we're out of time but i have to thank michael, kim, nick, tim. most of all, all of you for watching today. what a week it was. "mtp daily" with chuck todd starts now. with chuck todd starts now

welcome to friday. it's "meet the press daily." good evening. i'm chuck todd here in washington. we made it to friday. woo. there are so many questions about what happens now, though, considering not a single house republican is expected to support impeachment, despite 12 witnesses, 35 hours public testimony. a pile of e-mails, text messages, and public statements. all seemingly proving beyond dispute that the president pushed ukraine to investigate his political rivals ahead of the 2020 election. based on what we now know is discredited russian-backed conspiracy theories which leads us right now to the big news this afternoon. confirmed nbc news the substance of this new york times report that u.s. intelligence officials briefed senators warning them that russia had engaged in a years-long campaign to essentially frame ukraine for interfering in the 2016 election. the times reports that russia funneled this disinformation to

american political figures. perhaps, the president may have been one of them. mr. trump broached these russian conspiracy theories that ukraine meddled in the 2016 election when he pressured ukraine to launch investigations into his political rivals. and just this morning on fox, the president doubled down on those russian-backed conspiracy theories and then some which we'll show you in a moment. but it brings me to the next big question, for republicans, where do their loyalties ultimately lie? trump? the party? or their country? because i would argue it's three different categories you should be thinking about. despite the warnings from the intelligence community about spreading theories about ukraine, look like they're digging around for information to bolster those same conspiracy theories that could end up helping the president. big question for the democrats, why slow down the investigation? there is a mountain of new leads

that they have not followed and a long list of key witnesses they have not called. we're going to talk with a top member of the house democratic leadership a bit later in the show for answers to those questions. look, it's been an historic week pure and simple. we got a lot of questions now and we suspect you do too. let's dive in. i'm joined here on set by carol lee, cornell belcher, and msnbc contributor danielle. i want to start with today's news, carol. i mean, it's -- and what's interesting, it appears that fiona hill's statement -- here's what it sounds like to me. the intelligence committee has been dying to like stop this. fiona hill's testimony gave them the excuse to do this. >> yeah. it opened the window for them to be able to talk about this. but what i find very interesting about this is what -- is the fact that you have republicans who were pushing this when they potentially knew that this was a russian narrative.

correct. and -- and yet -- yet -- yet still did that. and it kind of -- it's not surprising in the sense that we've all been talking about how vladimir putin himself said, whether it was last week or recently, that this was -- that blaming ukraine -- so it's not surprising that this is a russian narrative and fiona hill saying that didn't -- you know, it wasn't a drop the mic moment necessarily. but the fact that lawmakers knew this and were briefed on it and then are continuing to raise these sorts of questions about it is -- is the part that i think democrats are going to seize on. >> i want to put up the full screen of all the republican senators trying to do ukrainian investigations because, danny, given this news now, how embarrassing does this look? johnson and grassly, they want details of fbi interactions with the dsn contractor. the first press release today, they requested records of white house meetings between obama administration officials and

ukrainian government dnc officials. yesterday, lindsey graham request state department documents on biden, obama's officials on ukraine. and apparently, they've been briefed saying, hey, russia is framing ukraine. >> well, i think it's important to understand there are two stories here. there is -- there is an effort by the russians to frame ukraine. to push this narrative that -- that no, no, no, don't look here. all the story is there. you know, crowd strike and all of the conspiracy theories the president has been repeating. but there is another story, which is that the ukrainian government was not at all enthusiastic obje enthusiastic about the election of donald trump. >> why? because he thought crimea belonged to russia? i'm sorry. >> many of them legitimate. >> right. like, context matters here. yes. >> many of them legitimate. also, they liked hilary clinton better. >> well, she was the one for not handing crimea to russia. >> i think that's probably a little bit exaggerated. i'm sorry. >> the president said it. >> no.

