i'll be back here live from miami 6:00 p.m. eastern tomorrow night where i'll be joined by another candidate on the stage, senator elizabeth warren. we're looking forward to having her. thanks to everyone in miami for the hospitality. don't go anywhere, of course up next we begin our special coverage with brian and nicole for this predebate. see you later. what kind of nation will we be? >> i will make sure that i sign into law the equality act. >> if billionaires can refinance their yachts, students should be able to refinance their student loans. >> we are on a mission to find the america that has been lost. >> we're the party of science. >> we are the party of working people. >> we can pass criminal justice reform. >> i want to strengthen medicare for the people who are on it. >> it will be the american economy that is going to thrive. >> overturn citizens united. democracy is not for sale. ♪

>> tonight from the beautiful performing arts center in miami and from our nbc news headquarters here in new york, our special live coverage of the first democratic debate of the 2020 run for the white house. there are so many democrats in the race, so many for one stage that it will require two groups over two nights. the stakes could not be higher for the most diverse field of candidates ever seen on a presidential debate stage. a strong performance tonight could shake up the leaderboard. a miscalculation could end a campaign right at that very stage. we are less than two hours away from the start of night one. brian williams with you here from new york. i'm joined by nicolle wallace, host of deadline white house, former white house communications director for george bush 43. chris hayes is with us, host of "all in," and our claire mccaskill, former u.s. democratic senator from the great state of missouri, and

eugene robinson, with "the washington post." also joining us throughout the evening, steve kornacki who has brought along some of the big board numbers. here is the lineup. from left to right, as you will see them appear on stage tonight, bill de blasio, city of the mayor of new york. ohio congressman tim ryan, former san antonio mayor, former hud secretary julian castro. new jersey senator, former newark mayor cory booker. massachusetts senator elizabeth warren. former texas congressman beto o'rourke. minnesota senator amy klobuchar. ohio congresswoman tulsi gabb d gabbard. and jay inslee and john delaney. we want to start with our friend chris matthews, host of "hardball." he is situated in the spin room in miami, across the street from the debate. chris will have analysis, journalists with him, some of

the candidates request him after tonight's debate. and chris, in your view, is there anyone you think is poised to have a moment this evening? >> well, i think it will clearly elizabeth warren is the star of the show probably because she is doing so well right now, and she is probably overtaking at some point bernie sanders on the left. but the one i think is going to get the pop tonight when he gets his close-up is cory booker. and the reason i say this, first of all, he is going to be standing right next to warren who will have her on the camera a lot. but second, he hasn't had his moment yet, and everybody think she's better candidate than shown. he didn't get his beto moment. he didn't get the "vanity fair" coverage. he didn't get the buttigieg treatment in the press. he hasn't gotten the treatment that warren's gotten. i think when gets up there tonight, he'll do it for all the candidates, there are three things they have to tonight. they have to show motive. why the hell are they standing up there? why are they in our face?

what do they want to get done for this country? motive. secondly, passion, especially with that picture on the front page of the "new york times" today of that father and daughter lying in the rio grande. they better show some feeling. and third, and this is the hardest part for us to watch, spontaneity. they have to be able to react and show there is somebody home, not just the lights are on. but somebody is home. it can't all be canned material. >> chris matthews in the spin room tonight. nicolle wallace, you can be sure these candidates have been practicing their spontaneity for about a week. >> you know what's so funny? when the music began, all my political ptsd kicked in. it's a debate. if you've been on the other side, claire, i'm sure you feel the same way. if you've been the one preparing for debate and listening to the pregame show, people talk about the stakes, it's a terrifying night for the candidates. and this whole idea that one has more to gain or lose than the other is wrong. because as chris just said, we

will cull through every hand gesture. the history of debates is a glance at a watch. al gore coming up too close to george bush. george w. bush making a joke. >> donald trump looming over the shoulder of hillary clinton. >> hurricaning. >> no way he could get elected. >> if that were me, identical 911 if it were a dark street of new york if i walked out of here and someone walked that close to me. what ends up sticking -- and the reason we focus on those moments is because those are the impressions that are made. and everyone can cram. everyone can prepare. everyone can actually sadly for us guess the questions. but what you can't prepare for, what you can't script is your reaction to the other candidates and your interaction was the moderators. >> and chris hayes, there is no way around this. the language of debates, often the language of various state primaries is not the language in the business of trying to get 65 million americans to vote for you. >> no. in fact one thing that's interesting, even this early in

this process, i think of it as to process, there is a selection process for the candidate and a process by which the party and the coalition i'd feiss its priorities and approach to governing. and sometimes those things happen in parallel, right? donald trump ran on build the wall and he got in. what did he try to do? he tried to repeal the affordable care act. that's what the coalition had decided was a priority. what we're seeing develop in this process, which i think is fascinating and will be fascinating tonight is certain things rising to the top. liemt change, which four years ago, eavent eight years ago, you're seeing that climb up the list. you've got these two things happening. people trying to distinguish themselves, but they're also involved in this very dynamic debate that happens whereby a party finds consensus on what it is going to prioritize. and prioritization is everything. you get a few shots to do a few big things. one of the things that naps this process and we'll see play out tonight is a debate over what the party stands for from a priority perspective.

>> senator, is it a given in your line of work that anyone has a leg up? do debate champions in high school or lawyers better equipped for tonight because of standing in a courtroom and making an oral argument? >> well, courtroom lawyers probably have a little bit of an advantage because when you're in a courtroom, you do have to think on your feet. there is nothing canned about the give and take between witnesses and opposing counsel, and even how you interact with the jury. but let me just say this. i think you're right about the policy stuff. but what these folks really need to do is make an impression on people. a bunch of these folks are done after this week, because, you know, the bar gets higher for the next debate. it's not or so many donors or 1% in the poll. it's twice as many donors and 2% in the poll. so at least half of the people we're going to see over the next two nights won't be around for the next debate. so how do they rise to the level of making that impression and

maintaining that spontaneity that you talked about? because if they tried to force it, it will be an epic failure. >> that's exactly right. if they try -- if everybody watching says boy, they're really trying to make an impression, that's not a good thing. you can't seem to be trying to make an impression. you to seem to be authentic. yes, spontaneous, but also you have to seem like you could stand up against donald trump. you have to seem like you can stand next to donald trump in a debate setting and give better than you get. and that's what i think a lot of people -- >> i think what you wrote yesterday about this is who we are, question mark, the country and who we are after next election day is on the ballot. i hear you on the policy stuff. but i think this is about more than just connecting and getting the priorities right. thing is about saving the

opportunity. and i don't think that's -- i think that's where the democrats have the opportunity to reach across the aisle and grab the attention. we know donald trump is going to be watching. republicans will be watching. and i think you put it perfectly in what you wrote yesterday. and joe biden so far has sort of branded his candidacy, if you will, with that message. >> he has done that. >> it's about taking a 2 x 4 of the ugliest aspects of trumpism. the three legs of donald trump's stool, the "access hollywood" tape came roaring back into the headlines with another accusation of assault. the muslim ban was updated with the children being victimized by his immigration policies. those aren't mistakes to the policy. >> that is the policy. those are features. >> exactly. and taking the downtown the brink of war with iran. that was for kicks for the president last week. he was telegraphing the whole thing on twitter. this is about big stuff. and i don't think anyone put it better than you. >> i think the other thing that is interesting about this debate is the hardest question and answer is the simplest.

why should you be president of the united states? there is 100 million people who are constitutionally eligible. >> how are you going to beat trump if 16 republicans who are indisputably more qualified and indisputably have more character and one democrat who had more qualifications, how you going to beat him? >> remember, in the middle of the country, it's hard to forget how disgusted everybody is with washington and the insiders. so this insider-outsider dynamic is going to be huge. who can dress up, even if they're not an outsider, and convince people that somehow they can be a change agent. and part of that is how realistic is the promises they're making. >> exactly. >> because the american people have figured out now that there is a lot of stuff that people promise, and really, getting 60 votes in the senate and actually getting it done, that's a whole another ball game. i think it's important that they actually focus on what can be

done and not try to overpromise and not appear to be of washington. >> two pieces of business. number one, your humble host already awarded the state of ohio to tulsi gabbard, apparently. i called her an ohio congresswoman. she couldn't be more of a daughter of the state of hawaii. u.s. army reserve major and war veteran tulsi gabbard. more about her later tonight. let's check with chris matthews in the spin room. chris? >> i want to back up with gene said about showing you're the person to stand up to donald trump. in the first ever of these tv debates back in 1960, the great debate between jack kennedy and richard nixon, just as jack kennedy was about to go on the stage with nixon, his brother said this, and i'll do it in spanish a bit. he said kick him in the cojones, since we're on telemundo tonight. but it was very clear what he was saying. go at him, hit him with everything you have.

