>> yes. >> surely not easygoing for the children of dave and debbie hawk. >> we do the best we can. >> that's all for this edition of "dateline." thanks for watching. good morning. i'm jo ling kent at msnbc world headquarters. here's what's happening right now. an unprecedented step and surprise summit. president trump visiting the dmz and doing something no other sitting american president has done before. this hour, the significance of that meeting and what kim told trump and the expectations for what comes next. attacks on kamala harris getting support from her democratic rival after new onlineiv attacks. defending biden, the new voices speaking up in support of the vice president. we begin with breaking news from

the demille i tarized zone in north korea. president trump was the first u.s. president to step on north korean soil. it was the first time they've heard kim jong-un's voice speaking korean. >> the voice you will hear is the translator. >> good to see you again. i never expected to meet you at this place. [ inaudible ] >> you'll be the first u.s. president to cross. >> you can hear the cameras clicking at that moment as the president crossed over that demarcation line four hours ago taking a step into north korean territory and returned to the south side with kim at his side. after the photo-op and a few shouted questions from journalists, president trump is

opening yet another door to another possible summit with kim. >> invite him right now to the white house. >> the leaders then retreated behind closed doos for almost an hour of talk. when they came out, president trump escorted him to the demarcation line. tow today the president declared the meeting was a success and played down north korea's recent weapons test. >> very small ones. these are missiles that practically every country tests. these were -- we don't consider that a missile test. actually, it wasn't a test. but we'reas talking about ballistic missiles, long-range ballistic missiles. not only not testing them, hasn't come close to testing them. there were no nuclear tests. hans nichols and janis mackey frayer are -- >> hans, what else did the

president have to say on this historic day? >> sure. well, we know a little bit what was discussed in that meeting behind closed doors because the president was at the air base talking about how he was offering economic prospects. economic opportunities to the north koreans. it gives you a sense of what these negotiation rs like. one bit of news from the president aside from the conditional invite, the conditional offer to the white house was the idea that sanctions begins north korea could be lifted during the negotiation process. the old line -- negotiations were complete and completely and unverifiably denuclearized. the president has made is clear he wants to take it slow. >> the meeting was a good one. very strong, very solid. great relationship. we'll see what can happen. we want to get it right. we don't want to -- we're not looking for speed. we're looking to get it right. in the meantime, there's been no

nuclear tests. no ballistic missiles, there's been a lot of goodwill. there continues to be. i think probably after today, better than it was even before. >> jo, the president said he told his negotiating team to start working with a north korean negotiating team to try toot hash out some differences two to three weeks, then potentially we could haveee a fuller, full-on third summit. although the president stopped short of saying that. as you mentioned, he did make a little bit of history. the president said it was legendary. i don't know about that. it certainly was historic. the president crossed across that line and was in north korea for about a minute. retrieved kim jong-un and brought him back for longer negotiations. >> thank you, hans nichols. the pictures are incredible. stay with me. i wante. to bring in janis mack frayer all in seoul.

you've covered the previous summits. what does the speed, the lack of a need for real speed indicate here? >> reporter: well, obviously, this is president trump considering this part of i his foreign policy win with north korea. he has prided himself on his personal diplomacy with kim jong-un and he has believed all along that this is going to lead to the deal of the century. the optics would play well for kim also. he will be able to take this back to a t domestic audience a show that he has further validation, that he is an international statesman. that he had the president of the united states send him a personal message to come and meet him to make history as he set it foot on north korean seoul. this is a pr victory for kim jong-un. what they also likely talked about would be kim jong-un's frustration since the failure of the hanoi summit.

he went back empty handed and he was embarrassed with the breakdown in talks, that he wasn't able to get any sort of sanctions relief out of those negotiationsth with president trump. so whereit does it all leave us? how does this change things? the skeptics are saying we're effectively back to where we were 15 months ago with the two sides agreeing to talk, saying that working level negotiations will resume. they haven't named their teams yet. they're committedea to seeing i through. there's also, as hans mentioned, this slight shift in the reward system that president trump had alluded to. the fact that there might be partial sanctions relief if the negotiations go well. but fundamentally, things have not changed. north korea has still not agreed to give up its nuclear weapons and therepo aren't many analyst who believe they will. thebe stockpiles effectively ha grown and, of course, they have

resumed testing of short range missiles andge testing. something they did a couple of months ago. what president trump was saying wasn't a big deal to the united states. what has happened is that north korea has still been able to make these gains. they have the commitment of the president, that diplomacy is back on. the coming days and weeks we'll see if this does lead anywhere and still what is the absence of a coherent u.s. policy on north korea. jo ling? >> janis, thank you for the excellent reporting. i want you and hans to stay with me. i wantth to bring a north korea analyst for the cia, formerly. and goesh at the -- >> you commented what it was like tont hear kim's voice and tell me about that. what was your overall assessment of what we saw unfold last night? >> well, it's always surreal to

hear a north korean leader's voice. i followed his father, kim jong-il for many years and his father barely spoke. he spoke maybe once. i don't remember ever hearing his voice. to hear kim jong-un speak was a surreal experience for me. this whole thing is obviously surreal. going forward, while it's somewhat historic, obviously, the first sitting u.s. president to step foot on north korea. i'm glad the working level negotiations are going to begin. but i am very doubtful that it's going to lead to progress of denuclearization. it's been a year in singapore. we haven't had a roadmap, we don't have a timeline. i'm still very skeptical what this will really lead to in terms of concrete denuclearization steps. >> to his point, bobby ghosh, i want to know, are we back at

square one? >> that's the most positive spin. that we've t gotten back to whe we were after singapore, with both side talking about more talking. the north koreans not having conceded one inch in their nuclear visions and theh president ofnu the united state claiming that he's going to get more from the dictator in pyongyang without anything to show forwi it except this time has handed kim jong-un an enormous propaganda treasure. this is propaganda gold. these images we've scene of the american president going across. it is historic in many ways. but here's one much those ways. an american president has now stepped into north korean soil without having got anything in return. all the -- kim comes off this looking very good to his people. it's a big propaganda victory for him. for the united states, i'm not seeing anyta reason to be

optimistic. >> bobby, what are the effects beyond north korea and the u.s. and south korea, what message does this send? >> well, there's been a whole other diplomacy that's been taking place between north korea and china, traditionally their main allies, but also between vladimir putin and kim jong-un. it looks like he'll make a trip to moscow as long as -- there are other countries that want to engage with north korea. what happened and we said this when it happened in singapore. by meeting kim jong-un, president trump has legit mated the regime. it was historically a pariah regime. nobody except the chinese wanted to touch these guys. now countries want to do business with the north koreans, with or without american sanctions. this regime, the regime itself does not really need american sanction toss go away as long as they can get what they want from the chinese and now from the

russia russians. as far as kim is concerned, that's plenty. that plus photo opportunities with donald trump is much more than kim jong-un reasonably could have expected a few months ago, never mind a few years ago. >> hans, before he met with kim, president trump made a striking claim about president obama. listen to this. >> president obama wanted to meet and chairman kim would not meet him. obama administration watts begging for a meeting. they were begging for meetings constantly. chairman kim would not meet with him. and forwi some reason we have a certain chemistry or whatever. now, let's see what happens. we have aet long way to go. but i'm in no rush. sanctions are on. i'm in no rush. >> hans, let's backtrack that statement about president obama. was president trump correct? >> well, there's no evidence, jo, to suggest that president obama wasjo begging or in any w had a foreign policy oriented