the president has basically been entirely transactional about this. he is the first one that provided defensive weapons to the ukrainians to defend against russia. so that really mitigates that story a little bit. again, you know how much i dislike defending donald trump but i do think it's important to understand where a lot of the republicans are coming from. that is the most important thing is there is a conspiracy theory. >> okay. >> they should not be mixing up the two. >> they're conflating them. >> they should not conflate the two. i'll give you that. >> chuck, there is a bear in the woods. and i just -- look. i -- i would be -- >> better explain that one. >> for our younger viewers, that was a -- classic reagan commercial about the dangers of russia. the soviet union at the time lurking out there. i'm amazed right now that -- that fast forward, reagan would be rolling over in his grave. fast forward, you have house republicans and house -- and house, you know, senate republicans apparently prepared to carry, knowledgeably, the

water of russia. to do the bidding of putin. you know, former governor casic has this sort of saying about putting country over party and too often what's happening with the republicans in washington is they're putting party over country. there is no clearer cut case. >> i actually argue they're putting trump over -- if they were putting party over country, they might actually put a check on trump. i think they'd put trump over the party. >> i don't think donald trump is doing what's in the best interest of the republican party. i don't think donald trump is doing what's in the best interest of the country. i don't think donald trump is doing what is in his own best interest. >> of course, he's not but he soo doesn't see that. >> the understanding that the republicans have here which is there has been as the president likes to say a witch hunt against him from day one. >> but this is not a witch hunt. this is not a witch hunt. >> kind of undercut the

republican argument that the ukrainians government was just out to get donald trump. she very clearly said there were a lot of other people who said really negative things. and they all said the stame thing. they all bet on the wrong horse. and you didn't see the kind of retaliation that you see that she believed was happening with ukraine. >> i can't let witch hunt stand, chuck. >> i was not suggesting it is a witch hunt. >> how many people around this president has been indicted or put in prison, right? how much -- how much evidence have we seen? >> all right. now, let me put you a little bit on the defensive here. >> well, there's a bear in the woods. >> this is my point. so why stop the investigation? >> i don't know. >> i think isn't it hard? i know politically why they're in this box. they don't have new witnesses yet. they don't have -- but my god there's so many leads to pursue. you stop now? >> here's -- here's one reason why you probably start now.

what more -- what more else can you say? and if you look at pbs had a poll out today showing actually a lot of americans are paying attention. and it's sort of become baked in. i mean, i don't know how much more you're going to change where people are on this thing from the -- from presenting more evidence. >> but forget the politics of this. if your concern is to root out the corruption, let's keep rooting itdanny, i think the last two weeks have surfaced more -- and you're like, jeez, what's that? i mean, it's surfaced more questions. >> so this is the great question, right? is this -- is this a political investigation? or is this an investigation investigation? i can tell you i'd love to hear from mulvaney. he's the guy who said get over it. there was a quid pro quo. >> i'd love to hear from john bolton. >> i'd love to hear from john bolton. so this actually bolsters the argument that people critical of the process have made which is that it's more political than it is about the substance. what do you think about that? >> everyone has said even his own people have said this was

quid pro quo. i mean, i don't know what more else we need than that, danny, except for maybe furry sleeves. >> carol, i do think that -- look, i understand the political argument democrats -- house democrats like the whole bunch of the moderate democrats weren't for impeachment with mueller. or saw this and said, okay, but this is it. they want to keep it narrow. and efficient i guess. >> yes. that's a good word for it. >> you're sitting here looking at all this. it -- it -- it -- you would think it's hard to walk away. >> well, there is -- nancy pelosi's under some pressure from outside groups, from democrats, from some within her own caucus to not just -- and there was pressure to make it broader, which she chose to make it narrower. but also, now to not make it so fast and try to slow it down a little bit. and obviously, within that, potentially make it broader. you heard adam schiff gave an interview to the l.a. times where he left open the possibility they would still do more while also starting to

write their report that they'll hand over to the judiciary committee. so they're kind of -- it -- it strikes me as a time when they're sort of testing the waters. feeling it out. and one significant thing that's going to happen is on monday, a judge is supposed to rule on this don mcgahn case. >> right. >> and what happens there? depending on that ruling and if it means anything. >> i will say this. in talking with some folks that are familiar with sort of the white house legal strategy here. number one, no court rulings matter to them unless it's the supreme court. >> it just matters to bolton. >> no. no. it may matter to bolton but don mcgahn, any ruling they don't like is going to the supreme court because they believe none of this has been divided. the separation of powers issues haven't been decided because no matter what. and the second thing i feel like i've learned or you feel like you learn here is the public posture is they want a trial. that they are confident in a trial. but it seems to me that they know that they've got a lot more

