a little something called instinct. been using it for years. yeah, that's what i'm afraid of. he knows exactly where we're going. my whole body is a compass. oh boy... the my account app makes today's xfinity customer service simple, easy, awesome. not my thing. thank you for watching this hour of "msnbc live." i'll be back next saturday and you can follow me online at twitter and instagram. right now with my colleague and friend, richard lui. >> enjoy the week. want to start this hour and thank you for being here on msnbc. we're going to follow breaking news coming to us from "the washington post." this story posted just a short time ago and i'll read a part of it for you that says a

confidential white house review of president trump's decision to place a hold on military aid to ukraine has turned up hundreds of documents that reveal expensive efforts to generate an after the fact justification for the decision. the paper cites three people familiar with these records. the report goes on, quote, the research was triggered by the congressional impeachment inquiry announcement in september. it includes early august email exchanges between acting chief of staff mick mulvaney and white house budget officials seek to go provide an explanation for withholding the funds. again, breaking news just in to us through "the washington post." we'll be following this. other developments today, devin nunes responding to media allegations today that he met with ukrainian officials, a topic investigating joe biden and his son hunter. as a result the top republican on the house intelligence committee is now threatening legal action after thanksgiving

against the news outlets reporting that story. we have a third story we're following for you, clear insight on the next steps of the inquiry. take a listen. >> you have said you would continue to investigate while also compiling your report. what does that look like? and is it more for show or is there some evidence more investigations will happen next week? >> certainly not for show. there's more work to be done. there are still other witnesses, other documents we would like to obtain but we're not willing to go the months and months and months of rope-a-dope in the courts which the administration would more than love for us to do. >> members of congress, they are back in their districts for the thanksgiving break on this sunday. they're going to return to washington, d.c., december 3rd. for now they're taking their

argument to the court of public opinion. >> if it's proven and we're getting close, i don't think any should be able to leverage their office. >> when ambassador sondland was talking to a quid pro quo he used words like presume and guess. every day provides new and incriminating evidence. >> every day the american people are able to tune in they see this is a partisan process and it's a complete waste of energy. >> and those are som of the responses so far this weekend. back to the top story i was just telling you. the breaking story from t"the washington post". white house review showing extensive effort to justify trump's decision to block ukraine military aid. one of the authors is on the phone with us right now.

thanks for jumping on the horn, the story just coming out authored by you. give us the summary. i read the headline but this is just coming in to us through your reporting. >> yeah, thanks for having me. the story we have been hearing for a little bit of time privately at the "washington post" was that the white house was doing an internal records review to figure out what happened with the way they had handled ukraine's military aid and the president's decisions. there was a protective move but what we learned is in the white house records review there is the chief of staff, mick mulvaney and the omg discussing after the president had blocked aid to ukraine trying to figure out how do we justify. what is our legal reasoning and public justification for holding

up this aid? the timing is interesting, too, because the search for a reason and rationale comes after the president made his decision and it's after a cia whistle-blower has made an anonymous complaint to the inspector general and the white house has been alerted to that. figure me, i want to correct myself. after a ceo employee made a complaint through an anonymous hotline system and the white house has been alerted to that. >> now in your writing here, in this report you say the research by the white house counsel's office. >> it is a totally appropriate thing for the white house lawyers to figure out what are we going to argue is our defense and let's get our hands around what happened so that we're not relying on what people tell us

or looking at what the records show and what i found interesting is they had a particular focus on records between the white house and federal agencies like the budget office or the state department or the department of defense because those kinds of emails and communications are subject to public records law. white house records can you hold on to them. you never have to share them with anyone unless under court order. records between the white house and the federal agency can ultimately be revealed to the public. >> carol, the information, where does it come from? of course not asking to reveal sources, but you are hearing this from those close to the story? >> people familiar with the records review and with the discussions this summer between mulvaney's office and the budget office. >> now there's the question of

based on this process happening within the white house was there information that should have been revealed in the process happening across the way in the house or not? was there information if you're a critic of what the white house has done there information that should have been revealed? >> an excellent question. all we have to go on is we know the white house's position, pat cipollone lead to the house intelligence chairman. we're not cooperating with your impeachment probe. it will be interesting if the records reveg something different than what anyone has said publicly or have testified to. that is a to be continued kind of category. >> carol, from what you are hearing about what is in the emails and the information

and/or the topics you hinted about that in the first question but if you are adam schiff, what do you find interesting about this? >> well, i know as an investigative reporter i can only speak for myself. as an investigative reporter what i find interesting there's a trove of records. they've been collected and reviewed by the white house lawyers. there are a subset that can be sought under the freedom of information act. there are records that have prompted consternation among white house lawyers and it doesn't mean that they are legally damaging to the president but they are concerning to the white house counsel's office. i always want to know what the records show and i assume the chairman does as well. >> do we know, and last question and thank you for jumping on the phone again.

