it is #:is 4:00 in the east as americans are facing off to a global pandemic and a jarring new way of america. donald trump is increasingly at odd with his scientists and there are signs that a showdown is imminent as last night he is hinting that a loosening of the most severe restrictions on the movement are coming sooner than anyone in the science community has indicated. last night trump indicating that we cannot let the cure be worse than the problem and adding this, quote, at the end of the 15-day period, we will make a decision as to which way -- those comments are at odds with the overwhelming body of recommendations from the public health experts and the homeland security officials who advice a much-longer period of social distancing to slow the spread of the virus. the "times science" reporter donald mcneil after interviewing

dozens of experting warning that quote, americans must be persuaded to stay home and isolated and care for the infected outside of the home. and the travel restrictions should be extended and production of mass ventilator must be extended and the testing problems resolved. according to a brand-new report out just this afternoon in the washington post is that the top infectious disease director tony fauchi has cautioned donald trump specifically of loosening the restrictions too soon. from that brand-new report, fauchi and other leading public health experts have told the administration officials and other lawmakers that prematurely scaling back will hamper the efforts to contain the virus and devastate u.s. hospitals. fauchi who often appears next to trump is more frank in a set of interviews is over the weekend of how he is dealing with trump's inaccurate statements

about coronavirus. quote, i can't jump in front of to microphone and push him down, fauchi said, but the scientists interviewed by the new york times also questioned if the president should be involved at all. the times adding this that the microphone should not be at the white house so that briefings of historic importance do not dissolve into angry politically charged exchanges with the press corps. this is coming after the news of the coronavirus has taken a frightening turn, and with more cases revealed and life now at a standstill and every aspect of life impacted. now, near ly 455 deaths so far n the u.s. the governors and mayors are warning of a dire shortage of hospital beds and ventilators

and stressing that the health care system and critically affected areas is on the brink of being totally overwhelmed and the lawmakers on capitol hill are scrambling to pass relief measures as millions of americans are facing unemployment, and the small businesses are closing up shops as the entire state economies continue the shutdown across the country. the growing crisis is where we start today with some of our favorite reporters and friends. today we have jonathan le mere, and also, a professor from george washington university dr. lina nguyen, and jonathan swan who first reported about this clash. jonathan, i want to start with you. help the viewers to understand how we have fauchi speaking out how difficult it is to navigate donald trump at that podium. and you have got what sounds

like a little bit of eagerness to perhaps jump the gun on donald trump's part and try to move out of this phase of social distancing. >> so i have been hearing this from the white house officials from the last three or four days, five days and we published the story first thing this morning. trump is losing patience is the bottom line with the public health prescriptions that the economy needs to stay in an effective state of shutdown and that people need to stay home, and that businesses need to shutdown. and the perspective, and i have spoken to a number of people inside of the white house and outside of the white house who have spoken directly to the president about this, and the way he is thinking about it is that we could, you know, it is this tradeoff between frankly death count and whatever misery ensues from a shutdown economy. some of the aides believe that they, the economy can't survive another few weeks of this no matter what happens on capitol hill. so they are weighing the

political and the economic considerations, and some at the top level of the administration who are very frustrated about fauchi frankly, dr. fauchi. they don't want him to be monopolizing the decision-making process. so that is another kind of tension. i think that this is -- i actually don't think that there is a chance of a clash. i think that there is no chance that a clash doesn't happen. it is inevitable that when the 15-day period ends, the doctors, the public health experts recommend one course of continuing pretty strict social distancing and the president moving in another direction. it is actually -- i don't see another scenario happening based on my reporting right now. >> i wanted the bring you in, jonathan le mire and i take that as a bombshell from jonathan swan where there is no scenario of the clash of donald trump and the advisers and the health care

professionals that all americans are looking at. and the people who like the president may watch the coronavirus briefings to see his face and others to see what dr. fauchi had to say. he felt emboldened enough over the weekend to make comments that turned heads. he said in the interview what am i supposed to do is to jump in front and push him down when he is uttering falsehood, but take me inside to fauchi? >> you are right, he was candid from the interviews over the weekend in which he said that he did disagree with the president on a number of issue, and to this point, the president has not gotten too angry and fired him. we will see if that changes at some point, but where the reporting is lining up, and we have a story moving right now along the similar lines as jonathan, and not just donald trump, but more and more senior administration officials are leaning that way and completely out of step where the public health officials and dr. fauchi are, and the measures to shutdown the economy is too

