and police based on trust and partnership without showing that police must be accountable if they step over the line and particularly if they break the law. we must have the law enforced for everyone, not for those that are not guilty. we cannot be anti-community or anti-police, but we must be anti-wrong, no matter who does the wrong. that does it for me this weekend. i'll see you back here next saturday at 5:00 p.m. eastern. up next, "meet the press" with chuck todd. this sunday, the democratic presidential race. >> that's the america we believe in. >> we have a chance to do this. >> and i got a plan for that. >> our brand new nbc news/"wall street journal" poll, who's up, who's down, and our first look at how the candidates' fare against president trump. >> we have a president who is undermining democracy.

>> my guest this morning, senator bernie sanders of vermont. plus, those immigration raids start today. >> we take those people out, and we take them out very legally. >> as democrats and republicans argue over how to handle the border crisis. >> what will we say to this generation of children and parents we imprisoned for seeking safety? we should be the ones begging for forgiveness. >> we do not get anywhere by blaming the people who are doing their best to help these people. >> i'll talk to republican senator ron johnson of wisconsin. and america's newest hero. >> we have to be better. we have to love more, hate less. we got to listen more and talk less. >> megan rapinoe joins me to talk about the u.s. women's world cup win, her fight for equal pay, and why she won't go to the white house to celebrate. joining me for insight and analysis are, nbc news chief white house correspondent hallie jackson, former republican congressman carlos curbelo of florida, former democratic senator claire mccaskill of

missouri, and tim alberto from politico magazine. welcome to sunday. it's "meet the press." >> announcer: from nbc news, the longest running show in television history, this is a special edition of "meet the press" with chuck todd. good sunday morning. we're getting our first clear look at where the race for the democratic presidential nomination actually stands and where the candidates stand against president trump. here are our first head-to-head matchups of the 2020 race in our new nbc news/"wall street journal" poll of registered voters. we have joe biden leading president trump 51-42. that's a healthy nine-point edge outside the margin. we have bernie sanders with a healthy lead sitting at 50% to president trump's 43. going down the line, elizabeth warren up five but under 50, 48-43. kamala harris is essentially tied with mr. trump. holding a one-point edge, 45-44. as you can see there, while the democratic numbers do change depending on the candidate, president trump's numbers essentially match his job approval rating, which in this poll is right in line where with

he's been at 45%. in the democratic race for the nomination, joe biden is still on top despite his shaky debate performance followed by a surging elizabeth warren. kamala harris, bernie sanders, and pete buttigieg round out the top tier. and yes, ladies and gentlemen, that is your top tier. sorry to everybody else these days. looking at the rest of the field, only andrew yang and beto o'rourke reach 2%. there's a real prospect that the remaining one percenters won't even qualify for the third debate in september and will be forced out of the race. ultimately, the real story of our poll is two separate and distinct races are emerging on the democratic side, each defined by the magnitude of change voters are looking for. there's the small change, get things done, restoration side represented by joe biden. and the big change, take risks side that favors elizabeth warren. >> we need big structural change in this country. >> i don't know why we get rid of what, in fact, was working and move to something totally new.

>> reporter: it's a tale of two primary electorates. 41% of democrats in that new nbc news/"wall street journal" poll seek smaller scale policies that cost less, may be easier to pass, and bring less change. 35% of those voters pick joe biden, who leads the field among them by double digits. >> but i'm not naive. it's not some old-fashioned way of doing things that no longer exist. it's the only way our system is supposed to work. >> reporter: the other 54% of democrats want larger-scale policies and major change. those voters pick elizabeth warren. again, by double digits. >> you want to make change? we're not going to do this by getting one statute over here, a couple regulations over there, maybe a better secretary over here. it's not going to work that way. >> reporter: while biden does best among moderates and conservatives, warren holds a substantial lead among liberals, now outpacing rival bernie sanders, who is competing for the same voters. >> these are not radical ideas, but we need to rally the american people by the millions. that's what i mean by a

political revolution. >> reporter: the fight between electability and progressive purity is playing out as democrats debate how to take on donald trump. >> you've been awakened, awakened by donald trump. let's talk about that genius for a second. >> i don't think you fight by getting up every day and talking about donald trump. i don't. this is our chance to talk about our vision for america. >> reporter: and argue over issues like health care. >> a medicare for all, single-payer system. >> i think that we should not be scrapping obamacare. we should be building on it. >> reporter: a battle is also playing out in congress, where tensions between house speaker nancy pelosi and four freshmen democrats who have called themselves the squad boiled over after they voted against a border aid bill they argue empowers president trump. pelosi told maureen dowd, all these people have their public whatever and their twitter world. but they didn't have any following. >> it wasn't dismissive. it was a statement of fact. they were four who argued against the bill, and they were the only four who voted against