do we know this paper trail we're discussing, were they within the scope of the documents that adam schiff and his committee has requested? >> adam schiff didn't get very far in requesting records of the white house. i'm sure that he will reasonably argue that he had been seeking some of this material, that it would have been responsive to his questions. as i say he made his request, issued his demand letters and the white house gave their reasoning why they were not going to participate. part of it they view this as executive material, conversations with the president have a special protection. i'm not a lawyer, though i was raised by them. i can't say for sure whether or not the white house has complied.

i would point to you again the white house has said they're not cooperating and adam schiff knows that. >> and well raised you were. an investigative reporter, get to their site if you want to read this article about eight pages long if you print it. involving a white house review that did turn up emails, a document trail showing an effort of the president's decision to block the ukraine military aid reading directly that title. carol, thank you so much. >> my pleasure. >> i want to bring in reporter former u.s. attorney and msnbc contributor, the hill senior staff writer scott long and justice correspondent carrie johnson. let's start with you on this, josh. if you look quickly down on my table here at this printed copy and running through it and you

heard what carol told us were some of the highlights in her excellent reporting as always, what's your take away in terms of how big of a deal this is? >> our big take system away -- and we want to comment nbc news has not independently confirmed this reporting, is suggestions that there may have been -- at least what democrats will look at, of a cover-up. not only there were problematic interactions why the aid was held up to ukraine but in the immediate aftermath as the aid was being withheld that lawyers and others in the white house were trying to back fill legal explanations for why that happened and we know from the testimony of several witness who is testified before the house intelligence committee there were legal concerns that folks involved, officials had with whether the white house could unilaterally decide not to give aid already appropriated by

congress. these documents are likely to put more meat on that and illustrate just how much effort there was behind the scenes to try to come up with some type of justification that would be substantial enough that would meet the questions about why this was withheld. >> niles, again, looking through the eight pages in front of me here, but we also heard from carol herself, omb is involved in this. mick mulvaney is involved in this and that was one of the questions what were the levers that were pulled as this aid to ukraine was stopped and how fast did the levers move? who pulled the levers? that's the entire question here. these emails according to the sources carol and her two co-bi-liners have gotten a view into right now.

did you have any hint this entire process was happening, that the white house was looking into how did this happen as the investigation was happening on the hill? >> no, i would bow down to "the washington post" reporting on this. i think it's important, richard, for a number of reasons. one, it goes to a phrase we've all become familiar with, the idea of consciousness of guilt. is there some sense this is a cover-up as josh puts it, that people are trying to, frankly, cover their asses in all of this. once it has gone wrong, once a whistle-blower has come forward. that, to me, seems the central issue here and the issue that has the potential to cause real problems not just for president trump but for people like mulvaney and others in and around who have tried to minimize their own involvement in this story, almost, ukraine,

where is that attitude that may become untenable. >> joyce, so glad you're here with us as we look at the timing here as carol's reporting was. she said this happened after that complaint was made by somebody who worked at the cia, right? and then became -- then started the process of trying to find a justification for stopping the aid. it says mulvaney asked for an update on the legal rationale for withholding the aid and how much longer it could be delayed. this happened after the red flag was put up on this very decision being made. >> if i understand carol's

reporting correctly, this was after someone in the cia called a tip into the tip line so this was available to the white house as events went on and they began to certificate. for a justification and one thing i think that we can be fairly certain about is they were unable to come up with one because if they were successful we would hear that and documents to substantiate it would have been turned over. so this reporting and the time line seems very important. the story notes the information gathered, the concern is that it's politically damaging. i wonder if we'll see the origins of these defenses we heard last week like the defense that trump is an anti-corruption fighter or that aid was withheld so the you're weans could pay their fair share. it will be interesting if schiff

can get his hands on these documents. >> yeah, the timing is mulvaney asked for the information i was just quoting from the article just days after the white house counsel's office was made aware of the anonymous cia official who made a complaint. justification versus explanation, and that will be part of our discussion here. >> yeah, richard, what's so interesting to me we're coming off a late-night friday document release based on a freedom of information lawsuit by american oversight. american oversight has is hayes helped to uncover documents that leave a paper trail among president trump and the oval office and his assistant rudy giuliani and his assistant and mike pompeo about ousting marie yovanovitch. what we have now based on "the washington post" report is another potential rich trove of documents that could help clear

