and colleague for doing this show last week. i've been a fan of hers longer than i've been a coworker of her. thank you for last week. thank you molt of all to you for watching. good morning and happy new year's eve. we're on tape this morning, the final day of 2019. what a year. it has been another unrelenting, fast-paced year of political news. the biggest story probably being the impeachment of president trump. before the democrats settled on the two articles of impeachment, we saw two weeks of testimony from witnesses, most of whom described in various manners how president trump attempted to shakedown a foreign power for dirt on a political opponent. one of those witnesses was ambassador to the european union gordon sondland. he was already likely the most anticipated witness in the

impeachment inquiry, but his appearance moments before he took the stand we got his bombshell statement on live tv. here's how the coverage played out. >> we just got, by the way, ed, we just got opening statement of ambassador sondland. and i go to page five of it where he says the suggestion that we were engaged in some irregular or rogue diplomacy is absolutely false. i've now identified certain state department emails and messages that provide contemporaneous support from my view. these emails show that the leadership of state, nsc, and the white house were all informed about the ukraine efforts from may 23rd, 2019, until the security aid was released on september 11th, 2019. i will quote from some of those messages with you shortly. any hope in the white house that

oba ambassador sondland would go quietly into that night are going to be unfulfilled today in his testimony. >> look at the -- >> go ahead, ed. >> his memory has been refreshed, famously refreshed. i think he's also concentrated his mind that roger stone last wrooek we week was jailed on seven counts, one was lying to congress. his memory has been refreshed. he's heard the president say i hardly know this gentleman. so he's been cut loose by trump. he's been left -- >> and, ed, let me give you his response to that. first, secretary perry, volker and i worked with mr. rudy giuliani on ukraine matters and here's the line, at the express ready direction of the president of the united states. >> and if you read further, joe, he goes on to say in the next page, quote, mr. giuliani was expressing the desires of the

president of the united states. we knew that these investigations were important to the president. the investigations about burisma. >> above that, mr. giuliani's requests for a quid pro quo for arrange white house visit for president zelensky. quid pro quo. mr. giuliani demanded, et cetera, et cetera. you go on to the next page, i was acting in good faith as presidential appointee i followed the directions of the president. we worked with mr. giuliani because the president directed to us do so. >> you are now watching mr. sondland try to shift from saying, hey, i'm into the going to be the fall guy here. you're trying to set me up as the fall guy. the fall guys here are rudy giuliani and president trump. >> he says dwe not wawe did not work with rudy giuliani. >> i'm not good at predicting headlines, but i can predict tomorrow's headlines. this is mr. sondland's words, we followed the president's orders.

well, ed. >> yeah, he's been given no choice. trump has -- now that i'd be under pressure to allow mike pompeo to testify, i thinkon bolton's testimony is going to come front and center. i do think that this impeachment inquiry today is the most important day yet. and we know already from sondland's opening statement. by do think the walls are closing in. this is not a predictable game. and sondland -- sondland's been cut loose and he's behaving as any racial person would do in the circumstance. he's not going to continue to commit perjury. that's what he's saying today. he will fess up to the orchestrated role that he was part of at the behest of president trump to get a quid pro quo. >> wow. >> that's exactly what we're getting bang to rights today. >> page five we learn that the

white house also suspend security aid to ukraine. i was adamantly opposed to any suspension of aid as the ukrainians needed those funds to fight against russian agreti aggression. willie. >> he does have new information about the phone call at the restaurant in kiev. he says the following about that. i spoke by phone with mr. trump. the call lasted five minutes. i remember i was at a restaurant in kiev. i have no reason to doubt this conversation included the subject of investigations. he goes on to say, other witnesses have recently shared their recollection of overhearing this call for the most part i have no reason to doubt their accounts. talking about david holmes who said he overheard the president talking loudly through the phone with ambassador sondland about investigations into joe biden and burisma. >> wow. >> so ed luce, even the

overheard phone calls, it seems that sondland is going to confirm just about everything that we've heard so far over the past two weeks. >> and let's just remember it was only a month ago in mid-october that he testified that'd heard nothing about any linkage between the suspension of aid to ukraine anda the campaign that trump was demanding. he'd heard nothing about that. one month later he's confirming everything. that's the speed with which this is changing and it is quite remarkable. >> so page 14. i know that members of this committee have frequently framed these complicated issues in the form of a simple question. was there a quid pro quo? as i testified previously, with regard to the requested white house call and white house meeting, the answer is yes. >> and further on down on page 14, within my state department emails there is a july 19th email that i sent to secretary pompeo. >> oh, boy.

>> secretary perry, brian mccormick, chief of staff, ms. kenna, mick mulvaney, senior adviser robert blair, a lot of senior officials. here's my exact quote from that email. i talked to zleps juelensky jus he's prepared to receive potus's call. he intends to run a fully transparent investigation and will turn over every stone. everyone was in the loop have mike pompeo was in the loop on page 18. the state department was fully supportive of our engagement in ukraine affairs. was aware that a commitment to investigations was among the issues that we were pursuing on tuesday, september the 3rd i sent secretary pompeo an email to express my appreciation for joining a series of meetings in brussels. i think was really important and the chemistry seems promising. really appreciate it.

pompeo replied, all good, you're doing great work. keep banging away. state department leadership expressed total support for our efforts to engage a new ukrainian administration which, of course, he now says included with his quid pro quo. arms for political dirt. >> and back up to page 16, nonetheless before the september 1st warsaw meeting, the ukrainians had become aware that the security funds had note yet to be dispersed in the absence of any credible explanation for the hold i came to the conclusion that the aid, like the white house visit, was jeopardized. in preparation for the meeting, i asked secretary pompeo whether face-to-face conversations between trump with zelensky would help break the logjam. specifically on thursday, august 22nd, i emailed him directly and i wrote, should we block time in warsaw for a short pull aside

for potus to meet zelenskiny would ask zelensky to look him in the eye and tell him once ukraine's new justice votes are in place in mid-september, that z should be able to move forward publicly with confidence on those issues to potus and the u.s. hopefully that will break the logjam. pompeo replays yes. >> quite early on, mr. sondland really declares war on the white house and the state department when he indicates that hundreds of meetings and calls with individuals but i am not a note taker nor am i a memo writer. never have been. my lawyers and i have made multiple requests to the state department and the white house for these materials. the backup materials about his conversations. yet these materials were not provided to me. they have also refused to share these materials with this committee. these documents are not classified and, in fairness, should have been made available. >> let's go back to ed luce. we just heard a ridiculous defense of the president that he

was too stupid to understand what he was requesting of the lieutenant colonel. you could make a montage, about a 20-minute montage of all the idiotic defenses republicans have trotted out over the -- all the straw men they set up over the past several weeks, months actually, and in this opening statement today you have ambassador sondland, a man who contributed a million dollars to donald trump and is a trumpist from day one, you have ambassador sondland ripping every one of the republicans' straw men to shreds. >> one can only imagine has devin nunes and jim jordan and others are speed reading this written text of sondland what lines they're preparing. they've retreated from one fallback position to another.

right now all their left with is really to assassinate his character. i have to say in this case with glab gland, it gordon sondland, it's going to be easier do than with vindman, marie yovanovitch, because he paid for play to get this job with that million dollars donation. tomorrow we have got a highly credible witness, fiona hill. a russia expert. she's going to be extremely hard to shake and i suspect her written testimony is going to be invaluable in fill in any blanks that gordon sondland might not yet have refreshed himself about. >> well there are was a question before, willie, and members have had to see yet, official they are reading this as we are. >> what do they do now? i mean, what do they do now? >> this is incredible. >> this is going to be really interesting. >> they can't trash this. they can of course trash this

man, but this guy was in the tank for donald trump from day one, take the million dollars, got awarded this ambassadorship, and sondland and giuliani went all over europe. and the republicans had hoped, i'm sure, that he was going to plead the fifth but as clair told us earlier, not in the cards for gordon sondland. i mean, i think he made the decision several weeks ago he was not going to go the way of paul manafort and roger stone. >> no. he is a trump loyalist and he was running the entire operation. he was deputized by the white house to run the operation. let me just read something that's as clear as day, john heilemann. sondland says was there a quid pro quo? as i testified previously, the assistance yes. that's a quote from gloond you'll hear from his mouth in a couple of minutes. he looks to separate himself

from all of this. he says my personal view which i shared repeatedly with others was that the white house meeting and security assistance should have proceeded without preconditions of any kind. but he says, we were handed this rudy giuliani mess and we tried to make the best of it. >> yeah. i think it's possible, joe, that it's a little more recent than that. i think that, you know, when he first amended his testimony he was still trying to admit what he to admit but not tell the full story. it's only subsequent to that that it's become clear that the lion forces around trump were trying to make him the scapegoat of the two potential scapegoats, rudy giuliani and him, that he was the easier target. giuliani has too much on trump. at this point as we sit here now, bh whwhen this standard fi started to break, one of the most remarkable things about it was that people like john bolton, mike pompeo, and rudy

giuliani were plaimplicate frome beginning. the president's personal lawyer were all in this, you could tell, from the beginning when the story broke, we're now back to those people as david suggested earlier in the program, that as sondland now decides, as you put it, not going to go quietly, not going to be a patsy, not going to be the fall guy, is going to take everyone down with him and is putting the harsh spotlight on rudy giuliani, on mike pompeo, on donald trump, now as this investigation now moves into its next phase, the focus becomes what will get john bolton on to capitol hill to testify because john bolton is someone who has a lot of direct knowledge? what are the calculations that mike pompeo and rudy giuliani make about their own futures, political futures, legal liability? these are now at the very senior levels of the trump administration, of the united states government, and they are now -- they've been kind of hovering in the background for the entire month and a half that the scandal has been 'in play. they are now front and center on

the stage and we're going to see some incredible things happen over the next couple weeks. >> and, clair, today we are going to see trumpists are going to see donald trump turn on yet another one of his own. peter baker's headline talk about the -- it now extends, they are now going to try destroy the representation of trumpist sondland, ambassador sondland, he gave a million dollars. and you do worried after today, is rudy giuliani next? >> sondland is a wealthy, successful guy. he got a good lawyer. and the other thing that be happened between the time he abehinded h amended his testimony and today is roger stone was convicted for lying to congress. this all came together for this guy to come clean and now the only thing republicans are left with is what the guy did, what president trump did was terrible, but it's not

impeachable. and that's not what trump wants to hear him say. >> ambassador sondland has entered the room, he will be sworn in and the proceedings will begin. this is expected to be after reading his opening statements, pretty damning testimony in the impeachment probe. >> a remarkable day. you go back to the personal where i read a story about his wife telling the ambassador that he needed to protect himself, his family, and his business. he had worked too hard to throw it all away for donald trump. and it is remarkable, ed luce, the number of people who have thrown away their lives and are now sitting in prison trying to show loyalty to a man who never shows the same loyalty in return. you have >> you have to think of rudy giuliani who joked the other day that he had insurance in case trump cut him loose.

and trump will cut rudy giuliani loose. i wonder what that insurance is? i wonder what it is that rudy giuliani can do to enrich this rapidly enriching story about ukraine. because he's going to know more than even sondland knows. he's been really the prime mover on behalf of president trump all and all. and he's the one in most legal jeopardy of all these characters right now. >> that was our live coverage leading into the testimony of gordon sondland before the house against committee. just one week later, president trump was impeached. when where he come back, another big story of 2019. the continued fallout from the administration separating children from their parents at the southern border. we're back in a moment. rents at the southern border. we're back in a moment. i've always been the ringleader had a zest for life. flash forward, then ra kept me from the important things. and what my doctor said surprised me.

