heart disease, type two diabetes tomorrow, and that means huge healthcare costs to come. and look at every trend for young people's health, it's worrisome. same thing with the opioid crisis. even when -- even when it abaits, you're still going to have massive healthcare costs, one of of the biggest problems this country is going to face, that our kids are going to face. >> all right. thank you very much. of course we'll be reading axios a.m. in just a bit and you can sign up for the newsletter at signup.axios.com. >> that's it for us on this thursday morning. "morning joe" starts right now. here they are, one strike away, one out away. 3-2. there it is! the washington nationals are world champions for the first time in franchise history! >> okay. here we go. >> who couldn't believe it. good morning and welcome to

"morning joe." it's thursday, october 31st. >> happy halloween. >> we have willie along with white house reporter for "the associated press," jonathan lemire, and "morning joe" economic analyst steve rattner. on capitol hill nbc news white house correspondent geoff bennett, nbc correspondent garrett haake. >> why even bother to start show today, because i know where you're going. >> of course we're going to history. sorry you hate history. willie, first time since 1924, walter johnson, there's a world champion in baseball in washington. i tell you, i grew up and for years, decades i grew up watching the redskins play with banners saying bring baseball back to d.c. well, my gosh, last night it came back in the most extraordinary way. >> what a great game. you had a couple guys on set here who stayed up all the way

through the end, that's how good the game was. the nationals, "the washington post" reports this morning that in may when there were 12 games under 500, 1931 there were calls for the manager davie martinez' job. that the odds in vegas of the nationals winning the world series were 1.5%, that was in may. and from that moment they went on this incredible tear. they won all four of their games on the road in houston in this series against a team with the best home record in baseball. zack greinke was cruising for the astros. looked like it was going to be an epic world series performances, and it was until he showed a little crack when rendon hits a home run, cuts the lead 2-1 and then there's an opening for the nats. >> was greinke lifted to soon? should they have gone to gerrit cole? was he the best starting pitcher but could he have come in relief? but it was a thrilling game.

nats were down 2-0 in the seventh. you're seeing the home run right here which gave him the lead right off the foul ball and they tacked on a few runs at the end. this nationals team deserves so much credit. they were down to their last two outs in the wildcard game against the brewers. they were down late in the decisive game in the division series round against the dodgers. here they are in a series where the road team won every game to come back in the late innings on the road here in game seven if the was extraordinary and a real mix of older players like max scherzer who was so hurt two days ago he could not only make a start, colbertly get out he ct of bed. and then juan soto. the wnba team won and now these nationals. >> willie, come on. this houston astros team. >> wow. >> i still believe the best team of our time. certainly the best baseball team

over the past three or four years. but you had the greatest team in baseball that just ran into a force of nature. i mean, this was for nonbaseball fans, you might follow boxing, maybe this was mike tyson versus buster -- >> i love the goggles. >> nobody would have seen this coming. but what a comeback. and, as jonathan said, this is something that they did all year. >> yeah, they did it all year. and it was, if you go back to may, this was buster douglas and tyson. but, from that point in may when they're 1931, they had as good a record as the houston astros. for the better part of the season they played as well as houston. that's what makes this all the more impressive and sweet for nats fans, they beat one of the best teams of this era but going back to many eras in the houston astros. and max scherzer walked out there with the ball, probably didn't have his best stuff.

the astros were hitting him pretty hard. but he got out of these innings, inning of inning without many runs. kept it to 2-0 to where the nationals could storm back and win the world series. think you'll have a lot of tired guests on this show today. >> yes, very. >> a lot of tired guests. but, jonathan, i think this has been a good break for us. we needed a year to be able to sleep a little bit more and in october and november. and, of course, the red sox will be winning the world series again next year but it was nice to let the nationals have it in 2019. >> it was. it was a thrilling playoff series. we should mention a shoutout to baseball fans in montreal. this team used to be the expos and they were the best team in baseball when that season was canceled because of the strike. they never got a shot in the playoffs that year. but the off-season starts now. i'm sure just like i am, you're

going to start upping your exercise and catch up on a little rest. we were able to rest in october, but pitchers and catchers will be here before you know it. i believe it's 104 days. the red sox have a lot of decisions to make before then. they better resign mookie betts. >> one more note, that's the bryce harper note, remember last season the nationals lost the most coveted free agent in baseball. he left and went to philadelphia. they didn't have a good season and here they are dancing on that field having won the world series after losing their best player at the end of last season. >> the nationals have just had such a frustrating run of of it since 2005 with bryce harper on the team, never being able to move forward. and now with this superstar gone, these guys, these kids win it all. it's exciting. as far as the red sox pitchers and catchers reporting, mika will tell you i'm working on my cut we are. the bull pen -- the bull pen was so weak at the end of last year,

i think -- i think i've got a shot. i'll still only be 56 by the time i get there. >> you'll be the seventh inning guy. >> i will have old man strength as i hurl my 47 mile an hour cutter in. they're not going to know what do with it. >> how old was phil when we used to watch him run out there for the braves? you still have time. you still have time. >> exactly. >> right. >> exactly. >> i'm sitting next to the most intense baseball coach i've ever seen in my life. so that was fun just watching you coach the kids. let's keep it at that. so -- >> they call me the woody hayes of baseball. >> oh my gosh. so into it. >> sometimes the bobby knight. sometimes bobby knight. >> we'll talk. all right. a lot going on believe it or not, with multiple recent polls showing a majority of americans supporting the house impeachment inquiry. late last night the house rules committee advanced the democratic resolution laying out

the next steps. the house has expected to begin debate on the resolution shortly after 9:00 a.m. this morning before voting on the measure. rules committee chairman jim mcgovern says the resolution set rules for open hearings as the impeachment probe moves into a public phase. according to "politico," top democrats are expecting few directions during today's vote and few, if any -- defactions, excuse me, and few, if any republicans are expected to vote for the resolution. during last night's markup by the rules committee, republicans spent nearly four hours attempting to pitch their own changes to the measure. "politico" notes that all of the gop amendments when focused entirely on the process were rejected on party lines. >> i think it's a sad day for the rules committee and for the insurance institution of the house of representatives. it's not a fair process, it's not an open process and it's

certainly not been a transparent process. it's been limited and closed and, frankly think there we're moving toward a preordained result. >> i mean, if you think this is fair there is not fair at all. >> they're trying to create something new that i think is just substandard and dangerous to the presidency. >> the process seems to be treating chairman schiff as though he were a de facto special prosecutor. notwithstanding the fact that he's a partisan member of congress, his strange behavior is all rind colluding fabricating a lengthy quotation and attributing it to president trump during an official hearing which he was sharing. no due process now, may be some later but only if we feel like it is not a standard that should be applied to any american and it should not be applied here to the president of the united states. >> you know, willie, it's so sad, actually. these poor republicans, can you imagine if you had to defend donald trump? it is just -- it is -- >> but you don't have to. >> they think they have to

defend donald trump. and so they'll set up a straw man and then nancy pelosi will knock it down. they'll set up another, knock it -- they are all they can do is argue process, process, process, process. and even when nancy pelosi and the rest of the democrats take those excuses away, they come up with others. they've been whining, oh, they've been whining we need a vote on this impeachment inquiry. she finally gives them a vote and they say well it's taken them too long to give us a vote. now they're offended about that. this sort of whining, let's keep this in perspective. what you heard in the rules committee, that was actually the sound of minorities in the rules committee talking over the past 200 years. if the rules committee's been around in fact that long, because that's just what they do in the rules committee. the rules committee is set up for the majority of the house to set rules for the debate.

>> right. >> same as it ever was, same as it ever was, you know the republicans have a losing fight on their hands because all they can do is talk about process. >> and, remember, this is nancy pelosi calling republicans' bluff because their argument was this is not an official inquiry. nancy pelosi says we'll have the vote and make it official and now they've moved down the road to another argument about that. obviously, as you say, joe, they want to argue process because the substance gets more damning by the day when you have colonel vindman's testimony that he went to a white house lawyer immediately on july 25th because he was concerned about what the president said on the phone to president zelensky of ukraine. and that white house lawyer according to reports said let's get that transcript locked away so people can't see it into that top secret server. we'll get to that in a minute. garrett haake, walk us through what we're going to see on capitol hill today. what's the house going to be doing? >> they're going to vote. it speaks to the lack of drama

around the whip count that we're not expecting this to be something that drags on late into the day. democrats are hoping they can keep everybody on board for this. it will be a party-line vote. this is a process vote. you're not really making a moral argument about the value of impeachment here or not, what you're doing is setting up a roadmap, setting up essentially a calendar with no dates on it n for how the impeachment inquiry will continue. you played the mitch mcconnell clip. what this resolution does is it will elevate the role of adam schiff significantly. this will put the ball in the hand of schiff go forward with the intel committee now driving the inquiry for the next couple of weeks. at the they will have the first open hearings and be required to hand over a report to the judiciary committee and it will be left to the judiciary committee to see how many documents they will produce. only then when you see involvement from the white house

counsel's office, see something that looks like the hearings in the clinton era. >> and with adam schiff taking the lead, that elevates the person that the president has tried to make the face of this impeachment inquiry, he feels like he can effectively paint schiff, he likes go back to him and go -- claim that he misquoted him in that testimony and so on that he's not acting in good faith. garrett, two questions for you. first, is there any sense of democrats here who aren't going to support this inquiry? and, with this -- with this particular committee running -- these committees running the show, doesn't this sideline some of the president's most fiercest allies, the jim jordans and mark meadows of the world who have been through the strongly defending him? >> if you're setting your lineup, the president wants adam schiff, the democrats don't want to see mark meadows and jim jordan and some of the other folks who have been the president's biggest defenders, they are on two of the other committees that have been

handling the process behind closed doors, but not on the intel committee. if you're on the democrats, you like your lineup card here. intel committee members versus intel committee members perhaps a bit better than if it were one or all of these committees who have been handling it or the judiciary committee who has been the most partisan committee in congress. you set that aside. as for wayward democrats, they may lose votes here. there have been about a half a dozen democrats who have yet to say anything supportive about the impeachment inquiry. only one of those that i've seen so far, joe kunging ham from south carolina has indicated that he might vote for this resolution today. but democrats can afford to lose a couple of votes on the process here and let this see how these arguments continue to play out. >> the testimony of decorated war hero and top white house ukraine adviser lieutenant colonel alexander vindman seems to be doing major damage to the president's defense against impeachment. in terms of both a quid pro quo

and a possible cover-up. so let's start with the official cover-up. vindman's testimony is corroborating the claim in the whistleblower complaint that the white house locked down all records of the july 25th phone call with his ukrainian counterpart. cite be people with the testimony he wrote this, moments after president trump ended his phone call with ukraine's president on july 25th, an unsettled national security aide rushed to the office of white house lawyer john eisenberg. vindman, who told house investigators that he was alarmed after hearing trump pressure ukrainian president zelensky to investigate his political rifles told eisenberg that what the president did was wrong. and according to two people familiar with vindman's account, eisenberg then scribbled on a legal pad and, quote, proposed a step that other officials have said is at odds with

long-standing white house protocol. moving a transcript of the call to a highly classified server and restricting access to it. former trump national security officials also tell the post that eisenberg had moved at least one other transcript of a trump phone call to that classified server. nbc news has also learned from three sources that house impeachment investigators have asked eisenberg and his deputy, michael ellis to appear for a deposition on monday. we do not know if either intends to appear or if the white house will seek to block their appearances. and the lieutenant colonel is also connecting other major dots in the probe. two sources familiar with his testimony tell nbc news that vindman told lawmakers that the white house meeting sought by the president of ukraine as well as the delivery of nearly $400 million in security and military aid was contingent on ukrainian officials carrying out

multiple investigations sought by president trump, including into the bidens, burriss of ma and the 2016 election. he drew a dlikt line from the investigations of ukraine and those investigations sought by president trump. >> it's very simple. vindman went to eisenberg, told him of the president's misconduct, misconduct which will probably prove to be impeachable, and eisenberg, the president's attorney, immediately took steps to cover it up. and actually move unclassified material into a classified server. my god. that's serious business and it's been revealed now by eisenberg. >> yeah. >> i said by eisenberg. no, the cover-up that eisenberg is responsible --

