retching by conditioning and smoothing fibers, so clothes look newer, longer. downy and it's done. welcome to "kasie dc." i'm kasie hunt. we're live every sunday from washington from 7:00 to 9:00 p.m. eastern. tonight trump version 2.0. the president prepares to launch his bid for re-election. and four years to the day he rode down that escalator at trump tower. there are warning signs ahead. new polling out tonight from nbc news and the president's own pollsters. plus, two nights of debate stages are set and a question, will the sequel be better than the first one? montana governor steve bullock joins me live. he won in a trump state but

didn't make the first debate stage. and later my conversation with historian jon meacham and country singer tim mcgraw. you will want to stick around for our attempt at a three-part harmony. first, it's rarely a quiet week in washington but this one was particularly colorful. exhibit a -- >> tiring to hear from so many sex-starved males on this floor talk about a woman's right to choose. >> mr. speaker, i would just like to ask my friend if she'd like to change her last statement. >> mr. speaker, if it pleases my colleague on the other side, i will withdraw my statement about sex-starved males on the floor. >> okay. exhibit b, this father's day tweet from the president. happy father's day to all, including my worst and most vicious critics.

of which there are fewer and fewer. and this a fantastic time to be american. keep america great. as the president launches his re-election bid in florida, that is the crux of his campaign. he's even warning about the possibility of a market crash if he's not re-elected. things will be much different this time around from 2016 with the power of an incumbent president. and with a much more sophisticated campaign apparatus with volunteer training, a major digital operation and massive fund-raising already banked. but there are now some new warning lights. in a new nbc news/"the wall street journal" poll, the president's approval rating is hanging basically where it's always been, at 44%. but there is growing support for impeachment. up 10% since the last time nbc news asked the question. >> you're not worried about what happens in congress? >> look, the republicans in the senate, every single one of them that i see, know this is a witch-hunt. they get it 100%.

and that's what matters. the democrats are going to do it because they might think it helps them but i think it only hurts them in the election. >> meanwhile a source close to the campaign said the president fired some of his pollsters after leaked internal numbers showing former vice president joe biden ascending in critical states. the polls show double-digit leads in virginia, maine, minnesota and michigan and leads in north carolina and iowa as well. and biden has a double-digit lead in wisconsin, pennsylvania and florida, central to the president's victory in 2016. it also shows biden ahead in georgia and texas even in play as well, although the campaign said the data was old, incomplete, misleading and representing a worse-case scenario under a bad turnout model. >> we have great internal polling. there were fake polls that were released by somebody that is ridiculous. no, we are winning in every

single state that we polled. we're winning in texas very big. we're winning in ohio very big. we're winning in florida very big. we do very little polling because i'm not a huge believer in polling. i think you go out there and you fight and you don't really need polls. >> let's just say that the president hasn't always felt this way about the polls. >> nobody thought i was going to run, and i'm doing well in the polls in new hampshire where they just said a poll where i was number three and nobody thinks i'm running. that was from yesterday or two days ago. and nobody thinks i'm running, and i do well in the polls. and now that i'm running, firmly running, i think they're taking this very seriously. >> are you expecting to be standing there august 6 in the first debate? >> i don't know. right now i am. i'm doing well in the polls. again, nobody thinks i'm running and i'm is it in the debate. everybody tells me i'm in the debates because of the polls. again, i would imagine the polls go way up now because of the fact nobody thinks i'm running and now they think i'm running because now i announced.

>> that moment was four years ago today, which was the day that trump descended a certain escalator to launch his run for president. at the time very much a polls' man. with that i'd like to welcome in my panel with me on set, national political reporter for "the washington post" and msnbc political analyst robert costa. nbc news correspondent covering national security and intelligence, ken dill lannian. campaign director for the center for sent are, for american progress action fund, and white house reporter katherine lucy. thank you for being here today. robert costa, let me start with you. what does your reporting tell you about how serious of an alarm has been going off in the trump campaign over this polling? >> the alarm's been ringing since 2018 when they start suburban voters start to drift from president trump and the republican party. private polling across the gop has reflected ever since the summer of 2018, almost a year ago. the president and the white house, his political operation,

i talked with them this asking what do they make of it, is this accurate? and they said they've been struggling in some of these states and have seen the numbers dip but they believe so much of their path to 2020 is stoking their own base, going back to immigration, back to trade. and that's why when you wonder why are they choosing their policy decisions, part of it is because there are insane internal numbers that show deflation among some trump course of orders. >> they are seeing an actual possible problem with their base? >> they're seeing a problem in 2018 their base did not come out in the numbers they needed them to come out in. they look at the upcoming special elections in north carolina for the house and they're worried about some of the turnout there. will the trump voter really come out? so they are thinking about instead of playing to the middle after what happened in 2018, they're really looking at the base. they see a place like texas where it's very narrow and they see how well beto o'rouke did in '18 and now these internal polls show a pretty close race in

texas. that to them means immigration for one has to go back to the floor. >> katherine lucy, what does this mean, is there any divide in your reporting about this strategy in the white house? is everybody on board with this plan that robert's discussing? >> i think there's a pretty wide agreement that the president is going to go back to those issues. that there are these sort of key things that he's -- >> even if they think that he should do something else, he wouldn't listen kind of thing? >> the president ran on immigration. he ran on the wall. he ran on these very specific policies. and whenever he senses any sort of disturbance in the force, he's going to go back to these core issues. so i think we're going to hear him doing his sort of campaign rekickoff this week. and part of that is to do a really big show of strength. they want to do a really big rally, which is something you're not going to see at this to point from democrats fighting it out in early primary states. they want to do something big,

show their operation and throw read meat at people at the policies he wants to continue to pursue, the things he's done. i think you will hear a lot of that same messaging. >> juanita, how does that work in terms of the democratic field that's unfolding here? clearly what voters want the most is to beat donald trump and right now it seems joe biden is in the best position to do that but is it your sense he electrifies people in the way that you need to if you're going to take out an incumbent president, i don't care who you are. >> joe biden came in packing a bunch just based on name recognition as vice president to barack obama. and that's carrying him a long way. but i think the other thing that people recognize is they're going to need someone who has a clear, unique vision. what we've seen from joe biden is so far this message of unity, which is honestly missing a group of voters, i would say minority voters, black and latin voters, who want to know more about how he will directly address their challenges. i think that's a group we will see trump trying to reach out to as well. because i don't think there's a clear path without him engaging and getting more support from

minorities. trump will throw out messaging associated with the economy, with jobs, with health care. >> we've seen that strategy on the criminal justice reform bill. >> absolutely. but i think the interesting thing is the positive narrative he will try to throw out are false, especially knowing his tax bill and trade policies have long-term impacts on the economy or as it relates to health care. the fact he and his administration are arguably fighting in courts to remove protections for people living with pre-existing conditions. so whatever narrative's thrown out there, there will be falsities associated with it. >> where does this play in terms of where the democrat ic base i and the enthusiasm trump is trying to reveal in his base. >> the mueller report did not generate the hope democrats hoped. now they're looking for the