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actions speak louder than words. she was a school teacher. my dad joined the navy and helped prosecute the nazis in nuremberg. their values are why i walked away from my business, took the giving pledge to give my money to good causes, and why i spent the last ten years fighting corporate insiders who put profits over people. i'm tom steyer, and i approve this message. because, right now, america needs more than words. we need action.

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homeland security inspector general report says the dhs did not have the necessary tools in place to track how many immigrant children it separated from their familiar this. the report found that the trump administration estimated it would separate 26,000 children if the zero tolerance policy of 2018 had been allowed to continue. furthermore, the agency new it lacked the technology to track and reunite the children with their parents. after receiving backlash, nationwide president trump signed an executive order ending the policy in june of 2018. the administration previously said an estimated 2,800 children were separated as a result of that zero tolerance policy, but the new report says that due to the lack of technology to track children which ones had been separated meant the agency had to revise that estimate to more than 3,000. the report also said officials at customs and border protection

forged ahead with the policy even though they knew ahead of time that the agency lacked the proper technology to track and reunify children with their parents. meanwhile, "politico" reports that the department of homeland security's inadequate medical technology and record management for thousands of migrants who passed through its custody are contributing to poor care and even deaths kitingciting a revi lawsuit records. the new book entitled migrating to prison, locking up immigrants. we have the author here. what is the obsession? are you saying americans are somehow -- they feel this in their guts? what is it? they want to lock up immigrants? >> immigration prison has grown from the beginning in the 1980s through today with bipartisan support. under president obama we saw more people locked up more than ever before because some of

violation of immigration law until president trump. so i think that is something that stretches across the political -- traditional political lines and we've only seen it get harsher. >> joe. >> you know, professor hernandez, what i've always found fascinating since the beginning of donald trump's presidential campaign is that if you -- if you put these policies up to the american people and ask if they support a border wall, if they support this separation policy, if they support donald trump's immigration policies, oftentimes you find support in the mid 30s and opposition over 60%. there seems to be a pretty huge disconnect between what the president and politicians in washington are doing and what a majority of americans, white, brown, black, want their government do when it comes to immigration. >> yeah.

i think migrants have been used as a chip in the political calculation that both political parties have been playing in washington for quite some time where one tries to out -- out done the other political party by showing just how strong they can be on enforcing immigration law, policing the border through boots on the ground, to high technology, the arrero stat vehicles, balloons, and prisons. and the sad reality is that while that's happening, there's stalemate in d.c. and there are human lives that are being -- that are being thrown behind barbed wire and steel doors. >> you note in the book that eisenhower shut down major detentioning facilities including ellis island. a few years later they said it was a sign of, quote, enlight will civilization. how do we get from there to here where we see migrants be

imprisoned both under president obama and in an accelerated fashion under president trump? >> that history is important because it reminds us it's pobli possible to do things in a radical way that's different than today. it started in the early '80s under carter and reagan when we started seeing large group of dark-skinned migrants coming to the united states first from haiti, then from cuba. in the midst of what was then the beginnings of the war on drugs, we started to see that congress and various presidential administrations became enamors with the ided wif locking up migrants and doing what we've seen time and time again, locking them up for social problems.

>> the president and his policies have been unique in some ways. but talk to us i little bit about policies of president obama as a predicate or stage setting for what has happened under president trump. even though they're different presidents in many different ways. >> they're very different in character and demeanor and president trump would like to take credit for absolutely everything that's happening with regard to strong arm immigration law enforcement, but the reality is that's not true. president obama really took a heavy line when it came to being looking up migrants and to deporting migrants. and that set foundzatiation fort was acceptable. what was acceptable politically and on the ground in terms of congress's willingness to fund an enormous immigration system. it's true that president trump has thrown that into overdrive but it's not come out of the

nowhere. whenever president trump is not in office, whenever that is, it's tempting to imagine a radically different world but it's not going to happen simply because the person sitting in the west wing is different. >> so we have the leading question, but you're not preaching moral equivalence between barack obama's immigration policy's and donald trump's are you? >> not on the whole. there are important differences especially with regard to the asylum. administration's postured toord asylum seekers. but had it comes to immigration prisons, the reality is under president obama, i.c.e. locked up more people than ever before until president trump. so that's not at all to say they're morally equivalent, but one stems from the other. >> what about the child separation policy? you have a lot of trump supporters saying that barack obama had the same sort of child separation policy as donald trump, that he, too, locked dmi

children in cages. is that true? >> when president bush left the white house and president trump obama entered it, one of the first thing he did was shut down the family immigration prison in texas. a few years later he opened up two sflimilar facilities. obama's response of families coming to the united states was to lock up families. the trump administration has been to lock up some families and to separate other families. i think there is a difference there. but one is morally problematic and the other is too. >> the new book is my greating to migrating to prison. thank you so much. we'll be right back with much more "morning joe." be right ba more "morning joe." i don't keep track of regrets.

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so i have a very strong personal connection with our next guest. joining us now, the ceo of brilliant minds foundation and host of the brilliant minds podcast, natalya.

it's an initiative focused on bringing together traditional long term business families and major tech founders to debate the convergence of humanity and technology. this takes place in sweden because all the brilliant minds want to go to stock holm. joe, take it away. >> it's so fascinating, when i first heard you where aere movi this direction, i said that's nice. and a lot of this took off as my high school teammates of a got elected to congress they called me and go what? and so, you know, a couple of years later suddenly you have barack obama, the world's top tech leaders, gwyneth paltrow, so many just so many political and culturally significant people going to brilliant minds. talk about for people that don't know just how huge this is.

talk about the importance of brilliant minds and what the goal has been from day one. >> well, i think you and mika both know the abuse i took at christmas and thanksgiving dinners from the whole family. >> we do. >> what the heck is she doing? >> what is she up to. >> what is the resounding mind from your dad, mika. i think he got into it along the way. it all started when we moved to sweden, he your brother, my husband mark, was obama's u.s. ambassador toe sweden and to sw went there to be a couple. that was the mandate from secretary clinton at the time. and when you become an ambassadorian couple, you literally go to school learning everything from confidential cia things to how to use a fork and knife at the nobel prize dinner.

and we were sitting with the first ever ambassador global at large, and ways raising my hand, this 26-year-old nut case that wanted attention, i said what i can do to be active? i don't want to host tea parties in a big castle in swede pent she said calm down, natalya. >> simmer down. >> that's my problem. she goes you have the most amazing power there. you have the power to convene. the power to bring people together. use it well. and that kind of stayed with me for almost five years living there. and i would bring everybody, young people from the suburbs, political refugees from afghanistan, artists, famous u.s. artists with famous swedish artists, and especially tech founders. and what i learned being on the sidelines of the u.s. state department, i actually was the first ever spouse, this sounds

funny, the first spouse to have an official contract to work alongside the u.s. ambassador in two areas. innovation and tech and women's economic empowerment. so i had a mandate and the support of the embassy. but what i learned is government and politicians are not enough. i know it's sack contract lathe to say this on this show, but you need the business community and you especially need the tech community. they're the next generation. they're fearless. that fearless entrepreneurial spirit. if we could bring that into leadership and government, he will make a more inclusive and sustainable world. essentially that's our goal. how can we convene really interesting, creative people that are extremely different? >> right. >> you named it from a president obama to a cardi d. to a gwyneth paltrow. >> to gayle king. >> gayle had a blast. she was amazing. you guys are coming in june. >> absolutely. so, no, every where i turn

someone interesting and someone i really like is there. i mean, these yearly events that you have in stockholm it's belle beco -- become really -- it's on the map. even barack obama. that is one of the hardest bookings in the world and you did it. and there were constraints and you made it real. >> mika, i'll never forget the posts that you put on instagram saying what did you just do? so i grew up in a fishbowl. we were a young couple. our daughter was 2. but you know what i learned? i learned how to be able to lirn h learn to think outside box. there was no stricter box than the obama messaging machine. it really taught me a lot.

i think also on top of that, sweden is so progressive and ahead on the issues you and i love, especially gender equality. so we began to see this interesting movement of americans coming, whether it was ceos or founders coming to swede ebb to learn how do we move the dial on women? how do we move the dial on parental leave? so i think when president obama came for a historic visit to sweden, mark got him there, there's never been a u.s. president come to sweden. his whole visit because on values. women's equality, innovation, sustainability. and he said to a big press conference, we can learn a lot from sweden. it's an example. for a u.s. president do that is pretty unique to not only promote american values. so i think that was when i knew i was on to something. obviously the founder of spotify is the founder and supporter of this. i think he was having a similar

journey as a tech founder in the u.s. raising money in the silicon valley and getting these really interesting comments from people in the valley about like, wow, how do we create a flat organization? how do we demock contract ties the workplace and bring more women in? and we had obama come again and he brought his whole family and it was amazing. >> joe. >> so let's talk about you brought up sheryl sandberg, dani daniel economy, t daniel eck. the fou the founder of this organization. talk about the balancing act that we're going to have to do in the future and how an organization like brilliant minds can educate not only people there, but around the world. like, for instance, i'm sure

you're house is the same as mine, we're constantly month storing how much time our kids are on devices. and we understand that many tech leaders don't even let their children have devices in their own homes because they understand some of the dangers. what -- what will brilliant minds do? what should we all -- who should we look for to be a leader in this area? >> in the tech world? >> well, my daughter recently spent four consecutive hours on tick tock so i then know we have a problem. >> i watched it, yes. she's additional. >> she's engaging our husband. i think those two will go viral, stay tuned for that. but i think it's really interesting what you're saying here, and it's very much the reason that we really started this. and we knew we had something with brilliant minds because flipping it around, for a long time silicon valley and tech founders generally really drank the kool-aid.