>> participated in. >> -- and participated in has now been exposed. >> what's extraordinary is you now have a couple new players, at least two entered the public consciousness of this thing that maybe guilty of a cover-up. the thing i find most extraordinary about this is you've had this parade of witnesses, career diplomats and military people with no political agenda and people who served the president loyally for periods of time come forward one by one and based on all the testimony we've been able to hear about, they have corroborated every single piece of the whistleblower complaint. there has not been, to my knowledge, one substantive fact in the whistleblower complaint that has been contradicted by any evidence that's been turned up not just by the intelligence committee but by anybody else working on it. now as you say on top of that, we have things that go beyond the whistleblower complaint in terms of evidence by a cover-up by people in the trump white house to keep us from finding out what the president and his

aides actually did with respect to ukraine and the aid and the bidens and so forth. >> you know, willie, it's funny when i hear people still, republicans and trumpists on twitter or on cable news talking about the whistleblower, we're going to find out -- like, why don't they buy a pet rock? why don't they buy a mood ring? they're like so behind the times. it's ridiculous. that -- that horse, as we say in the south, was let out of the barn several weeks ago and we found out that everything the whistleblower said happened has happened now. so why exactly are these republicans still trying to improperly track down the identity of a whistleblower who ended up being correct? >> because once again they want to change the subject from the substance of what the whistleblower reported to the whistleblower's background as they tried to do unsuccessfully

with bill taylor and some people tried to do with colonel vindman. the identity of the whistleblower does not change what was in the whistleblower's report and what has since been corroborated by a number of witnesses. jeff bennett, we may get more corroboration. john bolton is the big fish. he's been called next week. his attorneys say he will not come voluntarily but if he's subpoena he may show up on capitol hill. another big witness today in timothy morrisson. tell us who he is and why he may be so significant, because he was also on that july 25th phone call listening. >> he was. he's a central figure in this case that democrats are building because if you go back to bill taylor's testimony, the actor ambassador to ukraine, taylor mentions morey sson some 15 tim. it has to do with his misgivings about this entire pressure

campaign. he did listen in on that call and, according to taylor's testimony, he told other white house officials, other state department officials over the fact that it did not go that well. i'm paraphrasing something that taylor said that morrison told him. he told us he is leaving the nsc and he would be the third official do that. you have kurt volker, michael mckinley, both of them resigned amid this impeachment probe. volker resigned so that he'd be freed up in terms of what he could tell house investigators. so morrison is set to appear here today. i want to return back to something mika said about lieutenant colonel vindman as she talked about our reporting he's talked about those contingencies, the direct line that president trump drew between the white house deliverables and the ask for ukraine to open investigations into president trump's political rivals. what's interesting about that is in his opening testimony when which we obtained, vindman said

in his view it was not proper for this administration to demand that a foreign government investigate a u.s. official. that word demand, willie, struck us as curious and conspicuous because he could have picked any number of words. he said it was improper for him to suggest, request, encourage. he used the word demand. we did some digging and it turns out he went beyond that opening statement in his testimony and said explicitly that the white house that president trump -- or the white house officials at president trump's behest explicitly linked the white house deliverables and a demand for investigations into burriss m of burisma. the same quid pro quo that mick mulvaney admitted to before trying to walk it back a day later with willie. >> all right. nbc's geoff bennett and garrett haake, thank you guys both so

much for your reporting. it was written yesterday, everybody knows. republicans know. the white house knows. there was a quid pro quo, it was there. so the more the president denies that quid pro quo, the more he assures himself that he's going to be impeached. now, the president, of course, and republicans were talking about how unpopular this impeachment inquiry would be several weeks ago, a month or so ago saying that americans wouldn't support it. it is interesting today that as we move toward the vote the overwhelming majority of americans in poll after poll after poll. >> they don't like it. >> -- support this impeachment inquiry. and, really, they agree with nancy pelosi and the democrats. so we'll see what republicans want to not only be on the wrong side of history here, but also want to be on the wrong side of the american people. >> and the more people that come forward and testify, it just becomes impossible to debunk what happened.

so it's very questionable as to why they -- the republicans keep going here. still ahead -- >> it's a personality cult or just blind loyalty. >> still ahead on "morning joe," there's always a tweet when barack obama was president, donald trump thought 1.9% growth meant the economy was in deep trouble. >> well, listen, that's really bad and i'm sure donald trump is glad that he doesn't have an economy growing at 1.9%. that would be really bad. >> yeah. no, actually, he calls that the greatest economy in american history. these days he believes the same number signals the greatest economy. so ratner's going to help us straighten this out. >> yeah. >> you're watching "morning joe." >> 1.9. >> we'll be right back. ing joe." >> 1.9. >> we'll be right back. as a struggling actor, i need all the breaks that i can get. at liberty butchemel... cut. liberty mu... line? cut. liberty mutual customizes your car insurance

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is. two more signs of a slow economy emerged yesterday as the commerce department reported that growth in domestic product declined to 1.9% in the second quarter. and the federal reserve cut interest rates by another .25%. >> that's terrible, according to donald trump who, of course -- >> no, that was terrible according to donald trump a few years ago. >> but he said that would be horrible to be president when growth was that slow. steve rattner, you, of course, the kids that were excited about the world series were especially excited because there's a doubleheader here today on the 31st. halloween and your chart. so they're all very excited, very excited about that. you know, the fwhing ththing ab 1.9% growth, let's talk about this up front before the charts,

it comes after the president's extraordinarily reckless spending free. a spending spree that even rand paul said was the most reckless in american history. he couldn't vote for donald trump's budget. then of course that massive tax cut for corporations and the richest people in america, massive tax cut, that gutted actually a lot of deductions for small business owners, that was supposed to energize the economy. it's had the opposite effect and, of course, we now have a $22 trillion national debt because of it. >> all that's true, joe. so maybe you want to do my charts for me. you've got all the talking points. but i'll -- i'll chime in. let me start, because we went out with a donald trump tweet, i'll come in with a donald trump quote from december, 2017, when he said, so we're at 3.3% gdp, i see no reason why we don't go to 4%, 5%, or even 6%. and instead of that, we are at

1.9% at and what you can see on this chart is that he did have the sugar high that you were referring to after the tax cut in -- >> i can could ask you -- i can interrupt you quickly? i'm not good at these charts, so i see a lot of really, really high numbers in gray. those are like huge numbers. and then they're drawfing the little blue numbers to the right. can you tell me, what are those really high numbers in gray? who was president then? and who -- when the little, little blue part of the chart, i'm not good at reading charts, willie can tell you that. can you help us out there? >> yes, i can help you out there. the gray numbers, the gray bars, rather, are barack obama's eight years in office and the blue bars -- >> oh, wow. >> -- are donald trump. >> so he ended up doing a pretty damn good job, if you believe numbers and data, right?

>> he did a pretty good -- he took over an economy which as you can see that red line on the left when he took over the economy we were in negative growth territory. you can see the red line which shows you the annual rates of increase that were pretty similar, actually, under ba ram obama to wh barack obama under president trump. but you can see growth trailing off. there's a horizontal line that you can see at 3% which was trump's original target and you can see he only popped above it by a little bit for a little bit of time. and since then it's been trending essentially straight down. and each year of his presidency the growth rate has been lower than the year before. and weapon are now in sub 2% growth as opposed to the 3%, 4%, 5%, 6% growth that he promised us. >> boy, that's really bad. >> why is this happening? actually here's another great irony to the situation. the biggest contributor to the decline or to the slow of growth rate has been -- absolute decline, outline decline in

business investment. >> wait, wait, wait, steve. i'm confused because -- >> he's the deal maker. >> i'm really confused, help me out here i'm just a poor country lawyer. you about i thought and we were told -- >> yeah. >> -- and all republicans promised us that if they cut taxes for the richest people in america and multinational corporations, that that would spur investment. now, of course, i don't know a whole lot about economics so i was saying they're going to waste some money on stock buybacks and that actually this tax cut actually wasn't tailored to inspire investment. but all the smart republicans and all the right wing economists said it would spur investment. but could we put the chart back up, because i'm confused. i'm so deeply confused this halloween morning that it looks like investment is actually plummeted since donald trump's tax cut. >> so you've got -- you can see those three blue bars in the middle.

you've got a little bit of a short-term spurt upward and then, as you say, it's plummeted since then. now we've had two consecutive quarters of negative business investment. >> oh my god. >> i know you're going to want to go to those gray bars on the left and i don't think you can find -- >> the gray bars, i can get willie in here? willie, look. >> come on. >> the gray bars sore much higher and donald trump had promised us and every republican promised us that if they put a couple trillion dollars more in debt, that investment would pick up. it's just dropping like a led zeppelin. willie. >> i know you're better with the pie chart, joe, the usa today pie chart about which vegetables people like. >> yes. >> so let me walk you through this. >> by the way, also -- also my favorite usa today pie chart ever was that three fourths of americans make up 75% of the public. i understand those. these confuse me. >> that was a classic. those last two negative bars,

does that mean people are holding on to the money because of why? >> thank you, willie, for a good question. [ laughter ] >> wee! >> they are holding on -- they are holding on to the money first and foremost because of donald trump's trade war, which has caused business to say, let's just pull back, let's hold off, let's see what's going on here before we rush out and spend a lot more money on plants and equipment. and so he has only himself to blame for those two blue bars on the right that go down. now, can we turn to joe's favorite subject, which is federal spending. so, joe, you can see here over on the left that all the way -- >> wow. >> -- that blue line was the recession fighting spending that barack obama approved. then you can see the cut back, the sequestration, all the stuff we remember. blue line falls into negative

territory where we're cutting government spending. you can see trump's inauguration day and since then the blue line going up and up and up. in fact, of the 1.9% growth we got last quarter, .4%, roughly a quarter of it came from higher government spending, not from actual economic activity. >> well that's -- jonathan, that sounds like socialism. >> i don't know if this is a good question or not, but you just mentioned the "r" word, recession. there's signs of a slowdown. is there anything to suggest here that a recession could happen or that there's anything that could indicate that the economy could pick back up between now and say, i don't know, november 2020? >> so those are good questions too. >> thank you. >> joe asks good questions just for the record. >> sometimes. >> on the second part of your question is the easier one to answer. the chances of the economy picking up and increasing in growth rate, i think most economists think is very low. there's nothing going on that would cause it to pick up and

start growing at 2%, 3%, 4%, 5%. recessions are hard to predict, economists are bad at if the most economists think there's a 25%, 30% chance but you can't see it in the data yet. we will get a jobs number tomorrow, it will be a slow jobs number. it's definitely slowing down. manufacturing employment in three states plus some others, but three key states, pennsylvania, wisconsin, michigan all fell last month. >> those are important states, steve. >> those are kind of important states. >> so you actually moved to my next question which had to do with the manufacturing slowdown, we're in a manufacturing recession not just in a lot of those states but also worldwide. and most economists across the world do blame the worldwide manufacturing slowdown on donald trump's trade war.