middle that will decide the election. we had mueller go on television said look, if we could have cleared the president of a crime, we would have. people heard that for the first time. when they had donald trump saying he would accept help from a foreign power, that goes right to the voters in pennsylvania and michigan. they don't understand all of the interfering in election stuff but they understand something completely at odds with american values. i would like to see polling on it, frankly, how does this affect the middle? >> we all would. >> i was in iowa this week when the president was out there and i talked to a lot of voters. it was nice to get outi of d.c. for a little bit. and this is not a topic people are talking a ton about, mueller or impeachment. they're talking about jobs and tariffs and agriculture. but it wasn't something i heard a lot. >> and it's hard for the democrats to make the case for impeachment when you have this week hope hicks, the former

confidante for president trump, adviser, coming to the house judiciary but she will testify privately. they will release the testimony. but that political theater, the story of it all told by one of the key players will not be available to the public. and you have the white house at every turn blocking people like don mcgahn, former white house counsel, from testifying. so if you are a democrat whoa believes the president committed impeachable intentions, you need to improve his intent on obstruction but how can you prove his intent to the public when so many witnesses because the white house is exerting executive privilege refuse to sit down? >> instead what we see are people on msnbc who are great legal experts and john dean, back to the nixon white house, those are the speak speaking in public. that's not the narrative the democrats need to present in order to make a impeachment case. >> and the democrats in some of key battleground states, some who won districts previously held by republicans, we have not been hearing a lot from democratic-elected officials in the middle saying they want to see this happen. i think that's also a sign in terms whereof people are in

those states. >> absolutely. >> speaking of richard nixon, here's what the president had to say about richard nixon just this week. >> look, article two, i would be allowed to fire robert mueller. assuming -- assumingdy a i did of the things i did, that i wanted to fire him. number one, i didn't. he wasn't fired. more importantly, article two allows me to do whatever i want. article two would have allowed me to fire him. but i wasn't going to fire him. you know why? i watched rich nixon go around firing everybody and that didn't work out too well. very simply article two would allow me to do. >> so how much of this, bob, is the president being informed by what he remembers from watergate? >> president trump looks back at watergate and he sees the executive, the office of the presidency, really pushing the limits back then with president nixon and he wondered will he really get called preliminarily, legally pushing the limits once

again on executive power? his challenge though when he talked to his advisers when you look at the articles of impeachment from 1974, the house democrats, one of the articles of impeachment went after abuse of power, did the president do too much, president nixon, from stopping congress from hearing testimony about what actually happened during the watergate break-in. as much as the president believes how the office of the presidency evolves in the past 50 years and it has grown in power and it alarms people in both parties about how much pear it has, president trump still has to face congress, and he could face what many democrats are telling me would be a narrow impeachment process. >> it would be incredibly narrow. and the reality is he may have learned the lesson of don't fire everybody. but prey ltty low bar. but he's blocking congress from learning about anything else that happened. >> but i think that's a telling passage. richard nixon may have saved donald trump's presidency. he knew enough to push it so far but no farther. there was a lot of instances

where he gave an order and it wasn't carried out. nixon ordered people to cover up. he ordered the end to an investigation. trump didn't go that far. he was afraid -- >> but he did. didn't he call mcghan and say call me when it's done. fire mueller. >> it didn't happen. >> because mcghan made the decision to not. not trump, trump was ready to go there. >> and there were people who didn't follow nix anticipaon's . but i think he went further and that saved him in the end. >> there was a tweet from the president that stuck out for me today that the voters may demand he have another term in office. we are seeing it here on the screen. people may demand he have -- would they demand i stay longer. bob, how do you read that? is that him saying, pelosi has been quoted as saying privately she wonders -- it's motivated her thinking he may not accept the results of the next

election. >> there are two positions. is there a apparatus to amend the constitution to allow the to serve more than two terms. that goes back for centuries going back to washington's original decision and when the republicans got unhappy with franklin roosevelt and his multiple terms. on the question of legitimacy of the election, if the president does not accept the results in 2020, would you have a constitutional crisis. are democrats alarmed about it? sure. but a third term -- if he wants a third time, he's going to have to create political capital of this country to change the laws of this country and change the constitution. that's a tweet. that's far from starting a constitutional movement. >> fair enough. we have a lot more to come tonight. in the 8:00 hour, congressman pra milla jay appall shared a deeply personal story this week in "the new york times." her choice to have an abortion as the debate over abortion

rights boils over. just ahead -- a new chill in the cold war amid a "new york times" report the u.s. is inserting malware in russia's power grid with the president reportedly left out of the loop. . uh-oh, looks like someone's still nervous about buying a new house. is it that obvious? yes it is. you know, maybe you'd worry less if you got geico to help with your homeowners insurance. i didn't know geico could helps with homeowners insurance. yep, they've been doing it for years. what are you doing? big steve? thanks, man. there he is. get to know geico and see how much you could save on homeowners and renters insurance. cancer is the ugliest disease mankind has ever faced.

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russia's influence. >> just to finish, i hope poland will have a great relationship with russia. i think it's possible. i really do. >> the president just jumping in there. the president of poland and president trump offered shall we say slightly different assessments with their relationship with russia. on thursday, russian president putin joined in, telling russian state tv he and trump are not quite on the same page, saying the relations are, quote, in fact deteriorating, getting worse by the hour. this ahead of a "new york times" scoop indicating a new step in the digital cold war between washington and moscow. sourcing american officials who say potentially crippling malware is being placed inside the russian electric power grid. buried halfway in the report is this, quote, two administration officials said they believed mr. trump had not been briefed in any detail about the steps, and that the pentagon and intelligence officials described broad hesitation to go into

detail with mr. trump about operations against russia for concern over his reaction. president trump, of course, dismissed the story with a series of tweets calling the report, quote, a virtual act of treason. so setting that aside, ken dilanian, this is a remarkable step for the u.s. government to be taking. how does this kind of fit in to -- i think our perception has been the president doesn't want to do anything about foreign interference but it seems like perhaps our intelligence community is freelancing. >> sure. and that may be a little overstated that perception. the first thing we noted is the russians have been doing this to us for years. they're on our power grids, u.s. officials have said, with malware ready to be deployed. this is a response to that. let's not forget, this is cyber command, the military cyber warriors. they work out at ft. mead next to the national security agency. so nsa has digital spies, cyber and kmadcommander, cyber warrio. they've been stepping up operations, not because of

anything trump ordered necessarily, but there's been a zeitgeist that the u.s. was not doing enough to combat russia and china in cyberspace. so the general over there is talking about something called persistent engagement. they're not really telling us exactly what that means though. this is the first indication, "the new york times" report on what some of that might look like. and what this is is getting into the russian power grid networks to prepare the battlefield in the event they want to push the button and explode a cyber weapon. >> is this a thing where russia in your view or according to your reporting in talking to intelligence officials has that capability for us? would this be a back and forth, mutually assured destruction thing? >> yes, and more. and this didn't get a lot of attention but cyber command shut down the internet agency the st. petersburg troll farm in 2018 and trump was briefed on it and signed off on it specifically. so it may be true in "the times" reporting he wasn't briefed on this specific of this element russian power grid operation,

