much more long term. >> thanks, mike. >> thank you very much. we'll be reading axios in just a minute. you can sign up for the newsletter. >> that does it for us on this thursday morning. i'm yasmin alongside ahmed. "morning joe" starts right now. >>. welcome to "morning joe." good morning, i'm willie geist, it is thursday, august the 15th. we have washington anchor caddie kaye, white house reporter for "the associated press" jonathan meer, and contributor to time magazine and former aide to the george w. bush and state department elise jordan. and roger's professor of the vanderbilt university jon meacham. he's also an maple contributor and a roadietor tim mcgraw. we'll get into that later.

there's a lot to cover including the bruising day on wall street. now there's growing concerns over a potential recession. plus china with two big stories. they are still consuming hong kong and the trade war with washington. and congressman steve king managing to offend just about everything with his comments on abortion, rape, and incest. we'll get the latest reaction from capitol hill with some republicans calling for him to resign. but, we begin with a developing story out of philadelphia. an armed suspect accused of opening fire and wounding six officers during an eight-hour standoff has surrendered early this morning. shortly after midnight a police spokesman tweeted that a suspect was in custody and that s.w.a.t. officers were clearing the house where the standoff took place. police on the scene said the suspect surrendered without incident and was taken to a hospital for treatment because teargas was used. the gunfire began wednesday afternoon as police were serving a narcotics warrant. let's bring in nbc news

correspondent ron allen. ron, good morning. what is the latest on the condition of those officers? we're all thankful and grateful this morning and stunned in some ways that they're all out of the hospital. >> reporter: well, stunned they're in the hospital, stunned by the entire incident, willie. yes, they're out of the hospital. they were not life tlit evening injuries that they sustained. one officer was grazed in the head. but it's the first time in a long time in recent memory that anyone can recall six officers being shot. and the response here was just incredible. an army of police officers at about 4:30 in the afternoon arriving to this call. you can hear the radio traffic, it was frantic and one officer said for example, send everything you've got. it was that much of a concern. because at one point, and for several hours during this whole situation, there were two officers who were trapped in the building. the same building, the same home as the suspect. and there was a frantic effort to try and rescue him. we also know that there were

several hospital tags in thostae building as well. they were fire up through the floor at the officers as they were trying to escape and apprehend him. just a crazy scene, willie. the mayor here, for example, like many others, was just astounded and appalled, that this gunman, maurice hill, who are has a lengthy criminal record had so much firepower and weaponry and a.m. mu niption that he cou ammunition before this was resolved. >> the chief of police lamenting the fact he was able to get his hands on that kind of ammunition and weapons as well. but there was an extraordinary rescue made by the s.w.a.t. unit going upstairs and getting two officers who were trapped on a high higher floor in that building and getting them out without the shooter realizing they had been in. >> reporter: the s.w.a.t. team

apparently was able to do that white gunman was distracted. yes tr yes, it was a heroic effort. the police chief said it was astounding and incredible that more officers weren't hurt and wound seriously. there was also concern about the residents here. for hours there were bullets just flying everywhere. as you can see behind me, it's a very dense neighborhood, these very narrow streets in philadelphia in this north philadelphia neighborhood not far from where this is all happening. way down the street down there is when the incident actually unfolded. there was a daycare center with as many as 80 young chern wildro were sheltering in place and then evacuated. the old cliché it was a war zone, but it did seem like a war zone to people living around here. bullets flying everywhere. the suspect was taken in custody, the six officers were

treated and released at the hospital and now the suspect will face all kinds of charges including six counts of attempted murder. >> that's good news, the shooter's in custody and the six officers are home with their families. ron, thanks so much. global stocks once again under pressure this morning following a massive selloff amid growing worries of recession. they closed mostly in the red following major selling on wall street yesterday. the dow suffered its worst performance of the year on wednesday plunging 800 points. the s&p 500 and nasdaq also facing heavy losses. both shedding around 3% of their value. the growing volatility stems from the bond market sending warnings of the possible recession. the yield on the ten-year treasury briefly fell below a key marker since 2007. that ib version has predmiktd post recessions and is considered one of the strongest indicators of trouble ahead. let's bring in msnbc's don chu. what happened yesterday and

what's it looking like this morning? >> you encapsulated it perfect lin. interest rate picture right now is one that has typically in years past shown that the recession is somewhere in the offing. the issue is when that recession comes. but the idea that the u.s. economy could be slowing down markedly is the reason why you saw the dow, the s&p, and the nasdaq fall by as much as they did yesterday. a lot of that fear has to do with this idea that investors and traders are now handicapping or trying to predict more lowdowns ahead in the u.s. economy. in those kinds of environments, people will flock to the safety of u.s. government debt. when people flock to the safety of u.s. government debt, interest rates start to fall. and in those situations, that's where you start to see a recession fear possibly coming back in the marketplace. now, the continued worry today, we've seen a deterioration in the markets so far this morning because in addition to what we saw yesterday, two big pieces of

data or headlines came out in just the last hour. number one, the chinese ministry of finance is being reportedly -- is reportedly saying that it will look for necessary countermeasures against the u.s. for those tariffs that go into effect on september 1. also, hong kong has said that they will now take down their growth forecast for the rest of the year because of the protests and the lingering issues there. all of that, willie, is what's playing out in the markets. a bad day yesterday will be perhaps a little bit more worse today. >> let's talk policy. how much of this can be chocked up to the trade war between the united states and china and the tariffs put in place by president trump? >> it's probably fair to say at this point a good portion of this is being acontribute buttr trade war. and you throw hong kong in the mix from a geopolitical standpoint. had say stock market that's 5% or 6% away from record high levels. this is in no way a panic situation, however, there are

those investors who believe that given the current set of circumstances, because you don't know what trade is going to be like with china, you don't know what the market and economy are going to look like six, 12, 18, 24 months from now, that it's worth taking down the value of some of the markets out there. that's the reason why you see some of those moves lower today as well. >> germany having trouble and china as well with their economies. the president on a wild tweet storm yesterday as thee markets were tanking blaming the federal reserve chair, blaming his good friend president xi of china, is there some recognition at least when we saw him say he was going to pull back on some of the tariffs that perhaps his tariffs are part of the problem here? >> the president is consistent about very few things is his tariffs. the problem is he's wrong when it's who pays the price for these. it's american consumers time and time again. there's a growing belief that what he has done, his trade war here as impacted the economy

here and is slowing things down. and there's great fear among himself and his advisers, according to all of our reporting, but what could happen next if this gets worse. you saw almost like a panic surge of tweets yesterday. the federal reserve is always his scapegoat. yesterday they were the number one place where he was assigning blame for what is happening. but there is a recognition that there are other things at play here. we have seen him, this is in part has multited his response these hong kong protests, he's so upset to upset president xi in china because his sigh on the ball for what matters to him, and that's this trade dispute. there's a sense that he's told people around him were to go and criticize xi for what's happening in hong kong, stand up for values there, he's pulling back. he urged president xi to treat them humanely, but otherwise hasn't really said anything with any sort of strong stuff because he's afraid if he does it could really scuttle things as a trade

negotiations continue this fall and winter. and certainly there's a recognition that if the economy really does slow here, if there is real signs that a recession is coming, that that undermines what is his, in his belief, the best argument for his re-election which is that he's overseen a strong economy and if the market continues to fall and the economy slows down, he's in trouble. >> through all the storms of this presidency he's always come back to the economy. low unfloimt still true. consumer confidence still true. but if the flobl economy global taking a step towards recession, what does that mean for this presidency? >> it's political suicide. his political strength is premised on the idea that he has maintained and protected and cultivated a strong economy. his supporters and attractors overall agree that the economy has been pretty good the entire time of his presidency, whether it began with obama, that's

another debate. but you talk to voters and they love the economy right now. and that drops off it becomes much harder to excuse away the underlyi underlying instating in donald trump's statements. there no longer is the excuse i'm a republican who supports trump because i like the economy. that's a lot harder to say. >> yes. >> what happens i fwguess is ho much confidence can the president restore in the economy by talking the way he does and looking slightly panic, does that undermine confidence in the economy. when you see the president take on his own federal reserve chairman, i keep having to reread that tweet because it's so unusual to see them talk about their reserve chair as clueless in public the way that he does. but it's hard to think that the tone of the president's tweets in itself is stoking confidence. and as we know, to a large

extent markets depend not just on underlying facts but they depend on confidence as well. and i don't hear a lot of confidence coming out of the white house right now. >> well, markets can be irrational and we have an irrational president, so at least those two lines have intersected fairly briefly here. of course not. you know, one of the things that you heard so much going into 2016 was that the financial people were, despite some policy differences, believed that secretary clinton was a known quantity. and that that was a factor of uncertainty that they could take off the table. trump was uncertain. and so one of the things that makes that kind of wisdom questionable is that's been the case for almost three years now and the market's gone up. seems to me, both the political and economic reality at the moment is from what i can tell anyway, is that many, many companies have done a good job

of controlling costs. they've -- they're bullish but not crazy bullish. and if there's a pullback, two things happen. one is if working class folks have a harder time finding jobs or keeping the jobs they've got, then they're going to look to the political system and wonder why the president didn't deliver. and, to go to elisa's point, if the well off are seeing their portfolio's go down because of all these significant factors, then he begins to lose the tax cut republicans. anyway you look at it it's not a bright picture for him, and more important for the peck wople wh work and the people who create the state of the nation. had is the important thing. >> when the economy's good he wants credit for it but yesterday it was the fault of the federal reserve chairman. we'll get back to the economy in a moment. don chu, thank you very much for

being with us this morning. meanwhile, republican congressman steve king facing a wave of criticism from democrats and republicans for these remarks that at a conservative club yesterday when talking about his antiabortion rights legislation. >> are the reasons why we don't have exceptions for the most of us for rape and i set of because it's not the baby's fault. but i started to wonder about this. what if it was okay and what if we went back through all the family trees and just pulled those people out that were products of rape and incest, would there be any population in the world left if we did that, considering all the wars and all the rape and pillage that's taken place and whatever hpd to culture after society? i know i can't certify that i'm not a part of a product of that. >> the audio is tough on that so i'll read it for you. congressman king talking about inn set of and rape exceptions in abortion. he's against those exceptions. he said, quote, what if we went back through all the family trees and just pulled those people out that were products of

rape and incest, would there be any population of the world left if we did that? congressman king did not respond to repeated questions from nbc news outside of a town hall in iowa yesterday nor did his office respond to a request for comment. earlier this year king questioned why white supremacy and nationalism, that language is considered offensive. that led to republican leadership stripping king of his committee assignments. yesterday the highest ranking republican woman in congress, liz cheney said king's remarks are, quote, appalling and bizarre adding, as i've said before, it's time for him to go. the people of iowa's fourth congressional district deserve better. house republican whip steve scalise called his comments wrong and offensive and under score why we removed him from his committees. kevin mccarthy echoed that on fox news. >> have a great deal of problem with that. this isn't the first time i've had concerns with what steve king has said. earlier in this congress there are things that steve king said