we talk about it an awful lot. but, i mean, the evidence is -- is unavoidable. it's obvious that donald trump's trade wars not other causing manufacturing recessions in pennsylvania and michigan and wisconsin, but all across the globe. >> yeah. that is absolutely right. the great irony of the whole economic situation is that a year and a half ago the international monetary fund said that global growth has never been as broad based and sustained as it was around the world then. that was 18 months ago. they've been cutting their forecast steadily since then and it is exactly because of the trade war and it is exactly because of donald trump having started the trade war. so, again, among the many irony of this, trump came into office saying i'm going to fix this economy has actually made the economy worse off than it was when he got here. >> so our great fed chairman powell yesterday dropped the

rate another quarter point, but said that looked like that was about as far as they felt comfortable pushing rate drops. what's the impact of that going to be and are we at a point now where because of the massive spending, because of the massive tax cuts, because of the historically low interest rates we've really run out of fiscal or monetary policies that would help us escape a coming recession? we are in -- we're overleveraged and we're still sitting at 1.9% growth. it doesn't seem to be a great upside there if we do hit a recession. >> no, that's exactly right. we have used many of the tools that we have in our arsenal, fiscal policy as well as monetary policy. i think the fed was right to cut interest rates yesterday because you've seen the growth numbers. there's still variable inflation in the economy, that's one piece of good news that we should acknowledge and that does give

both the fed as well as the treasury if we decide to spend more money, if a recession occurs, some tools to work with. but, no, we're not in a great situation, joe. you talk often and i completely agree with you about the massive amount of debt that we've put on this economy in the last several years. and now we have these low interest rates which limit the feds' flex iblibility and we're in a good place when you put it altogether. >> with that as a backdrop, joining us now, vice chair of the house democratic caucus, congresswoman katherine clark of massachusetts. great to have you back on the show. looking forward to today. what are the chal leks and what challenges and what's the focus? the president refuses to be pushing back, will not participate, will not allow people to participate? >> yeah, so we're anticipating a crucial vote today in the house.

as we look at set the stating t for the next part of this impeachment inquiry where we move to bringing the witnesses and testimony to the american people. that's what we're doing with this inquiry, putting the truth out and defending our democracy against what is a rapidly emerging picture of a president who has abused his power and betrayed his oath and the american people and put his own political gain over our national security. >> so, congresswoman, of course republicans have come up with a series of arguments, the trump white house have come up with a series of arguments that have all been disproven quickly. i suspect we're going to move beyond no quid pro quo because it's obvious to everyone that there was a quid pro quo to the last desperate stand of trumpists, which will be, okay, there was a quid pro quo, but it's not impeachable.

so why don't you go ahead and let's just skip ahead a couple of weeks or maybe even a month and why don't you tell us now why you and the democratic caucus and a lot of patriotic americans believe it is an impeachable offense to actually hold up defense spending for a democracy who's under attack by vladimir putin until they give you dirt on your political opponent. >> yeah, i think we have to look at our constitution. look at what our founders told us. they were concerned about foreign governments interfering in our elections, in our government. and it seems with president trump every sentence that begins with him ends with putin. and what we are finding here is that he did exactly what the whistleblower said. this is being corroborated by witness after witness. he put it out in the transcript,

do us a favor, though. and he put his own political agenda, his own campaign over the very real security interests of americans and of an ally in ukraine who needed us. it has been put out starkly by witnesses this is a life or death issue for ukraine people every single day. ukrainian people. and we have to answer that. and what we have with the democrats is we are taking this deliberatively. we are being solemn and sober about this. but we have to get the facts out in front of the american people. and the facts that have emerged in just the last five weeks are painting a stark picture of betrayal. >> and you may get more corroboration of those facts today of witnesses and next week

especially if john bolton ends up testifying on capitol hill. it's willie geist. the republicans or colleagues do seem to be focusing on process and the not fact you talked about there. steve scalise and others have led the way calling this a soviet style impeachment process, suggesting it's secretive, that you're doing it in the dark basement of the capitol. could you explain for our viewers how this is proceeding and are there republicans sitting in the room with the opportunity to ask questions? in other words, what's soviet about this process? >> you know, i thank you for your question too, will. i -- it is really breath taking to watch my colleagues. they cannot excuse this president's conduct so they're trying to have a conversation around process. and they are misleading the american people when they say this is a secret investigation which they're not involved in. if you sit on one of the

committees of jurisdiction, which 48 republicans do, you can be in that room listening to this testimony. and, there is republican counsel present asking questions on their behalf at every single one of these depositions. now that we are moving into the public phase of this inquiry, all those process questions are falling by the wayside and i'm afraid what we're going to see is the playbook of this white house and republicans of smear and fear coming back into play because it's all they have. >> it's all they have. >> all right. >> thank you, vice chair of the house democratic kark caucus, congresswoman katherine clark. nice to have you. steve scalise talks about soviet style. if i were steve scalise i probably wouldn't bring up the soviet union because then you

think of the ex-kgb agent that is steve scalise's hero, that the president of the united states sides with, more than sides with the men and women of our intel committee. stay away from soviet or anything russian, steve, not a good look for the entire republican party. but you know what's fascinating? they're whining about these behind-closed-door meetings and you have trey gowdy who comes out and says, you have to do these things in private. in fact, the republicans time and time again for the fact finding of all of their benghazi hearings, they went behind closed doors. trey gowdy said it was the only way to do it. it was the best way to do it and they preferred do it that way. i don't know if republicans think that the overwhelming american -- part of the american public are struggling with their collective memory, but we're not. and they just look stupid when they say things like that. >> yeah. i'm glad congresswoman clark

laid out again what actually happens in that room. because to listen to steve scalise, it's not just him, the soviet thing say talking point. there was one congressman yesterday who talked about the hearing room being a, quote, secret chamber as if you had to pull a book out of a wall and you can proceed back inside. there's republicans in the room, there's republican counsel in the room, they have equal time to ask questions. this is an invented distraction from what's happening in the room. the idea that republicans don't have a advivoice in there and therefore they need to storm the scif and set up shop and eat pizza to make a point, it's not based in fact. there are republicans in the room and if they don't like the way it's proceeding, there will be public hearings. this is the first part of the process and there will be public hearings. >> first part of the process. >> trance patience. >> i and ttransparency. >> and so many of the buffoons who were outside having a pizza party and making it a complete mockery of the process and as general haden said probably were

committing crimes by doing that if they had phones, so many of those people could have been inside. >> right. >> like they're on the -- >> absolutely. >> they are actually on the committees that can hear this testimony. but they decided to sit outside and make an ass of themselves. again, as general haden said, commit crimes because they'll degrade themselves as much as possible just to get on donald trump's good side. >> but like trump, they are treating people like they're stupid. up next, "time" magazine is looking at rudy giuliani's bewildering turn from america's mayor to president trump's attack dog and chief. >> i'm afraid the dog may be rabid. it's running around in circles right now. >> a first look at the cover story next on "morning joe." lr story next on "morning joe."

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welcome back to "morning joe" on a halloween morning. u.s. department secretary of state john sullivan testified to senators yesterday that president trump's personal attorney rudy giuliani engaged in a coordinated smear campaign to oust former ambassador of

ukraine yovanovitch. they said revelations made by videoi yovanovitch about her ukraine matters were accurate and led trump to lose confident in her. >> you were aware that there were individuals and forces outside of the state department seeking to smear ambassador yovanovitch, is that correct? >> i was. >> and seeking to remove her, right? >> i was. >> did you know mr. giuliani was one of those people? >> i believed he was, yes. >> in a tweeted response, giuliani dismissed sullivan's account as false speculation calling it an orchestrated attempt to harass and hinder him in his role as president trump's attorney. joining us now, senior white house correspondent for "time" magazine, brian bennett. he's here with this week's cover story, the secretary of offense, the lead story entitled rudy cashes in. what his quest for money and power has cost trump. good to see you.

this is a story that goes back decades. donald trump has known rudy giuliani in new york circles for a long time, trusts him, i think they share an attack dog sensibility. how did rudy giuliani get into a position where he could run a shadow foreign policy around the world? >> so like a lot of people, we've been hearing from our sources and people are asking the question what happened to rudy? this doesn't seem to be the rudy we remember from 20 years ago. we went out and talked to people that worked with rudy in the white house, people who used to work in the white house and people who work closely with him when they were prosecutors over the last 20, 30 years. and even people who are close to rudy have felt that in the last ten years he has really tried to make more and more money and then ever since donald trump ran for president, became president, that he has done his best to become close to president trump and has turned into his most

verciferous defender. here's what's happening, rudy giuliani is still conducting his personal consulting business at the same time as being the president's personal attorney. iness that he's conducted a over the last 18 months. when he went to armenia last year to give a speech, he said he was there as a private citizen. but the government and media treated him like he was a visiting dignitary. people know he's close to trump. he visited in armenia with the defense ministry. the defense ministry put out an official read joust theout of t meeting. the problem that he has, while he's representing the president and projecting he's close to the president, has a line to the president, he's also got personal, private clients. >> am i right that we haven't seen rudy giuliani as much on tv at least in the last week, maybe two weeks? he was on every night for a while. as the white house asked him to

pull back a little bit? >> he has. he's been a limb scarcttle scar he was previously. he led the defense in the mueller investigation, but he's one of the reasons why the president is in trouble now or partially in trouble with this ukraine matter. not only has he disappeared recently, but his behavior prior to his disappearance seems more and more erratic capped off with that butt dial to the reporter. and he's butt dialed me a few times, but the most he gave me i heard him discussing flight arrangements to atlanta. i want to ask you, are people in the white house trying to sideline him and what is the president himself still think of giuliani? >> so i talked to people in the white house who have been trying to sideline giuliani for weeks. and only recently did we see giuliani go quiet relatively

quiet. i mean, a white house official told me it's only the president that can tell rude i do stay off tv. rudy has a direct line to the president. i talked to rudy yesterday and he told me very specifically that he doesn't mix his personal client business with his business for the president. but as we've seen over the last six weeks, when he goes on tv to defend the president, oftentimes he reveals new information, he contradicts denials that the white house has been making, and moves the story and the ball forward in a direction that hasn't been seen as advantageous to the president. >> i've never been butt dialed by giuliani, i'm starting to feel left out. appears everyone else has been. >> your day will come. >> the new issue of "time" magazine will be on news stands tomorrow with the piece on rudy giuliani, the secretary of offense. brian bennett, thanks so much. good to see you. coming up, in a series of tweets yesterday, the president urged republican lawmakers to

defend him on the substance of the allegations against him rather than providing the impeachment process. "the washington post" robert costa has new reporting on what senate republicans will do next. "morning joe's" coming right back. l do next. "morning joe's" coming right back. i'm bad. you're stronger than you know. so strong. you power through chronic migraine, 15 or more headache or migraine days a month. one tough mother. you're bad enough for botox®. botox® has been preventing headaches and migraines before they even start for almost 10 years, and is the #1 prescribed branded chronic migraine treatment. botox® is for adults with chronic migraine, 15 or more headache days a month, each lasting 4 hours or more. effects of botox® may spread hours to weeks after injection causing serious symptoms. alert your doctor right away, as difficulty swallowing, speaking, breathing, eye problems, or muscle weakness can be signs of a life-threatening condition. side effects may include allergic reactions, neck and injection site pain, fatigue, and headache. don't receive botox® if there's a skin infection. tell your doctor your medical history, muscle or nerve conditions, and medications including botulinum toxins, as these may increase the risk of serious side effects.