but he is aware of and signed off on -- he has to, he's the president, this major policy change. i wish the public knew a little bit more about this. this is some significant activity by our cyber warriors going on under the radar. we know very little about it. the congressional committees are briefed on it but that's it. we don't know the details. >> bob, how concerned are officials around the president about him hearing of operations like this? >> well, they're concerned about his entire position on russia. people within the national security and intelligence community, those within the white house as you would expect are somewhat sympathetic to the president's position. they wonder why inside of the national security community when you talk to people there who are familiar with all of the discussions, why does he have this kind of approach, warm approach to president putin in russia? yes, they say could president putin be a partner on some counterterrorism efforts in regard to syria and parts of the middle east? perhaps down the line. but there's a lot of real skepticism in our government about how putin interacts with

north korea, with the chinese, the iranians and for president trump to always have these overtures, whether it's at the rose garden elect urn or private meetings with national security officials does put him at odds, he's an outlier inside of his own government. >> catherine, some of the things that are supposed to be protecting us, secretary of defense, department of homeland security, are acting, are not actually in full-time roles either. what's your sense from covering the white house every day of how much push and pull there is on that question? >> the president expressed a lot of comfort with people in acting positions, he's talked about it publicly, he likes actings. some of this is around questions of confirming people and the process but he's not moving quickly on a lot of these. even people like his chief of staff -- >> but is there an argument there that gives him more control over questions like

this, when the community says hey, collectively this is not how we should be doing business? >> yes, it speaks to how much authority people in those roles have. and it also gives the president more power because he is in a stronger position because he has people in acting jobs. >> why is this shanahan nomination stalled? it just hangs out there, to your point about where are the officials inside of the government? where is shanahan? >> that seems like suddenly, nbc news has reported the president suddenly soured on the person he picked for this. where does that stand? we're just not having a secretary of defense until 2020? >> it's up to the whims of the president. we have a secretary of defense, but not a confirmed secretary. >> emphasis on whims of the president. that's why the intel security is skeptical to disclose this contents. the private overtures, things he stated in the public rose garden or even helsinki are red flags they should be evident in being

hesitant about releasing explicit information. >> thank you all for your reportings and insights tonight. when we return, governor steve bullock is used to the open prairie of montana. now his campaign is separated from the thundering herd of candidates left off the debate stage. he joins me live to talk about his campaign next. ♪

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the stages are set for the first democratic debates happening june 26 and 27th in miami, and airing right here on msnbc. a total of 20 candidates were selected after qualifying through fund-raising and polling. you're looking at the 20 candidates who made the cut. missing from that lineup, montana governor steve bullock. massachusetts congressman seth moulton and miramar, florida, mayor wayne messam. joining me now from montana, montana governor steve bullock. governor, it's great to have you on the program. thank you for being here. >> kasie, thank you for having me tonight. >> let's start with the debate stage. clearly the dnc set these criteria for who would make the stage. some have posited perhaps you

waited too long to get into the race. what do you attribute this to? and do you think it's a mistake for democrats not to put a red state governor who went ahead of donald trump on the stage coming up next week? >> yes, missing from that stage would be someone that actually won in a trump state. the bridge divides with the 60% republican legislature to get progressive things that done that represents our rural areas. i only got in a month ago because i still had a job to do. had i got in earlier, my legislature was going on. i wouldn't have gotten medicaid expansion reauthorized, freeze college tuition, wouldn't have been able to lower health care costs for everyone. if i had to choose between chasing 100,000 donors or getting 100,000 people health care, that's a decision i would make the same way each and every time. >> so what would your pitch be? the one thing is, you know, you're rivals are only going to get about ten minutes a piece it

seems because there are so many of them. what would you bring to the question if you were on that stage, how do these -- how do the democrats beat fpresident trump in 2020? it is the single most important thing to democratic voters right now. >> i think fundamentally we need to change our strategy, not only bring out our base but win back places we lost. we have to give people a reason to vote for us, not just against him. when you look at whoever's going to clean your studio tonight, paid more in taxes than 60 fortune 500 companies last year. when 44% of americans don't have $400 in their pocket in case of a health care emergency or the car breaks down, you have to make sure to make the pitch that democrats will be fighting for your interests, your economic interests, your education interests, your health care interests. it's not going to be enough just to be against him. >> what do you think democrats missed in 2016?

why did democrats lose? why did hillary clinton lose the election in 2016? >> well, look, it's easy monday morning quarterbacking. you can say russians, you can say any number of things. but we cannot be losing places, iowa is an example. a third of the counties went obama, obama, trump. and those are folks that we need to win back if we're going to actually win in 2020. so i think in part we missed it, at times there's many places as you noted that donald trump took montana by 20 points. i won by four even with being able to do good, progressive things, 25% to 30% of my voters voted for donald trump. at times there's a little disconnect with what our party's talking about and the ability for people to really believe they'll have a better economic shot and washington, d.c. will work bet are for them. >> if democrats in the house launched impeachment hearings, would that lose them the 2020

election in your view? >> you know, i think it's a moving target in as much as when you look at congress certainly has that overnight obligation to make sure -- and that's why all of those investigations are occurring. by the same token, the executive has to respond to those. that's the moving target on impeachment. when i'm out traveling like i did last week, seven different meet and greets in iowa, people are talking about health care. they're talking about the concern of losing their farm. they're talking about the flooding and climate change. they're talking about trying to get a better job. they weren't out there talking about impeachment. >> yes. what would you say about the democratic national committee and how they've gone about this process? do you have problems with how they've set it out? can you still hear us, governor? i think that the governor has lost communication with us, so

we are going to try to see if we can get him back. but in the meantime, we will take a quick break. actually, governor, are you back with us? >> i'm back. i'm back. i think the earbud fell out. sorry about that. >> no problem. happens all the time on live television. the democratic national committee obviously made this decision about the debate stage. i have covered bernie sanders' campaign in 2016 and they were very angry with how the party handled the entire primary process. do you have faith considering what happened to you in this debate question in how the party is handling things? >> yes, kasie, i certainly have my share of frustration, right. they said here are the legitimate polling polls that would count and one was "the washington post"/abc. they ended up excluding that one because they said, well, that can't be legitimate when 4% said they'd vote for donald trump. i think we should be saying why

are 4% democrats two years later say they're going to be voting for donald trump rather than discounting the polls? we're still, i don't know, still 230-some days from a voter ever expressing preference. where i always try to put people above politics. i think that's how i've won three times in montana. that's how i will run as president. so i'm going to be more focused each and every day on the individuals that will actually vote on primary and election day, not on party rules. >> one party rule, or at least decision that came down, is that they vetoed a debate on climate change. a climate change-only focused debate. i know this is something you have talked about that obviously affects montana deeply. what in your view is the best way to combat climate change? is it the green new deal, or is that the kind of policy that scares away those voters in iowa

you were talking about a minute ago? >> no, i think we have to take immediate and durable steps p the current secretary of interior says he doesn't lose sleep over climate change. we had the worst fire season in our state's history just two years ago. fire seasons are almost 80 days longer. i think we need to take immediate action. step one would be rejoining paris and actually funding it. step two, not even the auto industry asked for these fuel efficiency standards to be removed. we have to look at upgrading the grid and other technology opportunities given the fact so we can get more wind and solar, not bring together both labor, conservationists, suetilitiutil say we have short and long-term goal. the ipcc said we have to be net zero emissions by 2020.