the bill. all i said was nobody followed their lead. >> reporter: congressman alexandria ocasio-cortez fired back, criticizing pelosi's singling out of newly elected women of color. >> how do you respond to criticism that you're playing the race card with nancy pelosi? >> that's stupidly untrue. >> reporter: given these divides, can any one democrat build a coalition, bridging the distance between the party's two groups of voters? kamala harris, among others, is trying, criticizing biden and warren, though not by name. >> i'm going to tell you, that's why i'm not churning out plans like a factory. because it is really important to me that any plan that i'm prepared to implement is actually doable. >> and joining me now is presidential candidate bernie sanders, the independent senator from vermont running as a democrat for this campaign. senator sanders, welcome back to "meet the press," sir. >> good to be with you, chuck. >> it's fascinating in our poll. i think about your candidacy from 2015 and sort of your come from nowhere, insurgent

candidacy. here you have changed the democratic party. a majority of democrats want big, substantive, transformational change. how frustrating is it to you that right now among those voters, they're picking elizabeth warren right now and not you? >> well, that's in your poll. >> i understand that. >> there are three other polls that came out in the last week or two that had us in a strong second place. and let me tell you something, chuck. let me tell you why we're going to win the democratic nomination and why we're going to beat donald trump. that is that the working class of this country is sick and tired of working longer hours for lower wages. they're sick and tired of three people in america owning more wealth than the bottom half of america. sick and tired of 50% of american workers living paycheck to paycheck and being the only major country on earth not to guarantee health care to all people. that is why we're going to win this election. >> well, as i was saying, i feel like message-wise, you're winning the argument. voter-wise, you still have a ways to go.

you know, why you and not elizabeth warren? what would you say to those democrats that want these transformational changes? they look at the two of you and say, yes, there are a few differences here and there, but they're both advocating that big transformational change. >> well, you know, elizabeth is a good friend of mine, and all i can say is the following. what people understand is that for decades now, there have been great speeches, great legislation, great plans about how to move the working class of this country forward. and yet in the last 30 years, unbelievably, the top 1% has seen a 21% increase -- $21 trillion increase in their wealth while the bottom half have fallen even further behind. in other words, what we need in this country is a mass movement of millions of people, which i am prepared to lead as president, to take on wall street, to take on the drug companies who are ripping us off every single day, to take on the insurance companies, to take on

the fossil fuel industry, which is literally destroying this planet. what we need is a political revolution, and i think i am the only candidate who has been clear about that, who has the capability of doing that, and defeating donald trump in the process. >> you're getting a lot of advice these days from a lot of friends. "the new york times" story earlier this week was filled with a lot of it. i want to show you an excerpt. a deeper challenge confronting his aides and supporters after nearly four decades of running and usually winning, iconoclastic campaigns on his own terms, he is deeply reluctant to change his approach. and you've had a lot of -- these are people very much supporters of you who are saying it sounds too much like 2016. you have to rejigger things a little bit. be more personable. how are you accepting this advice? >> well, look, two things. people say, bernie, you know, you're repetitious. you are talking about the rich getting richer and 40 million people living in poverty.

you are talking about so many old people who cannot afford their medicine and so forth. you know what, chuck? here's a promise i will make to you. when the poor get richer and the rich get poorer, when all of our people have health care as a right, when we are leading the world in the fight against climate change, you know what, i will change what i am saying. so it's not me that's being repetitious. it is what is going on in society continues to favor the people who have the wealth and the power while all over this country people are working two or three jobs. and i understand it. i keep hammering away at that issue because i believe that in the wealthiest country in the history of the world, we don't need 45 million people struggling with student debt. kids can't afford to go to college. those are the issues i will continue to talk about, and those are the issues we'll win on. >> i'm very curious of what you make of what's happening in the house of representatives on the democratic side. because it does feel a bit like it's sort of insider/outsider. alexandria ocasio-cortez, who was a volunteer in your campaign, was very upset with

nancy pelosi and said, when these comments first started, i kind of thought she was keeping the progressive flank at more of an arm's distance in order to protect more moderate member, which i understood. but the persistent singling out, it got to a point where it was just outright disrespectful, the explicit singling out of newly elected women of color. is this part of this bigger disruption you helped lead four years ago where the party is just having growing pains? what do you make of this dispute? >> chuck, this is what i think. it goes without saying that the future of our country and the future of the democratic party rests with young people. and i'm very proud, by the way, in virtually every poll that i have seen, we are winning people under 45 or 50 years of age and younger. >> you do well of younger voters in our poll as well, yeah. >> okay. and what alexandria and other young women and women of color are saying, we have got to reach out to young people. we have got to heal the pain of the working class of this country. and that is causing some