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and because it's a ninja foodi, it can do even more, like transform into an air fryer. the ninja foodi grill, the grill that sears, sizzles, and air fry crisps. imagine if that was your -- your name was hunter biden. >> i wish my name was hunter biden. i could go abroad, make millions off of my father's presidency. i'd be a really rich guy. it would be incredible. >> i just -- come on. i said, willie, have you -- no, willie, seriously. come on. come on. everybody calls this guy frayed d fredo is the proper name. i suspect it's more -- are you a succession fan? >> i just started. it's amazing. >> he's romulous. >> i'm sure his father sometimes looks at him and goes, what do you think, romulous?

totally romulous there, willie. by the way, why would anybody be so unself-aware as to even throw that question to romulous? >> you can't be that unself-aware, right? i think he's just trolling right there. when you just said about hunter biden the exact thapg describes you, that without your name you wouldn't have the status you have or the money you have. >> but hunter biden's a piker compared who to what romulous has done with his name. >> we have a new name for him. come back to "morning joe." willie, joe, and me here thursday, october -- >> i think that's a hash tag. jonathan lemire -- >> donulous. >> jonathan, are you a succession fan? >> huge fan. i don't think donald trump jr.

is the number one boy that logan ryan described the kendall character. but i think tls anyou've had so success with nicknames. good luck with this one. >> i think that's mika's donulous. joining the conversation, white house correspondent for pbs news hour yamiche is with us. national correspondent natasha ber drand joi bertrand joi bertrand joins. and robert costa, what's the moderator of washington week on pbs. >> based on your reporting, give us a 30,000-foot look right now over this impeachment process as it begins. >> house republicans i'm talking to are very unhappy and frustrated because they know the speaker is moving in a strategic

way to focus this entire operation, this probe, on the intelligence committee side. not on the judiciary committee where so many of the president's allies are. and they also don't have clear guidance from this white house about what the facts are, who's testifying next and what they're expected to hear. as they try to build a stramg right n strategy for 2020, they're in survival mode and looking to attack the process because they can't engage on the substance of the facts. >> how frustrating is it not only for house republicans, but also for house -- or for senate republicans that they really don't know what's coming around the corner? that there is no war room and there can't be a war room inside the white house because donald trump is so erratic and he holds everything so closely to the chest? >> the -- >> yeah. >> i thought that was for jonathan. inside the senate there's a lot more quiet. house republicans are more of

the type to try to go to the barricades and fight for president trump and they're looking to the white house for guidance and talking to people inside the white house even though there isn't a war room. but among senate republicans there's this constant refrain when you go up to them in the hallway, sorry i'm a juror, i can't engage in this kind of conversation. you see them very nervous talking to mitch mcconnell, the majority leader, asking him to make sure that they're in a position to hold the majority in 2020. when you talk to top senate republicans and their aides, their focus is not protecting president trump, which is the way many house republicans see this moment. their focus is about their own re-elections in 2020, keeping the judicial nominations moving in the here's ahead. it's about four more thpower mo president. >> yamiche, how is the white house preparing for this battle again, understanding the limitations of having a president who is so undisciplined and is not a day trader but, in fact, seems to trade in ten-minute increments, as maggie haberman has said in

the past? >> the white house is really circling the wagons and trying to make sure that these house republicans are ready to defend the president and really display the kind of fierce loyalty that president trump craves. the president trump, of course, with that is that the president is continuously trying to adjust his messaging. you have army lieutenant vindman coming -- army lieutenant colonel vindman coming and he was really damaging witness for the president. i spoke to someone who was familiar with his testimony. they said that house republicans are really trying to ask him questions saying did you go to your higher up because you were concerned that this might be wrongdoing? he was very clear, no, i thought it was ethically and morally wrong what the president and the people around him were trying to do by pressuring ukraine to investigate the bidens. so he was really holding firm on the idea that he really thought that this was completely lawless for the president to be doing this to ukraine and that, instead, he, as someone who has had a long story career in the military, he felt like had he to go up the chain of command to

say, look, this is the commander and chief but i have a problem with what he's doing here. that's the problem that house republicans have. they want to focus on process, as robert said, but it's the substance that the president is now saying they want to focus on that's the most problematic part of this. going forward they're going to have to deal with the public hearings and people seeing lieutenant colonel vindman coming in in full uniform wall his medals and jim jordan and other people trying to assail his character. that's going to be real bad optics for the president. and the president understands the optics of this so that's why we're still seeing the white house trying to strategize and invite gop lawmakers to the white house for these strategy meetings, but it's stuff. >> your latest story talks about the madhouse atmosphere inside the white house when it comes to ukraine policy, and you actually have somebody like lieutenant colonel vindman who's an expert in the area who was pushed to the side by an accolade of devin nunez who knew absolutely

nothing about ukraine. tell us about it. >> yeah. so this was a pretty remarkable detail that we wrangled out yesterday, which is that devin nunez's long time associate cash patel who used to work with him on the intel committee going after the russia investigation and trying to discredit the investigators, who was then promoted to the national security council in who said was hired from the national security council in february and promoted in july wraerhe was feeding tru negative information about ukraine and was so involved in ukraine policy and so in the president's ear that the president actually thought that he was the director of -- for ukraine on the national security council rather than vindman. so what vindman testified was that he was -- after he went to the inauguration of zlans elens may, he was looking to going back and debriefing the

president with secretary rick perry who led the delegation and explaining that his inauguration and election was a positive thing for the future of ukraine and that the u.s. government's consensus view was that this was, you know, something that was going to be very good for ukraine's future. but, instead, he was told that he could could not not go at th debriefing because it could would confuse the president who thought that cash patel was the director for the unc. >> that's delish. >> i don't know if i'd say that. >> it's zblich itrich. >> but i guess what's delish for one person is frightening as hell for the other. according to the "washington post," the white house is planning to invite a group of republicans to meet with president trump as natasha was referring to ahead of today's vote as a way to rally the troops. in a series of tweets yesterday, the president urged gop

lawmakers to defend him on the substance of the allegations against him rather than protesting the process. he tweeted this impeachment nonsense is just a continuation of the witch-hunt hoax which has been going on since before i got elected. >> wasn't that a hit last year? >> it's trying. appearance an old one. >> i think it's -- >> go with substance and close it out. goodness gracious. good luck, guys. >> that's an old one. >> according to "politico," senate majority leader mitch mcconnell met with the president for a one-on-one meeting last week where mcconnell advised trump to stop attacking senators such as mitt romney who may soon judge his fate in an impeachment trial. last night, laura ingram of fox news had this warning for republicans who go against the president. >> i offer some further reminders to the gop senate as it awaits whatever articles of phony impeachment come from senator schiffless.

first, there is no gop in 2020 without trump. should you abandon him on these spearous grounds drummed up by schiff, you'll not only grow the party, you'll lose everything. >> okay. so -- >> is that a threat? >> jenny pirro last night on fox news. >> jenny pirro? >> i guess that wasn't jenny pirro. it sounded like it. first of all, republicans, don't take your threat from people that toss schiffless, i mean, shifty shift or whatever. secondly, yes, americans are watching. republicans, history is watching. there are some republicans and independents and others who actually believe that the country, the united states of america, the constitution, our democratic allies who are under attack from russia are actually taking care of our democratic allies and taking care of and protecting this country itself is more important than being

part of a personality cult where you elevate a man who puts his own interests above that of you, your party, the conservative movement, the constitution of the united states, and, of course, the united states of america itself. and in this case, jonathan lemire, you have the white house also that is so erratic, that lies to the american people so much, that lies to members of the house so much, that lies to members of the senate so much that it's really hard for them to figure out exactly what the game plan's going to be because the president just isn't capable of telling the truth. one other thing on laura ingram's statement last night, she said that if republicans don't blindly follow donald trump there will be disaster in 2020. they blindly followed donald trump into 2018, remember all the stories that he's sending troops down to the border and

there were caravans coming with people that were filled with what diseases? >> leprosy, just all of these horrible things were happening, an invasion was coming. and those republicans that followed donald trump especially in the house, house members, were absolutely destroyed at the polls. obliterated in the polls. jenn jonathan, i think republicans lost by more votes in a congressional election than they ever have in the history of this republic. so i'm a little confused by laura ingram saying you must follow this man like you're in a cult or else the entire party collapses. because that's sort of what the house majority did in 2018. >> it was a historic setback for the republicans. they'd argue republicans and allies of the president, that 20 2010's different because donald trump's name would be on the ballot. but we saw what happened last time around. in terms of just the day-to-day strategy to try to deal with

this growing impeachment inquiry, the republicans simply don't know what they don't know. and there's that hinders them in trying to defend this president. bob put it right that a lot of people in the senate are more concerned about keeping the majority there. they're not sure how to defend this president. his allies in the house have been more vociferous, but they've had to do it with very little guidance from the white house outside of taking their cues from the president's angry tweets. the president perhaps alone thinks that he did not do anything wrong, that he is saying that we should be fighting this on the substance. he's urging members to do that both in television interviews and appearances before congress. he wants them to defend his so-called perfect call. and that's the purpose of today's meeting is to try to rally them to do so. i'd also like to point out, it's halloween, the house, the democrats are going to have this impeachment vote today. the president has nothing on his public schedule. it will be a day of tweets. >> so, bob costa, we have the last couple of days and i think

because of lieutenant colonel vindman and his testimony and his credibility we've had this predictable raft of reporting where republicans are deeply disturbed privately by what they're hearing. they believe that what colonel vindman has described is perhaps impeachable, certainly a quid pro quo. and yet publicly they're out on tv holding press conferences talking about this being a secret, soviet-style investigation. what do you hear in private conversations from republicans both in the house and in the senate about what they've heard just in the last 48 hours from colorado vindman? >> most republicans, whether they're allies of president trump or more establishment believe the testimony has been very damaging for president trump. but what they're really watching behind the scenes is something like the kentucky gubernatorial race where matt bevin is up for election this fall. it's an off-year election in a red state. they're telling me and other

reporters behind the scenes that if governor bevin goes down in 2019 and the virginia legislative elections and even the louisiana gubernatorial race, if those trend toward the democrats this fall, that will be the hammer on the ice that cracks the already thin ice for the republicans even more because they're worried that voters are souring. and as much as it seems like a deluge of testimony and too much to process, too much is piling up about the president's conduct and impeachment amid other factors will start to get baked in to how voters see this president and this party and it could lead to real decisions post november, 2019, as impeachment heads towards the senate. >> they know in many cases what the president has done is wrong and perhaps even impeachable, but their finger is in the wind waiting to see how the politics play? >> look at not what they're saying, but what they're not saying. when i ask republicans in the halls of the capitol can you talk to me at length about the president's conduct on these

phone calls with the ukrainian president, with other world leaders about -- will they be willing to defend having this kind of tractional foreign policy, to have a personal lawyer have such a position of stature even if informally in the making of american foreign policy, that's when they go mute, that's when they walk away. that tells you everything. >> so, natasha, it's steve rattner. it seems know with the vote today the republicans are going to lose some element of their process argument because the house democrats are going a completely regular process that mirrors exactly what was done in the president clinton situation as well as the president nixon situation. so we're on to the substance, i think. and my question to you, knowing so much about what's out there and what's come out so far, so far everything, as we talked about earlier, seems to have corroborated the whistleblower, everything ties together, everything is bad for the president. i can't think of anything good for the president in any of the testimony so far. is there anything out there that you think could be helpful to the president that might come

out? >> yeah. so in speaking to, you know, former prosecutors who have been watching closely how democrats have been building their case here, they're all pretty unanimous in that the case they're building is extremely strong because every witness so far, with the exception of ambassador to the eu gordon sondland have been remarkably consistent in their testimonies, especially with news yesterday that vindman also said that there was a quid pro quo here that military aid and a white house summit was contingent upon ukraine launching political investigations. so with the outlier being gordon sondland's testimony that no one raised internal alarms about his conduct or the conduct of kurt volker or rudy giuliani, that doesn't really help the president, especially because now his credibility, the credibility of his most favorable witness, essentially, or his least unfavorable witness is now really on the line. and democrats have actually

tossed out there that he may be vulnerable to perjury charges, that his, you know, memory lapses in his statements that are so add ot odds could make h vulnerable to false statement charges. i don't see anything at this point that could help the president and, as we've seen, the republicans have continued to focus on the process question even after democrats launched this vote or are going to vote today. they're saying that this whole thing is still a sham process because it doesn't give the president, quote unquote, due process. i think we'll see those arguments actually continue. >> all right. natasha bertrand and robert costa, thank you both for your reporting and for being on this morning. and still ahead on "morning joe," presidential candidate amy klobuchar is with us. she's rolling out her new message aimed at the president this morning. we've got our first look at that. her new ad, whiner in the white house is ahead. but first, one of her senate

