hate crimes. that's of course a big issue when you look at the nature of some of these mass shootings and the hate associated with them. we wanted to bring you that update to a story we will keep following on "the beat." i'll see you back here tomorrow at 6:00 p.m. eastern. "hardball" is next. so who fires trump? let's play hardball. good evening. i'm crith matthews in washington. donald trump's chaotic presidency recalls the words of the great yogi burra. we're lost but we're making good time. every hour the president races from one crisis to the next then back, from iran's nuclear efforts to naelk's nuclear weapons. from trade brinkmanship with china to backing boris johnson's brexit. he fires one national security adviseder john bolton one night

while he secretly smoozs with an old one, h.r. mcmaster on other nights. he behaves most of all like a mexican jumping bean. what's up? who's in, who's out, who's he got in the loop, who's he freezing out and who decides, who else on this planet would be sending perfumed mash notes to kim jong-un while cold shouldering justin trudeau. while suffering hissy fits of france's president macron. who else, what sane leader would be making such decisions? and today on the 18th anniversary of the september 11th terrorist attacks the reminder of a crucial function of a national security advisor president trump spent the lion share of his day today bad mouthing now former advisor john bolton. a day after forcing him out via tweet the president criticized

bolton for his hawkish approach to foreign policy which trump knew well before he even hired him. >> he's somebody that i actually had a very good relationship with, but he wasn't getting along with people in the administration that i consider very important. john wasn't in line with what we were doing, andtually in some cases he thought it was too tough what we were doing. mr. tough guy. >> president trump began his day with a series of tweets complaining about a poll showing him losing to his democratic opponents, bashing the media, and bragging about last night's republican victory in north carolina's special election. well, speaking of the pentagon today the president's 9/11 comments included remarks about his failed peace talks with the taliban. >> we had peace talks scheduled a few days ago when i learned that they had killed a great american soldier from puerto rico and 11 other innocent

people. >> well, disagreement over those talks was reportedly a major factor in bolton's departure. one white house official told nbc news that afghanistan broke open the bottom of a bag in a relationship that had been eroding. in the oval office this afternoon trump blasted bolton over his reference to the libyan model to get north korea to give up its nuclear weapons. >> it set us back, and frankly he wanted to do things not necessarily tough and john is known as a tough guy. we were setback very badly when john bolton talked about the libyan model and he made a mistake. and as soon as he mentioned that, the libyan model, what a disaster. take a look at what happened with gaddafi with the libyan model and he's using that to make a deal with north korea? and i don't blame kim jong-un for what he said after that, and he wanted nothing to do with

john bolton and that's not a question of being tough. that's a question of being not smart to say something like that. >> trash talking was a big part of his day. john bolton responded to the president's comments in a text to nbc news saying i'll have my say in due court. i'm joined now by jill colvin and ben rhodes. this question today, he acts like as he sits there in the white house, in the oval office with reporters like he's running a little business called the presidency of the united states and it's all his. he has no real structure, no advisers, no national security advisor and it's all him. >> because i was a deputy national security advisor for a year and they coordinate a massive apparatus of the united states government. the military, the states department, the intelligence community, ongoing diplomatic negotiations. the dysfunctions of having that drastic turnover he's had in

that position and these massive shifts in how he looks at foreign policy and making people around the world wonder where does the united states stand? in the clip you played he's attacking bolton for something bolton said over a year ago. if this was such a problem for donald trump why was bolton in this job? >> why would he hire a super hawk who did push us into iraq, why did he hire him if he said there were both stupid wars? >> we pulled out of the iran nuclear agreement, so there are pieces of the bolton agenda that he liked. but here's the problem, trump has told us for some time his unpredictability is how he does business. well, look at the record. iran is resuming its nuclear program, north korea is still building their nuclear weapons. the china trade war has escalated with no end in sight and our democratic allies doesn't know where the united states stands. so he doesn't have anything to show, and i think where he is he knows he needs to make some deal