i think we can do it a heck of a lot earlier. as we go through this transition too another thing we have to remember is make sure the communities don't get left behind that have been working to power our country for decades and decades. >> governor steve bullock, thank you very much, sir. and happy father's day. thank you very much for bringing your son to visit with our -- with our studio to see how we do things here. there's a photo that you sent to us of the two of you waiting to go on air. we hope you had a wonderful day. >> we had a good day fishing and then we decided to come talk with you. thank you for having me, kasie. >> thank you for taking a limb time out of your day. when we return, my interview with country singer tim mcgraw and let's just say nonsinger jon meacham. we're going to talk about the new american song book and how history has shaped our nation. ♪

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from the battle hymn of the republic and the star-spangled banner to bruce springsteen and 2 pac, it's a small task to trace history through music. but jon meacham and country music legend tim mcgraw did just that in their book "songs of america: patriotism, protest and music that made a nation." i sat down with jon and tim earlier this week and asked them how exactly they decided to take on this project together.

>> well, we've known each other for seven years and it started with me hanging around jon's neighborhood and walking around in his backyard peeking in windows and trying to get a chance to be invited over -- >> to be cool. >> i'm a nerd who wants to hang out with a cool guy. >> reversal. >> yeah. >> sorry. >> after faking i got an invitation from keith to have dinner, and we were jumping for joy and excited for five days to go to jon meacham's home. had a great time. the night ended with a great time sitting around talking about history and politics and jon talking about the vast amount of knowledge he has about all of these things. >> that he can recall. >> that he can recall. like when we do our show and even today, i'm the one with notes. jon doesn't have any notes anywhere. half the time i think he's making it up but i don't know that.

>> tim specifically, tim asked a question -- i wrote a book last year on periods of division that felt like this, mccarthy, reconstruction, george wallace. and tim asked a question last christmas, he said have you ever thought the role music played in these moments? and i hadn't. it's a terrific question because it's an ambient reality, the music we hear and music we sing. it has a wonderfully clear political effect from the ages through the revolution to -- if you understand the civil war -- >> before the revolution. >> before. if you understand the civil war, do you really need to go much farther than dixie versus battle hymn of the republic? there you have it. >> did you find when you're doing this you were really writing the political story of america? >> i think it was a combination. i think it was more about -- for me, it was more about making a connection between the heart of what people were thinking about it and creating more of a three-dimensional character in

the people we were looking at. what we tend to do when we look back at history, we tend to look at our founding fathers and all of the figures throughout history and reflection points and see them in a two-dimensional way. i think music opens a door and allows us to see them not as people who are in our past but people in their present struggling to forge a path forward and they didn't know how it was going to end up. i think music is really a way to connect emotionally to things that were going on. and reflected the times going on but also propelled forward a better way in a lot of instances. >> there's a great line from a 17th century scottish writer andrew fletcher who said, i care not who writes the law of the nation if i can write its ballads. really interesting. you think about we shall overcome. lift ievery voice and sing. these anthems that were about calling us to actually live up

to the declaration, to live up to what we said we believed. >> all men were created equal. >> jefferson does prose and other folks do music but it comes together. >> one of the things that struck me as i was flipping through -- it's a beautiful book you have all put together. so many of these have become -- my family gets together in the summer and sings songs around the campfire. so many of the songs you have brought up here, either i never knew the story behind them or i knew the basic outlines of it, but this is really sort of -- so much of this is still the fabric of our lives and we don't necessarily connect that. >> absolutely. everyone, whether you're a huge music fan or not, you can hear a song and it takes you back to a place in time in a lot of ways. growing up, i can remember, i grew up in louisiana and i can remember being in a hammock on the bayou in my backyard in seventh grade listening to a transistor radio and falling asleep with my algebra on my

chest and hearing "i'm not lisa" and now every time i hear that song i'm instantly transported back to that time. i think that's what music does and the emphasis of the idea. ask jon about the idea, see if it would work. >> it is remarkable. let's show some of the -- some of the performances. it oftentimes, music is a moment as much as when you have a store that lives in the doors but obviously the performance in the moment signifies where we stand in history. i think this was one of these moments. this was 2009 when aretha franklin performed "my country 'tis of thee" at the inauguration of barack obama. ♪ my country 'tis of thee sweet land of liberty ♪ ♪ of thee i sing

>> the moment our first african-american president was naug rated, so much of it is there. >> "my country 'tis of thee" was wrote in 1871 by a sandover smith. think about the language, "my country 'tis of thee." it's the puration of dr. king's sermon on the washington out of march. it's played there as that remarkable barrier is broken. and oliver wepdndell homes, who saw himself quite famous, he said what is fame? fame is writing "my opportunicos of thee," a song known by every child, a song known by every american. >> and will always be. >> i covered the campaign trail and you get to know the anthems that play on the loud speaker every single time you hear somebody walk on or off the stage. frankly it's becoming incredibly

political and polarized like our politics today. but one of the places this got started what lee greenwood actually and ronald reagan. here's the song. ♪ and i'd gladly stand up next to you and defend her still today ♪ ♪ 'cause there ain't no doubt i love this land ♪ ♪ god bless the u.s.a. >> and, tim, you write in the book this really has become a red state anthem, and you compare it to a very different song, bruce springsteen's "born in the u.s.a.." >> which was really a blue collar anthem. and mistook, george wills, famously, wrote a review of a bruce springsteen concert and then ronald reagan tried to adopt it for his campaign, and bruce would have nothing to do with it because he didn't understand the song would always trying to say. he is singing about losing a

friend and applying to a blue collar worker and what america was doing for them. but it's easy to understand that when you listen to sort of the course of the springsteen song. certainly certainly when you see the album cover. lee greenwood's song is borderline over the top patriotic, and it's a fantastic song. i grew up listening to it and when i started singing it in clubs, i loved it. i sang it a ton of times. i'm back to sam cook "a change is gonna come." just because a song is patriotic or protesting something doesn't mean someone is going to sing it. it still has to be a great song. what you find are these songs that we remember, and the songs that stand out whether they're about protest or patriotism, they're really well crafted, well done and incredibly moving

songs. >> congratulation on the book. temperature mcgraw, congratulations on the book, jon, congratulations on appearing with tim mcgraw. i notice people family will enjoy this as wells. "songs of america." thank you both very much. we'll be back with much more in just a moment. ch. we'll be back with much more in just a moment ...every curve, every innovation, every feeling... ...a product of mastery. lease the 2019 es 350 for $379/month for 36 months. experience amazing at your lexus dealer. not this john smith. or this john smith. or any of the other hundreds of john smiths that are humana medicare advantage members. no, it's this john smith. who we paired with a humana team member to help address his own specific health needs. at humana, we take a personal approach to your health, to provide care that's just as unique as you are.