they said, we don't need politicians, we're innovating the future, they'll follow us. that's not case anymore, guys. there has to be a marriage between politics, policymakers, traditional ceos, and the tech community. and i think we need safe, trusting spaces for that. the reason i think we've been successful with brilliant minds, people feel their safe there. they're safe to talk to people they wouldn't normally talk to. they're safe to bat around ideas. and we need that. people, especially in the u.s., lock themselves behind these huge offices and quarters. same thing is happening in washington. people don't talk to people outside of their sector. >> or have a real conversation. >> before we go, where zo you want to go with this? you've conquered sweden and you've got the world coming there every year. do you want to branch out? >> i want this to truly be a movement. i think we're get there.

i want it to be the most important platform in the world one day where people come to learn, to get new ideas, and to really make change. and think we're on the way. >> by the way, i learned in realtime do not underestimate this woman. thank you very much, it's great to share it all. >> thanks, joe. >> and we'll be right back with much more "morning joe." oe >> and we'll be right back with much more "morning joe."

2019 marked a number of notable anniversaries, but perhaps none more iconic than the 50th anniversary of putting a man on the moon. apollo 11 took off on july 16th, 1969 and four days later, much of the world watched neil armstrong take one giant leap for mankind. here's nbc news senior correspondent tom brokaw. >> throughout human history, the

moon has been a distant beckoning presence. in the mid-20th century it became a destination. >> you're go for landing. over. >> go for landing. >> and 50 years ago, mankind arrived. >> the eagle has landed. >> and if this is not a permanent, enduring event in human history, then nothing is. >> today a new moon is in the sky. >> but at the outset, space race was a product of the cold war. >> a 23 inch metal sphere placed in orbit by a russian rocket. >> in october, 1957, the shock of sputnik helped scare america into space. the first astronauts introduce the 18 months after sputnik became household names.

but it was a cosmonaut who became the first man in space. just three weeks later, alan sheppard's suborbital flight kept them in the running and john f kennedy raised the stakes. >> i live thbelieve that this c should commit itself to landing a man on the moon and returning him safely to earth. >> the race to the moon captured the country's imagination with what would later be called the right stuff. courage, optimism, bravado. >> godspeed. >> in 1962, john glenn became the first north korean orbit the earth. >> all three engines burning hot pushing the spaceship closer to space. >> glenn returned to earth a hero and remained a national

hero until his death. the early pictures of space were breathtaking. the first space walk by ed white of gemini 4 in 1965. but two years later, white and his crew members died in a flash fire on the launchpad. space program survived and soon reached another milestone, lunar orbit. john saw earth from&tierl differean entirely different perspective. the crew of apollo 8 red from genesis. >> in the beginning, god created the heaven and the earth. >> just seven months later, neil armstrong, the crew of apollo 11 set out to shoot the moon. >> liftoff. we have a liftoff. >> but then, john f. kennedy was gone and so was much of the

optimism of the early '60s. but at 10:56 eastern time, the night of july 20th, 1969, an estimated 600 million people, one sixth of the world's population watched as one of mankind's oldest dreams came true. >> it's one small step for man, one giant leap for mankind. >> it was an achievement for the ages. >> john looked at the mean one time and wondered what was in it his heart. they thought they could send men to walk on it if they could build the hardware. it ourns out they could and they did. 50 years from now when people think of the past they will look at the pictures from last night. >> over the next three years, five for apollo flights would reach the moon. an incredible success story despite the near tragedy of

appall low 13 the. last three missions even came with a car, the lunar recover. it was difficult, dangerous work, but the moon landings were so successful they seemed to be almost routine. but, of course, they were not. >> we're on our way, houston. >> on december 14th, 1972, appall low 17 left the moon and no one has been back since. >> it's been a good trip. >> the spirit of exploration did not end with-a apollo. >> challenger heading down range. >> liftoff at space shuttle columbia. >> the space station has been circle the earth for two decades and counting. and there's an unmanned space exploration, a grand tour of the so solar system, including a look

at mars. we have seen distant corners of the universe revealed from the hubble space telescope. we've even glimpsed a distant black hole. the space age still is unfolding. new adventures await, but nothing will ever compare to the sheer excitement and sense of wonder shared the world over when neil arm strostrong took t one small step. >> we go to the moon and do the other things, not because they are easy, but baecause they are hard. because that goal will serve to organize and mesh you're the best of our energy and skills. because that challenge is one yes are willing to accept and one we are willing to postpone and one we intend to win. >> our thanks to tom brokaw for that report. we'll be back in just a moment. that report. we'll be back in just a moment.

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[ loud squawking and siren blaring ] only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ welcome back to "morning joe." we are on tape this morning. the final day of 2019. and we hope you're enjoying the holiday. we start this hour with a look back at one of the most seminal moments of the year, which happened just two weeks ago wednesday, december 18th, for just the third time in u.s. history the house of representatives was poised to impeach the president of the united states. and the president's last stand came in the form of an angry six-page letter to the speaker of the house. heres a look at our coverage the morning of the historic vote. >> today for the third time in history, the house of representatives will impeach the president of the united states.

the democrats have laid out their case, the president abused his power, and obstructed congress by trying to strong arm a foreign nation into boosting his political prospects. and then covering it up. the president's defense, if there is one, involves a rot of yelling, a lot of tweeting, and a lot of republicans appearing to turn a blind eye to the constitutional principles they had held sack crow sarvegt for generations. this is the 1 six teeth congress impeechg donald john trump president of the united states for high crimes and misdemeanors, abuse of power, and obstruction of congress. the new york times, "the washington post," and the ap all report that democrats have the votes. meaning, by the end of the day, trump will make history as only the third u.s. president to be impeached. coming one day short of the 21st

anniversary of the house vote to impeach bill clinton. the house is scheduled to gavel in in just a few hours at 9:00 to adopt the rules which call for six hours of debates split evenly between parties before members vote on the two articles of impeachment. speaker nancy pelosi is urging members to join her on the floor this morning when the house convenes. the president claims he will not be watching the proceedings. >> not true. fact check, not true. >> he is schedule to hold a campaign rally in michigan this evening at the same time we expect the house will actually be voting on the articles of impeachment. and he wrote quite a doozy of a letter, willie. >> yeah. >> it was actually, we'll get to that in a moment if the was actually very long real donald trump tweet that just happened to be on presidential stationary. >> to nancy pelosi. >> but you know people have been saying there's no drama here. there was a lot of drama unfolding which i want to talk

to bob about in a second. but there was a lot of drama anne folding yesterday in looking at one democrat in a trump district after another democrat in a trump district zhag th deciding that they were going to do something that was politically hazardous to their future and that is go ahead and vote to impeach donald j. trump. we seen one after another after another decide they had no choice but do that. >> we saw senator slotkin she announced she would be voting yes in impeachment. she took some heat in that town hall. that's not an easy vote for her. mike did the same. abby spanberger did the same. these are people who did not come into congress talking about impeachment. these are not people who have been banging they're fists saying we've got to impeach the blanker, whatever some other members have said. they have decided that they will vote yes after looking at this

seriously. which means the president of the united states will be impeached. fact that it's inevitable makes it be no less historic. this is now 2019 when the united states president has been impeached and the president united states is standing up at one of his rallies, he may have just been impeached or in the process of being impeached while he's raling against the impeachment process on stage. >> i remember back in '99 bill clinton holding this rally in the rose guard women democrats. you can dress it up anyway you want to to quote sara mccain's vice president. >> pail zblin ylin. you can put lipstick on a pig, at the end of the day you're still an impeached president. and bob costa may be whistling

past the graveyard, but, man, this really spintings donald tr. >> that letter was drafted by him in coordination with some of his confidants. that was a letter from donald trump. you called it a tweet on paper. his associates described it to me as a trump rally on paper. a letter that essentially lays out his entire 2020 campaign, grievance politics, running against the establishment, running against the democratic party. yet, as much as he and his republican allies want to cast this entire inquiry as a partisan process, speaker pelosi is keeping her conference together member after member because of the way she continues to frame this as a solemn duty-filled decision. that's what's keeping people like congresswoman slatkin and others in line. >> mika you want to read the letter? >> the president's last stand before impeachment game in the form of this angry six-page letter.

i had a hard time reading it. it was all over the place. it was to speaker pelosi, if you can imagine, described by most as a rambling diatribe of rehashed tweets on presidential letterhead filled with lies, bad grammar and personal attacks. the president also claimed the impeachment is unconstitutional, illegal, and invalid. i says the house speaker has, quote, cheapened the importance of the very ugly word impeachment and that, quote, more due process was afforded to those accused in the salem witch trials. yesterday pelosi said she did not read the fuller. >> question stop there. fact check, is that true? we're going to throw you to the bottom of the ocean with rocks and say you're a witch. >> the salem witch trials, they were strung up. i never thought i would have the sentence donald trump and salem witches in the same breath.