somewhere to show some results before he heads into an election year and john bolton was standing in the way of those deals and so now he's going to try something different. >> you know, right now because we're in media the media does a lot of preparation for days like 9/11, and there's a lot of recognition of that anniversary, the marking of that and it's a solemn day. you've seen it as people go through the day and the president acts like a bull in a china shop today, like it never happened, like he's going to engage in this stupid war, this exercise to trash john bolton he fired at midnight. >> it is so jarring when you wake up in the morning on september 11th and pullout your phone and look at twitter and the president is blasting the fed as bone heads and complaining about everything he's watching as he flips through the television channels. the president is someone who grew up in new york. he talked today in a speech he gave about the fact he could see he claimed the second plane

hitting the second tower, he went done there to help. >> did he? >> there's evidence he was present there. reporters saw him. he was interviewed by a news outlet. it's unclear if he was actually helping, to survey the site. for someone to have gone through that the way new yorkers experienced it just makes it the more jarring. >> why does he have to trash, and you can smile because you know how much we all know what he's up to. he fires bolton because bolton was willing to resign. so heaped to make sure it's official, he kicked him out the back door. and now he's afraid bolton is going to come back at him. >> bolton is going to come back at him. all of the main initiatives of his foreign policy are flailing and now he's seeking to shift all the blame for that onto john bolton. it's barack obama one day, john bolton the next. he finds people to blame. he's been president for almost three years. it's on him. people can see the results of

the approaches he's taken. he's constant lee looking to shift blame. bolton will fire back at him. he likes that fight. he likes that give-and-take. in actual reality what are we going to do with the fact the iranians have restarted the nuclear program? >> what's really wrong with trump aside from his personal wackiness, is it that he thinks a business deal -- i want to buy that building, i don't have to buy that building, he'd walk away. but foreign policy you can't walk away from china, north korea, from iran or the middle east or netanyahu. all these people -- it's not like a business deal. you can say i'm not going to do it. you've got to do it, you've got to deal with people. does he not get that? >> this is president security advisor because you saw him on november, watching on television. he likes to surround himself with people. >> what has trump accomplished in any of his deal? >> for him the way he sees it if

he can build personal relationships with these leaders he'll be able to create moments like we saw in north korea where he became the first sitting president to step overorth kore. he sees that as victories in themselves. >> and that's exactly the problem, chris. >> there are basketball players that have done this before. >> it's just a photo-op. every other leader has figured this out and they're taking advantage of the cast. the iranians say okay we'll resume our nuclear program we'll do that. the chinese say you want a trade wrash we'll slap tariffs on you, squeeze you and go around the world and pick-off all your allies and make trade with them. everyone is taking advantage of the united states of america withdrawing from its global leadership position. he picked john bolton because he was belligerent, because he would be confrontational to iran.

john bolton came in, pulled out of the iran deal. and now suddenly we hear trump is asking for a meeting with the iranians. >> who knows what's going on. great to have you both. "the new york times" reports bolton's dismissal leaves president trump as his own national security advisor. think of that. a quote from "the times," boat n's exit from the west wing on tuesday removes one of the last constraints. joining me right is former cia director, former secretary of panetta. this is a rock emsock em crazy moment. he wants to play all the instruments. what's going on? >> well, whatever is going on is

not good for this country because we're living in a very dangerous world and this is president who's now gone through three national security advisers. he's somebody who has a national security counsel that is dysfunctional, it doesn't work. there's no deputies meetings, no principle meetings. and in the end after three years of being in office this president has not accomplished any major foreign policy objective, and the result is that we have a very dangerous world as a consequence. >> let me ask you about the behavior of this presidency and this almost cartoonish decision that he had to say that alabama was exposed to the hurricane, to dorian. and even to the point of having his chief of staff mulvaney, while he thought he had his head screwed on, telling wilbur ross of commerce to lie over there

saying alabama was in fact vulnerable to the hurricane. this is abuse of his authority. he's like a third world guy. >> the problem, chris, you know, most presidents that i've served under and that i've worked for, those presidents have advisers around that president who are basically telling the president, you know, when you approach an issue this is what you should do, this is what you shouldn't do. i mean, most presidents really do relish having advisers who may say things that the president doesn't agree with. this president is not surrounded by any advisers who are willing to not only challenge him but to discipline how he behaves. i mean, the chief of staff in this situation rather than being somebody like, you know, a doggy running after a bone should be

