his subscriptions. he still has both of those apps on his iphone. >> you're familiar with his iphone. >> he is still able to read "the new york times" and he's still tweeting about the stories. thank you. we're going dob reading axios a.m. in a bit. you can sign up at signup.axios.com. >> what kind of apps are on your phone? that does it for us on this monday morning. "morning joe" starts right now. you know the truth is anybody that these they're a great salesman, usually they're not a very good salesman. there's the water company. we sell water and we have water. trump steaks, where are the steaks? we have trump steaks if t. it's called the jewel of palm beach, it goes to my clubs. i've had it for years. anybody want one?

my club champion. trump airline. i sold the airline and made a great deal. by the way, the winery, it's the largest winery on the east coast. and trump university, we're going to start it up as soon as i win the lawsuit. the truth have anybody that says they're a great salesman, usually they're not a very good sale mans, it's true. >> okay, self awareness definitely not his strongest suit, among other things. good morning and welcome to "morning joe." it's monday, november 4th. with us we have msnbc contributor mike barn knack will. national correspondent for in news and msnbc and author of the red and the blue, steve kornacki is with us. white house reporter for "the associated press" jonathan lemire. former chairman of the republican national committee michael steele. and former chief of staff to the dccc and an msnbc contributor,

adrienne elrod. up late last night. joe is off on dad duty this week for a couple of days, but another big week in the impeachment inquiry and what's expected to be the final few days of closed-door testimony before open hearings begin. so what's the administration's strategy? well, that are depends on the day. the president is bouncing between trying to out the whistleblower and intimidate a witness. republicans appear poised to acknowledge a quid pro quo. but insist that it's not that high of a crime and misdemeanor. and kellyanne conway is pulling a mick mulvaney and really confusing the matter. it all comes with more new polls showing nearly half of americans support impeaching and removing president trump from office. meanwhile, there is new 2020 polling on the democrat side. we'll get into the state of that race in just a moment as elizabeth warren defends her plan to fund medicare for all. could 2020 shape up to be a

demagog versus an idea log? we'll talk about that. but president trump was active on twitter and the increased frequency is usually a sign of he's distracted or nervous about something. trump tweet and retweeted 75 times over the weekend up until just after midnight last night, everything from retweets of the likes of jeanine pirro and mark levin praising a ufc fighter, he also attacked the whistleblower. the whistleblower got it so wrong that he must come forward. the fake news media knows who he is but being an arm of the democrat party don't want to reveal him because there would be hell to pay. reveal the whistleblower and end the impeachment hoax to which

me mimi wrote this. if shifty adam schiff who is a corrupt politician who fraudulently made up what i said on the call is allowed to release transcripts of the never trumpers and others that were interviewed, he will change the words that were said to suit the dems purposes. republicans should give their own transcripts of the interviews to contrast with schiff's manipulated house republican. he is a proven liar, leaker, and freak. this is our president. who is really the one who should be impeached. so which brian klas responded. trump calls the chairman of the house intelligence commit ttee freak and invents an insane conspiracy theory and it will barely be a story. that's where we are.

democracy erodes when previously unthinkable conduct becomes so routine that it's barely even noticed by voters. that was the warning mike barn knack will, real quick, that madeleine albright gave so early op on in this presidency especially with her book. >> you know what's interesting is comments about releasing the transcripts. steve, you would know this, a lot of people would know this, the stenographer that takes down the transcript, it's not a republican transcript, it's not a democratic transcript, it's an independent person, you're sworn that this is an accurate transcript that you're taking. the idea that the republicans have a different transcript than the democrats, it's absurd. >> the president found time to attack the purple heart recipient who testified last week labeling him a never trumper and threatening to reveal proof. look at this.

>> what evidence do you have that colonel vindman say never trumper? >> we'll be showing that to you real soon, okay. >> threatening him. tom nichols sums up president trump's unhinged weekend best writing it's not political polarization when people refuse to see tweets like this as a sign of a person who is unwe will unwell to support his behavior. and a man who controls a nuclear arsenal is evidence of moral rot among millions of americans. jonathan lemire, you were with the president all weekend. what was different? and i then want to get to michael steele about the republicans allowing this kind of behavior. but first, the president this weekend, your thoughts. >> well, we saw the president in public just once on his way to and from that ufc fight in madison garden. i was part of the press pool for that. i didn't see barn knack wiicle

front row seat. >> he couldn't make it. >> i liked the world series where he was loudly booed. and one of the fighters got kicked unconscious in front of us. but behind the scenes we saw him briefly make comments behind the lawn, he's fixated on the impeachment inquiry. we seem to be going a couple different directions. he and republican allies are trying to smear the character of some key witnesses here. vindman who is a purple heart recipient suggesting that he has a political agenda here and others said not loyal to his country because he's an immigrant and has ukrainian roots. that's a sinister allegation. his name is protected by federal protections, the name has leaked, it seems the president is dancing with the idea of unveiling him itself which would send this to another constitutional firestorm if he

were do so suggesting that, he of course, the whistleblower can't be believed because he's a, quote, never trumper or someone who has a political agenda. then you're seeing as you hit the opening, the idea of republicans trying to change their strategy with the concept of a quid pro quo, either say well, all presidents do this, this is not usual, or saying, yes, he did it and maybe it wasn't great, but it's not an impeachable offense. but the president himself who refuses to suggest he did anything wrong last night on twitter pushed back against that and said there was no quid pro quo, i didn't do anything wrong. so again republicans really seem to have a muddle in terms of a strategy to defend themselves and the president during this inquiry. >> michael steele, it's hard to not find yourself recycling the same story as we tell the story of the republicans. but if you could speak face-to-face to these republicans who are acting as trump's front men, mccarthy, scalise, and others, especially in terms of the rot that chips

away at our democracy, these tweets, intimidating a witness, bullying people, trying to not follow the law, refusing to comply with subpoenas. if you could talk to them face-to-face and confront them about the way this president is buying them off with attention, access, campaign money, what would you ask them to do? what could you say that could change this very unhealthy dynamic? >> well, i don't know if there's anything that i could say or any of us could say at this point that hasn't already been said. but i will ask this. is it worth it? is it really worth it? is the value of democracy, the rule of law, the very ideal and principles that you've espoused for your entire political career, that you ran on as a freshman congressman or a two-term senator as a leader both in the party and the country, is it worth it? is this one man worth all that

you are sacrificing right now? and then the second part of that would be, where are you going to dry the line? if you didn't draw it at charlottesville, if you didn't draw it at baltimore, if you didn't draw it at locking kids up in cages, if you didn't draw it at, you, a muslim ban, where are you going to draw the line? because that, as an american, not as a republican, not as a partisan, as an american i want to know from my leaders where you draw the line. i know where i've drawn it and i know where countless of americans have drawn it. but where have you drown iawn i? and if you haven't drawn it, please let us know when you do. that's the problem. these guys are so afraid of this one man that they're willing to sacrifice everything that they've stood on. the other thing, all this talk over the weekend about a civil war around donald trump?

and i'll ask, are you really prepared to sit down with your constituents and support a, quote, civil war because donald trump is in political trouble because of his own problems, what he's done? you're going to stand up for that? so draw me the line and let me know where it is, make it bright and red so the rest of us will know as well, and then we'll understand exactly who you are and what kind of party you represent. >> well, three new polls out over the weekend show nearly half of americans support impeaching and removing president trump from office. according to a new nbc news "wall street journal" poll, 53% of americans say they approve of the house impeachment inquiry into president trump. 44% said they disapprove of the probe. almost half, 49%, said trump should be impeached and removed from office. up six points from early october, 46 opposed down three. in the latest fox news poll, 49% also agreed that trump should be

impeached and removed from office. over half polled, 52%, called the inquiry a legitimate investigation into an important issue. 39% said that it is a bogus attempt to undermine trump's presidency. and in the newest "washington post" abc news poll, 49% of americans said that president trump should be impeached and removed. 47% opposed impeachment. president trump dismissed this new polling. remember he used to love pogs? he polls? he dismissed it when pressed by reporters at the white house yesterday afternoon. >> mr. president, according to several recent polls, more americans want you to be impeached and removed from office than more americans who don't. >> you're reading the wrong polls. you're reading the wrong pouls. >> abc, nbc -- >> i have the real polls. the cnn polls are fake. the fox polls have always been lousy. i tell them they need to get a new polster.

but you look at the polls that came out this morning, people don't want anything to do with impeachment. it's a phony scam. it's a hoax. >> wow. adrienne elrod, just in terms of the democrats' strategy, is this an opportunity or, again, more p pitfalls? especially the shaping of the truth at the president's whim? >> it's an opportunity, mika, and that's what you're seeing with the leadership so far with speaker pelosi who we talked about many times on the show has been so careful and methodical about this entire impeachment process. she is sticking to the facts. she is run the entire process aboveboard. think about this. we see these polling results that show at this point in the process when the impeachment process has really not even started to take shape that a majority of americans for the first time support impeaching donald trump and removing him from office. think about how those numbers are going to shift when we start seeing public testimony, when we start seeing credible witness

after credible witness on national television in front of millions of americans talking to congress and getting the facts out there for the entire public to see. what we're also seeing, mika, of course from this polling is that more independents are starting to say, you know what? we don't trust this president. we don't want to see limb in offihim in office. those are the numbers as to whether he get elect order defeated at the ballot box in 2020. >> steve, i don't think there's a lot of background and examples or parallels to polls that are asking whether or not the president should be removed from office so it's hard to look into history. but the numbers are up ticking in terms of removal, which is i think stunning, isn't it? >> they have moved the question is are they going to stop here or continue to move? one way of looking at these numbers on an array of different questions is they may all kind of be converging at the same place. trump's approval rating in our new nbc poll over the weekend,

45%. the percent who say they don't want him removed from office, 46%. the amount he got in the election, 46%. is it opinion converging on the same basic fault line that's defined donald trump and all trump-related issues for the last three years. if it stays there and where it is right now, i don't think you have a problem because the republican base is still behind him. >> an impeachment during an election year,on that lemire, are there any tracks on the republican side perhaps in the senate where they're saying if i had to be asked on the record whether or not to vote on this, would we see some movement? >> well, what republicans say publicly and privately about this president has always been different. most republicans right now are hiding behind or i shouldn't say hiding, perhaps genuinely saying

that there could be jurors in a senate trial and they don't want to prejudice themselves now by saying so. certainly some republican senators are come out and made it clear that they think this is indeed a witch-hunt, to borrow the president's phrase, that they think the whole matter say sham and they believe they would not cast a vote to remove the president. others are being more cagey and center mitt romneys and fewer republicans are very unwilling to be outspoken against the president. they're not committing to removing but certainly those in the white house who -- they're tallying voters here. they're away there's a very likely scenario that we will indeed see an impeachment trial in the senate at some point. they're watching. they're doing some head counting and someone like romney is someone they are nervous about. to this point, to back up what steve was saying, this president is still very, very popular among republicans. and that's what the president and his advisers are counting on. they feel like that any republican lawmaker, whether in the house or in the senate who breaks with the president, who goes for impeachment, who wants

donald trump removed from office, you know, is going to feel the wrath of the base. and we have seen donald trump sutly and not so slit subtly say he would back their opponents. he's got three rallies this week backing republicans. they feel good about keeping the republicans in line, but if the polls keep trickling one way or the other, that could change. >> mike. >> steve, those pro impeachment numbers that we see in poll after poll after poll. anecdotally if you speak to people about impeachment, i often wonder, is there a category into that number with a response instead of saying, yes, it's sort of i guess so. i mean, people were so overloaded with information about impeachment now and the president only adds to it each day with his behavior. the i guess so number is pretty good. >> the other question there, too, this is true right now when

you ask about the difference between do you support the impeachment inquiry? and you saw there, a couple points higher. solidly every poll i've seen there's a majority support for the inquiry. we've seen this the last few years when you were asking the question of impeachment in relation to the mueller investigation, the impeachment support number was much lower. but even back then if you said well, don't impeach but keep investigating, there's always been a lot more support just for the idea of investigating, of having hearings, of looking into trump. so that category of you know what? let's not look away, but let's not necessarily commit to going all the way to removal, i do think there's something there, yeah. >> still ahead at the top of the show, we engs manimentioned the polling on the race. we'll dig into those numbers next with steve kornacki. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. watching " we'll be right back. i have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. now, there's skyrizi.