that i do not believe the party of lincoln would stand for. and as a united conference, we actually removed steve king from his committees inside congress and i think this just continues to show why that action was taken. >> elise, i wish i would say these comments were surprising but he's made a career of saying things like this. you can go back 15 years to when he first came into congress including that if then senator obama were elected president alkide would al qaeda would be dancing in the streets celebrating, the anti-muslim rhetoric, it's justry tjust ridiculous. >> and it's just weird. who thinks that way? almost fantasizing about incest and -- i just don't -- i -- this weirdo needs to have been gone a long time ago. super weird. >> and, caddie, he may be gone, he won narrowly in his last

election, he's going to get a primary and he'll have a strong democrat running against him, the person who almost beat him last time. >> i was laughing at elise put is it so perfectly, he's just a weirdo. the fact that iowa's fourth district has re-elected him as often as it has is sort of strange given, as you say, there's a long history of him saying this. there are certain things you never want to be heard to even be vaguely supporting. and i think everybody would agray that ra agree that rape and incest of some are those things. maybe now with kevin mccarthy coming out saying this is not okay and they've stripped him of his committee assignments, there's not much more they can do on the sanction side, maybe there will be pressure on him. but he's been resilient to quite a lot of pressure over the white supremacy comments earlier and he resisted those. he got his committee assignment stripped but he didn't step down. you can feel the leadership now almost saying to him, okay, it's time for you to step out the

door with liz cheney saying they deserve better than this. >> yeah. remind our viewers in january -- >> that was great, weirdo. >> steve king wondered about white supremacy and white nationalist and said out loud how did that language become offensive? you heard for republicans calling for him to step aside. here's what some democrats were saying yesterday. >> you would think it would be pretty easy to come out against rape and incest. then again, you'd think it would be easy to come out against white nationalism. had is just one more example why there needs to be a sane representative in that district and it's why i think j.d. will be an excellent public servant for the people of that district. >> it's extremely disturbing and i would think anybody who had said something that extreme would resign. but then again i doubt that he'll actually do it so we'll have to beat him the old fashioned way. thankfully there's a terrific candidate in j.d. shuttle tton.

>> he said in a statement, yet again, steve king puts his selfish hateful ideology above the needs of the people of iowa's fourth district. excusing violence. a number of presidential candidates tweeted appeals for donations donations to shol10's campaign while others calling for him to resign, with sanders and gillibrand calling king a disgrace. not sure what else to say about this other than it's disgusting and appalling, jonathan, but he will get a primary challenge before he gets to j.d. from there's one voice i think people would like to hear weigh in on this. he has defended steve king in the past. he has at times half stepped away from this. i wouldn't say he's distanced himself from congress, came far from it. he tried to put a little bit of distance between himself and some of the remarks.

but king represents a portion -- some of the views he espouses are those shared by the president. not these, but some of his rhetoric about immigration and muslims, not too far off from what the president said. and there are people who support senator king support president trump. but these remarks are outrageous. it will be interesting to watch these couple days is there more pressure? we know the democrats will continue to criticize. but will there be more pressure from other republicans? we've stripped him of his communities, but will they try to force him out and lean on king and say you need to go? >> he brags about his relationship with president trump. he's close, i have the president's ear and he trust me. he shouted things out to king in iowa. although as you mentioned in june they decided not to let steve king fly with the president to iowa at least showing some distance from him. still ahead, china's collision course with democracy. we'll look inside time magazine's cover story on the battle for hong kong.

richard haase joins us for that conversation after their conversation in our blue-green room. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. g "morning " we'll be right back. johnson & johnson is a baby company. but we're also a cancer fighting, hiv controlling, joint replacing, and depression relieving company. from the day you're born we never stop taking care of you. and this is me now! fromi got liberty mutual. they customized my car insurance, so i only pay for what i need. then i won the lottery, got hair plugs, and started working out. and so can you! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪

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welcome back to "morning joe." beautiful picture of the white house this morning. some of the trump administration's top aides are urging the president to voice his support for hong kongese pro democracy protesters but with a narrow focus on trade negotiations with china trump so far as refused. people with knowledge of the matter telling "politico" yesterday president trump is only concerned with finalizing a trade deal this winter and therefore does not want to criticize chinese leader xi jinping. in a tweet yesterday, president trump wrote, he is a great leader who very much has the respect of his people. he's also a good man in a, quote, tough business. i have zero doubt that if president xi wants to quickly

and humanely solve the hong kong problem, can he do it. joining us now president of the council on foreign relations. richard haase also with us. and in london international editor don stewart. this time's cover overseas is the battle with hong kong. china's collision course with democracy. richard, let me start with you and the president trump angle on all this. he has been hesitant to say anything, he calls it the hong kong thing. he said we'll see what happens. he said i hope it works out for everybody. what more should he be doing and saying right now? >> what he and, you know, willbuwilber ross is given them essentially a green light to do what they think they may need to do. we should be reminding china that when hong kong was handed over by the british, they signed an international treaty with the british and they made certain commitments to except hong

kong's special status for 50 years, one country, two systems in the is not simply an internal matter. this now an international matter in addition to the human rights, in addition to basically telling the chinese the whole world is watching and if you do this, we will recalibrate our relationship with you. and that's what we ought to be telling them. >> and ayman, past president, any other president would come out and say we stand for democracy, we stand nor thfor t western society in hong kong fighting against an ought crattic regime. the president reluctant do that to give the trade deal. he thought the tariffs would give him the leverage to get trade deal, that isn't happening. he may be chasing something that isn't there and stepping back from supporting democracy because of it. >> there's a sense of realism that sets in on the president where he knows there's only so much that the u.s. can do to change the course of what's happening on the ground. we know that the protesters in so many ways reflect ideas and values that we would all agree with, democracy, freedom, they

don't want to have that extra diction which is what originate the these protests. but there's this double edge sword when america gets involved in some of these protests, having covered them overseas before, which is if you come out and lean too much in favor in support of the protests, the autocratic governments use that in their propaganda to say this is being fueled by america, we have to crack down and they see it as an interference. had is not the case with this president. the president is not making that calculation. he's not saying let's kind of support and do it gingerly and delicately. as abdicating america's responsibility for support of these protesters because he has other priorities with the chinese government. >> it's jonathan la mere, wonder if you could give us an update of what's happening on the ground today, what shape these protests are taking. but more than that, in terms of china's response. where do we see that escalating and how much of a concern for them is not just what's happening in hong kong, but what could be happening in other places whether it's taiwan or just an on mainland china where

there's expectations of that growing middle class to have some sort of potential freedom what they see in hong kong. >> so all try and -- to begin with, the protest have mainly been happening on the weekends. they've been staging marches open more or less weekly basis. so since the last couple of days they've been a little bit quieter. on the ground we what we saw last weekend a big interaction at the airport where they occupied the international met work and really struck at the heart of hong kong commerce, if you like. it's traditional role as a sort of trading place between east and west. but certainly i think, you know, building up to the protest this weekend, all eyes will be on how china is going to respond. there have been rumors now, reports, i think president trump tweeted out to one of those reports there's been a military troop buildup just on the other side of the border. hong kong of course has something like 10,000 soldiers

stationed on hong kong island and the hong kong government can call them in to keep the peace. but i think the sense on the ground there is that it's really an intimidation tactic at this point trying to convince the protesters to de-escalate, perhaps get some sort of pro democracy sort of more moderately leaders to try to negotiate a way out of this. it's an uneasy tension, i think, at the moment. >> so, richard, i want to pick you up on what you were saying about the deal that britain did with hong kong, because i've been looking and waiting for comments to come out of 10 downing street and boris johnson condemning what's happening in hong kong. i've just been going through the feeds at the moment and i'm still not seeing forceful words come out of downing street. to some extent it seems that these hong kong protesters encapsulate this moment we're in where china seems to wield an awful lot of power and you've got these twoing anglo-saxon

countries both in a position wanting to have a trade deal with the uk because of its brexit position and in the u.s. because donald trump wants this trade negotiation with china and therefore reluctant to stand up and say something firmly about what's happening in hong kong and send a warning signal to beijing. >> you're right. we've come depressionly long ways from when the anglo-american alliance created the foundations of the post world war ii liberal order and stood up for principles and democracy, the rule of law. and we have both countries now, the leadership of both countries taking a pass. let me say one other thing, caddie. if the president wants a trade agreement with china, he can have one. it was this administration that introduced goals that china could meet essentially to remake their economic model. but if we base -- put aside some of our demands that, for example, china stopped the massive subsidies of state and enterprise, which they'll never

do, and we went for a narrow trade deal, that's there for the having. so the idea that somehow hong kong is now the excuse not to have a trade deal, no, that's simply not true. we could do the right thing on hong kong and we could have a modest trade deal. what we can't have with or without hong kong is a trade deal that essentially asks china to give up a state-centered economic system. they're not going to do that. >> ayman, we have a lot of activity happening in kashmir this week too or little activity given there's a complete blackout in the country. you look at another place that has had a special status and india's like game over, not doing that anymore. what are we seeing from the trump administration in terms of how they're navigating the relationship? >> i think officially we haven't seen anything yet. i don't think there's been an official statement. correct me if i'm wrong, but i've been following closely trying to see if there's any kind of strong reaction one way or the other and there hasn't been. that's interesting because india moved swiftly and made this

decision. the current prime minister of india right now is a nationalist. this is not a surprise move given where he has historically been on the issue. but i think doing it without the calculation reflects more about how they view america's position in the world right now. and some have said this is because of america's vacuum on the region in general and also because it's tilted a little bit away from pakistan. traditionally after 9/11 and some of america's depend answer on the war, they would bring their concerns to kashmir and they would say don't do anything that could alter the balance of this specially administers region. if the indians calculated that they could move swiftly and make this change in the status of kashmir without any calculation whatsoever that america's going to respond forcefully, they probably thought that was because of a vacuum or that america's too preoccupied for that this particular administration doesn't simply care enough to weigh in heavily to try to push india to change or reverse course.

>> i think my reaction is slightly different. i think when donald trump had the pakistani prime minister in the oval office and out of nowhere he said the indians have asked me to mediate kashmir, zero chance on god's green earth india would ever want the united states or anybody else. plus, the indians are going hey, these americans are cozying up to the pakistanis again, they want their help to get out of afghanistan. so the indians, honestly, do not trust us. so my guess is, the indians decided to do a preemptive diplomatic strike here consistent with modi, his campaign, but they don't trust us and now we're standing back. we've essentially shut down american diplomacy. and whether it's japan, south korea, china, hong kong, we're too busy. we don't have to bother ourselves with what's going on in the world. >> we're too busy tweeting. >> that keeps us very busy over here. and meanwhile, modi said after the president uttered that in the oval office, dan stewart, he said, they've asked me to be the mediator and then he flipped and said well i'd like to be the

mediator. both india and pakistan said no, we would not want you or anyone else to be the mediator in this. >> yeah. i think the sense from -- from delawa dell i h deli they were furious with that remark. what's happening in hong kong and what's happening in kashmir is happening under this media blackout with reports of widesprewid widespread protest that are being quelled. i think in hong kong, you've got one of the biggest cities in the world there, a similar sort of crackdown would play very, very differently. so i would be very interested to see what happens there as well. >> thank you very much. richard, ayman, thank you both as well. good to see you. coming up, congresswoman martha judge joins us with an exclusive announcement. the democrat ready now publicly to back a presidential candidate.