harsh and inflicted too much pain, and as always, a eye on politic, and worry about endangering the president's re-election hopes, but injecting in the thought if it is a widespread pandemic, because of the president's decision to open up the economy too soon, some would think that has hurt his election chances as well. but that is not what they are thinking. they say that the danger is overhyped despite the images out of china and italy. they do not want people to get back to work, perhaps in the hot spots like california and new york and washington. and they will follow the leads of the state's governors, but in the states that are not affected yet will be allowed to have some reopening, and that is the current plan. and lastly, the president himself is deeply frustrated. that is what our reporting is showing and he has been calling up the advisers at all hours of the night complaining tbt ining

economy and trying to find a outlook that he likes. and so he is frustrated not to go after biden and define him early in the campaign like obama did to romney and biden could not play catchup, and of course, he is missing the rallies and the road. that is why despite a number of the senior aides saying this he should not be appearing at the briefing everyday, he insists that he will. >> dr. nguyen, i started with the political reporting, because it is important for the public to understand what the health care officials are having to contend with and not just a confounding new global pandemic and the coronavirus trying to understand who is at risk and how it spreads and how to shut it down, and how to sort of avoid the worst examples of the world over, but those officials and those like tony fauchi are having to navigate a president who in the reporting of two of the best on the beat, jonathan

and tony, and i don't know if there is ever an instance of the medical crisis having tona gate a president's personal impulses like the one we are witnessing right now. >> and i wish that the president is focused on the people. i mean, what i am looking at what is happening in the u.s. and i guess i see a different picture than the one that donald trump sees. because i am seeing more than 8,000 new cases of coronavirus in the u.s. since yesterday. i am seeing more than 500 people who have already died from coronavirus this pandemic, and i know what we are going to be seeing in the coming days and weeks which is that the numbers that we have now are going to be minuscule. they are going to be a drop in the bucket compared to what we are going to see this coming week, and in the coming weeks. i am seeing my fellow health care workers who don't have masks who are begging on social media for people to make gowns for them, and get the goggles for them from home depot and lowe's, and this is the

situation that we are facing on the ground and to hear that the president is thinking about re-election and his campaign and trying to prioritize these issues over the people's lives is just really, i don't have the word for it, but it is shocking and disappointing. i really hope that the president and other leaders can, if they can send a united and consistent message which is that we have a serious public health crisis on our hands that is about to turn into a catastrophe. we will have the blood of tens of thousands if not more americans on our hands unless we take this very seriously, and ramp up the production of all of the supplies that are true wartime mobilization to devote all of the efforts towards this public health effort and send a clear message to the american people that we need to be practicing social distancing. we need to be doing everything that we can, because it is actually not too late, but it will be too late if we walk back these measures and the price and

the consequences is going to be people's lives. >> just a stunning analysis, and just to let it sink in, i have a physical reaction to what i am sure is absolutely the brutal truth that any policymaker has to hear that if we don't do this right now, people will have blood on their hands. but for the people at home trying to figure out what they should and shouldn't do, can you walk us through that? a lot of us are juggling. i'm in a home studio and blessed to have a job that i can do from home, and my son is upstairs and he should be learning, but instead, he is playing with leg goes, and what should people be doing? >> that is right. i want to acknowledge that everyone is making significant sacrifice and some more than others and this is an extraordinary time, and we are asking people to live life differently, but there are things that we can do and in protecting ourselves and our families, we are also reducing

the spread of coronavirus in our communities. we are protecting our country, and three things. one is personal hygiene, and hand and face hygiene and wash your hands a lot, and we can't it is a enough, but wash your hands with soap and water and stop touching your face. and stop going out. restrict any gatherings. don't just because the schools are closed, it does not mean that you should go on play dates and have the kids over for birthday parties, and restrict yourself to the household yupt and do not go out. the third thing is to help others see the seriousness of the situation as well. because it is really going to take a concerted coronated effort and there are some people who are still believing this it is still a hoax, but please help to convince them that there are people dying in the country right now, and it is going to be so much worse unless we each do our part. >> so, jonathan swan, there have