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banks, i'm going to tax the banks. duh. what did you think i was going to do, hold up a gas station? come on. they're going to pay for it and not one penny from the middle class and all we got to do is convince jp morgan to operate like a nonprofit. okay, next question. >> hi, sorry. i have a follow-up because i'm annoying. you said your plan would cost 20.5 trillion but other economists have said it could cost 34 trillion. >> right. okay, let me stop you right there. we're talking trillions. you know, when the numbers are this big, they're just pretend. there ain't no -- you ready to get red pilled? money doesn't exist. it's just a promise from a computer. you might as well say it costs

ferteen nongill on. >> i'm going to seed to see the imagine on that. >> look at this here. yeah. do you understand this? i do. i could explain it to you but you'd die. >> all right. saturday nightlife, i love it. joe biden and elizabeth warren continue to fight it out for the lead of the 2020 democratic bill. according to three new pills. steve, let's look at those. biden at 27% and warren at 23% sitting within five point mar given error. bernie sanders up five points since september, now since at 19% at biden and warren are tied in the wash post abc news poll. the former vice president has 28%, warren has 23%, up five points since september. both sit within that poll's

almost six-point mar kitchen error. sanders follows in third place with 17%. in the latest fox news poll, biden is at 31% lead big ten points. warren at 21%. sanders at 19. another statistical tie. in hypothetical matchups against president trump, according to the newest nbc news "wall street journal" poll, both biden and warren would lead the president with 50% of the vote. trump would fair one point better against warren with 42% of support versus 41% against biden. and in the fox news head to head, biden would have a 12-point advantage over trump, 51 to 39%. sanders would lead by eight points, 49 to 41. and warren by five, 46 to 41. steve, break it down for us. >> there's two pictures here. we're talking about the general elections, the head to head matchups. there's two things to keep in mind. the first national numbers, what

you showed is consistent with what we've been seeing for a few months here. every time i see biden matched up against trump general election it's a high single digit, low double digit lead for him. warren has been leading him pretty consistently there nationally. that's one part of the picture. you see a president who has a 53% disapproval rating, 49% of the country saying they want him impeached and removed from office. he's going to be trailing in these polls. what just came out this morning, "new york times" did a survey of six key battleground states there, pennsylvania, michigan, wisconsin, florida, north carolina. if trump wants to win, they have to win three of these six states. if those head to head they've got biden up on trump in four of those states, sanders up in three and warren up in one. so close. >> how did those polls look you

to, adrienne, he wi elrod, and expect any changes ahead especially given the latest news of elizabeth warren revealing her plan to pay for medicare for all? >> yeah. i mean, a couple things, mika. number one i look at those polls and i think donald trump is in real trouble in terms of getting re-elected. we look at all the national polls and head to heads with some of the top democratic contenders versus trump and they show one thing, which is usually that donald trump is losing to elizabeth warren, joe biden, bernie sanders, et cetera. but then you dig down into some of the battleground polls which is where this race is going to be won and fought and trump is under water especially when it comes to joe biden. joe biden beating him in four of those six major polls which is where you've got to win in those battleground states in order to get -- to do well in the presidency you've got to do well in those states. that's why joe biden has done so well among the democratic

primary electorate at that point, because they see him, even though -- if he stumbles along the way, they see him as the most electable against donald trump. that really hasn't shifted much since the beginning of this race. i also think when elizabeth warren came out with her price tag for her medicare for all plan on friday, that really -- of that was a moment for joe biden to seize on the fact that he wants to build and repair obamacare but not replace it with something expansive and expensive like medicare for all. and then the biden campaign, to their credit, seized on that moment and capitalized on it. i think you'll see that play out in the next debate. but the race is tightening. we expected this to happen. iowa is going to be a battle. all the first four early states are going to be a battle. but right now joe biden is positioned to well in south carolina and think that's going to carry him into super tuesday which is for the first time ever is very, very delegate heavy state in this primary. >> mike. >> give us those states again and give us elizabeth warren's numbers.

>> the six states here, this is among registered voters, "new york times" siena poll here. pennsylvania, among registered voters they got an even race trump versus warren. michigan they've got trump ahead of warren by six points. wisconsin they've got an even race. florida they've got trump ahead by four points. arizona they have warren ahead by two points. and north carolina they have trump ahead by three points. so they've got trump leading in three, ties in two, and warren up by two in arizona. >> michael steele, "the wall street journal" just skewers elizabeth warren and i would think this would be catnip for the biden campaign and republicans. i'll read one part of it. start with the overall fiscal math which by itself is staggering. she concedes that her plan will cost only slightly less than the 52 trillion that the u.s. is expected to spend on healthcare in the next ten years.

she deducts from that what the feds now spend on medicare and medicaid plus 6 trillion that the states contribute to medicate, the state federal children's health program and government worker benefits. that leaves $30 trillion to finance. but senator warren waves her wand and says the bill will really be 20.5 trillion. it goes on. the question i have for you is that i think that people are clued into this type of thing. just like the polls show that the ukraine scandal is actually something that compute as not good, that the cost of this does seem unrealistic, it seems confusing. people have been through a lot with healthcare. they don't like another huge change that could be risky to them actually receiving healthcare. >> i think that's -- i think that's well put, mika, because throughout the battle of obamacare, there was always this uneasiness about what it meant and what it would do to individuals, their families, the

businesses, et cetera. we've now reached a point where the public and the system have sort of resolved those tensions in many respects, which is why republicans found it hard to repeal and replace at the beginning of the trump administration. because no matter how you cut it, it's like a doctor who injects that dye in your vein and says, oops, i injected the wrong dye, i got to get it out. how do you get that out of your vein? how do you get if out of the system? you can't. think the public is very settled comfortably, even if there maybe some uneasiness at the edge with the obamacare system. elizabeth warren comes along and says we're going to upend the entire thing and layer on top of that another ten or $20 trillion. i don't think that's going to be an easy sell in any stretch of the imagination, particularly given how hard it was to sell obamacare which was a plan that republicans originally proposed. so it just -- it's going to be a

very difficult slope and she's still at the end of the day i don't think fully answers the question will the middle class have to pay that $10 trillion gap i think they will. the numbers on paper work but you know what reality is, it's very different. >> the numbers are hard to comprehend. and i think that joe biden has two strong focuses now, one would be his ability to take on trump, that he has the experience to restore calm and order and move the nation forward. i would think the second would be elizabeth warren's plan to pay for medicare for all. what are you hearing? >> yeah, that's exactly what i'm hearing, mika. the healthcare debate is the ultimate distinction in this democratic primary. sweec we've seen that in the debates. now elizabeth warren has put a price tag on her plan. democrats like joe biden will have a real contrast to make here. you know, we saw in this last debate, mika, that mayor pete and senator klobuchar really sort of held the mant tle in

defending obamacare. think you'll see joe biden make a much stronger debate because the fact is he was obviously a big architect, a big component of getting obamacare passed and he has every right to defend those policies especially on healthcare. as michael steele pointed out, this was a very difficult bill to pass. the american people remember how hard it was and how it barely got through congress. they current exactly thrilled with it at the time but i think a lot of americans can't imagine upending this because it was so difficult to get past in the first place. think you're going to see joe biden really drive home that distinction going forward. >> jonathan lemire, steve's numbers that he just read off to us, michigan down by six to donald trump. it's a big union state, the united autos workeworkers have health plan. you can understand the minus six for elizabeth warren is another aspect to her plan which is

clearly thought out. a lot of people are going to disagree with it, a lot of people will agree with it. one element that struck me this weekend in talking to a couple of people up near where you grew up, jonathan, incidentally, is the idea that anybody who has ever dealt with the registry of motor vehicles in their state, any government apparatus, the idea of handing over your healthcare to the federal government is scaring a lot of people. so those twin things, i think, i don't know. >> well, i think the good folks of lowell, massachusetts, nearby would give you an honest answer. they won't be shy of sharing their opinions if that's where we were the last couple of days. but think that's right. i think elizabeth. there are huge questions that surround all of these candidates here. these national polls look good for democrats, but it's not a race about national polls. i think the trump campaign fully anticipates that they'll lose the popular vote by more in 2020 than they did in 2016 with warren. you have questions about the cost and feasibility of this healthcare plan.

do americans really want the federal government telling them what they have to do in terms of insurance. for joe biden it's been this very shall we say uneven performance on the campaign trail right now? and for trump himself, it's been this -- of course we have to see how do voters react to this impeachment inquiry. steve, let me ask you a question. the polls that you're seeing here in those battleground states in particular, are you seeing trend lines? are we seeing any impact yet from the impeachment inquiry on the president's approval in the battleground states that are going to really determine this election? >> i mean, yeah. it's not measured from what i can tell and this is "the new york times" siena. if it were a drag open trump you're not seeing it in these polls. a couple interesting findings here. how about this one, take the folks who voted for trump in these battleground states, they went for trump in 2016 and then they twic switched to democratic candidates in 2018. and two-thirds say they're going

back to trump in 2020. also the lead that trump has in the states among non college white voters, we're talking about those voters being the key for him, the lead he has with those voters, non college white voters identical to the lead had he in 2016. so speaking to things just not budging at all. >> all right. coming up, presidential candidates pete buttigieg and cory booker will both be our guests this morning. plus, despite an escalating impeachment probe, some of the president's closest allies are still working to advance trump's effort to get ukraine to investigate his top political opponents. nbc's josh letterman joins with us that new reporting next on morning show. us that new reporting next on morning show. oh, wow. you two are going to have such a great trip. yeah, have fun! thanks to you, we will. aw, stop. this is why voya helps reach today's goals... ...all while helping you to and through retirement.