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president trump has been in talks with key members of the senate following the recent mass shootings in el paso and date ton. the president has had discussions with democratic senator chris murphy, one of the leading gun reform advocates. president has spoken with pat toomey and joe manchin, the authors of a bipartisan background check bill that failed to pass in the wake of the sandy hook elementary school shooting of 2012. a senior administration official tells nbc news for background checks the white house is looking to model a bill after the toomey-manchin legislation. even though the bill was not successful in 2013, the white house believes it has a good policy framework and bipartisan support. that same administration official says the white house is not considering asking congress pass a federal red flag law but rather is focused on working with low makers to assemble a framework for states to choose if they put in place their own

such laws. so, we've heard this reporting, jonathan, for the last couple days that the president is talking to democrats like chris murphy, the white house is anyway. they mentioned bipartisan support for legislation on universal background checks. is that true? because it hasn't been true in the past. >> it's a little bit of wishful thinking at this point. it remains to be seen. perhaps some bipartisan support could emerge. certainly democrats have signaled that background checks are one of a number of things they would like. in their estimation we heard minority leader schumer say that they want much more than that, but certainly no one's going to turn down background checks. the question is will republicans come on board? to this point time and time again in the wake of these shootings we have not seen that. mitch mcconnell has not mobilized his senators to support this bill, even though the polling suggests that something like background checks is popular among republicans and gun owners and republican gun owners. and mcconnell has not fully come out and said what he would support. there have been some signals to

the white house. a lot of it will depend on how aggressive the president is. the senate is still out of session for a few more weeks here. is the president going to push for this which would give mcconnell cover in order to support this and defy the nra, which, as we've been discussing, certainly remains a very influential group though at a weak moment where they're in their own leadership crisis where they're surrounded by scandals and there may be a sense, and there's people i talked to the in white house believe the nra would not put up much of an option to background checks. at least not as fierce as they've done in the past. we'll give you this but stay away from any kind of attempt to curtail assault weapons and so on. >> john, we've been here so many times before after mass shootings that the question feels almost cliché. but is this time different? the president has signaled not just once but a number of times that he'd be willing to look at background checks. mitch mcconnell not so much. >> no, and it's one of the cases

in american life at the moment where a special interest group does, in fact, thwart the will of the majority. >> yeah. >> i think that's worth really thinking about. seems to me that the way forward here is if people who are -- whether it's joe manchin or pat toomey can make the case to enough colleagues that it's in their interests to get on board with this, let's just for the purposes of this conversation let's leave aside that it's the right thing to do, as john kennedy said, there's a reason profiles encouraged was just one volume. there are not a lot of examples out there. but in this climate, in these -- in a place and states where, in fact, they need to reach suburban folks, then perhaps this is the way to do it. the ambient shift on this is, i think, really interesting. because, you know, so many of us go to our kids' schools now and

there are armed guards. you hear people talk about the dangers. and one of the things that someone made the point over the el paso and dayton days, it's not original with me, said no one sesame more i didn't think it could happen here. >> yeah. >> and that is an ambient difference. >> i think john is pointing out something important. and it is this growing sentiment within the country even among gun owners that something needs to be done because the current status quo is unacceptable. and responsible gun owners don't want to have to worry about their children at school, especially if they live in a rural area where there are a lot of guns causally around for hunting and self-protection. i was surprised by this last year when we did ash kroft focus groups in mississippi and

tennessee. gun owners at the table, everyone owned guns and they said i would be for banning high-volume magazines. i would be for universal background checks. i don't want teachers to have to start becoming armed. i think that this is an opportunity for republicans to catch up with the mood of the country and their own base. >> well, that's why on paper at least, elise, universal background checks feels like an easy one because it does enjoy such support, not just in the country, but among republicans, as john said, and nra members that you think mitch mcconnell might be able to say let's give them universal background checks to give the appearance that we're doing something on guns. but he won't even concede on that. >> well, the nra right now really is a wounded animal. >> yeah. >> and the question is, is it a dying animal? you look at the leadership changes that have happened and the lunatics are running the

asylum. but are they going to have the support and funding and survive their scandals as their finances go through this deep dive? >> the momentum faded after parkland, which was a terrible shooting that really was followed by a lot of mass demonstrations and protest. the issue is will it again now? >> it couldn't pass after sandy hook, first graders killed in their classrooms. we'll see they pick up this issue when they return from the august recess. coming up next, the secret surge of migrants being held in the deep south. morgan radford has some exclusive reporting on what's happening at detention centers almost entirely out of sight. she joins our conversation next on "morning joe." ight she joins our conversation next on "morning joe. johnson & johnson is a baby company.

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week's i.c.e. raids, there's another story happening in the deep south that's been taking

place almost entirely out of sight. more than 8,000 migrants are now detained in the states of louisiana and mississippi. nearly four times the number held there last year. morgan radford has been working on this story. what more can you tell us? >> we have been digging into this story for over a month and basically what has happened is that the new fight over the border is now 600 miles away from the border and it's taking place inside the deep south. and these facilities, 13 new facilities in louisiana and mississippi, are holding now 8,000 detainees, but the thing is, these facilities are popping up so quickly and so quietly that a lot of the immigration attorneys and family members say they're like black holes. they're places where the detainees are unreachable for months and in remote areas and barely anyone knows that they're there. take a look at this. >> reporter: along the winding roads of the american deep south, the immigration battle has a new front line. >> so this is the facility where

he's staying. this is adams county correctional center in mississippi, a private prison now contracted to immigration and customs enforcement. we are outside of one of the detention centers here in mississippi. it's more than one of a dozen such facilities in loiuisiana ad mississippi. now holding more than 8,000 i.c.e. detainees, according to new data shared by i.c.e. with nbc news. that has been has almost kwau drup ld. this is one of eight attorneys in louisiana who are able to represent adult detainees for free in immigration court. there are none in mississippi. that's why she's driving across state lines to visit her client detained just behind these walls. >> how long does it take you to go see your client? >> this is going to take us about an hour and a half. >> each way.

she and other lawyers have referred to the facilities has black holes where they say detainees can be unreachable for days and detained for months. a claim that i.c.e. disputes, saying in a statement to nbc news, any claim that i.c.e. denies individuals access to legal counsel is false. adding, i.c.e. began using new facilities in louisiana and mississippi this year to house the increased number of persons encountered at the southern border. for family members, the weight is unbearable. >> translator: it's like you entered a cemetery, like you died in there. >> her brother is emily's client. once a doctor in cuba, he fled political persecution and presented himself at the border in texas last year. with no warning, he was moved to louisiana and then mississippi. he's been locked up for ten months while appealing for asylum after i.c.e. denied him

parole. >> what would you say if you could speak to a government official? they need to check out these government centers, especially louisiana. you came looking for liberty because this was supposed to be the country of freedom. if you had a message for your brother, what would it be? that you're fighting for him? and you're going to keep fighting for him. >> a fight that's playing out by the thousands across the country hundreds of miles away from the border. >> so willy, the question here is also the length of stay. since 2016, the pa rolls that have been granted have decreased from 75% to 1% and that's in the last few years. so that basically means if you're applying for asylum and i.c.e. or dhs does not grant you parole, you're there

indefinitely. >> great piece of reporting. so the brother in the piece here of the woman that you were speaking to, he presented himself at a port of entry, is that correct, fleeing political persecution? >> that's correct, most of the people are in there because they said i am presenting myself legally. he went to the port of entry in texas and this man is a doctor. my dad's family came by way of cuba, he said i was back in my country trying to help people, i took an oath. i am a doctor. and when i came here i wanted to do it lawfully and i wanted to help people in the united states and this is what's happened to me. >> we've heard about the detention facilities along the border and we've seen the conditions inside the facilities. is washington aware, as far as you can tell? is congress talking about these facilities. >> senator elizabeth warren wrote a letter to dhs basically raising a lot of questions about these new facilities, again the

ones that attorneys have said have been brought up quickly. she gave them until july 25th to respond and as of this morning, her office has still not heard back. >> thank you for putting a microscope on this problem. i know you'll stay on it. morgan radford, thanks so much. coming up, the dow trying to recover this morning from yesterday's dive, but overnight gains quickly have been wiped out after new trade threat from china just this morning. cnbc's john harwood joins us with the latest concern that the world can be headed toward recession. hiv controlling, joint replacing, and depression relieving company. from the day you're born we never stop taking care of you. at to cover the essentialsyou fromhave in retirement,n as well as all the things you want to do. because when you're ready for what comes next, the only direction is forward.

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we never stop taking care of you. we've sent our legislation to the senate. we've sent our legislation to the senate. moscow mitch says that he's the grim reaper. imagine describing yourself as the grim reaper, that he's going to bury all this legislation. well, we have news for him. all this legislation is live and well in the general public. that's house speaker nancy pelosi going after senate majority leader mitch mcconnell yesterday, calling him moscow mitch for blocking bills aimed at preventing both gun violence and foreign election interference. welcome back to "morning joe." still with us, white house reporter for the associated press, contributor to "time" g magazine and former aide to the

george w. bush state department elise jordan, and joining our conversation, cnbc editor at large, political reporter for the "washington post" and robert costa. he's also the moderator of washington week. a msnbc contributor. welcome to you all. we've got a great group and it's shaping up to be another tough day on wall street after yesterday's big sell-off among indications of the possible recession. china this morning vowed to take steps to counter tariffs from the u.s. that news comes after the dow suffered its worst performance of the year yesterday, plunging 800 points. the s&p 500 and nasdaq also facing heavy losses, shedding about 3% of their value in a single day. the growing volatility in the market stems in part of the bond market sending warnings of a mobl recession.

so john harwood, let me start with you. how much of this can we chalk up to the president and the trade war? >> well, we had an interesting development overnight, willie, which was yesterday as the markets were crashing, the president sent a series of tweets where he adopted a kind of strong stance and said, well, this is mostly going to help china rather than us. we're in a good position either way. then he tweeted with hong kong and had this appeal to xi jinping for a personal meeting with a question mark after it. overnight, however, what china did was not signal that they appreciated these gestures from the president. they said no, the tariffs that remain, we're going to have a retaliation and that sent futures into the negative. and so the president seems to have been -- have exposed himself, his own weakness in this negotiation and we have a

situation where our economy is weakening, the global economy is weakening, investors are becoming concerned about it, and the president is sitting there pulling levers, but not having them really be connected to anything and getting slapped by his negotiating counterpart. >> so john, you mentioned that germany also showing some signs that it may be headed toward a recession, china's output growing at the slowest pace in 17 years, the american economy has slowed to about 2% growth from 3 and a half percent last year. all the signs are sorting pointing down here, john. >> oh, me, yes. they are pointing down. we had even a quarter of 4% in 2018, but what's happened is the stimulus from the tax cut has now worn off. that was mostly demand side stimulus. we also had government spending.