to be people around donald trump who have articulated what dr. wen just so eloquently articulated and is he immune to it? does he not believe it? two weeks is enough of hand washing and -- explain to me the structural impediment of the assessment of what comes out at the briefings talking about george washington and i were rich and it is so hard to be me, and nobody thanks me for giving up the salary, and i mean, where is the disconnect? >> well, of course, there are people saying that to him, and the public health officials, dr. fauchi and others and again, i am not endorsing this line, but i am telling you what he is hearing. you have also got his economic advisers and other advisers that he is listening to on the outside giving him personal stories of the businesses going under and laying off the staff and on the brink and desperate, et cetera, et cetera. so he is hearing all of that as well. frankly, if you are going to

weight the two that he is hearing, more of the people that he is talking to in the morning in the residence on the phone or la late at night are the business people. donald trump is not a guy friends with a lot of the public health experts. he meets with them when they come into the formal meeting, but not late at night talking to the people at john hopkins, but the cable news hosts and old people from new york, and that is the stream of the information that he is getting. so that the world view, and that is the perspective. >> and you know, jonathan, there is something so stunning is about his feedback loop. it has always been what it is, but it is more jarring at a time when people are literally weighing, you know, whether they will have one more paycheck to make rent or move in with others, and they are making life and death decisions. >> it is terrible. >> and you know, the pain and the suffering is so much worse than what the president seems to be able to acknowledge through

any lenses other than not just the economy and the economic pain and struggles of people not even at the lower end of the spectrum, but i think that everyone is impacted, but it is only through his re-election, and is there no one -- and it seems that people like chris christie and others are taking to the editorial pages of the newspaper to talk to him, and any effort of an intervention or resignation that this is who he is? >> well, again, like i think that he is fully willing to spend as much as it takes on cash bailouts and all of the rest of it, but he is not a herbert hoover in the sense that he wants to save, be miserly in the crisis. he didn't care much about the debt before the crisis and he does not care about it now. he is willing to write big checks and do a big stimulus. again, it is really coming down to his economic and political advisers who are telling him and honestly, it is economic as much as political to telling him that the economy can't survive and people will be out of jobs versus the public health

advisers saying, please, mr. president, do not make the mistake of letting the people out too early and reopening things too early, because you could have a calamity of, you know, the proportions that we can't fathom on your hands. but there are the two scenarios, and so it is really sort of both sides to him are painted in very apocalyptic terms. so you have great depression imagery on one side and then mass death, plague, sort of early 20th century plague imagery on the other. and trump has been oscillating, but he is very much inclined towards reopening the economy. >> dr. wen, as much as everyone, i think hungers for the return to anything that resembles normal, and the instinct about that is the concern for fellow

citizens and at what point should we at a public health perspective contemplate a move such as that? >> well, i want people to think about what it would mean for their family. if somebody is ill in their family, and someone's spouse, and what that would mean or elderly parents who are not going to be alive as a result of this. it is not and by the way, it is not something that affects the most vulnerable, but we have a commitment to help the elderly and those most vulnerable, but it is something that could affect all of us. we are seeing the college students comatose and in the icu dependent on the ventilator to live. and young children affected as well. i am 38 weeks pregnant and other women who are in the position of now giving birth in a situation where there may be, ap we mnd w not be allowed a visitor with us as we are giving birth. so people are making very

challenging decisions, and at the end of the day, this is about our health, and i would want people to think about what is the price of health at the end of the day? what is the price of our lives? are we willing to do a little bit more based on public health in order to preserve life, and well-being of this country. >> you gave me a lump in my throat, because you are pregnant at an extraordinary time. i have a couple of friends pregnant, and any special advice for women who are pregnant in the third trimester, and you would not notice that obviously here, but can you give information for anyone watching that is pregnant or has a family member who is? >> well, the good news is that it does not appear that pregnant people are more susceptible to coronavirus or will have more severe effects of the coronavirus than those who are not pregnant, but there is a lot that we don't know, and we know