standing up and saying, mr. president, the last thing you should do is call the secretary of commerce and ask them to change what science tells us was a reality. that's the role of a chief of staff. and so if you don't have people like that around the president, then this president is going to basically operate by his own instincts. and what we're learning is that his instincts stink. >> he's also sending signals on how to behave. i remember mike decaucus once said that the fish rots from the head because the leader sets the course for how things are done. the word seems to be in the white house, the vice president's office, all around washington to foreign diplomats if you want to win the love of this president, spend money in his resorts. air force officers deciding they're going to go out of their way to stop a off in the right

place in scotland so they can expend some federal taxpayer money to make him feel there's pocket money being made in the white house. your thoughts. >> well, you know, again, this is a priz danes that distorts the priorities that the president should be focusing on. i mean, we've got the series of flash points around the world. what are we going to do with iran? we've got iran now basically enriching nuclear fuel. afghanistan, a failed effort at trying to work out a deal with the taliban. north korea, failed summitry. russia basically doing their own thing in terms of being aggressive. china, we're in a trade war. these are the things you ought to be focusing on. instead what they're looking at is how do we continue to make money for the trump operation? and to have the military be part of that possibility here with the air force, being -- landing

near turnberry and then having people go to turnberry to stay, i mean that's something that ought to be clearly investigated as to whether or not it violates laws. but more importantly it creates a perception that the pentagon is actually trying to cater to the president of the united states. >> thank you so much leon panetta for reminding us how a president should speak and behave. coming up, speaker nancy pelosi visibly angry about the republicans lack of action on gun legislation. watch her here. >> don't ask me what we haven't done. we have done it. and if you are -- it's because people are dying while senator mcconnell hasn't acted, why don't you ask him if he has any regrets for all the people who died because he hasn't acted. >> here is mitch mcconnell and he defiantly says nothing is going to happen on guns until

trump says so. and while a republican senator says there's not even a hint of what trump might support, which is probably nothing. plus breaking news. a source tells nbc news tonight that the manhattan district attorneys office is looking into whether the trump organization falsified business records in paying off porn star stormy daniels and modm karen mcdougal and trump's former attorney ready to testify and help in the investigation. this is real and hot and it's dirty, and we've got mouch more tonight to get to. stick with us. uch more tonight to get to. stick with us. to get the job done, it seems you have to accept the fact that some equipment will sit idle, or underutilized. but it doesn't have to be that way. that's why united rentals is combining equipment, data, safety and expertise to help your worksite perform better. united rentals. a better worksite is here.

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welcome back to "hardball." it's been more than a month now since 31 people were murdered in el paso, texas, and dayton, ohio. and today we're nowhere closer to knowing what president trump's going to do about this scourge of gun violence that still plagues our country. and earlier today he did reassuren come

up with something that's acceptable to everybody. it's a subject that's been going on for decades. decades we've been talking about it. so we're looking at background checks and putting everything together in a unified way so that we can have something that's meaningful. at the same time all of us want to protect our great second amendment. >> okay, well, nbc news reports he's working with a bipartisan group of senators who we're told to expect something from the white house by tomorrow. that's thursday. but they say the president didn't specifically signal whether he would actually support. according to "the washington post" the white house dispatched today to debrief republican senators yesterday with zero indication again yesterday on what trump would actually do or willing to do. one republican senator, quote told "the washington post" there was no hint whether the president was going to come down. senator mcconnell refused to do anything without the president's sign-off.

>> my members know the very simple fact that to make a law you have to have a presidential signature. until that happens all of this is theatrics. >> well, house speaker nancy pelosi has already sent two pieces of bipartisan gun legislation to senate majority leader mcconnell for action. >> senator mcconnell is standing in the way. we passed our bill in february. members have banded all over the cubtry to ask him to bring up the bill. don't ask me what we haven't done. we have done it. and if you are annoyed with my impatience it's because people are dying while senator mcconnell hasn't acted. why don't you ask him if he has any regrets for all the people who died because he hasn't acted. >> well, her members aren't waiting for the president or mitch mcconnell. late last night the house judiciary committee moved three bills to the house floor. it banned three capacity magazines, except for firearms