now we're back to the trend growth that we had at the beginning of the administration when barack obama handed things over to president trump and we don't really have much to show for the last couple of years, except a reckoning for this recovery that's gone on for ten years. the u.s. economy has been very strong for a long time, adding private sector growth month after month. recoveries end at some point. it's not a law of economics that you have to have a recession, but usually when you have a serious head wind or a shock to the economy, that can cause the economy to stumble and fall. and this trade war seems to be a precipitating event that has raised doubt and uncertainty and increased pessimism amongst investors. >> bob, we saw from the president on twitter blaming the federal reserve and the interest rate cut for the problems we're

seeing over the last few days. is the president aware in any sense -- he seemed to show some crack at least a couple of days ago when he talked about pulling back temporarily at least on the tariffs to save christmas, as he effectively put it, that he understands that the tariffs that the trade war is hurting the economy? >> tensions are high within the administration because when you look at how the president adjusted the tariffs, it's not just because he was looking ahead to christmas shopping. it's because he's trying to salvage a trade deal with china inside of the white house this week, and you have the treasury secretariry, the white house top economic adviser trying to get the markets reassured about a china trade deal on the horizon, pulling back the tariffs. but that discussion about the china trade deal and bob lighthizer's efforts are not happening in a vacuum. the hong kong protests, the

president still not going hard after xi jinping, not yet. and that's where the tensions exist. because if the president has to make some kind of statement on human rights, that could rupture trade talks even more with china. >> the anxiety in the president's tweets, blaming clueless jay powell, the head of the federal reserve. and you know that in the white house the strategy is to run on the strong american economy and the president very focused on things like jobs numbers and skt the stock market. if we are heading in this inverted yield curve, it seems to herald a recession about a year out. if we're heading into a recession sometime next summer or fall, what does the president run on then? >> well, he doesn't have much to run on if we have a recession next year. but of course we know that this president has made cultural appeals, cultural identification

with his working class base. the main engine of his support. he did get some traditional uniform traditional republican support when we got to november of 2016, but he's been losing support from college educated whites. he has gone harder and harder on issues of immigration over the course of his administration. the trade war fits into that because he's appealing to blue collar americans who have been concerned about what's happened to their lively hoods over the last generation or so. but if he doesn't have the prop underneath him of a growing american economy, it's very difficult to see -- given how underwater he is in several of the states that he won in 2016, very difficult to see him assembling a coalition under those circumstances. >> jonathan, the president is riding the wave of a strong economy and that could be dangerous. even just this week the markets were down monday, back up

tuesday, and tanking again yesterday. if the president is hanging his hat on this economy and hoping that sort of blocks out all the rhetoric and the ugliness we've seen in this administration, that's a dangerous strategy if the economy turns south? >> absolutely, which is why one of the cardinal rules of politics, particularly presidential politics at least before, was that the president should not hang his hat on the stock market because of the volatility, because it's up one day and down the next. and if you take credit for the up days, you're definitely going to get the blame for the down days. and while gyrations in the market as we've seen over the last three days sort of highlights the peril of that strategy. and to jump on something john was talking about, about the president going really hard on the culture wars and hammering away with racist rhetoric about immigrants, it's part of what we've seen with this president

before, which is distraction. and in this case i think he's going hard on culture to distract from the really painful economy -- the economic pain from his tariffs. my in-laws are in north dakota. my husband's family, they're a tiny island of blue democrats and they have lots of republican friends and trump friends. and those friends that are farmers, particularly boy bean farmers are hurting. soybean prices are gone down from $10 a bushel to $8 and if it went down to $6, farms were going to go under. a year later they're still talking about the pain in the market, but the fact that china has looked elsewhere. they've taken their business to latin america and to russia. and what are those farmers going to do to get that market back,

to get their livelihoods back? and if the president is going to hammer away with cara vans and racist rhetoric, at some point if there's a recession a year from now, that argument might not work. probably won't. >> picking up on jonathan's point, there's no question that this president has really wedded himself to the stock market and how well it is going. and he's very quick to tout it when it's going well and run away from it when it's not or shift the plam. and certainly the federal reserve has been his go-to whipping boy and he's been on them suggesting that they're the ones that are responsible for this. but also picking up on the point here, you're going to see there's a sense around the white house that they need to figure out some other issues. we were joking earlier about straws, but that is something, whether it's the cultural war or small things that they feel like they can win some points on. the country is changing, i don't

like it, and whether it is something significant and ugly, like these attacks on the four democratic congresswomen of color, or something like how we drink our beverages. that could be something that they do. but my question for you is, is there going to be a moment where other republicans who have supported him because of the economy, and if it really does start to slow, is that going to provide them the cover to finally step away from him? >> i think you could make the argument that the only issue that any congressional republicans have ever really stood up to trump on are the tariffs, and not wanting the trade war and the opposition. and they're just being drug along by trump and they're going with this crazy train because it's in their political interest at this current moment. but the economy starts to take a hit, they hear from their donors, they hear from their constituents. the instability of donald trump

on twitter and the volatility that he constantly injects from the stock market, it's not good for anyone. >> bob costa among the names you mentioned just a minute ago, people like larry kudlow fundamentally throughout their careers have disagreed with the idea of tariffs and trade wars. is there anyone inside that white house, anyone inside his administration who can prevail upon the president and say, look, the economy is starting to turn down, we told you the trade war was a bad idea, back off? >> well, we're trying to nudge him toward a deal. a deal with president xi jinping that they think could somehow move the economy away from the trade wars. the challenge for people like kudlow inside of the white house is that there are other advisers, like peter navarro and people on the outside who are more populus nationalist conservatives who say that an economy war with china, not just

a trade battle, is essential for the president's reelection. that a deal really isn't the goal for some allies, it's about fighting china and trying to bring the manufacturing base back to the united states even if there's no deal to be had. but the people who are more dovish like kudlow, they say the markets need to be reassured if you want to have the markets stable heading into the fall of 2020 for reelection. >> and some of those people like peter navarro yesterday giving the president credit for saving christmas by temporarily pulling back on his tariffs. i wish i were kidding about that, but i'm not. so let's talk about the democrats. despite some hurdles on the campaign trail, joe biden continues to maintain his lead among south carolina voters. that's according to a brand new poll. 35% of south carolina democratic voters say they support the former vice president, giving biden his largest lead among the early voting states. biden is 19 points ahead of senator elizabeth warren who sits in second place with 17%.

16% say they support senator bernie sanders, giving him a 7 point boost in south carolina just since june. meanwhile, senator cory booker, who has held more events in south carolina than any other candidate, sits in sixth place with 4% support among voters there. elise, let's just leave that graphic up there and tell me what you see there besides joe biden holding steady, despite some stumbles in debates, stumbles on the campaign trail, and particularly among african-american voters? >> it's interesting that elizabeth warren flat lined in this poll, when other polls in other early states she's been gradually on the rise and having the momentum and the kind of traction you want to be having at this point in the race. i was frankly a little bit surprised that bernie was on the rise and that he was increasing and not dipping in contrast to elizabeth warren. and breaking it down even further, you look at african-american voters and they're really sticking with joe biden for now at this stage of

the race. >> jonathan, that poll shows something that we've seen pretty steadily, joe biden with a significant lead, and particularly among african-american voters where he holds a massive lead in the state of south carolina. >> and that reflects something that i learned over the weekend with my own family in north carolina, our annual family barbecue where i had right there in front of me a huge black focus group. i went around and started asking everyone who they liked, who they were thinking about, who they were interested in in the democratic race, and of the 26 people i talked to, 20 said vice president biden was their first choice. one of my aunts said to me, when i asked her why biden, she said well, you know, i think that you need an old white man to go up against an old white man. an old white person to go up against an old white person, old school against old school. and then some other folks

said -- actually it was the same aunt who said, look, the way the system is set up, i don't think a woman is going to be elected. hillary clinton couldn't win. and if she had been a man, she would have won. the other interesting thing in talking to everyone, is that they're practical about joe biden, but the same aunt who liked joe biden, she told me that she really liked senator kamala harris, but because kamala harris is not an old white person and she's a woman, she doesn't think she can win. and i heard that from a few other people. and i think what's happening here and what i observed is that senator harris right now is where then senator barack obama was in 2007 when he was gearing up to run for president. african-americans, i think we all remember, were solidly in the camp of hillary clinton until the thunder clap moment of the iowa caucuses and that was

when african-americans saw that if a predominantly white state like iowa would vote for the black man with the, quote, funny name, then he has a shot at winning. and i think if kamala harris gets that thunder clap moment in this race, the same thing could happen for her. so african-americans love joe biden. one more point. it's not because he was president obama's number two. president obama is not the win underneath joe biden's wings. african-americans like joe biden because he's joe biden. >> first of all, this has been a wonderful journey through your family gatherings this morning. north dakota, north carolina, we're all over the place. you said something very interesting because there is this sort of cliche that joe biden is the most electable, this vague notion of electability. but if that changes over the course of iowa or new hampshire, the dynamics of this race could obviously change. >> right, they could change. but here's the other thing i

learned from my family, but also from my twitter feed and folks that i've been hearing, that the underlying sentiment in all of these conversations is basically can be boiled down to this, vote blue no matter who. they love joe biden. if joe biden isn't the person, then whoever the democratic nominee is, that's who they're going to vote for. the democratic party, the rank and file members of the party, people who vote democratic, are really angry, they're really concerned about the direction the president is taking the country in, and they really do think he's kind of nuts. and so they will look for -- they have their preferences, but on november 2020, on election day november 2020, they are voting for the democratic candidate. >> so bob costa, as the president of the united states and the white house looks at that field and they look at that graphic of joe biden and the sort of battle between elizabeth warren and bernie sanders for

that progressive vote, kamala harris right there at 12% as well, which of those candidates strikes the most fear in donald trump? >> it's not so much fear now they're watching inside of the white house, but it's an adjustment of the democratic race. events matter. and if this economy now takes front and center in the democratic debate, takes that center stage place inside of the conversation, senator warren and senator sanders with their call for structural change, for economic stability that's provided by government intervention or government support, could democratic voters now start to drift away from vice president biden who the white house had expected to be their main challenger perhaps in 2020, to a more economic populus candidate heading into next year. >> yeah, that seems to -- i was just wandering that. john harwood, in times of recession do voters tend to go for more government? do they tend to want to tack left a little bit because they are hurting themselves, and

therefore they look for a bigger social safety net? that's certainly the case in europe. do you think it could tb indicates in the u.s. as well if this is what pans out next year? >> it's absolutely the case. what we have seen is that over time the worse things are economically when you ask voters a question do you want lower taxes and less government or higher taxes and more government services, they tend to go to more government services. i want to go back to one thing that jonathan indicated to set a sense of expectations about timing here. jonathan referred to the thunder clap moment when barack obama won iowa and that shook loose of the practical minded african-american voters who had sided with hillary clinton. but when did he shake loose iowa? it was in the fall at the jefferson jackson day dinner when then senator obama gave a stirring speech. that was after you had a lot of paid advertising on television in iowa.

and so what we see right now in these midsummer polls is not reflective of where we're going to be this fall. people are going to start being on the air. that started a few days ago. kamala harris went on. you're going to see pete buttigieg go on and joe biden as well. and when the gears start engaging on the race in the fall, that's when we're going to see whether joe biden has a sense of vulnerability or shows vulnerability in this race, and that will be the key to unlocking the trove either for elizabeth warren, kamala harris. >> thank you both. still ahead, while some members of congress staying on the sidelines, others publicly picking sides in the democratic race for president. congresswoman marcia fudge has just made her choice. she joins us next to reveal it. you're watching "morning joe." johnson & johnson is a baby company.