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if it's connected, it's protected. call, click, or visit a store today. is it currently the policy of the united states that ukraine must conduct investigation has no burisma and crowd strike? >> no. >> why not? if this was the policy over the summer so why is it not the policy now? >> i had accepted as a hypothetical that that was our policy. i don't know that. it is not our policy. our policy has been to encourage any corruption reform generally in ukraine has something that i've worked on for over two years but never with respect to a particular investigation or company or individual. >> that was senator chris murphy yesterday and the testimony of u.s. deputy secretary of state john sullivan. and senator murphy joins us now.

he's the member of the senate foreign relations committee. >> so, senator, talk about john sullivan's testimony. did you find him to be pretty much a straight shooter? that, like most other people in the state department, wanted nothing to do with what john bolton has termed as rudy giuliani's drug deal? >> well, i like john sullivan, i think he's a good guy but i'm not exactly sure how the deputy secretary of state didn't know what was happening with respect to all these people working for him. kurts volker, gordon sondland, bill taylor given the fact that in may rudy giuliani was crowing he was going over to ukraine working with the u.s. government to try to get the ukrainians to interfere in an american election. so sullivan's testimony was that he didn't hear anything about this, the quid pro quo aspect of the scandal until the july 25th call. but even after that he doesn't seem to have done much actual digging as to what the truth was

because he was trying to testify yesterday that he still had no personal opinion as to whether this drug deal actually went down. i thought that was strained credibility, disappointing because i think sullivan is a pretty upstanding public servant. and if this kind of corruption was happening under his watch by people that worked for him, it's pretty unbelievable that he wasn't asking for questions. >> yeah, i mean, it is obviously disturbing. rudy giuliani -- i mean, the thing is, and we forget this, senator. this crime, if it is a crime, or this impeachable offense, it was happening in plain sight of the world. i've said it a million -- mika and i have said this repeatedly over the past several months. we were warned i believe it was late july, early august by somebody who had spent a lot of time working for america and america's interests in central and eastern europe said, hey, donald trump is holding up

military funding for the ukrainians in their fight against vladimir putin's invasion and he's doing it until ukraine investigates joe biden. and, by the way, i was reading that in the financial times, i was reading that in other other newspapers back in august. how could mr. sullivan not be aware or anybody not be aware that this drug deal was going down? >> it's absolutely impeachable if it looks what it appears to be. but it is also fundamentally corrupt for any presidential administration to be trying to get a foreign power to interfere in american politics, whether or not you're holding out aid in order to get that interference. and back in may, rudy giuliani was publicly crowing about his attempts to go to this new

novice president in ukraine and get him to do trump's dirty work to destroy the bidens. i sent a letter in may to the foreign relations committee dealing them that this was fundamentally corrupt, this was unacceptable in a democracy and that the foreign relations committee had to conduct investigations. so at that point the secretary of state, the deputy secretary of state should have shut down that back channel or they should are resigned if they couldn't get shut down, but they didn't. almost everybody involved in this scandal either tried to help perpetuate it or kept quiet. and that's -- no matter how many people come forward and tell the story now, the fact that they didn't do it until the whistleblower came forward is also pretty disappointing. >> well -- >> amazing actually. >> and speaking of disappointing, i want to ask you how disappointed you are in the fact that we have a secretary of state who was blessed with a west point education, a

secretary of state who is running around sounding like a frazzled parrot saying whatever the president of the united states puts into his head and even doing it yesterday starting a conspiracy theory on fox news that joe biden held up military aid for the sake of hunter biden. that is -- that is crowd strike -- a crowd strike-level conspiracy theory coming from a secretary of state who was blessed with a west point education and, yet, shames himself, shames this country, shames that great institution every day he does this in blind loyalty to a man who has no loyalty to himself or the office of the presidency or the constitution of the united states. >> so when you -- when you sign up for one of these jobs, whether you're a cabinet secretary or a member of congress, you pledge an oath and

your oath isn't to be president of the united states. your oath is to the constitution and the people that you serve. and ultimately whether it's the attorney general or the secretary of state, these seem to see their job as protecting the president, not protecting the constitution. and, you know, for somebody like mike pompeo who claims to be a patriot, i just don't understand how they see the long term damage that is done to the country by pretending that this is acceptable behavior. difference between a democracy and a tin pot dictatorship is in democracies we don't allow the chief executive to use the massive power of his office to try to destroy political rivals. and if republicans continue to defend the president's decision to do this, then guess what? sometime down the line they may be on the receiving end of a democratic president who sees this green light and tries to co-op the constitution and the powers of his or her office to destroy republicans.

that's why we don't allow anybody do this. >> senator, jonathan lemire. yesterday's hearing with john sullivan was about his nomination to be the u.s. ambassador to russia. you have outlined and a number of other critics is of the president have pointed out that so many of his foreign policies seemed to benefit moscow and vladimir putin and his interest in russia whether that be latest example some of his moves in syria. did you hear anything yesterday from the potentially soon to be ambassador to allay any of your concerns? do you feel that this government's administration policies towards russia would be in a healthier direction or do you still carry your suspicions? >> listen, i have all sorts of not just suspicions, but grave concerns about u.s. policy towards russia. john sullivan left alone would probably take a relatively hard line against russian aggression or interference in american elections but ultimately he's carrying out the policy of the president and the president has a soft spot for russia.

and, you know, of course the context of this ukraine scandal is important because at the very moment that this new president zelensky needed the united states to get their back because zelensky was negotiating with putin trying to get somed detene on the eastern border. and our public suggestion to zelensky that he needs to work out to on his own with vladimir putin played right in putin's hands. and zelensky ultimately got a worse deal with putin because america was so weak. and this is just the latest in a series of bizarre did he haver towards russia that has made russia much more powerful in and around the region than they have to be. >> senator chris murphy, thank you very much for coming on the show this morning. coming up, new polling shows former vice president joe biden's lead in the democratic primary race is slipping.

we'll dig into the new numbers ahead on "morning joe." be sure to check out knowyourvalue.com this week. we've got a brand-new interview with one of the greatest athletes of all time, tennis champion serena williams sat down with our own daniela at the forbes under 30 summit. williams is say leading voice in the push to stamp out an issue that affects one in four women in america. take a look. >> serena, i want to talk about your work with the all state foundation. you've teamed up with them for an amazing cause. tell us a little bit about it. >> i teamed up with all tate purple purse for domestic violence awareness month. but what's so important is financial abuse. people often can't even leave a situation because they're being abused so badly financially, that is, and that's an untold number of cases. >> people don't know the signs, right? >> no. and that's why i did this ad, it was about the signs. you can't use your credit card or someone's telling you how to spend your money or what do or

showing receipts for grocery store runs. those are some of the signs. >> what are some strategies that you have for women out there who are still struggling with it? >> it's an ugly subject to talk about but we have to talk about them and get comfortable with them. they're not the most fun, but they're probably the most effective ones and you never know when your voice is use who'd you can be helping. >> daniela who is the coauthor of my latest book "earn it" shared the stage with all three republican candidates challenging president trump. mark sanford, joe walsh, and bill weld. we'll show you more of that conversation tomorrow. and be sure to check out knowyourvalue.com for all of these great stories and interviews on knowing your value. "morning joe" is back in a moment. value. "morning joe" is back in a moment. ♪ there are things we would change about work.

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♪ walk on by ♪ stop ♪ walk on by >> joe biden's lead over senator elizabeth warren has narrowed in a new national poll. biden's lead in the newest usa

today suffolk university poll has fall tone nine points. he was up by 18 in august. the former vice president now sits at 26% down six points since the end of the summer. warren is at a statistical tie with senator bernie sanders, 17% to 13%, both within the polls almost five-point margin of error. mayor pete buttigieg follows closely behind at 10%. >> all right. >> the up three points. >> so steve rattner, looking at the numbers here, we, of course, see joe biden going down a little bit. this is a national poll, doesn't mean as much as some of the early state polls. but here we have news yesterday that kamala harris who was seen as a real challenger after the first debate now cutting staff and spending -- cutting all the spending at her campaign headquarters in baltimore really low to focus on iowa.

so, my gosh, this is happening to one candidate after another candidate. and, i mean, we're getting closer and closer to iowa and it's getting -- it's actually getting harder to figure out the shape of this race. >> yeah, couple things, joe. first you made a reference to this being a national poll versus the state polls. the last set of state polls i saw recently involved iowa and new hampshire are not great for vice president biden. in iowa it's essentially a four-way within the margin of error situation among sanders, warren, biden and mayor pete. and in new hampshire i think he was in third place behind sanders and warren, which was also a down tick for him. so it's become a dogfight among the top group. you do have this rich and poor thing. a dogfight among the top group and then the second tier starting to fall away. the only asterisk of caution i would put on that, i was thinking about it when i saw the kamala harris news last night, i

remember vividly in december of 2003 getting a call from john kerry who was literally truthdgg in the iowa winter when he was 4% in the poll at some low number asking him if i could find him another $2,000 so he could keep his operation going. and he ended up winning the iowa primary. you do have a number of these candidates, including kamala harris, including amy klobuchar who i think we'll be speaking with in a little bit, he staking an enormous a. themount of thei future in iowa and where kamala harris said she's going to spend thank ghi thanksgiving in iowa where going door to door there can make a difference. it's become a long shot, but iowa can be a graveyard for the front runners as well. >> it certainly can. yamiche, though you look at the man who's been seen as the front runner for so long, joe biden, joe biden could win iowa, he could win new hampshire, he

could sweep through south carolina and go all the way. there's also, though, the possibility and a lot of his fundraisers are starting to fear this, there is also a possibility he could finish third or north iowa, third or fourth in new hampshire and be crippled politically by the time he gets to south carolina. this race is wide open. >> this race is wide open. and it's still even though we've been talking about the 2020 election for a while, it's still fairly early in this race. there's this idea that a lot of these candidates are looking at iowa, looking at these first primary and saying if i can just get third or fourth that i can really continue to stay in this. and what you see, i think, in those numbers that you were showing there is really elizabeth warren having the steady climb and that people close to her and her campaign tell me that she's really feeling like really she's doing a slow march to the top. you can see her up 3%. you say she's statistically tied with bernie sanders. sanders had all the name recollection from 2016. he could have and should have

likely been at the top of this. back up what you see now is elizabeth warren taking the message of bernie sanders and th then bringing it forward. there are people who feel like elizabeth warren could be seen as someone who has a good chance of coming in very high in iowa and of really competing very well in new hampshire. i've talked to a couple candidates who say they're not going to look at new hampshire because they see it as already locked in for either bernie sanders or elizabeth warren. that's what you want if you're elizabeth warren. you want other candidates looking at you and saying i'm not going to compete in the states where i think elizabeth warren is going to win. >> coming up, presidential candidate senator amy klobuchar is standing by. i'm sure she has something to say about this discussion and she will join us next on "morning joe." e will join us nn "morning joe." mini is a different kind of car.