nixon's running mate, henry cabot lodge gave him the opposite advice, erase the assassin's image. that got nixon all nervous about looking too tough and mean. kennedy went in there, i'm going knock this guy off the stage. i think you need that kind of atmosphere. i think gene is right. if you don't show that tonight, they won't know you can take on trump. >> no, i agree with that. i think we're all saying different versions of the same thing. i think expectations are so high. i think democrats are desperate to feel -- and what do i know, the republican here, the former republican. but to field someone who answers all of their hopes and dreams at a policy level, but can also demolish trump and trumpism. >> a lot of the voters enough of their policy hopes and degrees. >> i think so. >> you know, it doesn't have to be the whole nine yards, but it does have to be trump. we have to end this. and that's what the mood that a lot of people are in. >> there is also a kind of show don't tell aspect to this.

the best way to show you can beat donald trump is be good in this debate in this context. talking about how you're going to do it doesn't do much. it's actually performing in the moment. in some ways, that's what will be interesting as the primary process plays out. people have images of ele electabili electability. this is the biggest test so far. you will see is that person charismatic, does that person have a compelling message, am i drawn to that person. that's going to be the thing that speaks volumes about the ability rather than any message about beating trump. there is also the inescapable brack drop going into tonight, the news we've been covering all along. we're going to fit in ra first break. when we come back, a democratic member of congress, specifically, a member of the house intel committee to talk about all of thats a our live run-up to our live debate tonight continues. here are even more reasons to join t-mobile. 1. do you like netflix? sure you do. that's why it's on us.

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we're going to be covering ten candidates on this stage coming up at 9:00 eastern time as we count down to the first of the two democratic debates, the first of the 2020 cycle. as i said before the break, there is no denying the news we've been covering. we talked about some of it so far this week. it was a little over 24 hours ago last night we learned the news that robert mueller, responding to not one but two subpoenas apparently, will be testifying in public in front of cameras, live coverage and all the rest in front of not one, but two congressional committees. we have a democratic member of the intelligence committee right now, connecticut democrat jim himes is with us. congressman, first of all, thank you for coming on. and to start with this mueller news, he's not a hostile witness, but your own chairman described him as a deeply reluctant witness.

and he is not your witness or the republicans'. he is deeply agnostic politically. how do you make him your witness? because it's the democrats who scauld him there, after all. >> yeah, and, brian, i don't think of it that way as making him our witness. i mean one of the amazing things as you just pointed out about bob mueller is that despite the president's attempts to smear him, to suggest that he is biased, anybody who knows bob mueller or has followed his career, knows he is a man of deep integrity. and he is going to do everything he can to be faithful to the words, literally the words of his report and to the truth underlying it. now, if you want to sort of say how does that help somebody or hurt somebody else? i think the real value in having mueller testify is not that he's going to make news, and i would not expect a headline. when he said his testimony is that report, he meant it, the value of the testimony is that, let's face it, most americans

have not read the 448-page mueller report level. be asked to sort of make some of the more salient points from that report. and quite frankly, if you read that report, if you want to think about this from a partisan standpoint, that is not a happy moment for the president of the united states. >> congressman, i follow your evolution, your tv appearances to where you arrived on monday, which is as a supporter of the commencement of impeachment proceedings. i would put you as a reluctant person to put you in that position as you're describing robert mueller. i wonder how you take all this reluctance that has been channeled to the public, mueller's reluctance to come to capitol hill, your reluctance and other democrats' reluctance to do something. to anyone who looked at the substance, robert mueller couldn't say he didn't commit crimes. he didn't charge a criminal conspiracy with the russians, but gosh, for some reason, 150 reasons talked to trump associates. how do you guys get yourself on

offense? how you make it an asset that robert mueller is going to stick to the four corners of that report? all of it feels so apologetic. >> i wouldn't say it's apologetic. i can answer your first question about why was i reluctant to come out in favor of impeachment. look, i think with a weapon as powerful as impeachment, i mean, it is at the end of the day, probably along with declaring war, the single most awesome that the congress can do. i would like to believe that people wouldn't rush there and say we got to do this immediately. it should being? that is considered. and this is where i was tied up until this monday. i was thinking hard about how divisive would this be? because it will be divisive. will this prevent us from getting an infrastructure deal done that i desperately need and want for my district, and i'm not ashamed to admit that i don't believe that there is any chance that this president is removed by impeachment. so my eye was also on the effects that could happen on our opportunity to deliver accountability to this president which i think is the 2020 election.

the reason i changed, i changed my mind because largely after talking to my constituents, they were begging for clarity. they were saying don't try to game out what you can't game out. the behavior of the president is abhorrent. it is not consistent with our values, and it is certainly not consistent with the constitution. so say that. just say that with clarity and conviction, and that may change the weather around all the things that you are playing with in your head, about the politics, about how this affects our ability to get things done. >> i'm in line with your constituents. i think that clarity is what is missing. if i could follow up, in the search for clarity of constituents, what's the first question to robert mueller? >> well, you know, we haven't yet gotten together to sort of talk about how to make these proceedings. quite frankly, up to the caliber of bob mueller. bob mueller is only reluctant to testify because he knows that he

is about to enter into an actual -- an absolute firestorm of partisan interest here. the republicans are going to spend the day trying to damage his reputation, to suggest that he is not impartial. the democrats will be trying to use bob mueller to make the president look bad. now what we need to do, and i think this serves the democratic purpose is to basically summarize the parts of the report that get to the president's misbehavior. this is a report about the president's misbehavior. it may be true and i'm willing to accept that it is not indictable with respect to the russian. but as you point out, holy smokes, 150 russian contacts. let's make sure the russian people know that. this is bob mueller's words, the president asked people to lie, fired jim comey because of the russia thing. there are a lot of people out there who don't know about the president's behavior.

it's spelled out in black and white in that report. >> congressman, chris hayes here. the white house has used some fairly extravagant legal theorys to block testimony before congress. do you anticipate them using any roadblocks here? >> that's exactly right, chris. that's at the core of the substance of my decision to call for an impeachment. all of the apparently illegal behavior is secondary to a president saying i'm not going recognize the authority of congress. i mean, a president that doesn't recognize the authority of congress is essentially a king, and that is not the way our system was set up. and so, yeah, i do anticipate that that will -- that will continue to be a problem. and i would note, chris, that if we do switch, if the speaker changes our mind and we do find ourselves operating under the rubric of an impeachment inquiry, it's not like the president and his people are going to roll over. we're going to continue to need to fight 24 in court. and by the way, we're winning in court. if we are operating under the rubric of an impeachment,

congress' power in that moment is at its very highest, because, of course, that is a power granted exclusively to the congress of the united states. >> connecticut democratic congressman jim himes, thank you very much for cottage with us as part of our run-up coverage to the debate tonight. we appreciate it. and about that debate, we're about concluded with the first half hour. 9:00 p.m. eastern is when it gets under way. we'll be going back there to miami when we come back. with fordpass, rewards are just a tap away. whether it's using rewards points toward things like complimentary maintenance. or for vehicle accessories. and with fordpass, a tap can also get you 24/7 roadside assistance. and lock your vehicle. only fordpass puts all this in the palm of your hand. fordpass. built to keep you moving.

