hurricane dorian which is national weather service calls an extremely dangerous hurricane. last night it was upgraded to a powerful category 4 packing winds of up to 145 miles per hour. the national hurricane center says it's expected to impact the bahamas tomorrow. then head towards the southeast united states. forecasters are watching to see if the path runs along florida's coastline or moves more inland. right now there's a chance that florida will actually avoid a direct hit but that is not for certain. officials warn residents along the coast of georgia and south carolina should also be on alert. people are boarding up their homes and stocking up on supplies because the storm could bring in heavy flooding. we'll be monitoring the latest forecast and updating you as they develop through the show. we begin with politics. i want to take you back to

donald trump's new year's eve gala at his for profit march la go resort in 2017. >> it's going to be a fantastic 2018. we're off to a very good start as you know with the great tax cuts and getting rid of the individual man date which was very, very unpopular as you know, but we're going to have a tremendous year. the stock market i think is going to continue to go up, companies are going to continue to come in to the country and they're doing it now soon to be a record clip. so we look forward to seeing you inside. come on along. >> enjiing the fireworks that were launched from the scene of an even more exclusive party nearby. paid for by billionaire oil barren david koch who passed away last week. the party was held at the flagler museum, a 75-room

mansion that was built by one of the the founders of standard oil for his third wife. he was the business partner of john d. rockefeller. he continues quote, we are living through another guilded age with growing inequality and a government that is once again tipping the scales in favor of the rich at the expense of the little guy. the piece reminds us that trump had boasted to members of mar-a-lago just days before saying you all just got a lot witcher according to cbs. trump reportedly said that a few hours after signing into a law a huge tax cut, the bulk of which would line the pockets of various millionaires and billionaires who make up his gloe gold plated cabinet. >> the bottom line is this is the biggest tax cuts and reform

in the history f oour country. everything in here is really tremendous things for businesses, for people for the middle class, for workers. >> trump made that claim even though the tax bill will add more than 1 trillion with a t dollars to the national debt while mass you haveively benefi 1%. people like the coch brothers. they came around not just because of the huge tax cut, the vast majority of which went to the rich and to huge corn rations while the little guy that trump supposedly ran to champion paid the bill with tinier tax refunds this year. they came after trump but certainly in their pocketbooks because of huge rollbacks in regulations and the boost in federal welfare for industries like oil and coal. trump's administration is handing out millions of acres of

pristi pristine federal land in places like the gulf and alaska and even national parkland for drilling and strip mining. climate change be damned. while stripping away protections for our air and water and for miners and small farmers too while killing their businesses with tariffs. so welcome to trump's america for billionaires an era defined by the president trump being openly in cahoots with big oil. just this week, waivers to oil refineries so they don't have to blend ethanol into their gasoline hurting the very farmers who voted for him. also the trump administration plans to roll back more obama air policy, a particular obsession of theirs, this time by slashing restrictions on the oil and gas industry for methane admissions. i's all part of the plan to deregulate the government and the environment allowing trump

to line the pockets of the rich at the expense of the rest of us. >> your book, david, is perfect for this moment because donald trump ran and the myth among many in the media is that he won because of the little guy, the scrappy little white working class guy who was so desperate in economic shape. but we now know the voters were more affluent and that his administration has really incredibly benefitted the super rich. >> well, remember when donald announced he said there would be a new tax system in this country and a married couple wouldn't pay taxes on the first $50,000 they made. by the time the trump gop tax law was enacted he barely changed the notch at all and for many middle class and upper middle class people their taxes went up when you look at their state and federal together. it was a con job from day one.

this was -- donald with us also going to be the candidate of the rich by the rich for the rich and on this interesting point you had at the end of your opening about methane which is about 25 times more damaging to the planet in terms of rising temperatures than emissions from tail pipes from co 2, if you think our problem is the planet isn't warm enough, this is the greatest policy in american history. >> it's interesting to me the extent to which the con. i call it the longest con in america history in the book i just wrote about trump that so much of the con is in favor of oil and coal. not only one of the biggest coal barons now, his wife, they've gotten tons but oil and strip mining and those kind of issues really benefitted. donald trump rescinded 1.9 million acres of protected land out west in utah. this is pristine beautiful land

that they're now handing over for mining and strip mining and oil drilling. in alaska they're doing the same thing, allowing forests that are critical to protecting our air to be burned down and allowing more oil drilling. i mean, is it -- is it mainly an oil and gas industry basically what donald trump is running? >> well, donald has no understanding of these issues about the environment. this is a guy who thinks dropping a nuclear bomb into a hurricane would stop it when the hurricane is producing more power than a nuclear bomb every half an hour or so. it would just spew radio active material everywhere. donald is backward looking in everything he does. you can say it's a good thing we learned how to mine coal, it got us in part to where we are today but donald doesn't see it that way. he looks back with his whole make america white again campaign to a mythical 1950s.

everything about donald is backward looking without any vision and without any deep philosophical understanding of issues either. >> and i mean, even big oil, even some of the big oil companies came out against this methane policy and they were like wait, whoa, this is bad marketing. we've been trying to say our fracking is making the air cleaner. so big oil realizes this is a dumb thing to announce you want to do. >> and they've invested a lot of money to reduce emissions because it creates problems with them with the southern california air quality board and with local governments near with their refineries are. where as the smaller operations, they don't care if they waste a lot of stuff because they're making a lot of money. this is moving toward self-reporting and we know from very smart work done that these

companies when they're self-reporting are underreporting by as much as a factor of 100. >> wow. >> and you know, the thing that is sort of remarkable is the disconnect between the favors that donald trump keeps doing particularly for oil and coal. that they just get whatever they want even if farmers get, you know, screwed in the process because they don't have to put their corn product in, but that the workers and the small farmers get hurt the most. these are his most fervent supporters. when it comes to coal and these workers, chris hayes has done town halls and they want to be back in the coal mine even though they're going to die in the process, they want their jobs. coal workers now, this is a piece of nbc news this week. they're fighting now for their benefits as the industry struggles under trump. coal workers have been under the strongest supports but their pensions remain at risk and mitch mcconnell isn't helping get their pensions right. they don't care if these workers don't get pensions, if they

