everybody, this is just the beginning. i ask everyone to stay vigilant and be safe. this has always been projected to be a rain/flood event and it will be. the vast majority of the rain that's falling right now is falling in the gulf. that will soon change as the storm continues to move north. >> very good evening to you. i'm richard lui, live from msnbc headquarters in new york city. following breaking news today, tracking tropical storm barry, making its way across louisiana, carrying with it, quote, off-the-chart amounts of moisture according to the director of the national hurricane center. flooding is the main concern for officials across the gulf coast with scenes like this in myrtle grove, louisiana, where water is flowing over the top of the levees. so far more than 120,000 people across the area are without power and the number is changing hour-by-hour.

joining me from plaquemines parish, nbc's mariana at tense i don't. you've been showing us the water going over the levees. it appears things have changed brac based on the water coming from the sky. >> reporter: the water has overtopped the levees in plaquemines parish. what we're noticing now is because of the rainfall, because of the flooding and the storm surge, this water is moving to my right towards the highway. that is highway 23. the only way in and out of this area, leaving these communities essentially cut off. more updates for our audience from the national weather service. still a high risk of storm surge in the area, still a high risk of rainfall today into tomorrow, six to ten additional inches in southeastern louisiana where i am. i want to bring in state representative christopher

leopold. when you see these images, the water spilling into the highway, the only artery in and out, what's your concern? >> unfortunately we've seen it many times before. the concern, which we have no control over, is that the whole road way doesn't get flooded. it looks like it may and probably will. we've been through it before. that's why a mandatory evacuation order was issued on thursday. >> did people heed the evacuation warnings. people have a tendency to want to come back right away. >> they do. therefore, sometimes they don't leave. i think those that wanted to leave left and those that wanted to stay have stayed at this point. as you can see, if anyone wanted to get out, they would still have an opportunity to do so hopefully before nightfall. >> how will this make recovery efforts challenging for you guys? >> it will make it a little more challenging than normal. unlike in the past, the levee won't be able to used during the dewatering process because of the abnormally high river and

the levees have been saturated for so long with the high river, it's simply not safe to do it this time. >> when will your teams, crews, authorities be out and about starting to pick up the pieces? >> i'm not directly involved with that. i would imagine as soon as the weather permits. >> thank you representative christopher leopold. you heard it. as soon as the weather permits, richard. judging from what i said in terms of the area still being at risk for more rain fall and storm surge, i don't know if that's going to happen any time soon. >> may >>. >> /* how has the level changed? we saw the stop sign. we can see one of those electrical polls. how has the water level changed? >> reporter: i've been speaking the the firemen here on site. i'm standing in front of a fire station, richard. nay know the area pretty well.

they say thankfully the river has started to go down which is a sigh of relief for everyone here. what's concerning is the water spilling onto the highway and everyone hoping and praying, as you just heard from the state representative, that it doesn't cut off these communities. that is going to complicate relief efforts and people wanting to get back to their homes. >> mariana, we'll be talking to you over the next couple hours. for now let's go over to nbc meteorologist michelle grossman tracking barry for us as well. there's been a change since the last time we spoke two hours ago. we have a new advisory. what's been the change in the last couple hours? >> the change is a decrease in speed a bit. looking at 65-mile-per-hour winds. again, winds haven't been the biggest issue. that's a lot of wind. we could still see power outages and trees down, roads being ripped up. forward speed of 7 miles per hour. still moving very slowly. went from five to six to seven

with the latest advisory. we have buckets of rain coming through. let's talk about what the path is right now. really the takeaway from this path is how slow it's moving at seven miles per hour. we have a lot of moisture and it's going to be a long time before it's out of here. here we go. it was a category one storm when it made the landfall. quickly downgraded to a tropical storm. that's what happens when you reach the land. by 1:00 still only in parts of arkansas and up through the tennessee valley, eventually the ohio river valley and into the northeast. this is our biggest concern, a flash flood watch and flash flood warning. we've already had a lot of rain so far. this is just the beginning of it. setting the stage for downpours over the next 48 hours. this is going to be a long event. it's not going to be until wednesday when we see how this all shakes out. the water that will be sitting there, has to find its way to streams, creeks, rivers. then we'll see what destruction is done now. it's going to be heartbreaking