political disruption within the leadership of the democratic party. and let me give you one example where i am very concerned. i have helped lead the effort to expand community health centers in this country. right now there's legislation in the house, the democratic house, to cut community health centers by 20%. unacceptable. so i support, you know, alexandria's and the other women's desire to bring more people, especially young people, working class people, into the democratic party. that is the future of the democratic party. >> do you think the speaker is being too tough on them? >> i think a little bit. you cannot ignore the young people of this country who are passionate about economic and racial and social and environmental justice. you got to bring them in, not alienate them. >> i'm curious. you're one of seven senators running. we have this crisis at the border, unsustainable conditions, and now even republicans are saying they think these conditions need to change. what could you guys do right now

in the senate? what do you think you could do now in the senate? i know you have plans to do something if you're elected president, but what do you plan on doing in the senate in the next couple weeks? >> well, the immediate crisis is that we cannot be separating children from their parents. you cannot be having unsanitary, disgraceful conditions in which women and children and people are living. this is the wealthiest country on earth. we can make sure that if people travel a thousand miles with their children, while they're awaiting the asylum proceedings, they are treated with respect and dignity and as human beings. >> is there something more, though, that you could do, band together almost as a presidential caucus and try to demand some of these changes? it seems as if it's a lot of rhetoric, but what could you guys bring from the campaign trail? >> well, i think we can raise consciousness about this issue and understand that desperate people who are fleeing violence

in honduras and other countries with their little children, these are not criminals. these are desperate people who deserve to have an asylum process and to be, if possible, not detained at all. go with their relatives and friends while awaiting proceedings. at the end of the day, chuck, we have got to do what the american people want, and that is comprehensive immigration reform and a path toward citizenship for 11 million undocumented. we need to provide immediate legal status for the daca program and a humane border policy. that is realitiy what -- really what we have to do as a nation. >> senator sanders, i'm going to leave it there for now. thanks for coming on and sharing your views. stay safe on the trail. >> okay. thank you. take care. >> thank you. now joining me from the other side of the aisle in the united states senate, senator ron johnson of wisconsin. welcome back to the show, sir. >> good morning, chuck. >> let me start with the vice president's visit with some senate republicans down to a couple of centers there, one of them the pool reporter traveling with the vice president

described a horrendous stench when they walked into the facility. the vice president himself said this was tough. we've heard a lot more republicans acknowledge the conditions here in these facilities are just unsustainable. okay. where do we go from here? are you comfortable with this situation? >> oh, absolutely not, which is why i was supporting the emergency funding measure for months before democrats finally decided to cooperate and grant the $4.6 billion or vote for the $4.6 billion in funding. that's just a first step. but chuck, the problem is the uncontrolled, the overwhelming flow of people coming into this country illegally. in may alone, 4600 people per day. came down a little bit in june to about 3500 people per day. on average, it's been over 2800 people per day for this fiscal year. so again, let me put this in context. since 2014, that was the humanitarian crisis year that president obama called a

humanitarian crisis when 120,000 people came in this country illegally, either unaccompanied child, but primarily part of a family. since 2014, the last five years, nine months, 1,086,000 people have come in as unaccompanied child or primarily as a family and been apprehended. 1,086,000 people, about half of those have come in the last nine months alone. so it's overwhelming our system, and the goal of our policy should be to reduce that flow. turn it into a legal process. there's a number of things we can do. one of the things we have to do is raise that initial bar in terms of claiming asylum. hopefully set up centers in guatemala, in central america so people can claim refugee status. but this is completely out of control. >> senator, there seems to be that enforcement -- there's an argument the extra enforcement measures, the get-tough measures

the president has tried is actually encouraging more migration. let me read you a clip from ricardo salinas. the people of central america are left with a stark choice. endure growing instability, poverty, and intensifying violence as part of the failed drug war or flee now before the border is closed completely. the rapidly rising numbers of families and unaccompanied minors who are willing to risk their lives to make the perilous journey north, even knowing that detention and separation await, speak of the increasing desperation. i mean, this seems to be -- we're talking about the border when the real core of the problem we're doing nothing about, if anything, the president took money away from central america. >> first of all, chuck, yeah, there is some short-term detention, but we're in full catch and release. people aren't being detained for much more than, at most, probably a couple weeks. so we're in full catch and release. there was a survey done by the association of research and social studies in guatemala that said a third of guatemalans intended to migrate to the united states. that's almost 6 million people. a gallup poll showed 42 million people in latin america want to migrate to the united states.