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we are back and apparently if the hall, the security lid has been lifted. everyone has passed through metal detect. >> and the first guests are arriving to find the best seats. steve kornacki is here for us at the big board with some of the numbers that these candidates bring into the hall tonight. not fair to say they are only known to family and close friends, but close foresome of them who are in decimals, correct, steve? >> yeah. there is quite a range here. ten candidates up on the stage. and polling is a part of who got to qualify for these debates tonight and tomorrow. and where they're going to be standing on the stage. so one way of looking at this first batch of ten candidates we're going to be seeing out there tonight, i think there are three different groups you can kind of create with three different challenges heading into tonight's debate. so the first group among this candidate of ten is a group of

one. it's elizabeth warren, center stage. elizabeth warren stands out going into tonight from the rest of the people on the stage for this reason. if you look at the polling, this is the average poll numbers for all the candidates right here. if you look at the polling for all of the candidates in the democratic race, there are five who have popped so far. five who have gotten some momentum. five who have been hitting double-digits. this is their average. elizabeth warren is the only one of the five who is going to be on stage tonight. biden, sanders, harris, buttigieg, they all go tomorrow. for elizabeth warren, she is the big star of the stage tonight. so it's a chance to stand out. of course, she loses that opportunity for direct contrast with the other candidates she is most directly competing with in the polling. so warren, that's your first group. your second group i'd say is these three. it's beerk, beto o'rourke and amy amy klobuchar. when they started, their average polling when they got in the race, they were all talked about as having a lot of potential.

there were even polls that had beto o'rourke in double-digits. this was his average. i remember talking cory booker 20 years ago. they talked about him as a potential presidential candidate then. look what has happened since. beto o'rourke plummeted, more than five points off his average. booker is falling. klobuchar is falling. they have not lived up to the potential that they were talked about having. so for beto o'rourke, this is an opportunity to hit the reset button tonight, for cory booker, amy klobuchar. forrest of the field, the other six candidates who are going to be on the stage, this is like when they talk about the ncaa basketball tournament. survive and advance. remember, the rules change. at the end of the summer for these debates, the criteria goes up. the polling threshold rises. right now the polling threshold that will eventually exist, none of these candidates would meet it. they have got to improve their poll standing through this debate tonight or through something this summer or they're

going to start getting left off the stage when we get to labor day. for these candidates, we say they all want to stand out. these candidates in particular have to find a way to stand out, have to find a way to get their polling numbers up, or they're not going to get an invitation once the fall rolls around. >> it's a brutal business, isn't it? >> it is brutal. >> but they all made the choice to enter the game. >> they did. in some ways, the candidates with nothing to lose are the most fascinating to watch. chris, you've sat with beto. he is running against sort of the ghost of beto. he has all the skills. he had captured everyone's attention. i've not met a democratic activist who wasn't intrigued by his candidacy and promise. but he is always sort of running against the ghost of beto the senate candidate. >> yeah, i think that's his problem, that he had his moment with that "vanity fair" magazine cover, and everybody said this guy is getting too much adoration by the media. and it faded.

i think he was replaced in the media heart if you will by buttigieg, mayor pete. but even he i think after last week's tussles with the situation with the police shooting down south bend, that he is having problems holding on to what he had. and i do think, i do think, nicolle, we're still in the baskin robbins. they're testing and tasting and saying i think i'll try this for a few weeks and see if it holds any heart or not. so i think we're still in the early stages of this. i want to bring in reverend al sharpton who has been there. how many debates have you been? ? >> we did about 32 when i ran for president in 2004. >> total vote? >> i don't even remember. >> oh, come on. >> i don't. but i tell you one thing. i'll be watching tonight atsz o

as one that was on the stage. there is a huge difference having been in local stages and local situations. and when you walk in and those big lights hit you and you have millions of people, different backgrounds, different regions of the country. one of the things i think you can't in any way play games with is your authenticity. you've got to come through tonight as authentic. you have to have passion, and you have to have content. if i were to use an entertainment example, now you've got to prove you're not a lounge act, that you're ready for the big stage. if you can't play the big room tonight, you either front tonight or make it. and a lot of those on that stage tonight have never been on the benjamin stage. >> but you're in new york politics, you had been a pretty big stake. let me ask you. how do you get as big as the stage? somebody like cory booker tonight, my hunch, this might be his moment for the close-up. i don't know. what do you think? >> thing is his moment. if he's going to break through, he's got to break through tonight. i think the way you get as big

as the big stage is you have to really make it about more than you. if you just come in and take shots at your other candidates, or just spend all night taking shots at trump, it doesn't show you're big enough to be president. you want people to walk away saying i could see that person as president. that person took their shots at trump on policy, but they're big enough to really own the seat of being president of the united states. and i think that's what they need to could. >> i love hearing that. back to you, brian and nicolle. >> good stuff there. thanks to chris and the rev. another break for us. again, we're all aiming toward 9:00 eastern time. all the folks on your program from left to right, all ten of them. night one of the democratic debate from miami still to come. fidelity's rewriting the rules of investing. again. introducing fidelity stock and bond index funds with lower expense ratios than comparable vanguard funds. and we now offer the industry's first true zero expense ratio index funds directly to investors.

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there is the hall in miami, the performing arts center. the first members of the public are starting to stream down the aisles. in not too long, we'll have ten democratic candidates for office on that stage. almost an equal number of moderators. but that's a subject for another time. welcome back to our live coverage and the lead up to tonight's event. we keep saying this is happening, of course, against the realtime backdrop of the news we've been covering. for starters, the president of the united states is airborne, bound to the g20 summit in osaka, japan. also, there is the news story that has really captured the attention for all those who weren't following it previously. of the united states' treatment of families separated while trying to gain entry to the united states, specifically the children. and we have two of our

correspondents covering this exclusively for us. gabe gutierrez outside the holding facility in clint, texas, that has been the focus of so much of the attention. jacob soboroff outside the facility in homestead, florida. gabe, i'd like to begin with you. i know you were given a rare glimpse of the facility today. we weren't allowed to bring cameras in. we're relying on your skill of description. >> well, brian, you're exactly right that it is rare, extremely rare to get inside one of these facilities. as jacob can also tell you, access is heavily limited to these border patrol facility, and this one is certainly no exception. as you mentioned, brian, this is the same one that earlier in the week we have been hearing the reports of nearly 300 children moved because of, quote, appalling conditions. the headline, brian, right now is that we learned that if 300 sounded like a lot, we just heard from border patrol

officials that a month and a half ago there were nearly 700 children crammed into this facility. right now it is still over capacity. it has 117 children inside here. it was originally built less than a decade ago to hold 106. so let me tell you exactly what we saw. we were brought inside. we were not allowed to speak to any of the children. we were not allowed to bring cameras inside, just a pen and a paper as is common in these types of tours. no handout video was given, no still photos were given out. we were taken to a conference room for a briefing, and then we were shown several areas of this facility. we saw children held in nine cells in a central processing area. i did see one older child in tears, apparently walking back from a phone, heading back to this cell, apparently to reunite with her brother or her sister. she was in tears. but other than that, i did not see any signs -- any clear signs of children in any distress. i can tell you that the cells, many of them were full.

one cell was allowed to hold the boy and girls. others are meant to separate boys and girls in different age groups. one of the cells is a quarantine area for any children that has a disease or has the flu. we saw one girl with a face mask that was there as well. we were then taken to another area that was a converted sally port. and it had makeshift air conditioning, but there were bunk beds on top of one another. there were three children sleeping on these bunk beds. some were playing soccer in this area. brian, nicolle, i must say if you're thinking this is a huge warehouse where all the children are, no, that's not the case at all. this is a makeshift area. and frankly, what struck me is how in the world they were able to cram nearly 700 children into this compound, brian. >> gabe, when you say cells, it's a word that jumps out. we all have a mental image of them. you paint a little picture for us to describe what we're talking about? >> right. and i've seen these in different

border patrol facilities before. these are processing facilities. when undocumented migrants are brought in, they're brought into the cells and held for processing. these children are not allowed, they're not supposed to be in these facilities for more than 72 hours, brian, but we're told that the average length of stay for these children in these facilities is an average of six to ten days here in clint, texas. and some may stay even longer. if they're hospitalize, some children could stay here for as long as 30 days. it does include the hospital stay. but the cells are several feet by several feet. it was hard to get a real sense of exactly the dimensions of each room. some of them were sleeping on the floor on blue mats. they had blankets over them. not mylar blankets. we're told this facility doesn't use those. but the kids were either talking, some were trying to sleep. there was one television in each of the cells that border patrol officials say they were allowed

to use and request tvs or movies. but overall, some of the cells were extremely cramped. what struck me is how many were put into this facility at any one time, brian. still 117 in here right now. >> gabe gutierrez in clint, texas. jacob soboroff, you cover this story all day, every day, and i imagine all night on a lot of these news cycles. but a lot of us are drawn to the horrors when we see the images. and the images you brought us when you went inside, the images of the mylar blanket and kids in cages. even the president's appointees had to acknowledge that they were kids in cages. the image that everyone is still reeling from, the image of the father and his very young daughter who died facedown in horrific circumstances. can you talk about, can you just -- what is the state right now of our country's treatment of children coming here seek asylum?