over the next several days in some spots. memphis, tupelo, greenville, little rock, jackson, hattiesburg. but we also have flash flood warning. watch means conditions are favorable. biloxi and mobile seeing the flooding happening right now. flash flooding, that means we could see life-threatening conditions in terms of the flooding. radar in the last six hours, not much has changed. you see the yellows, oranges, indicating heavy downpours. biloxi getting a little break right now but another ban will move in. this will move to the north. the track predicted a couple days ago moved to the west. so new orleans, you're going to get some rain. we're not expecting an event we were expecting a few days ago. baton rouge in the bullseye of very heavy rain. that will move up to parts of mississippi. where you see the pink, that's

your high flood threat. baton rouge, new orleans, also jackson, mccomb and alexandria. we have very wet ground. we've already had roads being ripped up. we could certainly see more power outages. we have a lot of power outages in four states along the gulf coast. we're seeing winds from 15 up to 52 miles per hour. that's going to move up to the north. we do have a futurecast in terms of wind, just to kind of show you where we're going to be. by 6:00, 7:00, 8:00, the numbers right there in bat ton rouge. not huge numbers you see big, big strong hurricanes. but you see enough to bring power outages down by tomorrow morning. it's sticking around. it's a very slow moving storm.

it will bring the wind in place for a long time. we'll also see the rain fall for a long time as well. as we go throughout monday, the same story as well. we'll continue to see the rain falling especially as we move to the northeast and then the tennessee valley. in the northeast we'll see some rain by thursday and also friday. richard? >> just starting with that one, covering so many states, michelle grossman, you'll get back to your commuters. i'll bring in andrea thompson associate editor of scientific american, justin kern from the american red cross joining us by phone as well. let's start with you first, andrea. looking at the numbers michelle is alluding to, they're growing in terms of people losing power, leveled off in louisiana as the storm moves. as has been said, i'll use a technical term, this is a chubby system, really wide, about 300, 350 miles wide.

as it moves north, it's affecting a lot of folks. >> yes, it is. it's going to keep affecting people well inland from the coast. some of the flooding threats will be into northern mississippi, arkansas, possibly even the tennessee river valley. yeah, this is affecting a huge group of people as these storms often do. >> when can the crews get back in there, those brave utility workers out there every time during such a situation, whether a tropical storm or hurricane moving through. also, there are the services on the ground, justin. american red cross right in the middle of it. how are the services right now? how are they being taxed and what are you seeing in terms of folks coming to get some help? >> absolutely. yeah. we've got more than nine evacuation shelters open for people in that area, especially in the baton rouge area that's getting pounded with rain. the idea -- to pre deploy a lot of stuff over the last few days because we knew the threat may not be from the winds, but

certainly from the flooding in these areas. setting it up in terms of having food, having places for people to stay that are safe. if you can get there, i'd encourage people to do it, but l if you're seeing those rising waters in the roads or if it's unsafe, hunker down and shelter at home tonight if that's the best option for you. >> andrea, lingering, sticking around. gobs of water. it was said earlier at the top of the show when i was quoting one of the officials, the national hurricane center, the director specifically saying, hey, you know, this one has off-the-charts amount of water. what's off-the-charts amount of water other than seeing these pictures, a lot of water coming down in a lingering way? >> part of it is, too, when you have the storms, you get these bands of thunderstorms. you can get several inches in an hour and the ground can't absorb

that that quickly. that's what causes the flooding of the it runs off into the rivers, causes the rivers to swell. that's been a lot of what's been happening in the midwest and along the mississippi river all spring and why the rivers are already in a precarious state. >> rock and a hard place? you want them to move fast but fast often means higher winds. >> yes, it can. it can be a double-edged sword. with this one, because the main threat is rain, having it go so slowly is the last thing you want to see. you want it to move out as quickly as possible. >> which makes us worry for you, justice. as we look at how slow and the deliberate nature that barry is moving, leaving so much water behind, are the folks that volunteer and work at these service centers, can they make it through two days of this? >> yes, this is what they train for. this is where they really thrive, their talents and their