towards directly engaging the north korean leader. there simply isn't evidence from his aides, it wasn't part of the president's public pronouncements. we're unaware of this. his own senior aides have come out and said this is absolutely untrue. there is a criticism, which some of obama's own confidants make. namely it was neglect. in that meeting that president obama had with then president-elect, he made the point that, look, i'm handing this mess to you. it is a problem. you are going to have to do something about it. buto there's an acknowledgment from obama officials that they didn't dedicate that much time to north korea. now, the time, north korea looked different. yes, it was a nuclear state. the nuclear program wasn't as advanced and the acceleration at the beginning of the trump administration put the world on notice about the scientific advancements that north korea had made. there doesn't appear to your

original question, there doesn't appear to be evidence that the obama administration was begging fora meetings with kim jong-un >> janis, what was it like in seoul, was it business as usual, another day in south korea? >> reporter: well, south koreans are accustomed to the situation with the north and certainly there were people watching with some interest. there were protesters in the street, many pro-trump protesters and some anti-u.s. protesters. there is the sense that they want to see progress. this is anse issue passed throu generations. they would like to see a resolution to it, namely, moon jae-inwould like to have some sort of progress. he was on the sidelines today. hesi said he would be. there wasn't a sense he was purposely excluded. he said there would be another time forer interkorean relation

to take over. today was about reviving the process between the united states and south korea. >> what do you make of the invitation to the white house that trump made? is this the president's version of the carrot he's holding out to n kim, he's extend to go him? >> i think yes, of course. president trump is extending carrots further. but i'm not even sure -- when he said two to three weeks, he gave the timeline of two to three weeks and then we'll see. again, that further le jet mizes kim. domestically, internationally, we're completely forgetting about the fact that this is a guy who killed his half brother at the airport using a banned wmd. he killed his uncle. all the human rights violations in north korea. we're not thinking about that.

we're legitimizing his rule. it's a big win for kim. to invite him to the white house when north korea has not taken a single step towards denuclearization? i think this is a big win for kim and not for us. >> due think, sue, it's realistic that we'll see steps towards denuclearization given the flip the way they've approached this entire strategy? >> if our goal is denuclearization, we're not going to get there. but i do think an interim deal is possible with north korea. for example, kim could offer president trump -- for sanctions relief. president trump hinted that we're going to give sanctions relief during negotiations. interim deal is possible. remember, we did have deals in the past with north korea. 1994, 2005, 2007. we had agreements with north

korea. they just fell apart over verification every single time. interim deal is possible because two leaders want a deal. that doesn't mean it's a denuclearization deal or we're going to get there. >> hans, building off of what sue just said, what did the president indicate there on the ground in terms of sanctions relief? >> reporter: hans? -- maybe we lost hans there. janis, can you answer that question? >> in terms of sanctions relief, there weren't any particular that is were coming out of the details of the meeting that president trump had with kim jong- jong-un. sanctions relief is something that kim has been looking for all along. it's what he went to hanoi expecting to walkan away with. when he didn't, it led to a colossal breakdown. there weren't even working level talks. just a couple of months ago,

north korea was venting frustrations through state media saying that it didn't want to negotiate with secretary of state mike pompeo anymore. if they expected north korea to return to negotiating table, they had to replace pompeo. they didn't likepl the way he w talking in the sense that the u.s. was looking for full dee luke larization before there would be sanctions relief. jo ling, i want to touch a bit on thean role of china in this. >> yeah. >> as we know, the regional dynamics dictate that not much happen here without china's hand being somehow involved. they went into the g20 meeting and the bilateral with jinping, both sides very hardened in terms of where they were with the trade war and the deteriorationan of trade talks d came a away from it with the announcement that they would resume trade talks and also that very curious backtrack that

president trump had on huawei, that ban on the sale of american equipment. that was a huge issue for the chinese foside. all of this, if we push the timeline back more, comes after xi jinping's visit to pyongyang where he had fruitful meetings with kim jong-un. if twwe look at how the pieces came together, it was remarkable what was happening today i and there wasni probably a lot more discussed at that closed door meeting between president trump and kim jong-un than what's being revealed. >> janis mackey frayer. hans nichols, bobby ghosh, sue mi terry. ahead, political news including this headline. kamala harris is surging and birtherism is back. sm is backles are excited about the potential of once-weekly ozempic®. in a study with ozempic®, a majority of adults

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developing this morning, 2020 candidates are helping kamala harris fend off attacks online. this was posted during the debate tweeting, kamala harris is not an american black. she's half indian and half jamaican. donald trump jr., the son retweeting to his 3.6 million followers. he has since deleted it. deleted that question you see on the screen. a spokesman for the president's son telling "the new york times," it was a

misunderstanding. harris' campaign now comparing the allegations to birtherism. campaign spokeswoman lily adams saying this is the same type of racist attack used to attack barack obama. it didn't work then and it won't work now. several of harris' 2020 rivals are jumping to her defense on twitter. elizabeth warren said the attacks against kamala harris are racist and ugly. we have an obligation to speak out and say so. >> joe biden who clashed with her during the debate, he tweeted it's disgusting and we have to call it out. racism has no place in america. the former vice president battling criticism over his recent comments on race. louisiana congressman and co-chair for biden's 2020 campaign, cedric richmond, coming out to defend him. >> cory booker and senator harris both said in the preface to their question that they don't believe that vice president biden is a racist. i don't think anybody in the country believes that he is a

racist. he was a great vice president to barack obama. if we get so focused on history, we're going to forfeit our future. we have a clear and present danger and racist in the white house and we're debating 40 years ago when the supreme court is at stake and other things. >> joining me now, dave leventhal, senior political reporter and melanie za known a with politico. thank you both for being here this morning. dave, i'll start with you. is that conventional wisdom from the democrats as a whole? do they have to stop looking at these historical issues and focus on only the future if they're able to win in 2020? >> of course, history informs the present and the future. you can't completely lose sight of history. by the same token, too, talking about 1974 and bussing. if you're over the age of 50, you might remember that. if you're under the age of 50, you probably won't have any frame of reference, certainly not any personal frame of reference. in an election when it's going

to be so important for democrats and republicans to engage younger voters, to get them motivated, get them out to the polls, this is not something necessarily going to be the biggest issue for younger people, at least in terms of the historical aspect about it. they want to hear about what joe biden wants or the 24 candidates in the here and now as it pertains to race or just about any other issue. >> melanie, we're already seeing echoes of 2016. rolling stone is reporting the campaign. there's an online campaign that's been deployed as harris is facing what's called the birtherism attack. you've got a bot net. the network of bot accounts. they've been amplifying that tweet that we referenced earlier. what kind of political impacts will this have in terms of polling and real life results. >> this is alarming to see. reported that a number of the bot accounts tweeted the exact same disgusting allegation about kamala harris.