we can't take all comers. we have to have a legal system, primarily designed toward working with our economy to get people in here to work so we can continue to grow our economy. this is completely out of control. again, the goal of our policy should be to reduce the flow of people coming into this country illegally and turn that into a legal flow. >> i understand that, but you don't believe coming up with some sort of better plan for central america might actually be the best way to decrease the flow? >> well, that is a very long-term solution. it's given rise to drug cartels, done great harm to the public institutions of central america. there's no doubt about it, we bear responsibility. that's not going to fix this problem in the here and now any time soon. i certainly want to see money flow to make sure we can safely return people. i'm working with democrat colleagues on a pilot program called operation safe return where we can rapidly and more accurately determine those families that clearly don't have a valid asylum claim, and

majority of them don't, and safely return them to central america. that will require some u.s. funding as well. there are also humanitarian organizations who are willing to facilitate that, but we have to have that consequence. when michael chertoff in 2005 faced a surge of brazilians set up a process of removal, reduced the flow in 90 days. that has to be our first step, reduce the flow, then work long-term with central america to improve conditions down there. >> i want to turn to a little bit of politics. there's a book out called "american carnage" by tim alberta. there's some interesting paul ryan quotes. being a wisconsin guy and paul ryan guy, i'm curious of your reaction. here's the excerpt. for a long stretch of the 2016 campaign, paul ryan refused to accept trump's take over the gop. he traversed the stages of grief. denial, no way trump can win. anger, i called him a racist. bargaining, the rnc powerpoint slides. and depression, this is fatal, he told reince priebus. before finally coming to terms with it. this resistance was grounded in a basic belief that the republican party was still his

party. looking back, ryan says, he should have known better. you know wisconsin. you know ryan. you know trump. what do you make of this dispute? is this personal? is this a misread of where the party is? and where do you fit? >> well, i consider paul ryan a friend. i've got a good working relationship with the president. i've always abided by the ronald reagan 11th commandment. i think we do need to realize, as republicans and conservatives -- >> president trump doesn't abide by that. >> we need to hang together here. so i think we've accomplished a lot of good things the last few years. we have more competitive tax system. that's produced more than 3% growth. ten times higher business investment. that's going to grow our economy in the future. again, from my standpoint, i'd like everybody to get along because we need to preserve this country, this marvel of the american economy and model of freedom. >> do you think president trump's criticism of speaker ryan and his speakership is warranted? >> well, again, i would prefer

that we all understand that the opponent in this political struggle are democrats and their growing socialism and what they would turn america into. so we need to hang together. i'd prefer nobody criticize each other on our side. >> all right. senator ron johnson, republican from wisconsin, i'm going to leave it there. thanks for coming on and sharing your views. much appreciated. >> have a great day. >> when we come back, those immigration raids starting today and the debate over the crisis at the border. the panel is next. and later, the co-captain of the u.s. women's national soccer team, megan rapinoe. liberty mutual customizes your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. nice! but uh, what's up with your partner? oh! we just spend all day telling everyone how we customize car insurance because no two people are alike, so... limu gets a little confused when he sees another bird that looks exactly like him. ya... he'll figure it out. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪

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talk to your doctor or pharmacist today that's it. i'm calling kohler about their walk-in bath. [ sigh ] not gonna happen. my name is ken. how may i help you? hi, i'm calling about kohler's walk-in bath. excellent! happy to help. huh? hold one moment please... [ finger snaps ] hmm. the kohler walk-in bath features an extra-wide opening and a low step-in at three inches, which is 25 to 60% lower than some leading competitors. the bath fills and drains quickly, while the heated seat soothes your back, neck and shoulders.