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today we know nancy pelosi as the highest-ranking woman in american politics, leading a record number of women in congress, but it was a much different story when he came to congress over 30 years ago. mika brzezinski recently sat down with the house speaker to talk about just how much has changed. >> nancy pelosi arrived in congress in 1987, with a solidly liberal reputation, and one obvious challenge. making her way through a house of representatives that was 95% male. >> there were only 23 women members of congress out of 435, only 23. so when i came, every place i would go, they would stop me and say you can't go there, you can't go there, members only,

and i would say i'm a member of congress. oh, you're a member of congress, you can go anyplace you want. shortly thereafter i was looking for a vote something for hiv/aids, which was my focus early in the days. i started following one of my targets into the speaker's lobby and beyond. i started to go into this room, and the officers are saying, congresswoman you can't go there. i said, i'm a congresswoman, i can go everywhere i said, and they want, congresswoman, it's the men's room. >> one place you don't want to go. >> what a thought. for more on this and pelosiii's relationship watch "headliners" to the at 9:00 p.m. eastern. we have more to come, as the president walks back claims he would accept a form terr power. i'm joined by sax by ham bling.

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the u.s. and iran. >> the u.s. is blaming iran for attacks this week. >> on two tanker in the gulf of oman. >> how certain are you that iran was responsible for these atakes. >> it's unmistakable what happen here. >> no question iran is behind

the attack. >> i'm concerned about the stability of the region. >> the united states is going to make sure we take all the actions necessary. >> does it dhow a military response? >> of course. >> we don't want it to escalate. >> these unprovoked attacks warrant retaliatory strike. >> president trump has done everything we can to avoid war. >> this administration might be leading us on a path to war. >> the remarkable comment, sure, i would take incrimination information. >> i think i would take it. >> accepting oppo research from a federal government. >> you came really close right there. >> he does believe people take this dirt from foreign governments. >> what would you do with the dirt? >> would you call the fbi. >> maybe i would go to the fbi. >> it's not hard. just call the fbi. >> does this change the calculus on impeachment? >> i don't think pelosi will

move on it. >> we should at least open an inquiry. >> the rule of law will catch up to the president. >> did you read the report? >> yeah, you should read it too. with that, welcome to the second hour of "cakasie d.c." and cofounder of foundry strategies and msnbc political analyst rick tyler, also from atlanta, former republican senator from georgia and vice chair of the intelligence committee saxby chambliss, thank you, all. amid all the outrage about foreign dirt in elections, it's worth noting that team trump has raised eye browse on this subject a number of times before.

>> russia if you're listening, i hope you're able to find the 30,000 e-mails that are missing. i think you will probably be rewarded mightily by our press. >> there's nothing wrong with taking information from russians. it depends on where it containment from. >> if would you call the fbi again? >> the reality is we were not given anything that was salacious. >> still, the president did seem to take thing, shall we say, a step further in that interview with george stephanopoulos this week. >> okay. let's put yourself in a position, you're a congressman, somebody comes up and says, hey, i have information on your opponent. do you call the fbi? >> i think if it's coming from russia. >> i don't think in my whole life i've ever called the fbi, in my whole life. >> your campaign, this times foreigners, if russia, china, someone else, should they accept it or call the fbi? >> i think maybe you do both.

i think you might want to listen. there's nothing wrong with listens. if somebody called from a country, norway, we have information on your opponent. oh, i think i would want to hear it. >> you want that kind of interference in our election? >> it's not an interference. they have information. i think why take it. the president attempted to walk back his comments? a subsequent interview with fox news, saying he would look at the information first and then report it, if necessary. republicans in congress really doing their level best to defend him, even before that revision. >> doesn't a president have to set a tone about what is right and what goes wrong? >> i think the up has been very clear. the president does not want foreign government toss interfere. he's been strong about that. >> he said he would look at the information, listen to it, and if there were a problem, he would go to the fbi. >> i've watch the president. i believe the president would always do the right action. >> would you call the fbi? >> would i call the fbi about

what? >> if a foreign adversary called you and said up niches on the opponent. i would send it to the authorities, yes. >> even as other congressional republicans were telling reporters exactly what kevin mccarthy 208d me there, finally, legislation that would make it illegal for campaigns not to report offers of foreign assistance was blocked in the senate. senator mark warner introduced a bill that would have done that. it failed to pass by unanimous consent when marsha blackburn he objected, saying the reporting requirements were overboard. oh, boyd, i'm not sure where to start here. saxby chambliss, let me begin with you, senator, you have obviously seen much more than most of us have in terms of the efforts that our adversaries abroad are making, to try to

advance their own interests at the expense of the interests of the united states. um, who should campaigns do if they receive information, offers of help from foreign entities, and how important is it for our government to be aware of those overtures? >> well, kasie, the first thing is if you're president, you don't do a 30-hour interview, you're going to say something you wish you could grab back. >> fair enough. >> we clearly know that in 2016 the russians tried to interfere in our election, and they had some success. we know that that's not the first time they've done that. they've not just done it to us, but on a wholesaling basis around the world. >> the good news in the 2016 case is we did learn a lesson. i will have to saying our intelligence community, and our folks in a position to oversee elections did a nice job in on

2018 of making sure there was no interference in that election. they tried again, but we had some success there. should we allow foreign entities of any sort to engage in an election process that's the threshold of the democratic process of the united states? absolutely not. and so i think, as we head into the next election, we're going to see more activity than earn from not just the russians, but some of our other adversaries, particularly in the cyberworld. i assure you, the folks in the position of looking out to make sure that we don't allow that interference, they're getting read y. and i think we're going to be ready in 2020, even more so than we were in '18.