compassion. the call is already going out for people from across the country to join them here in louisiana as well as mississippi where the stated need is right now. we'll roll with it as it comes along, with the ultimate goal of helping people in need. >> justin, you can go back a couple years, go back to katrina. how are you feeling this time around? >> i think we've done a great job of setting things up ahead of time. you don't want to compare storms, but there's a lot of great communication with partners. that's what i'm hearing. so i think that's the kind of thing, we're work together and understanding we all have a role in this and that includes people hunkering down at home watching us. >> andrea, final to you. as we watch the water and a lot of it, drinking supply. this is a petrol chemical heartland, if you will, for america. you pick any statistic you want,

half of the natural gas refining happens in that area in the gulf. >> it does. it can be a concern for those facilities in terms of preparing them. i think the companies do a lot to kind of try and guard against the flooding and things like that. with water quality, sewage can be a big issue because the infrastructure in these cities, the rain intensity is more than they can handle. >> we'll see what the sunrise tomorrow tells us as we hit the 5:00 hour there locally. thank you andrea thompson, justin kern, we a appreciate you taking the type. justin, our thoughts with you as you do if good work. >> thank you. undocumented americans bracing for tomorrow's immigration raids as the president says they'll happen tomorrow. we'll have that for you next. we'll have that for you next

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- the tech industry is supposed in invention and progress. but only 11% of its executives are women, and the quit rate is twice as high for them. here's a hack: make sure there's bandwidth for everyone. the more you know. there's nothing to be secret about. i.c.e. is law enforcement. they're great patriots. they have a tough job. nothing to be secret about. if the word gets out, it gets out, because hundreds of people know about it. it's a major operation. if the word gets out, it gets out. it starts on sunday and they're going to take people out and bring them back to their countries or they're going to take criminals out, put them in prison or put them in prison in the countries they came from. we're focused on criminals as much as we can. >> we're now mere hours away from what the president is discussing there. the reported deportation raids

targeting thousands in nearly ten major cities, nine. undocumented immigrants and advocates from coast to coast are bracing themselves for the show of force by the trump administration. according to new york city mayor bill deblasio, these raids may have already begun in his city. he tweeted earlier his officers are receiving reports of attempted but reportedly unsuccessful i.c.e. enforcement actions in the sunset park and harlem neighborhoods in brooklyn and manhattan in new york city. joining us now, raul reyes, msnbc.com contributor, diana pliego from the national immigration law center. thanks for being here. raul, what are the rights please migrants will have when they're engaged by i.c.e.? >> i think it's a surprise to many people, if you're undocumented in this country, you have rights. undocumented people have the

right under the fifth and 14th amendment to due process, have their claims add juft kated. if you're an undocumented person and i.c.e. comes to your door, you don't have to open the door, don't have to speak to them or give them any information. you have a right to an attorney. the problem is, in reality, these are rights that exist on the books and in principle. on the ground they're routinely violated. and i.c.e. will sweep up other people in the household, many times these are people latino and it opens the door for racial profiling. there's a big gap between the laws on the books and how i it plays out at the granular level in communities. that's one reason people are so scared. >> diana, you're one of the services asked for help. folks come and ask for help in these situations, whether families, or people here undocumented, here illegally. what is it you say to them in terms of these are your rights, this is what you can ask for.

>> first of all, thank you very much for having us on the show and having this important conversation. i think one thing that is important for people to do is be empowered and informed. so i really encourage anyone who might be directed impacted by these raids to be informed about what those rights are that raul was pointing to. you can always visit milc.org/know your rights to know you don't have to open the door, to know the difference between the different warrants presented to you, which ones are valid and which are not. it's important to be prepared and have a plan in place in case something does actually happen. >> the aclu did file a lawsuit to try to stop what is going to be happening in the next 24 hours. these are the government's i.c.e. raids. the government's system for providing notice is in chaos. in thousands of cases, the government mailed notices to incorrect addresses, sent them with no date or time and set hearings for dates including weekends when no hearings were