up discrepancies among the 12 witness who is have already testified as part of these pemt inquiry hearings and some of the white house heads. some of these documents will not lie or shade in a way some of the witness testimony or public statements not under oath might. we will be able to see, i think, explanations and justifications forming and what people were thinking and writing in real time. if this recent lawsuit is a path forward, we could be seeing more of these under a court order or political pressure to release them. >> adam schiff and his team and staffers are pointing to this thing right now and trying to figure out what's in this? should we move on?

do we need to find out what the documents are? >> that's right. i think adam schiff knows and they think they had two weeks of really good hearings and were able to make the case of presidential misconduct and so they feel they have a little bit of momentum coming out of the hearings. i think you heard on thursday with the last hearing adam schiff making what we thought was a closing case on these impeachment hearings and, so, adam schiff and others are heading into this thanksgiving week. it's going to be a very busy week for intelligence committee democrats. they're going to be writing the report they will then forward on to jerry nadler, the democrats, and hand off the process. they don't want these other issues slowing down the process. i think they can investigate and

perhaps interview some other people at the same time they are compiling the findings or writing that report but they feel they are in a good place and adam schiff says he feels they have overwhelming evidence of presidential misconduct. they're moving full speed ahead. following this report from "the washington post" as, again, adam schiff and the intel committee moves forward, the democrats move forward. more atmospherics that show so much still happening. so much still to be looked at. whether or not they will or will not, again, the breaking news reporting coming out of "the washington post." this on a white house review that we're just learning this hour that turns up emails and other documents showing a deliberate effort to try to understand blocking ukraine

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still following this breaking news story here at msnbc. a report that came out about an hour and 25 minutes ago from "the washington post," the headline reading white house review turns up emails showing extensive effort to justify trump's decision to block ukraine military aid. why this headline is of import is because of the very

impeachment inquiry happening now. where was the paper trail? what documents might this investigation want to see? this clearly might represent some of the documents that adam schiff, the democrats, are looking for. what was discussed in the white house as they were undergoing the very stress, the very crisis that some might call that's underneath right now of an impeachment inquiry related to this. so far 12 witnesses and public hearings, 35 hours of note that you probably watched as you are watching what was happening, very few documents and all fact witnesses. if the democrats could ever get their hands on but this reporting coming from "the washington post" about those very documents that if you are sitting in the white house you would find important. our panel is still with us.

and let me get back to scott and if you could reflect on the point i just made, it has been a parade of witnesses and not a parade of documents. this reporting, unlike what they have not had does show some information about documents that do have the discussion of the ukraine aid being withheld. >> this is why the democrats wanted, have requested so many from the state department, the white house, omb. the documents have the email that is show specific dates, what was discussed. as we saw from this transfer of documents that came out on friday, correspondence between mike pompeo and rudy giuliani, now reported by "the washington post." it provides a path of which questions to ask of certain wanses.

it would have been helpful to have the documents two weeks ago at the start of the hearings. >> don't get greedy, scott wong. >> they are going down to writing this report, as i mentioned before, while also, i think, keeping an eye on what new documents come to live. >> joyce, if you are putting together this report, and we have the first group of documents you and i were talking about yesterday that came from that watchdog group, it's just the first group, right? would you be able to include it in the report? i will add another reading and it says, quote, the government accountability office had warned omb it was not following the law how to disperse and uphold congressionally approved funds. that's a two-part question.

the president's disdain for the federal records app. every record is an executive branch employee is part of a record that's supposed to be retained so it can be search about in a setting like this and trump hasn't done that. he's taken it a step further. you might expect there would be some accommodation in the obama white house after they turned over tens of thousands of documents in the fast and curious crisis. they said enough and wanted to negotiate on further turnovers. trump said he won't turn over anything. i think now that strategy will begin to come into focus and schiff will have this problem going forward of how do you write a complete report on impeachment and propose articles of impeachment when it's clear

the white house is keeping from you getting information that you need. so i'll go out on a limb, richard, and make this suggestion. it's not impossible the intel committee could make some preliminary recommendations but continue to investigate. there's a process like that for prosecutors. we may well see it here necessitated by the white house's conduct. >> they're trying to build an argument on what appeared to be a moving ground, a quicksand of sorts at the moment as we get more information. carrie johnson, this is your beat. the gao warning omb that they were not following the law in how they chose to disperse and with hold funds. that, at least in this report, seems to be of good importance if you're trying to make the argument against what happened. >> in the cases that i've