they found their way on the president's son's twitter feed. he has millions of followers. this could be a preview of the disinformation campaign to come in 2020. of course, as you mentioned earlier, this is the same playbook used against barack obama with the birtherism movement. president trump then donald trump and private citizen was pushing these allegations. it comes as kamala harris had that breakout moment on the stage where she so eloquently talked about her experience as a black woman growing up in america. so clearly, these racist, disgusting attacks are an attempt to undermine her ability and authority to speak on issues of race. i would also point out, this isn't the first time that this sort of idea reared its ugly head in the 2020 race. conservative operatives questioned whether she would be allowed to run for president because her parents weren't born in america. these are the things the candidates are dealing with and it was nice to see nearly every

single contender come forward and rush to her defense. >> i've covered this disinformation campaign extensively and dave, i want to know, the campaigns were not ready in 2016 for this. are they adequately prepared this time? >> no, they're not. i think you see on a number of fronts how the campaigns at large are grappling with this. even the federal election commission is struggling to figure out exactly how to deal with russian disinformation or potential foreign attacks or advertising on facebook that's coming from rogue entities. this is going to be something externally and internally that will be a major problem with them. we're dealing with a domestic issue here, twitter. what it will have as a standard for information or for that matter, disinformation that affects presidential candidates of any sort, including donald

trump where they talk about putting disclaimers on certain tweets that come out. we're in a very, very different time period. it would have been unthinkable even last election cycle. >> at least some steps are taken by the tech companies. critics are not satisfied. i want to hit on what senator lindsey graham said. he weighed in on the debate where biden and harris were clashing. >> the policy options being presented by the leading contenders are the democratic side are their biggest problem. pretty liberal, pretty extreme. when it comes to joe biden, i think the next debate, he's got to change the narrative. one thing about kamala harris, i've said this before, she's got game. she's very talented. she's very smart and will be a force to be reckoned with. >> that's high praise from a fellow senator about harris. is she more of a threat do you think? is that what he's saying and

what trump has been intimating lately? >> i think it could be. it's important to understand with lindsey graham, he's one of president trump's top allies on the hill. he's really good friends with joe biden and he ran for president himself. he has a certain level of empathy and sympathy for biden and others running. i think stepping back a little bit, you have seen president trump sort of diversify his attack. initially, it was all about biden as he looked like he might be the front-runner. we've also seen him start to talk about other candidates more and more, including elizabeth warren who has crept up in the polls. i suspect that he may start to turn his attention now to kamala harris as she becomes a threat after her breakout performance. the question for harris, how can she keep the momentum going? can she lockdown other endorsements and build off of this momentum? what can she bring to the debate stage coming up in another month? certainly interesting that even a republican on capitol hill is

saying that kamala harris has some game. >> interesting stuff. we'll be watching closely. thank you both so much for being here. let's get back to the breaking news. president trump's meeting in the dmz overnight with kim jong-un. where this goes from here. ♪ every day, visionaries are creating the future. ♪ so, every day, we put our latest technology and unrivaled network to work. ♪ the united states postal service makes more e-commerce deliveries to homes than anyone else in the country. ♪ because the future only happens with people who really know how to deliver it. because the future only happens with people his life is pretty comfortable.

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breaking news. 20 steps into history. president trump's, the first sitting american president to set foot in north korea. the breven counter at the demilitarized zone happened. he was surprised by the offer and accepted due to their, quote, excellent relationship. >> it's good to see you again. i never expected to meet you at this place. [ inaudible ] you'll be first u.s. president to cross. >> trump and kim then met behind closed doors for almost an hour and trump declared the meeting a success. so to break all this down, we're back with sue mi terry and bobby

ghosh. sue, i'll start with you. how you expect the talks to proceed considering the major divide on the national security team. i mean, how have lower level talks gone in the past? >> bobby? you want to take that question? >> yeah. well, there's not been a consistent pattern established. after the meeting in singapore, there was a communication between lower level officials from secretary of state level downwards. but those never actually got anywhere. the north koreans were offended or claim they were offended by pompeo and the discussions sort of stalled there. they openly criticized pompeo. refused to communicate with him. then we had the breakdown in hanoi when president trump went all the way to vietnam and came away with nothing. arguably, that's also true of kim jong-un in practical terms. he came away with nothing although he had a propaganda

victory. at this point for the president to say he's expecting progress in two or three weeks, that would imply there's been quite a lot of discussion up until this moment. that is not true. so it's a little hard to take seriously the president's claim that he expects to see progress in a short period of time. historically, we've known this with negotiations with other nuclear countries. russians, soviet union. this sort of thing takes a very, very long time. remember that between singapore and now, the north koreans have shown off a bunch of nuclear capable missiles, short range missiles that the president now says all those are -- we don't consider them a threat. he was saying that standing thex to the south korean president who whom that is a real and existential threat. short range, nuclear capable north korean missiles directly threaten both south korea as well as japan, too, very

important american allies. there's a lot for the two sides to untangle here. there's a lot of discussion that has to take place. there might be photo-ops like the ones on our screens. there might be photo-ops from here to kingdom come. until the north koreans begin to disassemble their nuclear arsenal, that does not really count as progress. >> bobby, let's talk about the timing thing. president trump basically saying there's no rush. he would extend an invitation to kim to come to the white house when there is no time constraint, is that going to hurt or help this process from progressing forward? >> well, if there's no time constraint, then there's no need for either side to show any progress. let's not farorget, whereas there's been no progress from

the american point of view. from the north korean point of view, for kim, he's the big winner in all of this. he got to -- he got his country. >> got what he wanted. >> gets what he wanted. he's getting more from the chinese. the russians are beginning to offer him much more. he's getting recognition in the face of the world. so yeah, of course, most important for kim, his relation with south korea are improving dramatically. so from kim's point of view, he's getting quite a lot of what he wants in exchange for shaking donald trump's hand and smiling for a camera every now and again. that's pretty good for him. if the american president who claims to be the expert in the art of the deal but in these negotiations, kim is the one winning every hand. >> all right. so in your view, kim jong-un walking away with his victory. bobby ghosh, thank you so much for joining us. we appreciate your time this morning.

>> any time. now, what lawmakers want to ask robert mueller when he testifies on the hill next month and whether they'll get the answers they're looking for. ♪ corey is living with metastatic breast cancer, which is breast cancer that has spread to other parts of her body. she's also taking ibrance with an aromatase inhibitor, which is for postmenopausal women or for men with hr+ / her2- metastatic breast cancer as the first hormonal based therapy. ibrance plus letrozole was significantly more effective at delaying disease progression versus letrozole. patients taking ibrance can develop low white blood cell counts, which may cause serious infections that can lead to death. before taking ibrance, tell your doctor if you have fever, chills, or other signs of infection, liver or kidney problems, are pregnant, breastfeeding, or plan to become pregnant. common side effects include low red blood cell and low platelet counts, infections, tiredness, nausea, sore mouth,

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so you can feel good about using it in your home. for a light, natural-smelling freshness, try new febreze one. the president at the g20 in japan renewed attacks on special counsel in an effort to discredit the investigation. look at this. >> the mueller report was a very good report. it was a good report. i had 18 people that hated me. i had mueller who was totally conflicted and obviously didn't

like me. he was totally conflicted. yet, no obstruction, no collusion. you know, that was a good report. yes, please. the democrats want a do-over or five. they want to get it right. >> all this coming weeks before robert mueller set to appear before the house intelligence and judiciary committees on july 17th. joining me now with legal analyst katie fang. you heard it there. the president repeating his claims about mueller's alleged conflict. is there any evidence to support that? >> there's no evidence that there's any conflict at all. robert mueller wouldn't have continued on. people want to bust out the popcorn for the july 17th testimony from robert mueller, myself included. i think everybody needs to temper their expectations. just last month robert mueller in a public statement stated what he was to rely upon, his 448-page report. that really should be the scope

of his testimony as he's claimed. the reality is, he's going to be under oath and answering questions not only in two open sessions but in two closed sessions and also not only is robert mueller testifying but his staff and members of his team will be testifying. those are people we should be keeping an eye on. they themselves may be inclined to be a little bit more verbal and a little bit more outspoken than their boss maybe. >> we know that congressman schiff has confirmed his committee will be asking questions outside the scope of the report. if mueller reiterates what the report says but the staffers, some say a little bit more, is that going to be enough to get new information out there? >> we know that the house intel committee is going to be allowed to look at the unredacted version of volume one which dealt with investigation into the criminal conspiracy, what people call the collusion with russia in ternls of the 2016 election. the house judiciary committee gets his hands on the unredacted

version of volume 2, which is the obstruction of justice. for most of the american public, that's the one we want to look at. the underlying evidence in the unredacted portions of the section. we know that mueller stated that but for that office of legal counsel opinion that said you cannot indict a sitting u.s. president. that's the question that should be posed to robert mueller, would you have indicted donald trump regardless of his status? >> is that a question you would ask? >> absolutely. i would want to know, if your hands weren't bound or tied by this office of legal counsel memorandum that said you can't indict a sitting president, would you have pursued an indictment against him? jo ling, the reality is this. there's several people that haven't read the mueller report, some members of congress haven't taken the time to read, perhaps one of the most important

