estimated 3,000 people died. many puerto ricans blame the governor for not responding to the crisis effectively. now it's unclear where this goes. we could see more protests over the coming days. again, the governor saying he will not resign. >> we know you'll stay on it. thank you for joining me this hour. "andrea mitchell reports" starts right now. and right now on a special edition of "andrea mitchell reports," live from the aspen security forum. hate speech, the president escalating his attacks against congressman ihlan omar. stoking his supporters' anger at a campaign rally. >> omar has a history of launching vicious anti-semitic screeds. inside view.

new documents from the raid of michael cohen's office showing who else was involved in the stormy daniels cover up. >> there are a lot of questions about this investigation that, you know, we've never gotten the answers to, including why destiny decided to close the investigation on its own. and blocked. jon stewart eviscerates two republican senators who prevented passage of the 9/11 relief funds for now until they say it's fully paid for up front. unlike their trillion dollars in tax cuts. >> you know, there's some things they have no trouble putting on the credit card. but somehow when it comes to the 9/11 first responder community, the cops, the firefighters, the construction workers, the volunteers, the survivors all of a sudden, man, we've got to go through this. and good day, everyone, i'm

andrea mitchell at the aspen ideas -- excuse me, the asman security forum here in colorado. president trump is appealing to anti-immigrant bias in his campaign rants against four minority congresswomen, spotlighting the one member who was born outside the u.s. ihlan omar. she fled war torn somalia in the 1990s. the president armed with a string of attack lines went off on a five minute diatribe against omar, prompting this stunning chant from a north carolina republican crowd. >> she looks down with contempt on the hard working americans saying that ignorance is pervasive in many parts of this country. and obviously and importantly,

omar has a history of launching vicious anti-semitic screeds. >> joining me now msnbc political analyst peter baker, chief white house correspondent from the "new york times." and jane harmmon. nbc white house correspondent jeff bennett in washington. welcome all. thanks so much. peter baker, you and i have seen a lot over the years. but i have never seen a president of the united states arousing a crowd with rants of send her back. >> yeah, no, that's a different level than we've seen before. obviously in the 2016 campaign, we saw a lot of lock her up chants about hillary clinton. that was a new type of

campaigning we hadn't seen before. this takes it to a different level. it suggest physical you're an american citizen but don't agree with the president's policies you should leave the country. divided not -- democrats are very upset about this, but even republicans are uncomfortable about it. the head of the house republican campaign committee said that that kind of language has no place in american politics. he disavowed it. but he didn't disavow the president. he said the president doesn't have a racist bone in his body. he's making a distinction between what the crowd was saying last night and the president's actions. >> jeff bennett, tell me of a strategy as you cover the white house. what is the playbook he's following? it started last week and built over the weekend and it's now something that is so contradictory to american values to american politics and it's nativism and it's being endorsed by white supremacists.

>> and here's the thing, andrea. in these four women the president is finding the physical representation of everything that his anti-immigrant, you could say anti-multiethnic america that his make america great again pitch has been since. what we're seeing now is his allies trying to refine and rationalize what it is, those tweets he sent over the weekend. those racists tweets say it's about ihlan omar and what they view as her being a socialist and anti-zaisrael. that was never the case if you go back to what the president tweeted. now you have democrats on the hill who say this is an emergency for ihlan omar, that her physical safety is now at risk. it was just in the last ten years we've seen members of congress of both parties targeted and shot and gravely injured. ihlan omar was seen on the floor

of the house today. she is trying to put the focus back on politics. in my conversations with democrats and republicans and people close to the president, this will likely continue and will likely get worse. as democrats have not settled on a nominee, the president who always feels that he's at his best when he's on the attack has focused on these four women. he's focused on issues of race and ethnicity. >> we should point out that there was another republican, mark walker, republican congressman from north carolina, who was apparently disturbed by it. he said it was brief, the chants. i struggled with the send her back chant tonight, referencing representative omar. her history words and actions reveal her great disdain for america and israel, not phrasing that's painful to our friends in the minority communities. when you were in congress we had a lot of divisions. i don't think you saw anything like this. >> never. i left congress 8 1/2 years ago