but he clearly feels this enormous sense of grievance and the sense of drama and this is all about me. and the tone of that letter where it's so discordant with pelosi herself. the most offensive thing about the letter r you lied about praying for me. he's impugning her faith. >> that's just ridiculous. you lied about praying for me. >> you say you pay for me but you're lying about praying for me. >> her reaction is very fitting. if you could take a look at that letter, she said what -- she didn't read the whole thing, but what she heard about it was ridiculous and really sick. as for how the letter came to be, nbc news has learned that prur president trump came up with the idea last week and had it drafted by white house aides, including, wait for, it stephen

miller. we're told white house counsel's office was not involved in drafting but did offer some edits, some of which were accepted. >> they actually -- somebody actually edited that letter, david ignatius? >> it can't have a heavy hand? it's not -- like i wouldn't --. >> no, it didn't. >> it may be the most unpresidential document ever written. >> right? >> it is drab. i thought the thing that told you what's going on for donald trump is when he called impeachment a very ugly world. and he's wound. >> yeah, he is. personally. >> he gets it. he knows he's about to be impeached. and six pages flow, think the one thing that people have to think about today is how many people around the country would be as angry, you know, as full of venom and indignation at what's being done to donald

trump as he is himself? that's what we're living through the next couple of months? how many people agree with this rant? it's not a defense, it's a rant. but it was a document that told you that for donald trump this hurts. >> and -- >> real quick, one thing i keep thinking about as a reporter, you probably remember this back in 2015, then candidate trump gave me a list of his finances. it was his view of his own finances. at the top of that list billions of dollar was had name. the value of his name. and i recognized then that he put such an emdpa sphasis on hi brand. is he someone that licensed out his name and brand to be part of businesses and products. and now that brand, in history, will be associate and he can't stand it, his associates and friends tell me, with impeachment. he will be impeached if the vote unfolds as we expect in the house today. he will be an impeached president.

and this is a person whose entire business is on the name. >> it's a disgrace. >> the spaert thinkiparty is th use that asterisk to get all those people who are as furious as he is today to make sure they turn out in the polls. they see this as a fundraising and the numbers that have come up. but for him personally in terms of his historical legacy, it's devastating. it may ironically help him in november help him get re-elected. >> we know pro he projects a lo and what he's covering is for what these guys are describing, the fact that he knows a guy so worried about the impression of him that he joins a terrible club in american history that includes only andrew johnson and bill clinton as impeached presidents. ways driving in here last night from new york and you passed the washington monument and the lincoln memorial and there's the jefferson memorial. history receiver where you look in this town.

you can't turn around without seeing some piece of history. and when history looks back at donald trump among many other things, it will lead with the fact he was an impeached president. imagine waking up as donald trump and realizing that this morning. >> you talked about driving around washington add seeing the history. i remember commuting in from connecticut and going down the west side highway every morning. right before i got off on 57th, seven i think about seven veryfall tavery tall, beautiful condos facing the hudson. every one of them trump, trump, trump. trump. all one by one people have been so humiliated to be in a building with his name on it, they've demand the that the name get taken down. in chicago, the same thing. remember that trump tower when they were having the chicago sort of that faux chicago cancellation protest rally? the same thing.

they've had to tear his name off because his name is now so toxic. >> in chicago on the upper west side, i was in hershey, pennsylvania, last week, they're all wearing trump. >> yeah. >> western pennsylvania. >> in some areas it crops up. his behavior, though, including you the rally tonight, some argue this is why nancy pelosi wanted to keep it focus and quick. because he's going to turn up that victimhood and that anger as much as he can. because there are many other things they could have worked with here. they could have many more ash articles. >> but they're working with two and it seems to be fast and focused. there's been some concern is it too fast and not simple enough? but look at what he's doing. >> there are crimes on the table. >> there are crimes. >> that they decided -- >> and there are crimes off the table, one would argue. >> not to put in there. but, bob, when you're talking

about donald trump and his brand and how much it meant to him before, you know, you can talk to your colleague at the post, you can talk to so many others that have seen his earnings have gone down. high-end customers have left the trump properties. and impeachment just adds -- it's one more black mark attached to that name. and, yes, his base is going to be with him. but they've always been with him. they would be with him if he shot somebody on fifth avenue. those that the resistance will always be against him. it's those independents, of course, that matter. and those independents seem to have slowly been breaking towards peemimpeachment and rem. but that's really where the battle's going to be over the next year. there's going to be massive turnout operations for the bases, you but it's where those independents go, how they respond to impeachment that's going to matter so much and beyond.

>> and you say that over the next year that's going to be the likely scenario. at the same time when you talk to people who know president trump for the longest, they zwor wonder does this hen tire pattern of behavior last beyond 2020? does he become a president in exile? they see this political warfare that he's beginning to mouth with the letter, goes into 2020 as something that's going to dominate not only his life but the republican party next year and perhaps in years to come, that he can't give up the fight and that this is just the beginning. >> because with trump it's a fairly good rule of thumb with donald trump is in the end it's all about him. that there's this intense narcissism about him, which is why it also becomes so personal and the name, if you've built a whole business empire base dollars on your name and identity and persona, then to have that trashed, which is why i think this letter to pelosi is also so personal, he sees this as -- you know, that she's spiteful, that she's lying. it's about his battle with her as a person.

it's nothing to do with his behavior or the country. and it's why the central phrase in this impeachment do us a favor, though. the us is trump. it's not the country, it's trump. >> mika talked about the speed of this. adam schiff who will be our guest this morning was on this show sitting with us on september 17th. that's three months and one day ago talking about a mysterious whistle-blower complaint in the intelligence community. i didn't know what was in it yet, said he didn't have it yet. now here we are three months and one day after that moment and the house is ready to vote to impeach the president. >> i don't want to get in trouble here. >> uh-oh. >> i am drawing no comparisons whatsoever between pablo es cobr and donald trump. but speaking of great shows, narco, it's unbelievable. he tried to get in congress, they didn't let him in. even though got this legally

because he was a drug trafficker. and it just drove him crazy and he spent the rest of his life trying to get even with the establishment. it's a very touching moment where one of the hostages who was the daughter of a former president says to him, you could have done so much. you could have helped the poor whom you wanted to help. you could have built their houses. you could have fed them food. but you let the establishment get in your head and drive you crazy. now that's pablo. now let's talk about donald. donald's entire life, and i'm not the first person who's said this, can be explained by the fact that he's an outer burrows guy that always wanted to be respected, always wanted to be beloved in manhattan. they never would let him in the doors. they would never let him in their country clubs so he had to build his own. and nancy pelosi, more than

anyone, is in that club that he always wanted to be in as a democrat. through 2005, through 2006, through 2008 when he was giving money eight times to hillary clinton, when he was giving money to charlie randall, when he was giving non elliot spitzer, when he was gifg money to anthony weiner, when he was giving money to any democrat who would take his money, he wanted to be in the club. they never let him in the club. and in that letter yesterday, you see the intensity, the ferociousness of that anger and that rejection. and now nancy pelosi hands him the ultimate rejection. even as president, you will never ever be seen the way you want to be seen because you can't conduct yourself as a commander and chief should have some joe, that tone of the wounded applicant, they've wanted to take this away from me from the very beginning. they never gave me a chance.

it is the outer borough guy. the one thing i remember from narcos, which i agree is a great movie, is how hard it is to get people who kidnap your politics out and what courage it takes. that show, but so much of what we see around the world is people fighting year after year on something bad happens to their politics to put back together. and i think again what we're going to live through is the democrats educating the country about why this is important, why this is about the constitution, it's not so much about donald trump, it's about the constitution. >> again, that was our coverage from the morning of the house vote to impeach the president. still ahead, tom brokaw's look back at the fall of the berlin wall 30 years later. plus, joe's conversation with the legendary ringo star and how

things changed from abby road to today. we'll be right back. m abby roao today. we'll be right back. hey, well tell me about your experience when you switched to the hartford. - when i switched to the hartford, i'm sitting there, like, man, i should've turned 50 years ago. they saved me a bunch of money. you can't beat that. - what blows me away about the hartford is their lifetime renewability benefit. now this is their promise not to drop you, you know, even if you have an accident. - i know when i'm driving, i'm covered. - [announcer] drivers 50 and over can save hundreds of dollars when they switch to the aarp auto insurance program from the hartford. not an aarp member? the hartford can help you join in minutes. to get your free no-obligation quote and see how much you could save, call the hartford at the number on your screen. or go to the website on your screen. the buck's got your back.

another anniversary remarked this year was the fall of the berlin wall. nbc news senior correspondent tom brokaw was there that day and on the 30th anniversary last month, tom gave us this look back. >> it was a night when the world changed right before our eyes. >> good evening, live from the berlin wall on the most historic night in this wall's history. the. >> the berlin wall was such a fixed part of our lifers and it was a physically imposing barricade. it was so much uglier and oppressive than people realized on television. when you went to it personally it was apalg. and ronald reagan had gone there. >> mr. gorbachev, tear down this ball. >> john kennedy had gone there. >> so even with all the turmoil that was going on, it seemed

unlikely that that wall which was at once such a solid immachbliimage of oppression would come down in some fashion. and then in a heartbeat it did. >> i was the only journalist on the air the night the berlin wall came down. i owned that story and that was the end of the soviet empire. >> i'd like to tell you that i knew the wall was coming down. unfortunately i cannot. i didn't know. but it did come down on my watch and i will never forget it. >> east germany remains a punt in turmoil tonight. >> i had arrived in ber lane two days before the wall game down because theres was so much goi on in the east. >> you all represent the best of east germany. >> and then late that after plan to was that famous news conference in which the propaganda chief screwed up. >> he was handed a slip of paper at the very end and said the

bureau roy hhas decided that al citizens of the gr can leave the gr and come back to at any of the transpoints. and i looked at my german national cameraman and sound man and said did he say what we thought he said in they were astonished. and he said he did. that means you can go out of the wall and come back anywhere you want to. the room was abuzz. this man gets up and leaves the room. i had an interview arranged with him right after that news conference and i went up and i read it back to him. >> do i understand correctly citizens of the gdr can leave through any checkpoint that they choose for personal reasons? >> it is possible for them to go through the border. >> freedom to travel? >> yes, of course. >> and i went downstairs and some of my print colleagues were there and i said it's over. the wall is open. >> so we got out, i called the office in new york and this is

midday back in the states, we started making preparation for going on the air that night. i'm frantically trying to get this broadcast put together. i rushed out there, there were lots of students from the west who had come to the top of the wall. and the east german guards were trying to hose them off. and then my heart sank thinking, there's not going to be anybody there, i made this big deal about the wall coming down and they've been cleared off. then the people got back up on the wall and by the time we got to air at 6:30 it was a choscha >> nbc nightly news with tom brokaw, tonight from west berlin. >> we had a path on the satellite to get on the air. so that night i game on the air and we owned the story. no cbs, no abc, it was a worldwide exclusive. what you're watching live on

television is a historic moment, a moment that will live forever. you're seeing the destruction of the berlin wall. >> we just threw out the script. i had written this whole broadcast and i said to our producer, stay with me, i'm going to have to ad-lib everything here. i'm going to have to call on all my experience about what's been going on in the earn part stern not just germany but how this is the final moment. now people will be able to move through freely. i couldn't hear myself think. i kept thinking right before we went on the air i used the old ought nauts, cleaned it up up, don't strew this upcrew this up it's a big deal. as we were standing there someone said oh moore my g, my e take down the wall. there was a man with a hammer and chisel beginning to hammer at the wall. >> the wall as physically come down. that's a chunk of the berlin

wall. the party went on all night long as they chipped away at the wall, as they danced atop of it, as they drarvnk a lot. and i thought, this is the human story. this is the story of hume manned kind humankind. in the end, it's how people respond to captivity and how they get out of it and relate to one another. that's the enduring loss of everything that i've ever seen. >> it's a night to remember. >> our thanks to tom bro cow ca brokaw for that report. we have another monument historical event there are one from 50 years ago and a little streak called abby road. joe's sit-down with the legendary ring co-star is next. legendary ring co-star is next.