covered, richard, that's considered to be a bad fact. of course we still need to see the documents, if they ever do see the light of day. we need to get more information about what the gao is talking about. they have been warning the withholding of this $391 million in aid seems to be violating the congressional budget act. congress had approved the aid for ukraine which informs a who had war with russia and reasons seem to be fuzzy at best from the administration. we have not heard a complete set of responses from mick mulvaney, president trump, or anyone else about why that was done. now the new documents as described by "the washington post" could further complicate that effort and could provide a sense of what kind of things that the administration, including the omb, were on notice about.

and as they were grappling with the public relations consequences of those decisions. these are things reporters would want to know and investigators inside the justice department, too. >> if you're trying to keep the trains moving on time, josh, do you consider this reporting, the tranche of documents, the first tranche of documents obtained by the state department by this watchdog. do you consider putting these pieces, these exhibits, in the judiciary committee as they take on what might be the report coming from the intel committee? >> part of this is a political, if they allow this to be prolonged and go in the investigative stage they may lose some of the public sympathy. some indication from polling the public may be less supportive of

impeachment even than just a couple weeks ago. for democrats as they look at the calendar heading into 2020. the campaign season taking hold and all of those senators who are in the senate who would be side tracked from the campaign. there is a pressure to try to move as expeditiously as possible and the more you start to involve trying to get new documents that they're surely not going to hand over voluntarily to try to litigate that you're talking about a much lengthier process democrats would like to be able to move on what adam schiff has described this morning on "meet the press" as already overwhelming evidence to some of the allegations democrats have made against the president. >> if you're nancy pelosi and you're looking at all of this stuff that keeps on coming out and you look at what you already have and josh was alluding to this is the most you can get or there's still more, again, glass

half full or half empty. where do you think we are at based on this stuff that keeps coming out? >> josh is quite right, the democrats want to move along as fast as they can and believe there is grounds for impeachment already. it is true that the polls have been shifting around a little bit, some decline in support for impeachment. i think we have to be clear why that is. it's not because any is ex culptory it is this propaganda apparatus that stretches from some people on capitol hill to people in other news organizations who are trying very hard to discredit evidence, to divert people's attention. all of these things are building the case for impeachment, building with very solidly and the reason the polls are moving,

in my opinion, you have this chorus of people serving a propaganda position. >> thank you for being with us. niall stanage, thank you. coming up, i mentioned that watchdog group that got its hands on documents congress could not. up next the head of the group that got this stuff. group that got this stuff. (burke) at farmers insurance, we've seen almost everything so we know how to cover almost anything. (bert) even a "not-so-handy monster." (johnson) what is going on in here! i can't hear myself think! (grover) what does it look like, sir? i am here to help you with your water heater. (johnson) oh! [sighs defeatedly] (grover) do not worry sir. i also fix cars! [johnson groans]

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thanks for staying with us. i want to recap our breaking news in the impeachment inquiry coming to us from "the washington post" within the last two hours. this report right here, a confidential white house review of president trump's decision to place a hold on military aid to ukraine has turned up hundreds of documents and in the documents they reveal extensive efforts to try to generate an after the fact justification for that decision. again, that's coming from "the washington post." now the paper in this report cites three people familiar with the records. it goes on to say, quote, the research was triggered by the impeachment announcement in september and includes early

august email exchanges between mulvaney and white house budget officials seeking to provide an explanation for the with holding of the funds. this after the light went off, then began this effort in the white house according to the reporting. the story this comes two days after a completely different set of newly released documents were obtained by government watchdog called american oversight. more information this coming from communications and more between the state department and other agencies in the white house. that again coming in after the public hearings ended there on the hill. adam schiff, we understand, not intending necessarily to have more public hearings. this tranche of about 100 pages reveal new details on the roles secretary of state mike pompeo, also rudy giuliani in this

ukraine funding and the aid being stopped and then the controversy thereafter. american oversight, the group that did file of freedom of information act request got these documents. this is the first tranche in the first round of the closures. they are planning to release more documents in the foreseeable future. austin evers is the executive director of american oversight. austin, an everyday, average weekend, huh, and here we are with 100 pages of documents you got your first tranche and then we have "the washington post." i guess the question is i want to start with this, what stood out to you in the 100 pages? you have clearly gone through this a to z. >> two things, number one, that we got them at all. they should have been handed over to congress long ago. they're clearly pertinent to the impeachment inquiry and the fact

american oversight could get them, we're just citizens. we can go to court and press our right and what that tells us is that holding them back from congress is obstruction. it's astonishing mike pompeo won't turn these over. there's a clear paper trail that not only connected rudy juligiui to mike pompeo but the white house. the personal secretary described as his gatekeeper made it possible for giuliani to contact pompeo after he couldn't get through, quote, regular channels. we've heard that before on ukraine. at the time of these documents it appears what giuliani was doing was executing the first part of this scheme which was getting rid of a u.s. ambassador not sympathetic to pressuring the country to engage in the 2020 elections.

