats. 48% of them wanting impeachment hearings now. that's an 18% increase from last month. but more americans, 48%, oppose starting proceedings. and the president's approval rating remains virtually unchanged at 44%. also new today, abc news released a new portion of its interview with president trump. he doubled down that he never suggested firing the special counsel, despite what was detailed in the mueller report. donald trump citing the constitution's article 2 which establishes the power of the president of the united states. >> article 2 allows many he to do whatever i want.
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article 2 would have allowed me to fire him. i wasn't going to fire -- you know why? i watched richard nixon go around firing everybody and that didn't work out too well. >> so president can't obstruct justice? >> a president can run the country. and that's what happened, george. i run the country and i run it well. >> when the president does it, it is not illegal? >> i'm just saying a president under article 2 is very strong. read it. >> also new today, the trump re-election campaign is cutting ties with some of its own pollsters. that after internal polling was leaked. nbc news obtained new details of that march polling. it shows the president trailing biden in 11 crucial states. separately a new fox news poll released today shows five democratic candidates ahead of the president, some within the margin of error, but biden is ahead by 10 percentage points. the new york times is standing by its reporting that officials from the administration and pentagon did not fully brief the president about increasing u.s.
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cyberattacks against russia. let's bring in mike viqueira at the white house with more of this story. mike, what more do we know about this? and the fears of what would happen if the president had that information? >> reporter: so many interesting wrinkles to this story, as the u.s. and russia escalate their cyberwarfare, happening below the surface. this stems from a new york times article that came out late yesterday. the the u.s. authorities telling the new york times the u.s. is increasing cyberintrusion into russia and the power grid. why? it wants to send a message to moscow to stay out of the american cyberinfrastructure. the article went on to say president trump was intentionally left in the dark. here's an excerpt from the article now. pentagon and intelligence officials describe broad hesitation to go into detail with mr. trump about operations against russia for concern over his reaction. and the possibility that he
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might countermand or discuss it with foreign officials as he did in 2017 when he mentioned a sensitive operation in syria to the russian foreign minister. late last night, president trump was tweeting about this "new york times" article, as he has, calling it the failing "new york times" and denying the story altogether. he writes do you believe the failing new york times just did a story stating the united states is substantially increasing cyberattacks against russia? -- attacks on russia? this is a virtual act of treason by a once great paper so desperate for a story, any story, even if bad for our country. also not true, writes the president. anything goes with our corrupt news media today, they'll do or say whatever it takes without even the slightest thought of consequences and concludes they are the true enemy of the people as he often does. now, today, many republican officials, steve scalise, tom cotton, senator, steve scalise,
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number two house republican, and secretary of state mike pompeo were all asked about this story. and whether or not this was actually happening. here's the secretary of state. >> i never comment on intelligence matters, having come from being cia director, i know how important it is. but you should know and your viewers should know the united states of america under president trump has taken enormous effort to ensure that our elections are not interfered with. not from russia, not from any other country in the world. it is a serious matter. one that this administration took seriously at the direction of president trump, from the very beginning of his time in office. >> so one consistent talking point from every republican we heard from today on this issue is that they blame president obama for not doing anything about it in 2016 campaign. they say president trump is doing plenty about it. but just to review here for a moment, it is almost hard to believe, the new york times reporting an escalation by the u.s. into cyberwarfare with
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russia and intentionally keeping president trump in the dark. frances? >> we'll see how precedented this is when we talk about it. want to bring in liz goodewin and laura bassett. to that point, laura, how unprecedented is something like this, keeping this type of information from the presidentt absolutely stunning. it is unimaginable that this is supposed to be the commander in chief and he's actually seen as a liability to the country. his own intelligence officials don't trust him with this information, so they're going behind his back and stopping russian interference into our elections because they believe either he's going to -- either he's going to mess up the program deliberately or unintentionally. they don't trust the president of the united states. we have never seen this before. >> speaking volumes with that. what do you suppose this story came out? we heard that maybe the message being sent to russia, would that
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be the sole purpose here? >> it is interesting that sending a message to russia might be part of the intention here, just so that russia knows, you know, the u.s. has this capability as 2020 is getting closer. there also could be an intention to send a message to the president himself that this is happening, whether or not he's on board. >> what would the risk be with holding this type of information from the president? >> the rift? >> the risk. what would the risk be? >> oh, yes. it seems like they purposefully changed part of the law in the last defense appropriations bill to allow these kinds of cyberoperations to go forward without the president's say so. so i'm not sure if president trump is aware that that even happened, and letting him know that might, you know, bring forward the risk that he can try to reverse that decision and he would, again, assert control over cyberoperations.
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>> would it be an intention as far as having this leak out there, just to put the president in a bad light? >> i'm not sure if that's the intention. i think they clearly want russia to know and maybe they don't care whether the president knows as well. >> laura, i want to turn to you and talk about the poll numbers, the new ones we were mentioning, including this one, showing support for impeachment and how that is growing. so what should democrats take away from this, laura? >> i think democrats failed, right out of the gate they should have read the mueller report as elizabeth warren did and made a decision on impeachment. we he had all the information in the report, he hasn't said anything new. there were certain politicians that knew immediately upon reading the report there were enough illegal activities in there to warrant impeachment. and nancy pelosi has been dragging her feet and saying, we'll watch the polls, the american people aren't behind us, this is a case where you lead the american people, you are the one that is supposed to read the report, outline what is illegal in it and tell the american people this is what is appropriate.