don't get pension care. if they take obamacare from them. why don't these guys notice these guys are only helping their bosses and not them? >> well, because you know, there's a closs of people in america you and i where we think of ourselves as citizens. a lot of people who perfectly reasonable don't define themselves that way, they don't pay close attention and all of these regulations that are designed to protect pensions even though in many cases they don't, to protect the environment which we've done generally better on until trump, those are designed not to be understood by mere mortals. they involve subtle issues that require a lot of deep knowledge to appreciate and donald trump is not part of the citizen classification in america. he is someone who thinks about himself entirely in terms of money and addlation. >> is donald trump -- when he came into the presidency there was a lot of doubt including in the research that i did in

determining how rich he really was. obviously he's getting richer being president. you've covered him for a lot of time. when he says he loves the farmers and coal workers and love the people who are his base when the rich is really his base, does he have emotional attachment at all? >> donald is about donald. if push comes to shove don add will throw one of his children under the bus if he needs. to his relationships are transactional. he loved general mathis until he didn't. anybody that thinks donald cares about him has not paid attention to who the man is. >> just really quickly, steel plants are still closing. did donald trump ever use a

steel building. >> chinese steel and tried to hide that one. he built one of his projects and it's classic donald. say one thing and do another. the rules are for you, they're not for me. if you're dumb enough i'll sell you the brooklyn bridge. >> thank you very much for help us unpack. really appreciate you. >> up next, trump's most devoted supporters are feeling the economic pain from his policies. why some farm ers and miners are finally getting fed up. that story is next. every day, visionaries are creating the future. so, every day, we put our latest technology and unrivaled network to work. the united states postal service makes more e-commerce deliveries to homes than anyone else in the country.

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president trump is some of the rhetoric, farmers are starting to do great again, we're not starting to do great again. things going downhill and downhill very quickly. >> a majority of farmers voted for donald trump in 2016 only to see their businesses hit hard by trump's trade war with china. now trump policies are targeting farmers again. the administration issued waivers to dozens of oil refineries allowing them to stop blending ethanol into their fuel. with roughly 40% of the u.s. corn crop turned into ethanol the market for corn just got a lot smaller forcing farmers to grapple with lost revenue along with dramatically lower imports. but yet the president is claiming that the new policy is

great, fabulous, great for everybody. joining me is a business consultant. >> the stories are pretty horrib horrible. the farm recession is already here with falling incomes, rising delinquency rates and surging bankruptcies and the farm economy's troubles stem directly from trump's policies. there is a forbes story that talks about farm's suicides and bankruptryes are up. bankruptcies and suicides are up. >> so we're unfortunately we have to sell out all of our cows so we -- our barn holds 55 cows, but -- i'm sorry. >> reporter: and the tears. >> sorry about that. so that was a dairy farmer crying in a minnesota fair and here is donald trump's secretary

of agriculture and the way that he talks about farmers making fun of their challenges. here is sonny purdue. >> what do you call two farmers in a basement? i said i don't know. he said a whine cellar. >> so you hear the laughter turning to boos so we have the farm recession is here. we have tears and people losing and having to sell all their cows. we have china basically zeroing out at imports, corn getting hit hard too. we have this change that help oil companies and hurts farmers and we have mockery. the trump administration mocking marmers. so have we reached a point where folks are waking up and they're saying this guy isn't for me, doesn't care about me? >> yeah and let's also not

forget that trump is also allowing big oil to use eminent domain to take farmland and ranch land all throughout the midwest in order to build pipelines so farmers and ranchers are getting hit left and right. and you are definitely feeling the anger and the frustration coming up to the surface. the nebraska corn board for example just yesterday issued a scathing press release not only against president trump but the entire republican party because they start to see that their policies are hurting them. but the reality is, for democrats, we can't just rely on them being angry and frustrated and seeing the light that the republican party always chooses big oil and big business over family farmers or ranchers we have to put a megaphone up to their issues. we have to keep on putting p policies. was we need to do that more and more and more. >> and because the challenge is, people don't always vote their pocketbook. as a matter of fact, most people don't. i say this all the time. i don't vote my economic

interest. i live in new york but my tax rate is like 40 cents of every dollar is going to taxes. lot and lots of taxes and i'm choosing to live in a high tax state. we don't vote our economic interest so i don't know why we presume people on the other side of the aisle will. >> i want to point out a recent survey of 1,150 farmers that was done from july 21st to august 3rd by farm futures and it found that support for trump has actually gone up 67% of farmers as of now, as of that survey say they will back donald trump for re-election. >> this is after the tariffs, avenue the bankruptcies. >> this is up from 60% which is the number once china introduced the tariffs on soybeans. now we're up to 67%. when you dig deeper into that survey a lot of them talk about the fact they support trump's other policies. >> the border. >> and one of the things that

they talk about is the wall. >> immigration. yeah. >> so the things that he's doing on immigration front, all of these issues to your point, to what you just made they're voting based on some of these other issues and they spoke about the fact they don't agree with what democrats' vision is for the future. >> so basically they're going to vote race over their own pocketbooks. race is a powerful motivator. >> it is a powerful thing and 67% means if there are 33% who are not backing trump for re-election, we need to make sure the democratic party needs to make sure that that 30% shows up and votes democratic. it's one thing to say you're not backing trump. it's another thing to show up and mark the box for the democratic candidate. so i do think it still remains important for democrats to expose donald trump on these policies, on these lies, on these things because you still

need those folks to show up because those are people who are -- if they're not backing him they're willing to vote for you. >> and every vote counts. >> and you know, i have said many, many times i don't believe in conversion. it's like trying to convert someone out of their religion and if you're a trumpist you're a trumpist. because as you just heard people will lose their farm, be going into bankruptcy because they want the wall, they want the brown people out. it doesn't matter what's happening personally just like him. so you are the democratic chair in a red state. how do you go in and talk the 33%. we're leaving that 67% alone. they're going to lose their farms, you don't want democratic policies but the 33%, what do you say to them to get them to not stay home and to get them to come out and vote for a democrat? how do you talk to them? >> there are lots of other polls out there that show farmers support from trump went from 80 to 70% but the reality of that we need that at 60% in order to

close that gap so we can build up the margins but the way that i do it and the way i know a lot of other chairs in red states do it. we're honest with voters. we say that look, we are going to disagree on abortion, on guns and maybe immigration although not so much on immigration because the reality is a lot of farmers and ranchers rely on immigrant labor. so we talk about the reality that the big corporations are the ones that are getting the extra perks from donald trump and yet the workers are the ones that get all the penalties and the then farmers and ranchers don't have the work for the fields because they're being deported. so i'm always honest with voters. i say listen, we will disagree but the republican party has used these for dekatcades to ke us divided. so a lot of them did vote with obama so there is an opening