it should have gone to congress in the first place. >> you obtained these documents because, as i was mentioning, the request that you made, then the courts said you have to give it to american oversight. it was given. how much more are you expecting? you said this was the first tranche. how much more? >> this isn't our only lawsuit so the message i want people to hear this is the first tranche of many to come. my group alone has five pending lawsuits with more to come and several dozen requests from dod, from omb, from the state department as "the washington post" pointed out in the article if the white house communicates with a federal agency, it covers it. >> how soon might you expect this? i'm not going to hold you to it because it's impossible to know exactly. >> we don't know for sure. we will be opening negotiations

for round two tomorrow. >> got it. >> and then in another lawsuit related to omb with holding the aid their deadline to kick off negotiations is this upcoming friday. >> nonpartisan or partisan? >> we're a nonpartisan. >> i want to bring in two of our panelists still with us. joyce has a question for you, austin. you know who joyce is, an amazing prosecutor as well as a former u.s. attorney and she is with us from birmingham, alabama and is aware of this last tranche. go ahead, joyce. >> austin, i burned the midnight oil on friday reading your documents as you made them available. and i'm curious about a number of things but i'll ask you here did you feel like this turnover from the government was in good faith? it was pretty miserly. there were a lot of duplicates

so it was a lot of repetition some of it including rudy giuliani's trump towers binder we had already seen. do you feel the government is acting in good faith now that they're complying with the court order? >> i can tell you first and foremost that when we go to court tomorrow, we have a filing due, we will be poking and produpr prodding this to make sure it's full and complete. we have no indication of bad faith. we have reviewers standing between us and the documents. i have a lot of trust in the civil service. i think the last couple weeks have really restarred it. i don't have a reason to suspect bad faith. people will make responsiveness calls, redact things close to the line, so we will be pressing

our legal right constantly in this case and others. >> go ahead, joyce. >> no, i think that's incredibly reassuring and i agree the line people, the career folks who are used to handling this freedom of information act work and are doing it here can be relied upon. the interesting question, as you point out, comes in at the review level and i noticed that, fraps, in this turnover of documents there are some areas where items are redacted because of some of the normal category that can be withheld. do you plan on sharing these with the house? you've made them available on line. is there an open line of communication there? >> i'm not going to get into our communication of the hill but we did publish within minutes of receiving them ourselves. we believe it belongs to the public.

i would be demanding them and, number two, i would point out congress is not subject to f oy. they can press those with greater leverage for a foia group like mine. >> that is a big question. >> through foia, austin was able to get these documents yet we have an impeachment inquiry that is submitting subpoenas and they're getting zero. what does that tell you, joyce? >> so this is part of the president's announce. strategy where he said up front he wouldn't comply with subpoenas, wouldn't turn anything over. and that's what's forced congress into this posture of going to court to get items they're entitled to. what adam schiff refers to as

rope-a-dope. this is the administration's strategy of delay, of carrying things out because not only does congress have to wait on a ruling from the trial court from the district court there is then appeal and the prospect of appeal to the supreme court. i think hats off to american heroes who are using the legal process, the foia mechanism to short circuit all that have and get these documents. obviously it's going to take a full-court press to get this white house to give the american people what we're entitled to after all which is just accountability for its conduct. >> a part of also what american oversight was able to obtain was a list of scheduled calls for the secretary of state. it included the personal lawyer of president trump, rudy giuliani. austin, that then also includes, again, from the 100 pages that you got, that the president's assistant is the individual that assisted in getting those two together. give us more -- again, i'm just