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i think democrats' failure to act has confused the american public. they're not the ones that are supposed to understand how this works. >> digging into that, let's dissect that more for you, liz, 44% of independents say that they have oppose holding impeachment hearings. is this the key demographic here, the party sees a shift with independents on this. how is that going to move the needle or will it either way? >> i do think that independent number is something that democrats are watching closely because going into the elections, that really matters. not in the primaries, but the general election. and i think with some democrats arguing, if you have an impeachment hearing, you make the case to the public and that's how you move public opinion. it is not going to move on its own, people don't have time to read the entire mueller report. regular people, you know. and so i wonder if we're not going to see much movement in the absence of some kind of public impeachment trial. >> you consider that, and the
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fairness of nancy pelosi saying independents aren't for it, where do you see that in terms of the push for impeachment? >> i agree with liz. i think the reason independents aren't for it, like she he said, people deposit read the mueller report. we know there are people in congress who didn't read the mueller report. it is incumbent upon those who know the law, who read the report, who are supposed to be leading this country, to move public opinion themselves by making a strong case for why this president shouldn't be in office. that's what they have failed to do and i think the polling numbers are reflecting that right now. >> with those numbers, laura, you can touch on this a little bit, when it comes to the trump re-election campaign, cutting ties with some of its own pollsters after you have that leaked internal polling, the president was trailing joe biden in 2020, critical battleground states, what do you think was behind the leak from the first place, knowing this was internal? >> what was behind the leak, trump's administration has been leaking like a fire hydrant since day one. i think he has employed a lot of
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people who don't necessarily like him, don't necessarily trust him. and so they're going to the media and saying, look, this is what is going on. i think trump has a tendency to not believe numbers he doesn't like, doesn't believe news reports he doesn't like and he saw numbers that didn't look good for him and said we're going to twist this for the public and obviously some honorable people in there who said, no, we're going to show people what really happened. >> do you think that will do it, liz, as far as, you know, putting a little piece of tape on the leaks and getting rid of some of these pollsters? how common is it to be having somebody internal like that leak information? what happened here? >> it sends a message, i would say, to the remaining pollsters that the president does not want leaks and there is consequences. but i think the larger problem is if your campaign team feels like you're not going to listen to them, if you come to the candidate and show, listen, we have a problem here, look at wisconsin, look at iowa, look at these numbers, and those people are brushed aside, that is going to lead to this bottleneck where
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people feel like they have to go outside to the media to get the candidates' attention. so without addressing that problem, you know, it is hard to see that this would -- this problem would be over. >> and given that, laura, talk about what those numbers, that was from march, those numbers here, you think that will put a fire under the president as far as biden being his number one threat right now? >> from his tweets, it is clear that he's terrified of biden. he sees biden as his biggest threat. that's what the polls are showing now. i think things will change as the debates -- we're about to have our first debate, biden has benefitted from name recognition right now. so we'll see how that shakes out. i do think that trump is scared and shaking in his boots and should be, the numbers are not looking good for him right now. >> elizabeth warren right there behind him. thank you so much for starting us off today. >> thank you. >> new reaction today from president trump on whether he thinks he'll be prosecuted when he's out of office. i'll put that question to former
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that's 120 dollars less a year. better, faster. i mean sign me up. comcast business. beyond fast. you're not worried about being prosecuted once you leave office? >> i did nothing wrong, george. did nothing wrong. no collusion. you don't even hear russia mentioned anymore. russia is not mentioned. now it is all about obstruction of what?
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there was no crime. there was no collusion. the big thing is collusion. now there is no collusion. that means they set -- it was a setup. >> new reaction from president trump defending himself against facing possible prosecution after office. it comes after senator kamala harris said if elected, her department of justice would, quote, have no choice but to pursue obstruction charges against the president. joining me now is joyce vance, professor at the university of alabama law school, and also former federal prosecutor. joyce, i appreciate your being with me here. let's talk about what you told congress that there was sufficient evidence in mueller's report to on tanbtain a guilty verdict. do prosecutors ever weigh public sentime sentiment. different but for a specific purpose here. >> i think it is less a consideration of public sentiment and more a consideration of what best serves the interests of justice.
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so in reading the mueller report, i can look at the obstruction evidence and see how it would be possible to make a case. but these decisions will have to be made, if they're ever in fact made by professional prosecutors, who are looking purely at the available admissible evidence at the time that they're making that decision. and that needs to be left to career prosecutors and attorney general as opposed to a decision that is made for political reasons. >> how much weight would be placed on public sentiment given that they want it to be done, over with, after the president leaves office? >> for me as a prosecutor, that's just not a consideration that i'm authorized to make under the law. i would have to look at the law, at the evidence and have some consideration of how the national interest is best served. you'll remember at the end of the bush administration there was talk about torture and the torture memo and the decision was made by attorney general holder not to pursue charges
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because it was thought best to go ahead and let the country move forward. those sorts of concerns are always appropriate to consider. >> i'll ask you more about kamala harris and her comments. even if she or any other candidate wanted the doj under their presidency to prosecute a former president, was this comment the best approach and in essence couldn't a former president here, trump, use this in court against the department claiming it is political because she was running against him? >> so i may have interpreted her comments a little differently. i saw her saying she had looked at the evidence and felt like there was evidence that would force prosecutors to indict. i think that's a very different thing from saying that as president you would order an attorney general to indict, which would be in my judgment the wrong way to go about this. needs to be left up to prosecutors, not the politicians. >> i want to ask you about the hearing where you helped the americans understand the mueller report. let's play a little bit and get
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in your head on how that was. let's listen first. >> the special counsel's team wasn't able to find collusion between the trump campaign and russia, but apparently you did. >> so mueller in his report is careful to clarify he's not making any decision about collusion. he's making a decision about whether or not he has evidence to indict the crime of conspiracy. if anyone other than a president of the united states committed this conduct, he would be under indictment today for multiple acts of obstruction of justice. >> take us inside your mind set here, leading up to that. your concerns that it would be a tough crowd, your preparation, was it like prosecuting a case, different or can you even compare the two? >> it was a little bit more like an oral argument where you're talking about the law with the panel of appellate judges, but in this case, the panel, congress, didn't want to confront the issue that we were there to discuss. there was virtually no conversation about obstruction
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of justice because the evidence is relatively clear. instead, they kept trying to make this point that mueller had found there was no collusion, which is, of course, not what the report finds in any way. >> was there preparation for it any different? did you find yourself prepared, of course, but taken by surprise by anything there during those hearings? >>. >> i'm old school. i believe in being overprepared. it is important to have these exchanges. i was disappointed that republicans were not interested in discussing the evidence of obstruction. and evaluating the law in that area. they just really wanted to stay away from it. >> back to the president and that interview. not answering the other question about whether the president can obstruct justice. let's take a listen to that. >> look, article 2, i would be allowed to fire robert mueller, assuming, assuming i did all of the things i said i want to fire
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him, number one, i didn't. he wasn't fired. okay. number one. very important. more importantly, article 2 allows me to do whatever i want. without bringing up article 2, which absolutely gives you every right. >> so a president can't obstruct justice? >> a president can run the country. and that's what happened, george. i run the country and i run it well. >> when the president does it, it is not illegal. >> a president under article 2 is very strong. >> the president there saying he believes this amendment gives him unlimited power. help us understand this part of article 2 that gives a president license to -- is he wrong here? would you know any other lawyers or counsel who would see it in that way that he does? >> the president is not a constitutional scholar and his interpretation of article 2 is flawed. even his attorney general, william barr, wouldn't go so far as the president seems to go saying he can do anything he wants to do. the reality is that there are