>> there has never been ra more consequential, a more aggressive deterrent policy time in the modern era. over the course of the last 30 years, this country has been based on a largely deterrent-based immigration system. and the consequences are people die when they try to get into this country. i want to remind everybody, exactly one year ago, the trump administration was ordered by a federal court in southern california to begin the process of reuniting the thousands of children it systematically took away from parents. that process is still not over today. there are still children that were separated by the trump administration that have not been reunited. some of those parents were deported to their home countries without their children. tonight i'm 45 minutes away from where the debate is tonight. and i'm in homestead, florida. this facility behind me is currently housing 2300 unaccompanied migrant children, and they will sleep here tonight. i was looking over the yard earlier tonight, and there were hundreds of girls that were playing throughout in the yard. this facility is privately owned. it is essentially elizabeth

warren was here today. amy klobuchar was here today. elizabeth warren characterized it as a private prison for children. hhs which operates the facility disagrees with the way she put it. but reality is there are people, human beings, john kelly, former chief of staff to president trump. what i'm looking forward to hearing from the democratic candidates tonight is not just what you don't like about what donald trump has done, but what are you going to do about this? what are you going to do about this? what are you going to do about the separation of children at the border? how you going to be different from the previous decades of deterrence-based immigration. president trump took it to a level that nobody had ever seen before and has created life-long trauma for literally thousands of children that will never be able to overcome the experiences that they've undergone. but people have always died coming to this country. since the late '90s, 7,000 people have died coming into the united states trying to evade the border patrol just like that father and the daughter that everybody has seen the picture

of today. so beyond criticizing the trump administration, what are the democratic candidates going do when they get up there tonight in terms of how to take this country's immigration policy in a different direction. >> jacob soboroff. before that, gabe gutierrez, both of them outside these holding facilities, an issue that has clearly taken hold this week. we have to fit in another break, as you might imagine. we have several people waiting to discuss this exact issue, how it might play out tonight, after this. maria ramirez? hi. maria ramirez!

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can put back in the tube without people dying. his immigration policy, the combination of the cruelty as it's animating purpose and the incompetence with which it's carried out and the constant churn of turnover, that they can't find anybody terrible enough to marry up the cruelty of the policy or the incompetence is to me more than a question to the primary candidates. it's a national emergency. and i asked jeremy bash this week, if you advise a foreign leader and you're going to america to visit, do you go if america is jailing babies? do you go? >> that's a good question. deliberate cruelty to children, that's the policy of the united states. exactly that is intentional. that is what is being done in our name. so i guess they have to speak out about that tonight. >> and he and stephen miller believe this is the the deterrent. if we take them from their

families, families won't want to come here. if their rush to try to deter families that are on the brink of total disaster in the countries where they live, poverty, crime, he thinks that by deterring them, he is not harming our image around the world in ways that may be -- we can't repair it. it may be that bad. >> it's also a testament to the fact as we prepare for this debate, campaign promises matter. campaign rhetoric matters. the president railed against catch and release. he said they were sending rapists. he demonized them at every turn. he was serious about that. that has carried through. when you look at those detention facilities, that is the reality of not doing catch and release anymore. that's why we're detaining an expanding metastasizing set of irregular detention camp, precisely because of the promise the president made. back in the campaign he is making good on. >> it's a logical next step to

do with people about whom you speak in the same terms as you speak of fish. >> yes, that's right. exactly. >> and if that's how you think of them, then this is how you treat them. >> if we took russia, are you listening as one of the canaries in the mine for his intent or eagerness or enthusiasm to collude with the russians, i think that the treatment of children should be covered with the same seriousness of purpose. he intends to do this to the most innocent human beings on the planet. and the way he is conflated all the words, an asylum seeker is not this. to conflate the most desperate human beings and the youngest into one group and use them as a political pinata is to me one of the most egregious of a very egregious presidency. >> senator, back in your last job, if someone -- if a government lawyer came before the u.s. senate and said isis prisoners are being forced under our control to sleep on concrete floors with foil blankets and not given regular access to

basic personal hygiene, would that be an actionable matter before the senate? >> probably not as much passion and outrage for an isis person as for a 5-year-old. in fairness, if you look at the political realities. your point is well taken, however. and the other thing we're not talking about here is having some knowledge of how the homeland security department works. i was the ranking member on that committee. having some knowledge about the differences between cpb and i.c.e. and i.c.e. officers and border agents, you need to understand the chaos that is enveloping this agency. you actually had some of them not with attribution, but going to the press this week and saying we actually liked the priorities of the obama administration because at least we knew what our job was on any given day. this we don't know who is in charge. we don't know who is going to be in charge tomorrow. he calls that we're going to do a raid and then we're not doing a raid.

there is so much just total chaos at that agency that the men and women who are trying to enforce the laws and maybe some of them with more enthusiasm than they should, are really throwing up their hands now and saying this is just being incompetently run. and a big part of this, it is evil, but it's also massive incompetence. >> just for the record, "washington post" correspondent in tehran, jason rezaian, who was held for more than a year in iran's worst prison was given toothpaste and was given soap. so if we're treating children worse than the iranians treated an american prisoner in their worst facility. >> joy reid is standing by to talk to us. i wish he we had a cheerier topic to welcome you into this conversation. but we can't pick the backdrops against which this takes place. >> i think it's important to have this conversation before the debate.

i'm hoping that the debate participants get a chance to answer that question that i think the panel just threw out, which is how do you restore a sense of the america that we've said we are for the longest time? because what donald trump has done is dismantle that america and replace it with this, with deliberate cruelty to children, with this hideous system that legitimately gets talked about as concentration camps. that's the debate we end up having, what to call it. what we see is horror, and the horror is deliberate. to quote adam serwer, his base wants to see this cruelty to prove to them that he is hurting the right impeachment i want to see how these democrats respond to that. >> joy, do you think there is any chance -- you people today were talking today about beto. he has spoken passionately and eloquently with a lot of expertise from that state about these issues. do you think there is an

opportunity for him to kind of have a moment or capture both the tragedy that you're talk about, the cruelty and offer some solutions? >> it's a great opportunity for him. he obviously is from a border state, a state where this is emergent, julian castro also has that same opportunity as his mother came over, humphrey chicana. we see that horrifying photo of the father and daughter face-down dead in the rio grande. that's the actual picture of what the world sees when they think of america now. that's what they think of us. the world is watching us deteriorate. and donald trump is leading it joyfully. people like stephen miller, this is what they want, and this is what they want to show the world, that we're willing to be as cruel as you could possibly be, maximally cruel to children in order to scare brown people

out of coming here. it's horrifying. i've been sleepless watching it happen. and so i'm really hoping to hear from the debate participants tonight, and not just the two texans explain to us, because remember, the democratic party is utterly dependent on people of color. they're dependent on black women. they're dependent on latinos. that is how they win. so explain to those people and to just anyone with a conscience how do you change this if you become president? how you undo the existential nightmarish damage that this president has done to everything about what we've said we are, everything. even if you doubted when american presidents said that we are the shining city on a hill, even if you thought it was bs and a sales job, at least they said it. donald trump doesn't even believe it. he doesn't even want to be a shining city on the hill. he doesn't want to lie to us and tell us we're good people. he wants to be cruel. he wants to be vladimir putin. and that's not going to work if the united states is ever going to lead the world again.

>> you know, joy, you talked about beto and julian castro who are both texans. i was down at the border interviewing beto o'rourke and he made all this news. i said look, there is a wall in el paso. should they take it down? he said yeah. it was an interesting moment, because he does have -- it's an issue where he has policy command. they put out a very comprehensive policy that would essentially go back to the case management system that would not necessitate detention. he has some policy command on it. if there is a single thing that he has genuine passion authentically coursing through him, it is on this. it is on the border. it is about immigration, migration. that is something that he can speak to i think in a fairly distinct way. >> handy is right. the reason that there isn't a wall, and the reason that even the compliant republicans in congress won't give him money for a wall is because a wall doesn't actually stop illegal immigration. >> right. >> we want to bring in andrea mitchell. just told she is available to us from miami.

her first rodeo this is not. andrea, between the two of us, we've seen our fair share of debates in the past. >> yes, we have. >> but referencing our conversation here tonight, the backdrops are always different. tonight's backdrop features air force one winging its way to japan prior to a g20 summit where we know going in our president's going to talk to xi of china, putin of russia, and he told us just today what he discusses with putin of russia is none of our business. >> exactly. and remember helsinki. we still don't have the notes if there were any notes. no one even in the intelligence community knows exactly what was said during that two-hour private meeting. he is heading to japan, and the japanese have already watered down the draft of their climate proposal, the g20 agreement, the statement, to take out the words