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to start with the i.c.e. raids happening today. here's what a couple mayors have said. the president said they are welcoming this. here's a couple of mayors who say not so much. >> this fear mongering and making immigrants scapegoats and really disrupting families who are just here trying to live their life, that's not who we are or should be as americans. >> there's anxiety being created not just in our immigrant community but with anyone who has compassion and concern for human beings. >> and of course, the president is sort of bragging about these raids. here's what he said about it. >> so if the word gets out, it gets out. it starts on sunday, and they're going to take people out and they're going to bring them back to their countries or they're going to take criminals out, put them in prison, or put them in prison in the countries they came from. we're focused on criminals as much as we can before we do anything else. >> this is -- if you cared about this, why would you tell people? >> because the president likes talking about this.

he knows it plays well with his base. he was gautd got 2020 on his mind. cue the president's tweets to when he starts going after democratic mayors for talking negatively about his i.c.e. raids. there are people in the administration saying this has been grossly mismessaged. the president is way out over his skis on this trying to rile up people that support him and that's not backed up by what these i.c.e. raids will turn out to be. it's a concern, i think, for some people in the white house. >> tim, immigration in your book, i mean, it is probably the greatest sort of fissure point inside the republican party and why trump is president. >> that's right. and hallie have talked about this before. to use a basketball term, the president sees immigration as a high percentage shot. it's a slam dunk for him with his base. the problem is that we know, for a fact, that there were a lot of suburban traditional upscale republicans who voted for trump in 2016, who voted for a democrat in 2018. a lot of them did view immigration as that fissure point that begins to split the

traditional republican suburban upscale college educated republican from that more exurban rural working class conservative republican. the president is playing with fire here because while he may rile up his folks, while he may mobilize that true believer base, he runs a real risk of alienating that broader coalition that he's going to need to win re-election. >> carlos, you represented part of a county that is part of that broader coalition the president needs. cuban-americans, venezuelan-americans, colombian-americans, at what point do they not like this raid business? >> yeah, there is a breaking point. south florida is different. a lot of the hispanic vote there looks outside the united states to foreign policy and that kind of determines their votes. however, there is a sense of solidarity in the hispanic community and if you push too far on these enforcement policies, then you start losing those other hispanics who aren't directly impacted by them but certainly feel bad for those families, the individuals hurt by this. the sad part is this is not the solution. the solution to this is to

reform our immigration laws, to fix the entire system. this is a political stunt, quite frankly. if you wanted to conduct effective raids, why would you announce it? everyone is hiding now. >> it's also out of character for this president, who for every law enforcement action or act taken, loves to talk about the element of surprise and loves to talk about how, well, i'm not going to preview what we're going to do because you'll know what's happening. in this instance, he did the opposite. >> claire, the immigration issue is probably one of the reasons you lost in missouri. but i want you to react to something here. the heritage foundation wrote the following. so the open borders enthusiasts need to rethink. america is not a perfect nation, but it has done pretty well by its immigrants over the past couple hundred years. everyone is welcome provided you come here legally. work hard and stick to the rules. it is a more sustainable ethos for a nation. how did democrats walk that line? >> i think they've got to be respectful of the fact that most americans, maybe not the far left segment of the democratic party, but most americans want there to be a process that's

fair and legal. they do not like the idea that people can come -- because if you open the borders, then anybody can come. i think what's interesting about this raid is they are supposedly going after criminals. in other words, people who have committed felonies. there's plenty of people who have come here illegally that have committed felonies that they could be busy with. you never announce that ahead of time. if somebody has committed a felony, they know how to hide. so the notion that he's trying to throw out this idea they're going after criminals, as he announces they're doing it, just shows he's sending a secret message to his base that he thinks all of them are criminals, which is not what america thinks. >> and i think there's a competency question. we have an acting homeland security who used to be the border patrol commissioner. there's an acting border patrol commissioner who used to be the acting i.c.e. director. the current acting i.c.e. director, it's the second time he's been the acting i.c.e. director. that's just dhs. i'm going to put up a scroll of

all the actings we have here. it's going to take a while. we can start talking while people see here. these aren't small agencies either. this competency question. >> the president doesn't mind it, though, chuck. he thinks -- and based on my reporting, the president truly believes he has more flexibility when he has more all these acting positions in place. he has a new acting position, obviously, with the labor secretary, who just stepped down two days ago. when i talk to folks in and around the white house, it's not necessarily homeland security. it's not necessarily dhs. it's the defense department still without a permanent defense secretary. that's a concern for the president's allies, for people who support him in and around washington. >> and really thumbing the nose at the constitution. these people are supposed to be confirmed. that are leading these agencies. that's the way our founding fathers wrote the constitution. i'm so sick of some in your party, carlos, waving the constitution when a democrat is in office and completely ignoring the constitution when a republican is in office. >> and it's important to remember that even when there was not this long list of actings, even in the earliest

days of the administration when they rolled out the so-called muslim ban, there was no coordination between any of these departments. the white house had not given talking points to anybody to defend this when the president was at the pentagon signing the executive order. even when they were fully staffed with the a-team, this was still really messy. when you get to the third string, it's going to be worse. >> remember, that "a" team, not everybody thought that was an "a" team then. carlos? >> just briefly, the other side of what tim said, because immigration is going to be a top issue in 2020, if the president can bait democrats into saying that the status quo is acceptable, that we should have open borders or that, like some are saying, that we should offer benefits and all sorts of public welfare benefits to those that are coming, that could cost democrats as well. i think there's potential peril for them as well. >> we'll pause it here. when we come back, we're all pretty excited about our next guest. >> we have pink hair and purple hair. we have tattoos, dreadlocks.