that pregnancy is a medically vulnerable state, so i would say stay at home, and take additional precautions and also see that it is a time when a lot of things are changing. and i think that as much as we try to plan, we also to have take things as they come, and understand, too, that this is a time of huge change and sacrifice or all of us, but we will get through this. we can get through this, but we have to follow the public health guidance and cooperate and collaborate together. >> dr. wen, please promise to come back and please promise to take good care of yourself. thank you for spending some time with us. the jonathans are staying put. as we await the white house briefing, last night's descended into an airing of the grievance from the president who used the 100-minute opportunity as i said before to compare himself to

george washington and compared to not being thanked for giving up his salary and foregoing saying that he would not take bailouts for his own hotels. and also studying the economy of the industries as thousands of countless individuals are reeling from the shutdowns. we will be joined by jim hynes of connecticut, a state with the most restrictive shelter-in-place on the books today. oks today. everything's stuck in the drawers! i'm sorry! oh, jeez. hi. kelly clarkson. try wayfair! oh, ok. it's going to help you, with all of... this! yeah, here you go. thank you! oh, i like that one! [ laugh ] that's a lot of storage! perfect. you're welcome! i love it. how did you do all this? wayfair! speaking of dinner, what're we eating, guys?

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george washington they say he was a rich man relatively

rich, and he ran the presidency and also ran his business. they say he had two desks. nobody complained until i came along. i got elected as a rich person, but nobody complained until i came along and so it cost me billions of dollars to be president, and i am so happy i did it. because who cares. i committed publicly that i would not take the $450,000 salary and it is a lot of money whether you are rich or not, and it is a lot of money. nobody cared. nobody said thank you, thank you very much. >> that was last night's coronavirus briefing. that was donald trump talking about how he is not profiting off of the presidency. so another memorable part of donald trump's performance yesterday. his reaction to the news that senator mitt romney whose wife is isolating or who is isolating and his wife suffers from ms after romney was in close proximity of senator rand paul who tested positive.

>> romney is in isolation? >> yes. >> gee, that is too bad. >> is that sarcasm there, sir? >> none whatsoever. >> and trump making it awfully difficult to put politics aside, but maybe there is more bipartisanship going on than meets the eye. joining us is connecticuthimes? >> well, rein fairfield county where my district is, and we are in the epicenter of the connecticut problems and we have almost all of the fatalities and well in excess of 100 people testing positive. so things are really tough here. but, you know, unlike the president as you showed in the clips, our governor is like a governor cuomo or governor baker or newsome showing us what true leadership looks like in a moment of crisis. and look, we have problems with

testing, and we are running way short of the personal protective equipment in the hospitals and the health care facilities, but we are trying to do the best we can. >> i don't want this to come off sounding harsh, but when people hear that republican senator rand paul submitted to a test and then swam in the pool that the gym was open, i know that you are not in the capital and back in the district tending to the needs of your constituents, but what about this capital that this republican senator didn't have much regard for the health of the people around him? >> well, it is not just this republican senator, right. the man is a doctor. i would tell you that, you know, like the president's little festival of self-pity, a medical doctor going for a swim and then to a lunch when we should be isolating doesn't really send the right message, particularly sense, you know, there is defenders of the president and

fans of the president who are still, and a few days behind the president in that they still believe it is all a hoax. so what people like rand paul and the president do really matters to the safety and security of the people in the country, so i have no idea what rand paul was thinking, but at this point, i hope that he is okay okay. >> i think that everybody hopes that he is okay. i think that not wishing anyone to be sick or to be exposed is a universal sentiment, but i wonder if that is made more difficult. you have two stunning interviews with anthony fauchi coming out over the weekend where he is basically acknowledges, what am i supposed to do jump in front of the microphone and push him down, so while he is giving out life-saving information, the president is downplaying the very same crisis that he is trying to communicate urgency around. what do we do around that? >> well, i mean, what do we do about that? well, the president of the