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beautiful live picture this morning of the united states capitol in washington. joining us now, member of the congressional black caucus, democratic congresswoman marcia fudge of ohio. she's here to announce her endorsement of a democratic candidate for president. it's great to have you with us today. i'll let you make your announcement. who are you going to support? >> i am supporting kamala harris. >> why? >> first off, i think that she's an excellent candidate. i think there's no one better to make the case against number 45 than kamala harris. i think she is positioned well right now and she's going to continue to do better. so i'm excited about it. >> and congresswoman, what do you see in senator harris that you don't see, for example, in joe biden? what went into your decision here? >> well, there are a number of things. one is i do think that she is a person that has the kind of energy and she's a new fresh

face. she's someone that when people meet her, she like her, and i think that she is going to continue to move up in the polls. and of course she's an african-american woman. so that is very, very important to me as well. >> do you have concerns about the front-runner, joe biden, or was this just all about senator harris for you? >> this is about senator harris. i've come to know joe biden, i like him a great deal, but i have just chosen the candidate that i think is best prepared to be the president of the united states. >> congresswoman, jonathan has a question for you. >> hi, congresswoman fudge. thanks for sharing your news about who you're supporting. and i was just talking about my family barbecue in north carolina last weekend and it was my aunt gloria who said she likes senator harris but she thinks joe biden sho be the nominee, one because he's an old white person who can go up against an old white person, but also because senator harris is a woman and a woman is not going

to win. if my aunt gloria were here right now, what would you tell her to make her see the way you see it, that senator harris is the one who should be the nominee? >> i would say aunt gloria, remember that black women are the biggest and best voting block in the democratic party, that african-americans and people of color are going to determine who our nominee is going to be. we are the base. if we support her and we come out, she will win. >> elise? >> congresswoman, senator harris has a new plan to combat terrorism within the united states. can you talk a little bit about that plan? >> yeah, she's talking about domestic terrorism. certainly white supremacy is not new to this country, and it's real. and what she has done, not only as the attorney general of california when she dealt with hate crimes in a way that no one else on this ticket has, she has developed a plan that will say

that you can't just sell guns online and there not be a background check. that we can't make domestic terrorism an afterthought. we need to deal with it directly and make sure that our counterterrorism people deal with it directly. so i think that her plan is going to be a good one. there's no one better qualified than persons of color to talk about white supremacy. it is something we've dealt with all of our lives. so i think that she's uniquely positioned to do that. >> congresswoman, kamala harris has been bumping along at number four or thereabouts in the polling pretty much since this race started. what do you think she needs to do and when does she need to do it to catapult herself up to be the person that could have that break-through moment where more voters say we like her, but now we think we can invest in her because we think she can win? >> i think right now what you're seeing is that the people at top, the top three, are people that everybody knows. so i think you're seeing a lot

of name recognition right now. what kamala needs to do is keep doing what she's doing. the more she meets people, the more they become engaged and like her, i think that after labor day or getting into the fall, people are going to start to pay more attention and she is going to start to get a bump. i can almost guarantee you that that's going to happen. >> congresswoman, it's jonathan. switching gears slightly, your home state was one of the two impacted with a mass shoot ng the last week or so. you've obviously come out in favor of gun control measures, do you think universal background checks will pick up support in the senate and the president will add his blessing to it. if this ends up with a background check measure, is that an acceptable response to what happened or should the democrats be fighting for even more right now? >> i think it's a good first step. i think we should fight for more. that is who we are as a party, but that's also where the rest of the nation wants us to go.

so i think that if we don't do it, then we will have missed a great opportunity. >> so congresswoman, what is your hope as you speak to our audience today about what can happen with guns? we know that mitch mcconnell who stands at the head of the republican party in the senate has not been willing in the past to go there. even on a question of universal background checks, which enjoys wide support in the country and even among republicans. do you have some belief that what happened in your state less than two weeks ago may change things? let me just say this, i don't think that we judge ourselves based upon what mitch mcconnell wants or believes. he obviously does not believe in what most americans believe in. so i think that we need to pull together a coalition of democrats and republicans and i think that that is happening now, and force him to do what is right, force him to listen to the people. he's going to be up for reelection as well. he is going to have to do something to show america that

he wants them to be safe. and if he doesn't, he is going to lose. >> we will see if he does when you all come back from your recess. congresswoman marcia fudge of ohio this morning, endorsing exclusively on "morning joe" kamala harris. thank you for your time this morning. we appreciate it. >> thank you for having me. >> another development in the presidential race, a source close to democrat john hickenlooper tells nbc news the former colorado governor is expected to drop out of the presidential race today. hickenlooper widely is believed to be considering a challenge to colorado's republican senator. while he sits near the bottom of public polling of the presidential race and is not likely to qualify for the next round of debates in september, polling published by the denver post shows him holding a massive lead over two other democrats in colorado's 2020 senate primary race and a strong candidate against senator corey gardener.

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now to the latest in the investigation into the death of jeffrey epstein.

two people familiar with the findings tell the "washington post" that his autopsy revealed multiple broken bones in the neck. the autopsy was performed on sunday. new york city's chief medical examiner did not identify a cause of death saying she needs more information. the post reports the medical examiner's office did not comment on its reporting about the autopsy. multiple people briefed on the investigation do tell nbc news suicide remains the presumed cause of death. meanwhile the federal judge who was in charge of epstein's prosecution in new york says he is still waiting for the bureau of prisons conclusions about the first suicide attempt. the warden responded informing the judge that the current investigations would also examine the circumstances around that previous episode. we're also hearing more from epstein accuser who has filed a lawsuit against his estate. his long-time associate gill lain maxwell.

the new law gives abuse survivors to sue even after the statute of limitations has expired. the 32 year old claims epstein sexually assaulted her several times in his manhattan townhouse when she was 14 and 15 and says that one time he raped her. the suit claims that ghislaine maxwell assisted in maintaining and protecting his sex trafficking ring. rose says she never met maxwell personally. she has denied the accusations against her. she says, quote, the power structure was stacked against me. his money, influence and connections to important people made me want to hide and stay silent. those same powerful forces let him hide and evade justice. she writes, i'm angry he won't have to personally answer to me in a court of law, but my quest for justice is just getting

started. >> you know, these women are at the center of this and time and again they've seen justice denied. they had it denied back in 2008, we're having it denied again now. they feel with jeffrey epstein in these peculiar circumstances are now being allowed, we think, to commit suicide in prison. but of course the coroner's finding about his windpipe being broken raising more questions about what exactly happened inside that prison cell, and was there some other force at work when he died. the key i think now for these women is going to be able to go after those associates, the named co-conspirators, the other people who have been implicated in the release of documents last week. obviously prosecutors are going to want to look at ghislaine maxwell, she seems to have been a figure in procuring the women

throughout the years, sometimes up to three women a day, for jeffrey epstein to be able to abuse them. so i hope for them, we all have to hope that this case is not over and what new york has done in extending the time that they can now come -- overriding the statute of limitations so they can register their own cases against him even retrospectively, that's a good start. they have to remain the focus of this, what happened to these young girls. >> i'm just baffled as to why ghislaine maxwell, who has been accused of assault by several of the victims, how she's still living free and no one really seems to know her whereabouts. the daily mail said she might be in an ocean front estate in massachusetts. the owner of that estate denied the account, denied that he was her boyfriend. it's just bafling to me that she really seems to have also gotten

off completely free of any consequences for wrongdoing. >> and it's just one of a number of questions that still circulate around what's happening here, including the latest report about how he died and the broken bone in his neck they say is consistent with a suicide in an older individual, but is more consistent with a homicide. no one is suggesting that the cause of death was anything more than what they have said, what william barr said was an apparent suicide. but it's just another piece here as it slowly drips information about what happened over the weekend in that manhattan jail and the circumstances of his death. there's just going to continue to fuel not just questions about justice and how these victims should receive what's coming to them, but also the idea of the circumstances that he's died and it will lead to more conspiracy theories in part fueled by the president of the united states. >> retweeting some of those about the clintons. coming up, president trump heads to new hampshire tonight for a

campaign rally. if research holds, democrats may be more fired up about his visit than republicans. we'll explain that next on "morning joe." johnson & johnson is a baby company. but we're also a cancer fighting, hiv controlling, joint replacing, and depression relieving company. from the day you're born we never stop taking care of you. from the day you're born

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welcome back to "morning joe." sun is up now over washington. 7:45 in the morning. joining us now, national correspondent for pbs, also with us lauren leader, the co-founder and ceo of all in together, a women's civil and political information, which is out with new numbers showing political divisions have grown worse since the election of president. specifically 71% of men and 70% of women feel the country is politically divided, a 30 to 40% increase since 2016. it looks into president trump's impact on voter motivation, with

67% of voters saying they are more motivated to head to the polls in 2020. 28% felt no difference, while 5% said they felt less motivated. good morning to you and welcome. what do you read into these numbers as we head into the 2020 election. >> i think it's an important signs that voters are playing close attention and they're going to be mobilizing and they're driven by the current environment to make change. when you look at the numbers, women, particularly democratic women, 78% say that they are extremely motivated to engage in the 2020 election. it's so important because women have outvoted men in every election since 1980. they were the deciding factor in the 2018 midterms. and if that kind of motivation translates into action and mobilization, which there's some concern about that, but if it does, that's bad news for sure for the president. >> we've heard enthus yachl before. there was enthusiasm on paper for hillary clinton to become

the first woman president of the united states and a lot of people didn't show up. what is the gap you're talking about between motivation and activation? >> americans tend to really misunderstand what actions translate into political outcomes. so what we found in the survey is that women, democrats particularly, those who are most motivated. they're motivated to make change, but what they spend most of their time doing is social media. when we asked them whether they were likely to go out and volunteer for a campaign, whether they were going to make contributions to the campaign, those numbers are quite low relative to the time that they spend on social media. that's a problem, because americans really think that social media translates into political outcomes and it does not. very little changes ultimately at the ballot box based on how much time you spend on social media. so we need voters to translate that enthusiasm into the ballot box and also into working on behalf of candidates that they are committed to. >> do you see an understanding of that, any learning from 2016 that a hashtag is not enough? you actually have to go out and work and vote after that.