there. we have to show up, we have to invest real money and real organizing. >> is there a candidate that are left that is doing that. >> i've asked this question. nope, i'm neutralized chair. i was in nebraska and the candidates that they wanted to talk about were senator warren, mayor pete, cory booker and kamala harris. so it is very interesting and they talked about all the different reasons of why and they clearly are frustrated with trump. >> there's a -- even the subsidies that trump gave out, base think the payout, the welfare checks he's handing out to farmers. most of those go to huge corporations. why are democrats running ads on that? more than half of the farm bailouts went to 1/10th of the recipient of the study. the top 1% of farmers, meaning

the giants were paid an average of 183,000 while the bottom 80% averaged less than 5,000 so he's paying off big business when it comes to farms. >> i will add to that. the citrus farmers in florida still haven't received the aide that they were promised from hurricane irma last year. many of them have taken out loans, lines of credit and spent that money expecting to receive that payment. they have not. and now they're in the eye of another hurricane potentially. so that's another important issue that democrats need to talk about. that's why i think to jane's point, i think that for the people that are not backing trump, the farmers that we know aren't backing trump based on data, right? when you expose trump you're also exposing him to those people who are backing trump so it still is a helpful thing. you use that as a turnout for those people who you know you can possibly count on and have a strong indicator, you still are helping and i do think one thing to jane's point when it comes to

local races and local is important. a lot of what has happened in terms of gerrymandering is because we don't control these state legislatures. i think we have more of an opportunity on conversion at the federal level. >> we love this girl panel. always great to talk to you. we will bring you back as well. up next, the latest on hurricane dorian as the monster storm churns toward florida. ♪ limu emu & doug hour 36 in the stakeout. as soon as the homeowners arrive, we'll inform them that liberty mutual customizes home insurance, so they'll only pay for what they need. your turn to keep watch, limu. wake me up if you see anything. [ snoring ]

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dorian is now a category 4 hurricane slowly barrelling to the bahamas and florida. we go to michelle grossman. tell us the latest. >> well, this is like the little engine that could. every single update it has defied odds. it is now a category 4 storm. started out last monday as a tropical storm. but it continues to strengthen. we do have changes as of the latest advisory. it is a powerful storm. you can tell just by that eye right there. those blossoming thunderstorms and we are looking at the location at 445 miles east of west palm beach. it's moving fairly quickly.

no not as quick as it was. so winds again 145 miles per hour, gusting higher than that, moving to the west at 12 miles per hour but we are going to see it turn on the brakes as it gets closer to the bahamas is not good news. we're looking at life threatening storm surges and also heavy rainfall. category 4 storm in those very warm waters of the atlantic. that is a fuel that helps you go faster and stronger and that is what's happening right now. by sunday we're going to see it moving towards the bahamas. that will be the worst day for the bahamas. we are looking at the we're going to see destructive and damaging winds, winds gusting over 140 miles per hour. if you have not made plans in the bahamas right now you need to do so because it will be over top of you by sunday. look what happened with the latest anticipated that to

come right on land but we have this high pressure in place that's really turning it. so hurricanes don't really have a steering mechanism. they don't have a wheel per selike a car. it needs other things to steer it so it's going to turn it to the right. things could change. we're still four to five days out, but now along the coast of florida you still want to be prepared but now we're including parts of georgia and even into south carolina. we could see a landfall by early next week in hilton head, south carolina, so charleston, myrtle beach, even up to wilmington you need to be on alert. your next advisory comes out at 11:00 so we'll keep you up to date with that. >> everybody be safe. thank you very much. and coming up, johnson & johnson ordered to pay almost $6 million. we will discuss addiction and responsibility next.

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>> the promise was a wall paid for by mexico. >> i've got to tell you it's fascinati fascinating. >> your entire business is profiting off of other people's information your job is to keep that information safe. judge has affirmed our position that johnson & johnson motivated by greed is responsible for the opioid epidemic in our state. johnson & johnson will finally be held accountable for thousands of deaths and addiction caused by their activities. >> drug company johnson & johnson was ordered this week to pay $572 million to the state of

oklahoma for its role in the state's opioid addiction crisis. oklahoma judge said that johnson & johnson fuelled the epidemic by marketing opioids as having limiting risk of addiction. but oklahoma is just the start. more than 2,000 similar lawsuits have been filed seeking to hold drug makers and pharmacies accountable for widespread opioid abuse. the johnson & johnson case was the first to go to trial. thank you very much for being here, doc. let's talk about this. >> good morning. >> good morning. so from 1999 to 2017, per the stats in front of me almost 218,000 people died from overdoses related to prescription opioids. in 2017, about 50 opioid prekrippr prescriptions were written for americans. this is seen as almost like drug

dealing. right? >> right. so this is the deal. it's bad policy, bad education and bad regulation. that's what you need to take away from this, because the states could have done something, the feds could have done something when they saw all these prescriptions and they all know how they're logged in when think come into the united states. the insurance companies could have done something when they knew they were writing all these prescriptions and they were funding them but they didn't want to fund the opioids that weren't so addictive. the medical schools could have done something because you were educating people like me we were undertreating pain, but you also have to think about the state government who saw it and didn't do anything about it. and then last but not least, the pharma companies. they knew, but at the same time, do we stop selling cars to people if we're toyota because people get duis and they still

have a state license? can we stop selling cars? so everybody has a problem with this, but everybody plays a part in it so johnson & johnson is getting theirs, tiva is getting theirs. purdue pharma, they're getting theirs, but it's all legal drug dealing and everybody has a price to pay. >> let me give you the response from the johnson & johnson lawyer. this is what he said in response to this lawsuit which they are going to appeal. take a listen. >> these medications that the company manufactured are for people who suffer from chronic debilitating pain. and the way in which the company manufactured these medications and mark ted them to doctors was extremely responsible. there are warnings on these medications, fda approved warnings. it is up to the doctor with their patients to make decisions about who is appropriate for these medications. >> i feel like i was just