process arguments to stop this than they do evidentiary arguments. and i think they kind of know this. >> well, for me, look, i'm a political hack. i do campaigns. and where i think, for me, being completely political in campaign is look at where the polling is going on this. look at -- chuck -- chuck -- but, chuck, check this out. in georgia right now, majority of college voters in georgia right now are for impeachment. georgia is supposedly a red state. so when you talk about the slide that republicans have had in the suburbs, this is not helping them, right? when you have college-educated voters, particularly led by college-educated white women turning on this even more, look. kentucky was a state that sort of trump did not help them in kentucky. >> look. >> but there is the political argument. >> i'm making a political argument. >> i will say this. this idea that the president wants a trial seems ludicrous to me because none of this has helped make the case for re-election. >> yes. >> we talked about this. >> in fact, everything has made

it like it's -- it's a case against re-electing him. >> but, look, i do think it's important to understand that nobody on the republican side has been won over, including people who really have stood against the president. will hurd. others have basically made clear they are not going to vote to impeach. >> yeah. look, the power he has over the base of the party is -- is -- is huge. >> it's not just the power over the base of the party. >> it is. >> no. i don't -- i mean, yes, of course that's real. but i also think that this is not got the grip on the public mind that you think it does. i think a lot of this week has been -- >> but a majority of people do think now -- majority of people do think now he's be impeached. and that has moved over time. i'll say this one thing, this last thing. put barack obama's name on the front of any of this and i've got a feeling a lot more of those republicans would not be where they are right now and you cannot sit there in good conscience tell me that's not true. >> well, i don't know whether

it's true or not because barack obama didn't do this, which is good, right? >> next week -- in two weeks -- a judiciary committee -- do we think we get more witnesses? or are they gonna do what they've sort of seemingly which is they're just going to do a constitutional argument? >> i think it depends on a couple things. one it depends if any of the witnesses they want change their minds. the only one i could see that happening to is john bolton. >> the twitter tease. and frankly, he's at the point where he could be risking overplaying his hand a little bit here. >> he's having too much fun with this. at some point, it's serious. >> right. and there are questions, you know, one of the questions i had after all this is, you know, john bolton sent his -- his deputy fiona hill over to talk to the lawyer about his own views on something. well, did he send himself? like, did he express his concerns? and -- and if not, why? >> my favorite anecdote that

gordon sondland loved to trumpet which was he asked me for rudy's contact information. why didn't he ask somebody else for it? i want john bolton to answer that question. i have a feeling i know why he specifically wanted sondland to be the one to give it to him. but anyway, carol, cornell, and danny, stick around. up ahead, as we have been talking about a big question for house democrats. are there more hearings coming? are there more witnesses? if not, why stop now? i will speak to a member of the house leadership after this. plus, the republicans' campaign of impeachment misinformation. sure seems like they're taking a play straight out of the russia playbook. a play straight out of the russia playbook imagine a disease is caused by too much of a bad protein,

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welcome back. the biggest question facing democrats right now, are they wrapping up this investigation? 12 witnesses have now testified leaving a wake of unanswered questions including why does the president seem to believe an unfounded russian conspiracy theory about ukraine meddling in

the 2016 election? we haven't heard publicly from any of the 13 members of the trump administration that gordon sondland testified were in the loop on trump and ukraine. nor have we heard from giuliani, nor giuliani's indicted associate who signalled a willingness to cooperate with the house's investigation. joining me now is the vice chair of the house democratic caucus, massachusetts congresswoman katherine clarke. congresswoman clarke, nice to see you. >> nice to see you, chuck. >> let me start with that question there. i've seen adam schiff's comments that if there are more hearings, you'll keep going. but do you really want to start drafting the articles now with so many unanswered questions? so many leads? the fact is the hearings led to more testimony. the hearings led to more information. why stop? >> you know, i think that you're right. the only thing that is predictable about this situation and this administration is that it is unpredictable.