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this is my charge to everyone. we have to be better. we have to love more, hate less. we got to listen more and talk less. we got to know that this is everybody's responsibility. >> welcome back. that was megan rapinoe, who right now is bigger than lebron, bigger than brady, bigger than just about anyone in the sports world and maybe beyond. rapinoe is co-captain and star of the u.s. women's national soccer team which just won the world cup again. but she's about much more than soccer. rapinoe has made news both for her fight for equal pay for women's soccer players and for her refusal to celebrate with her team at the white house.

we are very happy to have megan rapinoe join us this morning. welcome to "meet the press." >> thank you. thank you for having me on. >> a long-time boxing reporter who's now a baseball announcer, charlie steiner, said to me he viewed you as a modern day ali. here's what "sports illustrated" wrote. there are elements of a modern-day ali many rapinoe's co-mingling of sports and social activism, to say nothing of her ability to turn the media's attention, even when negative, in certain circles to her advantage. what do you make of the ali comparisons? >> that's very flattering. i don't know if i'm ali, but i'm happy to be the biggest ally akin to ali. >> what opportunity do you see here? it's like, okay, we got the attention. i am going to make these points. am i going to make -- do this activism. >> i think the opportunity is in everyone's exhaustion of the fighting and the negative, and our team has managed to make people proud again, to capture people's interest, and make them

want to do something. i think people are asking the question, how can we rally around this team? and in that, what the team stands for, whether it's equal pay or racial equality or lgbtq rights, i think we've just managed to give people hope, and with that we need to do the next step, which is to actually take the progress step. >> let me go specifics with equal pay. i'm sort of surprised here that the corporate communities that support the u.s. soccer federation have been so slow to see this, have been so slow to fill the gap. i know proctor & gamble came out today. they've given an additional bonus to every member of the team. but i understand the way these deals are negotiated, and some of this is the u.s. soccer federation, but are you disappointed in the way corporate america has handled this, your sponsors? >> yeah, i am. i think that we can do a lot more, a lot more quickly. i think that it is a complicated issue, and i think sometimes we

get in the weeds about it. can't see the forest for the trees when, you know, big sponsors can just write the check. these are some of the most powerful corporations, not just in sports, but in the world and have so much weight they can throw around. i think they just need to get comfortable throwing it around. >> how much of this is you got to grow the game globally, by the way? because it does seem as if it's the westernized nations who have supported women's sports first. >> yes. >> and that is perhaps made folks in the corporate community think, oh, there's not enough people there to market to. >> no, i think that the global aspect is huge. even just in the last three or four years, to see the way that other federations have succeeded with their teams on the field. they've thrown money behind them and, shocker, those teams are doing better. >> it's good it was harder this time, right? >> i know, exactly. >> no offense to the other teams, but it was a little harder. that's good for the game. >> it's great for the game. i think it allows us to put so much more pressure on fifa as well, to mandate that these federations have the money to

pay their programs and to mandate that fifa and to push them really to do more. >> you were talking about that you see an opportunity here to preach a message of unity. i think the hardest conundrum a lot of us are in, in american politics, whether it's those of us that care about these institutions or otherwise, how do you preach unity and at the same time you don't want to be near president trump, and i get that. how do you do both? >> i'm figuring that out by the day. i think you inspire people. >> what do you tell a trump supporter who loves watching you and is like, i wish she'd go to the white house? >> i think i would, you know, try to share our message. do you believe all people are created equal? do you believe equal pay should be mandated? do you believe everyone should have health care? do you believe we should treat everyone with respect? i think those are the basics of what we're talking about. and i understand people feel upset or uncomfortable. there's, i think, some feelings of disrespect about the anthem

protest or things i've said in the past. but ultimately, i think i am here open and honest. i've admitted mistakes. i will continue to do that. i will continue to be vulnerable and be honest and be open and want to have that conversation because i think trump's message excludes people that look like me and are me, of course, but it excludes a lot of people in his base as well. i think that he's trying to divide so he can conquer, not unite so we can all conquer. >> anything he could do to change your mind about a visit to the white house? >> there's like 50 policy issues that we can probably reverse and get going. i mean, it would take a tremendous amount. i think i understand that progress is sometimes slow, and i'll never close any door all the way, but i think it would take more than trump is willing to do. >> what are you going to do next? you want to keep playing? give us one more world cup? would you at all entertain professionalizing your social activism, perhaps running for office or something else?