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actions that a president could take that would violate the law. he could order a u.s. attorney to indict one of his political enemies when there was no evidence to indict them. that would be a crime. he could accept a bribe in exchange for an appointment of a supreme court justice. i'm just making this stuff up, but that would be a crime. his power is not limitless and he is accountable under the constitution to both the executive branch and the courts and ultimately to the voters. >> joyce vance, thank you for helping us understand the breakdown there, as always. i appreciate it. thank you. >> thanks, frances. >> no health care, no raise. it is a battle cry for one lawmaker now trying to prevent bigger congressional paydays. pt bigger congressional paydays
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there's no such thing so start driving and don't stop. because no one takes off at the finish line. and the only way to get that trophy, is to take it. net generation. official youth tennis of the usta. nearly 2 million demonstrators today filled the streets of hong kong, propesting a proposed bill that would allow criminal to be extradited to mainland china. secretary pompeo said the president may discuss this at the upcoming g-20 summit. take a listen. >> going to get the opportunity i think to see president xi in a couple of weeks now at the g-20
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summit. i'm sure this will be among the issues that they discuss. we see what is happening, what sun folding in hong kong. we're watching the people of hong kong speak. >> some would call the decision a victory, many took to the streets nonetheless after last week's protests turned violent. now to capitol hill, there may never be a good time to give congress a raise, but it has been ten years since members have gotten even an increase for cost of living. house leaders from both parties negotiated a deal to allow pay to rise with inflation. some lawmakers are opposing it. one joins me now, job harder, democrat from california, he defeated an incumbent republican in 2018. i appreciate you being with me. we talk about the reason behind your opposition. is that because you fear backlash from your constituents? >> absolutely. look. before i came to congress, i worked in business. and in business you give an employee a raise after they have done a good job. i don't think the people from my
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constituency are looking at congress today and thinking that we have actually completed our mission. we got to make sure we're lowering the cost of health care and giving access to everyone. then talk about giving ourselves a raise. >> the argument is from some of your democratic colleagues that the pay raise will prevent high turnover among congressional members. wouldn't that help in the effectiveness of congress and getting things done, like you just mentioned. >> we need to make congress more effective. we do that by making sure we're getting big money out of politics, by making sure we're enacting real campaign finance reform, that's what we got to do if we're going to end corruption and making sure we're making congress more responsible to people's needs. we don't do that by giving folks a blanket pay raise. >> so house democrats, leadership, in favor of this. what have you told them and do they deserve a raise more than nearly elected representatives?
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>> i told them what i'm hearing from my constituents, before we do anything else, we got to prove to folks that we can do the job. we can lower the cost of prescription drugs, we can make sure every american has access to seeing a doctor. that's what i got elected on. i went in a district where 100,000 people would have lost health insurance if the affordable care act was repealed. that's what i ran on. that's what my other colleagues across the country who flipped seats like mine ran on as well. we got to make sure we are building that trust before we're trying to do anything else. >> what would be your level of sacrifice as far as those who have been around, those who have seen accomplishments made and seen progress made, would you be willing to give up your raise to those? >> i look at what we see right now, the average american makes $60,000 a year. congress already paid three times more than an average american family. i don't think that we need to be using this time as an
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opportunity to pay ourselves more money. i think we should be focusing on how to put more money in the pocketbooks of ordinary americans. that should be the first job. >> i want to talk to you about the calls for impeachment here and the divide in congress between those who want the impeachment hearings and those who you may not. let's listen to what alexandria ocasio-cortez has to say. >> speaker pelosi said so far, she seems to be really holding the line, she's not ready to do that. >> i think it is quite real. i believe there is a very real animus and desire to make sure that we are -- that we are holding this president to account. >> what is your level of agreement with that? that there say real animus on how to hold the president accountable? >> i absolutely think we have to hold the president accountable. i don't think anybody can read the mueller report and not walk
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away disgusted by the corruption in this. the next steps on the investigation are to make sure that attorney general barr is testifying, making sure we're bringing mueller in front of congress, making sure we have an unredacted mueller report to get all the facts on the table. we can't just let that be the only thing that we're focused on. we also have to make sure we're holding the rest of the administration's feet to the fire for what they're doing to hurt everyday americans. >> with that said, knowing that there is call for the president to be held accountable, do you sense this divide between nancy pelosi and other progressives? >> i don't know if there is a divide. everybody has a different job to play. there are folks who are holding the epa accountable for what
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wheeler is doing to make sure that we're undermining the obama administration's rules against corruption and against pollution. that's what i think we need to be thinking about, is everybody has a different place to play, i'm not on the judiciary committee, but that doesn't mean that we're, you know, walking away to the beach, we can still hold this administration's feet to the fire. >> i want to ask you also about one of the headlines made out of the president's recent interview here, he talks about accepting foreign campaign for help. let's take a listen. >> you don't call the fbi. you throw somebody out of your office, you do whatever -- >> al gore got a stolen briefing book, he called the fbi. >> that's different. this is somebody who said we have information on your opponent. oh, let me call the fbi. give me a break. life doesn't work like that. >> the president appeared to back track on those comments. did you move you any closer to supporting an impeachment inquiry? >> the president should realize
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that that's a violation of federal elections commission to take any significant assistance from a foreign adversary. but, look, i think, again, what we got to be focused on is also the legislation piece. we got to be making sure we're bringing back the bacon for folks in districts like me, like mine, that we really ran on election based on lowering the cost of health care and making sure everybody had a chance to get insurance. >> last question as far as impeachment here, we heard from congresswoman ocasio-cortez who said among democrats in swing districts there have been a movement toward favoring at least opening an impeachment inquiry to find out what is out there. do you agree with that? what are you hearing about your constituents? >> i've done almost a dozen town halls in my district since being elected. and in those dozen town halls, i've gotten maybe one or two questions about the mueller report and what we need to be doing. i get an awful lot more about
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what we actually need to be doing to -- on health care what we need to be doing on education, what we need to be doing on infrastructure, and about these trade wars that the president continues to escalate, which are hurting farmers in the california central valley and everywhere else. i think we got to be making sure we're holding this administration to account. but we can't keep our eye off the ball, which is actually delivering on the promises that got us the majority. >> congressman, josh harder, we thank you for being with us on this father's day sunday. appreciate it. >> thank you. >> we turn to the road to miami. some candidates hitting the tv talk show circuit with ten days to go before the first debates. von hilliard joins us from amarillo, texas. he's hearing directly perfect voters about what issues matter most. what have you been hearing in the lone star state? >> reporter: good morning, frances. we're 2300 miles into this journey. we started in seattle, came down through oregon, california, arizona, nevada, we just wound
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up here in amarillo, texas, this morning. we're here, we just wrapped up service at metropolitan community church here. we're stopping in the bluest cities, in the reddest cities, asking voters what they want to hear on the debate stage at the end of the month in miami. i want to play for you a few folks that we met along the way. because we hear a flurry of issues discussed, but one of the prominent issues we continually hear is health care. this is what a few folks have told us so far. the critical issue on your mind? >> health care. >> pretty much across the board to support medicare for all. >> my daughters, we got off of it last year. >> why? >> it is too much. >> you're right now going without health care in. >> yeah. >> how is that? >> hard. you're always lingering. you're always thinking about what if. >> what have you thought of the republican efforts and donald trump's efforts to repeal the affordable care act? >> they're not proposing anything that i see that can