and look at mentally for people who shouldn't have the guns and also ban sales of people convicted of hate crimes. good for them. thank you, congressman, for this. i get the feeling trump is worried. what's going on with him because i was amazed 5, 6 weeks after the shootings, the mass shootings in texas and ohio, he's daring to say the word background checks again like he's still afraid of the suburbs. what do you think? >> chris, good evening. he is worried. he should be worried because he only cares about public opinion, and the public opinion has dramatically changed on this issue. and in just the last few years. however, vice news just broke a story liz landers one of the reporters says that michael williams is a lawyer for the american suppresser association who is now in the white house advising the president on guns. the people around him are from

the gun industry. he cares a lot about where the money comes from, $30 million from the nra. that is also very persuasive. i don't think he's going to do anything. i think he's too beholden to the nra, and that's very, very sad. >> what's the suppresser association? what the hell is that? >> they represent gun silencers, so they represent the device that would silence a firearm, and the republicans, they actually after a mass shooting last congress tried to put legislation forward that would make it more widely assessable. that's where they are on this issue. we have to keep the drum beat going and show the frustration speaker pelosi showed that we cannot wait not to wait for the president but put forth ledge slagds. >> guys, i forgot that people need silencers on their guns to defend themselves in their homes. you have a silencer to shoot deer. the only reason to have a silencer is to commit crimes.

>> this is one of those things where the white house is clearly being pulled in a whole bunch of different directions. but the white house is making a big show of bringing all these people in, saying they're talking to all these different voices and they want to see what everyone can agree on -- >> if you say that then the nra has to sign-on. >> that's the issue because the congress is saying what is the president going to do? wae can't do anything until he gets in line. >> this is a cutting issue. the nra wins these political fights because they've got people who will vote on the gun issue and only the gun issue. they vote on their gun rights, the second amendment rights, that's all they care about. can you get suburban women and men to start voting with the same intensity on the gun safety issue, on that front. >> that's a real question. it did seem like during the mid-terms that there were people that really ran very hard on enacting more measures for gun control and that they were

successful. but the question is whether that would actually play in a presidential year where you're going to have amounts of people -- trump is going to be able to turn out his base. so that idea of taking away your guns is a powerful message that the president and white house is very aware of and that he uses against his opponents. >> yesterday's house judiciary committee marked up a gun legislation lucy mcbath whose sun was murdered in a gas station seven years ago called a call to do something. this is her personal plea. let's watch. >> nearly 100 people every single day die in this country as a result of gun violence, and yes, i will never let you forget that my son jordan was one of them. i know the pain of losing a child to gun violence. and that anyone in this room, anyone in this country that should ever be faced with that pain. and for every single day that we fall into not taking action,

mothers and fathers across this country will live through the same nightmare that i did. it is our responsibility to prevent this suffering, to bring an end to this constant heart break. >> that was one -- her child was killed by the way by somebody who didn't like the loudness of her radio, his radio in the car. here it goes. >> and today we have more politicians encouraging jealousy, cowardiceness and we've decided the country and it needs to stop. that will do more than any of these bills. >> what we have before us tonight is another attempt to make people feel good without helping a thing. >> we all want to stop gun violence. we all know these terrible things that happen are just that terrible and evil, but trying to do something what this bill seeks to dine this manner is so

fundamentally wrong. >> you know, you would think, congressman, they're talking about or your side was talking about collecting everybody's rifles and you're talking about a background check to keep people who shouldn't have guns from getting them. why do these people -- what is their argument with all this stuff about how this isn't going to work? of course if you keep the gun out of a dangerous hand, it's a good thing. it's a safety measure. >> no one wants to take a gun from a law-abiding individual. so shoot for sport, go to -- take your kids out to go hunting, protect yourself with a shotgun in your house but keep the most dangerous weapons from the most dangerous people. the views you just played from my republican colleagues, those are the views of a going extinct species. what you did not see behind lucy mcbath who was speaking and she ran for congress on this issue, were other moms, dozens of moms in the audience who are demanding action. and mittically in 2018 because

they joined the students and every town, we beat 17 nra endorsed members of congress. so you should fear the moms and all of the groups with them today more than you should fear the nra. >> it seems, iesha, i'm not asking you to play political consultant, for this to become an issue, the nominee for president whoever it is,as got president in the debates next fall before the election and say challenge him right there. in other words, it's going to be the nra who keeps the issue on their side. meanwhile the nra stays focused on protecting our gun rights. >> well, democrats could definitely challenge president trump, and to say what they exactly are going to do, they have a bill that passed the house, and so they have to say this is what we're going to do and why won't you act. right now the president seems to