>> one of the other these, guy and rick, i'm interested in your perspectives, that the president said, this is the kind of thing that happens all the time, not unusual at all to receive an emay from something saying the russians want to give you dirt, has that ever happened? you both have been very involved in campaigns. >> no. if it did, i think most of us would be very clear about what we would do about it. this is not -- this is nothing that requires a paragraph answer or pretending like you don't know what question you're asking to mccarthy. it's a pretty simple answer. we don't welcome foreign interference, and if a foreign government tried to interferes, we would report them. >> this was so basic it was in our founding documents that they were concerned. >> i worked on three presidential campaigns, and it's never happened. first, let me establish something about the way the president conduct this had

interview with george stephanopoulos, he literally said everything in that interview, you could slice and dice that interview up, play one set of comments on fox news, another on msnbc, and you would draw totally different conclusions about what the president said. he virtually said everything in the campaign. the other thing that's important for people to understand is opposition research is legitimate tool that campaigns use. you hire people to do opposition research. >> sure. >> the analogy that the clinton campaign hired a foreign agent is just flat-out false. they hired an american agency, opposition research, whose name was fusion gps, which hired a british former m-16, which means he was well trained to give opposition research. he was a priefer citizen. there's no foreign influence in that scenario. the same way i could work on a campaign in israel or a campaign

in spain or anywhere else. >> there's a big difference between taking an american firm, collecting information potentially from foreign sources. >> correct with motives based in the united states, than a foreign adversary with interests that it's trying to execute reaching into a campaign. i thought it was interesting that trump tried to walk this back a bit. >> it was one of the rare times where we saw the president pause and say maybe i should just try to take a couple steps back, because maybe i went too far this time. maybe because the republicans on capitol hill, maybe lindsey graham sea he made a mistake may have factored into his thinking. maybe it was the capable news coverage. but i think we definitely have to look at the fact when he got on "fox & friends" and did that 50-minute interview, as rick points out, he walked it back. when we think about the narrative that the trump campaign and the people around

him have been making no a long time. the message has always been they've been don't opposition research through jared kushner, through rudy giuliani, and they're talking to the supporters and other people sea are saying what did don junior really do in that trump tower meeting? he's been making the case my son did nothing wrong, doing what normal political candidates -- >> of course, who wouldn't. >> but this is an important point. a state, foreign actor, a state is not going to have, i would think, any more better opposition research than you can hire in the united states, what they could offer is stolen information, like stolen e-mails, things stolen by military intelligence. >> that's illegal on its face. there's no reason to take opposition research from a foreign actor, because it's not going to in any way be better, it's only going to be illegal. >> but i think there's another

point, in talking about walking things back and saying ten things in the same interview. imagine, though, what message oar sending to a foreign adversary. you're encouraging them to participate in this activity by not being clear, ever -- >> like russia, find hillary's e-mails. >> he will walk back the walk-back before we get to the end of this week. this is the way he communication. >> hold on one second. senator, jump in. >> remember, after the meeting in trump tower in 2016, the campaign took no action, because there was nothing to it. to now say we shouldn't allow interference, we all agree with that. this was a mistake to say this, clearly. we don't need the russian, the chinese, the iranians, or

anybody else giving any information on any candidates. how are you going to use it? i'm not sure there's any campaign that's ever used any information that's been given to them by a foreign power. let's hope not. for gosh sake, this is clearly is the sort of thing that should be reported to authorities immediately. >> on that very question, senator, why -- this has been introduced as legislation in the senate, your former colleagues have essential rejected it. mitch mcconnell is running the show. he seems to be -- and marsha blackburn was officially objected. it's clearly going nowhere. why? do you think they should pass in reporting requirement, saying you better report them to the fbi or you're at legal risk? >> well, number one, to even have to have this kind of legislation introduced in the senate is -- it tells you the sad state of affairs we've

gotten into politically and otherwise. mark warner is my dear friend. i'm sure his legislation is well meaning, maybe straightforward, i'm not familiar with it, but obviously there must have been some problems on the other side, because the issue of interference by foreign powers is not questioned by either side at this point in time. so the fact they're even talking about this means we're in a sad state of affairs. >> and quick last word? >> the senator is saying it's a sad state of affairs, the head of the federal election commission, i think her response stuck with me the most, which is she said i didn't think i would have to say this, but no, you should not be taking information from foreign countries, foreign governments. i think that was an underline and bold what she said. most people would say this is common sense, but the president obviously felt differently. all right a very spirited conversation about a very

important topic, senator chambliss, thanks for being with us. >> sure. >> i appreciate it. when we return, we'll try to separate fakes from the genuine article. a sea change in south carolina in the 2020 presidential field. first i talked to pramila jayapal in her first tv interview since publishing a deeply personal essay. she reveals her choice to have an abortion. e reveals her choice an abortion. ♪ limu emu & doug look limu. a civilian buying a new car. let's go. limu's right. liberty mutual can save you money by customizing your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. oh... yeah, i've been a customer for years. huh... only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪

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a weave of attempts to restrict or ban abortion is pushing women around the country to speak out and fight. in some cases that means sharing incredibly private stories about abortion that go beyond the impersonal and divisive world of politics. this past week congresswoman pramila jayapal told her own story in "new york times," after she gave birth to what she calls a miracle baby, who experienced a difficult birth and related health problems, she became pregnant with a second child. she writes -- it was excruciating, i wanted children, but i wasn't ready, nor was i fully ready. i could not tempt fate again. it would to be my choice, because in the end, i would be the one to care the fetus in my

body, i would be the once to potentially face another emergency cesarean section, and i would be the one whose baby would face the -- i had to make a decision based on the tremendous risks that had been clearly laid out for me. joining me now on set is congresswoman jayapal of washington. thank you so much for coming on. >> thank for you having me, kasie. >> this is such an incredibly person story, we are living an incredibly divisive times. what made you decide now was the time you needed to step up and tell this story. >> it felt urgent, and it felt necessary, as i watched states across the country passing abortion bans, and thought about the peril of a supreme court that we really don't know if that supreme court with brett

kavanaugh on it is going to preserve this right. it felt very important for me to bring this voice to the platform that i have, and hopefully by doing so, facilitate a discussion, a discussion that i think frankly is not had in many households around the country. it's whispered perhaps between best friends, sometimes kept from parents or even partners. i wanted to make sure that we were talking about this incredibly important constitutional right that pregnant people have over their own choices and their own bodies. >> the reasons is, i go into a great about the reasons for doing this. one thing i think gets lost in our political debate is, you know, this becomes a very polarizing moral question that doesn't often focus on why somebody might make that decision. just talk to us a bit about why

you made your decision, and how you felt about making it. >> well, my child was born at 26 1/2 weeks, 1 pound, 14 ounce when is they were born and i use the pronounce they, because they're gender nonconfirming, and really should not be alive by all accounts. this was 22 years ago, and i was in india at the time, so there were only two nicus in the country, but even if they had been born in the united states, a child at that time 22 years ago, a child born that early, and that low birthweight had less than a 50% chance of survival. >> even today it's difficult. >> even today. and even if they do survive, tremendous morbidity issues, all kinds of issues that might come up. so, you know -- i also had an infection at the time, so there was a issue of my own mortality. i had an emergency c-section.