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. 40 past the hour. live look at the white house. welcome back to "morning joe." joining us now, national political reporter for nbc news josh letterman. he's just back from kiev where he interviewed several of the prominent people involved in the

ukraine controversy and is out this morning with new reporting on how the pro trump search for dirt on ukraine, the bidens, and the 2016 election goes on even amid this impeachment circus. you'd think they'd pull back a little bit, josh. >> you'd think that they might keep their heads down with rudy giuliani reportedly under federal investigation, his associates already arrested on campaign finance charges. but while we were on the ground in ukraine, we found that that was not the case. there's actually this group of lawmakers in the parliament there, mostly folks who have been associated in the past with paul manafort who are pushing for a new temporary investigative commission, which is kind of like their equivalent of a select committee in congress for us, the kind that was used in watergate. they want to investigate not only the bidens, hunter biden and ber miss ris maburisma, but

happened back here in 2018. and we are learning that rudy giuliani is meeting as recently as last week with a former ukrainian diplomat who has alleged that he witnessed collaboration in 2016 between the ukrainian embassy in washington where he was working and with the democratic national committee. so we talked to folks in ukraine. this is still a pretty fringed theory there. a lot of folks saying that they thought that this was basically a pr stunt intended to try to help president trump and rudy giuliani have fresh cards to play in the political conversation here in the united states. but it just goes to show you that with all of this swirling around in washington, a lot of these efforts to do basically what trump and giuliani had wanted in the first place are continuing full speed ahead, mika. >> my gosh, out in the open with everyone to see. nbc's josh letterman, thank you very much for your reporting this morning. let's bring in history professor at rutgers university, david greenberg. his new piece in "the washington

post" is entitled "when should republicans jump ship? " it's a good question which looks into the effects of those that turn against trump and those that will stick by him through the impeachment process. help me understand because i really don't -- i don't see a line anymore that the republicans feel the president could cross that would surprise them and they still stay with him. it seems to me that they might need some guidance from history? >> yeah. >> take it away. >> i'm not predicting anyone's going to jump ship anytime soon. i think this is a very different -- >> it doesn't seem like it. >> -- republican party from the one that richard nixon faced. you look at who did leave nixon early on, and those people are often well record regard garded bill cohen who went on to serve in the senate. people like lowell whiteker who went on to be an independent. history has kind of smiled upon

those who -- >> try to do the right thing. they may have gotten sucked into something, but if they try to do the right thing, history is kind to them. >> for the most part. we can't predict from history what they will say. if we use the nixon impeachment as a lens, there's something to be said for those profiles in courage. >> does it get to the ultimate question, though, of what is history today? is it like yesterday? i mean, is it, you know, last week? i mean, we measure history unfortunately, sadly, in different ways. >> yeah. look, i take care in this piece to say it's too early to really offer the judgment of history, obviously, and what history says in five years may be different interest what history says in 25 years. but, i think enough time has passed for the nixon impeachment, you know, nixon's resignation and watergate, that

we can sort of draw some tentative lessons, some tentative judgments about who did the right thing and who did the wrong thing. >> in thinking about this as you wrote it, did it strike you that an inordinately large number of republicans, specifically in the senate and many of them -- all of them in the house, they live with such fear of this one person, donald trump. >> well, it's hard to know how many are living in fear. i think for some of them that's definitely it, that privately in their hearts they know what the right thing to do is. and i think for others they've really gone into a universe where they've convinced themselves that trump hasn't done anything wrong, that he's just standing up to whatever, the washington establishment. they really have adopted their whole world view that prevents them from seeing things with the same clarity that maybe they would have in prove -- >> clarity is kind, but okay. steve, steve kornacki.

>> i wonder if you think this is a key difference between then and now when those senators, barry gold water, the famous senators went to nixon said time's up, he was gone and vanished for a couple years. if republicans turn on trump right now, chances are he's going to very publicly trying to burn down the party for the next two years. >> absolutely. nixon, by the time that so many of these people turned on him was already really, really on the ropes. it was in his second term, he had only two years to go anyway. so in that sense, yeah, maybe there was less at risk. but it was also a different republican party. it was a republican party that had people who would be called liberals, but also had a right wing, people like barry goldwater whose loyalties were more toward their ideals than richard nixon. >> but sure saying there's still time? >> sure. we don't know what will happen.

early on in the nixon process and the hearings it didn't look like too many republicans were going to turn on him either. so sometimes the emergence of facts, the emergence of information does change minds. >> but here's the problem. the facts are out, aren't they? i mean, i don't want to sound naive here, but not all of them of course. but much of the facts, i mean -- >> enough. >> during watergate when the facts rolled out, didn't you see somewhat of a shift, you know, wa tap with tapes? it was very obvious. the white house actually released a memo saying that this happened many weeks ago. >> the crit kaical factor about nixon was that the white house released the tapes which ended up incriminating him. if we do, for example, find out that even though this is an

incriminating mem call about the ukraine call, if that was doctored and there was more, who knows. i'm not predicting -- >> it's a new time. >> a big republican shift on this at all. i'm just saying there are times where people do kind of in the face of history when they're thinking about how am i going to say to my kids and grandkids, what do you do when trump was impeached, they might just think twice and turn around on this one. >> that's the question elijah cummings asked all of us. david greenberg, thank you very much. we'll be reading the new piece in the "washington post." great to have you on. >> thank you. still to come, president trump likes to out to ttaut thef the economy. but nearly two 30s of voters say that he has not made them better off. we're digging into those numbers straight ahead on "morning joe." s straight ahead on "morning joe."

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we have frinancial strength and by the way, for those of you with a thing called 401(k)s, the stock market hit together another all-time historic high. [ cheers and applause ] >> unemployment in mississippi has reached the lowest rate ever recorded. ever recorded. [ cheers and applause ] >> that's not bad. that's not bad when you're on the debate stage and you say we have the best economy we've ever had. we have the best military we've ever had. the best unemployment and employment numbers we've ever had. >> president trump on friday touting his economic record to supporters in mississippi with just a year go until election

day. the final times is out with a new monthry poly poll that ganu whether americans are feeling betters off than they were four years ago. let's bring in peter spiegel. let's look at the findings. nearly two-thirds of americans say they are not better off financially than they were when trump was elected. 31% of americans polled said they are now worse off financially than at the start of trump's presidency. 33% say there has been no change in their position. and 35% said they are better off since trump became president. americans are split on whether trump's economy -- economic policies have helped or hurt the economy, 45 to 45%. looking at that poll, how do they match realities, steve? >> well, i think the question is raised here, i'd be curious what

peter thinks of this. we're used to when we talk about the economy and politics, we're used to talk together economy driving people's perceptions of politicians, of leaders. if the economy's good, the president's awarded and gets re-elected. if the economy is bad he's a one termer. but i'm looking at these numbers and i think it does raise the question is opinion of trump driving opinion of the economy? >> or is trump driving it? >> that's exactly the questionawquestion we want to answer. i have a hunch that the economy was not driving perceptions of trump because of impeachment and all the things is you guys have been polling this morning. what we show here is that the same sentiment that happened in 2016, which is just general grumpiness about the economy is still out there. looking at your poll this morning about this issue of sort of non college-educated working men which is the base that trump has looked for, that is actually the group that is least happy about the -- >> really? >> -- performance. i think it's an issue for trump. there's no change in work class

white, non-college-educated men. those who are most happy are those b&f $100,000 earnings and those who are college educated. he's losing that base in terms of the economy. that was that base that rose up in anger three years ago. that's something we're doing this every month. we want to track that and see whether the economic performance and the perception of the economic performance, the president's not wrong on the stock market or on unemployment, those numbers are at historical highs. people aren't feeling it yet and that will have an impact on voter behavior. >> jonathan lemire. >> the president has done a lot of work to cater his policies and rhetoric towards those voters. it's interesting to hear they're not benefitting from his policies but it remains to be seen whether they will break from him come election day. but i wanted to ask you peter about another group. if you have in the polling or things you've heard, particularly suburban voters and suburban women, are they happy with the economy? because they're another group

that has largely swung away from the president in polling but cot economy lead them back? >> that's a very good point. looking at the cross tabs, women are the ones who are more dissatisfied than men, you know, by a statically significant portion. they are losing the female vote but he are splitting on other issues including the perception that the president is misogynistic and those kinds of things. but on pure economic issues, what the president is touting his economic record, he's losing women as well. >> wow. can you stay with us? >> absolutely. >> coming up, new reporting on the white house efforts to thwart the impeachment push and risky strategy senate republicans plan to employ to defend the president. plus, democratic presidential candidates cory booker and pete buttigieg join the conversation. "morning joe" is coming back in two minutes. tion. "morning joe" isom cing back in two minutes. when did you see the sign? when i needed to jumpstart sales. build attendance for an event. help people find their way. fastsigns designed new directional signage. and got them back on track. get started at fastsigns.com.

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individual slat. and you'll see it's a combination steel, concrete, and as one of the folks just said it is virtually impenetrable. i haven't heard that. we have a very powerful wall. no matter how powerful, you can cut through anything in all fairness. but we have a lot of people watching. cutsing is o cutting is one thing. but it's easily fixed. one of the reasons whyaway did it the way we did it, it's easily fixed. but we have a very powerful wall. but you can cut through any wall as you know. >> so it's empen trabl, bimpene people have sawed through his wall by using power tools. still with us we have msnbc contributor mike barnicle. jonathan lemire, former chair of the republican national committee, michael steel.

the u.s. managing editor of "the new york times," and an msnbc contributor kare contributor karine jean-pierre. her new book is out tomorrow but we'll get a sneak preview a little later on in the show. also msnbc anchor stech e stephanie ruhle and cnbc editstor at large john har woods and robert costa. he's the moderator of washington week on pbs. joe and willie are off this morning. joe's on dad duty, he's got a lot of kids. but we've got a lot of updates for you this morning. in our effort to keep you updated on this careening strategy of president trump and the republicans, here's a sampling of their latest talking points on impeachment. purple heart recipient

lieutenant colonel alexander vindman is a never trumper, but they've never shown any proveoff that. the whition wistleblower got it and must be revealed. the house intelligence committee chair will change the word of the transcripts after demanding for weeks that they'll be released. trump's attempted quid pro quo with ukraine wasn't illegal after endlessly insisting that it never even happened. and then there's this. on friday, fox news senior political analyst tweeted part of the wall street editorial. it reads this. democrats want to ex-peach mfr mr. trump for asking a foreign government to investigate his political rivalughhe probe never happened and for withholding aid to ukraine that in the end wasn't withheld. then this was tweeted of all the

ridiculous arguments this is at the top. guy who failed to rob the bank because he got caught is still a bank robber. it wasn't a failed crime. he got caught after he'd already done the act and abused his power. and anyway, you're basically admitting the crime but asking for leniency because it wasn't so bad. which is absolutely remarkable. bob costa, your take, what are you looking at? >> you have a white house that's on edge because they don't have a war room. they're take the president's cues about how to proceed and they're also taking their cues from members of the conservative media who are attacking many of these witnesses on air, online. but many members of congress i spoke to over the weekend, republicans, are uncomfortable with this strategy. they feel like they needs foo f to testify about the president's conduct. and it's important to know the the president was with mccarthy

and meadows when he went to that wrestling match in new york city. he's talking to house republicans more than anyone as he moves forward. >> jonathan lemire, you were at the wrestling match and with the president all weekend. things seem a little bit different? he seems to be concerned and trying to deflect. >> yeah, politics is a bruising business. he traded that for a different ufc match on saturday. bob is right, there's no war room. the war room is the president's twitter account and what he says in interviews. and republicans are trying to keep up. they're trying to formulate some sort of strategy here. and a number of the lines of defense that trump and his allies are floating out there are simply not true. i mean, charging that the whistleblower got it wrong. well, the whistleblower's account has been corroborated by scores of witnesses now, including the white house's own memo about the zelensky call. the idea that the transcript could be altered. there are republicans in the room during these testimony's and that they certainly would be able to object if they felt like

the democrats were altering something. there's no suggestion that that is happening. we are seeing him, he's demanding that republicans really try to fight this on the facts. and that is putting republicans in a pretty difficult position because the facts don't seem to be on their side. to this point, they've been battling the impeachment inquiry on process claiming it was being done in secret, claiming this was done in really playing out the idea it was done in the basement of the capitol, ignoring that's simply where the secure room is, it's a matter of geography, nothing else. and complaining that the speaker hadn't called for an official vote on tinquiry, had she did l week. so those things have faded away the 'the president is no, . the president is demanding that they argue the facts. they're saying maybe the quid pro quo wasn't wrong but other presidents did it, or maybe it was wrong but not enough to remove the president from office. that's the battleground right now where the gop is fighting.