so while we have closed the public hearings for now, those questions of will we take further evidence, will there be further depositions, witnesses? what will the judiciary committee do? are all undecided and we have to proceed like we have been proceeding. pursue the truth. and try and do that with urgency and expeditiously. but not let the truth get lost in a political timetable. >> okay. but it also feels as if you're letting the political timetable rush this a bit. i mean, look, sdny, the southern district of new york, is obviously investigating some weird ukraine business between giuliani and his associates. this, to me, seems like a classic case of congress figuring out how to work with another investigative body there. why not at least try to see what

you can get, what cooperation you can get from them before moving on? >> well, i -- once again, chuck, there has been no decision to move on as you put it. we are going to pull together the -- the chair people of the committees of jurisdiction. we are looking at where we are. as adam schiff indicated, we may proceed on dual tracks. starting to write a report on the witnesses we've already talked to. but also being open to there may just be more information. we have one goal here. it's get to the truth. and what we have had presented so far is a very stark and dangerous abuse of power by this president. and that is what the witnesses have confirmed. that is where we are and we need to proceed very carefully and

make sure that we are pursuing the truth and that the truth is setting the timetable here. and, you know, the picture is one that is stark. it is a portrait of betrayal of our national security, of an ally, and it jeopardizes the integrity of our 2020 election. >> impeachment is both a -- a legal and political exercise. if this were -- you're trying to build a case and argue it in a court of law, i don't think you'd have much trouble winning the argument with 12 jurors. but you have to win a political argument and you're not winning that argument at all. you don't even have will hurd. now, there is a bunch of explanations for that, that maybe are out of your control. but how much should that matter to how you decide how quickly you send over articles of impeachment? >> i think that we -- our goal in opening this inquiry and our

goal in whatever we decide around the timing, if, when, what will be included in articles of impeachment. and then what time is may end up at the senate if we get there. all has to be driven by the same goal of ending this that we started with. let's get to the truth. let's defend the constitution. let's make sure that nobody, including the president of the united states, puts himself above the law. that's the opening goal and that's the ending goal. and, yes, this is inherently a political process but what we have seen is that the facts are uncontested. and we have watched the different defenses the republicans have tried to lodge on the president's behalf disappear. it's like sand through their fingers. and yet, they are defending this president. and that is a dangerous

indictment of where we are with the republican party. that it is about one man above country, above the constitution, and above our democracy. >> i want to put up another tweet from john bolton today. he's been very active on twitter. he said this. speaking up since resigning as national security advisor, the white house refused to return access to my personal twitter account. then he asked out of fear of what i might say question mark? to those who speculated, i went into hiding. i'm sorry to disappoint. john bolton is certainly teasing everybody involved here that he has something to say. we know he's got a book deal. you guys have invited him. but you don't seem to be overly anxious to try to beg him to come. why not? >> because we have been met with obstruction from this administration in every single turn. they've been very clear. people are not allowed to

testify. john bolton has something to say? if he can add something that is important for us to know about this situation, he should come forward. take a -- a page from the book of the patriots that we saw come and put their careers, potentially, in jeopardy. the wrath of the president of the united states being, you know, really ostracized in their jobs. and they said this is about our country. this is about the service that we have done and will continue to do. this is about our national security. and when they saw a situation and certainly john bolton came up in many of their testimonies where the president was willing to hold $400 million in aid to pay for political dirt. then john bolton should look at

his conscience. look at the oath that he took when he took the national security position and come and put that information before the american people. >> very quickly, any chance you guys don't send over articles of impeachment? >> you know, at this point in time, you know, with the witnesses that we've seen. again, with the stark betrayal of abuse of power, i think it is likely that we will get there. but the timeline is gonna be driven by, you know, the witnesses and the testimony that we need to get to the truth no matter what the political consequences. >> congresswoman katherine clark. democrat from massachusetts. vice chair of the caucus. thank you for coming on and sharing your views. i appreciate it. >> thank you very much. >> up next, we're digging into the disinformation campaign we've been talking about this morning -- this evening. russian conspiracy theories being pushed directly from the white house. and the president is leading the