be better maybe if they don't take action or he can just say the democrats tried to do something. >> he had the mental health thing. >> or, yeah, say it's mental health. and a lot of those talking points from republicans we hear that from the white house. we want to do something that will really change things. so those are the arguments they're making. >> i think he gave it away, guys, when he said i want something everyone can agree on. well, the nra is not going to agree on anything. it's great to have you back. congressman eric swalwell of california. thank you both. up next, some breaking news. prosecutors with the manhattan da's office have interviewed michael cohen, the president's fixer as part of their investigation into whether the trump organization falsified business records when they paid off stormy and paid off mcdougal, the two women they paid off after those relationships. you're watching "hardball." this is dirty. it's going to be interesting. g . this is dirty. it's going to be interesting bu.

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welcome back to "hardball." we have the breaking news tonight right now nainvolving trump's former lawyer michael cohen. according to a source familiar with the situation michael cohen has signed a proffer agreement with the manhattan district's attorney's office and that zbreemt stipulates he will ya t cooperate in their investigation of the trump organization. da's prosecutors who met with

cohen are investigate whether the president's company falsified business records. last february cohen shared several checks, there they are, signed by the president and other company executives to reimburse him for the pay off he made to silence stormy daniels on trump's behalf. we know all about that story. cohen testified the reimbursements he received were d disguised. >> the payments were designed to be paid over the course 12 months, and it was declared to be a retainer for services that would be provided for the year of 2017. there is no retainer agreement. >> based on your conversations with him, is there any doubt in your mind that president trump knew exactly what he was paying for? >> there is no doubt in my mind.

>> right now i'm joined by joyce vance, former federal prosecutor. let's talk about michael cohen's cooperation here. he has a view of what to say about trump and what he thinks about trump. where could there be a criminal violation by the president in regard to how he paid off stormy daniels? >> so it's early times in this investigation, chris. but what prosecutors seem to be focusing on is the idea that there would have been false business records that would have been submitted. normally that's a misdenener. but if you submit false business records in an effort to conseal another crime, here presumably a federal crime involving campaign finance fraud then it becomes a felony and you're really in hot water. >> because no one it seems to me would write into an accounting document for the irs or anyone else paid off porn star for

night in wherever, wherever the hotel was. it doesn't seem he'd ever put that record together. so come up with something like entertainment costs. how would you file that information? it's a quarter million, in fact he paid almost up to $400,000 to pay tax kaus and everything else to make michael cohen happy. >> right. but the time they paid cohen the $130,000 payment for the pay off money had turned into $400,000. and what we're hearing in this testimony is that there was an effort to convert that into legal fees, and that that was likely how trump's organization reported it in business records, as legal fees when in fact it wasn't legal fees. it was hush money. so that would be the offense. >> here he is at sort of the tail end, if it is the tail end of this whole opration of going after trump it seems to me the

manhattan da, that's a political office, this case could be a big case if you're taking the president of the united states down into a criminal matter. the question i have i guess as a nonlawyer is what's the penalty for this kind of case? >> so that really depends on how it's ultimately structured. if they were able to make some sort of a tax charge here, which we don't know. we don't know if they have tax records, we could be looking at a lengthy violation for a felony. it's certainly not a misdemeanor. the felony crime is a serious one, it carries a lot of collateral consequences but most significantly is the threat there is jail time involved, and any amount of jail time in the state system in new york would be very unpleasant for the president of the united states. >> let's talk about michael cohen. could he get good time out of this, could he get relief on his own sentence if he plays ball with the da's office?

>> you know, michael cohen is in custody on federal prison. it's not hundredheard of for federal prosecutors to agree to give someone who's in their custody good time or rather time off of their sentence in exchange for work with the state prosecutors or local prosecutors. but it's not usual. i would expect that to happen, more of cohen's cooperation to be with federal prosecutors. and of course we know the origin of this investigation that's happening out of da vance's office is the fact that federal prosecutors in manhattan terminated any further investigation into the allegations that were raised by cohen whether that was campaign fraud or look into the trump organization in july. and suddenly be learn prosecutors from cy vance's office took the trip up to otisville a couple of hours from manhattan later in august. it seems the two are related in that way. whether cohen's getting credit in the federal system i think looks unlikely at this point.