>> watergate was also a botched crime. okay. three new polls over the weekend show nearly half of americans support impooechieaching and re president trump from office. we'll look at those and also economic polls that could show some waectieakness for the pres and then the opportunity for the democrats here. but according to a new poll, 53% of americans say they approve of the house impeachment inquiry and 49% say trump should be impeevi impeached and removed from office, up six. in the latest fox news poll, 49% also agreed that trump should be impeached and removed from office. over half polled, 52% called the inquiry a legitimate investigation into the issue. 49% said it's a bogus attempt to

undermine trump's presidency. and in the newest "washington post," abc news poll, 49% of americans said that president trump should be impeached and removed. 47% opposed impeachment. stephanie and peter, i want to look at those numbers up against economic numbers and how people are feeling under president trump as opposed to how they felt three years ago. >> president trump, when can it comes to the economy, is an excellent salesman. we can tell you all day long look at the data. president trump was delivered a very strong economy from obama. what president obama didn't do was sell it very well. president trump does. and whether you are talking small or large business sentiment, it is up with president trump in office and all he needs to do is convince the american people, you know what elizabeth warren is going to do? it might not be great with me, it be a disaster with her. what he's saying isn't true literally but when it comes to sentiment and people vote based on how they feel, it could be a

positive for him. >> peter, bouncing off that, president trump does say sometimes often what's not true even about the economy and there is this personality cult. and i do think there's a real weakness for the democrats if it's elizabeth warren and her plan that he's up against. >> it's true. but let's give the president some credit here. look, the stock market is at record highs. unemployment is at record lows. we've had the largest peace time expansion on record. >> it's not a turnaround. >> it's not a turnaround. but are voters going to be motivated by economic issues or other cultural issues? if you look at the job numbers that came out, wages are still stagnate. they're still did he low precrisis levels. the effects of the economy, the boom have not trickled down to the angry non-college-educated voter that's trump's base. >> but he held on to that for cultural reasons just like he

held ton white evangelicals with over a 90% voter rating those people are so thrilled with the president, couple that with p.m. on the top of the tax bracket who did get a tax break and that is bigger than his original base. >> it is i think that's different than it was in previous presidential elections when the reagan asked if you're better off than four years ago? no. '84 they said yes, voted reagan again. those things may not motivate voters this time. that's what we want to track for the very reasons you're talking about. >> john harwood, from farmers there's the polling that showed that the trade disputes, the self-inflicted wounds on this economy as it pertains to the president, biggest threat to the u.s. economy, trade disputes with trading partners, rising healthcare costs. how much does that impact the trump voter? do they actually get swayed away from trump? >> i think peter made the right point which is that it is not

clear many this moment in our politics that attitudes about the economy narrowly drawn are really what's driving our politics. cultural divisions are more significant. now, that presents an opportunity and a challenge for people like elizabeth warren to make the argument, bernie sanders makes this too, joe biden the make the case as well, that working class voter, you're not getting from president trump what you thought you were getting and try shift that debate back to the economy. because, as peter said, we do have low unemployment, we have high stock prices, but we have not seen a fundamental change in economic opportunity for the average worker. and if democrats can shift the debate on that terrain to those workers, they're going to be advantaged. but right now that doesn't seem to be where the debate is actually taking place with those voters. >> so president trump took to twitter yesterday to tag virginia's successes, including having the, quote, best unemployment and economic

numbers in the history of the state. he went to warn that if the democrats get in those numbers will go rapidly in the other direction. on tuesday, vote republican. just one caveat worth pointing out, virginia's current governor attorney general and both u.s. senators are in fact democrats. michael, that's what i was going to do to ask you -- you can't help yourself. are you going to be okay? >> okay. i mean, really? i mean, this is -- this is the, you know, planet one, planet two, earth one, earth two world we live in. he's saying it's the best ever, but, yeah, the democrats have been running the state for the last eight years. so i don't understand exactly how that changes anything for -- you know, this is the problem with the economic arguments that the trump administration makes broadly speaking. it's so narrowly tailored and

focussed to him and about him that other realities get lost in translation. and i think one of the -- one of the questions i have for the panel and probably in particular for peter is do you think the voters actually separate this economy and the economics from trump? in other words, when you look at where he is and how they view his job performance and how they view him personally, there's a big gap in the numbers. you know, people think the economy's strong, it's doing well, first plus 50 plus percent. his numbers lag behind that. is this just another faction of the numbers we're miss organize don't get? >> i think your -- >> i can make one point before peter responds? >> go ahead. >> that's responsive to what michael said. michael was talking about there's earth one and earth two. i think sometimes we forget to point out only one of those two is real.

only one of those two is the truth, right? so the one that president trump is evoking is not true. it's false. >> but that's not necessarily relevant. whether or not it's the truth you vote based on how you feel. >> i think the truth is relevant. >> of course we all value the truth, but how trump is able to sway voters with lies is the problem. peter, finally answer. >> this gets to the original top line. if you ask better whether they're better or not, two-thirds say they're not better off. but if you asked what do they think about trump's economic policies, to get to michael's point, they say it's an even split, 45/45. so to answer michael's question, they cannot separate the president from the economic policy. if when they're asked if they support the economic policies, yes. and i think that's the earth one, earth two thing. >> karine, take to us democratic voters. because if you say who say pro business president, whether you like or hate the president,

people would say he's a pro business president. and the idea of pro business makes people believe that's good for the economy. is there a democratic candidate that is willing to say i am pro business? >> so that's an interesting question because, look, that's how he essentially got elected, right, by using that message pro business. but i think for democrats it's really about, you know, we were talk about the culture wars that president trump puts in. that's a real concern for people. that is something that really they come out -- they come out in droves, right, in 2018 because they wanted that rhetoric to stop. and here's the thing. donald trump's base is small and shrinking. yeah, he's pro business and, yeah, it is a small base. and let's not forget the tax returns, right some the tax cuts that he gave the 1% and is hurting everybody else. what democrats need to do is they need to message better. they need to make sure that they're pushing on these issues, that donald trump is really

hurting his base and hurting many of the people who got him elected. and going back to virginia for just a quick second, you know, that tweet was really insane and doesn't make sense and i think for the race in virginia we got to look at the suburbs. because in 2018, 2017 -- well, 2017 you saw folks in the republican party leaving from the suburbs. women, the suburbs women leaving donald trump. and you see that again today. and i think that virginia is going far, far away from -- >> mike. >> robert costa, the financial times poll, peter's poll, 33% of americans indicate they're better off. the rest are the same or worse off. that's a total of 64% of americans in that poll who are saying i'm still driving the same truck, okay. so when you take that and put it on the table and you take donald trump's appearances, every appearance, here's a guy with no campaign consultants, no real campaign manager, it's him. it's all him. and the bravado with which he

presents his case to american voters, specifically to his base, that's his strong -- that strength is not going to diminish, correct? >> let's pay close attention not only to suburban voters which get an enormous amount of coverage, rightfully so, but look at the more rural, conservative evangelical voters in virginia in this upcoming election. this off-year election. look at those elections in the gubernatorial election. vice president pence went down to virginia beach and tried to rally those voters, the president's base. if that base does not turn out at the levels respected by republicans in virginia, in kentucky, matt bevin, unpopular governor goes down in kentucky, that will be so closely watched by republicans in congress because they need that base to come out in 2020 to stick with this president. this vip trarelationship is transactional as it's ever been.

republicans are not just looking at the suburbs. are those evan ggelicals going stick with president trump. >> i'm going to ask who trump wants to run against when it comes to the dems, you but first, filling in for mick mulvaney, kellyanne conway. take a look. >> was there a time when military aid was held up because the president wanted ukraine to look into the bidens? >> i don't know but i know they've got their aid and i know that -- >> so it's possible? >> here's what's absolutely unimpeachablely true. ukraine has theed a. they had more haaid than the previous administration. the president said he had no idea aid was being held up. he felt no such pressure. >> top foreign policy officials for this president have all testified about repeated instances where they saw that support for ukraine was depend end on ukraine investigating the

bidens. isn't that the definition of a quid pro quo? >> the fact is that ukraine has that aid, they're using that aid as we sit here. under president obama they've gotten pillows and blankets. that's important. >> but you're missing the point, which is the way the aid was withheld until -- >> the ukrainian president says he has no idea the aid was withheld. >> let's just say that president trump did condition giving the military aid, withheld it and said it will be given out only if you investigate joe biden. >> i haven't seen that anywhere. give me -- >> is that an impeachable offense? >> you're giving me -- is it a high crime and misdemeanor? i wouldn't think so. but you're giving me a hypothetical. >> good lord. jonathan lemire, at least she didn't tell us to get over it. what's the strategy? >> well, first of all, it's difficult to keep track of the goal posts because they keep moving in terms of the republicans and the white house's attempt to defend this. you're seeing there the real struggle that this white house

has had to try to get out ahead of this story and high the president has been so frustrated at the lack of support he's gotten on television. which frankly is, to him, the sort of most obvious sign of loyalty and of support is someone being out there defending him and on tv. he's been angry at the lawmakers and most notably kevin mccarthy who is he close with. his poor 60 minutes interview a few weeks ago, the president has still been complaining about that. and here with kellyanne conway you're seeing her basically saying, well, first of all suggesting that -- admitting that a quid pro quo may well happen, suggesting that ukrainians now have their aid. and saying, well, it's not that bad. this is not an impeachable offense. this does not rise to the level of removing him from office. basically saying, yes, the president did this, yes, he got caught, but he shouldn't be kicked out. >> so bob costa, is the strategy to get over it? it appears at that point over the weekend once again the strategy includes threatening

witnesses, intimidating witnesses, threatening the whistleblower, breaking the law in a number of levels, if you pare it down, and how excited is the trump white house that elizabeth warren released her trillion, trillion, trillion dollar plan in to pay for medicare for all to try to distract? >> on the surface senator warren's plan is drawing many republicans in to cheer and to say, oh, she's running too far to the left. but based on my reporting, private conversations with top republicans, there's more alarm about senator warren's ascend sensesy th -- ascend densesy. president trump was a candidate of radical change in 2016. there are some angst behind the scenes that she could steal that change mantel if she's the nominee and cast herself as an outsider and she would take some of that change mantel away from

donald trump should she be the nominee. many republicans say vice president biden could be easier to run against even though he's more moderate and win more swing states because they could cast him as the political establishment. >> stephanie. >> but here's the thing about us can sort of laugh at that mick mulvaney and get over it. you know who doesn't laugh about it? the trump campaign. mike barnicle said he's got no campaign manager and consultants. you know what he's got? a bullet proof -- bad choice of words, digital campaign. brad pascal. what do they do with get over it? john harwood, they go on and sell a get over it t-shirt for 30 bukds. it 30 bucks. they know how to sell things like the t-shirt, paper straws, sharpies that say trump 2020 after sharpy gate. and the people who buy them give trump 2020 the most valuable commercial ba

commercial data. they can cross reference that and create a bigger base. most of those people didn't give contributions before. so while we laugh at things like get over it, president trump is able to use it to hone in on who his base is. that flavor base is willing to push any sort of misinformation. they also hate the media. >> well, steph, you're exactly right about that. and, but i think we also need to step back and look at what facilitates that messaging. they're using the tools they have and social media is a significant tool that they have. facts are not so much the tool that they have. but a lot of this is visceral. it is not really success septemberab susceptible to facts one way or the other. blue collar whites think the country is being overrun cult e