"global warming" under pressure from the u.s. if they were to mention the horrible words, global warming. that's the kind of pressure this president is exerting on our japanese allies. at the same time he got a birthday card or letter from kim jong-un. so very happy. he called it a beautiful letter. he sent a letter back. we're now in line to have a third summit, even though there is no agreement on what denuclearization means, and the north koreans have not given up anything, this after the failed hanoi summit. and tomorrow, iran is set to break out for the first time of the iran nuclear accord incrementally under pressure from the europeans not to do it, but under much greater economic pressure from the u.s., all of this getting back to your point, these were the promises the president made. to get out of the iran nuclear deal and not to join the paris acco accord, to get out of the paris climate accord and trade, the trade war and immigration, to

shut down the borders. >> andrea mitchell in the spin room studio for us tonight. andrea will be watching along with the rest of us, which remind us, it is 8:00 p.m. eastern time this evening. whatever we witness on that miami stage this evening, remember, it takes place against the backdrop we've been discussing. the president airborne, en route to japan for the g20 and a meeting with vladimir putin, among others. a border crisis back at home, chronicled in our last hour. tensions with iran. an allegation that the president raped a woman in new york two decades ago, and the news just 24 hours ago, that one robert mueller will testify before congress and on live television three weeks from today. or as we prefer to call it, wednesday in the era of donald trump. i am joined by nicolle wallace, former white house communications director for george bush 43. chris hayes is with us, host of "all in" and claire mccaskill,

former u.s. democratic senator from missouri, and eugene robinson, who to the best of our knowledge has never served in the u.s. senate, but does have a pulitzer prize by dent of his work as a columnist for "the washington post." also with us throughout the e , evening, steve kornacki, who has brought along some of the numbers from his warehouse to share with us. and in miami, chris matthews, host of "hardball," live from the spin room. it is a lot on this debate night. >> it's so much. i'm so glad. it's bleak and it's grim to talk about everything happening, but the democrats, this debate was articulated best by michelle obama. when they go low, we go high. whoever wins is going to have to give us that shining city on the hill that joy talked about. but they're going to have to get down there and slug in with their right hand while they lead with the left. they're going have to walk and chew gum. >> i was in that room when she said that, and it got huge cheers. if you go back and poll democrats right now years later about how do we feel go high

when they go low thing, people feel very different than. >> you got to do both. every working mother knows this. you've got to order groceries on your phone, not that i was doing that on the break. but you've got to do everything at once. you've got to juggle spinning, burning knives. that's what this democratic nominee will have to do. >> i think it's interesting just listening to andrea talk about the constellation of international problems and crises. and it's going to be interesting tonight. >> that's not important. >> here is what has struck me. the energy. you know, i sort of came of age as a young political reporter as george w. bush and iraq. when you would go to democratic events, people wanted to talk about foreign policy and specifically want to talk about the war and what was happening with the war and all that. foreign policy has been remarkably absent afrom the conversation among the democratic party from the run-up to the debate. it's not where voters' heads are at. when you look at the polling, you go down and down and down number you get to it. and yet, what we know is that

particularly with the senate, with mitch mcconnell barring some unforeseen miracle for the democrats, that is where the president has the most power, where the decisions are often the most consequential. and it will be very important for these folks to articulate division both in response to donald trump and their own about those sorts of things. >> and what you talked about, nicolle, in terms of having a to do both, think about their challenge tonight. they have to do that in about five to eight minutes. >> yeah. >> they've got to figure out a way -- >> they're lucky. >> they have to figure out a way to show they have command of the issues and also show that they can kick donald trump in the shin so hard that it makes everyone in the country go okay -- i want to follow up on your point on foreign policy. i actually think that our domestic crises have become foreign policy crises. i think there will be a world leader who will see children in

cages and say i'm not going to america until they get babies from south america and central america out of jails. i actually think sort of the cancer around immigration policy and other domestic policies will become national security issues for the democrats. >> because what happens domestically matters so much because of what the united states is, because of the economic impact and military impact we have across the world. diplomatic impact we used to have across the world. you know, just to step back for a second about tonight and tomorrow night, sort of take them together, it does kind of feel that finally it's getting under way. there has been the whole sort of overture to the campaign. it feels like now we're off, or in about 50 minutes, we're off. >> we're to be off. and one of our copilots is with us, robert costa, national political reporter for "the washington post." also happens to be moderator of washington week in review on

pbs. standing by in our washington newsroom, bob, who have you been -- well, you're never going to tell me who you've been talking to. what have you learned? let's skip forward to what have you learned? >> all eyes on senator warren. she has gained traction in this democratic presidential race. they believe her allies tell me this could be a showcase for her tonight, for her progressive values, her populism to counter president trump on a lot of those populist economic issues. they believe she has also been ready with all of her plans to try to fend off any attacks that might come. >> and about those in the steve kornacki grouping of about half a dozen, some of them polling sub one-point levels. we've been saying, stating the obvious, some campaigns may end on that stage tonight in miami. >> they very well could. i sat down this morning for an hour with seth moulton, the massachusetts congressman. he didn't make the debate stage.

but what moulton offstage or john delaney at the edges, you're trying to get attention, because the threshold for making the stage in july, in august will only increase according to the democratic national committee. expect potshots at times on a personal level. many top strategists try to tell me because so many of the democrats actually agree on policy. there aren't many sharp differences. yes on medicare for all or maybe a different version on health care. there are differences out there. but there aren't wholesale huge gaps between many of the candidates. >> the democrats, of course, because this is a democratic gathering, run the risk that people like us are going to use phrases like circular firing squad after nights like this. it was interesting when kocory booker game after joe biden. cory booker started his remarks by saying this is not a circular firing squad.

with that in mind and realizing some of their worst critics will be in the room, robert, talk to us about the other side. talk to us about the people around the traveling white house en route to japan, how they and the president will be viewing tonight. >> they know on thursday they're going to be paying attention to vice president biden. but they are too watching senator warren tonight. they see her as a threat, someone who could win over trump voters in the industrial midwest by talking about economic issues, by having plans on the economy, on tax that could appeal to working class voters. they want to see can she be effective on this stage? she has been effective on the campaign trail. can she make that pitch to a national audience? and they're also paying attention slightly to candidates like beto o'rourke from texas. he has slipped in the polls. but they always know a movement style politician, whether it's beto o'rourke or senator sanders or senator warren could be a problem against a politician like president trump who himself runs as a movement style

politician. >> robert costa, all we ask of you, as always, when you put your phone down after talking with the numerous people you talked to on the phone, make your next call to us. we will put you on the air during the course of the evening. thank you, as always, for joining us. i could not help but notice steve kornacki in front of a graphic that says "all eyes on warren." steve, what do you have? >> i swear we didn't know that bob costa was going to say that. we actually had this in here. the setup there was perfect. yes, elizabeth warren comes into this debate as the highest polling candidate who is going to be on this stage. let's take a look first of all. it's been a surge for her. let's take a look at that and put that in some perspective. go back to january 23rd. what you're looking at here is her average performance in the polls. she was polling at 4.3% january 23rd. that was her low point. remember when that was. she had just been through at the end of last year, that controversy where she took the

nah test. the bottom line is her numbers were dropping. she hit 4.3%. expectations for her campaign were being revisited that was then. where do we stand now heading into the debate? she has tripled her support since then. she comes in averaging 13% with a trajectory upward. elizabeth warren more than any other candidate has improved her position over the last few months. now the question becomes where is her strength and where does she still need to improve if she wants to move into the next rung here and have a shot at taking out joe biden for the lead. well can show you first of all, very liberal democratic voter. you see quite a trend here. among very liberal voters, she is getting 21%. let's start working our way back ideological. now 14% for liberal. moderate, now we're into single digits, 9%. conservative, down to 6%. very conservative. actually it jumps up two points. but basically, you can see a stark ideological divide with elizabeth warren's support.