>> not as much as we would like. we train women across america on the tools of political power, influence and leadership. we need more women to understand this and this is an issue for americans generally. social media does not actually have a mobilizing effect on the electorate. >> there was one stat in here that was so disturbing and mirrors what, unfortunately, i've heard so often from voters, that there is a belief that a woman can't win the presidency. >> so we asked voters to basically prognosticate to say who do you think wins, and overwhelmingly the generic democrat wins by huge margins, even among independent men and women. however, when you ask them about a generic woman candidate, those numbers flip and the president winds up with an advantage. and i think this reinforces what what we've been hearing for the last number of months, that women aren't electable. worry worried that becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. the more people that listen to

this narrative, the less level the field is for the women candidates. we saw this in 2007 in the polls about are people ready to elect neighbors are. they don't think americans are. women like women candidates. they say overwhelmingly, they think they represent them better. they just worry whether they can win. question, to underline the numbers, trump has an 18-point deficit, but only a nine-point deficit if the candidate is a woman theoretically in this poll. >> and let me piggyback on that. thinking about this idea of electability, there's this discussion about whether a female candidate is perceived as electable. it's been joe biden's number one argument. maybe not the one that he physically is making, but those around him are suggesting he's the guy that can beat donald trump the and that's why he should be the nominee. what are your thoughts?

is that motivating democrats when they pick a candidate? >> yeah. i mean, the numbers line up precisely with what i've been seeing in the field when you go talk to voters. this issue of electability, particularly for our democratic voters and likely democratic voters is front and center. we've been seeing it in the polls for a while now. our latest polls show that issue, who can beat donald trump, is way more important to some of those voters than anyone who lines up with them. the interesting part here, though, is the idea of electability, critics will say it's often wrapped up in who we think can win as based on who has won in the past. and the irony is when you look at female legislators, the idea that women have to work harder to win office in the first place which sometimes mean they perform better once in office, there was a study a few years ago that showed the average female legislator secures more funding for her district. she's able to enact more bills than her male counterparts. that aside, people feel the way

they feel right now because they haven't had an example. we've had one female major party nominee and she lost. and that unfortunately matters in how people are factoring the candidates today. >> when you look at lauren's numbers, it appears she's been talking to aunt gloria in the north carolina focus group. >> all the aunts. >> yeah. it's a bit of a deja vu. lauren, i was wondering, do you have a racial breakdown of these women? as congresswoman fudge said in an earlier segment, african-american women are the foundation and backbone of the democratic party. they are super energized and mobilized, but i'm wondering where do they fit in this? and also, where do college educated white women fit because if you're going to look at two big important electorates for 2020, those are the two. >> yeah. and the data was remarkably consistent across all of these groups, which we thought was

fascinating. and i think what you heard from your aunts is very reflective of what we're seeing across the country, this sense of with, you know, fear of taking too big of a risk in an election that has enormous consequences in the sense that as your aunt said or as you said earlier, jonathan, that somehow the white male candidate is a better matchup against the president. look, i mean, to this point about turnout, look, any democrat wins or loses the 2020 election on the enthusiasm and the turnout of women, of underrepresented minorities and of millennials. that is based on enthusiasm and excitement in the sense that that person speaks for them. so i think there is the potential that this gap winds up closing. if we start seeing the candidates who really are resinating with those three groups breaking through, i think this dynamic could shift. but, again, it's this fear that somehow i get it, i as an individual voter would be able to do this, but i worry that my neighbors won't, that there's bias out there that make it

impossible for a woman to win. >> it can't just be, though, the fear that a woman can't win onner an african-american can't win that is keeping joe biden so consistently at the top of the polls. he has debate performance after debate performance in which he doesn't do very well. the press is spending a lot of time reporting the things that he says out on the campaign trail that are being described as gaffes. yet voters still like him. there must be something about joe biden. maybe it is just his you electability factor, but there is something about joe biden that voters are sticking with. >>. >> absolutely. and electability, likability, familiarity, matters a heck of a lot of this stage of the game. it's still very, very early and a number of voters who wooerp talking to out in the field say yeah, i like joe biden and that's why even if i haven't necessarily made up my mind right now, i am leaning towards joe biden.

but back to the issue of how these democratic voters are likely to perhaps turn out in an anti-trump way, this is something we've been fascinated to look at. when you look at the way president trump is messaging right now, when you look at the things people may call unforced errors, the go back tweets and family separation, the kinds of things people see as unnecessarily cruel and maybe even questionable policywise if they have any policy behind them at all, those are the things that likely democratic women and voters say makes them more motivated to want to show up. those things do motivate them. >> what do they do to change the dynamics? >> i think the better they post those, the better it will be. the senators have never lost a race. so i think they're doing a lot of the same things.

it's early. we've seen it change in the past. i think the obama election is a good indicator that americans are open to great candidates, inspiring candidates and will willing to vote for change when they think it's the right person. >> and there is time left. thank you. still ahead, when it comes to looming ae session, president trump is blaming his hand-picked fed chair for holding us back. plus, a suspect is in custody this morning after an eight-hour standoff with police in philadelphia that left six officers injured. we'll get the very latest coming up next on "morning joe." e veryg up next on "morning joe. is a b. but we're also a cancer fighting, hiv controlling, joint replacing, and depression relieving company. from the day you're born we never stop taking care of you. from the day you're born

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hiv controlling, joint replacing, and depression relieving company. from the day you're born we never stop taking care of you. welcome to "morning joe." joe and mika have the morning off. i'm willie geist. we have caddie kay, jan than lamere, alesse jordan and jon meacham. there's a lot of ground to cover this morning, including that

bruising day on wall street. the markets were hit hard and growing concerns now over a potential recession. plus, china at the center of two big stories. the protests that are still consuming hong kong and the trade war with washington. and congressman steve king managing to offend just about everyone with his comments on abortion, rape and incest. we'll get the latest reaction with some republicans calling for him to resign. out of philadelphia, an armed suspect accused of opening fire and wounding six officers during a nearly eight-hour standoff has surrendered early this morning. shortly after midnight, a police spokesman tweeted a suspect was in custody and s.w.a.t. officers were clearing the house where the standoff took place. the suspect surrendered without incident and was taken to a hospital with treatment because tear gas was used. the gunfire began wednesday arch as police were serving a narcotics warrant. let's bring in nbc news

correspondent ron allen. ron, good morning. what is the latest on the condition of those officers? we're all thankful and grateful this morning and stuned in some ways that they're all out of the hospital. >> stunned they're out of the hospital, stunned by the entire incident. they were not life threatening injuries that they sustained. one officer was grazed in the head. but it's the first time in a long time in recent memory that anybody can recall six officers being shot. and the response here was just incredible. an army of police officers around 4:30 in the afternoon arriving to this call. you could hear the radio traffic was frantic. and one officer said, for example, send everything you've got. it was that much of a concern because at one point and for several hours during this whole situation, there were two officers who were trapped in the building, the same building, the same home as the suspect. and there was a frantic effort to try and rescue him.

there were several hostages in the building at the same time, as well. there were reports that the suspect was firing through the floor up at the officers as they were trying to escape and trying to apprehend him. just a crazy scene, willie. the mayor here, for example, like many others, was astounded and appalled that this gunman, maurice hill, who has a lengthy criminal record had so much firepower, so much weaponry and ammunition that he could hold off the police for the better part of seven hours before this whole situation was resolved. >> and the chief of police there lamenting the fact that he was able to get his hands on that ammunition and those weapons, as well. you alluded to it, ron. but there was an extraordinary effort made by philadelphia's s.w.a.t. unit going upstairs and getting two officers trapped on a higher floor in that building and getting them out without the shooter realizing they had been in. >> the s.w.a.t. team apparently

was able to do that while the gunman was distracted. yes, it was a heroic effort, a miraculous, the police chief said it was astounding and incredible that more officers weren't hurt, weren't wounded more seriously. there was a lot of concern about the residents here. for hours, there were bullets flying everywhere. as you can see behind me, it's a very dense neighborhood, these very narrow streets in philadelphia in this north philadelphia neighborhood. not far from where this is all happening. wait down the street down there is where the incident actually unfolded. there was a day care center with as many as 80 young children who would sheltering in place for a time and evacuated. you know, the old cliche, it was a war zone, but it really did seem like a war zone to people who live around here. bullets flying everywhere. but, again, the bottom line, the suspect was taken into custody. the six officers were treated and released from the hospital.

and now the suspect, maurice hill, is going to face all kinds of charges, including six counts of attempted murder. >> that's the good news, the shooter is in custody and those six officers are home with their families this morning. global stocks once again under pressure this morning following a massive sell-off amid growing signal owes of a possible recession. stocks in asia closed mostly in the red following major selling on wall street yesterday. the dow suffered its worst performance on the year on wednesday plunging 800 points. the s&p 500 and nasdaq also facing heavy losses. both shedding around 3% of their value. the growing volatility in the market stems from the bond market sending warning eggs of a possible recession. the yield on the ten-year treasury briefly fell below a key marker for the first time since 2007. that so-called inversion has correctly predicted many past recessions.

dom, what happened yesterday and what is it looking like this morning? >> you encapsulated it perfectly. the interest rate picture right now is one that is typically in years past shown that a recession is somewhere in the off. the issue now is when that recession comes. but that idea that the u.s. economy could be slowing down markedly is the reason why you saw the dow, the s&p and the nasdaq fall by as much as they did yesterday. a lot of that fear has to do with this idea that investors and trader are now handicapping and predict more slowdowns ahead in the u.s. economy. in those kinds of environments, people will flock to the safety of u.s. government debt. when people flock to the safety of u.s. government debt, interest rates start to fall. and in those situations, that is where you start to see a recession fear possibly coming back in the marketplace. >> so let's talk policy. how much of this can be chalked up to the trade war between the united states and china and the tariffs put in place by president trump?

>> it's probably fair to say at this point a good portion of this is being attributed to the trade war, the uncertainty about policy with china. and, of course, you throw hong kong in the mix from a geopolitical standpoint. this is a stock market that is currently about five or six percent away from record high levels. so this is in no way any kind of a panic situation. however, there are those investors out there who believe that given the current set of circumstances, because you don't know what trade is going to be with china, you don't know what the market and the economy are going to look like six, 12, 18, 24 months from now, that it is worth taking down the value of some of the markets out there. and that is the reason why you're seeing some of those moves lower today, as well. >> germany having its troubles with the economy. china, as well. the president on a wild tweet storm yesterday as they markets were tanking blaming the federal reserve chair, talking about his good relationship with president xi of china. is there some recognition at least, did we see yesterday when he announced he was going to

pull back on some of the tariffs that perhaps his problems are part of the problem here? >> the president has a belief in tariffs. the problem is he's wrong on who pays the price for these. it's american consumers time and time again. there is a suggestion from the white house, there is a growing belief that what he has done, his trade war has impacted the economy and is slowing things down. there is great fear among himself and his advisers according to all of our reporting about what could happen next. you saw it almost like a panicked surge of tweets yesterday. the federal reserve is always his scapegoat. even yesterday, they were the number one place where he was assigning blame for what was happening. but there is a recognition that there are other things at play here. .we have seen him, and this is in part has muted his response to these hong kong protests as he's so afraid to upset president xi in china because his eyes on the ball on what he meant, what matters to him, which is this trade dispute. and there's a sense that he has

told people around him that were he to go criticize what is happening in hong kong, stand up for american values here which a lot of his predecessors would have done, he's pulling back. he urged president xi to treat them humanly, but otherwise hasn't said anything with any strong stuff because he's afraid if he does, it could scuttle things as the trade negotiations continue this fall and winter and certainly there's a recognition that if the economy really doesn't slow here, if there is real signs that a recession is coming, that that undermines what is his and his belief the best argument for his re-election which is that he's overseeing a strong economy. and he ties it to a booming stock market. if the market continues to fall and the economy slows down, he knows he's in trouble. >> through all the storms of this presidency, he's always come back to the economy. low unemployment, still true. consumer confidence, still true. but if the global economy, including the united states, is taking a step towards recession, what does that mean for this presidency? >> it's political suicide.

donald trump's political strength is premised on the idea that he has maintained and protected and cultivated a strong economy. his supporters and detractors, overall, agree that the economy has been pretty good the entire time of his presidency. whether it's benefitting from obama, that's another debate. you talk to voters and they love the economy right now. that drops off, it becomes much harder to excuse away the underlying instability and bracism of the administration and donald trump's constant statements. it becomes much harder. there no longer is the excuse. i'm a republican who supports trump because i like the economy, that's a lot harder to say. >> yes. >> i guess how much confidence can the president restore in the economy and by talking the way he does and looking slightly panicked, does that actually undermine confidence in the economy?