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counter it. since it is there, already there, it needs to be fixed. >> frances, that last gentleman you heard from, david kline, he voted for president trump back in 2016. he lives in las vegas, a swing state up for grabs in 2020. and i think what he's a testament to, this debate is a broader conversation beyond just democratic voters and this primary process. but there are republicans and independents in places like nevada, like here in texas, beto o'rourke lost that senate race by just 2.5 percentage points. you talk to voters, there is also independents and republicans who are paying attention to the debate stage and want to hear what the democratic alternative is. that's pretty much the sentiment we have been hearing from the blue states down to the red states, all the way, on our road to miami. >> we're just ten days away. von hilliard for us, thank you. four top democratic
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>> we have an entrepreneurship gap in america. african-americans are about half as likely to own their own businesses, to start their own successful businesses. what is the reason for that? it is capital. and why do we have that kind of black, white wealth gap? a big part of it is because of discrimination that was actively fostered by the united states government, that kept black families from being able to buy homes, and to build the wealth they would have built generation after generation. >> joining me now is jonathan alter, columnist for the daily beast and msnbc political analyst. also policy strategist aliana beverly. she worked for the obama administration and amy holmes, former speechwriter for bill frist. to all of you, welcome, as we jump into this starting with aliana first here. how significant is that we're not talking about one or two
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democratic candidates, we're talking about a group of them and ways to close the wealth gap. who will voters believe can deliver that promise and how can they make their message stand out with so many of them? >> i think black voters are testing the waters and going to kick the tires on each of these candidates. i think it is remarkable and fantastic that we are in a place where the democratic candidates are recognizing that structural discrimination does exist, and that the average black household only has about 10% of wealth of the average white household. and that -- the reasons for that are because of generations of structural discrimination that have been executed by an american government that has been complicit in this experiment. and so we are -- we're excited we have candidates that are speaking to ways to have racially conscious policies to affect generations of racism in the american government.
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>> we're seeing these four candidates here, i want to talk about who is not there, joe biden, kamala harris, bernie sanders, they didn't attend. and in essence, they did send video messages, but is that kind of like phoning it in, was there some of the messaging there that lost some impact because they weren't present? >> i don't think you can be too hard on any of these candidates for missing this forum or that forum. the big event actually in south carolina is coming up next friday, that's when congressman jim clyburn has his famous fish fry. and all of the candidates, except steve bowlic, are going to that. that politically -- that's the really important one. you're right that i think african-american voters in particular expect these candidates to be very specific in what they are proposing. and this is one of the reasons why elizabeth warren is, right now, surging in some polls because she has a plan basically for everything. and when she said on -- at this event, i have a plan, before she
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even began to outline her plan for small business, african-american and other minority small businesses, people are already cheering. because they know that she is actually addressing in very specific ways, you know, these charges. other candidates are also outlining plans but they're behind her on the specificity. >> also -- just to jump in there, jonathan, i wanted to remind our viewers also that pete buttigieg released a plan this week, the douglas plan named after frederick douglas, his plan would increase entrepreneurship in the african-american community over ten years, and also ensure that it is investing in ensuring there is $660 billion of an increase in black wealth. >> that's the hope there that -- >> the other candidates all have plans. so don't want to short change them. but this becomes a useful exercise for the democratic
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party because it is substantive. it is not about image and superficial things. it is about where people really live and what is so interesting about this year, frances, is that voters are rewarding specificity. that's a good thing. >> it is interesting, you ask the president, amy, about that, he says, hey, things are going well with minorities. when it comes to a plan, pitch for 2020, this is what he had to say. >> what's your pitch to the swing voter on the fence? >> safety, security, great economy, frankly i think we're going to do tremendously now with african-americans, with asians, with hispanics, because they have the lowest unemployment numbers they have ever had in the history of the country. >> that's the pitch? >> no, i have no pitch. you know what i have? the economy is phenomenal. we rebuilt our military. we're taking care of our vets. we're doyne the best job that anybody has done probably as a first term president. >> amy, you got a new poll showing him with 32% latinos,
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17% with african-americans. is that going to cut it? >> it is higher than i would expect for president trump with african-american voters in particular. but he now has a record to run on. back in 2016, his pitch to african-american voters was what have you got to lose? which is kind of the opposite of specific. when he talks about african-american economic gains, it is true, the unemployment rate among african-americans is at an all time low. and in 18 states, it is actually below prerecession levels. that's just part of the picture. 2014 census data shows african-american poverty is at 27% and when you look at single female households, black households, that goes up to 37%. so there is still a lot of work to do there. we're talking about, you know, entrepreneurship, small businesses, which of course is excellent for the african-american community. and in particular being your own boss, so you're not as exposed to some of the structural racism
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that the other guests have been talking about. but we also have, of course, this poverty gap and interestingly when you look at married black families, that number goes down to 8%. so what kind of policies can we implement that will encourage marriage in the black community. >> we have to wrap it up. want to give you the last word when it comes to that. >> i would also -- i agree with amy, i would say that unemployment is still twice that in the black community as it is in the white community. trump put brown children in cages and he just invited foreign interference in our elections and democracy actually is a black issue too. >> aliana, jonathan, thank you. part of this mark zuckerberg video is fake. have you seen it? it looks and sounds real. could sophisticated phony videos
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i'll say hold are you. she'll say i'm four and a half. i say no you're not. t she grabs my face and says four and a half. >> that was also a kind of schwarzenegger a bit. >> i'm four and a half father. >> this video has racked up over six million views. it shows snl star doing an impression of schwarzenegger but if you look closely, you can see his face morph right into schwarzenegger's face. congress holding the first hearing focused on videos like they. they are called deep fakes. videos that look incredibly real. joining me now is computer science professor at uc berkeley. professor, thank you for being with us and helping us to understand how these are made. that video that we just showed was greated by a graphic illustrator from the czech
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republic saying it only took a few days using free software that anyone can use. is it really that easy to make? >> it is. it's the classic story of automation where we have taken out of the hands of the hollywood studios and the experts the ability to create fake videos and turned it over to intelligence and they can make very sophisticated fakes. we have always been a i believe to manipulate media but you now have a real threat. when you add on their ability to distribute it around the world to tune of millions of views, now you can see how this can start to threaten our upcoming elections. >> i want to bring that up. axios found that 2020 candidates have done little when it comes to these types of videos and the spread of deep fakes. how devastating would this be when it comes to knowing that
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people, my mother would believe that in a second. >> yeah. that's right. here is what i can tell you. we have seen the impact of the fake news phenomenon over the last two and a half, three years. we have seen its use and interfering with elections. we have seen it lead to violence in myanmar and the fill poophil. inject into that these compelling videos. if somebody releases a video of the president or a candidate 48 hours before the election. even if it's debunked, you can't put the genie back in the bot e bottle. that's what concerns us about this tieechnology. >> a lot of us saw the deep fake video of mark zuckerberg giving
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about the power of facebook. the video still up on instagram. what's the responsibility of social media companies handling it and the measures that can be put into place to stop it. >> that's the right question to a ask. if you read their terms of service, they will tell you you're not allowed to post things that are misleading or fraudulent. baked into their terms are pretty good policy. they will unwilling or unable to enforce the policies at scale. we saw this with the video of speaker pelosi. it wasn't a deep fake but meant to be fraudulent. i think they will have to wake up and start getting more realistic and responsible with how their platform is being weaponized. >> you also have to consider the involvement, the responsibility from the government. the house intelligent held their meeting on deep fakes.