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that could allow hackers devices into your home.ys and like all doors, they're safer when locked. that's why you need xfinity xfi. with the xfi gateway, devices connected to your homes wifi are protected. which helps keep people outside from accessing your passwords, credit cards and cameras. and people inside from accidentally visiting sites that aren't secure. and if someone trys we'll let you know. xfi advanced security. if it's connected, it's protected. call, click, or visit a store today. americans are tired of

having a whine irreleva having a whiner in the white house. i won't govern by tweet, i'll lead with an optimistic economic agenda for all americans. rebuilding our infrastructure, lowering the cost of prescription drugs, investing in education and reducing student debt. i have a proven record of getting things done. together we can move forward because what unites us is so much stronger than what divides us. that's why approve this message. >> that's a new ad from presidential candidate amy klobuchar running on facebook and instagram across early primary states. senator klobuchar, as you can see, joins us now. great to have you back on the show. >> thank you. >> we were talking about the polls last block. what's your strategy to get a surge before iowa? >> well, a lot of this is getting my message out there, which did i in the last debate, mika, which is that, you know, i don't want to be the president for half of america. i want to be the president for all of america.

and that really means reaching out to people, including our fired up democratic base, but also reaching out to independents and moderate republicans and people that feel that this country needs to be governed by someone who doesn't want to have a yos every dchaosd actually has their back. i and think this impeachment that you've been talking about understandably some people say, oh, that's a separate thing. i think it's part of a pattern with this guy. he puts everything in front of our country, his own partisan interests, his own private business interests, you know, trying to have an international conference at one of his hotels. it goes on and on and on. and people see that. and the reason i picked that idea of using the whiner in the white house, a lot of times people call him a bully, and he is, but for working people, people that go to work that are working one, two, three jobs that are just trying to make it, to have someone that every

single day complains about everything, blames everyone, goes after everything, he whines. he literally whines while they're working hard. and i think that's a case that we need to make in the middle of the country. >> senator, good to see you. thanks for being here. on that, the news of the day is of course the vote the house is going to take. what is your assessment so far as to house speaker pelosi has handled these proceedings and as you're reading the testimony and hearing day in and day out, what's your assessment as to how this looks for the president and what happened? >> i think that they are handling this incredibly professionally. you know, you look at what's going on here, they are just gathering evidence and they're respectful the witnesses. they have 50-year veterans, graduates of west point, people that have served their country for years. and they are coming before them, giving testimony, and now they're going to have a public proceeding which i also knew that they would do. that's all this is about. they're gathering evidence and now it's going to be public where they're going to be asking

witnesses questions in public in front of the intelligence committee and then there will be a process in front of the judiciary committee. and i think it's very clear. then it goes over to the senate and that's where the trial occurs. that's where chief justice roberts is basically presiding over a trial with the senate. and this is very similar to processes in the past. is very processes in the past. this looks like a pretty normal process when we have such an important issue to decide. it was james madison who said those impeachment articles and provisions had to be in the constitution because he feared that a president would betray the trust of the american people to a foreign power >> speaking of fitbits, steve gets his steps every morning while he is here in terms of though -- there's so much of the heart of this matter

with ukraine is about foreign interference in an election. in 2016 we know, of course, that russia did so. one of the ways they were able to do that was through socia you saw yesterday, i want to get your reaction to twitter's announcement, they're not going the allow political ads online anymore. do you think other places, particularly facebook, should follow suit? >>ll if they're not going to lo for truth they should. i would hope we should have the same kind of rules in place you have for msnbc or any other network has or newspaper or radio. all that is saying that you have some kind of truth standard, but you also have to make sure that you keep those ads on file so that anyone can look at them, reporters, campaigns, and that you say where the money comes from. $3 to $4 billion will be spent on social media ads. can you imagine? last time in 2016 it was over $1 presidentia

billion. now it is going up that high. if they don't use twitter they will go with dirty ads on other platforms and there are no rules in place, nothing. that's what i'm trying to change with my bipartisan bill. but who has blocked? i don't think joe will be surprised by this. mitch mcconnell has blocked this bill as well as the bill for backup paper ballots for the 11 states that don't have them. this is a democracy issue. maybe we can turn to the democratic primaries and your strategy for hopefully getting to the top. there are a few pieces to this. one is money. we saw what kamala harris's announcement was last month. it has been tougher for some others to raiseto money. how do you navigate your way through the money problem to get to iowa and beyond? >> sure. we have had a surge in contributions since the debate. in thee first 24 hours we rais a million dollars online at

amyklobuchar.com and over $2 million in six days. thatn changed and allowed us t run the ads on tv, in new hampshire and in iowa, and it is going to allow us to do even more because it is hard if you don't have the resources to do it. then we have a grassroots effort, and that's how i came up. iam always have had less money my big races than my opponent and i have done it through getting out there, working harder than anyone. right after that debate i about a 30-hour, ten-day tour in new hampshire with three hours sleep and then went to iowa and basically did the same. that's what i'm going to do, and we're just going to get out there. i have the mostoi endorsements electeds and unelecteds in the state of iowa, and that's because people know i can lead and win. >> good morning, senator.mo i have heard a lot of different voters who want the field to be smaller because they want to be

able to make a choice between three or four people. the dnc, the democratic national committee, really raised the criteria for the debates in december, which pbs news hour will be hosting along with "politico". do you thinkal it is fair to rae the criteria? if it is not fair to do it that way, how do you think the dnc should narrow the field? >> i have no problem with what they've done. it is not easy, some of the criteria they've put in place but ihe try to meet every bar ie been given. i will go through to iowa, new hampshire and beyond no matter what, but we have made a poll for the december debates and i'm in for the november debates. i keep making the bars i'm given here. people want to narrow it down, but please remember there are a lot of successful presidents and winners for a party like bill clinton and jimmy carter who no one expected to win. even barack obama was way behind at this point.

so i think it is important you keep having a number of candidates in the mix. >> don't disagree with that. senator amy klobuchar, thank you for being on the show this morning. >> thank you. it is great to be on. still ahead, a major day in the trump impeachment push as the house prepares to take its first formal vote on the case. new revelations are bolstering claims of a quid pro quo and a potential coverup. "morning joe" is back in a moment. ♪ th ok own your look... ...with fewer lines. there's only one botox® cosmetic. it's the only one... ...fda approved... ...to temporarily make frown lines... ...crow's feet... ...and forehead lines... ...look better. the effects of botox® cosmetic, may spread hours to weeks after injection, causing serious symptoms. alert your doctor right away as difficulty swallowing, speaking, breathing, eye problems, or muscle weakness may be a sign of a life-threatening condition.

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here they are. one strike away, one out away. 3-2. there it is! the washington nationals, the world champions for the first time in franchise history. >> okay. here we go. >> who couldn't believe it? good morning and welcome to "morning joe." it is thursday, october 39 happy halloween. >> we have garrett hague. >> why even bother to start the show today in i know where you are going. >> well, of course. we are going to history. i mean i'm sorry you hate history. but, willie, first time since 1924. >> very cool. >> the washington senators and

there's a world champion in baseball in washington. i will tell you, i grew up and for years, decades, i grew up watching the redskins play with banners saying "bring baseball back to d.c.." well, my gosh, last night it came back in the most extraordinary way. >> uh-huh. >> what a great game. you have a couple of guys onset who stayed up all the way through the end, that's how good the game was. the nationals, "the washington post" reports this morning in may when they were 12 games under .500, 13-30-1, there were calls for the manager davie martinez's job, that the odds in vegas of the nationals winning the world series were 1.5%. that was in may. from that moment they went on an incredible tear. they won all four of their games on the road in houston in the series against the team with the best home record in baseball. greinke was cruising for the

astros, looked like it would be an epic serie and it was. he showed a crack and he cut the lead 2-1 and the flood gates opened for the nats. >> for houston there will be a lot of guessing, was greinke lifted too soon, should they have gone to cole, their best starting pitcher, but should he have come in in relief. you have seen kendricks home run right here. >> amazing. >> off the foul poland they tacked on a few runs at the end. the nationals' team deserves so much credit. they were down to the last few out against in brewers, down late in the decisive game in the division series round against the dodgers, and here they are in a series where the road team won every game to come back in the late innings on the road here in game seven. it was extraordinary and a real mix of older players like max scherzer who was so hurt two days ago he not only could not

make a start, he could barely get out of bed. >> right. >> young stars like juan soto. good for washington, which after decades of sports futility in the last couple of years won a stanley cup, the wnba team won and now the nationals. >> willie, come on, the houston astros team. >> wow. >> i still believe the best team of our time. certainly the best baseball team over the past three or four years. but you had the greatest team in baseball that just ran into a force of nature. i mean this was -- for non-baseball fans, my fellow boxing, maybe this was mike tyson versus buster. >> i love the goggles. >> nobody would have seen this coming. >> but what a comeback. as jonathan said, this is something that they did all year. >> yeah, they did it all year. you know, it was -- if you go back to may, this was duster douglas and tyson, but from that

point in may when they're 19-31, ford has as good a record as houston astros. that makes it all the more impressive and sweet for nats fans, is they beat one of the best teams certainly for the era but going back to many eras i think in the astros. scherzer walked out with the ball, probably didn't have his best stuff, astros were hitting pretty hard, but he got out keeping it 2-0 where the nationals could storm back and win the series. i think you will have a lot of tired guests on the show. >> i don't know, tired guests, but, jonathan, it has been a good break for us. we needed a year to be able to sleep a little more in october and november. of course, the red sox will be winning the world series again next year, but this was -- >> already got it booked. >> it was nice to let the nationals have it in 2019.

>> it was, joe. it was a thrilling playoff series. we should mention very quickly a shout out to baseball fans in montreal. this washington nationals team used to be the montreal expos. 25 years ago they were the best team in baseball when the season was cancelled because of the strike and never got a shot in the playoffs that year. i'm sure like i am, you will start upping your exercise. you will catch up on your rest. i believe it is 104 days, the red sox have a lot of decisions to make between now and then. they better resign mookie betts. i miss baseball already. excited for the spring. >> one last note and that's the bryce harper note which remember last season nationals lost the most coveted free agent in baseball, he left and went to philadelphia, they didn't have a good season. here help are dancing on the field having won the world series after having lost their

best player at the end of last season. >> the nationals had a frustrating run twisince 2005 w bryce harper on the team, never able to move forward. with the superstar gone, these guys, these kids win it all. it is exciting. as far as the red sox pitchers and catchers reporting, mika will tell you i'm working on my cutter. the bullpen was so week at the end of last year i think i've got a shot. i still only will be 56 by the time i get there, so -- >> you will be the seventh inning guy. >> i will have old man strength as i hurl my 47-miles-per-hour one in. they won't know what to do with it. >> we used to watch ekro run out there for the braves. you still have time. >> exactly. >> i'm sitting next to the most intense baseball coach i have ever seen in my life. so that was fun just watching you coach the kids. let's keep it at that.