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breaking overnight. a moment for the history books. president trump greeting north korean leader kim jong-un at the demilitarized zone. stepping over that border into north korea. i want to thank you. that was quick notice. >> president trump later saying both sides will restart meetings on north korea's nuclear program. president trump he's calling this pro gles. are you going to give him credit for being the first u.s. sitting president to set foot into north

korea. >> i don't think he gets any credit. nothing has been accomplished. let's be very clear. why presid president bush would have ever done anything like this is because they refused to allow the dictator, kim jong-un to play them like this. trump is being played like a fiddle. d like a fiddle relationship -- a whole lot of promise, a whole lot of back-and-forth, and absolutely nothing has been done. as a matter of fact, they are currently in violation of the quote/unquote peace treaty that was reached by trump bac and we're talking about sanctions. well, as vladimir putin said, thatti country and the leader would rather eat grass than stop the nuclear program. i agree with russia on that fact. but president trump is doing everything he can because he realizes he'she kind of stuck i making this work, and all it does at the end of the day is it bolsters the claims of kim jong-un that he is the most powerful person on the planet

earth, and it only feeds into his terror further for human rights violations in his country. >> there is no doubt he is one of, if not the most repressive leader on the planet. so, ned, do you think after this, after this gift, some say, to kim, will the next set of talks be anyex different than t last tries? >> i mean, we're going to have to find out, jo. this is oneou of those things where i think trump, again, he's not going down the path of the more traditional diplomacy that the obama and bush and even clintonsh administrations went down. obviously, he is trying to solve a problem that the three previous, both republican and democrat administrations failed on -- how do you solve the existential crisis of north korea having a nuclear program and a being an existential thre to the united states? this will only be historic if actual progress is made. i know that the white house has said that they hope that this handshake, this moment, will lead toha the reopening of negotiations at a lower level. the fact of the matter is trump isfa intent on doing this. again, it'son not the tradition approach. it's a nontraditional approach. but it will only be historic if

we actually see progress. and i think he wants to. he's demonstrated again, jo, again withra iran and now with north korea, he does want to solve these things peacefully. at the same time, i think at some point, trump has to put his foot down and say, if you will not solve this peacefully, i've made every attempt to do so, i'm going to have to use force. i am going to solve this problem, no matter what. >> rashad, president trump is also extending that conditional invitation to kim to come to the white house. is that a good idea here? and also, do you think that with more pomp and circumstance around the meeting of those two, does that actually slow down or speed up those lower-level talks that ned's talking about? >> well, i think it's a good thing for kim jong-un, and it does slow down lower-level talks, because these individuals who actually negotiate are full-time diplomats, and they're nonpartisan, and they continue asnd career-long or lifelong negotiators. the president of the united states gets in the way of nggot. but i find it baffling that, somehow, the president can give

dictators the benefit of the doubt, try to work with them, but then would viciously attack americans who happen to disagree with him right here on american soil. i findri that quite ironic thate is president of the united states and has not found a democrat that he f actually can say i agree with or have respect for, if they happen to disagree with him on a political matter. >> now, ned, the president's also making some headlines, raising some eyebrows this weekend for his interaction with putin, as you can see there, the russian president. he defended that moment when he appeared to make light of election meddling leading into 2020 yesterday. listen to this. >> you'd have to take a look at the words.e i did say it. and we had ad discussion. we had a great -- actually, we had a greattu discussion, president putin andea myself. i thought it was really a tremendous discussion. as per your question, though, i did say it, and i did discuss it a little bit after that, too. you know he denies it totally, by the way. how many times can you get somebody to t deny something?

>> okay.de so, what>> kind of message does that sendes to nonstate actors d to governments who want to thwart or mess around with the 2020 election, not just russia, but iran and china and other places? >> well,er no, i mean, fact of e matter is, trump has made it clear. there have been a lot of things that he's done behind the scenes to russia. he's actually had a policy, especially on the energy front, that has been very damaging to putin. again, i would say the russians have been meddling for decades in ourdd elections. i would like to see that it would be significant consequences behind the scenes for carussia, iran, china, everybody else who attempts to meddle with our w elections. so again, it's one of those things where i think trump, again, hashe made the point, do not meddle m with our elections. i would like to see there be significant consequences coming into the 2020 elections for these actors. at the same time, how far does he push the envelope to get them to stoppe and what are the consequence snaez so, it's one ofue those things, i think ther, going to continue to be back-and-forth, jo, but i do think -- and i think everybody,

right and left, republican, democrat, agrees, do not meddle with our elections, there will be consequences. >> rashad, what kind of consequences do you want to see? >> yowell, number one, the president of the united states actually acknowledging that russia did interfere in the elections.n that would be a really good start. >> he did. >> number two,ar making sure th we have real, real sanctions against russia and stop with this lovey-dovey back and forth with the dictator of russia when he is trying to attack the fundamentals of our democracy. all of those not only play into the optics, but also the cause-and-effect dynamic that we see playing out in the media every day. these guys should know, if you mess with our elections, that is congruent to you declaring war, civil war, domestic war, in the united states of america -- >> jo -- >> -->> because our democracy i fundamental to our constitution and our way of life here and should be treated as so. and president trump making jokes about it is the wrong thing to do and the wrong place to do it.

>> ned, is that fair what rashad just said? >> well, here's my thing -- we can either have the president wagging his finger at these leaderss and telling them, don you dare do this, or as with russia, he canor go after their energy policy. and when youth look at what he' actually doing, when you realize putin's regime, half of their revenue isha based off oil and s exports, and what trumpil is dog to undermine that, i would much rather that he damages him that way significantly than he wags his finger atif him on the publ stage. p so, you ask do i want a show or do i want significant pain. i want pain. >> rashad richey, ned ryun, spirited as usual. thank you for joining me this morning. >> thank you. >> thanks, jo. historic it may be, but what do the events at the dmz actually mean in the pursuit of denuclearizing? actually mean in the pursuit of denuclearizing with new nicorette coated ice mint. layered with flavor... it's the first and only coated nicotine lozenge. for an amazing taste... ...that outlasts your craving.