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how can that be straddled? in there's ve in. >> there's complex issues. when the government starts telling the companies what to do, now we have first amendment expression issues. we have to balance those. we want to have things like sapphiis satire and political commentary. i think we have to think very hard about this and try to map a strategy forward and i'm fearful that the tech companies have been dragging their feet knowing the problem was coming and here we are not too far away from the plars. i don't think we have the technology or the policies in place yet. i think time vuping out. >> it's a tough one. thank you so much. the newest 2020 poll still has joe biden at the front. who is right behind him? it may surprise you. o is right ? it may surprise you. introducing the all-new 2019 ford ranger,
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more calls to begin impeachment hearings on president trump. now the results of a new poll and how it may sway house democrats on the fence. >> i did nothing wrong, george. i did nothing wrong. there was no collusion. >> reacts to a question facing prosecution after office. why he says he can do whatever he wants. why wasn't he told the u.s. is getting ready for a cyber
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showdown with russia and the president was kept in the dark. good evening to you. welcome to weekends with alex witt. alex is office today. new today into how americans feel about whether congress should start impeachment hearings, a new nbc wall street journal poll found that overall 27% of americans say there's enough evidence to begin impeachment hearings now. a ten point increase from last month. almost all the growth came from democrats with 48% of them wanting impeachment hearings now. that's an 18 increase from last month. more americans, 48% oppose starting proceedings. the approval rating remains unchanged at 44%. a democratic congressman who defeated an incumbent run in 2018 said he's not ready to support opening impeachment hearings. >> i don't think anybody can read the mueller report and not walk away disgusted by the corruption that is
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indemonstratic indemonstratimmi this investigation. we can investigate and legislate at the same time. that's what we need to be doing. >> abc news has released a new portion of the interview with president trump. he doubled down he never suggested firing the special counsel despite what was in the mueller report. >> article two allows me to do whatever i want. article two would have allowed me to fire him. >> it sounds like you -- >> i wasn't going to fire him. i watched richard nixon firing anybody and that didn't work well. >> a president can't obstruct? >> i run the country. >> when the president does it, it's not illegal? >> a president under article two is strong. read it. >> the trump re-election campaign is cutting ties with
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some of its own pollsters that after internal polling was leaked. nbc news has obtained details. it shows the president trailing biden in 11 crucial states. a new fox news poll shows five democratic candidates ahead of the president. some within the margin of error but biden is ahead by 10 percentage points. officials did not fully brief the president about increasing u.s. cyber attacks against russia. what more are we learning. >> reporter: this a story about the daily cyber wars between the united states and russia and some apparent misgivings in the white house about telling the president a lot of secrets, a lot of details because this deals with russia. the story says that the united states in recent months has stepped up its intrusions into the russian power grid by putting malware, by inserting
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computer code that gives the united states an opportunity to exercise some controls and cause discorruptions in truptions in russia. the concerning part of the story is the quote that talks about the president. it says that pentagon int intelligence official didn't go into detail for concern of his reaction for the possibility he might counter man or discuss it with foreign officials as he did in 2017 when he mentioned a sensitive operation in syria to the russian foreign minister. president trump has reacting saying in a couple of tweets. do you believe the failing new york times stated the united states is substantially increasing cyber attacks on russia. this is a virtual act of treason by a once great newspaper so desperate for a story, any
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story, even if it's bad for our country. the president saying not true. anything goes with our corrupt news media today. they will do whatever it without the slightest thought of consequen consequence. i should point out in times reporting they made a point of saying that national security officials who they spoke to said their reporting wasn't a national security concern because the officials wanted russia to be aware of this intrusion. aware of this cyber attack by the united states if they weren't already. >> i think the intelligence community is training its focus and resources on the russian threat even if the president isn't. i can't comment on whether the new york time s accurate or inaccurate but we have had a heightened focus on russian med
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-- meddling. what i found disturbing about the new york times story was the fact that security officials with the administration felt they couldn't tell this to the president because he might compromise that information with a conversation with the russians or countermands their military decisions because of the president's attitude. >> reporter: we've not confirmed this reporting. very deep reporting by the new york times but they point out in their story, they say that national security officials told them that they were not concerned about this information being revealed publicly. his critics have said in the past he reacts. >> john, let's start with you.