to head the wilson center, which you pointed out is a place where scholarship and policy are discussed free from the political spin. at least that's what we try to do. i don't recognize there. there were divisions. there was increasing partisanship. that's a reason i left in my ninth term to do this job. but i never saw this. let me say a couple other things. it's fine for people to oppose other people. it is fine for heated rhetoric to occur. it's not fine for hate speech to occur on either side. it worries me, too, that this group of four new members of congress have said things, at least reported things like the blue dogs are segregationests. i was a blue dog, i'm no segregationist. >> ihlan omar is leaving the capital. there were hearings today. a cameraman fell down, she was

helping him up. you can see she's now become the center of huge attention. but the concern is that she's also potentially the center of threats. that this has become very dangerous. let's listen to what she has to say. >> who clearly hates someone like me should go back. the message that he sends is not -- to every single person who shares an identity with me. he's tell moing them that this not their country. and what we tell them is that this is. they are welcome here. because what i said on me election night was in minnesota we don't just welcome refugees, we send them to washington. >> we can see what has happened

here. the attention being focused on her, she's a somali american, a refugee who came here at the age of eight or nine from a refugee camp. and a lot of her speech may have been inflammatory, you can go back over it and we can interpret that. but the basic values of america are really threatened by what is happening from the oval office and from the campaign podium of the president of the united states. >> and the president has really settled on this idea that he wants to focus his campaign and his political might on vilifying these women. yesterday at the rally it was also striking that the crowd included children. that was something that takes us past politics. >> let me just interrupt for just a moment. we believe that the congresswomen is speaking again. >> if there was a somali person wearing a maga hat they would

not be deported. because i criticized the president, i should be deported. i want to remind people that this is what this president and his supporters have turned our country that is supposed to be a country where we allow democratic debates and dissent to take place. this is not about me. this is about us fighting for what this country should be and what it deserves to be. >> what you were saying, picking up exactly on that and the sentiments she was just expressing. >> the congresswoman is saying in america where it should be allowed to disagree, be allowed to debate policies, we should be allowed to do that while calling ourselves american. the president is saying to his supporters and to people around this country that if you disagree with him you should not be living in this country. over the last couple days i've been talking to people at the

white house who have been trying to pivot away from the president's initial tweets when he said these four congresswomen should go back to the countries from which they came. the white house was saying -- the crowd yesterday chanting send her back was very clear that they heard him the first time and he can't escape his initial comments. >> peter, what is the fallout of all of this politically? >> well, it's interesting. for one thing, it actually has -- the president has intervened in a democratic debate that was already happening. these four young congresswomen were already a controversial part of the democratic caucus and they were fighting with nancy pelosi. instead of talking about that division within the democrats, we're talking about the president's behavior, his attack lines and the way he's handling this. that's how he wants it. he wants us to be talking about him. he likes that more than anything. and second of all, he wants to frame the debate, clearly, on us versus them line. we head into 2020, you're either with him on this ideal of a

largely homogenous america that he remembers from the old days versus the new america that clearly has, you know, created resentments among a lot of his supporters. >> and, jane, mariemerriam webs listed the top searches. let's listen. >> he talked about the love of his country. no, he classified inside his tweet, if you want to read the clarification of his tweet. he talked about the love of this country and said if you don't love this country, you can leave. that's a fundamental difference. that's what the president is talking about. this is an issue about idealogy. this is an issue that when you talk about one of these individuals who introduced a bill, introduced a bill in support of boycott, divestiture and sanctions against israel. in this bill that she

introduced, it even talks about the boycott when it came to nazis in germany. this is the differences that we have. this is what this debate and fight is about. >> you really think these lawmakers don't love their country? >> i didn't say they didn't love their country. the president did not name the individual. he said if you do not like this country, you can leave. what the president talked about building on this economy, making it stronger. there's a clear difference in this. you watch -- i didn't get to see the rally. if you're going to claim the president having a battle over a socialist issue and socialist democrats, that's one that he's taken up even in the state of the union. he promised that this country will never have socialism here. that's why he's fighting so hard. and i think it's really wrong you would challenge this president when you look at the first lady is foreign born as well. the question is out of base. >> last night as we hearing the chants, the president stood