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good morning. i'm jo ling kent in new york at msnbc world headquarters. it's 7:00 in the east. it's 4:00 out west. here's what's happening right now. historic step. president trump visiting the dmz and walking into north korea. >> we went and met at the line. and in meeting at the line, i said, "would you like me to come across?" this was a pretty big move today, i imagine, based on what everyone was telling me, but it was my honor. i said that to him. >> this hour, the significance of the meeting, what kim told trump, and the expectations for what could come next. plus, new attacks against

kamala harris, and who is helping to spread them. all right, we begin now with breaking news. president trump is now on his way home after making history this morning, going up the stairs of air force one right there. he became the first sitting president to step on to north korean soil. and in another first during the big event, many heard kim jong-un's voice. he's speaking korean there. and it's the english voice that you're going to hear right now is his translator. >> translator: good to see you again. i never expected to meet you at this place. step over, you will be the first u.s. press to cross. >> you're also hearing all the cameras clicking to capture the moment that president trump

stepped into north korean territory. he then returned to the south korean side with kim. so, after the photo op and a few questions from journalists, president trump opening yet another door to a possible white house summit with kim. >> i would invite him right now, to the white house. >> now, leaders then went inside. they retreated for almost an hour of private talks. when they came out, president trump escorted kim to the demarcation line for kim's departure. and although we have no measurable progress on denuclearization here, president trump already declared the meeting a success, playing down north korea's recent weapons tests. >> very small ones. these are missiles that practically every country tests. i mean, these were very safe. we don't consider that a missile test. actually, it wasn't a test. but we're talking about ballistic missiles, long-range ballistic missiles. and not only not testing them, hasn't even come close to testing. and most importantly, there were no nuclear tests.

>> nbc's hans nichols and janice mackey fraher are all standing by in seoul. hans, i'm going to start with you. the president and kim met for nearly an hour. so what do we know about what was discussed? >> reporter: well, we know that there have been some changes in u.s. policy. the president is saying now that there can be the lifting of sanctions during this transition period, where before, north korea fully gives up all its nuclear weapons. that's a shift. that's a change from the president. the president is asking his negotiator and his negotiating team to get in touch with kim's negotiating team so they can start talks at the staff level. that's an indication that something could ultimately happen in a more formalized summit. and finally, you have this conditional offer from the president, talking about a potential invite to the white house to kim jong-un. now, overall, what they said behind closed doors is the president really focused on the carrots and what the economic benefits of denuclearization would be. >> all right, hans, stay with me --

>> prosperity that awaits north korea when this whole thing gets settled. i have been talking about this for a long time, but that's a country with tremendous potential. and i've had a good relationship with chairman kim. you know that. you see what's happening. it's been a lot different. they were giving us a great briefing right at the dmz, and they said it was so different before we had the meeting, the big summit in singapore. it was different. it was really hostile. you understand it better than anybody. it was really hostile. and since our first meeting in singapore, we get along. >> reporter: jo, in the last 12 hours, we've been focusing on this particular meeting, but over the last 72 hours, we've really seen the premium that president donald trump places on personal diplomacy. it is clear that he has great confidence in his ability to cut deals. we saw that with putin. we saw that with xi. and it was cast in really sharp relief in this visit with kim

jong-un. jo? >> hans, thank you. stay with me for a minute. i want to bring in janis mackey frayer, also in seoul. janis, how significant is this? where does this actually lead in terms of talks? will we see something concrete in km out in this two-to-three-week timeline? >> reporter: well, this is the golden question. as hans mentioned, there's not a lot of detail coming out of this closed-door meeting between president trump and kim jong-un, but there is the sense that negotiations will resume. talks had broken down completely. the lines of communication have been sidelined since the failure of the hanoi summit. and there's really been very little progress made since the singapore summit last year. working-level negotiations have stalled. there was even the fury of north korea coming through state media a couple months ago, saying that if the u.s. had any expectation for the regime to return to the table, then secretary of state mike pompeo had to be ejected

from the negotiation process. >> that's right. >> reporter: so, there is this sense that these teams are coming together again, but the sense that we've been here before, that this essentially pushes reset, returns us to where we were 15 months ago, but north korea still not pledging to give up its nuclear arsenal. it has added to its stockpile over the past several months. it has resumed testing short-range ballistic missiles as well as weapons, something that president trump dismissed today, saying that they were really not that big of a deal. but really this sense that the big winner in this attempt by president trump to revive his foreign policy win is, of course, kim jong-un. all he had to do was show up, and he emerges with this validation of being a true international statesman, a man that the u.s. president would put out an invitation to meet at the border, to be the first to

step on to north korean soil. so, this is a tremendous victory for kim jong-un to take back to his domestic audience in pyongyang. >> janis, hans, stay with me for a second. i want to bring in colonel jack jacobs, med yal of honor recipit and msnbc analyst. i want to know, did trump give up too much to kim? >> yeah, look at it this way -- we didn't get anything in return. trump personally got something. don't forget, this is a campaign year. looks like a statesman. but otherwise, the united states got nothing. and in exchange, as has been mentioned, north korea's been testing not nuclear weapons anymore, but certainly delivery means, which leads people to indicate, to think that they've got the capability of mounting nuclear weapons on top of these delivery means, is just scaring everybody in the region, but particularly japan. and it doesn't look like we're going to get anything even on a

short-term basis. but surely, even if you're going to focus on strategy, you'll see no return to the united states. >> so, the american voter, colonel jack, isn't, in your view, getting anything out of this situation. so, was this the president's attempt to help those lower-level negotiators here, in a way, to push it forward? >> i think the thing to do is to start at the end and work backwards, like just about anything else. what is it we're trying to achieve? well, strategically, we'd really like to see north korea give up its nuclear weapons. it is not going to do that under any circumstances. nuclear weapons are north korea's insurance policy. it prevents the united states, or indeed, anybody else, from changing the regime, from influencing action in the northern part of the peninsula. without nuclear weapons, north korea's at risk.

it is not giving them up. in the interim, it will continue to develop them. and tractically, it will give in to doing things like having talks, restarting talks and so on. but north korea's not going to give up its nuclear weapons. and if that is our objective, to get them to get rid of nuclear weapons, we're headed absolutely nowhere. and in the interim between now and when we would like to see them give up their nuclear weapons, we, the united states in particular, is going to give up a great deal. i think one of the things you're liable to see is that we're going to reduce the economic sanctions on north korea, and that would be a big mistake. >> janis, what do you think here? can the chinese, who have historically been very involved in these talks, actually make a difference? i mean, how does that change their power positioning? >> reporter: well, as we know,

there is not much that happens with the north korea situation that doesn't involve the hand in china. and we only have to rewind over the past couple of weeks to see some of these pieces of the puzzle come together. that visit by china's president, xi jinping, to pyongyang, a state visit where he was welcomed very warmly, the first time in over a decade that a chinese leader had visits there, and then these other pieces falling into place -- the letter that president trump sent to kim jong-un, that kcna splashed all over the evening news and newspapers were carrying on the front page, showing kim reading a letter that he described as having most excellent content. so, there was the sense that there were some of these dynamics being put into play before president trump sent that tweet suggesting that kim jong-un meet him at the border. president trump, as hans

mentioned, prides himself on this personal diplomacy. he had somewhat of a breakthrough with the chinese in his bilateral meeting, suggesting that trade talks would resume, that there would not be more tariffs introduced next week, as he had been threatening to do, and this very surprising decision where he appeared to backtrack on the ban -- selling american equipment to huawei. so, there seemed to be a fall there. there is now this resumption of personal diplomacy between president trump and kim jong-un. and also, you know, the nuance behind this announcement that their teams would be reassembled and put together. the negotiating teams to this point have had some difficulty at the working level. and so now, there seems to be the interjection of the two men themselves, these two leaders. >> yeah. >> reporter: who pride themselves on being the ones who can come together and get it done. so, the fact that they're now

anointing these negotiation teams and telling them to go and get it done, perhaps that could be the catalyst towards some sort of progress. but as we've been talking about for much of the day, there is this sense that president trump may be giving up too much, too soon, by suggesting that there could be sanctions relief before north korea gives anything up. >> let's talk more about that, hans. we have sound from the president talking about sanctions. take a listen to this. >> i mean, at some point, look, i'm looking forward to taking them off. i don't like sanctions being on his country. i'm looking forward. but the sanctions remain, yes. but at some point during the negotiation, things can happen, and that's what we'll be talking about, sanctions. >> reporter: it seems like the president's position on sanctions is now softening, hans. is that another win for kim? >> reporter: potentially. i mean, things can soften. the president clearly indicating that he is no longer going for just complete and verifiable denuclearization, and then the sanctions will be lifted.