being held at all. raul, will that be able to stop the raids? if you're here illegally, you're here illegally. >> if you're here without documentation, that's a fact. however, for these people, the term of having, as we mentioned, a final order of deportation is very misleading. what this aclu lawsuit points to is many of these were issued for people in absentia, no legal requirement that they receive them. the problem for i.c.e. going forward, i'm not sure if the aclu will be able to have, say, an injunction or some type of temporary restraining action to stop this. on the ground there are many people who do not know that they're subject to removal right now, and even if i.c.e. were to come in their homes -- president trump is saying these people will be removed right away. that's not true. they have the right to reopen their case, the right to apply for as sigh lull. if they didn't have their case adjudica

adjudicated, they have a right to a lawyer, though not at government expense. this will add to the backlog in our immigration system and the overcrowding in the detention centers. where are these people going to be placed? we know family detention is wildly and dangerously overcrowded. >> diana, what do you tell folks who have family members in these detention centers? we must say the detention centers are often contracted to private companies here. >> i think, what i say to you is to, first of all, stay strong. this westbound incredibly traumatizing for people. a lot of times people are moved around from detention center to detention center, so it can be incredibly difficult to sometimes locate your loved one. i definitely encourage people to reach out to organizations that are willing and able and have the resources to help you find your family member, to get an attorney and to not give up the fight because people do have rights and they do have this right to due process even if it's trying to be stripped from

them, to continue fighting for your rights and make a public outcry to try to help your loved one win their case. >> raul, it's been said for those who are critical of the detention centers, we're not talking about coming to your house when you have an i.c.e. officer, all of them trying to do the job they've been told to do, what is it in terms of rights that you have, when you're in the detention center both practically as well as on the books? >> actually, when you're in a e detention center you have more rights, because you're under the u.s. government's care. you have the right to basic medical care, things like daily recreation, to basic food and nutrition. all those rights, as we see from very consistent reporting are being violated. that's where you see the gulf, again, between the laws on the books and protections in place in theory and the reality on the ground. whether you're talking about mike pence's visit or

congressional visits or reporting from different journalists, again and again we see people in horrific conditions. our system was not designed for this number of people. the government wants to keep them there, that's their choice. our government is failing to provide even the most basic human rights in terms of their care. >> 6:23 here in the eastern time zone. it's an hour earlier in texas. what is it that you're hearing up to this time from families that were looking and trying to plan in advance? this is not the first -- as i said before, not the first cycle we've gone through. we heard the government was going to be doing this. tell me about some calls that you've received asking for help, and what did you tell them? >> i think people are constantly reaching out, trying to figure out what they should do, whether they should go to work, continue life as normal. it's really difficult to tell them exactly how we can be

prepared because even though we have a list of cities, people supposedly going to be targeted, we know the real goal is to arrest as many people as possible, whoever they might come in contact with while they're conducting these raids. >> what do you tell them? do you tell them we're not sure, reach out to a lawyer? >> absolutely. we tell them to have a plan prepared. it's really, really critical that people have a plan prepared to go and look at these resources to know your rights and have a plan for your family to know what to do in case something happens to any one of you, to have your network of people ready to go, in case something happens, you can activate them and have the attorney to call, have a care giver in place for your children. there's so many things we have to think about. it's important to have that plan in place just in case something happens. >> of course, there was the vice president's visit to a couple of detention centers. we'll cover more of that specifically next hour. diana pliego, thank you very much. our good friend raul reyes as well, here in studio. we'll talk to you later on. coming up, we'll bring you

the latest on the tropical storm we've been watching weekend, barry. that's next. the very latest. that's next. the very latest. most people think a button is just a button. ♪ that a speaker is just a speaker. ♪ or - that the journey can't be the destination. most people haven't driven a lincoln. discover the lincoln approach to craftsmanship at the lincoln summer invitation. right now, get 0% apr on all 2019 lincoln vehicles plus no payments for up to 90 days. only at your lincoln dealer.