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it despite their senators and aides being briefed who made it clear no uncertain terms that it is russia who's been attempting to frame ukraine for the 2016 election and they've been doing it for years. even if we assume none of the republican senators passed on the information in the house intelligence committee, a parade of witnesses also testified the theory has no merit, including one of the white house's own russia experts, fiona hill, who explained why. >> this is a fictional narrative that has been perpetrated and propagated by the russian security services themselves. right now, russia security services and their proxies have geared up to repeat their interference in the 2020 election: we a election. we are running out of time to stop them. in the course of this investigation, i would ask that you not promote politically-driven falsehoods that clearly -- russian interests. >> several members of that intelligence committee doubled down on those conspiracies at her hearing. >> the end of the day, the commander in chief, concerned

about 2016 election meddling by ukraine. >> but at the same time, certain ukrainians did work against candidate trump. some with the dnc. >> alexandria chalupa. former dnc official who admitted she provided information to the dnc and hilary clinton. nellie ore from fusion gps to help create the ridiculous steele dossier. >> and this morning, president trump passed on yet more disinformation on his favorite tv network. >> you know, it's very interesting. it's very interesting. they have the server, right, from the dnc. democratic national committee. >> who has the server? >> the fbi went in and they told him get out of here. we're not giving it to you. they gave the server to crowd strike or whatever it's called, which is a -- which is a company owned by a very wealthy ukrainian. and i still want to see that server. you know, the fbi's never gotten that server. that's a big part of this whole thing. why did they give it to a

ukrainian company? why? >> are you sure they did that? are you sure they gave it to ukraine? >> that's what the word is. that's what i asked actually in my phone call if you know. i mean, i asked it very point blank because we're looking for corruption. >> it's a stunning embrace. not just of misinformation but of russia propaganda by the president. he is promoting something that is completely at odds with the u.s. intelligence committee. he himself has been briefed by his own former national homeland security advisor that this is a debunked conspiracy theory. it's completely at odds for officials who work for him say. this demonstrates how successful the russian misinformation campaign has been, particularly inside trump's political party and it continues to be amid the effort to impeach the president. so what exactly are the consequences of these trump/russia disinformation campaigns? well, ahead, we're going to talk to an expert who's testified before congress about hacking and the spread of disinformation. be right back with more "mtp daily" after this. back with mop daily" after this.

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welcome back. as a russian conspiracy theory grips the republican party, including the president himself, we are taking a closer look at disinformation campaigns. but this time, it's not russian bots or fringe right-wing groups pushing a debunk theory that ukraine, not russia, meddled in the 2016 election, it's the president and the republican party. msnbc national security analyst clint watts joins me now. so, clint, we've gone through this before. but there's something extra alarming about now hearing that the intelligence community has already briefed elected officials about what russia is doing. and it's still happening anyway. first of all, clint, how -- do -- what should we read into the fact that the intel community confirmed this almost immediately after fiona hill testified? >> it's not surprising because you could actually see this in

overt russian propaganda going back early this past spring. this -- this was repeated in their circles. what i find just alarming is why do this? it -- it just -- you know, i think the question you and i probably had i think it was two and a half years ago i was on meet the press. we talked about -- because often times the president uses russian active measures against his political opponent but the question is was he doing it deliberately? did he know he was doing it? or was information drifting into his orbit that he thought useful so he would accidentally repurpose it. what you're seeing now is they know, the republican congressmen that are repeating it on capitol hill. the president knows this. they have been briefed. this came from russia. this is a russian conspiracy and it has not stopped them one bit. in fact, they've doubled down on it. we saw it consistently throughout this week. and if you are only believing what the president says and what the republican congressional members are saying, you actually believe the conspiracy in the

united states right now. >> i think there's quite a few americans that do believe this. and to the point where it may paralyze us as a republic for a bit. i'm curious what does russia get from this successful disinformation campaign that they have orchestrated i guess via donald trump at this point? >> two things. first, they get to rewrite history around interfering in the election 2016. we just went through two and a half years of, you know, political and social torture in this country around the mueller investigation. and finally, came to an end. we got some very definitive answers about what russia did in the 2016 election. but here again, you see it being walked back. and who's walking it back? it's political officials inside the united states. and so that just further puts us in chaos. it puts us against each other. we can't know the truth because we don't have elected officials actually saying the truth. i think the second part, which is incredibly damning for us worldwide, which is also a long-term goal of -- of russia

is to have u.s. retreat from the world stage and not be trusted. the message going from russia to ukraine right now is we told you they would throw you under the bus. we told you they would abandon you and you could not trust them. if you can't trust the u.s. and they're not there to support you, if they're not delivering that aid when they said they were going to, if they're trying to manipulate you, why wouldn't you just trust us? we are russians. we're right next door. used to be part of the soviet union. so it's a two-directional divide and it is working in spades again to where putin just probably can't believe the success they're having with these disinformation campaigns. >> and so let me ask this. have we completely destroyed the information ecosystem in the president of the united states becomes the chief misinformation provider? i mean, it seems as if he's got a willing outlet that will do this in real time. he's doing this. he doesn't seem to care about the consequences long-term in