culturally and politically by people that were not in control of the country when they were growing up. the people they're not accustomed to as thinking of real americans. there's a sense of that dread within the republican party as well. that's why you see their attitude toward voting rights in many states. so some of this is pure tribal solidarity that isn't so much about messaging or facts, it's about we need to stick together in order to survive. >> that is a very difficult landscape for the democrats. especially when you're not -- you're not basing things on facts illinoanymore. >> it's going to be a difficult landscape for democrats in 2020. it's going to take a movement to beat donald trump, that say fact and something we need to focus on. but the thing about donald trump, he's not expanding his bases. in the states like michigan, pennsylvania, wisconsin, he got that 270 electoral colleges, he is under water. so we have to remember, yes, he's spending tons of money on

social media, he's raising a lot of money because he has no primary opponent. he is not expanding his base. and you cannot win that way. you cannot win a re-election in that way. but, democrats cannot sit on their laurels. it is going to be an uphill battle. >> michael steele. >> mika, i think to karine's point which falls into what we were just talking about, stephanie's point, the thing that's important to note here, he is expanding his base. you just don't see it. it's not necessarily going to bubble up in polls. these are folks who aren't going to talk to polsters. they're not going to get captured. what stephanie's written and what she's talking about touches into that base. they manifest their support by participating in the ecommerce of trump. whether that is buying a sharpie or getting a t-shirt, they're finding other ways to sort of manifest that support. i think we need to step back

from a 2016 or pre 2016 lens and reexam how we look at the 2016 base. it's not going to show up in a poll. democrats are going to walk into the biggest trap ever if you don't read what stephanie wrote and understand how the money angle solidifies the vote. remember, trump marketed these people long before he announced his presidency. he turned his viewers into his voters. and those viewers/voters are still there. >> i can just say something really quickly? >> go a head. >> i agree. the thing about the polling i see is the intensity amongst his voters. that's insane and high just like the democrats are as well. but we have to look at 2017 and 18 as well. he's losing suburban moms and independents. that matters as well. i'm not saying he's not increasing his base. but is that going to be enough? is that going to be enough for 2020 when you're losing independents, you're losing

suburban moms as we've seen be in 2018 and 2017? i'm not saying it's easy for democrats. it's going to take a movement to beat dofrnald trump. but it's not that easy for donald trump. >> the trump campaign has a strong data operation. they're going to these rallies not so the president can get cheered by his crowd, but they're collecting information from people who are there. brad pascal tweeted out they have 20 odd percent of the people who attended hadn't voted for president trump and now believe they could this time. they know they can't change people's minds about the president, but they have to find new voters. they have to find people who don't vote or don't vote often in those battleground states and they'll have the money do it. that ad during the world series last week, that ad probably didn't change a single mind during game seven. it was a statement of intent. it was we have all the money and we're going to spend it and this is just our opening volley. so my question for you, stephanie, these are democrats who are also going to have to

compete on a financial landscape with this president. or do you think there's enough money out there, we've seen joe biden in particular struggle with fundraising, are they going to be able to play with this juggernaut that the president is going to have? >> well, the question for a joe biden or whomever the candidate is, who do you want to take money from? joe biden could be taking more money now, pete buttigieg could be taking more, big corporate dollars, big wall street money. they don't want to take that money because if they do, the progressive wing the base will take their heads off for it. so once we get to the general, the question is, can all of those democrats get under the same tent to bring in those big dollars? we'll soon find out. >> robert costa, john harwood, stephanie ruhle, peter spiegel, thank you all for being on the shoal this morning. still ahead on "morning joe," pete buttigieg said the democratic race will come down to himself and elizabeth warren. our next guest just might disagree with that. presidential candidate cory booker is standing by. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. y. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. hmm. exactly.

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it is 30 one past the hour. joining us now, democratic presidential candidate senator cory booker of new jersey. good to have you on board this morning. >> it's great to be back with you. >> you say the race is wide open and historically changes have been seen at this state of the game. >> not historically, consistently. >> but what's going to change it at this point? >> we've never had in our party, the democratic party in our lifetime never has there been someone leading in the polls this far out ever gone on to be president. jimmy carter was polling around 1% at this time. you know, bill clinton around 4% at this time. "the washington post," as i was saying earlier, keeps this wonderful twitter feed who led, which they talk about where people were. barack obama was 21 points

behind hillary clinton. this election hasn't settled. i just came back from iowa. 80% of people said they have not come to a conclusion on who they're candidate is. this is won on the ground in iowa. >> what's hard is the debates because there's 40,000 people on stage and you get 30 seconds to make your case. i'm going to help you define yourself from the two front runners. let's start with elizabeth warren. she's got this 20 bill dollar plan and how to pay for it. how does your differ and what would be wrong with hers in your mind? >> let's pull the aperture back a second. whoever the nominee is going to be able to unite the people from the left of our party, the mod rates of our party, and i'm most certainly the person that can best do that. everybody on the stage coming up in mof, i think there will be nine of us, bless that everybody in this country should have coverage and the question is whose the person that can bring that down the field. >> does your plan work? >> you and i both know a lot of democratic senators.

barack obama failed to get the public option or to bring medicare eligibility down to 55 because of democrats not all voting to support the plan. you and i know folks like joe manchin and others are not going to support that plan. you have to start talking about, i believe in the goal line being universal healthcare, everybody having it, but the steps getting there is going to be what can you cobble snogt htogether? chow you get things done in the only bipartisan bill that's gotten past this president was the criminal justice reform bill that i led from the democratic side if the didn't do everyth g side. it moved the ball down the field. >> joe biden says he has the experience, the contacts across the globe, decades of service to back up the argument that he can restore order to the presidency, that he can bring things back to normal and move america forward. what makes you have more experience or more ability than joe biden? >> well, first of all, i've been everything from a chief executive in new jersey's largest city in the middle of a

crisis all the way to a senator getting things done. think my favorite new author, i said a little earlier, we're not going to win -- people have to understand. we've got one shot to make donald trump a one-term president. we need a movement in this election. someone that will activate and engage the entire breath of our party, create excitement and enthusiasm. this is, again, why we've seen from the democratic party that people have gone on to be president are the folks that can create and activate that movement election. i believe i'm the best person in this field to unify us and to engage and excite the key elector rates that we need in the future. >> back to healthcare. >> yes. >> part of the problem might be that most americans, maybe huge majority of americans really don't ask what anything cost. they go to the doctor did you get your flu shot, no, do you want it? yeah. but they know what their drugs cost them. >> yes. >> when they go to cvs and stand in line to get their prescriptions filled.

what could you do immediately, immediately upon your election to change the structure of drug pricing? >> well, immediately that's, to me, one of the biggest pain points in our country. i've got people in my community rationing their drugs, not being able to buy thaeir inhalers. the president of the united states is negotiate to down costs. that's what i'm going to do. we should do what other countries are doing, pulling away patents from companies that raise the prices of drugs in our country higher than canada or peer nations, that will be unacceptable. a president has a lot of actions. this president's talked about it, done nothing about it. i will do everything something . this idea of attacking us on the democratic party because of the costs of our plans, this is a republican party that literally just blew multiple trillion dollar holes in our overall budget -- national debt in order to give tax cuts to the

wealthiest of the wealthy and to corporations that use that not to give workers a pay increase, to do stock buybacks which were illegal before the 80s to ginn up their stock price, a third of which is owned by people outside of our country. talk about fiscal irresponsibility. if you look at democratic presidents versus republican presidents, deficits skyrocket nund republic under republican president. you have something that's hurting you? wait for a little while before you see a doctor because of the cost of that copay. people end up in emergency rooms where the care is so much more expensive. >> that's the doctor. >> yes. this is the system right now as we have it that we can't afford the system we have right now approaching 20% of our economy. it is so broke, so expensive, and on top of that we get the worst results of the industrial world. we need to have courageous leaders, that's why i'm saying we need to completely reimagine

our system and start continue to sentive recenti sentive incentivize it. we can build this to get us down the field more towards the day when healthcare is right for every american. >> just to add to what you're saying about healthcare. you also have a trump administration that's in the courts right now taking away healthcare from tens of millions of people. the fact that democrats are having a conversation about how to make healthcare better and thousand expa how to expand and it cover more people, i think that's a good conversation for their base. and i wanted to agree with you on how the race is still very fluid and what matters are these early states. >> yes. >> i've heard from people in iowa that you have a strong operation on the ground in iowa so that's good for you. my question now is on impeachment. what should democrats do as we're talking about healthcare?

as we're talking about issues that really matter, the economy and the tax cuts that we've seen from the trump administration, how do we walk and chew gum able to really push hard on impeachment in a fairway and also talk about all the other issues that are important to people? >> well, you said it. this is such -- we're talking about removing a sitting president from office. and when you say that word fair way, this has to be done in a way that's sobered with the gravity in which it should be dealt with, in that it builds consensus in this country and doesn't create deeper divisions. that's why i do believe we can't put this in the context of a political campaign for presidency. this is a hopefully once in generations event where we have a president that, in my opinion, has butchered his oath of office. and that should be dealt with in the most sobered way possible. so i understand that this is the middle of a presidential campaign, but i swore an oath do

my duty, to defend, protect the constitution and i'm not going to allow this to be politicized. think that we all, democrats and republicans, should be showing some states personship at this point. >> jonathan lemire. >> senator, the democratic field thins a little bit in the last couple days. beto o'rourke dropped now the part because of fundraising struggles. you yourself about a month ago had to have an emergency fundraising appeal in order to make enough money to stay in the race, you said. you were able to do that but that might be something that's hard to duplicate. my question to you is how's your fundraising now? are you going to be able to afford to stay in this campaign until iowa? >> thank you very much nor that question because you give me the chance to make the appeal. as was just said, hands down this race in iowa is going to be won on the ground. and the teams that have had the best campaigns, and this is not me saying it, the does moines register, me and elizabeth warren have had the best ground

games in all of iowa. we need to keep that up now that we need to put people on the ground. that's why i'm telling folks if we're going to continue to be competitive. me and elizabeth warren lead the field in endorsements from activists and elected leaders. i've got keep the pressure on. we want people to keep going to cory booker.com. we just hired up in iowa now but we're going to hire more. that's going to be folks understanding i can win not only iowa, but after that demographically the world changes and i believe i'm the best person not only to take on the other people in this race, but to take on donald trump as well in states like wisconsin where we lost that by maybe less than 10,000 votes and 70,000 less african americans came out to vote in milwaukee than had -- in '16 than had voted in 2012. we need a candidate that can neth gu geth ey energize our entire base. i hope people will go to cory

booker.com. >> staying in the game with that website. i know meeting with dr. david campbell for a health check on wednesday. thank you so much. coming up, mayor pete buttigieg joins us in a few minutes. we're back with "morning joe" in just a moment. nutes. we're backit wh "morning joe" in just a moment. swoman] meet the ninja foodi pressure cooker, the best of pressure cooking and air frying now in one pot, and with tendercrisp technology, you can cook foods that are crispy on the outside and juicy on the inside. the ninja foodi pressure cooker, the pressure cooker that crisps. aveeno® with prebiotic striple oat complex balances skin's microbiome. so skin looks like this and you feel like this. aveeno® skin relief. get skin healthy™ ♪ do you recall, not long ago ♪ we would walk on the sidewalk ♪ ♪ all around the wind blows