attempting to be hypnotized. let me read you what the wall street journal said. they call this is a stickup. the ruling could have had had for larger and more dangerous consequenc consequences. johnson & johnson's opioids which includes a fentanyl patch and crush resistant pill. the food and drug administration approved the drug and they're still legal. patients may only obtain the prescriptions through government licensed pharmacy. everybody was involved in this and profits were being made. how dare you come after profit. that seems to be their answer. >> i agree with what that lady said. because the reality is when you get a medical license it is up to you and when you allow a pharmaceutical company to come in and tell you how to practice medicine that's a weak doctor and i don't want that doctor in my profession, but at the same

time they knew what they were doing but it's not just their fault. it is everybody's fault and so to pin them with this kind of lawsuit and to make them pay almost $600 million that's a lot when the other companies and the other entities are paying nothing and i think that's wildly unfair but we all have to do something about this because the opioid problem is not going anywhere and it's getting worse and people say it's not getting worse, i think it is, because people are in more despair right now and they take opioid to get away. don't get me started talking about sickle cell disease and how hundreds of thousands of people that are black are taking these opioids and that's the only time black people get prescribed those opioids. >> mainly it's a majority white issue because to your very point here's an april 2016 study of

how black patients are treated for pain. how many believed in accurately in a fantastical differences about the two races. black people's blood coog rates more quickly. and black patients' pain is lower than white people. but black people aren't getting opioi opioids. that's why they're not addicted to them as much. >> we've got to take a whole segment for this. the issue is white doctors have thought that black people have a high tall rans for pain, so black people in the streets are not dying from opioid overdose. they're getting it from stolen opioids that were prescribed to white people, that's really the bigger part and by and large, they are getting the statistics a little bit skewed because fentanyl is being brought on the black market, being sold on the streets and taken in that way. also heroin overdose is being con flated to say that's also opioid overdose which it is but it's from a very different place and with a disease like sickle

cell disease which is 100% preventable in america, we have 100,000 people that take it and opioids are prescribed and you have children addicted to morphine because of this, that's my whole new thing too. everybody in america has a test that says whether they are sickle cell trait positive or not and nobody's doing anything about it and we've got kids addicted to morphine because of that. that's a whole other issue. i know i'm going crazy over here but i got to get this stuff done, joy, because it's not fair to the african american population to be lumped in that opioid epidemic when we're getting it in a whole different way. >> absolutely. and let me just amen anybody who -- please google and look up the show he did this week when he talked about the fact that when it was crack epidemic it was lock everybody up and throw away the key. when it's opioid, it's like compassion, lawsuits.

>> all of the words used for crack epidemic, opioid 'em demiic. we let women go home with their babies when it was opioid epidemic but when it's crack we take baby from their mothers and send them to prison. >> just keeping it real. >> keeping it real. >> thank you very much, sir. have a wonderful weekend. more after the break. rted cours♪ ♪ each careful step ♪ along the byway ♪ much more ♪ much more than this ♪ i did it my way (announcer) verizon is america's most awarded network and the only one with the galaxy note10 5g. right now, when you buy one, you get a galaxy note10 free. that's verizon.

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and we are usaa members for life. get your auto insurance quote today. coming up, just when you thought the trump administration's immigration policies could not get any worse, there are signs of cruelty, this time affecting get this, i immigrants seeking life threatening medical treatment. >> and hurricane dorian taking a turn. more a.m. joy after the break. [ applause ] thank you.

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there has been this pronouncement from the trump administration to isabel and her family to get out and get out now. the trump administration's plan, in other words, is to kill this woman. we are talking about hurricane dorian as it heads to florida and the bahamas. we'll have a live look at the path of this storm in a few minutes. that from rachel maddow kind of stopped the clock, because this week the president's immigration policies got even more intense. as you read, the trump administration is now ordering immigrant children and adults who are receiving medical care in the united states to leave, ending the program that has granted them legal status to be here. they're giving the patients and their families just 33 days to get out, to leave on their own or get deported.

y leaving the country and leaving the treatment they are receiving means in some cases those patients will die. isabel russo was invited to the united states from guatemala for a rare drug trial that saved her life. she graduated from college, winning awards for advocacy for people with rare disorders. this week isabel russo undergoes treatment that she can't get in guatemala. her doctors say without that treatment, it may only be a matter of months before she dies. >> at this point, my position would be if she stops enzyme, she'll rapidly move into that category of disease level, and whether it's months or one to two years, you're really handing her a death sentence.

>> every year about a thousand immigrant families like maria come to the u.s. to get medical treatment they can't get in their own countries. the trump administration has pulled the rug out from maria and other immigrants like her. their plan is to get rid of these immigrants even if it kills them. maria inahosa of the group, and all of you, thank you for being here. let me read the quote from maria herself. i have been feeling super scared and overwhelmed. the treatment that i receive keeps me alive. another one, i feel like i'm

signing my son's death warrant. we get that the cruelty is the point, that the trump administration wants to scare immigrants from around the world from wanting to come here, but this is taking that horrific cruelty to a new level. how is it that republicans are okay with this? >> it's an interesting dilemma for the president. i don't understand why he does not go into the details on some of these issues -- >> does he go into the details on anything? >> that's a good question. when you get into someone like steven miller, who i know well, going into details of these things, you get instances like this. the idea that trump can take immigration, border security, creating an american aristocracy system, and then you get people who are here. that is very bipartisan. before you had people like

miller and everyone else going on, you get something where you can have immigration with democrats on the debate stage saying they don't want to have deportation, they want to give immigrants health care, undocument, but the president could have an issue he could be winning on and lose it. >> you know him, steve miller. what's wrong with him? >> i've had minimal contact with him. >> you said you know him. >> i've known him for years. i don't want to pretend i'm a confidant of his, but from everything i hear when i see instances like this -- remember, i'm somebody that wants the border secure, i want to have less undereducated people come into the country, i want americans to have jobs. i don't want schools to be filled. i want our american citizens to be able to get educated. but when i hear incidences like this, i'm not here to defend this. this is not something i believe -- this is something i believe. i'm not going to sit here and

defend something like this. >> i will say donald trump's great-grandfather came to the country poor, speaking nothing but german and went into pimping because he couldn't do well finding gold and oil. there are a lot of immigrants who came to this country poor who came from europe, who came from ireland to escape the potato famine who were poor, came from italy who were poor. >> they didn't have masters degrees. >> it's changed since then. >> how? >> we've had our manufacturing diluted -- >> that's not because of immigration. >> we've had outsourcing of jobs. >> what does immigration have to do with manufacturing? >> if we have people who are underemployed, if we have people who aren't highly educated -- >> wait a minute, you're saying -- hold on, one question. do you think that the american economy has been growing factually over the last, let's

just say, eight years? >> do i think it's been growing? sure. great. do you know how many undocumented immigrants have been here during that time? >> they say 12 million. i would say more. in the 20s. >> you just disproved your own theory. >> i don't think i did. >> let me get terry in here real quick. you run a business in addition to being a political marketing consultant. what sam is saying is what i think a lot of republicans believe, that undocumented immigration is kaucausing -- an the steel worker and coal miner who is out of a job is because immigrants are coming from south america and all parts of the country. one does not seem to have one thing to do with another, but they think it does. >> i want to make a point. i do run a business. some of my biggest clients are women who came to this country from the continent of africa, from ethiopia, from liberia.