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can you talk about the president keeping this critical information from a president of the united states and what it says about their relations between the intelligence community and fear whing what t president might do with it if he knew it. >> it's part of a broader pattern where elements of the government act as if the president is not president. many times and we have seen this in some of the reporting about books from the administration that aides will keep information from the president. they will try to ignore some of his orders to them because they think they are unwise. the story about gary cohen keeping a letter about a trade deal off of the president's desk so he wouldn't act on it. i think this is case where national security officials believe there's a threat from russians. every one is uncertain about the
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president's relationship with the russians given what happened in the campaign and his financial relationships with russians in the past. i think they are trying to be prudent about this and hope they don't find the administration getting counter manded. it's interesting to hear the president come out and say this wasn't true. doebts don't know whether that's defending his ego on that score or whether he wants it not to be true. >> what's your take on the reason why this was leaked? s is it targeting russia and putting them on notice? >> i think it's pretty specific into the deep dive into the war we're in with russia now. if anything that was an
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indication, sort of a shot across to signify we're prepared for any sort of digital cyber intrusion into our electrical grids and we can take counter measures and response. the president coming out and calling this treasonous is directly contradictory to what the national security council was trying to do and proves this point of why the president was being kept in the dark about all of this. >> i want to talk about the new poll numbers including one that shows the president trailing a handful of democratic candidates. you have the numbers right up there. bide p ahead by ten points. the president has been touting his economic growth under his administration. doesn't seem to be helping him there. why is that not sticking? >> first of all, growth is slowing down in the economy. we had 3.1% in the first quarter
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of the year but all the signs indicate that the second and third quarters will be much lower than that. for one thing the trade conflicts which have caused the markets to bounce up and down for several weeks now, that's one threat as well as a global slowdown. that's one reason it's not helping him so much. we have seen that americans are reacting to donald trump's personal conduct and behavior. not so much he acting to the day-to-day or month to month state of the economy. give tennessn the way he behaves why we see him falling behind. >> given that, what's the level of nervousness that the president should have when it comes to the poll numbers.
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>> it's clear from his polling team there is a level of nervousness. i think that was the point of the leaks to begin with to sort of light a fire under him. give a sense of urgency he is behind in the polls. he hasn't been disciplined about the messaging. it's show ng these polls that people are ready to not necessarily support a democrat but to support the democratic party over trump. nbc news reported that you guys have written that the president is getting rid of those pollsters because trump is clearly in denial about these numbers which is the president constantly takes the pressures that are really counter productive to his success and the reality of the situation. >> we have seen that over and
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over again in this administration. today it marks the four years since this escalator ride to the presidency. figuratively a ride as well. how has your ride been since that? how unexpected is it that we're here at this point today? >> completely unexpected by me. i'll put it out there. when donald trump entered the race, i thought there was no chance he was going to win the nomination. i said it over and over. i thought after he acquired lead in the fall of 2015, i thought when he got closer to iowa and new hampshire that he would fall off and people would dismiss him as a serious candidate. did not happen. i did not expect him to beat hillary clinton either.
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pretty much everything about these last four years have been a surprise and a roller coaster for me. >> i was covering the campaign out of new hampshire. thank you very much. i have to say actually there was already a bubbling up, a small sort of grass roots movement that was gravitating towards the president. i do remember there was a trump office with designated parking spots to trump's suv. people were surprisingly flocking to him. it's not necessarily something that all of us -- he wasn't aur priority but the crowds grew bigger and bigger. my next assignment after that was in ohio. i remember the first few voters i spoke to, the second i moved into the state told me just how much they hated hillary clinton.
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i'll always remember that as we're in trump territory now. >> now some of this ride continues. some of us needing stronger seat belts. >> where were you? >> i was here. 30 rock in this building and clearly remember that day. we had a throw programming out with interviews with him. we've all got our stories. we thank you both. now to the battle for 2020. in a brand new poll giving fresh look at the democratic race in south carolina, joe biden leading the field with 37%. elizabeth warren is the closest behind with 17%. buttigieg and harris rounding out the top five. it's also a busy day for beto o'rourke as he makes multiple stops in south carolina.
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what are you see there? >> reporter: it feels bit like the calm before the storm. beto o'rourke, the only one of those 23 candidates actually out on the road today. we have seen him hit a couple of shops and in a black church. getting the african-american vote behind him will be so important. he's had a monopoly. i asked earlier today about being the only candidate out on the road today. take a listen. >> i'm relentless. this campaign is relentless. we're going to fight for people in this country every single day. do whatever it takes to bring folks into their democracy. today we're fortunate enough to
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do it in spartanburg and have a donut along the way. >> reporter: campaigning is always better with a donut. you go back to that south carolina poll. that's a big number for joe biden but it's not all roses for the former vice president. two things. number one, that number is trending downward from the last south carolina poll that had him up a couple more points. a lot of the folks who said they were supporting someone other than joe biden said it was because of concerns about his age. that he might be too old. that's not the kind of thing that's easy to address for a candidate. it's a fact of life. we see the same thing with bernie sanders whose support is slipping. if you were one of these other candidates, you still see the opportunity for movement. i have to think this is the dynamic we're looking at pm.
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>> thank you very much. now to comments about impeachment from a republican who once accused candidate trump of being unfit for office. has anything changed? anything cc three-point turn. -[ scoffs ] if you say so. ♪ -i'm sorry? -what teach here isn't telling you is that snapshot rewards safe drivers with discounts on car insurance. -what? ♪ -or maybe he didn't know. ♪ [ chuckles ] i'm done with this class. -you're not even enrolled in this class. -i know. i'm supposed to be in ceramics. do you know -- -room 303. -oh. thank you. -yeah. -good luck, everybody.