and these categories, moderate and conservative, it's not the majority of the democratic party. there is still a big chunk of democrats,on the moderate side who would define themselves that way. she's got to make inroads there. we say she is very strong with liberal voter, particularly white liberal voters. race enters into this as well. among white voters on the democratic side, their polling on this, you see elizabeth warren right there in third place, right behind sanders, 14%. in a democratic presidential primary, though, nationally, one out of four votes next year are going to be cast by african american voters. it's essential that you get traction with african american voters to have a shot at the nomination. there warren runs about half as well as she does with white voters, getting 8% in this poll. two ways to look at that if you're warren. clearly, you need to improve on that if you're elizabeth warren and you want a shot at the nomination. but look at the name you don't see here. pete buttigieg. warren and buttigieg both doing well with white liberal voters,

but warren unlike buttigieg has a pulse with black voters right now. and that's got to be the most promising thing when you look at the numbers here for elizabeth warren's campaign. she's got grow, but that number suggests there may be potential. and that's one of the things i'm going fob listening nor this debate. we have seen elizabeth warren make direct appeals. her campaign understands the imperative there. i'm surio curious how she addre that. >> thank you. chris hayes, i'm watching nicolle wallace. nicolle's guest that day was one donny deutsch who was doing branding and strategy work for the democratic party and is quite open and up-front about it. >> most of that work on tv. >> okay. he stopped me in my tracks when i heard him say if it's warren, they lose 48 states. >> i think that's a view that some people hold. and i think that underestimates

a little bit her political talents. one of the things that i think is interesting about warren is that she has carved out this niche as a policy candidate, the i have a plan candidate. her bio was pretty fascinating. i think she stayed away from it because of the questions around the claim of native american heritage. of everyone in this race, she is someone who grew up in a white working class family, this term that we use all the time. her brothers went and served. she dropped out at 19 from a scholarship on debating to marry her sweetheart. she went to night school. she was a special education teacher. on one level she is the harvard liberal. she comes from working class folks and is able to talk in that way. the thing i will talk than, if you cover politics or you are a politician, people are good or bad communicators, and you see it. when she is in a room with people, she is a good communicator. >> let's talk about who she is really a threat to tonight. because i would make the argument that elizabeth warren is not a threat to joe biden

tonight. >> not tonight. >> she is a big threat to bernie sanders because what's really happening in this polling, and i would hope that steve would back me up on this is that she is stealing votes from bernie sanders. biden has not moved. all of the kerfuffles in the campaign, and there haven't been that many, but they've been blown up in the media, he stayed steady. she is not getting hi votes. she is getting bernie's votes. so the person who has the most to lose from elizabeth warren meeting expectations tonight is none other than the oldest candidate in the race, bernie sanders. >> she gave us a lot to unpack? can i? >> please. >> i agree with you that biden hasn't been touched by what has been covered as scandals. you want to elaborate on that? >> well, his numbers have not moved. >> and you don't meet any voters that are as bothered by the things that have been covered as you do reporters? >> that's exactly right. and thor thing that is going on here, if you look at bernie sanders's numbers and the

african american community, they were double-digits, i think 17 i looked over there. i will tell you, i think that is familiarity with who he is. i'm not sure that bernie ever really had much success getting votes. i mean, hillary clinton killed him in the african american community in that primary. >> yeah, she did. >> so the african american question is can kamala or cory booker or pete buttigieg or elizabeth warren or anyone really touch the support that joe biden is enjoying right now, particularly from older black voters. and i will tell you, elizabeth warren has a long way to go on that. she may get there, but it's really biden. if you combine elizabeth and bernie's votes right now, they still are under biden. >> they're getting rather goes to him. >> it's close. two or three points. >> i think under tonight's rules, you give at least 60 seconds for rebuttal. >> 30. >> no rebuttal.

>> i think it gets to one fascinating thing about warren and her support and that issue with bernie sanders, and it's this. clearly if warren's going to be the nominee, she needs to eat into what sanders has, obviously prevent him from climbing. there are some clear differences in the early going, though, because their supporters right now. elizabeth warren supporters on the democratic side, we're seeing right now that. >> tend to be not just self identified liberal. college educated much less likely than we see with sanders voters. truthfully, i think warren's rise so far has really come more at the expense of pete buttigieg, stopping the momentum he had early and kamala harris, preventing her from breaking out further. but for warren, that's not enough. she needs to start eating into that sanders coalition there a little bit too i think to climb um and challenge biden. >> steve kornacki, thanks. i don't know where i had heard the phrase before, but bernie said today the system was rigged against him in the last election. >> oh, my gosh, that's so 2016. >> search my brain.

i am speaking this way because we must go to another break. you see the seats filling up. some people might have gotten better ones on stub hub. we don't know. we do know than there will be ten democratic candidates on that stage within the hour. and we'll be back with our live setup coverage. ♪ i've been diagnosed with age-related macular degeneration,

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we are back. 8:20 eastern time for a 9:00 start time on the debate in miami. as we mentioned, chris matthews is just across the way at the spin room, where he'll be receiving and handing off journalists, candidates, all kinds of people tonight, which includes right now our friend garrett just off the road. >> thanks.

what i hear you've got for a story right now there is going to be people going after the front-runner tonight that would be elizabeth warren. >> i think we'll quite literally see elizabeth warren getting hit from the left and the right tonight. the two men on the far ends of the stage have telegraphed in different ways their idea of going after her in this debate. you have john delaney on our air today talked about hammering the idea that medicare for all is not the way forward that free college tuition is not the way forward. while he was targeting bernie sanders more on those comments, elizabeth warren will be a perfectly acceptable proxy. on the far left side of the stage your going to have bill de blasio who sees himself as a progressive champion in his own right and is somebody who quite frankly likes to mix it up. far more political as a political knife man than some of the other candidates. the dynamic in the room will be weird because of the physical distance. but for the viewers s at home y

could get fireworks. >> here is the question. delaney is a fiscally conservative business guy running in the democratic field. how does he convince democrats who don't generally show much interest in the cost of things, how does he earn their intere interests. >> there is not much of a caucus for that. if delaney has a path, it's to be a very version of joe biden. i don't know that he can show that tonight. but he could get help. the dynamic here, if he hits elizabeth warren from the right and she is trying to defend herself as not as progressive as you might think or not a scary liberal, and bill questide blass maybe that's not scary enough. >> she is going after millionaires, billionaires. she doesn't say billionaires, but a millionaire tax, a wealth tax. she has made a lot of commitments in terms of cost. >> but she's got pay for it with somebody's money, probably people who are better off. how does de blasio beat that to

the left? >> universal two weeks of paid vacation like he wants to push through in new york city. a very popular idea if you're somebody who can never get a day off. >> garrett, we pull you into the floor from the road. you've seen the candidates and raising money, talking to donors. who is primed to have a moment where in the room they make an impression, either by getting a laugh or sort of having the chutzpah to launch a sharper attack. most people don't realize how auch twhard is standing at a podium right next to someone. >> i would be shocked to see the elbows get super sharp here tonight. i think it is one of the things other than the folks i mentioned, unless you have to do it, i think it will be a misreading of the room. i would watch cory booker as somebody who could potentially get people fired up in the room. when i watch him on the campaign trail, he tends to rise to the room he is in. he can be a little bit much if you cover him at a house party, if there is 20 people in the room. but if it's a big stage and a

big speech, that's the kind of environment that i think he is comfortable in as a candidate. if he can get himself properly worked um, he is somebody who has the right emotional cadence and pitch that i think could excite the room if he gets an opportunity. >> i'm with garrett. and back to you, i think he is right. it's watch cory tonight. >> all right. the pride of pennsylvania and the pride of texas in one place. thank you, gentlemen. >> did you feel like there was a story there? i feel like when garrett comes back, i want to know what happened at the house party with kovrnlt. >> it's reassuring to know that garrett from texas and my late mother from chicago both used the phrase "he is a little bit much." >> we're going push on that. >> i think that one of the things that is central here is that the appetite for a lot of brawling amongst the potential voters is low. you know what i mean? >> we get that during the day. >> people read the room. and i just think that there's

not a lot of appetite in the part of democratic voters who generally feel positive across the board or don't know who the heck these people are. i don't think the way to make an impression with them that lo would be favorable -- it might be memorable -- but would be favorable is some sort of scorched earth attack. i don't think is much appetite for that. >> talk about the room versus the only audience that really counts. forgive room, and that is the people watching at home. it is so tempting if you have any audience empathy at all, this is true for any major venue to talk to the people in front of you, though exponentially greater the folks watching at home. >> although both play a role. >> yes. that's true. >> you can more effectively communicate to all the people watching if they sense you're connecting with the audience in front of you. so, for example, making a funny joke, if nobody in the room laughs. >> that's bad. >> people watch willing go well,

that was weird and awkward. and i don't really want them in my living room for the next four years. there is an element of both. and i don't really know how many of these candidates tonight have been in a big tv debate before. certainly beto has with ted cruz in texas. that certainly qualifies. that was all in by a $100 million race down there. but most of these candidates are from safe places. >> yep. >> they're from very blue place. and when you're from a very blue place, you are not used to really mixing it up. because frankly, a lot of your debates don't really matter if you're debating a the republican because you're going win no matter what. so the pressure on these candidates is a different kind of pressure than most of them have ever had. >> bill de blasio, new york city. >> you've got to mix it up. and warren had to debate scott brown who was the incumbent. >> right. >> and was not coasting in that race. >> you know, the other people who will be watching tonight are donors too, campaign donors. and this is an expensive