that marks a shift and not an insignificant one. jo, when you look at the way the president was trying to unstick these negotiations, that was clearly a sticking point for kim. and one of the more interesting but subtle comments that came out of these last 12 hours is the president talking about the hanoi summit, which is widely regarded as a failure because they failed to reach an agreement. he thinks of it as a success because he learned something. and what you're hearing from the president, he thinks he understands what kim's pushes and pulls are and how he can be a better negotiator with him. and the president clearly places a premium on having a personal relationship, and he feels -- and you read their body language -- the two of them seem like they enjoy each other's company. jo? >> colonel, last question to you. after we see this photo op unfold, you see all those images, so striking, do you think -- just playing devil's advocate here -- that president trump is now going to be less motivated to actually get steps accomplished because he already

got this photo op that he clearly seems to be quite pleased with? >> well, that's a very interesting question. i hadn't thought about it that way, but i think you're absolutely right. i think he got 90% of everything that he wanted. and in exchange, we got very little. do you remember not all that long ago, the president canceled our joint and combined military exercises that we have annually in the korean peninsula, which, by the way, are not just war games, they're vitally important for us to test out our systems, make sure there's interoperability, that our plans work properly and defend our interests in the western pacific. i think that with what's happened now, the president is going to be disinclined to have them again. and the military establishment really needs them to make sure that we can defend. no, i think the president got just about everything that he wanted out of this, which is basically a photo opportunity in the middle of a campaign year, jo. >> all right, colonel jack jacobs, hans nichols, janis

mackey frayer, thank you all so much for being here. we appreciate it. donald trump jr. in hot water this morning over a retweet about kamala harris. what it said, why he deleted it, and how it's uniting democrats, next. it's unitingem docrats, next get that butterfly! you know those butterflies aren't actually in the room? hey, that baker lady's on tv again. she's not a baker. she wears that apron to sell insurance. nobody knows why. she's the progressive insurance lady. they cover pets if your owner gets into a car accident. covers us with what? you got me. [ scoffs ] she's an insurance lady. and i suppose this baker sells insurance, too? progressive protects your pets like you do. you can see "the secret life of pets 2" only in theaters.

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tweet during the debate -- "kamala harris is not an american black. she is half indian and half jamaican." then donald trump jr. retweeting it to his 3.6 million followers with that question, "is it true?" but he since deleted that. a spokesperson for the president's son telling "the new york times" it was a misunderstanding. now kamala harris' campaign compares it to the birtherism. lilly adams says this is the same type of racist attacks used to attack barack obama. it didn't work then and it won't work now." several of harris' 2020 rivals are jumping to her defense on twitter. elizabeth warren tweets "the attacks against kamala harris are racist and ugly. we all have an obligation to speak out and say so." and joe biden, who clashed with her on that debate stage just nights ago, tweeted "it's disgusting and we have to call it out when we see it. racism has no place in america." the former vice president still battling criticism over his

recent comments about race. republican senator lindsey graham is now reaching across the aisle to try to defend him. >> anybody that knows joe biden, there is not a racist bone in his body. that's not a cliche. that's the reality. but the narrative is that maybe it's not his time and that he's not up to the task. i think you will underestimate joe biden at your own peril. >> joining me now is julia manchester, reporter for "the hill" and francesca chambers, white house correspondent for the "daily mail." thank you for being here this morning. francesca, why are these attacks happening against senator harris? >> well, partially because she's surging right now. if you look at a morning consult poll that dropped on friday, she gained about nine points. and guess who lost points after that debate? joe biden. he dropped about ten points for people who were questioned after that debate. so, that puts her now in double-digit support and joe biden dropping, and that's

something that was expected to happen after this debate. he was going to be a target on that stage as the candidate who was getting more than a quarter of the vote in previous polls, and now you're seeing candidates pile on to him as well. >> francesca, what's the white house explanation? what are they saying as to why donald trump jr. retweeted, asked that question, and then deleted that tweet on harris? >> well, president trump, obviously, has been overseas right now, and he's -- as we've seen this morning, he's been a little bit busy, meeting with more than one world leader, so they're not really saying too much specifically about this incident with kamala harris and the president's son, choosing to focus on his meeting with kim jong-un, which i'm sure we'll get to as well. >> julia, fellow democratic presidential candidates have come to harris' defense, including former vice president biden, but he's also continuing to defend his civil rights record, right, and the fallout of that exchange with harris on the debate stage about federal bussing. so, what are congressional democrats saying about that right now? and what is the wisdom here as

to what biden should do to move past it? >> yeah, i think it depends what congressional democrats you're talking to. you know, you are seeing more establishment democrats really defending biden. i think the logic behind that is, basically, biden may be the best choice in their view to defeat trump in 2020. you know, biden does have that pull with a lot of -- in areas that may be seen as trump country, in areas such as the rust bet, pennsylvania, michigan, wisconsin. so, i think there's that kind of narrative, and i think biden is seen very much as a very safe choice. he is seen as more experienced in those areas. however, if you talk to various progressives, you are seeing some frustrations. biden continues to make these gaffes on the campaign trail, whether it's those comments about those two segregationalist senators that happened a couple of weeks ago, the defense of his record on stage with kamala harris, or you know, obviously, those allegations of inappropriate touching before a couple of months ago.

so, you're seeing the biden campaign really scramble to continue to defend these gaffs, and it's a little ironic, because biden is the front-runner so far, and he really shouldn't be making these mistakes at this point, but we're seeing that these mistakes don't appear to be hurting him too badly in the polls yet. however, to francesca's point, you're seeing other candidates like kamala harris really surge. and to piggyback onto the surging point, she raised $2 million in the 24 hours after that debate. >> that's right. >> so, while biden's kind of sitting still there, you're seeing other candidates like harris really begin to escalate. >> francesca, you're covering the white house. what does the administration think of the infighting among the democratic contenders? how much do they like this? >> well, i mean, they love it, because when there's comments about joe biden and questions about his remarks on race, then it takes the heat off of donald trump and comments that he's made in the past about race. joe biden has oriented his

campaign on president trump and comments that he made about both sides in charlottesville. so, it definitely makes it more difficult, i think, for joe biden to have that conversation and say he's the right candidate to have that conversation with america. if you look, just this weekend, to cory booker, after joe biden was playing cleanup and he made remarks about people wearing hoodies, then cory booker even said, our nominee has to be someone who can talk and has the right language to talk about race and bringing attention to hoodies and whether people should or shouldn't be wearing them isn't the right thing to do. so, all around, joe biden taking a lot of fire and his cleanup game maybe not working out the way his campaign would have wanted it too. >> julia, i also want to talk about the dmz and trump's visit and crossing into north korea. what are expectations for how members of congress are going to respond to this latest meeting with kim tomorrow? >> yeah, i think you're going to see democrats obviously really go out on the offensive on this for president trump meeting with a dictator like kim jong-un. and let's not forget, just a