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still to come on "morning joe," at a time of deep u.s. skepticism toward the government of saudi arabia, the kingdom's first female ambassador is working to mend the alliance between riyadh and washington. that is snenext on "morning joe but first, more on the 40 forbes debate. and the candidates challenging president trump for the nomination. mark sanford, joe walsh and bill weld. we have the comoderator of that event where they tackled issues from younger voters from college

tuition and student loan debt to impeaching president trump. we'll be posting the full debate on our website, but here's a snippet. >> we want to welcome you all to the first ever under 30 summit presidential debate. it's a rare debate in that it will focus largely on the concerns of voters under 30 since the decision politicians make today are the ones you all have to live with for the next 70 or 80 years. who's ready for a debate? [ applause ] >> all right. >> as a daca recipient i know first hand the frustration over the inaction about what comes next for us, for me. govern far sanford, if you were president how would you handle daca and dreeamers like us? >> we need to do something about the undocumented 11, 12 million folks that are in this country. but we do need to tie it to the notion of border security. we got close a couple times in the house, but ultimately never got there. >> i would not tie it to the border security because i think it's a matter of justice that has nothing to do with border

security. these dreamers are no threat. >> it demands republicans and democrats in congress doing their job in sitting down and hammering out a compromise and not another president who thinks that he or she can just snap their fingers and get whatever they want. >> based on what we know now, if you were in the u.s. senate and president trump was impeached, would you vote to remove him from office? >> a thousand times yes, remove. [ applause ] >> more emphatically, hell yes. >> governor sanford. >> i'm odd man out. know no. if you impeach in the house and don't remove in the senate, when it does it is allow him to say what i did was not wrong. we're codifying his behavior. so do you want the impeachment merit badge or do you want him out of office? i think it's clearer to offer a

censure, trust the american public to get it right in november and leave it alone at that. >> if soliciting illegal dirt on your opponent from a foreign government is not impeachable, if betraying the country doesn't demand you're removed from office, then nothing is. [ applause ] >> the two things that the framers were most worried about when they drafted the constitution were foreign interference in our affairs and corruption of the office. that's use of the office for personal gain. mr. trump has clearly committed both of those. the ten examples of obstruction of justice that are in the mueller report and the entire ukraine operation are quintessential removable offenses. at fidelity, we help you prepare for the unexpected

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security reporter for the "washington post" john hudson and journalist in residence at georgetown university school of foreign service, elyse labbot. she recently sat down with saudi arabia's ambassador to the united states. let's start with who she is and what impact she could make on relations between riyadh and washington. >> well, her name is princess bandar. and if the name sounds familiar, that is because she is the daughter of the legendary ambassador here in washington prince bandar who spanned many generations and was so close to the bush administration that he was actually named bandar bush for his relations with the bush family. anyway, she grew up here in the united states, really on one hand having a muslim/islamic background, but also a very american background and learning about american culture and american way of life.

took that back to saudi arabia and when she was working as a business woman, as an entrepreneur, really trying to pave the way for more inclusion for women in saudi arabia. and with everything that happened with jamal khashoggi's murder and the removal of the ambassador here, which is crown prince bin salman's brother, they put her here, a lot of people say that that was a pr stunt. but many people that know her think that having a woman in the position, the first ever woman ambassador from saudi arabia, could have a difference in softening the saudi image here in washington. >> so you can change the ambassador, you can change the approach, you can put a woman in place and she can have different dynamics that perhaps could have a different approach, but you can't change the facts of what has happened. and i think that it will be perhaps quite a difficult

mountain to climb. what makes her different in terms of being able to leverage the situation to get to better relations? >> i think that you are right. she represents a regime that is really known here in the united states for gross human rights abuses. and you know, what she tries do is not, you know -- she is obviously defending him, but trying to accentuate the positive, the fact that there are changes in saudi arabia, social reforms, economic reforms. and she is trying to show herself and she really is the embodiment of those changes. there are some people that think that she does have some sway with the crown prince, others say that he doesn't have really any close confidence and keeps his own counsel and really shoots from the hip. so i think that it will be really interesting to see if she could help him, you know, kind of move in a more positive direction. i will say that she has been, you know, kind of really diving

into try to recruit the best and brightest of american, sport, culture, plurentrepreneurs, tak them to the united states. and i think she is trying to soak up the expertise of the united states and take that to saudi. and some people think that that will be a welcome change. >> and there was a brief flurry of publicity, most of it favorable about davos and everybody flocking to riyadh oig to make money and try to get into the ipo for aramco. but saudi arabia is still at war with yemen and other things. and continued to be a point of turbulence in the middle east. two part question before how much of an ally is saudi arabia, a true ally of the united states, and, b, has the state department be so hollowed out that they really couldn't configure a strategy, a daily straechbl strategy, to contend with saudi arabia? >> on the ally front, you will

still have long time national security officials in the u.s. who say that they value saudi arabia as a counterterrorism partner. but really the elite national security officials in the united states have been increasingly alarmed at mohammad bin salman and view him as a loose cannon. and when it comes to our relationship with saudi arabia, it used to be sort of a bipartisan support for, okay, this country does not share our values democratically and we're very opposed to the sort of religious theocracy that is exported from saudi arabia. but now the bipartisan support has been chipped away with the disastrous war in yemen and this sort of permanent stain regarding jamal khashoggi's murder which the cia believes was conducted and ordered by senior officials in the saudi

government. so the state department has largely been following the orders of the white house and trying to do anything it can to preserve the u.s./saudi relationship and mike pochl hmps been the point person, he is meeting continuously with bin salman, smilinging in froe ing relationship is crucial to continue. and meanwhile congress has been more irate with republicans and democrats breaking with the administration and for instance voting in support of withdrawing u.s. military support for the war in yemen 37. >> john hudson, we'll be following your reporting. and elyse labbot, we'll be reading your piece. still ahead, president trump calls for the ukraine whistleblower to be identified promising, quote, there would be hell to pay. one former federal prosecutor calls that witness intimidation.

plus 2020 presidential candidate pete buttigieg joins the conversation. "morning joe" is back in two minutes. joe" is back in two minutes. ♪ limu emu & doug hour 36 in the stakeout. as soon as the homeowners arrive, we'll inform them that liberty mutual customizes home insurance, so they'll only pay for what they need. your turn to keep watch, limu. wake me up if you see anything. [ snoring ]

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>> self awareness definitely not his strongest suit among other things. good morning and welcome to "morning joe." it is monday, november 4. with us we have mike barnicle, steve kornacki, and white house reporter for the associated press, jonathan lemire, former chairman of the republican national committee, michael steele, and former chief of staff on hillary clinton's campaign, adrienne elrod is with us. up late last night. we'll talk about that. joe is off on dad duty this week for a couple of days. but another big week in the impeachment inquiry and what is expected to be the final few days of closed door testimony before open hearings begin. so what is the administration's strategy? well, that depends on the day.

the president is bouncing between trying to out the whistleblower and intimidate a witness. republicans appear poised to acknowledge a quid pro quo but insist that it is not that high of a crime and misdemeanor. and kellyanne conway is pulling a mo a mick mulvaney and really confusing the matter. and more new polls show more than half of americans support impeaching and remove willing president trump from office. meanwhile, there is new 2020 pollingwilling president trump from office. meanwhile, there is new 2020 polling on the democratic side. and as elizabeth warren defends her plan to fund medicare for all. could 2020 shape up to be a dem going vers demagog versus an i' idea log? president trump was active on twitter and usually a sign that he is nervous about something, maybe trying to distract. in this case, it is clearly the

impeachment inquiry. trump tweeted and retweeted 75 times over the weekend up until just after midnight last night, everything from retweets of the likes of jeanine pirro and mark levine praising a ufc fighter, he also attacked the whistleblower. the whistleblower got it so wrong that he must come forward. the fake news media knows who he is but being an arm of the democrat party don't want to reveal him because there would be hell to pay. reveal the whistleblower and end the impeachment hoax. to which mimi labeled witness intimidation and retaliation, period. trump also went after adam schiff. if shifty adam schiff who is a corrupt politician who fraudulently made up what i said on the call is allowed to release transcripts of the never

trump ertz and others that were sbh interviewed, he will change the words that were said to suit the dems purposes. republicans should give their own transcripts of the interviews to contrast with schiff's manipulated propaganda. house republicans must have nothing to do with shifty's rendition of those interviews. he is a proven liar, leaker and freak. this is our president. who is really the one who should be impeached. to which brian clause responded trump calls chairman of the house intelligence committee a freak and invents yet another insane conspiracy theory and it will barely be a story. that is where we are. democracy eroding when ly unthinkable conduct becomes so routine that it is barely even noticed by voters. that was the warning, mike barnicle, that madeleine albright gave so early on in this presidency, especially with

her book fascism, a warning. >> and his warning about releasing the transcripts, a lot of people know this, the stenography who takes down the france crypts, it transcripts, it is not a republican or democrat, it is a legitimate stening ographersten independent person. and the idea that, you know, the republicans have a different transcript than the democrats, absurd. >> yeah, it is not a partisan position. >> the president even found time to attack the purple heart recipient who testified last week labeling him a never trumper and threatening to reveal proof, look at this. >> what evidence do you have that colonel vindman is a never trumper? >> we'll be showing that to you real soon, okay? >> threatening him, telling -- best writing it is not political polarization when people refuse to see tweets like this as a sign of a person who is unwell

to support his behavior in a man who controls a nuclear arsenal is evidence of moral rot among millions of americans. jonathan lemire, you were with the president all weekend, what was different and i then want to get to michael steele about the republicans allowing this kind of behavior. but first, the president this weekend, your thoughts. >> we saw the president in public just once on his way to and from that ufc fight at madison garden. i was part of the press pool for that. i didn't see mike in his usual front row seat. but he was greeted with a mix of cheers and boos unlike the nationals game. but setting that aside, we saw him briefly make comments on the white house lawn and he is fixed

on the frooeimpeachment inquiry. he and rep allies are trying to smear the character of some of the key witnesses. vindman, suggesting that he has a political agenda here. and others have said that perhaps not loyal to his country because he is an immigrant with ukranian roots. he is suggesting that the whistleblower whose name is protected by federal regulations, he has legal protections, the name has leaked in some far right conservative website, it seems at this moment that the president is dancing with the idea of unveiling it himself which of course would send this into another sort of real political cry can sis and constitutional firestorm if he were do so suggesting of course that the whistleblower can't be believed because he is a, quote, never trumper or someone who has a political agenda. and then as you hinted at, the idea of republicans trying to change their strategy a bit with the concept of a quid pro quo. either saying, well, all presidents do this, this is not unusual, or saying, yes, he did

it, but -- maybe it wasn't great, but it is not an impeachable offense. but the president himself last night on twitter pushed back against that and said that there was no quid pro quo, i didn't do anything wrong. so again, republicans really seem to have a muddle in terms of a strategy to defend themselves and the president during this inquiry. >> michael steele, hard to not find yourself recycling the same story as we tell the story of the republicans, but if you could speak face-to-face to these republicans who are acting as trump's front men, mccarthy, scalise and others, especially in terms of the rot that chipts aw chips away at our democracy, bullying people, trying to not follow the law, refusing to comply with ises, if you could talk to them face-to-face and confront them about the way this president is buying them off with attention, access, campaign

money, what would you ask them to do, what could you say that could change this very unhealthy dynamic abo dynamic? >> i don't know if there is anything that could be said that hasn't already been said. but i would ask is it really worth it. is the value of democracy the rule of law the very ideals and principles that you have espo e espoused for your entire political career, that you ran on as a freshman congressman or a two term senator, as a leader both in the party and the country, is it worth it. is this one man worth all that you are sacrificing right now. and then the second part of that would be where are you going to draw the line? if you didn't draw it at charlottesville, if you didn't draw it as bat baltimore or loc kids up in cage, if you didn't draw it at, you know, muslim

ban, where will you draw the line? as an american, not as a republican, not as a partisan, as an american i want to know from my leaders where you draw the line. i know where i've drawn it and i know where countless of americans have drawn it, but where have you drawn it? and if you haven't drawn it yet, please let us know when you do. i bet you that it will be too late though. and that is the problem, that these guys are so afraid of this one man that they are willing to sacrifice everything that they have stood on. and another thing, all this talk over the weekend about a civil war around donald trump, are you really prepared to sit down with your constituents and support a, quote, civil war because donald trump is in political trouble, because of his own problems, what he has done? you are going to stand up for that? so draw me the line and let me know where it is. make it bright and red so that

the rest of us know as well. and then we'll understand exactly who you are and what kind of party you represent. >> still ahead on "morning joe," the public support for impeachment is on the rise. could the same trend be true in congress? steve kornacki breaks down the latest poll numbers and the state of play on capitol hill. most people think of verizon as a reliable phone company. (woman) but to businesses, we're a reliable partner. we keep companies ready for what's next. (man) we weave security into their business. virtualize their operations. (woman) and build ai customer experiences. we also keep them ready for the next big opportunity. like 5g. almost all the fortune 500 partner with us. (woman) when it comes to digital transformation... verizon keeps business ready. ♪