one of my clients is one that is the second largest employer in the township of urbanton. she is a refugee who fled the civil war in her country, went to sierra leone, went to a refugee camp, came to this country at a second grade education level and was placed in the second grade. sti she was placed in the seventh grade and still graduated at the top of her class. immigrants are more likely to start businesses in this country, less likely to commit crimes in this country and have added to the value of this country. i am a personal beneficiary of the fact of the hard-working immigrants who come from other countries with nothing and had built amazing businesses and then retained my firm and retained other firms in this country and have hired hundreds of people alone with nothing and second grade education levels coming into the seventh grade. one of my clients graduated from

harvard magna cum laude from ethiopia. it's about the facts and democrats need to get these facts out there. >> i want to come to everybody, and i haven't gotten to donna yet. the irony that's happening is you have this spectacular cruelty of people who will die if they're thrown out of the united states. >> oh, it's not ironic. >> well, the cruelty is the point, as we know. it's intended to terrify people into not coming. who is being terrified is the question here. what you're seeing is the people who are desperate and who are fleeing from guatemala and from places that are war torn where they're desperate are still coming. but you know who is not coming? tourists. united states tourism is going down. it's hurting the united states economy. college students, those who are being denied like the young man from harvard who was told he can't come. so you have a brain drain. so if the idea is that you want the higher educated -- they're

the ones saying, oh, my god, i want nothing to do with the united states because of this. >> i guess the irony here is the real person they're trying to scare is the trump voter into being terrified that my job is being outsourced, not because of my boss but because of the guys sitting outside home depot looking for work. we had the occasion where 600 undocumented immigrants were arrested, and if they wanted undocumented immigration to end, they would start arresting the people who do the hiring. there is no wall big enough to hide the "help wanted" sign along our border. i no longer call them illegal immigrants or undocumented immigrants, i call them christian refugees. that's what they are, their christians at our border fleeing

the drug war. and the president who has had no teachings of christ whatsoever, it's the deportation of cancer. it's showing the base that we're cracking down and we're not going to have minorities be the population. >> there was fear of that, fear of white americans being the minority. poor people don't vote. so the poor white people who did vote voted for hillary clinton. i want to talk to you briefly because you've been covering this in politics for a long time. this pop eeye's chicken thing ts week that was a big phenomenon covered up something underneath that. people love fast food but they

don't think about where the chicken comes from. we have a huge raid in mississippi of plants that supply the chicken that supply t -- to a lot of the fast food restaurants. but the chicken comes through the work of undocumented labor. they're not taking jobs from coal miners, they're making your chicken. you want your chicken but you don't want them. >> it's important that people start making these connections, because what we're basically looking at is the dehumanization of an entire population. that's what allows people to say do whatever, deport sick people who care, it doesn't matter, they're he wi they're illegal. >> that's why they're illegals. >> that's why we say never call them illegal. they may have committed a crime or a misdemeanor by crossing the border, but that's not like your illegal bike rider or cab driver. so the point is that making the connections between these

things, if you dehumanize an entire population and then you allow these things to happen, and then you don't care. you're like, what does it matter? you're bringing to a people's personal interest, what, you can't get your popeye's because there is a long line and it comes to what you were talking about, john, the fact that these people were deported. here's the thing. these cruel things, i get a lot of attacks when i talk about obama. i'm going to set president obama aside. these specific kinds of cruelty happening to immigrants, whether it's the deportation of sick people, that is definitely trump. but the story we saw about denying women or teenagers pads when they're menstruating in detention facilities. in 2011, we were talking about maggots in the food,

overmedicating people, rape, sexual assault, beatings, being put in the icebox, no pads, no sun, no water. >> this is the dhs facilities? >> yesment but this actually started this kind of like the subtle torture was actually under george w. bush. solidly under his period of time. so to come back to the republican party, it's like, what's up with the republican party that somehow they were okay with unleashing this against undocumented immigrants. and so many of us were just like, oh, they're like illegal. so they don't get sunlight. now we're at a crisis point and this is why we have to begin to make these connections because we are at a crisis point. >> i want to talk to you about that, too, sam, because you're the only republican at the table.

the people who can't wrap their heads around this is the people who claim to be christians, the sick kids were here under a legal program. they did nothing to break the law at all, not even a misdemeanor. they are here at the behest of the federal government. they were brought here to do clinical trials which actually help all americans because the clinical trial proves the drugs work, in the case of this young woman who may die, maria isabel russo. i don't know how trump voters can sleep at night knowing breastfeeding babies are being taken from their moms, little kids are being sent home to die. why are people okay with that? can you explain it? >> once again, the reasons are

terrible -- >> did they think they're terrible? >> it's one of the reasons why i don't believe in trump's prospects. i don't think today he would get reelected. i think all americans agree we want a safe border, we want a border that we want the rule of law. at the same time we have people here, and the problem then becomes treatment issues. there becomes a disconnect when they will hear joy reid on msnbc and they'll say joy reid doesn't care about the border. >> they would dismiss it. >> they would dismiss anything like that that is said. now, the president did not get credit. when he tried to do a comprehensive deal, he went against his political policies, he went against what he promised and he said, i'm

daca, but in exchange for daca, i want to do this. >> he took daca away. >> no, he said i will do daca in exchange if we do certain changes -- >> you mean i will not destroy daca if you do certain things. >> let's put the facts on the table. donald trump had ended daca and he said he would restore it in exchange for dramatically reducing illegal immigration. >> he ended barack obama's executive action. that's what he ended. they never had an executive action before obama. >> that's what daca is, obama's action. >> it was an immigration action. >> but that was daca. >> he said he wanted to make a deal with congress in exchange for certain other issues, such as ending family -- >> chain migration. >> -- family chain migration. >> i want to shift over and talk about the democrats. on that particular deal that donald trump said he would