couple of days ago, president trump appeared side by side with saudi arabian prince mohammed bin salman and i think they're going to be highlighting president trump's moves to really get closer to these dictators. however, you're probably going to see some praise from republicans for president trump, you know, continuing to maybe make progress, at least on the public relations front, with kim jong-un. the problem is, president trump -- you know, in substance, the negotiations between the u.s. and north korea haven't gone too far since singapore. you now, we've seen that north korea continues to show off its nuclear arsenal and there continues to be this kind of war of words with the administration and north korea and state media. so you're seeing this tension continue to play out. >> okay. >> so we really have to see because right now it seems like a public relations move. >> all right, francesca. so, then look at the domestic impact of this dmz day for the president, you know. does this quickly, actually have any impact on the american voter in their psyche, what they're

thinking? >> well, it does tell you a lot about president trump's approach to the job and that he thinks that you should be in contact with and you should be meeting with some of these world leaders who are not considered allies and might be enemies of the united states, but i do agree with julia that the message that democrats are going to be pushing today is it's not just about mohammed bin salman and kim jong-un. he also met with vladimir putin and there seemed to be a little laughter. they talked about election meddling. and that is going to be the message that democrats not just hammer today but hammer throughout this election about why donald trump, they say is unfit for office. so this isn't going to go away quickly. >> francesca chambers, julia manchester, thank you both. crossing the line. as talks restart between the u.s. and north korea, the big question about what kim jong-un will give up in exchange for a deal with president trump. a former cia analyst joins me next. rmer cia analyst joins me next this is the ocean.

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breaking news. 20 steps into history. president trump, the first sitting u.s. president to set foot in north korea. that brief encounter at the korean demilitarized zone happened overnight as the

president tweeted an invitation on saturday. kim jong-un said he was surprised by the initial offer and accepted due to their, quote, excellent relationship. trump, of course, is opening the door to a possibility of another summit with kim. >> we just had a very, very good meeting with chairman kim. the team will try and work out some details. speed is not the object. we want to see if we can do a really comprehensive, good deal. this was a very legendary, very historic day. it was quick notice. nobody saw this coming. in speaking with president moon, oftentimes he was saying this is historic. just the meeting is historic. a lot has already come up, because you see what's going on and you see what's happening and you see the level of relationship as opposed to the way it was when i came into office. when i came into office, it was a fiery mess. >> the leaders met behind closed doors for almost an hour, and when they came out, president trump walked the north korean leader back to that demarcation

line and trump declaring the meeting a success. back now to discuss this is former cia analyst and commentator see me terry as well as msnbc military analyst colonel jack jacobs. thanks, guys, for coming back. su, the president said earlier that he thinks he understands that kim, who appeared to soften his position on sanctions -- i mean, trump appeared to soften his position on sanctions -- are they getting closer to being on the same page? >> i don't think they're going to be on the same page in terms of denuclearization, if washington is still seeking that as a goal. we're not on the same page because north korea is not willing to even give a declaration on their nuclear missile program, they're not agreeing to any kind of roadmap or timeline. that said, i think interim deal is possible because president trump is now willing to give some sanctions relief or ease sanctions during negotiations, and that's a change from the

previous stance, which is that sanctions relief can only come after denuclearization is complete. so, that means president trump is willing for a deal. and i think then if kim jong-un offe offers yongbyon plus more, that is a possible deal. >> is that a deal? >> our objective is to have a nuclear-free korean peninsula. north korea's objective is to retain nuclear weapons as insurance against anybody interfering with their regime. over the short term, north korea wants us to remove sanctions. i think they're liable to get what they want and we're not going to get anything that we want, jo. >> well, sue, let's listen to what president trump said earlier about former president obama on this front. >> president obama wanted to meet, and chairman kim would not meet him. the obama administration was begging for a meeting. they were begging for meetings

constantly, and chairman kim would not meet with him. and for some reason, we have a certain chemistry, or whatever. now, let's see what happens. we have a long way to go, but i'm in no rush. the sanctions are on, and i'm in no rush. >> former obama adviser ben rhodes hitting back on twitter, saying "trump is lying." you worked for the cia during the bush administration, part of the obama administration. what's your reaction to this back-and-forth? >> well, president trump is flat out wrong. president obama, when he was a candidate, in a debate against hillary clinton, said he was willing to meet with kim jong-un, if needed to be. but obviously, he did not beg, he did not offer that at all. in fact, it's north koreans -- the north koreans have always consistently asked for a meeting, but u.s. president -- we did not. president clinton did not. he almost did.

president george w. bush did not. and president obama did not. and there's a reason for that, because you are giving legitimacy to the north korean leader without getting what we needed, which is denuclearization. so, that's flat out untrue. i'll just say one more thing about this timeline, the sanctions relief, and president trump saying he's not in a rush? that just plays into north korea's hand. north korea has all the incentive in the world to play this out and drag this out. and eventually, get what it wants, which is international acceptance of north korea as a responsible nuclear weapons power. that's what they want. >> so, that's what they want. colonel, what about what the president wants here? what do you read in terms of his body language, his tone of vice? what was he trying to convey to the world today? >> well, that he's in charge and that he's a master of international affairs. but we have to look at this more practically. at the end of the day, this was touted as something significant.

it's not historically significant. we can look at it as a photo opportunity in a campaign year. and just about everything that the president does is focused on this one particular objective, and that is to get re-elected. i don't think that we're going to see any -- not even minor positive results from this engagement, so you can look at this as a campaign ploy and you can actually see that in how the president comports himself. >> sue, one last question on that front, what colonel jack was talking about. does that then really hurt the efforts or help the efforts of the lower-level individuals that have been working so hard to get somewhere over the past several decades? >> well, president trump with this decision to spontaneously meet with kim jong-un in this way only confirms kim jong-un's thinking, which is that he wants

to only deal with trump, he wants to separate president trump from his advisers, because he thinks only president trump, with him, there is a deal to be had, right? his advisers are too tough on north korea, are demanding pesky things like roadmap, a timeline, a declaration. so, kim jong-un just wants to deal with president trump, and i think he might be right. he's about to have a deal, potentially, with president trump. >> all right, we'll see what happens. sue mi terry and colonel jack jacobs. thanks, guys. a former member of congress weighing in on the events at the dmz and whether this moment would draw a different reaction under a different president. ion under a different president. ♪ limu emu & doug

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stepping across that line was a great honor. a lot of progress has been made. a lot of friendships have been made. and this has been in particular a great friendship. so, i just want to thank you. that was very quick notice and i want to thank you. >> that's president trump just hours ago greeting north korean leader kim jong-un at the dmz. then he stepped over the border into north korea. president trump later saying that the two sides are going to restart meetings on north korea's nuclear program. let's bring in bishop garrison, co-founder of the joseph raney center for public policy, and former georgia congressman jack kingston. congressman, i want to start with you. how significant was this? and did trump give up too much here to kim?