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still following tropical storm barry on msnbc. let's get over to the high winds to tell you about, storm surge. let's get over to michelle grossman. looking at an advisory that came in from mayor cantrell. she highlighted, flash flood watch in effect through 7:00 p.m. sunday and rainfall at least in the 10 to 20-inch range, could be higher in some areas as well. local leaders saying, hang on, you've got another at least 4 hours to go through this ooh thing. >> you're right. this storm has taken a lot of patients. we've been talking about it for days. it's been an odd storm. most of the heavy rain has been out over the gulf. it's finally making it onshore. so you're definitely not out of the woods yet. we're actually just getting started in many, many spots. we have about two days to go before it moves to the north. i'll go through the track.

let's talk about the rain. that's the big headline right now. we did have an advisory come out about an hour and a half ago, 65-mile-per-hour winds, still pretty strong tropical storm is moving to the north-northwest at 7 miles per hour. so picking up a little speed. it was really moving at five and then six and now seven. still seeing the bands come onshore. this is the track and this is what we or talking about in terms of length. it's going to take a long time to get where it needs to go, very slow moving storm. it's a wide storm, too. it's affecting many states. four or five states. it will eventually affect more as we go throughout time. take a look at the track as we go throughout time. sunday, 1:00, still in louisiana. not until monday is it in arkansas and finally making it into the ohio river valley and then eventually into the northeast. that won't be until thursday and friday. this is the big weather headline as we go throughout the next couple days. flash flood watches, rain. we'll see the potential for life-threatening rain because flash flooding. we're already seeing all that

water, the live pictures, it will find its way to lakes and streams and rivers. this is what we're looking at. one warning affects mobile, alabama. the watch means we're kind of right for the conditions to happen. warnings will pop in tonight and through sunday into monday morning. memphis, little rock, greenville, jackson, hattiesburg, lafayette, alexandria you're in the bullseye. the yellows and oranges are very heavy downpours it came from kansas, went to the south and gained speed and energy over the gulf. now it's moving to the north. it's like a magnet, picking up all the moisture from the north and dump it in places as we go through the next 48 hours. a still image showing us what is happening. most of the heavier rain at this moment.

further to the south, new orleans getting range, baton rouge, mobile getting heavy downpours. we've seen that for hours and hours today. we want to talk about winds next. we're looking at the flood threat in terms of baton rouge and new orleans. high-risk is jackson, mccomb, alexandria. moderate or high. we're looking at a dangerous situation over the next couple days. we don't want to discount the winds. we just don't want to highlight them. it's never been the big headline with this story but could cause problems in terms of power outages, trees coming down. seen pictures with trees on top of cars, trailers, houses. roofs being picked up off of houses. we really want to talk about the rain. this is what's happening in terms of winds gusting from ten to 30 miles per hour, seeing a 45 might 45-mile-per-hour wind .

the rain will continue, the winds will continue. it's really the rain bands we'll watch. >> tens of millions of people in the area we have to worry about. $8 million to $10 million in terms of losses. everybody hoping it's not going to be that bad. michelle grossman, thank you. we'll touch base with you letter. the 2020 candidates hit the campaign trail today. we'll bring you what happened on the field in just a little bit. it's so important to us that verizon is supporting military families. when i have a child deployed, having a reliable network means everything. so, when i get a video chat, and i get to see their face, it's the best thing in the world. and i've earned every one of these gray hairs. military moms, we serve too. (vo) the network more people rely on, gives you more. like military plans with a special price on unlimited, $100 per line, and big savings on our best phones when you switch. that's verizon.

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the rich and powerful have figured out, you can invest in buildings, you can invest in training your workforce, but you get a much better return on your investment when you invest in politicians in washington, to give you what you want. well, networks, grassroots movement is how we take our country back and how we decide we are not going to be an america that just works for those at the top. we're going to be an america that works for everyone. >> a working weekend there, senator elizabeth warren the clear headliner today sharing her platform from breaking up big tech to ending for-profit prisons. former vice president joe biden was on the campaign trail where he was asked about anita hill. take a listen to this.