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use a little, pay a little. use a lot, just switch to unlimited. it's a new kind of network. call, visit or go to xfinitymobile.com. the president made very clear he's going to do the right thing. i have enormous confidence in that. i've watched him do it. >> call the fbi? >> i've watched him do the right thing. >> establishing a deterrent is
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very important but that effort to establish the deterrent is undercut when the president a monk ago told putin over the phone he city thinks the russian interference in our lelection ws a hoax. the president said he is still open to receiving foreign help and may or may not call the fbi. >> democrats like adam schiff still raising concern s of russian interference as the 2020 election gets closer. congressman, thank you for being with me on this father's day sunday. i want to get your take on this. not just your committee chair stance but the white house is insisting the president will do the right thing every time. do you believe that? >> so francis, first i have to note the last time you interviewed me was mother's day and now we're here together on
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father's day. i guess i'll see you july 4th. i think that people in my profession, unfortunately, are too given to engaging in hi hyperbole was it was attention given. it saddens me even more today to suggest that what he said last week was downright un-american. we should call it for what it is. the fact of the matter is he admitted on camera he would be willing to participate in a crime. the chair of the federal elections commission said it's clear that you cannot accept cash or a thing of value as a matter of furthering a political campaign. that is a crime. the president came in for some rare criticism, whithering
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criticism from members of his own party and he attempted to walk it back. those are words that cannot be with drawn. that's a signal that's already been sent to our adversaries. >> the president said he would report that to the fbi and that's simply receiving information. what happened in 2016 is hillary clinton hired a foreign spy who then recruited russian spies to fab fabricate lies about her political opponent. >> your take on that. what part of this do democrats not want to believe or not want to hear? >> first of all, let's be clear. to my knowledge or recollection, senator cotton has not at one time in any regard or any instance ever disagreed with the president about his behavior related to the russian interference in our election. at no time do i recall him ever
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criticizing the president for calling out for the russians to get involved, for welcoming their interference and for benefitting from it. there is a bit of a credibility problem with the source on this assertion. >> there's nothing there. i want to ask you about the president standing firm that the mueller report absolved him of any crimes. doubling down saying he has a right to fire mueller. >> you can hire or fire anybody. >> the i veat's the position of of great lawyers. you have to have a position like that because you're the president. without even bringing up article two which gives you every right. >> a president can't obstruct justice? >> a president can run the country and that's what happened, george. i run the country and i run it
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well. >> invoking article two. what's your concern when you hear that? >> that the president continues to believe he is above the law and if there's anything that distinguishing this great experiment known as american democracy, the longest running democracy in the history of the world, it is that we function by the rule of law. every person within that society is subject to the rule of law. i dearly wish the president would read article two but even more so i wish he would read article one because the founders put the congress as the first article in the constitution because they expected it to have primacy. that's not the way our democracy has evolve ed over time. >> we got a new look about how americans feel about that. it's a ten-point increase from
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last month. has your position changed at all? are you ready for those to begin? >> we made get to impeachment or impeaecach ment inquiry. stop and this, if you will, about the success we've had in the last three weeks. we've had two successful court cases compelling them to cooperate. we've had two witnesses come forward both donald trump junior and hope hicks reach agreements with respective committees. in fact, we had two agreements with the department of justice about the production of documents that we had sought. our investigative efforts are bearing fruit and should continue. we have to follow the facts where they will lead. i will tell you that there are all manner of things that we do not know the answers to as it relates to what the special counsel may have discovered
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relating to counter eer intelligence. what we also know is that there were 12 investigates spun out of the mueller report and we don't know anything about what those may involve except u.s. attorneys throughout the country. there's a lot of unanswered questions. i think most notably is what the the potential conflict of interest that the president has had that may have motivated him for his open solicitation of russian participation in our election. >> i also want to you about the push for impeachment here in the sense of what senator lindsey graham had to say what about ha will happen if democrats bring up impeachment and keep pushes for that. >> mueller is the final word for me. everything the house is doing is politically motivated. i think most americans are ready to move on. to my democratic colleagues in the house if you bring up impeachment based on mueller report then it will blow up in your face.
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you're being unfair to the president an he's going get re-elected. >> do you see or fear that happening? >> so, i'm always a bit hesitant to attribute particular motives to fellow politicians when taking positions on people. try to take them at their word and evaluate the substance of their assertions. in senator graham's case what he is most focused on is a primary opponent in the 2020 election for himself and to assert that the mueller report exonerated the president which flies in the face of what over 1,000 and counting former u.s. attorneys have said about the president's repeated efforts to obstruct justice doesn't fly op tn the f of fact. >> hope you get a chance to enjoy it today. thank you. hitting back at russia. a new report about how the u.s. is using technology to beat the
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standing by its reporting that the u.s. is stepping up its cyber counter punch on russia's electorate power grid. they don't believe the president was briefed about it because they feared the president would stop the operation or discuss it with foreign officials. joining me is security analyst with msnbc. nicholas, thanks for your time this morning. talking about this new york time's report, it describes it as placing land mines in a foreign power network. can you break down what exactly intelligence officials are doing and the message being sent to russia. >> well, i'm not going to have a whole lot to say a bout the classified details but it makes sense that the united states would be one to develop capability that would cause us to have the capacity to punch back at the russians in the event of some kind of cyber
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conflict where we want to make a point with the russians. at the same time there's an important interest in creating a sense of deterrence as well. that's why i suspect some of this has made its way into the press. that the russians understand we have capability in this area. >> how does russia interpret this? >> well, it puts into their mind some degree of doubt. they now have to calculate as they choose whatever moves they choose to make how we might respond. that is the idea behind creating a sense of deterrence. >> is it possible that the officials didn't brief the president? they don't need his approval in. >> the reporting in the times piece was detailed and
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meticulo meticulous. up with of the things that was mentioned a couple of different times was the degree of delegation of authority that seems to have gone on inside the administration in terms of making decisions about these kinds of operations outside the white house and not necessarily requiring white house approval to carry out these decisions. we've heard before reports of seep your administration officials wants to steer clear of talking about certain topics with the president because of the way they feel he might react. >> it is odd that a president could comment at all? >> that's one of the things that was hard to parse from the president's tweet this morning when describing the news as inaccurate. it's not clear what he was referring to. is he arguing with the premise of the piece of the article? was he arguing with the bit that said he wasn't aware of it? what exactly was he unhappy with? it's hard to get all that information unpacked. >> i want to talk to you about iran. there's some democrat questioning the evidence including this video that the trump administration decided to
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blame iran for the tanker attacks. this morning the chairman of the house intelligence committee said the evidence is solid. here he is. >> there's no question that iran is behind the attacks. i think the evidence is strong and compelling. the problem is that we are struggling even in the midst of this solid evidence to persuade our allies to join us in any kind of a response. it shows just how isolated the yiet has become. our allies warned the united states. i think our i tell jens agencies warned policy makers this kind of reaction was likely a result of a policy of withdrawing from the iran nuclear agreement. >> is there enough intelligence made public for americans to come to the conclusion whether iran was behind tanker attacks and what about the allies? >> first of all, the stuff that chairman schiff said on tv i take at face value. it's important.
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this man has access to the most sensitive intelligence our community produces. i have tremendous amount of confidence if they felt the administration was cherry picking or misleading the american people with intelligence related to iran that we would find out about it. start with that. schiff makes another really important point and this is the who hole that we have dug ourselves into with the unilateralism when it comes to iran. when crisis moments come, and this is a crisis moment, we find it difficult to persuade our allies to see things the way we do. that's a problem. we're not going to solve this problem entirely on our own. >> watching to see how if those tensions escalate. thank you for being with me. more reason for president trump to dislike polls. at least the ones he calls fake. that's next. s he calls fake. that's next. ♪
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a new poll out today paints an ominous picture for president trump. the fox news poll sizing up the race for 2020 found that each of the five top democrats tested in match up against the president, beating him. joe biden ahead by ten points and bernie sanders by nine. the difference narrows for elizabeth warren and kamala harris and pete buttigieg buttigieg, but they each come out on top.
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welcome as we jump in with you first, amy. how do you make sense of those numbers? shouldn't an incumbent expect better numbers? >> no, not necessarily. we also have to remember, there's still over a year. a lot happens in an hour politically. we all know that. i'm not too worried. i haven't heard any other republicans that are too concerned as well. at this point in time in the race when president obama was running, he was down in the polls in state of nevada and ended up wipi inwinning the sta nevada in the end. we're not too concerned. >> talk about the significance of biden and sanders having the biggest lead. >> amy is right to the extent we're well over a year out. trump has got time to make up ground here.