jon meacham, when you see the president take on his own federal reserve chairman, i mean, i keep having to reread that tweet because it's so unusual to see a president talk about their own federal reserve chair as clueless in public in the way that he does. but it's hard to think that the tone of the president's tweets in itself is stoking confidence. and as we know, to a large extent markets depend not just on underlying facts, but they depend on confidence, as well. and i don't hear a lot of confidence coming out of the white house right now. >> well, markets can be irrational and we have an irrational president, so at least those two lines have intersected fairley briefly here. of course not. one of the things that you heard so much going into 2016 was that the financial people were, despite some policy differences, believed that secretary clinton was a known quantity and that that was a factor of uncertainty that they could take off the

table. trump was uncertain. and so one of the things that makes that kind of wisdom questionable is that's been the case for almost three years now and the market has gone up. seems to me both the political and economic reality at the moment is from what i can tell, anyway, is that many, many companies have done a good job of controlling costs. they're bullish, but not crazy bullish. and if there's a pullback, two things happen. one is if working class folks have a harder time finding jobs or keeping the jobs they've got, then they're going to look to the political system and wonder why the president didn't deliver. and, to go to alesse's point, if the well off are seeing their portfolios go down by a specific percentage because of all these factors, then he begins to lose the tax cut republicans.

so any way you look at it, it's not a bright picture for him and, more important, for the people who work and the people who create wealth and the state of the nation, which is the really important thing. still ahead on "morning joe," iowa congressman steve king facing new criticism from across the political spectrum for remarks he made yesterday. even a top republican saying it is time for him to go. we'll explain his latest remarks. hmm. exactly. liberty mutual customizes your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. nice. but, uh... what's up with your... partner? not again. limu that's your reflection. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty ♪

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republican congressman steve king of iowa talked about his anti-abortion rights legislation. >> the reasons why there there are exceptions for rape and

incest. it's not the baby's fault. but there's another -- i certainly wonder about this. what if it was okay and what if it went back through all the family trees and pulled those people out that were products of rape and incest. would there be any population in the world left if we did that considering all the wars and all the rape and pillages that's taken place? i know i can't certify that i'm not a part of a product of that. >> the audio is tough on that so i'll read it for you again if you're riding in the car. congressman king talking about inset and rape exceptions in abortion. he's again those exceptions. he said, quote, what if we went back through all the family trees and pulled those people out that were products on of rape and incest. would there be any population of the world left if we did that? congressman king did not respond to the news outside the town hall yesterday. that language is considered offensive.

that led to republican leadership stripping king of his committee assignments. yesterday, the highest ranking republican woman in congress, congressman liz cheney, said king's remarks are, quote, appalling and bizarre. adding, as i've said before, it's time for him to go. the people of iowa's fourth congressional district deserve better. steve scalise called king's comments wrong and offensive and underscore why we removed him from his committees. >> earlier in this congress, there are things that steve king said that i do not believe the party of lincoln would stand for. agency a united congress, i think this continues to show why that action is taken.

al qaeda would be dancing in the streets celebrating, anti-muslim rhetoric, this is just the latest. >> and it's gone on far too long. why has this weirdo -- who even thinks that way? almost fantasizing about incest and -- i just don't -- this weirdo needs to have been gone a long time ago. >> there is a long history of

him saying this. there are certain things you never want to be heard to even be vaguely supporting. and i think everybody would agree that rape and incest are some of those things. maybe now with kevin mccarthy coming out forcefully and saying this is not okay and they've already stripped him of his committee assignments so there's not much more they can do on the sanctions side, maybe there will be some pressure on him. he was under quite a lot of pressure under the white supremacy comments earlier and he resisted those. he got his committee assignments stripped, but he didn't step down. you can feel the leadership now almost saying it's time for you to step out the door with liz cheney saying they deserve better than this. >> and we'll remind our viewers in january steve king used the -- wondered about white supremacy and white nationalists and said out loud how did that language become offensive? you heard from republicans. hear what democrats are saying yesterday.

>> you would think it would be easy to come out against rape and insist. then again, you would think it would be easy to come out against white nationalism. >> there is a terrific candidate in j.d. shutton. >> you heard j.d. shutton's name there. he's running against king for iowa's steve king. he said yet again, steve king puts his selfish hateful ideology above the needs of the people of iowa's fourth distinct. his comments are disrespectful to survivors and they don't reflect iowan values.

all calling for king to resign with both sanders and gillibrand calling king a disgrace. not sure what to say about this except that it's appalling and disgusting. but he will get a primary challenge even before he gets to j.d.schulton. >> there is one voice people would like to hear weigh in on this and that is the president. the views he has are those shared by the president. not these, but some regarding muslims and there are people who support congressman king who support president trump. he's reluctant to alienate those. i think it will be interesting

to watch the next couple of days, is there more pressure? will there be more pressure from other republicans? we've stripped him of his committees. will they lean on king to say you need to go or we could lose this seat. >> coming up on "morning joe," president trump ties his ongoing trade war with china to the unrest in hong kong. richa ri richard haas is here to weigh in on that when "morning joe" comes right back. when "morning joe" cs right back johnson & johnson is a baby company. but we're also a cancer fighting, hiv controlling, joint replacing, and depression relieving company. from the day you're born we never stop taking care of you. from the day you're born iand i don't add up the years.

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welcome back to "morning joe." beautiful picture of the white house this morning. some of the trump administration's top aides are urging the president to voice his support for hong kong's pro democracy protesters. but trump so far has refused with trade negotiations sdwron goi ongoing with china. in a tweet yesterday, president trump wrote, he is a great leader who very much has the respect of his people. he's also a good man in a, quote, tough business. i have zero doubt that if president xi wants to quickly and humanely solve the hong kong

problem, he can do it. joining us now, president of the council on foreign relations and author of the book a world in disarray, richard haas, ayman mohyeldin and dan stewart. this week's cover story "overseas" is the battle for hong kong china's collision course with democracy. richard, let me start with you and the president trump angle on all this. he has been hesitant to say anything. he calls it the hong kong fame. he said we'll see what happens. he said i hope it works out for everybody. what more should he be doing and saying right now? >> what he and wilbur ross had been saying is to give the chinese a green light to do what they need to do. when hong kong wag handed over to china, china signed an international agreement with the british and they committed to

agree to the status for 50 years. this is now an international matter in addition to human rights in addition to telling the chinese the world world is watching and if you do this, we will recalibrate our relationship with you. and that's what we ought to be telling them. >> ayman, a past president, any other president perhaps would come out forcefully and say we stand for democracy. we stand for this western society in hong kong fighting for its rights against an autocratic regime in china. the president reluctant to do that to give him a trade deal. he thought the tariffs would give him a leverage. he may be chasing something that isn't there and, in fact, step back from supporting democracy because of it. >> yeah. and i think the risk here is there's a sense of realism that sets in on the president where he knows there is only so much the u.s. can do do change the course of what is happening on the ground. we know the protesters in so many ways reflect the ideas and values that we would all kind of agree with. democracy, freedom, they don't

want to have that extra democracy which would involve these proesttests. if you come out in support of the protesters, they use that in their propaganda to say this is being fueled by america and they crack down. this is not the case with this president. the president is not making that calculation. he's not saying let's support and do it gingerly and delicately. he's abdicating america's support to this because he has other priorities with the chinese government. >> it's jonathan lamere. give us an update on what is happening on the ground in hong kong today, but more than that, in terms of china's response, where do we see that escalating and how much of a concern for them is not just what's happening in hong kong, but what could be happening in other places, whether it's taiwan or mainland china where there's expectations of that growing

middle class to have some sort of potential freedom, which they see in hong kong. >> so i'll try and unwrap that question a little bit. the protests have mainly been happening over the weekend. they've been staging mars on more or less a weekly basis. they've been quieter on the grouped. we saw last weekend a big interaction at the airport where they occupied the international airport and really struck at the heart of hong kong commerce, if you like. it's traditional role as a sort of trading place between east and west. but certainly i think building up to the protests this weekend, all eyes will be on how china is going to respond. there have been rumors now, reports, i think president trump indeed tweeted out one of those reports that there's been a military troop build up in shenzhen just on the other side of the water. hong kong, of course, has something like 10,000 soldiers stationed on hong kong island

and the hong kong government can call them in to keep the peace. but i think the sense on the ground there is that it's really an intimidation tactic at this point trying to convince the protesters to de-escalate, perhaps get some sort of pro democracy, sort of around the moderate leaders to try and negotiate a way out of this. and so it's sort of an uneasy tension i think at the moment. >> dan stewart will be reading your new reporting in time magazine. thank you very much. richard, ayman, thank you very much, as well. coming up, it was about this time yesterday markets were flashing warning signs about a tough day on wall street. and it certainly was. so what's happening out there today? we'll check in on business before the bell, next on "morning joe." before the bell, next on "morning joe." johnson & johnson is a baby company.

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christmas season just in case some of the tariffs would have an impact on u.s. customs. but so far, they've had virtually none. the only impact has been that we've collected almost $60 billion from china, compliments of china. but just in case they might have an attack on people, what we've done is we've delayed it so that they won't be relevant to the christmas shopping season. >> that's president trump earlier in the week on his decision to. new tariff owes chinese imports until after the busy holiday shopping season. still, it has not been enough to calm the markets and business which slief on uncertainty. in the last hour, china has now said it wants to meet halfway in the ongoing trade issues. joining us for business, sara mcgregor and connie otani. good morning to you both. what does it mean for china to meet halfway on a trade deal? what does a trade deal look like at this point?