>> they call me the woody hayes of babe ruth baseball. >> guys. >> sometimes a bobbie knight. sometimes a bobby knight. >> we'll talk. a lot going on, believe it or not, with multiple recent polls showing a majority of americans supporting the house impeachment inquiry. late last night the house rules committee advanced the democratic resolution laying out the next steps. the house is expected to begin debate on the resolution shortly after 9:00 a.m. this morning before voting on the measure. rules committee chairman jim mcgovern says the resolution sets the rules for open hearings as the impeachment probe moves into a public phase. according to "politico", top democrats are expected few directions during today's vote and few, if any, republican -- defections, excuse me. few, if any, republicans are expected to vote for the resolution. during last night's markup by the rules committee, republicans spent nearly four hours

attempting to pitch their own changes to the measure. "politico" notes that all of the gop amendments, which focused entirely on the process, were rejected on party lines. >> i think it is a sad day for the rules committee and for the institution of the house of representatives. in my view it is not a fair process. it is not an open process, and it certainly has not been a transparent process. it has been limited and closed and, frankly, i think we're moving toward a preordained result. >> i mean if you think this is fair, this is not fair at all. >> they're trying to create something new that i think is just substandard and dangerous to the presidency. >> the process seems to be treating chairman schiff as though he were a de facto special prosecutor, notwithstanding the fact he is a partisan member of congress whose strange behavior has already including fabricating a lengthy quotation and attributing it to president trump during an official hearing which he was chairing.

no due process now. maybe some later but only if we feel like it is not a standard that ever should be applied to any american and it should not be applied here to the president of the united states. >> you know, willie, it is so sad actually. these poor republicans, i mean can you imagine if you had to defend donald trump? it is just -- >> they don't have to. >> no, but they think they have to defend donald trump. so they'll set up a straw man and then nancy pelosi will knock it down. they'll set up another, knock it down. all they can do is argue process, process, process, process, and even when nancy pelosi and the rest of the democrats take those excuses away, they come up with others. they've been whining. oh, they've been whining, we need a vote on this impeachment inquiry. she finally gives them a vote and they say, well, it has taken them too long to give us a vote and now they're offended about that. this sort of whining though, let's keep it in perspective.

what you heard in the rules committee, that was actually the sound of minorities in the rules committee talking over the past 200 years, if the rules committee has been around in fact that long, because that's just what they do in the rules committee. the rules committee is set up for the majority of the house to set the rules for the debate, and the same as it ever was, the same as it ever was. you know the republicans have a losing fight on their hands because all they can do is talk about process. >> remember, this is nancy pelosi calling republicans' bluff because their argument was, well, this is not an official inquiry. nancy pelosi says, okay, we will have the vote and make it official and now they've moved down the road to another argument about that. as you say, they want to argue process because the substance gets more damning by the day when you have colonel vindman's testimony where he went to a white house lawyer immediately

on the 25th because he was concerned about what was said on the phone and the white house lawyer said according to reports let's get the transcript longed away so people can't see it into a top secret server. garrett hague, walk us through what we will see on capitol hill today. what is the house going to be doing? >> the house should vote in materially part of the day. it speaks to a lake of drama around the whip count, that we're not expecting it to be something that drags on late into the day. democrats hope to keep everybody on board for that. it will be a party line vote. you don't anticipate republicans coming across the line, in part because it is a process vote. you are not making a moral argument about the value of impeachment. what you are doing is setting up a roadmap, essentially a calendar with no dates on it for how the impeachment inquiry will continue. mcconnell is right about the very first part of it. what the resolution does is it will elevate the role of adam schiff significant live. this will put the ball in the

hand of schiff to go forward with the intel committee now driving the inquiry for the next couple of weeks. they will have the first open hearings. they will then be required to produce a report to hand over to the judiciary committee, and it will be left to the judiciary committee to put a bow on however many articles of impeachment they decide to produce a little further down the line. only then will you see involvement from the white house counsel's office, see something that looks a little more like the hearings folks saw during the clinton impeachment. for the next few weeks this will continue to be adam schiff's show as they move into public hearings. >> and with adam schiff taking the lead here, i mean that elevates the person that the president tried to make the face of this impeachment inquiry, that he feels like those -- he can effectively paint zhischiffe likes to go back to him, claim that he misquoted him in the testimony, that he is not acting in good faith. two questions for you first. are there any sense of democrats here who will not support the qu inquiry, and with these

committees run the show doesn't it sideline some of the president's most fiercest allies, the jim jordan's, mark meadows of the world so strongly defending him? >> yes, you are talking about the president wants adam schiff, well, the democrats don't want to see some of the other folks who have been the president's biggest defends, they're on two of the other committees handling the process behind closed doors so far but not on the intel committee. if you are the democrats you like your line-up card here, intel committee members versus intel committee members, perhaps better than you do if it were one or all of the other committees handling it or if it were the judiciary committee which has been since time immemorial the most partisan committee in congress. as for wayward democrats, they may still lose some votes here. about half a dozen democrats have yet to say anything supportive about the impeachment inquiry. only one of those that i've seen so far, joe cunningham from south carolina, has indicated that he might vote for this

resolution today, but the democrats can afford to lose a couple of votes on the process part of this here and let's see how the arguments continue to play out still ahead on "morning joe," the latest fall-out from the testimony on capitol hill that is poking huge holes in the president's claim of no quid pro quo. we'll run through the new developments next on "morning joe." ♪ u dr with drivewise. it lets you know when you go too fast... ...and brake too hard. with feedback to help you drive safer. giving you the power to actually lower your cost. unfortunately, it can't do anything about that. now that you know the truth... are you in good hands? - [woman] with my shark, i deep clean messes like this, this, and even this. but i don't have to clean this, because the self-cleaning brush roll

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the testimony of decorated war hero and top white house ukraine adviser, lieutenant colonel alexander vindman, seems to be doing major damage to the president's defense against impeachment. in terms of both a quid pro quo and a possible coverup. so let's start with the potential coverup. vindman's testimony is corroborating the claim in the whistle-blower complaint that the white house locked down all records of the president's july 25th phone call with his

ukrainian counterpart. citing people familiar with the testimony "the washington post" reports this. moments after president trump ended his phone call with ukraine's president on july 25th, an unsettled national security aid rushed to the office of white house lawyer john isenberg. vindman, who told house investigators that he was alarmed after hearing president trump pressure ukrainian president zelensky to investigate his political rivals, told isenberg that what the president did was wrong. according to two people familiar with vindman's account, isenberg then descri scribbled on a league pad and, quote, proposed a step other officials said is at odds with long-standing white house protocol, moving the transcript of the call to a highly classified server and restricting access to it. former trump national security officials also tell "the post" isenberg had moved at least one

other transcript of a trump phone call to that classified server. nbc news has learned from three sources that house impeachment investigators have asked isenberg and his deputy, michael ellis, to appear for a deposition on monday. we do not know if either intends to appear or if the white house will seek to block their appearances. the lieutenant colonel is also connecting other major dots in the probe. two sources familiar with his testimony tell nbc news that vindman told lawmakers that the white house meeting sought by the president of ukraine as well as the delivery of nearly $400 million in security and military aid was contingent on ukrainian officials carrying out multiple investigations sought by president trump including into the bidens, burisma and the 2016 election. sources say that vindman drew a direct line between the deliverables for ukraine and

those investigations sought by president trump. >> so, you know, steve ratner, it is very simple. vindman went to isenberg. told him of the president's misconduct, misconduct which will probably prove to be impeachable, and isenberg, the president's attorney, immediately took steps to cover it up and actually move unclassified material into a classified server. my god, that is serious business and it has been revealed now by isenberg. >> yes. >> about isenberg. i'm sorry. >> i'm sorry? >> yes, i say -- i said by isenberg. no, the coverup that isenberg is responsible for -- >> participated in. >> -- and participated in has now been exposed. >> what is extraordinary here is you now have a couple of new players who have at least entered the public consciousness in this thing that may well be

guilty of a coverup. the thing that i find most extraordinary about all of this is you now have had this parade of witnesses, career diplomats, career military people with no political agenda in any way, people who serve the president loyally for periods of time come forward one by one, and based on all of the testimony we've been able to hear about they've corroborated every single piece of the whistle-blower complaint. there has not been to my knowledge one substantive fact in the whistle-blower complaint that has been contradicted by any evidence that has been turned up, not just by intelligence committee but by anybody else working on it. now, as you say, on top of that we have things that go even beyond the whistle-blower complaint in terms of evidence of a coverup by people in the trump white house to keep us from finding out what the president and his aides actually did with respect to ukraine and the aid and the bidens and so forth. >> you know, willie, what is so funny when i hear people still -- republicans and trumpists on twitter or on cable news talking about the

whistle-blower, we're going to find out, like why don't they buy a pet rock? why don't they buy a mood ring? they're like so behind the times. it is ridiculous. that horse, as we say in the south, was let out of the barn several weeks ago and we found out that everything the whistle-blower said happened has happened now. so why exactly are these republicans still trying to improperly track down the identity of a whistle-blower who ended up being correct? >> because, once again, they want to change the subject from the substance of what the whistle-blower reported to the whistle-blower's background as they've tried to do unsuccessfully with bill taylor and some people tried to do with colonel vindman. the identity of the whistle-blower does not change what was in the whistle-blower's report and what has since been corroborated by a number of

witnesses. jeff bennett, we may get more corroboration. obviously john bolton is the big fish most people want to hear from. >> right. >> he has been called next week. his attorneys say he will not come voluntarily, but if he is subpoenaed he may show up on capitol hill. another big witness today actually in timothy morrison. tell us who he is and why he may be so significant because he was also on that jewel 25uly 25th p call listening. >> he was and he's a central figure in the case the democrats are building, willie, because if you go back to taylor's testimony, the acting ambassador to ukraine, taylor mentions morrison some 15 times. it has to do largely with morrison's misgivings about the entire ukrainian pressure campaign. morrison wasn't part of the nsc long but as you point out he listened in on the call. according to testimony, he told other white house or state department officials after the fact it did not go that well. i'm paraphrasing something

taylor said that morrison told him. we learned yet morrison let the white house know he is leaving the nsc and he would be the third official to do that. you have kurt volker, you have michael mckinley, both of them resigned amid the impeachment probe. volker resign so he would be freed up in terms of what he could tell house investigators. so morrison is set to ahere here today. i want to return back the something mika said about lieutenant colonel vindman as she talked about our reporting as he talked about those contingencies, the direct contingency, the direct line president trump drew between the white house deliverables and the ask for ukraine to open investigations into president trump's political rivals. what is so interesting about that is that in his opening testimony, which we obtained, vindman said in his view it was not proper for this administration to demand that a foreign government investigate a u.s. official. that word "demand," willie, struck us as curious and conspicuous.

he could have picked any number of words. he would have said it wasn't proper for the government to request, to suggest, to encourage. he used the word demand. it turns out he went beyond the opening statement in his testimony and said explicitly that the white house, that president trump -- the white house officials at president trump's behest rather, explicitly linked the white house deliverables and a demand for investigations into burisma, into the bidens, into the 2016 campaign. vindman really telegraphing that quid pro quo president trump and his allies say do not exist, the same quid pro quo, mind you, mick mulvaney admitted to before trying to walk it back a day later, willie. >> earlier in the show we examined the president's claim that the u.s. economy right now is, quote, the greatest ever. we will go live to cnbc for how the markets are reacting to the new gdp numbers. "morning joe" is back in a moment.

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products approved by voters. prop c means more kids vaping. that's a dangerous idea. vote no on juul. no on big tobacco. no on prop c. welcome back to "morning joe." the pentagon has revealed new details of the mission that killed isis leader abu bakr al baghdadi and released video from

the raid. marine corps general mackenzie said the operation included helicopters, drones and jets, and upon arrival at baghdadi's compound they took fire from two separate groups not believed to be affiliated with isis. the u.s. team responded with a helicopter airstrike on one of the groups which appeared to include about ten people. once on the ground, the team cleared a number of noncombatants including 11 children while five isis members inside the compound, four women and one man, all wearing suicide vests were killed when they approached, quote, in a threatening manner. baghdadi, who by now had fled into a tunnel with two children, killed himself and the two children, quote, when capture was imminent. yet there are some details that mackenzie, like other top members of the administration, could not confirm. >> could you confirm that

baghdadi, his final moments, the president said he was whimpering and crying in his final moments? >> i can tell you this. he crawled into a hole with two small children and blew himself up while his people stayed on the ground. you can deduce what kind of person that is from what he did. i can't confirm that one way or another. >> president trump has declassified the name of the military dog from the baghdadi mission while announcing he will be coming to the white house next week. trump revealed that the dog's name is conan while responding to one of his own tweets of an altered photograph from "the daily wire," the president giving a paw medal of honor to the pooch. in the original picture trump was awarding the medal of honor to james mcewen, a retired army medic, credited with saving the lives of ten men during the

vietnam war. mccloughan was not offended. he said that it was accepted on behalf of the entire team which canines have long been a part of. he worked with dogs helping to detect enemy activity. california businessman jeffrey bizack was sentenced to two months in prison for participating in the scam. prosecutors say he paid $250,000 to get his son admitted to the university of southern california as a volleyball recruit even though his son does not play the sport. he pled guilty in july to conspiracy to commit mail fraud and honest services mail fraud. on top of the prison time he was sentenced to three years of supervised release, 300 hours of

community service and was ordered to pay a $250,000 fine. he is the 12th parent to be sentenced in the scheme. and still ahead, yesterday was the gdp. tomorrow it is the monthly jobs report. we'll go live to cnbc on this busy week of economic numbers. over at know your value.com, another critical issue with clear impacts on the economy, women in stem, science, technology, engineering and math. l'oreal usa is taking the lead with independent research on the front and the findings are eye opening. the numbers suggest women in the arena are thriving and opportunities are on the rise. still, a staggering 91% say gender discrimination remains a career obstacle and a full 100% agreed that self-doubt and a lack of confidence stand in their way. so head over to