proposition, running for president. so some candidates will get a boost in their fundraising and some get cut off. >> thing is an argument to be made that in some ways, particularly this early on, because it's real early, that might be the most important thing. particularly from a small dollar perspective. >> exactly. >> the ability for someone to have a breakout moment and oh, who is that person or not even a who is that person, but reexamination. and that's klobuchar or cory booker. >> or beto. >> about how early it is, summer of '15, donald trump was already near the top of the polls. the republican primary never changed. >> that's true. >> and by the way, let's just guess, will any of them ask for a $10 contribution tonight? you know, low donors, low donors is where it's at this cycle. it's not the big -- it's not the 2700 checks in living rooms. >> but here is the thing know about that comparison. the key to donald trump and the

key from the beginning and all through the donald trump era in which we still live is the power attention over all of us. it's bad attention a lot of times, but it's attention. everything revolves intentionally around him. there is a real question about whether the intentional dynamics of this race will be similar to the intentional dynamics of the republican race because of the rear with we live in and the media environment, or if there are some fundamental group psychological asymmetries because republican party voters and democratic party voters. it's an open question. we haven't run this experiment in the moerner remarks 20 candidates in the era of donald trump. does attention matter the way it mattered to donald trump even when he said i like people that weren't captured. every headline was about him. it doesn't matter people found it disgusting. does that matter on the democratic side in the same way, or do voters have a stronger reaction of disgust? do voters have a feeling of rejection that never' rose in sufficient numbers to knock donald trump out? >> that's a really good

question. >> we haven't lived a lot of this before. we're going to take a break. when we come back from this break, we'll be within the half hour mark of things getting under way in that very hall in miami. maria ramirez? hi. maria ramirez! mom! maria! maria ramirez... mcdonald's is committing 150 million dollars in tuition assistance, education, and career advising programs... prof: maria ramirez mom and dad: maria ramirez!!! to help more employees achieve their dreams.

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so viola could focus on her future. their future. this is how we inspire hope. this is how we heal. cancer treatment centers of america. appointments available now. within a half hour now. soon we'll be going down to miami to hear some of the opening and welcoming remarks. lucky couple of hundred people are there for this first of the cycle debate, the first of two nights of debate among the democratic candidates. nicolle wallace, have i heard from several people, american citizens, voters who have reminded me that most folks don't want to see a fight. most folks don't want to see a knife fight break out. they want to hear a discussion. they want to get to nose these candidates. >> the two things i hear most, and it's connected with what claire said, the feeling about their front-runner is one of

protectiveness. there is a lot of ptsd. i think the democrats feel about the media treatment of hillary clinton, and it surfaces in worries about the media's coverage of biden, is that fair? and then there is a lot of angst about covering any of these candidates at their low points. i mean, just talking about beto not having kind of the magic of the senate run. just covering what is indisputably a crisis for the mayor of south bend. pete buttigieg makes democrats anxious. so i think it's all wrapped in the same thing. they're so -- i mean the trump presidency is so searing, it has people -- i worked on campaigns. you wanted to win. but if you worked on campaigns, you really didn't think about the result after election day. you feel like oh, i believed in something, i worked for the campaign. the trump victory is so searing, it is so gutting, it is such a disorienting feeling of we're not who we thought we were that

just the way we talk about the democratic candidates is fraught for most democratic voters. >> it's a stripped down party that is rebuilding on the fly. >> i've had these conversations with people. the thing i remind people, and again, we don't know what precedent extends. we all watched those republican debates which were insane. they were the ugliest. most depraved indecorous displays that anyone -- >> did you see fox business this morning? it's still happening. >> we watched them go after each other. we saw ted cruz pivot to the counter and you're sniveling. and at the end we thought they all destroyed each other and nominated this complete ridiculous buffoon who is now the president of the united states meaning i'm not sure we know which dynamics do and don't lead to strong candidates. i really don't. and i understand people's impulse they shouldn't go after each other. people don't want to watch that i understand where that's coming from. but i am not convinced necessarily that in the sort of

brutal darwinian logic of winnowing and selecting candidates who are going to be able to survive him that some amount of conflict and fighting and getting after it is not to the benefit of the process. >> the other thing that democrats forget, i think, it's kind of a general amnesia, there was like an election last year. the democrats did really, really well. >> they lost the last big one, though. >> they lost the last big one, but since the last big one, there has been an election. it shows that all has not fallen apart in terms of the democratic party, its appeal, its mobilized base, traumatized perhaps. but they sure mobilized themselves last november. >> it's a good motto of the democratic party. >> in major way. so that should -- we should remember that, i think. democrats should remember that.

and republicans should remember it too. where this race kind of starts. >> as i keep reminding everybody that night when trump won, we were all here in this room. there was no victory speech written or loaded in any computer. >> i was in communication with sources at the trump campaign. and i think i was sitting right there where you are, claire. and around 10:30, i was texting with a source. and the source said do you think we should have a victory speech? and i was like yeah, probably. and it slayed me to say it. but when people talk about ptsd, it's in the media too. we got it wrong. but trump didn't think he was going win either. you look like you were bursting before. >> well, i think it's really important to remember that there was an insider/outsider factor in the trump campaign. it wasn't that america was just really thrilled. he had terribly low approval numbers.

>> still does. >> for a newly elected president. america wasn't happy with either one of their choices. but one they shout you know what? everybody said we thought barack obama was going to be change, and things haven't changed that much for us. so let's pull the pin on the grenade and toss it into washington and see if this guy who is the ultimate outsider, who is saying things that nobody's ever said running for president before, and i don't think we should extrapolate too much from that that is somehow now the new way of getting to be president is by saying bizarre, weird things and going after your opponents with personal insults. and i do think if any of the candidates try that, there will be a visceral negative reaction from most democratic primary voters. >> steve kornacki back at the big board. how can you possibly contribute to this with numbers? >> well, we will solve all the problems in world. we're talking a minute ago about the possibility elizabeth warren potentially has with that attention with bernie sanders,

trying to win over his voters. a number that puts that in some perspective is the profound, and you'll see in a second, the profound age gap that exists in the democratic race right now. this is the quinnipiac poll. take a look at this. voters under 50, look who is leading the way in the most recent poll. it is bernie, 32% of the vote under 50. go over 50 years old, look at sanders, from 32, look where he comes in. 5%. 32% under 50. 5% over 50. for instance, the debate over debt-free college, those sorts of issues that are being debated here sanders versus warren. there is an opportunity. when you say warren can eat into sanders vote, it's specifically with the younger voters. over 50 sanders is barely registering. something to think about tomorrow night when joe biden takes the field, under 50 he is sitting at 18% right now.

over 50, that's the strength of biden's strength. older voters, cleaning up right there. when you get younger, that's where biden has trouble. that's where sanders has his strength, and i think that's where warren tonight as an opportunity. >> the man is never unfascinating to use a double negative. miami, steve kornacki. we are minutes away from going to the first of its cycle debate in miami. you hear the music that music around here means we're going sneak in a break. we'll be back on the other side. we'll go down to chris matthews in the spin room.

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8:42 eastern time and change, and a big sweeping look at the big sweeping venue, several balconies tall. okay, so that was an accident.

but we tried to turn it into a positive. just keep going. >> i was with you. >> you sold it to me. >> thank you. thank you very much. i tried. >> he's got a button under the desk. >> anywho. we should go down to chris matthews in the spin room. he has two guests of ours to talk to about all of this. chris? >> i do, brian. i have michael steele who is with us. thank you. let me ask you about this question of the star tonight at center stage based on polling is elizabeth warren. make a bet. is she coming out of this thing ahead? michael? >> i think she does. look, she's going to lay down a lot of policy tonight. i think she of all the candidates on that stage is going to be the most disciplined to talk what has gotten her past the early bumps in her campaign. people are gravitating towards her. it's a conversation they are engaging in. why would he is change up? she holds that line, she'll come

out well. do. >> you agree her momentum continues after tonight? >> yes. i think she can get up on the stage and do what she has been doing every day on the stump and back in congress and even at harvard. the only thing she has to worry about is meeting the time led line for her responses. >> who is going to be the number two success tonight? >> i think senator klobuchar could have an interesting moment if she decides to use her record of winning in trump won counties and districts in minnesota to show and argue that she would be tough on trump in a general election. that would not only show her efficacy as a democratic nominee, but take away support possibly from joe biden, who is viewed right now as the -- >> you see her entering that moderate lane? >> certainly, yes. >> entering it. she is going to be part of defining it, i think. tonight is a way for her to do that, particularly with biden going tomorrow. it won't be a whole lot for the party to take in at one time, because if they were both on the stage at the same time, it may be a little different tactic.