>> well, a trade deal at this point would be anything that shows us that both sides are willing to come to the table and meaningfully make progress on things like intellectual property which has been a huge thorn on the u.s.'s side for quite some time. but i don't think we should be too optimistic just yet. we have seen these kinds of statements hinting at a meeting over and over and over again. just this month, we saw escalation of tariffs and a particles ka lagz of the tariffs. so i wouldn't be too confident just yet. >> the president believes tariffs is strategic. he believes it's going to bring china to the table. it hasn't done that yet. is there any evidence that china will bring tariffs to the table other than hurting their economy? is it being used correctly by the president if china is responding to that? >> there are folks in the administration who would say yes, this is us putting our foot down and drawing a hard line and that the u.s. economy is doing

better than the chinese economy. their hope is if they push harder and wait a little longer, it is going to bring china back to the negotiating table in a meaningful way. but there's a lot of anxiety rippling across markets and even the economy at the moment. there are a lot of folks who are getting a little bit impatient with these kinds of aggressive approach. >> so, sara, the market dropped 800 points yesterday, was up monday, it was down tuesday, and it tanked on wednesday. what does that tell you? what is behind that? we know germany is showing signs of recession, china manufacturing, as well. what does it say about the united states economy? >> well, i think what it really shows is that, you know, the markets go up and down. it's like a roller coaster with this trade war. one announcement of tariff reprieve, the markets go up. deterioration, the markets go down. but i think what we're seeing right now is a bit of a more stance on volatility. i think the markets are seeing past this temporary reprieve in the tariffs and saying if we look at the fundamentals right

now, germany's economy and contraction, it's export dependent. we're seeing manufacturing activity slow down in the u.s. this seems to be more of a wider term problem and i think the markets are reflecting that and that is a very worrying sign. i think the trade war has been a bit of a distraction, but this is where the rubber is hitting the road. this is where we're starting to see what everyone has warned all along that the tariffs will cause a fundamental weaker economy. >> the headline that just flashed, "new york times," germany nears recession. people are getting very concerned and have started throwing around the "r" word a lot. you said during the commercial break that we're not there yet. how important is it that the fed take action or doesn't take action this month in terms of staving off a recession? >> i think it means everything. everyone in the markets has been looking to the fed for its leadership you he, really looking for that reassurance that they're ready to step in and lower interest rates if

needed, lower them more and faster if needed, as well. and on the other hand, to take a more gradual course of action, if it does look like the u.s. economy is in a solid enough place to warrant that. so i think, you know, people will be very closely watching the fed, very much looking for reassurance that they are intending on delivering the rate cut that many people on wall street are pricing in at this moment. >> sara, it's been interpreted this past week with what we were just talking about how the president pushed pause on some of these tariffs, saving christmas while doing so, that it's sort of the idea that he blinked. what is the inventorial off r5678 here, though? what is going to be any sort of meaningful compromise and do the chinese at this point feel like they almost could just -- with the election coming up, could they wait him out and try to make the deal with whoever comes next? >> i think it's going on be very difficult for the trump administration to get the kind of deal that they want before the elections, maybe even after the elections. it's interesting today that china's words, they chose to say

they would be willing to meet the u.s. halfway. we heard from peter navarro, the white house trade adviser saying the u.s. won't meet china halfway. its wants deep economic reforms to china's economy, the removal of state subsidies. so as much as the trump administration caved to business by allowing this delay to some tariffs to save the holiday shopping season, this isn't a sign of progress. the two sides are no closer to a deal. right now, probably the trump administration's best bet would be to make sure that they're not getting a bigger hit to the economy. the uncertainty to business right now is deep. it's a head spinning uncertainty and i think that needs to be alleviated. >> connie, i got a hard time yesterday for suggesting that traders were perhaps a little exhausted at the moment and we should spare a thought for them with all this volatility in the market. but when the trump administration said it was going to postpone tariffs, that reassured markets but not for a huge amount and not for very

long. are we in a position where markets are responding to the latest tweet or comments that have come out of the white house but are factoring in deeper fundamental issues. it seems for a while as if markets were discounting geopolitical issues, but now i wonder if they're looking at something that is more fundamental rather than just the latest headline that comes out of the white house. >> sure. i mean, i think in the stock market, it does seem like we're still seeing a lot of the volatility ripple through. you know, you see a tweet and it really seems to be reflected there. but in the bond market, i think that's where you see a little bit more skepticism, a little bit more worry about the long-term economic outlook around the world baked in. because no matter what trump has tweeted or what china has said, we still continue to see the long-term slide in bond yields continue and that reflects a deeper worry. >> so in case you thought jonathan lamere was kidding about christmas before, peter

navarro, economic adviser, said on fox news yesterday that the pulling back temporarily of the tariffs on china was a, quote, christmas present to the nation from the president of the united states. but you point out that delaying the tariffs perhaps was just to get some shipments out for companies like walmart and home depot are very happy with that decision sin the short-term, anyway. >> absolutely. come september 1st, $110 billions of additional tariffs will hit. this is not a scaling back of the trade war. china said it's going to retaliate today. we don't know exactly how. it hasn't announced those measures. but you can bet it's going to hit trump where it's politically sensitive and we see farmers right front and center of that, a big support base for trump. plane manufacturers might be another target. so, you know, this is by no means. there's importers in the u.s. being hit now, exporters are about to be hit.

it's coming from all sides. no one is fooled right now into thinking that the trade war is going away. >> so, connie, if we look at a snapshot of our economy, unemployment remains low, consumer confidence remains high. we see all of these warning signs. does the president have a case to make that we're still on the right track? >> i think a lot of folks believe that if we continue on this path, if we do see a full implementation of tariffs on nearly all chinese goods, that we will see a deterioration in some stronger metrics that trump has been able to tout as successor throughout his administration. whether we're talking about the labor market or the consumer. but if we do see the tariffs continue to escalate and if we do see these tariffs ripple into consumer goods, i think that is where the concern is, that one of the strongest parts of our economy is going to get hit. >> for the rank and file investor watching the stock market, right now is probably as good as it's going to get, would

you say, because this growth period seems to certainly be coming to a close. >> i don't know if it's coming to a close yet, but it does pose a tricky question because a lot of the investors i talk to believe that the chances of a recession in 2020 have gone up in the last couple of weeks just because of the escalations that we've seen in the trade front and also the weak data that we've seen in really important global economies like germany and china. so are they pulling out? i don't think any of the folks i've spoken to are ready to call it quits on stocks. but they are feeling a little bit more cautious. >> and what you said there about a possible recession in the middle of 2020, you can imagine who is not happy to hear that, perhaps watching from his golf club in bedminster, new jersey right now. akane, thank you very much.

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animals still be euthanized every year because of over crowding. since 2015 clear the shelters has helped more than 250,000 pets find a home. joining us now to tell us more about this army veteran and co-founder of i heart dogs.com marshall morris. great to see you here. >> great to be here. thank you. >> five years ago you started a group i heart dogs. what was the inspiration? >> we wanted to give back in the world and saw all the animals in the shelters and these heroes in there every day long hours trying to find them forever homes but they needed resources so we said we're going to plug in and i used what i learned in the military to put together a team, we built a whole community around it and we found a way to start raising money for the shelters. >> how many dogs would you say you've fed in the five years? >> we just hit 15 million shelter dogs fed. >> talk about what is happening this saturday. it's an important day because hopefully a lot of sweet, deserving animals will have new

homes. >> we're excited to be part of clear the shelter with nbc. the idea is to raise awareness for these wonderful pets who need forever homes, a chance, a second chance as we call it. we want to drive a lot of people there. go and find your next best friend, your next whatever, right? they're just there waiting for a wonderful home. >> i don't have a dog. i would like a dog. most of my twitter likes are about dogs. my question, though, is you said you're an army veteran. part of what you are doing here is obviously helping animals but some of the programs help other people, veterans like yourself and the dogs are helping with ptsd? >> correct. as part of being a veteran after basic training, 9/11 happened while i was in basic training and the world changed and i actually was deployed to new york city to support the community here. a lot of my friends went overseas. they came back and came back with ptsd and it was heart breaking. they needed someone to fight for them here. three years in, we got to see what happens when you pair a veteran with a service animal. it is the closest thing to a miracle you'll ever experience.

we said we love dogs, we love veterans, let's do both. we launched a line of para cord bracelets and you buy it to help fund service animals for veterans. you can find everything whether to spoil your dog or support veterans, it's all there i heart dogs.com. >> i have a dog, a rescue dog actually oddly rescued in tunisia and i got it in virginia. had a very long journey. it's been fantastic. i was just wondering whether the number of people who are now rescuing dogs as opposed to getting bred dogs is going up in the states. i am much more aware of rescue dogs than i was a few years ago. is that something happening more and more? >> absolutely. it is incredible. in fact, i got a recent note from our page. we have 4 million people on i heart dogs facebook page that pour into us and that is all they hear. literally it's changing, the tides are changing. we're raley excited about that. absolutely seeing a huge amount of people willing to go in and

adopt a dog versus buying one for sure. >> i read some of the statistics in the lead-in. definitely more awareness. we all see it in our lives. there are still way too many dogs euthanized because there is just no room in the shelters. >> exactly. we have a program called second chance where we drive, fly, boat, anything we can do to get them out of kill shelters to no kill shelters. if you shop on i heart dogs.com you come alongside us to do those things. we want the dogs into homes. they deserve it. they make great companions. >> i elise has an announcement. >> yeah. i'm just going to announce to my husband that i am going to clear the shelter and bring one home. >> all right. >> no, i really can't do that this weekend because, unfortunately, unfortunately i have a pure bred corgie who is not so nice and i love him to death. he's sweet but sometimes he can be a little territorial. my point being, obviously i love the dog so much. the best dog i've ever had my entire life.

i got from humane society event in front of the local walmart, spot, a very creative name i gave the dog as a first grader. wonderful pets. i just want to do a pitch for mixed breeds are the sweetest personalities. >> yes. >> the american shelter dog is what we call it. that's the breed. >> marshall, what do you get out of being with a dog, you, personally? >> it just reminds me there is still a place in this world, just the relationship of unconditional love with animals and dogs especially but it changes lives. we're in a world in a tough spot, right? things are, can be heated or escalated and when you just sit with an animal like that that loves you unconditionally, there is nothing like it. i feel like it enriches our lives in a powerful way. they are the closest thing to angels on earth. >> well said. you're doing such a great job. marshall morris, thank you very much. the fifth annual clear the shelters day again is this saturday. nationwide. you can visit clear the shelters.com for more

information. the annual event has put 250,000 animals over the years into new homes and we hope there are many more this saturday. thanks so much for being here. we'll book elise for next year. >> yes. >> thank you. thank you for your awesome work. people who do, you know, so much for animals like you and it might -- it is so rewarding and just so important and they bring -- they give so much to us. thank you. >> thank you. we see ourselves as a conduit and our customers as heroes. we get to work in the trenches and we love it. we're thankful for everyone. >> doing a great job. >> thank you. >> we have time for final thoughts, jonathan lamire speak eg of animals everyone loves the president of the united states retweeting for reasons that remain unclear but you don't really need a good reason to show adorable elephants frolicking together. >> the president is finally bringing the country together. he is on a bit after retweet on his golf course in new jersey. you can see it. this included a mama elephant helping her baby. the president of the united states retweeted that for

reasons unknown among the others he also promoted a show from his supporters, diamonds and silk in billings, montana, so get your tickets now. as a quick, serious note, he will be in new hampshire tonight at a rally and there is some talk he may endorse cory lewandowski his former campaign manager for the senate seat. >> is cory really going to run for senate? >> he has not committed yet. a lot of drive for people to want him to run and certainly trump world would like him to run. >> i am going to hope the kind, sweet animal elephant retweet means that donald trump is going to embrace animal welfare causes and use his presidency the remainder of his presidency to help animals. >> he is the first president in decades, though, to not have a dog. >> i swear i think a dog would make the white house a lot better place. >> final thoughts to you? >> i am loving elise's optimism this morning. it was world elephant day on

monday but who needs an excuse for a random animal story with a cute baby elephant. i think that's all it was about. >> thank you very much. thank you all very much. marshall, thank you. this was great. that does it for us this morning. stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now. thanks much. hi there. i am stephanie ruhle. it is thursday, august 15th. here's what's happening. is your money safe? important question. investors and average citizens alike are nervously watching wall street after the dow plunged 800 points yesterday, the worst day of the year, and the white house is worried, too. on wednesday president trump lashed out at fed chairman jay powell, again on twitter, basically blaming him for the market meltdown. but many economists and even the wall street journal editorial page talking rupert murdoch said the real problem is not the fed but the president's import taxes. that is what the tariffs are. this trade war. peter alexander is outside of the president's golf club in my