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see how investing with a j.p. morgan advisor can help you. visit your local chase branch. 38 past the hour. it appears president trump is rewarding his staunchest supporters when it comes to backing him against impeachment. with money. according to "politico", trump is tapping into his fundraising network, which has raised over $300 million this year, to help senators who are facing tough reelections and have signed on to the republican-backed resolution condemning the inquiry as unprecedented and undemocratic. senators who have signed on so far include cory gardner, joni ernst and tom tillis. yesterday the trump reelection campaign sent a fundraising appeal to donors, urging them to contribute to the president and

these senators, saying, "if we don't post strong fundraising numbers, we won't be able to defend the president from this baseless impeachment witch hunt." noticeably absent from the list of senators, trump urged donors to contribute to susan collins and martha mcsally. let's bring in professor at princeton university eddie claude jr. eddy, i guess money talks. is that what this is about? >> absolutely and it makes sense. president trump has to do what he has to do in order to shore up his support. we've said all along on this show and in other places that those senators who were up for reelection in the battleground states would face a very difficult reelection given the circumstances surrounding the president. so it makes sense that the campaign would use their large and vast war chest to try to shore up their opportunities, because they're going to have to go out and defend what donald trump has done. they're going to have to defend donald trump in places, at least

what we saw in 2018, which suggested they very well may lose their seat. >> and it comes in a moment when the white house is trying to really rally republicans to fight not just the process but the message on impeachment, trying to defend the president and say that he didn't do anything wrong and money is a way to do that. the story also notes the president next week is appearing at a reception for the senate leadership fund, which is a super pac closely affiliated with mitch mcconnell, who of course will drive what the trial proes wou process would be in kentucky. how effective do you think it is particularly from some of the senators mika just mentioned who are facing really tough reelection fights, who some of the voters probably will not be in feign avor of them defending president. >> i'm not sure i would want to be cory gardner this next year because he's in a tough spot. he is in a purple state where he is going to have a tough opponent in john hickenlooper.

i think joni ernst is in a slightly better position and tom tillis in between. i think trump is putting their feet to the fire and saying, are you with me, are you not with me? i don't know what they're going to do. sounds like those three probably will go with him. susan collins probably less so and we'll see how it unfolds. this is part of trump's not even hostile takeover of the republican party where he has brought them all into his camp. >> complete ownership. >> he has a special approach to the economy as well and we will get to that now. the commerce reported yesterday that growth in domestic product in the second quarter was at 1.9%. president trump touted the data on twitter yesterday writing in part, quote, "the greatest economy in american history." he should tell that to donald trump of 2012 who tweeted in may of that year when growth was the exact same 1.9% under president obama, quote, the economy is in

deep trouble. hmm, confusing. during his 2016 presidential campaign trump boasted the potential for growth to reach 3% to 4%, an annual base he has yet to achieve. for more on this let's bring in cnbc's dominic chu. what are we supposed to take away in terms of the presidentes a translation of how the economy is doing? >> certainly he has an ax to grind, right, mika. he is trying to make sure that the american public knows it is in a good shape prior to the election. there are still things to be done with regard to what is happening with the u.s. side of things both on jobs and on international trade, but what is curious about this on wall street is that it was a record high for the stock market just yesterday, and what the federal reserve did probably had a huge amount to do with it. it cut interest rates by a quarter of a percent. by the way, that's the third time they've cut rates this year

and fed chairman jay powell has come under all kind of pressure from president trump to lower rates in an effort to boost markets. what powell signalled yesterday is it is not going to be likely part of a rg laegular campaign lower interest rates unless the economy takes a turn for the worse. probably president trump is thinking i should go after fed chair jay powell in this whole thing. one of the reasons i would say the fed may have to cut rates more so and why they did it yesterday is perhaps some of the economic stress abroad like in hong kong where the economy shrunk by 3.2% in the third quarter. that's even worse than a lot of people had thought. that follows a contraction in the second quarter as well, which means many economists and analysts will say that hong kong is in a technical recession. so the ongoing pro-democracy protests there along with ongoing u.s./china trade disputes are taking their toll on that economy. earlier this morning cosmetics

giantes t giant este lauder cut for a lot of the same reasons. one thing you won't see anymore and a lot of the rhetoric in political advertising, you guys were just talking about some of the moves, you won't see any kind of political advertising on twitter anymore. that's because the social media platform's ceo, jack dorsey, tweeted the change in policy yesterday to stop all police cal advertising on the twitter platform across the globe. they say, quote, we believe political message reach should be earned, not bought, and that political messages should gain traction because of their merit and not be promised by money. that stance, of course, guys very different than social media giant facebook and its ceo mark zuckerberg who have come under all kind of fire for not removing or fact checking political advertising. so all of this, economy, politics, all swirling together

and that's what traders are watching today, mika, on wall street here. >> cnbc's dominic chu. thank you very much. eddie, your thoughts on the twitter decision? >> i think it is a great thing for our democracy, a democracy that is in some ways under assault by a number of different forces. it makes sense to me, given the outside influence of forces outside of the united states that have tried to in some ways have an impact on our elections and, you know, in some ways it also speaks to i think the disastrous citizens united decision where outside influence of money in our democratic process can skew in some ways outcomes. i think twitter, the ceo is really ahead of the game here. i think it is a good thing. we need to figure out a way to get big money out of our politics so our democracy can function better. >> right. i think the pressure now goes to faetsch and other places. >> exactly. >> will they enact a similar system or at least put up some sort of standards together.

steve, you were saying a few minutes as we teased this segment that google has something like that, they actually have a standards department as opposed to facebook which sort of takes whatever they have and puts it on line. let's a be cle let's be clear, this is a step in the right direction for twitter, but twitter has a fraction of the reach facebook does in terms of political advertising. >> google has what newspapers used to have but much less of a factor for screening all kind of ads that are fraudulent, that make increate claiorrect claims the line in terms of decency and make it work. zuckerberg has taken a stand on free speech, the right of everybody to be spoken. i have read political advertising is only .5% of facebook's revenue so it is not like it would be a big economic hit for him to do something like this or at least something like what google does. >> i would totally agree. for twitter, what a sign of

corporate responsibility in terms of the product they have and that they offer. i don't understand why it is so hard for other tech companies. before we sneak into our final break, because we love polls on this show, here is one just for today. a recent monmouth university poll asked americans what their favorite halloween candy is. over one third -- this is good. over a third picked reese's peanut butter cups. totally agree. 18% said snickers. yep, had one last night. 11% picked m & ms. 6% chose candy corn. my gosh. plain hershey bars and 5% said skittles. i love candy. according to "usa today" and candy store.com, the most sold candy during halloween over the past ten years has been skittles followed by reese's peanut butter companies, m & ms and

final l finally star burst. willie is over at the "today" show and they're having their costume review. here he is as johnnie castle, patrick swayze's character in "dirty dancing." ♪ ♪ i had the time of my life ♪ never felt like this before ♪ cause i had the time of my life ♪ ♪ and i owe it all to you ♪ ♪ you're the one thing ♪ i can't get enough of ♪ so i'll tell you something >> hey, guys, this is important. ♪ this could be love >> this is -- i know your value skill i teach women. if you are going to do something, you go big or go home, and that's what willie is doing right now. i got to hand it to him. do you agree?

>> i love the movie and i love willie, yeah. >> go big or go home, baby, and he did it. >> how long do we think he rehearsed like that? >> not long. >> when you can dance like willie, no need to rehearse. that's all natural from within. >> that was worth watching. now we can hold it against him for quite a long time. >> indeed. moving on our next guest is examining the collision between internet and racial justice. it is an important conversation and it is next on "morning joe." ♪ ♪

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joining us now, the vice o probost and a professor of media. she author of the new book "black software." from the afro net to black lives matter. thank you for being on the on the show this morning. the book explores -- >> sorry, the book explores the worship between the internet, black americans, and racial activism, what did you find? >> what i set out to find was to understand the roots of black lives matter, one of the most

powerful racial justice movements that we have known. what i found as i tried to seek those answers was a group of early black technologists that really received technology and platforms to build an internet that was for and by black people and in the interest of black people and used it to bring them on to the early web and the early 90s. >> so this idea of the early pioneers, right? what did they see? did they see thousand was shaping technology? or the absence to the particulari

particularity. in some ways some of these very ak activists you write about. >> they got into it often because they did not see themselves. they saw technology that started to get used more and more often by more and more people that was in the businesses they were running, it was in their communities, but they did not see themselves. and so folks like a kamal kamala almansure they were listening to a professor talk about building culture and he saw all of these white guys and he says i have not seen my culture, i have note seen me and i want to do something about it. >> where do you see it there, is

there a sflois what the mega companies do? >> i think in some small way, but we all know that african-americans are under rated generally. facebook, google, and across the board and it remains such even as they say hey, we want to diverse if i, and it is hard to believe that such small numbers of people in such massive companies really had the power to make the kinds of changes we need. >> so just to follow up, is there a talent pool of black engineers for them to be hired. what do you see for students coming through the pipeline to try to change this unfortunate situation. >> i think go to the pipeline as the first excuse for why we don't have the representation that we have in tech and the

fact is that we over look many of the folks there in that pipeline. and that is much a part of what black software was about when we go back to the 80s and the 90s, and black folks were saying that they were not online, but there was millions of folks who were and they were doing things very powerfully, and i think it is the same when we think of representation of tech today. we need a voice to and an entry point to the folks there. >> you tell the story looking backwards, what do you see moving forward? >> i see struggle and i think that is the story. when new mediums come on line, folks able to grasp and take hold of that to use it for our purposes very quickly the powers at be seize those again to

thwart those. i have no illusions that things will get better, but i think the future gives us persistent struggle and i think that is where the optimism is at. i think that is where we see suici citizens take advantage of media environments and they just consistently push and push and push. >> the new book is blackso"blac software." and in our final few moments, jonathan what are your thoughts as we look ahead to impeachment proceedings officially starting today. >> it is a significant, historic day. they will hold a vote in the next few hours to commence the impeachment proceedings. we will hear from the president in response. he doesn't have a public schedule today. today's move takes away one of the republicans arguments about

process, and it makes us more about the substance of what the president is alleged to have done. also, happy halloween, my two boys are going as dinosaurs and i plan to go as willy geist. >> steve, what are you going to be for halloween. >> my kids are grown and gone so i will be home alone with no trick or treaters. i think jonathan really summed up today well. donald trump is coming to new york on saturday, apparently to go to a boxing match, apparently simply to amuse himself, and it costs millions of dollars to taxpayers, it is also a marathon sunday, and he will make it even worse. this is just another self indulgent move by our president.

>> here we go. i will also add that i think it is a sad day as the impeachment procedures officially start. the house will start voting on the impeachment resolution. you'll have full coverage all deta day long on msnbc. stephanie rule picks up the coverage right knew. it is thursday, october 31sst ad we start with breaking news. members of the house are gathering to debate on a resolution that sets the rules for the impeachment inquiry, sets the stage for public hearings, and sets us on a court for the senate trial. we have to dd big into this and more, how is this day going to unfold? >> by noon it ought to be over here, we're expecting a debate to begin this