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the legendary ringo star is back with both a new album entitled what's my name and a new book entitled another day in the life featuring hundreds of photographs and images shot by ringo and pulled from the

beatles archives. >> the -- >> you must have been in heaven talking to him. >> i was. another day in the life has shots, some extraordinary shots from his time with the beatles. you know, ringo always you can go back to a hard day's night and you see him in that iconic scene going around taking photographs. there are also, it's very cool, there are a lot of shots of him shooting with his iphone. and he just talks about he's a guy that's been taking pictures for over 50 years, how remarkable the iphone camera is. you see a lot of montages here. but what an incredible book that is. another day in the life. a great book for any beetle fan. >> in one of joe's favorite interviews ever, he sat down with the legendary beat forl a wide-ranging discussion. he began the conversation discussing beetle mania and how his life instantly changed forever back in 1964. >> everything exploded. and especially in america.

>> oh, yeah. >> it was like you guys this super nova that exploded. >> yeah. >> and since then, you know, you can't walk across the street without people stopping to take your picture. i remember paul mccartney talking about it one time saying he made a decision he went to france, drove around, said i do really want to live this way the rest of my life? he said he remembered making a conscious decision saying it's worth it. is there ever a time where you said the price is too high? i wish i would have been -- in the early document pits triarie wanted to save money to you'd have a hair salon. >> i'm still being bam bombarded with that. you say several things. >> in your life and you pay for them. we didn't know it would be so big. the decision that we made was that we were bombarded day and

night. and very little space. john and i went in the holiday -- we all did holidays and we weren't that recognized then. so we could have a good time. the pressure did start to hit and if you look at ron howard's documentary on us, you can see us getting grayer, we're getting gray and we're like, it was like, it was getting harsh. we stopped touring. and we did some really good things in the studio. but the other thing we had to say or i had to say, i can't speak to them, is that i'm going to the movies. i'm going out. we're going to -- you know, whatever. and that's how it is. >> you do it? >> you just got to do it. >> you can't hide. you know, there's always -- all the stories about the white album. >> yeah. >> being so hard and times you left and all the fighting and that abby road was somehow this

wonderful, managical happy mome. but that had to be tough for you? >> there was discussions, meaningful discussions. the white album, my response was, well, i left the band. i didn't feel i was playing and everybody knows the story, i went over to john, knocked on his door. he was in the apartment i owned but with yokeco and i said, i feel i'm not really playing that great and you three are so close. he goes, i thought it was you three. zboi to pa so i go to paul, knock knock, because that's what i'm like. i'm not playing great and you three seem to close. i he said i thought it was you threw u three. i said i'm out. when we came in there was pictures. there was george with a bobby hat. but there's this really cool shot of a car full of fans. >> oh, yeah.

>> that's an awesome picture. do you remember where that was? >> yeah. it was when we landed in new york the first time. and i had my camera with me. and these kids had heard we were coming and they drove to the airport and then they just sort of followed our car. but anyway, they came right in line with us. you can see by the picture they're all looking at us. and i thought, i'm just -- i had the camera, i used to have the camera all the time then. i'm like that is so great, new york and the kids, you know. so they actually made it happen because they just came right alongside us, not just following, you know. >> by being a photographer you've got to see the moment, find the moment and take the picture. >> well, you've got to -- yeah. you've just got to take it. >> i actually had grow old with me. >> john's version. >> yeah, john's version, because it was such an incredible song.

i thought it was like jealous guy or imagine, and i always thought it was a shame that more people didn't hear that song. you've come back and -- >> yeah, by done it out of -- i never heard it. i knew nothing about it. >> really? >> really. so i'm hanging out and, you know, in this town and jack douglas who produced john's song. >> the producer, right. >> i bumped into him for several years but just the -- this year he said, well, did you ever get that cassette? i don't know what you're talking about. and john was doing the bermuda demos. >> which they released in the album after a couple -- >> he covered it. he finished all of those. he didn't finish grow old along with me. but anyway, at the beginning of this, he talks about me. he says, not about that song, just about whatever song was on there.

he says, that would be good for richard's story. that would be great for ringo. >> did he really say that? oh my god. >> he's been gone 39 years. i've got his voice talking my name. it's like so emotional. anyway, all of the others he'd done. this one, i had no idea about this one. i was like what? i was shocked. i had niever heard about it. >> you had never heard about grow old with me until this year. >> this year. >> oh my god. >> then as usual we went on the internet and we found john playing it in i believe of it was george martin put sfrintrinn top of it. that's the only version, some girl singing it. that's all we could find. >> that's amazing. because i think it's one of his best, that song. so when somebody told me a while back that you had redone the version, i said oh my god, thank gold.

so i can ask you, i would think you had to feel a burden doing that song, gone, man, i want to do this right for john? >> i did it the best i could. and so i thought, i'm going to do it. and, you know, i did the backing track and put the drums on and sang it, you know. the only base i want on this track is paul. it's the most incredible bass player, he's my friend. i didn't point out to john, sure, coming over. he's now part of my family, joe walsh, married barbara's cyst sorry you can never say no. >> got no choice, actually. >> i wanted him. and, you know, it just came together really good. and, you know, there's going to be some flak, but i didn't care. look, i love john, i love this track. i've done my best version of it. >> you talked about working with paul. one of my -- it's very weird.

i was a little too young for the beatles but i started listening to music in '71, '72 so i go introduced to you through the solo stuff. and then by '73, '74 i was like wait, they're in a group. so paul playing on this you said in the book he's been very generous. >> yeah, yeah. >> but reminded me of one of my favorite albums, rick go, tngo,t holds up all these years later, but also the first 45 half the people want know what that is, but the first 45 i bought was your 16. >> oh, wow. >> tell the story about paul and what people called the kazoo. >> oh, yeah. he just did with had his hand. >> that was his big contribution. >> but that was lowe we wehow wn

there were four of us. sounds, i actually played boxes with the drums. and, you know, we'd play -- if it was around or felt it was needed, that loose. so he went into the kazoo on the track. but that regard, you know, i was flashing back on that ringo album because the band are on it, dr. john's on it, everybody's on it. that's like the all-stars now or the last 30 years. i love that because i get to play with all these great players and they support me and we go on tour. >> let's just say you had a great time down in los angeles. coming up a little later, part two of joe's conversation with the legendary ringo starr on his new book and album and how a potential move to texas once almost kept the beat frls ever becoming a band. >> but the book, another day in the life, really something. up next, much more "morning joe." , really something. up next, much more "morning joe." so what are you working on?

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now for part two of joe's wide-ranging discussion with

ringo starr for the legendary musician's new album "what's my name" and great new book "another day in the live ". how they lured him back after he quit for the recording sessions for the white album but how his time away and how it inspired one of the group's songs. >> i was getting telegrams in those days come on back, we love you, blah, blah, blah. when i got back to abby road it was full of flowers that george had arranged. whole thing was flower madness, flower power. anyway, that was my moment then. which is on abby road. you know, we're inside -- peter's boats. so he land his boat, we took the kids, went out and we asked for something to eat. and the guy gave us octopus. octopus, we don't need -- we're

from liverpool, we don't eat octopus. >> right. >> anyway, i was talking to the captain, you know, just sailing away. and he said, octopus, man, we like fish. and now we're vegetarian. i was saying, you know what octopus is in the ash shone and they go round picking up all shiny stuff and putting it around their cave. and it just sounded beautiful. they were making this garden. so i would like to be because i was a bit deranged and real weird brain damage at the time. and how beautiful. so i'd like to be under the sea in an octopus's garden in the shade. and that's how that -- that's on the abby road album. >> one of the fascinating things i loved reading about was your process of recording at home.

and everybody, of course, when paul did it with his first solo album it was interesting, although it's revolutionary. you've actually turned that into a way of life. you say you don't -- you write that you don't want to go back in the old traditional stud yio you've got pro tools, your homes. talk how artistically that makes it so much easier for you and so much more enjoyable. >> it makes it more enjoyable because it's all -- if you look at the credits, they're all my friends. and there aren't a lot of -- i have a lot of friends, but there aren't a lot on the album. there's like eight musicians for the whole album. joe is on three. steve judas is on four. you know, dave stewart, or so that's how it works. and sob we' we're comfortable w each other. and i just don't like the big glass separation.

there's no separation in my studio, really. and the drums are in the bedroom. it's a little one-room guest house. the drums nrare in the bedroom anywhere else i've ever played them. >> how do you think it's impacted music that you can record on pro tools, you can distribute -- >> it's a natural move with the process of life, like the computer came out, and, you know, the computer is bigger than this room, to send guys to the moon. there's more power on this -- it's like mad. and it's just the way of it. and i think, also, we have to recognize that the kids, a while back, the garage band kids, they were doing it in the garage, not the bedroom. i've just moved to the guest house. so it was sort of like a natural move. but i do feel, and i was talking to somebody today about this, that that's my last album. ten tracks, album, that's it. last one! i want to go in and do like

three tracks. i think an ep is enough now. >> isn't it funny how it changed. it used to be, until you guys started putting out these extraordinary albums, the record institute was driven by singles. we're kind of getting back to that now, because of the way people listen. we're almost getting back to, an independent label can put out a single and maybe that makes more sense to do a song or four songs. >> that's what i'm thinking. >> two other songs i want to talk about really quickly before we get to the book. "what's my name?" don't you think, it's going to be an anthem. >> unbeknownst to me, this is why life keeps unfolding. i'm in the studio working and a friend comes over. and he says, did you ever hear the song collin wrote? he was there six years ago and he wrote this song, "what's my name." no idea. collin never mentioned it.