there. >> the president moved on with his speech. >> if there's no -- >> the president -- >> does the president have a responsibility to cut this out? >> for those who are at the event -- i was not. i did talk to someone who was there. he said it was a small group off the to the side. the president did not join in, he moved on. he moved on about a speech about a country and the things that are building and right. that's what the president did. has it become so far that you want to dislike the president so much you're going to accuse him of trying to do something he did not do? from the places that he moved on in the speech, he never joined in in it. and you want to try to hold him accountable for something in a -- are you going to hold him accountable, too, for any protesters or someone else? that's an unfair position. >> he has no responsibility to turn to his supporters -- >> what he did in his responsibility was right. he moved on to make them stop in the process. that's exactly what the president did and the president talked about the greatness of this country. yes. sure. [ inaudible question ]

>> i spoke with him again today, too. [ inaudible question ] >> kevin mccarthy there defending the president. he says he didn't watch it. a lot of us watch it. he did call out the congresswomen by name specifically. we were talking about the most searched words last night. and they were in order, racism, socialism, fascism, concentration camp, xenophobia and bigot. first of all, none of these members of congress are socialists, but that is the way the republican leadership wants to frame this election. they don't have a democrat to run against. they're not running against bernie sanders per se yet. and there's not a single member

of these congress -- congressional representatives who are avowed socialists. we don't know where that's coming from other than opposition research. whatever her views may have been or are about israel, that doesn't define her. and has nothing to do with the attacks against her. >> well, i totally agree. i'm the daughter of a refugee from nazi germany. i disagree with her position on the bds movement. she has every right to express her position. if it's the dominant position it will win, i doubt it is and i don't think it will. not the less, demonizing people is not the way we have ever behaved in congress. and the president did use her name. and he knows what the crowd was going to do and these slogans are harmful. i want to endorse something peter said. because the democrats are in some disarray. this stuff is sticking. it will be very important for speaker pelosi and i think she can do this, to unite the caucus so it represents the broadest

cross section of people so he can't anymore just frame this in terms of four people. there are 200 plus people in the democratic caucus. most of whom are trying their hardest to add value to our politics. >> well, peter, as we leave this conversation, it just becomes very clear that he is trying to brand the democrats, all of them, without having an opponent yet. the way he did hillary clinton. >> right. there's a dncifference between arguing policy and go back. he said two days ago go back. it's not unreasonable that the crowd would take go back to mean send her back. they're not arguing about policy, they're arguing about people and this -- a very inflammatory idea that if you don't love your country you should leave it. you want to argue, it makes perfect sense. is the green deal socialist, those are reasonable debates in this country. ones we've had in the past and will have going forward.

it's different what he's doing. >> john mccain in 2008 in the campaign responding to that woman in the crowd about birthribirt birtherism correcting the woman rather than the president of the united states not correcting the crowd last night. thanks to all. coming up, the cohen files. hundreds of unredacted documents tied to hush payments made by donald trump's ex-lawyer released moments ago. the details coming up next. stay with us on andrea mitchell live from aspen, colorado, only on msnbc. ado, only on msnbc some reach a level of top safety pick. but only a select few of the very safest vehicles are awarded a top safety pick plus. the highest level of safety possible. how many 2019 top safety pick plus-winning vehicles does your brand have? one. two. how about eight? subaru has more 2019 top safety pick plus awards

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and welcome back. we're getting new details breaking news now about the fbi's investigation into the hush money scheme that took down president trump's former lawyer and fixer, michael cohen. newly released search warrants showing how involved the president may well have been in trying to keep his alleged affair with stormy daniels secrets. joining me now, an all-star lineup. jeremy bash, frank fragluci, and nbc news correspondent tom winter. welcome all. tom, you've had time to go through the fbi documents. the released documents from michael cohen case.