>> i do continue to keep playing. i'm not sure i'm qualified for office. >> there's no qualifications for office these days. >> well, yeah, that's true. up to 44, i guess there was. you know, i'm going to fight for equal pay every day for myself, for my team, and for every single person out there, man, woman, immigrant, u.s. citizen, person of color, whatever it may be. equal pay, as the great serena williams said, until i'm in my grave. >> were you about 11 or 12 when brandi chastain, and that moment of, guess what, girls can go crazy and celebrate too. >> yeah. >> what do you hope the 12-year-old girl, a bunch of them are in the audience today, thinks about 20 years from now in remembering you and what you gave to the sport? >> i hope the same thing i felt. i think in that moment, it was just an incredible explosion of joy. it was so unbridled, so off the cuff.

it was just everything that you want from sports. you want just those moments that are totally indescribable. i hope they feel inspired that they can do that, that they can take on more, that they're worth every penny and more, and that they have fun and with a smile doing it. >> well, you have fun. you always have a smile on your face. >> that is true. >> it's been great meeting you. you have a lot of humility. i have to say that. megan rapinoe, good luck to you. we're rooting for you. get us another world cup too. >> yeah, another one. five is better than four. >> always. that's right, there's five fingers. >> exactly. when we come back, as robert mueller gets ready to testify, what do americans think about impeachment now? that's next. always. that's right, there's five that's right, there's five ♪ applebee's all you can eat is back. now that's eatin' good in the neighborhood.

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we are back. data download time. until billionaire tom steyer jumped into the race this week, none of the candidates have wanted to make impeaching president trump the focus of their campaign. there may be a reason for that. our latest poll finds just 21% of registered voters say there's enough evidence for congress to begin impeachment proceedings now. that's actually a six-point drop since last month when we polled all adults, by the way, not just registered voters. and it doesn't take much imagination to guess which voters are driving the pro-impeachment sentiment. 39% of democrats say there is enough evidence to begin impeaching president trump compared to 21% of independents. then, of course, republicans want nothing to do with it.

85% say they want impeachment dropped altogether. like everything this year, this has to be looked at through the lens of the 2020 presidential race. especially among those democrats. that's where you see an increasingly predictable divide along the ideological spectrum. only 37% of joe biden's supporters who are more likely to consider themselves moderates are interested in starting impeachment hearings now. compare that with the more progressive candidates. sanders, warren, harris. support for impeachment among their voters is in the mid to upper 40s. of course, whether the candidates stand won't matter if these candidates oust him from office at the ballot box. politically speaking, impeachment is not likely to go away, at least as a wedge issue. robert mueller will testify about his russia investigation before the end of the month. and president trump is likely to run against the idea of impeachment no matter what speaker nancy pelosi decides to do about it in congress. when we come back, the democratic divide. small change versus big change. the pragmatists versus the purists.

end game is next. the more, the merrier. got to have this stuff in the morning. oh, that's too hot. act your age. get your own insurance company. carlo, why don't you start us with a little bit of cereal? you can spread it all around the table. and we're gonna split the warm hot dog. and i'll have a glass of grape juice to spill on the carpet. oh, uh, do you want some to spill? act your age. get your own insurance company.

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back now with "end game." a lot of intraparty politics and divides, it seems, this week. let's start with pelosi v. aoc. maureen dowd started this last week. and then just comes -- brings the house down on aoc, claire mccaskill.

in the age of trump, there's no more stupid proposition than that nancy pelosi is the problem. if aoc and her pygmalions and acolytes decide that burning down the house is more important than deposing trump, they'll be left with a racist, backward president and the emotional satisfaction of their own purity.

although i feel like the freedom caucus had more followers than aoc does. >> for now. nancy pelosi sees this coming. she saw john boehner suffer. she saw paul ryan suffer with a difficult element in their caucus and she's doing everything possible to prevent it. she knows it's a threat to her majority makers. she knows it can make her caulkous ungovernable and that's not good for any leader. that's why we see her coming out very aggressively where boehner and especially ryan were more laid back. >> tim, what advice do you think ryan would be giving pelosi now? he seems to have a lot of

opinions. i mean, he basically is admitting he failed. >> yeah, the parallels are uncanny between that tea party and this sort of progressive wave in '18. it is worth noting carlos' point, the progressives were not the majority in 2018. and it allowed them to consolidate power in the statehouse to are you draw the lines so that allowed a broader portion of the republican base to move to the right in seeking elected office. aoc has to realize if it weren't for these 40 democrats picking up these suburban held traditionally republican seats that they don't have the majority now. and that's obviously the message pelosi is trying to push but she will have a hard time keeping a lid on this. >> this directly plays into the primary with warren and biden. >> yes.