so i called collin. i said, i hear you've got a song, you know, "what's my name." bring it on up and let's have a look at it. and anyway, i believe the story goes that six years ago he puts the stuff away, he was searching for the words of this song. and anyway, in one drawer, he took everything out, and it was the last thing in the drawer. anyway, he brought it up and i just loved it, because i do that every night. you know, it's like part of the act. and it rocks. it just rocks. and it's fun. >> so the first song, "got to get up to get down." >> but we can't call it that. >> why's that? >> because we didn't know that, jim and i. we were out to dinner, it was just one of those dinners and somebody said, i like to say -- and i said, you've got to get up to get down. and it was like, yeah, we've got a stoong. i was going into my studio and

joe was coming over, that's the title. but there's been three songs out there called "you've got to get up to get down." >> oh, really. >> we didn't know. so universal said, can we call it, "you've got to get up." so that's what's it's going to be called. >> let's talk about the book. you didn't want to write a traditional memoir. people have been trying to shovel money at you to write a memoir. but they only want to hear from '62 to '70. i actually learned something, and i thought i knew everything about you and everything about the beatles until i read your book. i had no idea that but for bureaucratic paperwork in england, you would have split and left for texas and the beatles may have never been. why texas? >> my favorite blues player of all time, i don't know, i just feel lightning. so i'm sitting in liverpool and

i got into country, got into the blues, got into pop and i just loved lightning's style. so as you do at 19, you decide to emigrate. we were working in the factory. and we went to the consulate in liverpool and they gave us all of these forms and they gave us a list of factories we could apply to for jobs, because we were factory workers. so anyway, we filled in all the forms and they were lengthy. and we took them back and they said, okay, and they gave us more forms. and we were teenagers. and we just ripped them up. we could not fill anymore forms. >> too much work. >> yeah. that's how you react when you're a teenager. >> so another day in the life. talk about, what are you proudest of with the book? and what do you think people are going to get the most out of in getting the book?

>> what i'm proudest about, everything i do that's outside of playing is for our charity. it all goes to charity. and it's great to put my pictures in it. and i think they'll find, you know, it's like my painting, if i paint it, it's just a painting. that's how it is. i have to get over the attitude that, oh, it's not quite rembran rembrandt, because i love rembrandt. i have to say, no, it's just what you do. that's how i paint now. so it releases me from that fear. and i take photos of anything. you know, if you look at page whatever, there's just plugs in the wall, but they're faces to me. you know, i think it's flashbacks from timothy leery. and, you know, empty plates, i'm in a mood, whatever i left at dinner, i take photos of it. or then they're suddenly potato man with asparagus mouth.

and this is all on tour. and you know, i had this huge glass of organic veg before i go on stage and it's a lot of beet in it and i started painting and splashing with beet root. oh, this is great, take a few pictures, in the book. so it comes from anywhere. i think one of the fun ones for me is there's a spoon and it's got lights in it. and that was -- oh, look at the lights, yeah, i'm going to just show them. you know, you can do it. >> our thanks to ringo starr for spending some time with us. we'll be right back with much more "morning joe." l be right b more "morning joe.

good morning and happy new year's eve. we're on tape this morning, the final day of 2019. what a year. it has been another unrelenting fast-paced year of political news. the biggest story, probably being the impeachment of president trump. before the democrats settled on the two articles of impeachment, we saw two weeks of testimony from witnesses, most of whom described in various manners how president trump attempted to shake down a foreign power for dirt on a political opponent. one of those witnesses was ambassador to the european union, gordon sondland. he was already likely the most anticipated witness in the impeachment inquiry, but his

appearance became all the more anticipated when moments before he took the stand, we got his bombshell opening statement while we were on live tv. here is how our coverage played out. >> we just got, by the way -- ed, we just got the opening statement of ambassador sondland. and i go to page five of it, where he says, the suggestion that we were engaged in some irregular or rogue diplomacy is absolutely false. i now have identified certain state department e-mails and messages that provide contemporaneous support from my view. these e-mails show that the leadership of state, nsc, and the white house were all informed about the ukraine efforts from may 23rd, 2019, until the security aid was released on september 11th, 2019. i will quote from some of those messages with you shortly. any hope in the white house that ambassador sondland would go

quietly into that dark night are going to be unfulfilled today in this testimony. >> yeah. >> go ahead, ed. >> his memory has been refreshed, famously refreshed. i think he's also concentrated, his mind, the fact that roger stone was jailed last week on seven counts, one of which was lying to congress. his memory has been refreshed. he's being told -- he's heard the president say "i hardly know this gentlemen," so he's been cut loose by trump. he's been -- >> and ed, let me give you his response to that. first, secretary perry, ambassador volcker and i worked with mr. rudy giuliani on ukraine matters, and here's the line, at the express direction of the president of the united states. >> and if you read further, joe, he goes on to say in the next page, quote, mr. giuliani was expressing the desires of the

president of the united states. we knew that these investigations were important to the president. >> and above that, willie, as i -- mr. giuliani's requests were a quid pro quo for arranging a white house visit for president zelensky. those words, quid pro quo. mr. giuliani demanded, et cetera, et cetera, you go on to the next page, i was acting in good faith as presidential appointee, i followed the directions of the president. we worked with mr. giuliani, because the president directed us to do so. so you are now watching mr. sondland try to shift from saying, hey, i'm not going to be the fall guy here. you're trying to set me up as the fall guy. the fall guys here are rudy giuliani and president trump. >> by the way, he said, we did not want to work with mr. giuliani. >> and if you go down -- and ed, i'm not really good at predicting headlines, but i can predict tomorrow's headline. and this is mr. sondland's words, "we followed the president's orders."

>> ai yai yai. >> ed? >> he's been given no choice. and trump is now going to be under pressure to allow mike pompeo to testify. i think john bolton's testimony is going to come front and center. i do think that this impeachment inquiry today is the most important day yet. we know already from sondland's opening statement. but i do think the walls are closing in. this is not a predictable game. and sondland's been cut loose and he's behaving as any rationale person would do in the circumstance. he's not going to continue to commit perjury. that's what he's saying today. he will fess up to the orchestrative role that he was part of at the behest of president trump to get a quid pro quo. that's essentially what we're get getting bang to rights.

>> page 5, we learned that the white house also suspended security aid to ukraine. i was adamantly opposed to any suspension of aid, as the ukrainians needed those funds to fight against russian aggression. >> and he does address, just hopping ahead a little bit, the new information about the phone call at the restaurant in kyiv. and he says the following about that. "i spoke by phone with mr. trump. the call lasted five minutes. i remember i was at a restaurant in kyiv. i have no reason to doubt this conversation included the subject of investigations." he goes on to say, "other witnesses have recently shared their recollection of overhearing this call. for the most part, i have no reason to doubt their accounts," talking about david holmes, who said he overheard the president talking loudly through the home with ambassador sondland about investigations into joe biden and burisma. >> wow. >> so, ed, even the overheard

phone calls, it seems that sondland is going to confirm just about everything that we've heard so far over the past two weeks. >> and let's just remember. it was only a month ago in mid-october that he testified that he had heard nothing about any linkage between the suspension of aid to ukraine and the campaign that trump was demanding. he had heard nothing about that. one month later, he is now confirming everything. that's the speed with which this is changing. and it is quite remarkable. >> so page 14. i know that members of this committee have frequently framed these complicated issues in the form of a simple question. was there a quid pro quo? as i testified previously, with regard to the requested white house call and white house meeting, the answer is yes. >> and further on down on page 14 -- "within my state department e-mails, there is a july 19th email that i sent to secretary pompeo, secretary

perry, brian mccormack, perry's chief of staff, miss kenna, acting chief of staff and omb director mick mulvaney and mr. mulvaney's senior adviser, robert blair, a lot of senior officials. here's my exact quote from that email. i talked to zelensky just now. he is prepared to receive potus' call. he will turn over every stone. everyone was in the loop." >> mike pompeo was on the loop on page 18. the state department was fully supportive of our engagement in ukraine affairs, was aware that a commitment to investigations was among the issues that we were pursuing. on tuesday, september the 3rd, i sent secretary pompeo an email to express my appreciation for his joining a series of meetings in brussels following the warsaw trip. i wrote, mike, thanks for schlepping to europe. i think it's really important and the chemistry seems promising. really appreciate it.

pompeo replied, all good, you're doing great work. keep banging away. the state department leadership expressed total support for our efforts to engage a new ukrainian administration. which, of course, he now says, included with this quid pro quo. arms for political dirt. >> and back up to page 16, nonetheless, before the september 1st warsaw meeting, the ukrainians had become aware that the security funds had yet to be dispersed. in the absence of any credible explanation for the hold, i came to the conclusion that the aid, like the white house visit, was jeopardized. in preparation for the meeting, i asked secretary pompeo whether face-to-face conversations between trump with slens could help break the logjam, specifically. on thursday, august 22nd, i e-mailed secretary pompeo directly, copying secretary kenna, and i wrote, should we

block time in warsaw for a short pull aside for potus to meet zelensky. i would ask zelensky to look him in the eye and tell him that once ukraine's new justice votes are in ukraine that he should be able to move forward publicly on confidence with those issues of importance to potus and the u.s. hopefully that will break the logjam. and pompeo replied "yes." >> and quite early on, mr. sondland krereally declares war the white house and the state department when he indicates, i have had hundreds of meetings and calls with individuals, but i am not a note taker, nor am i a memo writer. never have been. my lawyers and i have made multiple requests to the state department and the white house about these materials. yet these materials were not provided to me. they have also refused to share these materials with this committee. these documents are not classified. and in fairness, should have been made available. >> let's go back to ed.