janek is beautiful, they're 22 years old, just graduated from college, but it was a long road. when they were in the nicu in the translucent box that i describe in the piece, they were stuck with needles all the time, multiple blood transfusions, i think it was seven. they would bleat, because their vocal cords were not developed, they went down to 600 grams, and it was difficult. when we came back to the united states they had for a brief tie high roe encephalitis, seizures, would have to go to the emergency room every year because they would get pneumonia. it was very challenging. i think, you know, i also was coming back to the united states, i suffered postpartum depression, which was undiagnosed for several years. later when i did finally do see a therapist, she said i had a

protect form of ptsd. >> so much was happening. >> i also went through a divorce around the same time. it was difficult to be back in the united states and have a very, very sick child. i met somebody who i ended up marrying, who was my husband today, but i nigh you want ready for children. we were on birth control. i was very religious about it, because i thought i would have children -- and birth control methods are nots foolproof. i did get pregnant and had to make this choice. the doctors said i was extremely high risk for the same kind of births. i just didn't think, kasie, i could do it again. in fact i knew i couldn't. they could not assure me that anything would be to different. janek was going through a rough

time. i made the choice to have an abortion. i didn't tell my mother about it. i didn't tell her about it until i wrote this piece. i called her to tell her, because i didn't want her to read did in the paper, but i told very few people about it. i think that's an experience as this piece has come out and the tremendous response from around the country, people -- >> what have you heard from others? >> it's been incredible. it makes me glad that i wrote the piece. i wondered, because it's obviously a very personal thing to share, but people have been flooding me with thanks for talking about this, for making it clear in the piece that even though i explained everything, women frankly shouldn't have to do this. we shouldn't have to explain why we're making these choice. it is our choice. some of them are very hard decisions for some people. other people are just exercising their free constitutional right to make choices and understand that reproductive choice is very

much linked to economic security and economic freedom for women. in isn't a judgment about which case deserves an abortion and which case doesn't and how hard it was or wasn't, but people across the country have been saying thank you. we've been talking about abortion at our dinner table. people have been writing to me and telling me they found out their mother had an abortion, because somebody told them that. people in clinics who are republicans have said, you know, we believe in safe access to abortion. we wish that the political jargon isn't what it is out there, because we actually don't agree with that. we think every pregnant person should have the right to make choices about their own bodies. if i was wondering if the piece was doing its job, i feel like i've gotten the clear message that it is. i would just encourage -- not everybody has to tell their story, but to talk about it and understand this is not a stigma. it doesn't have to be a trauma.

it can be a trauma, but this is a constitutionally protected right, and we do have to stand up and fight for this, because it does that appear that often all-male legislatures are taking this right away, or trying to take this right away. we cannot go back to a time in the '60s where people were getting them in back allies. banning abortion does not mean it's not going to happen. four office five people across this country believe that safe abortion is a right that should be protected. >> certainly, you know, for a debate that is too often lost in absolutes and forgets to remember there are real people at the heart of every story. congresswoman, thank you for coming on tonight. i'm honored you were here. when we return, the first debate of the 2020 election cycle is sell for this summer. the panel returns next. r this s. the panel returns next this is the ocean.

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a. a sort close to the trump reelection campaign, tells nbc news that they are cutting ties with some pollsters. the president was asked about in

the abc interview, and you'll notice his answer took a bit of a turn. >> what's your pitch to the swing voter on the fence? >> saved, security, great economy, i think i've done more than any other first-term president ever. itch a phony witch hundred dollars, mueller's comes out and no collusion, and they keep going with it. people are angry about it. >> i don't think that -- we don't have time tosh. >> excuse me, he found no collusion, and didn't find anything to do with obstruction. they had made a ruling based on his finding. >> they didn't examine collusion, they laid out -- >> are you saying now there was collusion even though he said that. >> he didn't say. >> he said no collusion. >> okay. rick tyler, how dire are things really for the trump campaign right now? >> look, it's hard to tell.

if i were the democrats, i wouldn't be, you know, celebrating and thinking that they can get anyone elected. i don't think they can. look, these polls are early. i'm trying to contemplate the situation where you're in a presidential campaign and your internal polls leak without intentionally leaking them. i don't understand understand quite how that happened. if someone did leak them and they weren't supposed to, he's right those people should be fired, but he hasn't named anybody. we don't know -- >> it makes you wonder who -- >> the president is in trouble. his favorables are terrible. he's stuck -- i think he's a 44% against. he's never been above 50% in a gallup poll, and that's a very different thing to do, to win with that kind of approval. >> and, of course, the president still has yet to officially launch his campaign, but he's

going to do it this week in florida. here's a sneak peek on how wonderful candidates will take him on starting in florida this week. >> people talk about trump care. i want to say trump what? all the time, the ability for us to afford the basic health care, they took it away from us. >> i'm sure he didn't run into anybody on his golf courses or in his hotels that have the issues that 70 or 80% of our country has. >> so that of course is priors usa, which guise cecil is -- guy, what is your goal here? and it seems to me the lessons of 2018 apply in your view. >> absolutely. in some respects the lessons of 2016 apply, in terms of what we should be talking about and what we shouldn't be talking about. the country has made a lot of determinations about whether

they believe he cease a racist or homophobe, or unethical. a lot of people have made those decision. i'm not sure there's much more we can add. i think what is important for us to say is, despite the talk about the jobs report, 70% of the country still believes their wages are not keeping up with the cost of living. when you look at the cost of education, the cost of health care, they are far outpacen inflation. for most americans, they see a failure, they see it in carrier, in gm, in steel, in the tariffs, in health care. i think it's our job now more than ever, to make sure we keep the conversation on much -- more on this than -- >> like if democrats are talking about the democrats broadband a raci racist, et cetera? >> no, i don't. it's very easy, because most of the conversations we have on cable news -- except you, of course -- and -- it's about

mueller, stormy daniels, artist formerly known as michael avenatti. >> i like that. i'm going to remember that. >> it's not to say that impeachment and hearings aren't important, but democrats have to be much more intentional about bringing this conversation to the forefront. the only way to do that is bring the president head-on. >> speaking about issues, and that guy's group is talking about health care, elizabeth warren, who is very focused on her plans, continues to rise in statewide and national polpolls, which is in our poll of primary voters, enthusiasm for warren is up six points. in a new poll out of south carolina, she's up nine points and now only sits behind joe biden. split do reports that the trump campaign is taking note, quote,

the trump team, includes the president himself, had been fob cussed almost exclusively on biden, but now her rise's disciplined style, populist-infused pieces and has raised some concerns. this is pretty interesting. there was the sense, some early stumbles over the dna test and the pocantah line, and people you are now wearing t-shirts, she's got a plan for that. how real is the concern in the white house? >> there was always a lane i think for elizabeth warren to take some of that support from bernie sanders. i always interviewed a load of sanders supporters who said i also like elizabeth warren. i think sheer set her self-apart by saying the president should

be impeached. >> she made that comment about him ending up in a jumpsuit. >> and she doesn't want to go on fox news for the town hall, saying she sees fox news as a propaganda machine, whereas others want to talk to voters that watch that network. inside the white house, the people i've talked to -- or more of the campaign, they talk about joe biden, someone who could pull away support from places like pennsylvania, so joe biden, more generally, but of course i think as her favorability rises, the president will start picking on her. he said the three penalty he thought could see being part of it were joe biden, bernie sanders or elizabeth warren. we've heard the president says he's concerned about these

people. he was talking about senator harris for a while. his attention goes all over the place. >> certainly lines up with the polling, for sure. what do you do when mark zuckerberg calls. according to bob cots that, if you're nancy pelosi, you don't pick up. reportedly she's angry about 9 manipulated handling of his video by the company. of all time. lease the 2019 rx 350 for $399/month for 36 months. experience amazing at your lexus dealer. but allstate actually helps you drive safely... with drivewise. it lets you know when you go too fast... ...and brake too hard. with feedback to help you drive safer. giving you the power to actually lower your cost.