the same way i think that -- i do think there are well-meaning republicans may be participating in this that might at least be nervous about the long-term impact. i don't know that he cares about the long-term impact. but are we powerless to this if our commander in chief is so willing to participate in this disinformation campaign? >> if it continues, we are, chuck. it's remarkable. two and a half years ago, my concluding point of that hearing was if we can't figure out what's fact and fiction, if we don't have trust in our elected officials and institutions, we will be lost as a country because you can't -- you can't function as a democracy. you can't have debate when you don't agree on what occurred. you can't actually formulate policy or represent the best interest of americans. and so, you know, what do you tend to believe? you tend to believe four things in -- in terms of what you hear. the first thing you hear, that which you hear the most, that from a trusted source that you believe, and that not accompanied by a rebuttal. so if you're in that echo chamber in the political right and it can be the political left, too, if there's disinformation, it becomes almost paralyzing for you to

actually know or know what to believe. >> you know, there was an interesting story earlier this week about a -- a -- a former fox news exec who sort of is in the fake news business. got involved in macedonia. you and i, i think went down this road before. but i want to pull out this quote because i think it shows you that there's a business incentive that particularly social media companies have helped create. here's what kent's his name. here's what he said. i wanted to try to find middle ground. unfortunately, the things that work best right now are hyperactive politics on one hand, that's at odds with what i want to do. but you can be more successful by playing the edgy click-bait came and he added where does that line turn from good business to that's sleazy? when, of course, i want to say is i think you're at that line, sir. >> yeah. i think he's well past that line. we're in deep sleazy i think at this point. and it just -- it -- it speaks to social media. engagement on social media is about creating an emotional response in the recipient.

it's not really about gaining information or gaining news. people respond intuitively to headlines, pictures, graphics. and really if you want to infiltrate the united states, if you want to spread fake news, you enrage the political right and you shame the political left. it's literally a deliberate formula that you can use or see for these outlets if you buy them and the russians are grand masters of this technique and they know how to do it better than anyone. >> well, and again, our -- our current political leader is willing to pass it on. clint watts, thank you very much for sharing your expertise with us. still ahead, is impeachment clouding joe biden's 2020 vision? or is it actually propping him up? we've got his response to a new republican investigation of him. that's next. i thought i was managing my moderate to severe ulcerative colitis. but i realized something was missing... me. the thought of my symptoms returning

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imprisonedly happenstance and the unforgiving rectangle of a view finder. hour after excruciating hour. you think it's easy? then try this. sit in your chair with a blank expression on your face doing absolutely nothing for 60 seconds. then do that another 400 times because that is the peripheral purgatory that is being a congressional hearing background person. now, sure, people have had their weak moments every now and then. we spotted one swigging her coffee like it was the very last drop she would ever have. then there was this guy whose eyebrows were clearly so over this. but come on. these people are only human and humans can suffer only so much bureaucracy. so i ask unanimous consent to revise and extend my remarks and shine the spotlight where it really belongs. the background. and to thank these patriotic americans for doing everything

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join me and american express on small business saturday, november 30th, and see how shopping small adds up. what are you doing back there, junior? since we're obviously lost, i'm rescheduling my xfinity customer service appointment. ah, relax. i got this. which gps are you using anyway? a little something called instinct. been using it for years. yeah, that's what i'm afraid of. he knows exactly where we're going. my whole body is a compass. oh boy...

the my account app makes today's xfinity customer service simple, easy, awesome. not my thing. look, um, i may be the last guy to publicly call for impeachment but i'm the only reason there is impeachment going on because this president

has -- i've written extensively how our democracy is really at stake. it's not joke. >> joe biden said the impeachment inquiry sentered around ukraine to publicly announce the investigation. we moe tknow the president didnt that investigation. lindsey graham will try to do it for him. he's launched a probe of the bidens. has the impeachment inquiry propped up biden standing in the democratic primary or is it not having that impact? could all these gas be hurting him more? >> it isn't hurting him.