>> by the way, i've had a long conversation. she said could you vote for joe biden, she said yes. didn't say she will, but she said yes. so it's a little blown out of proportion a little bit. the fact is that i think it's important that the courts look like the country. >> joining us now, political consultant tara dhar del, fer and in omande. tara, he didn't answer the question, when specifically asked, he would nominate anita hill. >> for joe biden, i think this is going to continue to dog him. first of all, his opponents are going to continue to use it against him. it is a legitimate line of attack. it speaks to policy positions. it speaks to other issues. i think it's a fair game for him. i think he's going to have to have a better answer, not just not answer the question, but also when he does answer it, it needs to be a better answer. i think one of the things joe

biden has struggled with is he has a long record in the sflat, obviously, and he was vice president. he needs to do a better job of accepting that some of the decisions that he made when he was in the senate and throughout his career? the government have not been great decisions, and that's okay. because you can't have a record that long and get everything right. he needs to own those things that he did that people reasonable fond on. part and parcel to that, he needs to do a better job of defending the things he was right on. that's also a much lengthier record. he was right on a lot of things, violence against women act. he was a huge proponent of that and a huge force and advocate behind that. he needs to stand behind those things and forcefully make pronunciations about those things he got right, especially the lbgt community, a lot of progress made under the obama 5d registration, it wasn't just president obama, it was him pushing the progress. he needs to be more forceful in

making the case for the things he did get right. >> so fernand, is biden the one that can do wrong better than anybody else because he has historically had a lot of things that he would not get right and people would go, oh, that's joe biden. >> richard, this is the high-risk, high-reward nature of biden's candidacy. what has propelled him to front-runner status in the race is his long-time experience, long-time record. as tara mentions, that's 48 years, combination of time in the senate with a whole host of votes over the decades. of course, his tenure as vice president. i think whether it's the anita hill question, the tempest -- the issue around the segregationist senators he had to deal with and how that ended up harming him in the debates. this is what joe biden is going to have to contend with, not the

least of which is also the fact that this race, which he started off as the clear front-runner as recently as two months ago, he now has elizabeth warren nipping at his heels. you look at the new nbc news poll that came out, this is now down to a less than double-digit advantage. he's got to be concerned about that. >> now you're doing my job. i'm supposed to be talking about the poll. give me a minute, would you? >> i'm a pollster. >> i like pollsters. pollsters are my friends. when we look at the numbers, and that's where i want to drill down more jason. what are you seeing in the latest nbc news/"wall street journal" poll, joe biden, still 26. what we're seeing is single digit difference, elizabeth warren popping, kamala harris, solidifying at least post debate a steady top-tier number here. >> no question about it. as you know, we have seen an

unprecedented campaign for president on the democratic side this time. there's a lot of pent up demand to get started, determine the nominee for the democratic party for the one thing everyone in the democratic party agrees with which is defeating donald trump. as such, if you go all the way back to september, consistently idea has led in the polls, but now, as you point out, we've seen a very significant collapse in joe biden's polling numbers. what is that a result of? that's a result of the very first debate when kamala harris came out and prosecuted -- did a really good job of putting joe biden on his heels. for a guy whose number one message to the democratic voters is i'm the best guy to defeat donald trump, then the town around and say he didn't expect for kamala harris or anyone else to come at him on his record of

busing, i think that really caused him to question his number one strategy brand message going forward. yes, he's collapsing. no doubt about it. >> tara, as jason is saying, the numbers, the real clear politics average that looks at the average of the most recent polls. last weekend to this weekend, you can see here on the screen pretty steady freddy for all the top four at the moment. we kind of hit a medium until the next debate. >> i think so. joe biden has a base of support is -- there's a group of people that will be with him no matter what, they're older, disproportionately african-american. the question is how much of the support he has now is soft. >> who is in play? >> exactly. what is that hard number for him? what is that floor? what is that number? we don't know that. the second debate will probably suss that out.

another issue joe biden has had that's not been really explored is he hasn't been, up until recently, campaigning much. that's the other issue. >> fund raising on weekends. >> if you're not out there as much, you also allow those people who are to make inroads. i would argue it wasn't just that debate where he clearly did not perform well, it's also the fact that he had not been out there as much and people will view that as a lack of enthusiasm, maybe complacency, expecting something. voters take note of that type of thing. that's another issue. >> without even asking for it. a new cadence and we've seen it in the last cycle that we expect as consumers of this stuff, we expect a high volume, high cycle cadence. >> and high energy. >> and high energy. very much one-to-one where possible. i want to play a little bit to you, fernand, of the issues