what have we learned? >> we had 20 pages that were unredacted. as far as, you know, whether or not there was a scheme to pay stormy daniels, whether or not michael cohen was involved in it. we know that. we're not getting a lot of new details about the narrative. what is new is the president's involvement. specifically five phone calls that occurred over several weeks, including a series of phone calls that began shortly after the access hollywood tape came out. the fbi says that based upon their understanding, their analysis of the phone calls and e-mails they have from michael cohen that there was an effort after that tape came out to try to clamp down on any further claims of women who had ex -- >> let me interrupt you. we're talking about the access hollywood tapes coming out at a critical moment right before the third debate in 2016. >> exactly. in october of 2016. so the first phone call was made on october 8th. i want to be clear. there's been allegations over the past couple years that somehow the president's phones

were tapped or there was surveillance of the president. these phone records all come from authorized court ordered search warrants of michael cohen's phone records. there's no wire tap device here. i want to say that up front. apparently on the night of october 8th there's a phone call between trump, cohen and hope hicks who was interviewed by the fbi. we learned that today as part of these documents be unredacted. 8:03, there's an eight minute phone call, this is with david pecker, the publisher of the national inquirer. the fbi notes leading up to this, trump and cohen had spoken ininfrastructu infrequently, twice in september, once in july, once in june, respectalfully. they speak on the 26th of october and that's when michael cohen finishes setting up his bank account of his shell

company. that's the morning he funds into escrow the $130,000 payment for stormy daniels' attorney which was going to be passed today stormy daniels. the two have another phone call on the 28th of october. tha that's when michael cohen confirms it was a done deal. everything's been over. these are five eight minute phone calls. it's that detailed, the president's involvement in these phone calls that we're learning today. >> as well as hope hicks. as a former fbi guy, i mean, you look at this and you see hope hicks in the oval office in charge of so much. the closest advisor to the president throughout. and refusing to testify to the -- >> exactly. i look at this and i see co-conspirators conspiring to break the law. i see in hope hicks someone who may have criminal exposure now because we don't know exactly the full nature and scope of her testimony previously. and now we point right at the president and say you're

involved in multiple calls right on point. you're part of the criminal conspiracy. >> if i'm not wrong, the final debate was october 9th. all of this was happening on the eve of that final debate. >> what i think is significant, andrea, is that on october 7th when the access hollywood tape came out, it was all hands on deck for the trump team. one of the hands on deck was the russian federation. because the day the access hollywood tape came out was the very same day the russian federation dumped the john podesta e-mails through we c wikileaks. this coming together on the same day as the access hollywood tape, the release by the director of national intelligence and department of homeland security saying it was the russian federation and then the russian federation going to the defense of donald trump. now we learn the next day trump on the phone with his team saying pay off stormy daniels. it's part of one effort to protect donald trump and insure that he'd get elected. >> and, tom, this all sets up

more questions now for robert mueller next week. >> it does. because this was an investigation that was done in tandem with the special counsel's office. matter of fact, some of the initial inquiries into michael cohen had nothing to do with these alleged schemes that had -- i shouldn't say alleged, because people pleaded guilty to it. but were investigations that were started by the special counsel's office. so i think those could raise more questions for the special counsel's testimony next week. in addition, i think what it does say is that this investigation -- we know this because the southern district to said this. you'd have to wonder if the president was in any other office or any other position other than the president, would he also be looking at charges or would he already have been charged? i think that's a valid question. i'm surprised congress' lack of interest, it appears to me being a crime reporter observing from afar, into this particular case. >> i want to switch gears for a

moment. i want to ask you your expertise. the fbi agent's association, you know this group very well. calling on the senate to act now on the 9/11 victims compensation. rand paul and mike lee, two senators stopping a unanimous consent vote more than 70 senators were in support of this. and now they have not voted on it. it's another delay. i'm not saying it's not going to be approved, but the recess is pending. you never know what's going to happen. and the fact is, it's another delay in -- 15 years of delays now for these people. we've seen already how, you know, lou alvarez has died and has not lived long enough to see the compensation. >> we're living in a time where the normal isn't there anymore. it's elusive. what should be a no brainer has become a great dilemma -- >> the fbi was headquartered in one of the towers.