restore daca in exchange -- >> he got a lot of criticism on the right. >> right, because they don't want daca, but the deal democrats were willing to make in exchange, they at least weren't talking about, was building this ridiculous idea of a wall. the rio grande is a wall, okay, you can't build a wall on the southern border. but also the idea you would discuss ending -- the only reason i'm here is chain migration. both my parents were immigrants. if chain migration means my cousins, all my family wouldn't be here. so they're saying get rid of that, get rid of everything that brings the families in because they don't want the brown folks. but democrats don't discuss that. why? >> i think democrats need to be better on the immigration issues in terms of communicating. candidates have gotten better, i want to make that point, too, and we have to be consistent with the messaging around

immigration because there is a lot of misinformation out there, and if you hear some of the misinformation and you don't have the proper context, the proper pushback, the repetitive pushback that's needed around these issues, then even people who may not be republican can fall into a trap of believing something to be untrue. so i think there needs to be a better strategy from the democratic party in terms of combatting all this misinformation that's out there, and it is voluminous. and the one person who i have heard -- i've heard a few people articulate very properly, even this talking point, that democrats don't want any kind of border security. it's false. democrats have voted over and over again for increasing border security, right? >> ronald reagan. >> yes. and you can have a safe and secure border, right, for the most part, along with having a

humane immigration policy. so i think the democrats do need to do a better job around that. >> you said the important word is nuance, and we don't do nuance in politics. that is the reality. on immigration we don't do nuance. can somebody on the debate stage in a couple weeks say, i want border security. >> respectfully, they've all said it, saying to candidates who wants to give health care to illegal immigrants? well, if you had said, who wants to let illegal immigrants die in the streets, you might have had a different answer. >> what have the most violent, horrific things that this country has lived through over the last two or three years has been? it has not been immigrants coming in. this whole notion that we have to have the border in order to have security, i'm sorry, is not true. it is not true. we don't need that. >> immigrants, both undocumented and illegal immigrants, commit

crimes at a lower rate than people born here for one reason, fear of deportation. and if they really cared about stopping border crossings, they would start inkars natucarcerai nice business owners who hire them. they don't. the "help wanted" sign will always be on our border. >> why do the chamber of commerce republicans -- they don't want you verified. >> you have to investigate donald trump. we're out of time. because donald trump is one of the employers of the rich people, and the rich people want to do what they want. this is a great discussion. thank you for being here. we're just going to keep reforming our same panels here. tara and maria will be back later. john and sam, come back often. we appreciate having you here. the dorian forecast is next. devices are like doorways

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category 4 hurricane dorian is moving to florida and the united states at 50 miles an hour. for more we go to meteorologist michelle grossman. okay, meteorologist, give us the latest. >> we just got an update a few minutes ago, and we have some key issues. one, it is more powerful, and key for florida, it's moved

further to the east. 150 miles an hour, last advisory was 145. there's that slowdown we were talking about. down to 80 miles an hour. could slow to a walking pace as we get to the eastern coast of the u.s. the track is very important. right now category 4 storm moving over the northwestern bahamas as a category 4 storm. we'll see very strong winds, very high wind gusts, damaging winds, so pay attention if you're in the northernmost part of the bahamas. it is moving off to the east. that is a second trend where we're seeing an eastern shift. that is good for the coast of florida, but now we're looking at the bahamas and del mar peninsula in delaware with some leftover rains. >> you'll keep us updated, thank you very much. coming up, corruption is it is na-- the name of the game. we'll tell you all about it

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magnificent rooms with magnificent views. we have incredible conference rooms. it's such a natural. we have over a million acres so in terms of parking, in terms of everything you need, the ballrooms are the biggest in florida and the best. >> trump is openly breaking the emoluments clause by inviting next year's g7 leaders to his conference. he wants his precious wall built so badly that he says he will pardon his lawmakers if they go against it. take general william barr. we learned this week that barr booked his annual $30,000 holiday party at donald trump's d.c. hotel. so more personal cash for the

trumps squeezed out of government officials at home and abroad. perfection. joining me now, windham charles, peter under president george bush, and paul butler, legal federal analyst and prosecutor. i have to go to richard first because you were an ethics czar in the white house. here's the justification the department of justice is using for the attorney general of the united states to hand $30,000 over to his boss, the president of the united states. barr is paying for the event himself, they said, and chose the venue only after other hotels, including the willard and the mayflower, were booked. according to a justice department official, the purpose of barr's party wasn't to curry favor with the president. >> paul, there are more than three hotels in d.c. essentially he's saying there were only three choices and he picked the best one and he's paying for it himself.

is that the best argument? >> there are plenty of hotels in d.c. as well as private clubs and country clubs where he can have this party. there is a government ethics prohibition, a rule, that prohibits any government employee from giving a gift to his superior worth more than $10. you cannot take your boss out to lunch unless the lunch costs less than $10. that's the law for all federal employees. this is a $30,000 party, and you can bet the profits the trump organization is going to make off of it is a lot more than $10. this is corruption, and the idea that the top law enforcement official in the united states government, the attorney general of the united states, wanting to break the law by handing a huge gift to his boss, the president, is outrageous. this is on top of the solicitation of emoluments,

profits from foreign governments, from the g7, open solicitation of illegal constitutional payments from foreign governments and of course the president telling the people he'll pardon them if they commit crimes. this president needs to be impeached now. the house of representatives needs to get going. he's the most corrupt president in american history. >> he claims he was joking about pardoning people. by the way, that story, he literally said "take the land." he's telling his officials, just take it. take people's land, and if you end up breaking the law in the process, paul, i'll pardon you. is that impeachable, illegal? is the offering of pardons in advance a crime? >> absolutely. it's more obstruction of justice. i don't know if this is any more impeachable than the president's documented obstruction of justice with regard to the russian investigation or more impeachable than his racism, but yes, this is another example of abuse of office.