paraphrasing. >> sure. what you see is an assistant for rudy giuliani reaching out to the assistant for president trump saying rudy can't get through to the secretary of state through regular channels. can you help? and the president's assistant does that. i think there's a couple things that this does. number one, it takes it directly to the oval office and, number two, it short-circuits any attempt. we've heard inklings the white house or republican congress might want to throw rudy under the bus as freelancing. we know that's not true. common sense says that. we have rudy relying on the power of the white house to start the execution of the scheme, to smear a u.s. ambassador. it's extraordinary to think of the united states president and the united states secretary of state going after someone who is representing us abroad. >> quickly here, joyce, what does that mean? again, the assistant to the president putting the two

together. >> so the whole issue that comes to the forefront is whether or not this conduct in ukraine is attributable to the president, and i tend to agree with austin. my eyes sort of popped when i first saw the documentation that it was the president's assistant that rudy giuliani's folks had reached out to and said can you put us in touch with pompeo. i think what will be interesting to find out going forward and it's not entirely clear to me in this tranche of documents is whether pompeo and giuliani were in contact before this happened and they were seeking a more private channel of communication or whether this request for contact through the white house was the first time they spoke on this subject. >> talking about eyes popping, scott wong, you know the beat you've got, eyes are getting wider here on the sunday and friday based on what joyce and austin were saying. >> well, that's exactly right. i think what the stories on

friday with the american oversight documents show as well as this new "washington post" report is that there's still a lot of things that we just don't know. despite eight weeks of this investigation carried on by the house intelligence committee, two weeks of public hearings in which we learned a lot of new information and we were able to follow the story of president trump's involvement on ukraine, there is just simply a lot that we still don't know that we're continuing to learn about. it's entirely possible that the intelligence committee will write its report and send it to judiciary and we will still be learning new information each and every day. >> thanks to my co-pilots as we go through the friday release of a tranche of documents, hundreds of pages more documents and why that's important because the last two weeks, again, has been fact witnesses not pages, not

documents and now we have reporting of some in front of us. austin evers, scott wong, joyce vance, thank you. enjoy your sunday and have a great thanksgiving week ahead of you. all right. we do have some other big news this hour if this wasn't enough for you. former new york city mayor michael bloomberg says i'm in. y. when you shop with wayfair, you spend less and get way more. so you can bring your vision to life and save in more ways than one. for small prices, you can build big dreams, spend less, get way more. shop everything home at wayfair.com

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♪ former mayor of new york city, michael bloomberg announced he was in. >> there is an america where everyone without health insurance and those who have it can keep it and the struggling middle class get their full share. mike bloomberg, problem solver to take back a country. >> that and $35 million for television ads, set a record with that, fwryi the field to de

$20 million. and they plan to spend $100 million. welcome to michael starr hopkins. big dollars here. big dollars and unconventional. he will skip the early states. aren't we living in the era of unconventional campaigns. >> michael bloomberg's ad budget, he can do anything to a guy worth $50 billion is a drop in the buckets. after the first four early states, a split decision. you won't have a clear front-runner. they will be waste wade as far as finances are speaking and he can come in and start to compete in super tuesday and he can start to play rather

significantly there. as pointed out by many, money doesn't buy happiness, puts a down payment on it. elizabeth warren, according to tom steyer, calculated elizabeth warren had $80 million in free television. you compare that to a $30 million buy and you can see free media carry the day. although he has unlimited deep pockets, not a cure-all. >> it's a long pass and you pick on what you want to pick on at the moment. money cannot buy debates. >> no, it can't. when you're michael bloomberg, you don't really need to be on the debate stage. you look at the debate and how they play out, they haven't moved the needle much. they have had negative consequences and no one has broken out. his willingness to spend money on tv will supplement that.

>> as he enters, one poll from the marquette law school, they did match up to the four leading candidates, it says democrats are falling back a little. all four of, the top four leading candidates behind trump. another factoid, 18 point difference for pete buttigieg. go to the next one, look how donald trump won wisconsin in 2016, he won by .06%. theoretically, democrats added another candidate and they may not need that right now. >> that's true, beware of forecast bag poll. anyone who tells you donald trump won't be competitive in swing states are not telling you something good. the big problem democrats had in swing states, not only that they hemorrhaged white voters and failed to turn out a significant portion of their base.

if they're able to do both this coming time they can win and if not they can lose. this is idle speculation on our point. >> michael, final 15 seconds. >> i would say i think democrats should beware of going after michael bloomberg for money. he came from a middle class family and bloomberg stands a strong chance of being around this coming tuesday. >> apologize to you both for keeping you waiting around due to breaking news. politics nation up next! next! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ ♪when you have nausea, heartburn, indigestion,♪ ♪upset stomach, diarrhea. try pepto liquicaps for fast relief and ultra-coating.

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