>> well, so understand the fbi association's doesn't come out a lot and lobby for things. what it's saying is to congress, we lost lives. the bureau lost lives in 9/11. they continue to lose lives through the illnesses that are attributed to that crime scene at 9/11. and yet we have congress saying to law enforcement federal law enforcement in particular, in this case, you know what? we don't know how valuable you are to our society. >> we have to leave it there. jon stewart said it better than we could. we played that already. jeremy, tom, and of course frank, thank you all so very much. and coming up next. locked up. accused sex trafficker jeffrey epstein has now been denied bail today. a live report from federal court in new york next. stay with us right here on "andrea mitchell reports." we're live in aspen at the security forum. ve in aspen at te security forum ♪ limu emu & doug

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and welcome back. jeffrey epstein is going to remain behind bars as he awaits trial on new federal sex crime charges. epstein was denied bail today after prosecutors argued that the well-connected

multimillionaire was a risk to the public and a flight risk. joining me now is nbc's stephanie gosk at the courthouse in new york and barbara mckwoqu, former u.s. attorney here with me in aspen. stephanie, tell me what happened in court today. >> reporter: this was a quick hearing. this judge wasted no time. he said jeffrey epstein will not get bail. and if he's convicted on these two charges, sex trafficking and conspiracy to traffic minors for the purpose of sex he could be sentenced to up to 45 years. he's 66 years old. that could mean the rest of his life. the judge said there was clear and convincing evidence that jeffrey epstein is still a risk to the public. he then went on to say there's a preponderance of the evidence that he's a flight risk. his wealth is north of $500 million as far as they know. they talked about what the fbi agents found in his safe in jeffrey epstein's mansion,

includi including, quote, piles of cash, loose diamonds, an expired foreign passport from the 80s that had jeffrey epstein's photo, but not his name. his defense team had said that was used when he was traveling to the middle east as a jewish man he was worried for his safety. prosecutors say he had the ability and the money to run if he needed to. andrea? >> and barbara, you've dealt with a lot of cases like this. the president of the united states saying he was never a fan of his and they haven't talked in 15 years. then this tape emerges from the energy aerchives showing the raucous parties with the cheer leaders from buffalo and miami. it's pretty visual exposition of the kind of life he was leading. >> certainly nothing on that tape alone suggests criminal behavior, but one of the first things that a lawyer for jeffrey

epstein will want to discuss with him, because he's facing so much time, is is there any information you can share with the authorities that they might be interested in for prosecuting others. you know, child exploitation is something prosecutors take seriously. if he has information about other people, he's going to want to tell them about it. it could lead to the prosecution of other people. >> other people, you know, we don't know who could be involved. he was very well-connected. there were famous people, bill clinton took trips with him. donald trump partied with him. prince andrew was a frequent guest. one of the frequent people involved according to some of these alleged victims was his former girlfriend whose father was robert maxwell, a famed british publisher who, you know, died under terrible

circumstances. she was apparently running the house. what do we know about her? >> reporter: we don't know anything about her. her name has not appeared in any of the documents. we don't actually even know the alleged victims in this case. if i could jump in for a moment on this idea of jeffrey epstein cooperating with federal prosecutors. i would add you have to remember this comes in the context after a lot of criticism about the deal that was done with jeffrey epstein in florida over a decade ago. a lot of people have called it a sweetheart deal. he served 13 months in a state jail and was released. he pled guilty to a much less serious charge. a lot of people saying there was enough evidence to charge him with the charges he now faces. the u.s. attorney at the time, alex acosta, who is the former labor secretary for donald trump, had said they did not feel confident they had the evidence at the time. all of this to say that i can't imagine there's going to be a lot of excitement for cutting a

deal with jeffrey epstein right now. >> stephanie gosk, barbara mcquaid, thank you so very much. coming up next, a big announcement from congressman seth moulton. stay with us, we'll be right back. moulton ay with us, we'll be right back en us, you know what's better than mopping? anything! at the end of a long day, it's the last thing i want to do. well i switched to swiffer wet jet and its awesome. it's an all-in-one so it's ready to go when i am. the cleaning solution actually breaks down dirt and grime. and the pad absorbs it deep inside. so, it prevents streaks and haze better than my old mop. plus, it's safe to use on all my floors, even wood. glad i got that off my chest and the day off my floor. try wet jet with a moneyback guarantee