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from office. up six points from early october, 46 oppose down three. in the last fox news poll, 49% also agreed that trump should be impeached and removed from office. over half polled, 52%, called the inquiry a legitimate investigation into an important issue. 39% said that it is a bogus attempt to undermine trump's presidency. and in the newest "washington post" abc news poll, 49% of americans said that president trump should be i67 peampeached removed, 47% opposed impeachme t impeachment. president trump dismissed it. >> according to several recent polls, more americans want you to be impeacheded a remo and re >> you are reading the wrong polls. let me tell you, i have the real polls. i have the real polls.

the cnn polls are fake. the fox polls have always been lousy. i tell them they should get a new pollster. but the real polls are -- you look at the polls that came out this morning, people don't want anything to do with impeachment. it is a phony scam. it is a hoax. >> bow. adrienne elrod, in terms of the democrats' strategy, is this an opportunity or again more pitfalls especially the shaping of the truth at the president's whim? >> yeah, this is certainly an opportunity and that is what you are seeing with democrats so far under the leadership of speaker pelosi who is we've talked about many times has been so careful and methodical about this entire impeachment process. she is sticking to the facts. she is running the entire process above board. and the polling results show at this point of the process when the impeachment process has not even really started to take shape that majority of americans for the first time support impeaching donald trump in

removing him from office. think about how those numbers will shift when we start seeing public testimony, when we start seeing credible witness after credible witness on national television in front of millions of americans talking to congress and getting the facts out there for the entire public to see. what we're also seeing of course from the polling is that more independents are starting to say you know what, we don't trust this president rng, and those a the numbers that matter to whether or not he gets elected or defeated in 2020. >> and i don't think that there is a lot of, you know, background and examples or parallels to polls that are asking whether or not the president should be removed from office, so it is hard to look into history. but the numbers are upticking in terms of removal which i think is kind of stunning, isn't it? >> they have definitely moved. the question is are they going to stop here or continue to move. because i think one way of

looking at these numbers is they may all be converging at the same place. trump's approval rating in our new nbc poll, 45%. the percent who say she don't want him impeached and removed, 46%. the percent that he got in the 2016 election, 46%. so the question, is opinion on impeachment converging on the same basic fault line that has defined trump. if it stays there and it stays where it is right now, i don't think that you have a scenario where republicans start to abandon him because that mean that the republican base is still largely behind him. if it goes another five or ten point, then i think that we're in a new you territory. >> and impeachment during an election year, jonathan, any cracks on the republican side perhaps in the senate where they are saying, oh, boy, if i had to be asked on the record whether or not to vote on this, would we see some movement? >> well, republicans say public

ly and privately, it has always been different. most republicans are still hiding behind or -- i shouldn't say hiding. genuinely saying that there could be jurors in a senate trial and they don't want to prejudice themselves now by saying so. certainly some have made it clooer that they think that this is indeed a witch hunt to borrow the president's phrase, that the whole matter is a sham and that they believe of course they would not cast a vote to remove the president. others are being more cagycagy. mitt romney, one of the few speaking out against the president, they are not committed to removing. but those in the white house, they are tallying voters and they are aware that there is a likely scenario that we could see an impeachment trial in the senate. and so they are doing head counting. and romney is someone that they are nervous about. to back up what steve was saying, this president is still very popular among republicans

and they feel like that any republican lawmaker whether in the house or in the senate who breaks with the president, who goes for impeachment, who wants donald trump removed from office, you know, will feel the wrath of the base. and we are seen donald trump say that he would back primary challenges to anyone who did that. he is still a huge draw, a force for fundraising. he has three rallies this week backing republican candidates including one tonight in kentucky for the governor's race there. they feel like at least for now they feel good keeping the republicans in line. but if the polls keep going one way or the other, that could change. >> and steve, those pro impeachment numbers that we see poll after poll after poll, if you speak to people about impeachment, i often wonder is there a category in that number instead of saying yes, it is sort of i guess so. people are so overloaded with information about impeachment

now. and the president only adds to it each day with his behavior. the i guess so number is pretty -- >> yeah, it is the other question there too, and this is true right now when you ask about the difference between do you support impeachment inquiry and you saw there are a couple points higher. every poll, there is a pretty clear majority support for the xw inquiry. so when you ask the question of impeachment in relation to the mueller investigation, the impeachment support numb was-46 numberer was much lower. but there is always support of just the idea of investigating. of looking into trump. so that category of, you know what, let's not look away, but let's not necessarily commit to going all the way to removal. i do think there is something there. >> coming up, mayor buttigieg is standing by the presidential candidate, he joining the conversation next. e joining the conversation next. heading into retirement you want to follow your passions

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house at 26 past the hour. welcome back to "morning joe." joining us now you from clear lake, iowa, presidential candidate mayor pete buttigieg of indiana.

great to have you on the show again. how is it going? >> good, good to be with you. a little chilly, but having a great time here in iowa. >> i want to talk about elizabeth warren revealing her plans to pay for her medicare for all plan. looking at the numbers, some would say it is likely to pass as mexico paying with the wall. is there a concern with the democratic frontrunner, potentially the nominee, putting out ideas that are fanciful in the age of trump? >> i think one of the hallmarks of the democratic party should be our seriousness and we need to make sure that everything that we approach makes sense. if you are just counting on immigration reform for a trillion dollars worth of the funding for a hallmark plan, it raises some concerns about how achievable it is. but the thing to me is major health care reform really is achievable if we set it up the

right way. what i'm proposing with medicare for all who want it can be done for $1.5 trillion. that is still obviously a huge sum of money, but it is also paid for. we can find that funding without being in a situation of having economists arguing over differences and estimates to the tune of trillions and trillions. but there are two big concerns about senator warren's approach. one of them is the cost. the other is the idea of kicking people off their private plan. and again, we don't have to do that to implement a bold change that would be the biggest thing we've done to medicare since it was invented in the first place before the idea of medicare for on you who want it, we give everybody the chance and we let you decide whether you want it. and i think leaving the choice to the miles per hoamerican peo better option for us in our lives as americans as well as being part of a plan that is easier on explain how we will pay for it. >> so mayor pete, how would you characterize her plan? you say what you put forward needs to be serious. is it not serious?

>> well, what i would say is that we need to make sure that there is an ironclad explanation how to fund things. and what i'm offering is something that can very clearly be paid for with a combination of the roll back of the trump corporate tax rate cut and the savings that we will get by allowing medicare to negotiate with drug companies. i'll let others speak to the other plans other than to say i think my plan is better because it is dramatically more affordable and because it allows you to choose your plan. >> mr. mayor, iraq, afghanistan, the endless wars that the president keeps talking about, a, do you think that we should withdraw from both the iraq and afghanistan and if you do, b, how would you do it, what would be your time table and how would you continue to fight terror in this world? >> well, a big exam peop exampl

are were doing in syria. we did not have massive ground troops in syria. we just had a small operation of intelligence assets. in some areas just a few dozen people who were the line between what was going on and the possibility of descending into chaos. that is very likely the way going forward in a place like afghanistan. we have to withdraw from afghanistan in the context of a political settlement that protects american interests and sees to it that that country can never again be used as a base for a terror attack against the united states of america. in order to do that, that very likely means having some kind of very targeted, small footprint presence of intelligence assets. where the president seems to have gotten confused is the idea that it is either endless war or totally disappearance. unfortunately when you totally disappear, often that can lead to more chaos and make a war

more likely which is exact any what we have seen in the case of syria. >> this is michael steele. quick question for you regarding your douglas plan. you have done a great work in sort of putting together a strategy to deal with a lot of the systemic issues around race and racism and the issues that lot of african-americans had. your plan was recently endorsed by like 400 south care krariakc. and i know that is a big wall to murder dem. how is your strategy now ekrofiekrovoling and doeling that relationship with the black community? not just because of south carolina, but across the country because you will need that ongoing support as you move into a full blown presidential. >> what we've seen is that the substance of the douglas plan is extremely well received in our

outreach to black voters. this is the most xle h. comprehehe comprehensive plan put forward in order to tear downism in all. but we still have to make sure that i do my job as a candidate and that there is no question in any voters' mind especially black voters trying to size up my campaign of where we stand. and some of that is things that you will see as we do campaign events in places like south carolina and reach out not just in a political setting but really find votings where they are at. one reason why i was pleased to speak at the ame zion church event recently. but some of it is more low key, not necessarily things that you will see on tv or reflected in the media. one-on-one conversations with leaders, with activists, with pastors as we travel and just picking up the phone to make sure that i'm getting the right input and that i've conveyed

what it is that we seek do. that work will take a lot of time and we have to keep doing that engagement and we know it may not pay off fully until people are making up their mind in the last few days of the race, but we have to be doing the work every day and that is my focus. >> jonathan lemire. >> mr. mayor, president trump quite some time ago announced his intention to withdraw from the paris climate agreement. today is the day that he could begin that process. it will take about a year. so my question for you is this, what will you do to sort of -- i assume that you will return to the agreement. but is there more to be done to undo what has happened in the last few years? in particular we see the impacts of climate change all the time, particularly right now in california with the wildfires. yet the president seems to be threatening to withhold federal assistance there. so let me ask those two questions again. first of all, is that appropriate from this president and secondly what more can be done to protect the environment, to protect climate change in

light of what this president has done with the paris accord? >> the really disturbing thing about the president threatening to withhold disaster assist anc, he is behaving like he is only president for some americans. you are responsible for the safety of every american especially when recovering from a disaster. so no excuse for that behavior. for you, on the big picture around climate, paris should be viewed as a floor, not a ceiling. and i actually see an opportunity in this. as bad as it has gotten with both how close we are to catastrophe in climate and the disappearance of u.s. leadership from the world stage, i also see in that the opportunity to do something important which is restore american credibility. climate is the top example of a major issue that the u.s. can't solve alone because most of the emissions are coming from around the world. that the world can't solve without us because we are still in the leadership position and the world's largest economy.