united states who was elected three years ago and people need to reflect on that fact, because again like him or dislike him that he would stand in a moment of crisis and call himself a wartime president, and that is the thing, now he is a wartime president. think back on the wartime presidents of the country george washington, abraham lincoln, and fdr and then dwight eisenhower and people who were absolutely selfless. absolutely selfless and all about the dignity and the generosity that we encapsulate and like to believe of ourselves as americans, and yet, the president of the united states is talking about himself. you watch anthony fauchi and deborah birx, they need to convey the life-saving information they have all while kowtowing to the president's ego. it is stunning to watch. and secretary azar and the vice president who need to start every sentence with the thanks to the stunning and outlandish leadership of the president, and it is like watching the south

korea or the old soviet union, and so, nicolle, this is not the moment to talk about november 2020, but the american people know what we can do about this. >> i want to ask you about one more topic in the news friday night, and the washington post broke a story that said while donald trump may not have seen this coming and we can debate it until the end of time, the intelligence community did, and they were providing the classified and i think that in closed door, but not classified briefings about coronavirus and the spread in china and that there is one intelligence official described it as a flashing red light. as someone who worked in white house on 9/11 and has a particularly chilling connotation for me, that is how dick clark described the warnings coming out of the intelligence community from bin laden and so in terms of what we knew and when we knew it, what is your sort of take and what did you know about the intelligence around coronavirus? >> yeah. yeah, it is a good question, nicolle, and certainly when we

get past this moment in time where this has to be about saving lives and that is why my fingers are crossed for, you know, a deal to be reached today for both the health care and the economic crisis that we are experiencing, there will come a time for accountability and for an after action report in which we will look at the stuff. nicolle, i can't get into as a member of the committee as to what i saw on the committee, but the public record is out there, right, and what we knew was happening in china, and yes, china stopped the information from coming, but the public record was stunning at the time. as you might imagine at the time, our intelligence community is as good as it gets and, so, yeah, they had more detail and information than the average person watching cable news or reading the newspaper had, but there is a time for us to do the after action report and really figure out how the u.s. response was so slow in the initial period. >> yeah, i mean, i think it is bob woodward who says that the truth emerges and having worked

in the post-9/11 white house, the intelligence community always gets information out about what they tried to warn about, and so you are right to say it is coming. i wanted to ask you about one more story that broke in "the new york times" right before i came on air and it is about the animosity being conveyed towards asian americans and what is your message to anyone who is feeling more afraid because of their ethnicity today? >> well, it is something that i have had to say for all three year of the trump administration which is that, you know, his bigotry and prejudice is probably coming around to you. obviously, the latinos and the immigrants have felt it from inauguration day onward and the president is going out of his way to despite the fact that the scripts don't describe it as the chinese virus to describe it that way. why does he do that? because he knows one response when he is back on the heels which is to atk t ttack and bla others and in this instance, it is the same as attacking the

latinos have had, and so people react to the bigoted language and we have seen cases of that as "the new york times" have reported. so what about can we do about that? we are better than that. better than that. and just because it is known as the spanish flu is not a good reason to decide we will call it the chinese virus this time around. so, again, you know, it is just, i'd like to believe that americans despite what they are seeing from the president of the united states can reach into their american souls and hearts and know that they are better than the behavior being conveyed by this supposedly wartime president on national television television. >> congressman, i know that you have a lot of things to deal with, but we are grateful to spend some time with you, and i hope that we can call on you again as this goes on. thank you. thank you, nicolle. after the break, time is absolutely of the essence. the clock is ticking, but congress today, well, they are still fighting over the particulars of a massive economic relief measure.

a report from capitol hill is next. is next. california phones offers free specialized phones... like cordless phones,

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millions of americans desperately waiting for congress to get its act together as the negotiations on a colossal stimulus bill seemed to have hit a stalemate. the lawmakers are finger pointing and no surprise, and it was torpedoed a bi-partisan

provision while republicans are claiming that it is containing too much and democrats say it is not enough. now nancy pelosi is saying they will introduce their own bill. and now joining us from capitol hill is correspondent garrett haa haake. tell me what it is like going on up there? >> well, it is a ghost town. it is a bizarre atmosphere up here. there are fewer reporters, and a fewer lawmakers and fewer staff. with one house in operation right now, the senate, you would expect to see a lot more people up here than you would on a weekday of a major major piece of legislation is worked on. that is not the case up here. it is an absolute feel that is going on here is unlike anything they have ever experienced covering capitol hill. and now, as to where we are in this all of this, the negotiations are continuing. and secretary mnuchin is going back and forth between schumer