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presidential candidate seth moulton, a democratic congressman did not qualify for the next 2020 debate, but today he is getting a high profile endorsement from retired four star general stanley mcchrystal. general mcchrystal spent decades in the military and was appointed as chief of staff to the joint task force operating in afghanistan after september 11th. and i'm joined now by seth moulton and general stanley mcchrystal, former commander of international security forces. thank you both. first of all, you not qualifying for the debates on the 30th and 31st is a problem. general mcchrystal, let me ask you first why you're endorsing congressman moulton today. >> i am. i'm proud and happy to do it. you know, i got home early this morning from a trip, andrea, and watched television and saw a chant send her back. and it reinforced for me the

reality that leadership in our country is first and foremost about character. second i think about competence, not just personal competence but the ability to shape and lead an honest good team. and lastly about specific policies or politics. and so i'm endorsing sethmou moulton, i've known him for years. i think he'd be the best president for our nation for where we are now and where i think we need to go. >> congressman, how impeded are you in this campaign by your inability to get a national forum in these debates? >> i don't think the summer debates are going to decide the election. voters don't go to the polls until february of next year. our response on the ground has been fantastic. those are the voters who are ultimately going to make this decision. and we're doing well. we're inching up in the polls. we polled ahead of a couple of senators just in the poll a couple days ago. we out theraised five of the

candidates that were on the debate stage. the message is resonating on the ground. america is ready for a new generation of leadership. we need to put someone forward who is strong enough to go toe to toe with donald trump. i got to tell you, this endorsement means an awful lot. it means a lot to me personally and it means a lot to the campaign. i'm reminded of a veteran that i met on my first campaign back in 2014. a world war ii sailor from the pacific. and he said seth, if you win this race, promise me you'll go to washington as an american. not as a democrat or as a republican, but as an american. general mcchrystal is a great american. one of the greatest americans i've ever known. someone who has put his life on the line for decades to keep us safe, to keep our values strong. that's what this race is ultimately about. who we are as a country and who is going to lead us forward. >> general mcchrystal, i want to ask you about your endorsement

today. because you're not endorsing a former vice president, former chairman of the foreign relations committee, someone who clearly know well is campaigning in part of his experience in foreign policy. why not joe biden? >> i'm endorsing my friend because i've known him for years. i know he's been a combat leader. i've been able to watch him up close in his values. i think he's the right person for the future. and we've really got to think about what's right for the decades in front of us. there's going to be emerging requirements. we need to be set up with a forward focus. >> and why -- i think i know the answer, but why do you think that the chants of send her back against an elected representative who is a refugee from somalia, why is that so damaging to us as americans? >> well, i think who we are as americans is important, not just

for how we think and treat each other, but how we're looked at in the world. and so our -- with the respect we get, the credibility we have, is ultimately based on our values. when we very openly denigrate, not just an individual, but theoretically an entire race or anybody who is not us. that's watched closely around the world. my time around the world, what you learn is people watch america with the scrutiny we don't spend on the rest of the world. everything we do matters. so how we treat people if we do it well, we benefit. if we do it poorly, we pay a stiff price. go back to the bottom line. it's just wrong. >> i want to play some sound the president addressing troops at a u.s. base in south korea after his recent trip to the dmz and ask you about it on the other side. >> our equipment, whether it's the missiles, or the planes, or the ships or the equipment for the soldiers. it doesn't matter.

we have the best. and we have the budget to do it. that wasn't easy because i'll tell you this is not a political speech, but the democrats were not going to give it to you. that i can tell you. they weren't going to give it to you, folks. they weren't. they want open borders and the hell with the military, that's not good. >> is it appropriate for the president of the united states as he frequently does to slam democrats in a political way on a military base in front of u.s. troops? >> no. one of the things that's important to remember is inside the military, the ethos is to be apolitical. i never knew what the political leanings were of other officers or non-commissioned officers. we didn't talk about that. you particularly don't put your subordinates in the uncomfortable position of proselytizing them with your politics or your religion or any

other personal thing like that. because it's not fair to them. so i think it's important for all leaders, whether they're in office or they're in a position of influence to show that kind of respect for the people who work for you. >> general stanley mcchrystal, as always it's a privilege to see you. thank you very much. and seth moulton, good look out there on the campaign trail. very good of you to come with us today. thank you. >> thanks very much, andrea. >> thanks, andrea. coming up, under pressure. we're going to see thousands of people in puerto rico, protesters as the u.s. calls for puerto rico's governor to resign. you're watching "andrea mitchell reports" live from aspen, colorado. only on msnbc. only on msnbc. this is the couple who wanted to get away