talked about on the trail right now. iowa is where many are. i want to play this first and get your response, at net roots. >> >> that's one of the big topics. this is the weekend to talk about it, is it not, with the very issue that will be happening according to president trump in the next 24 hours, immigration and the issues behind snit. >> no doubt about it. i'm coming to you from miami, one o the cities that are on edge right now. i think a lot of democratic voters are looking to which of the candidates is really taking the lead on defining these issues like immigration. i thought it was fascinating to see that elizabeth warren, who is kind of regarded as the policy leader, issues leader in terms of putting out robust

issues, this week announced a comprehensive immigration plan. i think you see vice president biden and those comments, reacting to the notion while he's running on the basis of experience and record, he needs to address these issues, immigration at the top of the list. >> jason, quickly to you. last word. >> joe biden's record on immigration and border security is nothing let's than schizophrenic. he really has to decide where he stands. is it he going to go with the left wing base of the party and embrace open borders, am necessity, et cetera? or is he going to be the joe biden that voted for 700 miles of fencing when he was a united states senator. while he was in iowa, the last time he ran for president, stated we cannot have illegal immigration in this country and we need to crack down on employers who hire, quote, illegal immigrants. he's got a real decision going forward. >> jason, fernand and tara dowdel, thank you all three. >> thank you.

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mueller about the evidence of the ten obstructions of justice by the president, of the repeated instructions by the president to people to lie to them, the american people, and to investigating bodies. and, of course, barr doesn't want that. of course, he doesn't want to be contradicted in his lies and misrepresentations. >> after weeks of anticipating special counsel robert mueller's testimony before the house judiciary and intelligence committees, his testimony has been delayed for a week. he will now testify on july 24th for five hours instead of the originally planned four, giving all judiciary members, democrats and republicans, a chance to question the former special counsel. joining us now, jill wine-banks, former special prosecutor and former federal prosecutor glenn kirschner. what happened with this change in date? >> the change in dates was to gain one hour of testimony with

two hours and 41 members of the house judiciary committee. there wasn't enough time for everybody to get a question in. now each member of the committee will get less than five minutes to question him. and i think that's definitely not enough time. that's five minutes, including his answer. i think it's a bad format. i would really like to see, for example, either staff do the questioning or have each congressmen seed his or her time to one person so there can be questions and sffollow-up. that's what's important, is the public education that this will provide for all the people who have not yet had time to read the report or even just to thumb through conclusions or to see the repeated number of times

that it says we did not exonerate the president. >> what concerns do you hear, glenn, if you're trying to get to the truth, as you listen to bob mueller and you have both who are supporting his work and those who do not. who does this help more, the critics or the supporters? >> i agree with jill. you know, there should be no time limit, richard, on getting truthful information before the american people about what's been going on in this administration. to answer your question, i think it probably helps the mueller detractors, because they will successfully spend five minutes talking about, you know, things like dossiers and spying on campaigns. and i'm sure somebody will gratuitously mention hillary's emails, as opposed to the kind of methodical questioning

required to really expose to the public the findings in volume 1 of mueller's report, showing massive coordination between the trump campaign and the russians. i would call it collusion because it is collusion. and then all of the instances documented in volume 2 showing that the president obstructed justice trying to keep himself out of hot water. i think the short time period given to each questioner helps his detractors, not the people who are really interested in getting the truth out. >> jill, you've been through the process. it is not a short process once you begin these series of questions. congress has eight days, i think, working days left this year before the summer break. we are also talking about potentially those who are watching the democratic house members that they're not all necessarily kumbayaing because as they try to come together, what you're suggesting,

especially staff leading questions, do you think it might be probably? are they huddling like this as you suggest? >> i think they are. i have every reason to believe that the -- at least the democratic side of the house -- are working out a way that it's not going to just be jumping from question to question and going from democratic to republican to democrat to republican where the public can't follow what's coming out. i think they understand the importance of this. let's not forget that mueller is not just going to summarize and agree to the things he's already said. but he is a fact witness to misrepresentation by barr. so in addition to whatever he said, he should be asked about that. >> all right. thank you, jill wine-banks and john kirschner. appreciate both of you your

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the water is stacking up. we got good news to the east side of parish, the tide has fallen. hopefully within the hour the tide will start to fall, and as we see, the levee has not broke.