we just heard a ridiculous defense of the president. that he was too stupid to understand that what he was requesting of the lieutenant colonel. you could make a montage about a 20-minute montage of all of the idiotic defenses republicans have trotted out over the past -- all the strawmen they have set up over the past several weeks. over the past several months, actually. and in this testimony today, in this opening statement, you have ambassador sondland, a man who contributed $1 million to donald trump and is a trumpist from day one, you have ambassador sondland ripping every one of the republican strawmen to shreds. >> one can only imagine as devin nunes, jim jordan and others are speed reading this written testimony of testimony, what lines of attack they're preparing. they have, you know, retreated from one fallback position to another over the past few weeks.

right now, all they're left with is really to assassinate his character. and i have to say, in this case, with gordon sondland, it's going to be easier to do than with lieutenant colonel vindman, with bill taylor, with marie yovanovitch, because of sondland's providence. the fact that he basically paid for play to get this job with that $1 million donation. tomorrow, we have got a highly credible witness. fiona hill, a russia expert. she's going to be extremely hard to shake and i suspect her written testimony is going to be invaluable in filling in any blanks that gordon sondland might not yet have refreshed himself about. >> there was a question before, willie. and no members have had a seat yet. obviously, they are reading this as we are. >> what do they do now? i mean, what do they do now? >> this is incredible. >> this is going to be really interesting. >> they can't trash -- they can, of course, trash this man, but

this guy was in the tank for donald trump from day one, gave him $1 million. got awarded this ambassadorship. and sondland and giuliani went all over europe, and the republicans had ophoped, i'm su, that he was going to plead the fifth. but as claire told us earlier, not in the cards for ambassador sondland. i mean, i think he made a decision several weeks ago, he was not going to go the way of paul manafort and a roger stone. >> he is a trump loyalist, and he was running the entire operation. he was deputy tooiized by the w house to run the operation. let me read something that is as clear as day from the opening statement. sondland says, was there a quid pro quo? as i testified previously with regard to the requested white house call and white house meeting, the answer is yes. that's a quote from gordon sondland that you'll hear from his mouth in just a few minutes. he also looks, john, to separate himself from all of this.

he says, my personal view, which i shared repeatedly with others, was that the white house meeting and security assistance should have proceeded without preconditions of any kind. but he says, we were handed this rudy giuliani mess and we tried to make the best of it. >> i think it's possible, joe, that it's a little more recent than that. i think that, you know, when he first amended his testimony, he was still trying to admit what he had to admit, but not tell the full story. it's only subsequent to that the it's become clear that the forces around trump were trying to make him here of the scapegoat, of the two potential scapegoats, rudy giuliani and him, he was the potential target. giuliani has too much on trump. at this point, as we sit here now, when this scandal first started to break, one of the most remarkable things about it that we noted that things like john bolton, rudy giuliani, and mike pompeo were implicated from the very beginning. these are the most senior people in the united states government, other than the president himself and the vice president. the national security adviser,

the secretary of state, the president's personal lawyer were all in this, you could tell, from the very beginning of when the story broke. we are now back to those people again. as david ignatius suggested earlier in the program, as sondland now decides, as you put it, not going to go quietly into the good night, not going to be a patsy, not going to be the fall guy, is going to take everyone down with him and is putting the harsh spotlight on rudy giuliani, on mike pompeo, on donald trump. now as this investigation now moves into its next phase, the focus becomes, what will get john bolton on to capitol hill to testify? because john bolton is someone who has a lot of direct knowledge. what are the calculations that mike pompeo and rudy giuliani make about their own futures, their political futures, their legal liability? these are now, we're at very senior levels of the trump administration, of the united states government, and they are now, they have been kind of hovering in the background for the entire month and a half that the scandal has been in play.

they are now front and center on the stage. and we are going to see some incredible things happen over the next few weeks. >> and claire, today, we are going to see -- trumpists are going to see donald trump turn on yet another one of his own. peter baker's headline talking about the cannibalization of the -- it now extends. they are now going to try to destroy the reputation of trumpist sondland, ambassador sondland, who gave $1 million. and you do wonder, after today, is rudy giuliani next? >> well, and you know, sondland is a wealthy, successful guy. he got a good lawyer. and the other thing that happened between the time he amended his testimony and today is roger stone was convicted for lying to congress. this all came together for this guy to come clean and now the only thing the republicans are left with is what the guy did, what president trump did was terrible, but it's not impeachable. and of course, that's not what

trump wants to hear him say. >> all right, ambassador sondland has entered the room. he sat down. he will be sworn in and the proceedings will begin. this is expected to be, after reading his opening statements, pretty damning testimony in the impeachment probe. >> a remarkable day, and you go back to the personal, where i read his story about his wife telling the ambassador that he needed to protect himself, his family and his business. he had worked too hard to throw it all away for donald trump. and it is remarkable, the number of people who have thrown away their lives and are now sitting in prison, trying to show loyalty to a man who never shows the same loyalty in return. >> and you have to think of rudy giuliani as the one in the most acute legal jeopardy right now, who joked the other day that he had insurance in case trump cut

him loose. and inexorably, trump will cut rudy giuliani loose. and i wonder what that insurance is. i wonder it is that rudy giuliani can do to enrich this rapidly enriching story about ukrainegate. because he's going to know more than even sondland knows. he's been really the prime mover on behalf of president trump all along. and he's the one in most legal jeopardy of all of these characters right now. >> again, that was our live coverage leading into the testimony of gordon sondland before the how intelligence committee. just one month later, president trump was impeached. when we come back, another big story of 2019. the continued fallout from the administration separating children from their parents at the southern border. we're back in a moment. in a mot $12.99 all you can eat now with boneless wings.

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a recent department of

homeland security inspector general report says the dhs did not have the necessary tools in place to track how many immigrant children it separated from their families. the report found that the trump administration estimated it would separate 26,000 children if the zero tolerance policy of 2018 had been allowed to continue. furthermore, the agency knew it lacked the technology to track and reunite the children with their parents. after receiving backlash nationwide president trump signed an executive order ending the policy in june of 2018. the administration previously said an estimated 2,800 children were separated as a result of that zero tolerance policy, but the new report says that due to the lack of technology to track children, which ones had been separated maintain the agency had to revise that estimate to more than 3,000. the report also said officials at customs and border protection

forged ahead with the policy, even though they knew ahead of time that the agency lacked the proper technology to track and reunify children with their parents. politico reports the department of homeland security reports th cites a review of lawsuit records. joining us now, caesar garcia hernandez. congratulations on the book. an important time for this book. what is the obsession? you say americans somehow feel this in their guts? they want to lock up immigrants? >> immigration prison has grown in the beginning from the 1980s through today with bipartisan support. under president obama, was saw more people locked up than ever

before because of some violation of immigration law, until president trump. so i think this is something that stretches across the traditional political lines and we've only seen it get harsher. >> joe? >> you know, professor hernandez, what i've always found fascinating, since the beginning of donald trump's presidential campaign, is that if you -- if you put these policies up to the american people and ask if they support a border wall, if they support this separation policy, if they support donald trump's harsh immigration policies, oftentimes you find support in the mid-30s and opposition over 30%. there seems to be a pretty huge disconnect between what the president and politicians in washington are doing and what a majority of americans, white, brown, black, want their government to do when it comes to immigration.

>> i think migrants have been used as chip in the political calculation, that both political parties have been playing in washington for quite some time now, where one tries to outgun the other political party by showing just how strong they can be on enforcing immigration law, policing the border, through boots on the ground, through high-tech technology, through aerostat vehicles and balloons and prisons. and the sad reality is that while that's happening, there's a stalemate in d.c. and there are human lives that are being thrown behind barbed wire and steel doors. >> so you note in the book, that in 1954, president eisenhower shut down major immigration detention facilities, including ellis island. a few years later, the supreme court declared, quote, this was a -- there was a sign of, quote, an enlightened civilization. so how did we get from there to here where we see immigrants, migrants be in prison, both

under president obama, and now particularly, in a much more accelerated fashion under president trump? >> that history is an important one, because it reminds us that it's possible to do things in a way that's radically different than the way we do things today. but the turning point really started in the late 1970s and the early 1980s under president carter and then president reagan when we started seeing large groups of dark-skinned migrants coming to the united states from haiti and then from cuba. and in the midst of what was then the beginnings of the war on drugs, we started to see that congress and various presidential administrations became enamored with the idea of linking up migrants, linking them to this newfound concern of illicit drug activity, and doing what we've seen time and time again, pointing to prisons as the solution to social disruption and social problems. >> professor, you know, the attention right now is largely on president trump and he's the president.

his policies have been unique in some ways. but talk to us a little bit about the policies of president obama as a predicate or a stage setting for what has happened under president trump. even though they're very different presidents in most ways. >> certainly, they're very different in character and demeanor. and president trump would like to take credit for absolutely everything that is happening with regard to strong arm immigration law enforcement. but the reality is, that's not true. president obama really took a heavy line when it came to locking up migrants and to deporting migrants. and that set the foundation for what was acceptable. what was acceptable politically. and what was acceptable on the ground in terms of congress' willingness to fund an enormous immigration prison system. it's true that president trump has thrown that into overdrive. but it's not true that this came out of nowhere and moving forward, once president trump is no longer out of office,

wherever that is, it's tempting to image a radically different world, but it's not going to happen simply because the person who's sitting in the west wing is different. >> so, forgive the leading question, but you're not preaching a moral equivalence between barack obama's immigration policies and donald trump's, are you? >> no on the whole. i think there are some important differences especially with regard to the asylum, the administration's posture towards asylum seekers. but when it comes to immigration prisons, the reality is that under president obama, i.c.e. locked up more people than ever before, until president trump. so that's not at all to say that these are morally equivalent. but it is to say that one stems from the other. >> what about the child separation policy. you have a lot of trump supporters claiming that barack obama had this same sort of child separation policy as donald trump. that, he, too, lock children in cages. is that true

>> well president bush left the white house and president obama entered it, one of the first things that president obama did was to shut down a family immigration center in texas. the obama administration's response to families coming to the united states seeking refugee was to lock up families. the trump administration's has been to lock up some families and to separate other families. so i think there is certainly a difference there. but one is morally problematic and the other is, too. >> the new book is "migrating to priso prison: america's obsession with locking up immigrants." we'll be right back with much more "morning joe." s. we'll be right back with much more "morning joe. - why are drivers 50 and over