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this is what i presume to be the result of the fact that donald trump has not done anything to expand his base. he won by the hair of his chiny chin chin in 2016. these polls show he's done nothing to expand his base. if i was advising trump, which i'm not but if i was, i would say, okay, the moment that you become the president, let's figure out how we can implement policies that will grow and expand your electorate. he's clearly done nothing to do that. he's done more to alienate potential voters than gain voters. >> let's hear from the president. this is where president trump thinks things stand light now. let's listen. >> even your own polls show you're behind, don't they? >> no. my polls show i'm winning everywhere. >> we have seen all the reports. there's 15 out of 17, you spent
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2 million and you're behind. d >> nobody showed you those polls because they don't exist. those polls don't exist. i'm losing in 15 out of 17 states. those polls don't exist. >> all right. we know nbc news obtained internal trump polling data from march that has biden leading in 11 key states. how the you read this? would that worry the trump campaign? >> i'm not exactly why the president decided to respond in the way that he did. i would much rather he just take it with grain of salt and do exactly what adrian and i just said. there's over a year still to go. there's so much ground to be made. i agree with adrian to the extent he can still work on expanding his base. there's so many positives he can be femaocusing on.
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i don't think he should worry about the polls at this point. >> how about the concern that trump campaign is cutting ties with their pollsters after those internal numbers leaked. is it fair to say that the leak is just one of their problems? >> well, yeah. i think it's one of many tr problems that trump is facing. i'm not sure how this data leaked. the sign of a good pollster is somebody who comes forward, a firm that comes forward and says here are your liabilities. here is where you stand. here is what you can do to imkbrooui improve your standings. the fact he turns around and calls them fake news demonstrates and tells you all you need know about the fact he's failed to learn anything about how to run for president since he's been in office. >> what put him in office was that moment that all of us remember. four years ago today, we're
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having a very different conversation about donald trump. this image here of him stepping on the escalator announcing his candidacy. amy, talk about your reflections on that day. >> like how you chuckled. we all did, including myself. now duo have to remember that not only is the president a businessman but he's also an entertainer. he knew how to set the scene. he knew how to set the stage. it grabbed the attention of the entire nation. whether we thought he was going to pull it off or not, he did it masterfully. i, myself, did not think he was going to win. i liked marco rubio and i like something about rand paul. i did not any that after watching he and melania coming down the escalator, he was going to be our nominee. i was a delegate for him but i did not think it was going to
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happen. >> you were hillary clinton's senior adviser, what were you thinking? how unexpected is it where we stand now? >> i was across the river here in new york in brooklyn in her campaign headquarters with my fellow campaign colleagues chuckling at the notion of donald trump running for president. by the way, let that be a lesson learned to everybody out there. you never know who is going to rise from the bottom of the pack and move to the front. i think part of the overall collective way that the media and pundits looked at trump and americans is nobody really took him seriously to the point that amy just made they couldn't get enough of him. he sucked up the media attention and became president. >> we have ask many of you that during the course of the day. that's one thing al you have can agree on. appreciate you being with me. thank you. the top secret connection
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between the u.s. government and kim jong-un's late brother and how president trump is reacting. d how president trump is reacting. change has many faces. names you'll never know. the bright-eyed, the brave, the visionaries. where challenges exist, you'll find them. at citi, we empower people who are out to change the world. because tomorrow belongs to those who welcome it with open arms. citi. welcome what's next
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president trump's attention. the book is "the great successor," a biography of kim jong-un by a beijing bureau chief. she claims kim jong nam was a cia informant for years before he was murdered. here is how president trump reacted to the information. >> i saw the information about the cia with respect to his brother or half brother, and i would tell him that would not happen under my auspices, that's for sure. i wouldn't let that happen under my auspices. >> joining me is the author, anna phi field. you quote an anonymous source for the explosive tidbit. did you get a sense of why he did it, he just needed the cash? >> i think he did need the cash. after his younger brother kim jong-un became the leader, he seemed to have cut off his older half brother who had been living in exile or kind of quasi exile.
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from other friends of kim jong-nam and business associates i introduced in the course of reporting this book, they also said he seemed to be a little down on his luck and a little short of cash in the last few years. so it may have just been pragmatic. >> you also wrote that kim jong-nam's sister couldn't and wouldn't talk to you. was that out of fear or something more? >> it was out of fear. she's been living in hiding for 25 years and defected from the regime. when i found them, the first question was how did you find us? they had been living entirely anonymously all this time. her husband said to me, look, listen, her brother was assassinated by this regime, her cousin, kim jong-nam was as sat nated. it's too dangerous for her to talk about kim jong-un. >> you write about his choold
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hood, normal aspects, liking whitney houston, james bond, "mission impossible." there was a stare-down with a sushi chef, his friends laughing at him. then they saw his temper. do you think president trump is naive about kim's ruthless side? >> i think he is. he's really tried to explain away kim jong-un's pru at that time. it is through this brutality that kim jong-un has managed to keep a hold on power in north korea. we've seen president trump say there are a lot of rough places out there or not as many places rough like north korea, so-called rough. i think president trump is maybe just out of pragmatic concerns putting aside all of this as he tries to make some progress on the nuclear issue. but i think it will do him well to remember that the 25 million north korean people live in really ep tick circumstances under kim jong-un. >> the president complimented
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kim jong-un last year about a warm letter. bloomberg saying it contains an interesting part he couldn't disclose. what was he referring to there? >> we don't know at this stage. donald trump has not disclosed this letter, but the previous letter that kim jong-un wrote to him was full of excessive flattery and praise, calling him your excellency, the best president ever. kim jong-un has shown that he knows how to play donald trump. >> anna phi field, we thank you for perspective inside the book. fascinating. thank you. >> thank you. temperatures so high they are breaking troubling new records. in our next hour, bill nye's message about climate change and how the trump administration tried to sidestep policies meant to slow it down. 2. unlimited data. use as much as you want, when you want. 3. no surprises on your bill. taxes and fees included.
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that does it for me on ""weekends with alex witt."" i'm frances rivera. kendis gibson ready to continue our coverage. >> francis, so great to see you in the daylight. have a great sunday. good day. i'm kendis gibson live at msnbc world headquarters in new york. american history 101. president trump says he didn't fire robert mueller because of a little lesson he learned from richard nixon. more on the rest of his latest interview including his interpretation of the special counsel's final report. as a new nbc poll reveals a surge in impeachment calls amongst democrats.
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