>> i'm so glad we have you on this story. thanks for your expertise just as a witness to this whole saga. it's amazing after all these months of following the bad behavior of this president and his people who worked with him in the bad behavior like michael cohen ends up in a case in the new york district attorney's office. up next a new poll shows democrats beating trump, almost all of them are beating him. his response, it's fake news. you're watching "hardball." his s you're watching "hardball. you're out there, quietly running the world. creating jobs and fueling the economy. you're small business owners, and there's nothing small about your business. that's why with dell small business technology advisors. you'll get tailored product solutions, expert tech advice and one-on-one partnership. to help your small business do big things. call an advisor today at 877-buy-dell. get up to 45% off on select computers. ♪

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history of calling polls he doesn't like fake. after the latest "the washington post" abc poll calling it a phony suppression poll. the poll shows all the top democratic presidential candidates beating trump. well, look at them all. among registered voters ahead 15 points with dern ae sanders ahead by 9. look at them, all the leaders ahead of them. trump tweeted if it weren't for the never ending fake news about me and all i have done i would be leading the partners of the main stream media by 20 points. and also claimed i haven't started campaigning yet. he hasn't? well, that's news. you're watching "hardball." has? well, that's news. you're watching "hardball. ever since i started renting from national. because national lets me lose the wait at the counter... ...and choose any car in the aisle. and i don't wait when i return, thanks to drop & go. at national, i can lose the wait...and keep it off. looking good, patrick.

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that's what you get, when you've got wayfair. so shop now. welcome back to "hardball." trump said today he hasn't started campaigning for president yet. he also mentioned his 2020 campaign multiple times during rallies all this summer. let's watch him not campaigning. >> i stand before you to officially launch my campaign for a second term. we're actually here today to officially launch our campaign to win the great state of new hampshire in 2020. the 2020 election is about one thing. it's about you. we begin our campaign with the best record, the best results, the best agenda and the only

positive vision for our nation's future. >> joined my the campaign director for the center for american progress action fund. john, you're great to come on and talk about this but these polls suck. these are terrible. >> the point of the matter is stuff this far-out in a ballot test does not matter because it's really -- it's really the president against. >> so you're telling me if trump was ahead he wouldn't be bragging? >> what i see is i do believe the democratic primary polls are relatively accurate. a general election poll where we're going to have two more world series before people even vote, they don't know who these democrats really are at this point, they're not defined. i think they're mythical. >> i'll give it to you, a quarter of the electorate or more is not plugged into the race just yet.

but the fact trump is polling with the top five democratic candidates i think is reflective of the country given the negative trend ao blame trump for that. >> you guys are like charlie brown withhe football. the fact that all five are -- >> let's be fair. every poll in 2016 was very much like this poll. i will say this, though, the real secret to look at these things is the in the cross taps. >> for the first time please explain the word. >> it's all the demographic and segmentation stuff, where they live, their ages and breaking down, you know, whether they have a college degree or not. >> and women in the burbs are turning against trump. >> that's the one thing when i look at this thing he's actually winning among men, but the gender gap is a little bit on steroids right now.

here's what i think and the president said look with everything i accomplished if you really polled right, this should be great. but what i think the president has to understand is accomplishments is only part of the story and executive position. they actually want to like, respect and feel comfortable with that president. so sometimes process stands on top of his own message and takes away what he wants to be talking about -- >> you think process takes away what he wants to talk about versus trump taking way what he should be talking about. >> i always said a candidate, why are you talking about polls anyhow? that's the job of people who work on campaigns for you. i don't think he has to be talking about polls. >> but he is because he lives and dies by this. it means so much to him. as he did today on september 11th of days he's going to make it about polls.