so we must show globe hal leadership and when we do, when the people of the world and leaders see americahal leadership and when we do, when the people of the world and leaders see america on global climate change, when diplomacy is something that really matter, that is an important way that we can re-establish our credibility and leadership on an issue where we really are needed. >> and mayor pete, you said last week you thought that it would be better for donald trump to take a thumping at the polls rather than be removed by congress through impeachment. so my question to you, do you not think that the offenses that donald trump has done are impeachable, do you not think that is the case? >> oh, no, it is impeachable. no question that he deserves to be removed from office. and it is not just the things that will emerge in the investigation. it is the things that he con fessed to television.

what is on my mind though, we have to deal not just with trump, but with trumpism. and whether it is him on the ballot if he does survive this process or in some other way, it will be really important for the american people to send a message to people like the congressional republicans who deep down know better than to be on board with this. they are riding a tiger. but they are not listening to their own conscience because they think to stay in power requires them to stay stapled to the trump presidency long past when it is defensible. and so how do we make sure no matter who the president is next november and knowing what i know as senate republicans there is a good chance that it remains president trump, that we not only win the presidency, but have such a decisive election victory that it has enough shockwaves that it can reunite

our conscience. >> and i'll take another tap at the he's too young question. because a lot of fans here for you on the set of "morning joe," we love having you on, but we hear that along the way. and in the debates, it is often there is nine 9, 10, 12 people on stage, you don't get a chance to put yourself up against one or two other candidates. so i'd like to ask you to respond to biden's contention that he has the experience, the life experience, as well as the service experience to bring this country back to where it needs to go, to put it back on track. he has the experience geopolitically, he has the contacts across the globe, he has the life experience, he has been challenged in many ways. and that is his argument, that he can do the job. he has been there, he has served has

as vice president. what makes you more qualified than joe biden? >> well, experience 345matters it dae serveserved to be respec. so does judgment and vision. and i'm offering a different vision and a different approach. what i'm putting forward, the idea that there is no such thing as going back to normal. but we don't have to be afraid of that if the new normal will work better. i don't think that donald trump is a blip or aberration. i think that we got to this point at a country for a reason and i think that we have to see into the future in order to understand what is going to be required of the next president. i'm certainly young, i'm the youngest candidate in the field. every candidate brings our mix of experience and vision to the table. and while it is certainly true that wisdom can come with age, it is not true that they are the same. look at the current white house. we have the oldest president and by no mean the whisest.

>> mayor meepete, great to haveu back on the show and we'll be watching. still ahead, what is driving the day on wall street. it is the business before the bell next, including a shakeup in leadership at mcdonald's. and as we go to break, a look at know your value.com, our monday motivation, play for the long game. as we move through the week, we follow into form just trying to get through the day or maybe just get to lunchtime let alone get through the week. but your career is a long game and every day is an opportunity to play it. so only at know your value.com, my advice on why it is important to play for the long game at work and in life. i'll give you continues on that. so head to our site for your monday motivation. frsz monday motivation. frsz mini is a different kind of car.

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. we want to talk about the new book "moving forward." a story of hope, hard work and the promise of america. she calls for a call to arms for those who know that now is the time that we must act. and i couldn't agree more. it is a great book. you get very raw, very vulnerable, very personal in this book. why did you decide to write it? >> i wanted to put something that was honest and like you said raw. and i think that many people that i meet, they are like, oh, you are on tv, you've worked in the white house, you have it all together. and when i decided to write this book, i wanted to be like, no, you know, what i've had a tough up bringing, i've had my ups and down, but i still managed to get over the 4u6rhumps and overkayc

lot. and i think it was important for young black women who look at me now and see me as a mentor. and i just wanted to really share that. because it is not all wonderful and flowers and just a beautiful beautiful -- >> it is not easy. and i think that you describe your rock bottom moments, your struggle with mental health and for people i think with know your value and we did a piece on this for know your value.com a, it is all about sort of showing that it is not easy, everybody has a story and it is a tough one and you debunk that. >> i mean, a sad but formative childhood. and childhood, the building blocks of a life. spell out a few pieces of that sad but formative childhood. >> yeah, so i grew up in an immigrant household, my parents came here for the american

dream, what they believed to be. and it was really tough because i didn't speak the language when i got here because i'm an immigrant myself. not just my parents. and it was hard to really kind of fit in. i've always felt like i never fit in. whether it was not speaking the language, whether because i didn't have the right clothes, and i grew up in a working class family, so didn't have the money either. and so there was always challenges. always a hurdle to try to overcome. and in school, i wasn't the brightest in school, so i had to kind of -- >> did you have any friends in school? >> i had friends, but it was tough very early on. it wasn't until high school that i really found myself and felt that i knew who i was and had my real friends. but it is tough for many people. and i think that people don't understand what you come with an immigrant family and your family is trying to kind of morph into this culture, morph into what is

happening right here, it is tough. and that is why it makes me sad when i see right now the anti-immigrant sentiment, because my parents make this country great just like everybody else. >> i think that you are also pointing out even if it is sort of the subconscious of this, the message is that our history matters. and our personal history, our personal experience, buttal tal history of the country. what is the connection from your own story line into politics today? >> i think that it is basically that you don't have to come from a legacy family to get into politics. you can find your political power by just stepping in, you can find your political voice by stepping in. and i managed to do it as an immigrant, as someone who didn't go to an ivy league school, didn't have the doors opened for me. i decideder want ei wanted to g politics and i had great mentors and i was able to make change. whether working through policy,

legislation, helping get barack obama elected. so i think that i hope that my path inspires people. i actually dedicate the book to folks who have been told no so many times in their life. and i say i hope this book motivates you and inspires you. and that is the -- that is the point book. >> that is a lot of people. >> really. i'm right here. it is officially out tomorrow, and you will be tonight at 7:00 on barnes & noble on the upper east side. thanks so much. time now for business before the bell with dominic chu. >> we're watching mcdonald's because they have fired its ceo after it was revealed that he violated company policy by having a consensual relationship with another employee. now, this is steve easterbrook, he was dismissed after being chief executive of the golden arches since 2015.

he is going to be replaced by the usa operating chief chris kempczinski. easterbrook is credited with the all day breakfast and he updated a lot of the restaurants with self order kiosks and the company has come under fire in the past for workplace related personnel issues. so we're watching that. also under armour stock has taken a big hit after the company said that federal regulators including the justice department and securities and exchange commission are investigating it over its accounting practices. under armour said it began responding to requests for document days going back to 2017. it is cooperating with both investigations. it does believe that its accounting practices are appropriate. now, separately the company reported better than expected quarterly financial results, but can projection for full

year sales. and apple announced a $2.5 billion plan to help california residents deal with surging costs of living including $1 billion for affordable housing investment fund and another billion dollars to help first time home buyers get a mortgage. it will also make loans available for affordable housing projects. the move follows microsoft which you remember pledged half a billion dollars earlier this year to help with seattle area housing there as well. so another big tech company trying to tackle that real estate issue. >> dominic chu, thank you so much. and up next, we'll bring in the ceo of bank of america here with a big announcement about wages and what it says about the overall economy. brian moynihan is standing by with that reveal next. iece is t. ye so what do you see?

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52 past the hour, michael steele and jonathan lemaire still with us, and chairman of the board and chief executive officer at bank of america brian moynahan. i know we have a lot to talk about, we have new information on what you're doing for employee wages. i want to start by asking

something that you wrote for the business round table letter. you said that expressways must address issues in the community. you say it is something you and the company has been doing since day one, but what do you mean by this type of responsibility and is it more important at this moment in history. >> the oldest ports of our company are 250 years old. we strongly believe that we have to drive the changes that happen because we have resources and capabilities to make that happen. so we call that the genius of the end, deliver great results from our shareholders. >> societal issues, and explain

what type of issues that you think the company would need to definite i will be engaging itself with in terms of the employees and the community. >> you think of two core exampl examples. one is environment. we started with a major campaign to go $125 billion in investment to help make the change from current fuel sources to new energy sources. we ran through that. and it was $300 billion in the next ten years. and that affects everything we do. whether it is the ability to develop other resources, wind, water, hydro power, and how we operate the company. we he will be carbon neutral as a company by 2020. when you talk to the other companies, most have committed to date and as they derive that

change that will create demand for the new energy sources and make that happen. >> that also means paying your employees a living wage so they don't have to have five jobs to get through the week. you're moving up on plans in terms of increasing the minimum wage. how many employees does this affect? >> starting back from the other example, if it is their mental wellness, vphysical wellness, w hire kids from hvcu, we hire them from colleges. but we have been talking on compensation. we have two major things we have done in 2017 a lot of people announced a special one time event with the tax changes, we have now done that three years in a row, it's a billion and a

half dollars, and we announced we would move from $17 to $18.50, to $20 an hour. so that is $40,000 to start at our company for all employees. >> that is a big change. >> who will that impact? >> it affects everyone we hire and everyone that moves up. >> i think that is great news, i'm glad that you're doing it. how do you encourage your counter parts in the industry to do the same. what do you say to them? >> they have been doing it, we're doing it faster than everybody else when we announced $17 people started to move if is the nature of the strong labor market and the nature of trying to hire people and make sure they have great careers with us and we want people to start a career, not thinking of being

temporary. i'm sure it will have an impact on other companies. the way duo our benefits, the way we train them, half of our employees, 60%, have less than 2% cost increase for the last ten years for their health care, and pay about 6% of their income for it for family coverage. we try to do a great job and that brings other people to market. >> michael steele? >> you're doing a great job in terms of laying down the track for new employees coming in and those part of the business, show that also translating for you in terms of minorities and women moving into management and senior leadership roles throughout the bank. not just in the corporate, at the high corporate level where people like to show case we have a black here or a hispanic here, but within the body of the organization across the country,

what are you doing to promote and produce new leaders, african-americans, hispanics, in key leadership roles. >> i will give you just a few statistics. 42% of our managers are women of our 20,000 across the company pap that continues to move up and we continue to drive that until we get to parody. in terms of people of color, that number is moving up also and the overall employees from the employees we're bringing in from college, 40% are people of color and we're bringing in new people, and in the company 30% are people of color. but the reality is that we don't leave anything to chance. we monitor at all stages of the company the progression of our teammates, whatever their background, so they can be who they are, come to bank of america, and be extremely success. and you have seen that happen, on women you used the exact with

43% women managers today. >> chairman of the board and ceo of bank of america, brian moynihan. thank you for being on the show this morning. before we close, final thoughts go to jonathan, what are you looking at today? >> tomorrow is election day. there is key races in a number of states including a few that the white house is looking at in particular like the kentucky governor's race. they face a stiff challenge welcome the president will be in lexington continue tonight. i will be with him to hold a rally on his behalf, and another test where this president stands right now as he barrels into this impeachment inquiry. >> really does, barrelling in with a lot of distractions and tweets. you will be traveling with the president and we look forward to your reporting on all of that tomorrow morning on morning joe. that does it for us this morning, stephanie ruhle picks

up the coverage right now. >> hi there, it is monday, november 4th, and we stwart what is not happening, four witnesses scheduled to testify at part of the impeachment inquiry now saying nope, we're not showing up. two members of the national security council. the top advisor to mick mul v e mulvaney. but we do not know if any of them are actually going to up. i want to start with garrett haake on the hill, 13 people have already testified. there is still more to go, what do we know about many week. >> i would not be surprised if 13 ends up close to the final