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advances in ai and machine learning have led to the emergence of advanced digitally doctored types of media so-called deepfakes. one does not need any great imagination to envision more nightmarish scenarios that would leave the government, the media and the public struggling to discern what is real and what is fake. >> sounding the alarm over deepfakes, showing people saying and doing things that literally never happened. did you deepfakes aren't just spreading on twitter and facebook, a linked in profoil, she claims to work for a think tank in washington, but according to a report from the associated press's rafer yell satter, katie jones doesn't

exist. experts who reruled the activities of the protile, it's typically of espionage efforts on of professional site has made it a more powerful magnet for spies. rafael joins some he from london and ken is back as well. rafael, always great to have an old ap colleague on the show. thank you so much for being here. this story is absolutely stunning. can you walk us through how you figured out this profile on link linkedin that presumably many powerful people thought was a person actually isn't? >> what happened was about a month ago, i was alerted by a british academic in london that head had been approached by this katie jones character. he thought there was something suspicious about her, because she would claim to work in the field of russia studies. he's a longtime russia watcher.

he had never heard of her, so he asked me to look at the profile, and i did. this was something weird about the face, miseerie. you know, when everything seems just about right, but not quite right. we slowed it around to a few experts. sure enough not only the face itself didn't exist, it wasn't a human. >> so i think we were just showing our viewers a graphic that points out how your expert detailed the signs to look for. she does look like something straight our "the americans" a perfectly crafted what you would think of's a because of individual, but obviously you have to have something intelligent behind it if you're going to try to set up a fa face network, who were they connected

to? >> so, katie jones was connected to my friend keir giles, but also other experts in washington, people who were working at heritage, people who were working at brookings, and people who were working at rand, which is historically the department of defense's favorite think tank. a lot of these people were pretty high profile academics and researchers, but there were also some u.s. officials on there. i'm thinking of an official at the u.s. department of state, paul win friday, who's apparently in the running for the fed, and a couple other folks who work in government. it was a select group of people and fairly high ranking. i spoke to about 40 of them and what they told me is probably something familiar to your users who use linkedin. they get a lot of questions all the time, and if the request looks le jet, they say. >> not something i practice in

my day-to-day online life, but ken, that is something that a lot of people do. this has such incredible implications, specifically for our politics, especially going into 2020, this makes it seems as though what happened in 2016 is basically child's play. >> the story highlighted two things, one linkedin is targeting americans for espionage. there's real-world cases of this. the second is the emergence of deepfake. the reason they used it is it would be harter to detect if it was a real person, there is reverse image searches. >> so basically if they steal a picture of me and pretend to be somebody else, somebody else can plug it into a search engine and it will poppy up this is a real person somewhere else. >> exactly. >> this becomes one of the first real-world example of deepfakes being used, and intelligence

officials irsay we could see a wave of this, this is the next front tier. >> this is what happened with nancy pelosi? >> that video wasn't typically a deepfake, a manipulated video using standard techniques, it was an inaccurately depicted video, there's a video of narc zuckerberg that was a deepfake that was designed as a message for facebook they need to get their act together and confront this technology. the creators of deepfakes are outnumbering the defenders, but i feel like we're catch warm-up it. the issue is that it doesn't take much in social media. >> what are the social media companies doing? >> it's not clear they're doing very much. they're just trying to figure out fake accounts at this point, let alone fake videos. facebook decided not to take down the pelosi video, they

seemed it as free speech, whereas youtube did take it down. even if we can flag them right around, it only takes an hour to make an impact. i have millions of people willing to believe things when we tell them it's fake all right. so a realize tick video of a politics doing something embarrassing. rafael, ken, thank you both so much. more "kasied.c." coming up in just a minute. "kasied.c." comi just a minute. ♪ limu emu & doug

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this father's day weekend marks one year since the first on the scene reports of the trump administration's controversial family separation policy. a year ago, joining me live from the border patrol processing station in texas after witnessing the impact of the policy firsthand. >> people have been detained inside buildings like this and this building for a long time. but this is the first time since -- this is the first time ever that children have been separated on a systemic basis. look at those photos right there. that is because of the trump

administration. people here are locked up in cages essentially in what look like animal kennels. i don't know any other way to describe it. in this building what happens is parents get ready to leave the building, they don't know if they will get to bring their children with them or if they will go to the courthouse and get charged. they are given a piece of paper. their children are left behind here and they don't know when they are going to see their children ever again, frankly. >> last month, jacob was awarded the walter con cronkite award. earlier today he wrote this on twitter. last father's day i was here, border patrol central processing station in the epicenter of trump's separations. today we still don't know for sure how many thousands of kids are separated. so on this father's day, our thoughts are those who still

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before we go, let's talk about what you are watching in the week ahead. rick, what are you looking for? >> what kind of nbc person would i be if i wasn't looking for the debates coming up? >> we do have a week still ahead. >> we still have a week to go, yeah. >> guy, what are you watching? >> there is one forum in

particular i was looking for, a poor people's campaign, the first and only forum of democratic candidates where people will be asked by and challenged by poor people and those that are affected by poverty policy in this country. >> how many of our candidates? >> i think we're up to ten candidates, which is pretty remarkable. hopefully it will be great and lots of people will tune in. >> i'm looking for tuesday for the president's re-election campaign in orlando. i will be down there. the president did say he was running for president again the day he was inaugurated for his first term. i will be interested to see his messaging. is he going to try to center it on health care or talk about the mueller report? so i'm interested to see what his platform might look at, if it looks any different than 2016. >> i'm looking to see if there is movement on the impeachment reporting. that's going to do it for us tonight on kasie d.c. up next, headliners.

nancy pelosi. we talk to the highest ranking elected woman in american history. at 10:00 p.m., a special hour on the stonewall riots. but for now, from us at kasie d.c., good night from washington. under the dome of this temple of democracy, we renew the great american experiment. >> she's the most powerful woman in the history of american politics. >> not just the first woman to be speaker of the house, the first woman to lead a political party in congress. >> she's like a nuclear sub. you don't hear it. you don't see it. but it's moving. >> the face of both the democratic party and its resistance to president donald trump. >> this administration just is in a