you're seeing it in the house of representatives with the central party fretting. your point, sen may -- and republicans may not want to talk about the intraparty back and forth. guess who does want to talk about it, donald trump. president trump loves this. it plays directly into what he's tweeting this morning. your book, your excerpts got under his skin, i'm told, based on my reporting. the president was tweeting about kevin mccarthy, for example, and how much more he likes him. the president will focus on this issue with alexandria ocasi ocasio-cortez, with speaker pelosi because he thinks it wins him points. he hates this talk about republicans not supporting him, the never trump movement. now he has an opportunity to say, look, democrats have their own problems too. >> claire, check this out. the democratic presidential pray mire is a tale of two my prayers. among moderates and conservatives, which make up 45% of the electorate, joe biden is up 20 points. take a look here. kamala harris in second under the moderate/conservative

category. the other three in single digits. among liberals, 53% of the party call themselves liberals, and look at this. warren by double digits. add up bernie sanders, if she eventually grabs more of the sanders' support or vice versa. you can see where this is going. we're going to have a clash at some point here between the leading moderate and the leading liberal. what does this mean for the party? >> i think a lot of it is how they communicate with members of the democratic party. you know, wide, sweeping structural change, how do you do that under our constitution if you only have 49 votes in the senate? how do you do that? you can't do that by executive order. so there is a disconnect between what is possible and what is pragmatic. and i think that whoever wins our nomination needs to stay focused on those voters that are going to decide this election. and they're not in the bronx.

>> is elizabeth warren starting to at least -- do you think she has the ability to bridge this divide? sanders it feels like has less of a chance. does warren? >> well, i don't know. warren keeps talking about this massive structural change, and i keep thinking, how does she do this? right? and i think voters will eventually begin thinking about that. i do think that any of the top five have the ability to begin to focus more on some of those voters that make up almost half of the democratic primary that are so into joe biden right now because they see him as steady as she goes, someone who will bring normalcy back to the oval office. that's a really important thing he has going for him, right? >> and somewhat counterintuitive, but in a way, biden is the change candidate. the party that's challenging the incumbent president has to make a compelling case for change. joe biden is probably the candidate on the left that is most different than donald trump. joe biden is vanilla, and vanilla would be a change to the presidency today. >> it's interesting. there's this argument that, okay, he won with disruption. democrats need to be more

disruptive. >> that's not change. >> but does the country -- you know, is warren seen as more disruption in a weird way? do you buy that? >> kind of. listen, i think that if elizabeth warren ends up being the democratic party nominee, there's going to be some, frankly, celebrations at least from what i'm told inside the trump campaign who believes that she is somebody they could beat easily. there's not that sense with joe biden. and that's evidenced by the president going after him so directly and so frequently. there are others in this race who could be problematic for president trump, like senator kamala harris, who got a second look by this trump campaign. we'll see what happens. >> harris is the one candidate who's in third among liberals, third among -- you know, is she the one that's got the porridge that everybody is comfortable with? >> as you look through the polling, talk to the campaigns and study the strategies of their races, harris would seem to be the one person, if she can put it together who could build that coalition, whereas you

struggle to see it with some of the others. >> claire, megan rapinoe. what do you think? >> i think she's fantastic. i was struck how humble she is. >> so was i. >> you know what's really refreshing? listen, acosta the last couple weeks, i've admitted on these cameras a number of times, i'd love to have that vote back. i regret that vote. it was a mistake. i love that she admits her mistakes. she hasn't done it all right. everything she said hasn't been perfect. but you get her heart and her heart is in the right place, and she will do more to move the needle on equal pay than all of the democratic women in congress. >> if nike hasn't filled the gap by now, i don't know -- they're not the nike i thought they were. >> that was a wonderful interview. i enjoyed it. i think she should go to the white house. i think she should show the country that we can talk to each other, that we can meet, and that we can disagree. but refusing to talk to each other, refusing to meet, that's going to -- >> guess what, we can always talk here. and we are happy to host her here. so there. that's all we have for today. tim, congratulations on the

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