he's the guy that trump fears the mark. trump has given him millions of dollars of communications. he has good debates, bad bedates and go up and down. that central premise, stays fa r fairly consistent and it is being helped by donald trump. >> it's held off some of the takes by the other democrats. >> don't want to look like they are using trump talking points. there's a bit of that. if you watch the impeachment hearings you could envision democrats saying we ought to get somebody in there that knows what they are doing. that bolsters biden's case. i think it's interesting. >> it's like a shield a little

bit. it's not totefully -- he's getting some incoming. that isn't helpful probably but it does seem to, again, you can't go after -- you can't attack hunter biden if you're a democratic presidential candidate. >> biden doesn't need other people to attack him because biden is self-foiling. he causes his own problems. i thought the idea was donald trump really didn't know what he was talking about about anything. this affirms the case in terms of joe biden. what you hear from people and you're closer to this than i am. you hear from people and gossip is he's frail. he's not on his game. that he's not paying attention to his advisers. that he's really not the formidable person he might have been 20 years ago. >> who is? >> you. >> all right. lindsey graham decided to do

this and it got, joe biden has noticed. he has an interview tonight with don lemon. they released the excerpt of his response to this lindsey graham investigation of hunter biden. >> he knows me. he knows my son. he knows there's nothing to this. trump is now essentially holding power over him that even ukrainians wouldn't yield to. ukrainians would not yield to inve investigate biden. lindsay is about to go down in way that i think he's going to regret his whole life. >> carol, lindsey graham just the other day was talking about how much he likes and respects joe biden. it's of all people to go down a russia rabbit hole like this.

>> there's layers. it's the russia piece and lindsey graham and what his views use to be in being tough on russia. there's the relationship he had with former vice president because they served in the senate together. joe biden is right. i don't know if you recall when president obama when the republicans won the senate and the white house needed to cut deals in the senate and when foreign policy issues that lindsey graham was having an issue with, it was joe biden who was dealing with him in that way. it's really remarkable to see. on top of that, lindsey graham it was plenty of years for them to go after these documents if this was an issue. >> why do it now? >> why do it now? we know the answer. >> what is surprising is that it's lindsey graham. >> that's the surprise. >> not surprising that people would go after hunter biden. he is what man skank is but he is one. >> wow.

>> i'm sorry. it's dirty. the father and the child out of wedlock that just came out. we all remember sarah palin and the stories about her kids and everybody sort of looked at them and thought. we talk about the president's kids and we judge them. look, there's judgment going on here. not good judgment. >> there is video out there of lindsey graham saying that joe biden is one of the most honorable men he's met in politics. you look at what he's doing with biden but also look at what he's done with supposedly his best friend john mccain. >> is he rolling the dice politically? is he rolling the dice? >> he's doing more than rolling the vice. i think south carolina voters are going what happened to lindsey graham. >> are you sure? or is he following the voters? >> i think it's hard -- well, lindsey graham, part of his brand was he was a guy who call

it like he is. >> he didn't follow. >> he didn't follow. he had integrity. it's hard to see what he's done with john mccain and now joe biden to say he's a man of integrity. >> i think it's changed his persona whether he likes it or not. >> not just persona in terms of whether you like someone or you don't. >> his long term image. >> his policies. the whole thing. what sort of policy he was aligned with or how he sort of conducted himself as a senator. >> it's so politically -- it's exactly what they all say. it's to transactional. it's like -- >> well to the trump era. >> i can carry donald trump's golf clubs. i got a feeling the voters of south carolina is not what they want. >> i'm a huge lindsey graham fan. >> his approval rating went up 20 points. >> the base. >> i don't understand this exactly. i will say he's not the only

one. there's been an entire nuttiness around the administration on left and right. >> carol, cornell, danielle, happy friday. that's all we have tonight. if it's sunday, it's "meet the press" on nbc. we have a lot going on. we have adam schiff, roger wicker and the gps fusion founders behind the steel dossier. the beat with ari melber starts now. tonight donald trump agonizing the white house on edge. the impeachment walls and very real ways are coming crashing down. we begin with breaking news. tonight, we can report adam schiff says his committee is beginning work on its report laying out the facts for a potential impeachment gathering evidence. a blue print for what would be the facts on ukraine for any articles of impeachment, more depositions and hearings are