>> however, what i believe is for example the tweeting he does, it goes to a group of people who either are already supportive of him or -- >> let's talk about tomorrow night because i'm going to move ahead. i'm going to be in the spin room trying to get the right questions and right people tomorrow night, in other words when they're vulnerable. here's the question, biden said, hey, he doesn't get much ahead but a third of the vote roughly all the time. does that mean when somebody on the left moves up and knocks out the other person on the left, if elizabeth knocks out bernie, for example, does that mean he's in trouble? >> i do. his numbers, for example, are creeping down. and i think where the democrats are going to come, they're going to say elizabeth warren is a better general election candidate than bernie sanders. >> who's winning it? >> elizabeth warren is coming into this with a surge in money, in polling, in just energy. and people are going to latch onto this and she can leverage.

>> what's stopping kamala harris with the black vote? >> i don't think there's anything stopping cam lah harris with the black vote. her team admitted there was a summer slump, they're coming out of it. if she wants to be successful tonight it's going to be important for her to drill down what her message is. >> does she have a positive message? >> absolutely. she has a positive message. she's fighting for americans. she's fighting every single day. >> what separates her from the other candidates? >> i think one is the historic nature of her candidacy in and of itself, and two, she's going to reach a demographic that i think needs to be reached in -- >> i'm stunned at the fact she hasn't caught on yet. john, are you surprised of kamala not catching on? >> she's dropped significantly from after the first debate. and i will tell you people don't always give you second chances when there's this many candidates. she better have a heck of a debate. >> if she attacks biden she's back in the old corner again. who's going to attack who

tomorrow night? >> i feel like biden is going to try to go after warren because that's the person who's surging most. >> i think what biden is going to do is play the why are we attacking each other, this is about taking back america and our ballacies, this is shameful and i think he's going to shut it down because i don't think he wants to be a punching bag. >> it's not about him wanting to be a punching bag, but if he goes after warren, he's also going to get were complementary. >> there's a term in politics i learned years ago, loves someone to death. he's wonderful, we agree on everything, but i'm going to beat him. >> the why is eventually i'm going to have a tough conversation with bernie about why you have to get out and support me. >> democrats say they'd rather nominate the candidate most likely to win than the candidates closest to them on

the issue. voters also want to get another look at the policy proposal. a new poll shows most think would send the country in the wrong direction. i don't know if people think st strategically who do you think will win therefore you're for that person over the person you like? don't people say at this point in the election i'm going with who i like, but now they're saying i'm not going with who i like but who is beating trump. >> what americans have the opportunity to do in this primary is say who motivates me, who inspires me, who's going to we able to fight for me -- >> who's getting independents? >> independents had said in that same poll, 49% no matter what they're definitely voting against trump. >> it doesn't matter. >> i think it matters because of course you're going to have appeal broadly. we've seen the polls, all five of the top candidates have the

best chance of beating trump. >> who has the best chance. >> at her upward trajectory i'm looking at elizabeth warren very closely. >> i honestly don't know that. i do think once -- it doesn't matter. i think once the democrats say it's not biden, he's done. and so i think that's the real thing to watch. the thing about democrats in these debates, they attack differently than republicans do. they always start by saying, you know, joe, you're a very good friend of mine and i respect you a lot but noi i'm going to kick you in the groin. >> they shoot their wounded. that's what they do. i know you hate it, but it's so true. thank you. tomorrow night is the third democratic debate in the primary season down in houston. our special coverage begins at 11:00 p.m. up next on the somber anniversary of 9/11. you're watching "hardball." y of. u're watching "hardball. hmm. exactly.

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you must be steven's phone. now you can know who's on your network and control who shouldn't be, only with xfinity xfi. simple. easy. awesome. there was something about powerful about 9/11 of course we must never forget. it was the courage of first responders. remember that firefighter heading up the stairs of the world trade towers with everyone racing down, it's my job he said. hundreds offered up their lives that day. and let's remember too our feelings about those first

responders. and more than that the proud sense of country wefelt that we had those among us who would race to their duty on such a day, and that's "hardball" for now. "all in" with chris hayes starts right now. tonight on "all in." >> john wasn't in line with what we were doing and actually in some cases he thought it was too tough what we were doing, mr. tough guy. >> the bolton fall out from the iran negotiations to nuking a hurricane to north korea. >> i don't blame kim jong-un for what he said after that. and he wanted nothing to do with john bolton. >> tonight new details about exactly why trump no longer has a national security advisor. plus, breaking news. michael cohen makes a new agreement to tell all about t