the emoluments clause exists to prevent a foreign government from offering money to the president of the united states. joy, there are two lawsuits actually working their way through the federal courts now about this very issue. so when the attorney general does things like spend $30,000 of his own money to host a party in the trump hotel, one of the concerns, one of the many concerns, is that he's the director of this litigation about this very issue. and so in addition to all of the documented health code violations at trump's resort in florida, there is the horrible stench of corruption. >> yeah, midwin, there is so much here to unpack. you have william barr thinking it's a defense to say he's personally writing the check to his own boss who rents a hotel that elises from the federal

government. trump even leased that hotel from himself as head of the government, and then he's going to get paid, he and his family, from the attorney general. but let's go to the g7 which he wants to invite putin to and make it the g8 again. donald trump wants to have seven european allies pay him and his family to host an event where seven foreign leaders, seven presidents and leaders of nations, would be in florida during hurricane season, the height of hurricane season where that's not safe in a place that already got sued for bedbugs. >> irrespective of those things, right, forget the fact it's hurricane season, forget the fact it's got bedbugs -- >> it was sued for allegedly having. >> emoluments, we have this clause in the constitution, and in order to prevent corruption,

what we're seeing here right now, and it's important for everybody to realize this, these are the type of things that typically happen in dictatorships. when you have so much outright corruption, when you have the person who is responsible for managing all of our laws, the attorney general. as i said before on your show, he's the attorney specific, right? he is now an attorney specifically for donald trump. we do not have an attorney general. i've said it before, i will say it again, and we saw it in the way he handled the mueller report and he was only looking out for donald trump and has not been, as far as we've seen, looking out for all americans with respect to how he has directed himself in that office. but irrespective of that, we cannot have, as a standard, the president of the united states making money off of the white house. it's obvious why this is bad. corruption is bad because we do not have anyone with integrity and character running the country. the standard now is with barr doing this, does it now mean

that federal employees, in order to curry favor with donald trump, have to spend money at his hotel? >> it seems so. >> we know that's going on right now, so one of the concerns when there is no impeachment is that the message is that this is okay. so to this point, $2 million, that's how much the federal government and republican campaigns have spent at trump properties since he became president. $2 million. >> so if you have, richard painter, donald trump essentially committing open emoluments clause violations, this would be foreign governments paying the president and his family directly for leasing his hotel in the g7, not using camp david. he has this wall thing he wants to build, currying directly to make sure it goes to an ally. the particular senator of north dakota wants his friendly firm to get the wall product, so now

donald trump wants him to get that. any one of these things would seem to be an impeachable offense. trump is doing them all, richard. >> it is, and he is going to keep doing this until he's impeached. the house of representatives needs to have the courage to impeach him. there is a formal impeachment inquiry, or so the house of j e judiciary says, but we need to have a trial in the senate, and even if the republicans in the senate want to give him a pass, there will be a trial in the senate in front of the american people. the american people will see the evidence, the evidence of corruption, of racism, of violations to the constitution, a tax on the free press. he calls the newspapers and the media the enemy of the people. that's the way hitler talked in germany in the 1930s and '40s. he must be impeached. there must be a trial in the

senate. the american people will see the evidence and he will be out of there. >> there was a time when appearance of i mpropriety mean you didn't do it. this president does not even care about that. >> on this last word, paul butler, we now have 134 tout of 235 democrats in favor of impeachment inquiry. is this going to happen, in your view? >> i hope so, but it's up to the women of the country. speaker nancy pelosi seems to think it's more efficient to get him out of office through the electoral process rather than the impeachment office. i think you could do both. even if impeachment doesn't mean trump being removed from office by the senate, he deserves the stain of impeachment on his

historical record. >> absolutely. and by the way, the brilliant lawrence tribe has made it clear that the house could hold a trial, find that donald trump has committed impeachable offenses, impeach him and not even send it to mitch mcconnell. then he can tell mcconnell, look at that. the writing is on the wall. you don't get to free him for this. >> midwin charles, richard painter, paul butler, thank you for being here. hurricane dorian is only at 20 miles an hour. it's slowing down.

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four years later, one of those little boys, my son bo, was diagnosed with terminal cancer and given only months to live. i can't fathom what would have happened if the insurance security said for the last six months of his life, you're on your own. the fact of the matter is health care is personal to me. obamacare is personal to me. >> that emotional political ad actually turned out to be a high point for joe biden this week, reminding many democrats why they liked biden in the first place. biden continues to be the frontrunner in a democratic field that is starting slowly to shrink down. this week new york senator kirsten gillibrand became the latest to end her run for president. 20 democrats made the next cut for the debate. second tier candidates are still

vowing to stay in place. >> it would be better to be in the debate than not be in the debate. but if you look at the interviews we were in, it didn't seem to matter which indicates it's just getting started. >> the debates are a great platform to be able to reach a lot of people across this country, but it's not the only way to spend time with voters. that's exactly what i'm doing here in iowa. >> we're moving forward. this is not going to stop us at all. >> tara dowdell and maria are back with me. john delaney said, hey, the debates didn't change the status of the race. john delaney, you're at zero! if you're a john delaney or tim ryan, why do you stay in?

>> some folks are staying because they enjoy the stage, right? >> they have a lot of money. >> they have money, they don't have anything else to do. i think part of it also is people want to introduce certain topics into the discussion. i think every election cycle you see that. i think people are still thinking they might get certain positions, they want to level things. once your candidate drops out of the race, the rumors swirl that you're going to drop out, those calls start nonstop asking for your endorsement and trying to do some behind-the-scenes maneuvering about what that means. >> i want to bring this to you, maria, because jay inslee was the climate changing guy. even though he only had 1 or 2%, he did have that issue and he was very credible on it. so you become someone who can

bless other poeople. >> which is why i was saying, what does john delaney offer? i'm sorry, i was with him last week, and this is a moment we have to have these conversations. i said, there is a critique that white guys just take up a lot of space and kind of like an understanding of the sense of humility like this maybe isn't my time, because what exactly is bringing you to the race that's going to change things? i'm wondering how long they're going to stay in. >> he didn't answer your question. i did see that segment. i think for delaney and tim ryan -- i don't want to speak for them, but from what i've heard from them and what they seem to be saying is if we leave the race, the race swings too far, in their mind, to the left, so they don't want to seed the ground for people they see as too liberal, so they want to keep the vote of white working class republicans.