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so your growing life can be more rewarding, too. ♪ what would you like the power to do? ♪ a sixth day of protests now expected in san juan, puerto rico tonight. demonstrators are demanding the resignation of the governor over disturbing leaked e-mails and other accusations against him. the governor has said the chats were private remarks made as a way to blow off steam and has not signaled he is going to resign even as top officials are giving him a deadline to prove he can stay in office.

the president is trying to exploit it all on twitter. iran's revolutionary guard, reportedly responsible for seizing a foreign tanker in the strait of hormuz. according to iran state tv, tensions are continuing to escalate. the iranians claim smugglers were caught transporting gasoline from small boats to a large ship outside territorial waters. msnbc's global affairs contributor wendy sherman who of course served as under secretary of state for political affairs during the obama administration and is the author of "not for the faint of heart" lessons in courage, power, and persistance, joins me now. a terrific book. >> thank you. >> of course you were chief negotiator of the iran nuclear deal so you know very well what is going on there. i think the real concern is, i don't think either side wants war. from my understanding of the iranians or the americans, the u.s. president said that. he said it to the amir very clearly the last couple of weeks but that said there can be an

accidental war and this is a very, very tenuous situation in the strait of hormuz. >> i think it is very ten use. i know a few days ago we were all concerned we were right on the edge of war and then people relaxed. i don't think anyone should relax. i think the tanker discussion you just put on the table about what is happening in the strait of hormuz is of concern, the fact the administration is sending 500 troops to saudi arabia to deal with iranian tensions? the last time we had troops in saudi arabia we had huge anti-american demonstrations. some would say that led to osama bin laden down the road. i'm not sure that isn't really increasing the drum beat toward war. we know, andrea, that inside the administration there is a huge battle going on. i believe john boulton or his allies leaked that just to scuttle diplomacy. i think a senator can do whatever a senator wants to do. >> rand paul famously against foreign entanglements could be a very interesting envoy to the

foreign minister. the problem with iran is it is not monolithic. if the president ever were to reach a deal with kim jong un if you could trust kim jong un you know he reflects whatever is going to happen. you've dealt with the north koreans as well. but iran has the revolutionary guard, they're oof on their own tangent and they are the military force that are patrolling these waters. >> indeed. people don't think when there is a supreme leader there are politics in the country but iran has a lot of politics as you point out and the supreme leader tries to balance the diplomats with those folks who are the militia and the islamic revolutionary guard corps and they are the ones if this tanker was seized to seize the tanker. they are the ones in syria, the ones that finance hezbollah and want to sow the seed. we have a battle inside of iran, a battle inside of the united states government, and no one should drop their guard. we may be heading to war. i am very glad that in the house

they overwhelmingly passed a resolution saying in fact the president doesn't have the authority to go to war. even the acting secretary of defense at his confirmation hearing said that the 2000-2001 umf does not provide the basis but did point out the article 2 responsibility a president has. so the president can go to war, nonetheless. >> wendy sherman, a lot of things to be concerned about today. thanks for being here. more ahead. we'll be right back from aspen. stay with us. so why am i still thinking about this? i'll take aleve. aleve. proven better on pain. what do all these people have in common, limu?oug [ paper rustling ] exactly, nothing. they're completely different people, that's why they need customized car insurance from liberty mutual. they'll only pay for what they need!

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thanks for being with us and picking it up in new york for velshi and ruhle. >> guess what my friend? i am right next to you. andrea mitchell. hello everyone. i am stephanie ruhle coming to you live from aspen, colorado for the tenth annual aspen security forum, a place where the most critical questions about the safety of our nation are answered by top level government leaders and experts. my panel just wrapped a few minutes ago and i am back with you for another hour of news. trust me, we got a lot to get to. coming up in the next 60 minutes, big news just released court documents in the michael cohen case. the fbi believed that then candidate donald trump was closely involved in a scheme to hide hush money payments to adult film star stormy daniels. here's the question. what does that mean now for a possible case against president trump on campaign finance violations? also today, locked