>> i think it was hugely significant. it was significant not just for the president and the two nations, but it was significant to the world that the president is willing to talk -- talk, not war with north korea is a good thing. the fact that he went to south korea first reassures our allies that he's not going to sell them out. the fact that he says we've got to keep talking, that we're in no rush, but we want to get things done. this is a nation that we've been struggling with since, really, since the korean war. and starting with maybe george bush sr. trying to come up with treaties that they would stick to. so, i think it's very important. and to suggest that it's a campaign ploy is ridiculous, since he's not being criticized for his strength or peace through strength policy. so, i think he is one of the few presidents who i think can get away with going into north korea and not selling out the country or not selling out his position. >> bishop, that's a pretty bold statement there by the congressman.

do you agree? >> surprisingly enough, i do not. i do worry that this is a political ploy. at the end of the day, is it a good thing that we're trying to have these type of substantive talks with north korea? yes. but process here actually matters. this is an administration that time and time again has demonstrated that it lacks structure around diplomacy. this is not business. you cannot go in and have these random talks without your subject matter experts there to support and back you and get the substantive type of discussion that you need in order to reach your end stated goals. our end stated goals are diametrically opposed. the united states wants to see the peninsula without nuclear weapons. north korea wants us out of its business, out of the business of the regime so we could continue its stronghold and stranglehold on its people domestically. those are two things that simply do not work. they are at odds. and this president, i do not believe he understands that, and i don't believe his state

department, which has been just decimated from its career staff understands that either. >> congressman, if this was president obama, i want to know, wouldn't you be criticizing him for potentially giving up too much at that -- >> he absolutely would be. >> -- dmz? >> i actually defended president obama when he said he would talk to dictators, because i think talk is preferable to war. and to suggest that this was supposed to be a substantive meeting is absurd. this was a meeting that was all about symbolism, that the president is willing to continue discussions and continue negotiation. remember, all the trump critics two years ago were saying -- and in fact, it was summer, two years ago exactly -- we are on the verge of nuclear war. this president doesn't know what he's doing. this president is going to be reckless. well, it's the same people now who are mad he's continuing engagement through discussion. it is a good thing when the united states of america leads in an international issue like this. it is a good thing when the president of the united states sits down and says i'm willing

to talk. and by the way, if any of us think that kim jong-un is going to give away his nuclear weapons with, you know, without a struggle, we're ridiculous. we have to talk to him. the other alternative is war, and i don't think that's acceptable. >> but the president has said time and time again -- >> i want to jump in here and ask you -- >> sure. >> -- would you be praising if it was a democratic president in office this as a diplomatic achievement? >> no! i would be saying -- >> yes, i would. >> i would be saying the exact same thing i am right now, because i think you have multiple individuals who don't fully understand from a diplomatic perspective and from a security perspective what they're dealing with whenever they engage north korea like this. i think the congressman is right, this is symbolism. it's political symbolism. given the timing of everything that's happening, given all of the issues that we as a country right now are dealing with, with a humanitarian crisis at our border, with our talks about pushing iran to the brink of war. this is something that we need

to be thinking about clearly and we need to be engaging in a much more structured manner than this. >> well, speaking about engaging clearly and having a structure here, congressman, i want to know from you -- president trump may be striking claims about former president obama on the north korean front. listen to this. >> president obama wanted to meet and chairman kim would not meet him. the obama administration was begging for a meeting. they were begging for meetings constantly, and chairman kim would not meet with him. and for some reason, we have a certain chemistry or whatever. now, let's see what happens. we have a long way to go, but i'm in no rush. the sanctions are on. and i'm in no rush. >> okay, so, obama's former deputy national security adviser ben rhodes, also an msnbc contributor, then tweeted back, "trump is lying. i was there for all eight years. obama never sought a meeting with kim jong-un." so, congressman, why does the president keep bringing up

former president obama? what's the point of that? >> i'm not certain. i don't think it was necessary, and i will agree that there is reason to criticize there, but i think the broader statement that he did say in that same discussion was that there's no rush, that sanctions are in place. and again, this is not just a one-off, random meeting with kim jong-un. they have had ongoing discussions, and this administration has been fully engaged with it, and i think the president can argue that they've made more progress than the obama administration. >> okay, bishop, i'll let you have the last word on this one. >> sure. thank you. i would argue that we're giving kim jong-un exactly what he wants, a stage in which for him to try to show the world that he is some type of rational leader when he is an authoritarian dictator. we see the way that they've been with their own people. we see how they treated our citizen in otto warmbier. we understand and know who kim

jong-un is, and i think that this is a terrible, terrible idea, the way this administration is going about handling diplomatic relations with north korea. >> okay, well, bishop garrison, former congressman -- >> -- all over the world, though, we have to -- >> i know you want to keep going, but we have to go. thank you so much. >> and go usa soccer, for women. >> indeed, go, usa soccer. >> we're in agreement. in agreement. stonewall 50, the birth of the lgbtq movement, the wins since and the fights ahead towards achieving equal rights when we come back. ts when we comeac bk. let's be hone. it's kind of unfair that safe drivers have to pay as much for insurance... as not safe drivers! ah! that was a stunt driver. that's why esurance has this drivesense® app. the safer you drive, the more you save. don't worry, i'm not using my phone and talking to a camera while driving... i'm being towed. by the way, i'm actually a safe driver. i'm just pretending to be a not safe driver. cool. bye dennis quaid! when insurance is affordable, it's surprisingly painless.

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today is world pride in new york city and all around the globe, people are celebrating and some are protesting. it's been 50 years since the stonewall riot energized what the now the lgbt rights group. thank you for joining me on a superbusy day for you. i want to know, is this the first time that the u.s. is hosting world pride. what does that mean? >> this is a major celebration for us. pride is back in the birthplace where the stonewall riots happened in 1969.

it's an exciting day for all of us. >> tell me about stonewall 15. >> we knew that lgbtq people had been targeted before the riots dropped off. we said we're not going to stand for this treatment and stand up for ourselves. >> what do you think is the most important step recently toward achieving equal rights? >> that's difficult to answer. while there's so much excitement, obviously, the sobering reality, is that we need to focus less on visibility, and focus on vitality and a new vision of liberation. >> there's two marches scheduled today here in new york city. you have the official world

pride parade, and the other, the reclaimed pride march. what are the differences between the two? one of the biggest communications in our country is how pride has fallen into capitalism. they were fighting for a radical vision that included black and brown folks at the front, transfolks, sex workers. we don't see the focus on the radical groups. that's what's happening with prid. and a lot of people are hoping for a pivot back to those roots. >> what is your personal hope for today? what are you hoping to feel and to achieve? >> i hope that people will be excited. we will be starting in a lot of ways.

i hope that we have a real commitment. what will the next year look like for our community? that's what i open we can be focused on going forward? >> happy pride and thank you for being with us this morning. >> thank you very much. for more on lgbt issues, go to nbc out at nbc.com. president trump visiting the dnc and doing something that no other sitting american president has done before. a live report on the top of the hour with "up." we got the idea that if we took two dimensional patient imaging and put it in holographic displays, we could dissect around the tumor so we can safely remove it. when we first started, we felt like this might just not be possible but verizon 5g ultra wideband will give us the ability to do this.

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better, faster. i mean sign me up. comcast business. beyond fast. all right. thank you so much for watching. "up with david gura" starts right now. >> this is "up," i'm david gura. president trump made history and became the first sitting president to go to north korea. >> i didn't expect to see you in this place. >> it should pave the way to another meeting in washington. >> we'd invite him right now. to the white house. absolutely. >> this weekend, two of the democratic candidates are in texas, continuing a fight over immigration policy that