>> but that's their issue, right? in a way that for jay inslee climate was something he wanted to introduce, for them there is a segment of the democratic party that does believe the democratic party has swung too far to the left and they believe they need to be a counter. >> let's talk to the guy who is that, and that's joe biden. his opening and that ad were the two best things of joe biden's campaign. there have been new issues, the story issue where he told a story. i think it's a bit overblown. he mixed two stories of american heroism. but when biden emphasizes an issue, it's not about him. >> i did a little reporting on this and i was asking, what's the sense? just from people i spoke to who are men of color voters, they're like, joe biden is like the cool

grandpa. so not like that, what is he called, drunk uncle? where drunk uncle is nasty, probably more like donald trump. but cool grandpa says, oh, no. but he's actually cool. i was speaking to black women and said, what do you think? one was here downstairs from maryland, and i said, why do you like him, and she said he's a professional statesman. another woman who i spoke to said i like him because of his ideas. she said, i like his politics. this is a black woman more traditional middle of the road. i think the question for biden is just going to be let's just assume. this is a democratic process. like more the merrier except

when it's like 20%. what happens if biden becomes a vp and he doesn't create that fire. >> that is a challenge with joe biden, is what he has is obama. he uses it a lot, maybe a little too much, but people want the obama era back and he gives them that. but at what stage does "oh, joe" become "oh, joe" and he's not excited enough to get people to stand in line for seven hours, like they did for obama. >> i say this a lot and i'm going to say it again. we have a really diverse party, so for those who support joe biden, i think it's not just about the era of obama, i think that definitely plays a large role, let me be very clear. but they think joe biden cares about them. they see joe biden as someone who cares about them.

i spoke at a conference to get more women -- or a work shop sha conference to get more women from the south. the majority of black women from those states supported joe biden. that is before he even entered the race. people remember there were a lot of stories coming out because there was anticipation he was going to enter the race, so some campaigns were putting out opposition research on him pro actively. >> they were unmoved by it. and theically, but they generally believe joe biden cares about them. that's a lot of union people. >> i want to really quickly add warren. elizabeth warren has the hot hand right now. she is moving up.

it is eventually going to be a biden-warren showdown. it could potentially be, because people lover elizabeth warren, her policy, the way she deliv s delivers. i feel sad having to hear this because you hear people saying, i just don't know. you're punching your own balloon. >> you're -- the republicans i talk to, they used to say worry about biden. now they say worry about warren. >> when you have 15,000 people turning out for a rally for you,

that is predictive. now, how far of a prediction -- you know, how far you can take that correlationwise, but the. thanks, you guys are great. fox takes aim at one of our guests, and bishop art is here to respond. every day, visionaries are creating the future. so, every day, we put our latest technology and unrivaled network to work. the united states postal service makes more

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♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ when we embrace our language, we must ask does our policy care for the least of these? does it lift up those who are more marginalized in our society? does it establish justice? that is the moral question. if someone calls it socialism, then we must compaall on them t acknowledge that the bible promotes socialism. because jesus offered free health care to everyone and he never charged a co-pay. >> when d. barber spoke at the dnc, it sounded reasonable to

me. but here's what a dnc speaker had to say. >> if they call them redeemable and deplorable, most people might not be drawn to them. so now they're struggling for this religious language and this religious protection, and what they get is a birkenstock-wearing socialist and we're told the bible is sort of a religious communist manifesto. >> joining me now is bishop william barber, author of "revive us again." jonathan hartgrove. william, are you okay? >> it was said if we're wrong, the constitution is wrong. here's their argument and they actually said this, that there

are 140 million poor people in this country without health care. they keep comparing themselves to caesar, and most of the people are white, and these are so-called white evangelicals who i thought read the bible. jesus said in matthew that justice ought to be in the front, that the nation ought to care and said they challenged a nation. they literally said the church ought to care for 37 million people without health care. it is ridiculous. what i was saying is -- i was criticizing them. if you say that caring for the sick and caring for the poor and lifting up society is socialism, then your own logic -- by your own logic you're saying the abolition movement was socialism, the movement for

women's rights was socialism, the labor movement was socialism, and you're saying that jesus is socialism. i call it doing right by social justice. >> this is literally what they said. this is a -- crenshaw is his last name, congressman crenshaw. he said, it's a deliberate misreading of biblical principles by the dnc to promote socialism. the bible teaches charity with one's own time and money. socialism teaches charity with other people's time and money, so not the same thing. >> there is a difference in words and what jesus compelled us to do, with what governments do. >> they're saying don't live like jesus because jesus says, you do that personally but not publicly. >> and ralph reed was acting like this is a new thing when

what reverend barber was saying is what moses and the prophet said, it's what jesus said, and it's what prophetic movements throughout history have said. for 40 years the religious rite has tried to use fear to get white evangelicals to not gather around race but to gather around religion. to connect the south and the suburbs with this kind of value umbrella, that is being challenged right now and being challenged in a powerful way, not just by folks like us but by a mass movement of people of pro-life, pro-values movement as corrupt one of the most controversial presidents in this country, and that's what has him on attack. >> this idea of equating donald

trump to being sent dreirectly god or being like a kind of god. last year candace owens tweeted, only god could deliver such a savior to our nation. michelle bachman said, we will not see another biblical person like that in our lifetime. donald trump said he would vote for potus. it was a define moment. donald trump said he essentially was sent by god, equated himself to god. do these people believe donald trump is god? what is it? >> let me operate as a professor. if your god is greed and racism,

or your religion and greed and racism, then perhaps trump and his enablers are god. they said about the civil rights movement and the abolition movement, you all need to stay out of us and it is of god. nifs mississippi last night where activists are standing at a black and white and brown at what trump did to -- there are people down there who believe that what he is doing seeks their idea of rationalism skpchlt thinking about who you see as your choice.

if you're a slavemaster that's on the top of the slave ship, and you're a slave in the bottom of the slave ship, who was your guard ld. >> is it wrong to call this christianity? >> they called it christianity. i don't believe it's true christianity and that's why we're drawing folks to call for jesus to justice. we had a red letter revival. we're trying to help people know you have a choice between the jesus they're presenting and the true jesus of the bible. >> william barber and jonathan hartgrove, thank you for coming. more after the break. play it cool and escape heartburn fast with new tums chewy bites cooling sensation.

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that is our show for today. "am joy" will be back next week. we've got some stuff going on with this storm. good day to all of you at msnbc headquarters in new york. welco welcome, everyone, to "weekends with alex witt." shifting