but tonight she has an opportunity to do exactly what alexei just said. you know who else i am keeping an eye on? mr. yang. >> yes. >> mr. yang of all the candidates has the absolute nothing to lose card to play. >> let me go back to amy klobuchar. does see an opportunity after buttigieg's bad week? >> in what way? >> a moderate challenging ultimately biden? >> yes. i don't know that those two things are related, though. i don't know that klobuchar's campaign views someone like mayor pete as a direct challenger. they're totally different as candidates. and as michael said, she is sort of -- she is sort of defining the centrist lane already in her policies and where she is from and where she is winning. >> we have a moderate lane and progressive lane. thank you. we'll go back to tom perez who is speaking on the -- actually on the debate floor. >> an opportunity for everyone. folks, you're going to see that we have a remarkably deep field of incredibly qualified

candidates. the most diverse field in the history of our country. that's who we are as a party. folks we have 496 days until the most important election of our lifetime. let me put it differently. 496 days until the weekend. we got work to do. the stakes couldn't be higher. our democracy is on fire. it's a five-alarm blaze. our health care is under attack. women's reproductive health is under attack. the right to form a union is under attack. civil rights, voting rights are under attack. the future of our planet is at risk with the urgent threat of climate change. our character as a nation, our basic commitment to liberty and justice for all, no footnotes, is under attack.

folks, millions of americans are struggling to make ends meet while the rich continue to get richer with the reckless ill-advised republican tax cuts. you know, this president is not simply divisive and dangerous. he's chronically ineffective. he spends countless hours tweeting when he should be solving problems and forging consensus. and as a result, we are less safe, we're less respected around the world. how can you ask our friends around the world for help when you disrespect them with regularity? you can't. this presidency is a long trail of broken promise and a bottomless culture of corruption. democrats believe in fairness. we believe in hope and compassion embodied in lady liberty. we believe that children should never be separated from their parents.

we believe in the dignity of all people, including asylum seekers luke oscar ramirez and his daughter valeria. tragically drowned this week in such an avoidable incident. we believe zip codes should never determine destiny. we believe we should be building more schools and less prisons. we believe everyone has a fair shot and should have fair shot at the american dream. we believe that elections are about the future. and what you're going to see tonight is our candidates communicating with their vision and their commitment to have your back on the issues that matter most to you. that's what it's about. now we're going to have a spirited discussion of critical issues. we should welcome that. i certainly welcome that.

and while you will undoubtedly hear differences of opinion on critical policy issues, one thing is clear. what unites us far exceeds what our differences are. our unity is our greatest strength, and our unity of values is our greatest strength and this president's worst fears. now i got a prediction -- >> the head of the democratic party giving what is a very standard thing at these events, a kind of pep talk warm-up to the audience in the hall. and because we chose to take a minute or two of that, by extension to our audience. nicolle wallace, the question for you as a political professional, did they take that speech text on a thumb drive and plug it in for a nominee at the convention? >> listen, it really affirms the conversation that we've been having, the things that you've all been saying. these elections do not take place in a vacuum. and as you've been talking about, there is a oxygen sucker

in the middle of the political arena named donald j. trump. these candidates aren't going to have to speak to all of the crises that we're in. and i think he touched on most of them. i didn't they are going to have to draw attention to not just donald trump, but to all of the brush fires he started. i think we are putting so much on the eventual nominee, we should always remind ourselves that no one else who ran against trump could wrestle back any of that attention. nobody in congress, democrat or republican has figured out how to wrestle back the lime light from him. we are asking them to do something no one has figured out in three years. >> part of that starts with orienting one's self in relationship to the president and what i mean by that, how much you talk about him.

that's one of the most interesting rhetorical choices and one of the most interesting choices made on the campaign trail. >> the guy at 38% started his campaign by taking a two by to his racism. it suggests that democrats want something. >> that's his theory of the case and think it's early. there is a lot of trump fatigue and ma cab obsession and desire for conversations that don't involve him. >> joe biden was smart. that's precisely what you said. trump is the central fact of the selection. there are all these issues, a lot of them caused by trump. he's in the way. ever o before you can get to the issues, you are going through him. that's why you can't define the

electability and all the pitfalls of trying to measure this quality, but a lot of people are going to be thinking about that because there is the 800 pound gorilla, literally, in the room. >> i don't know the answer to this, but our production team will perhaps have to deal with donald trump during this broadcast. the u.s. air force does an excellent job and among their many talents, a lot of miles between the air force and the white house communication agency. they can bring in on satellite, live television and presumably they know how to make a tweet exit from the fuselage. this will be interesting. this is the first ever that i can remember full field debate schedule with a looming character of the other party over the event. >> looming, the best word. >> to your point about biden, whatever your approach s you have to have a theory of the case. you have to have an approach.

biden approached and warren has an approach. she talks about him as a symptom and doesn't talk a ton about him, but you have to have a r an approach and a theory. the folks around the clinton campaign will tell you this. you will get sucked in. >> but warren's surge happened at the same time when she became one of the leading voices for trump's impeachment. she managed to synthesize the mueller report in a sentence. something that no other man or woman in the party could do. she is about more than trump, but the single most effective communicator on the subject of impeachment on the mueller report. >> i have to interrupt you. i'm sorry. they are all coming out on the stage. >> they are not doing the -- >> the first order of business is a group photo to avoid the republican debate we watched

back stage. . >> say what you will, some of them have mastered the point and wave, master bide bill clinton. you don't need to see or know anyone in the crowd to master the point and wave. it makes a very good picture.

it looks like the leading man's tie color tonight is blue. that's about all we can report. deblasio beats everyone in height. he's about eight feet tall. >> as much of an enormous moment it is and nerve racking it can be, there is a little bit in the crowd. you are not going out there on one. i feel like in some ways, there takes a little bit of the burden off. >> only better than a couple of them. >> you have to outrun the bears. >> i started to say before they came out, he may be the huge sucking oxygen out of the room force, but also the unifying force. trump will unify this party no matter what happens in the primary. >> i guess they are trying to tell us something with the backdrop. this is where they will stand

and this was to avoid any miscomfort and misunderstandings. you see the clock in the right hand corner. >> you see what they are doing? how they are all writing? they are writing down their lines they are not supposed to forget. they do that right away because you can't bring notes. while you have the few moments, what is the point i have to make or my line i rehearsed to sound spontaneous? >> i love to see this and i feel like we should be quiet. >> remember to precede your answer with what is? the audio folks just adjusted the mikes and that game famously an issue in the last round of debates and resulted in a big microphone change for all the white house going forward.

the first ever to insist on a microphone he can be on top of. that's what we have today. you are so right. they are fresh from having it drilled into their heads. most of these -- >> did you drop the plural of podium? >> poedia. >> i try. >> that's like shank of the night. >> it's poedia. this is exactly as uncomfortable as it is in the room. they have several hundred people in front of them. they are urged to keep quiet at this point though urged by a manager to make a lot of noise when the broadcast starts. i assume alliances will develop across candidates, but all bes

are off once we are under way. >> that's funny about alliances and trump as a unifier. most of the candidate who is talked about the primary talked about how even in the awkward moments, they would shake hands and there was camaraderie about having to be on the stage with the oxygen sucker. >> two minutes to go until the debate begins in miami. a reminder to all, we are at this again tomorrow night. 10 more democratic candidates. that doesn't could for all the democrats who didn't make the cut. there are still more. tomorrow night we get to hear from, among others, buttigieg, sanders, and so on. the moderators of tonight's debate. five of them, 10 candidates.

i think we have everything handled on stage. >> these nerve racking when you know everyone is talking about the final preparations? >> you don't want to make small talk. >> par want to think. >> first of all, it gets you out of your head. you need to be focussed on how to be stronger. it's all awkward. they are trying to look friendly. they don't feel that friendly. >> a reminder. at the conclusion of this debate, our team comes back on from this studio for two hours of live post debate coverage. obviously we will take a look back at all the substance, all the style, any of the moments

that become moments over the broadcast we are about to watch. i have been assures this camera will be secured by the time we go live. we are within 10 seconds of the first democratic debate of the 2020 cycle. we will let the on moderators in the room take over. moderators n the room take over >>. >> good evening. i'm lester holt and welcome to the first democratic debate. >> i'm savannah guthrie and this is the first chance to see the candidates go head to head on stage together. we will be joined by josé diaz and chuck todd and rachel maddow. >> they are trying to nail down where they stand on the issues and which of the hopefuls has what it takes. are. >> now it's time to find out. >> new jersey senator cory booker. former housing secretary julian castio. bill