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so i have a very strong personal connection with our next guest. joining us now, the ceo of brilliant minds foundation and host of the brilliant minds podcast, natalia brzezinski. do you recognize the name? the foundation is an initiative focused on bringing together

traditional, long-term business families and major tech founders to debate the convergence of humanity and technology. and of course, joe, this takes place in sweden. because all the brilliant minds want to go to stockholm. we need to get it to america. we'll get to that. joe, take it away. >> it's so fascinating. when i first heard you were moving in this direction, i thought, oh, that's nice. and i sort of had the same rax as this took off as a lot of my high school football teammates after i got elected to congress. they called me and they said, what, you?! so, you know, a couple of years later, suddenly, you have barack obama, the world's top tech leaders, gwyneth paltrow, you have so many just, so many political and culturally significant people going to brilliant minds. talk about, for people that don't know, just how huge this

is. talk about the importance of brilliant minds and what the goal has been from day one? >> well, i think you and mika both know, the abuse i took at christmas and thanksgiving dinners from the whole family. >> yes, we did! >> what the heck is she doing, was the resounding line from chief, your dad, mika, but i think he got into it along the way. it all started when we moved to sweden, your brother, my husband, mark, was obama's u.s. ambassador to sweden. and we really went there to be a modern diplomatic couple. that was the mandate from president obama and secretary clinton at the time. and when you become an ambassadorial couple, you literally go to school, to learning confidential cia things but how to use a fork at a dinner. but one of the things that was a

lightbulb is when we were sitting with ambassador verveer and i was raising my hand and i was this typical 26-year-old nut case that wanted attention and energy. and i said, what can i do to be active? i really want to be active. i don't want to host tea parties in a big castle in sweden. and she said, calm down, calm down, natalia. >> simmer down. >> simmer down. that's my problem. she goes, you have the most amazing power there. you have the power to convene. the power to bring people together. use it well. and that kind of stayed with me for almost five years living there. and i would bring everybody, young people from the suburbs, political refugees from afghanistan, artists, famous u.s. artists with famous swedish artists. and especially tech founders. and what i learned being on the sidelines of the u.s. state department, i actually was the first-ever spouse -- this sounds

so funny -- the first spouse to have an official contract to work alongside the u.s. ambassador in two areas, innovation and tech and women's economic empowerment. so i had a mandate and the support of the embassy, but what i learned is government and politicians are not enough. i know it's sacrilege to say this on this show, but you need the business community and you especially need the tech community. they're the next generation. they're fearless. that fearless entrepreneurial spirit. if we could bring that into leadership and into government, we will make a more inclusive and sustainable world. and essentially, that's our goal. how can we convene really interesting, creative people that are extremely different. you named it, from a president obama to a cardi b. to a gwyneth paltrow to a politician. >> to gayle king! >> gayle had a blast. you guys are coming in june. i'm not dealing with your

excuses. >> everywhere i turn, someone interesting and someone i really like is there. i mean, these yearly events that you have in stockholm, it's become really -- it's on the map at this point. especially getting barack obama. i mean, that is one of the hardest bookings in the world, literally, and you did it. >> it took a few years. >> it took a few years to build. and there were constraints as an ambassador's wife. you had to learn along the way, but you were able to build something real. >> mika, i'll never forget the late-night texts i would get from you saying, what did you just post oninstagram!! you can't do that. we were a young couple. our daughter was 2. but it was amazing. because i learned how to be really creative and think outside the box in a really strict box. there was no stricter box than the obama messaging machine. and and it really taught me a lot.

and i think also on top of that, sweden is so progressive. it's so far ahead on the issues you and i love, especially gender equality. and so we began to see this interesting movement of americans coming, whether it was ceos like jeff immelt and muktar kent coming to sweden to learn, how do we move the dial on women, on parental leave? so i think when president obama came for an historic visit to sweden, mark got him there. there's never been a u.s. president come to sweden. his whole visit was on values. women's equality, innovation, sustainability. he said to a big press conference, we can learn a lot from sweden. it's an example. for a u.s. president to do that is pretty unique, to not only promote american values. and so i think that was when i knew i was on to something and obviously, the founder of spotify, daniel ek, is the founder and supporter of this. and i think he was having a similar journey as a tech

founder in the u.s., raising money in silicon valley, and getting these, you know, really interesting comments from people in the valley about like, wow, how do we create a more flat organization. how do we democratize the workplace. how do we bring more women in. that was a bit of the thesis and now it's become a movement. we had obama come again and he brought his whole family and it was amazing. >> joe? >> yeah, so, let's talk about, you brought. sheryl sandberg, daniel ek, of course, again, the founder of this fantastic organization. talk about technology's sort of creeping impact on our daily lives. talk about the balancing act that we're going to have to do in the future. and how an organization like brilliant minds can educate not only people there, but around the world. like, for instance, i'm sure your house is the same as mine.

we're constantly monitoring how much time our kids are on devices. and we understand that many tech leaders don't even let their children have devices in their own homes, because they understand some of the dangers. what will brilliant minds do. what should we all -- who should we look for to be a leader in this area. >> in the tech world? >> well, my daughter recently spent four consecutive hours on tiktok, so i then know we have a problem. >> she's adorable. >> she's engaging our husband. i think those two will go viral, so stay tuned. stay tuned for that. but joe, i think it's really interesting what you're saying here and it's very much the reason that we really started this and we knew we had something with brilliant minds, because flipping it around, for a long time, silicon valley and tech founders, generally, really drank the kool-aid.

they said, we don't need politicians. we're innovating the future. thal they'll follow us. that's not the case anymore, guys. there really has to be a marriage between politics, policy makers, traditional ceos, and the tech community. and i think we need safe, trusting spaces for that. the reason i think we've been successful with brilliant minds is people really feel they're safe there. they're safe to talk to people they wouldn't usually talk to. they're safe to bat around ideas, and we need that because everybody is really scared right now. you know, people, especially in the u.s., lock themselves behind these huge offices a corridors. the same thing is happening in congress. you have loads of teams. they don't talk. and they don't talk to people outside of their sector. >> or have a real conversation. so before we go, where do you want to go with this? you've conquered sweden and you have the whole world coming there every year. do you want to branch out? >> i want this to truly be a

movement. i think we're getting there. i want to be the most important platform in the world one day, where people come to learn, to get new ideas, and to really make change. and i think we're on the way! >> natalia brbrzezinski, by the way, i learned in realtime, do not underestimate this woman. thank you very much. we'll be right back with much more "morning joe." h. we'll be right back with much more "morning joe.

she's so beautiful. janie, come here. check this out.

let me see. she looks... kind of like me. yeah. that's because it's your grandma when she was your age. oh wow. that's...that's amazing. oh and she was on the debate team. yeah, that's probably why you're the debate queen. - mmhmm. - i'll take that. look at that smile. i have the same dimples as her. yeah. the same placements and everything. unbelievable.

the same placements and everything. some things are too important to do yourself. ♪ get customized security with 24/7 monitoring from xfinity home. awarded the best professionally installed system by cnet. simple. easy. awesome. call, click or visit a store today. 2019 marked a number of notable anniversaries, but perhaps none more iconic than the 50th anniversary of putting a man on the moon. apollo 11 took off on july 16th, 1969. and four days later, much of the world watched neil armstrong take one giant leap for mankind. here's nbc news senior correspondent, tom brokaw. >> throughout human history, the

moon has been a distant beckoning presence. in the mid-20th century, it became a destination. >> you are go for landing. over. >> go for landing. >> and 50 years ago, mankind arrived. >> tranquility base here. the eagle has landed. >> and if this is not a permanent, enduring event pneumonia history, then nothing is. >> today, a new moon is in the sky. >> reporter: but at the outset, the space race was a product of the cold war. >> a 23-inch metal sphere placed in orbit by a russian rocket. >> reporter: in october 1975, the shock of sputnik helped scare america into space. >> these men, the nation's project mercury astronauts. >> reporter: the first astronauts introduced 18 months after sputnik became household names. but it was a soviet cosmonaut,

yu yuri who became the first man in space. >> liftoff and the clock has started. >> just three weeks later, astronaut alan shepard's sub-orbital flight kept america in the running. and an emboldened president john f. kennedy raised the stakes. >> i believe that this nation should commit itself to achieving the goal before this decade is out of landing a man on the moon and returning him safely to the earth. >> reporter: the race to the moon captured the country's imagination, with what would later be called the right stuff. courage, optimism, bravado. >> god speed, john glenn. >> reporter: in 1962, john glenn became the first american to orbit the earth. >> all three big engines burning clean and hot, pushing the friendship 7 spacecraft ever faster towards space. >> glenn returned to earth a hero and remained a national figure until his death. the early pictures from space

were breathtaking. the first american spacewalk by ed white of gemini 4 in 1965. but just two years later, white and his fellowgemini 4. the space program survived and reached another milestone. lunar orbit. earth was seen from a different perspective and proclaimed it our spaceship. ki circling the moon, the crew read from genesis. >> just seven months later neil armstrong, mike collins set off to shoot the moon. by then, of course, john f. kennedy was gone and was so much of the optimism of the early

60s. but at 10:56 eastern time, an estimated 16 million people watched as one of mankind's oldest dreams came true. >> that is one small step for man, one giant leap for man kind. it was an achievement for the ages. >> john keats looked at the moon one time and wonder whad was in it that moved their heart. they thought they could send men to walk on it if they would build the hardware. 50 years or more when people think of the past they will look at the pictures from last night. >> five more flights would reach the moon, an incredible success story despite the near tragedy

of apollo 13. but they were now routine. >> we're on our way, houston. >> on december 14th, apollo 17 left the moon and no one has been back since. >> the spirit of exploration did not end with apollo. they flew other missions. >> the international space station has been circling for two decades. there has been a grand tour of the solar system in unmanned

systems. we have seen decent corners of the earth. we have even glimpsed a distance black hole. want space age is still unfolding. new adventures await, but nothing will ever compare to the sheer excitement and sense of wonder shared world over when neil armstrong took that one small step and mankind took a giant leap. >> we choose to go to the moon not because they are easy but because they are hard. that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills. that challenge is one that we are unwilling to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one we intend to win. we'll be back in just a moment. n we'll be back in just a moment

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. good morning, i'm jeff bennet in washington. it is tuesday, december 31sst ad we're looking at protests about ir iraqi to u.s. air strikes that killed dozens of fighters. the militia was responsible for killing a u.s. contractor in it's own attack on friday. jans nichols is traveling with the presint