and mcconnell's offices all day long and continuing to try to hammer out the bigger points in this which is coming back to the $500 billion fund to bailout or help to provide the loans to larger businesses that don't have enough transparency or oversight for democrats, and getting more money to the state and local governments and hospitals. those are the real issues here. then there is a whole bunch of chippy kind of nasty tone of debate around the other issues that both parties have tried to insert into this. republicans are accusing the democrats of holding up the process over the campaign grab bag items that don't necessarily fall into the real emergency bill, but it is the core $500 billion and the money for the local and the state governments and that is the main issues here. the small business provisions and the monies for individuals and people are not arguing over that, and that is what the fight is really about at this hour. >> uh-huh. so, you know, when the president was asked at last night's pandemic briefing about the

stalemate that really took place while he was briefing, he kind of shrugged and he had nothing to say. is the white house playing any role or vested in the outcome there? >> well, the legislative director of the white house, and steve mnuchin have been here a great deal deand this is how th senate prefers it. they are people who do a deal together on a daily basis and having the president firing off the tweets and getting involved in a microlevel in past has not been helpful in solving any issue from the shutdowns to other big legislative things that have gone on here in the last couple of years. so if you took a blind poll of the senators, they would be comfortable with the white house by and large staying on the sideline while they work this out. >> and that speaks for itself. i wanted to ask you a personal question, my friend, because any other reporter on our network who is on the show regularly, and you have whip sawed from the campaign trail to the mass shooting and the tragedy in el

paso back to the capitol hill for impeachment, and back to the campaign trail, and now on the coronavirus beat. what is this like for you? >> it is constantly strange, but it is really useful, because i think that i have probably a little bit perspective on what people in the rest of the country actually feel about what is going on here. i mean, washington is a bubble, and everybody knows that, and it is very easy to get caught in the situation where everyone that you talk to agrees with you or each other and they don't see it the same way. being out in the other parts of the country and hearing the real fear that people have and not just about this virus, but that the government might, you know, be shutting down their businesses and this genuine fear that people have at this moment is something that i would not necessarily pick up just being in washington. so it is a different perspective, and by the way, the lawmakers are hearing that, too. i have talked to a couple of the lawmakers from a healthy distance today, and they have told me that they are inundated from the calls from the people

in the community who don't know what to believe and when they are going back to work and if they are. there is genuine fear out there that i think that we have to capture in our reporting even on the back and forth of trying to figure out a legislative package here. >> and is it your sense, garrett, and this is my last question and my last attempt of putting you on the spot today. >> just today. >> and back at capitol hill, they understand what you have articulated that people are genuinely afraid and afraid if they have their parent living with them, and if they get the disease they won't bounce back in two weeks and if they own a small business, they have been shutdown. do you feel they get it up there? >> i think they are starting to. quite frankly, rand paul testing positive and amy klobuchar's husband getting very sick. and so this is not feeling real until our colleague passed away a couple of days ago made it

1,000% real to me, and having people that you know get sick and diagnosed and being scared about getting sick is going to be a lot more real for the lawmakers and the reality is a lot more real for all of u because that is what is coming. >> and the tweets paying tribute to him were among the most beautiful ones of anyone that we work with. so thank you, garrett haake, and i am glad to have you from anywhere and any beat that we send you on. stay safe. thank you, nicolle. and after the break, who do the american people believe is doing a good job handling the coronavirus, and it is not the president at least not universally, and not the congress. we will answer that next. not e congress we will answer that next. ancestry...gave us context.

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plus a powerful decongestant. so you can always say "yes" to putting your true colors on display. say "yes" to allegra-d. the pandemic is accelerating. that is the stark warning from the world health organization today as they are report more than 300,000 cases worldwide. that is due in part to the surge in the united states where one-third of americans are facing a drastic new way of life, at least for now. in new york city with the most cases of, new york state with the most cases of any state in the country, the images showing normally busy streets inerted a good news, because it means that americans are complying with the distance measures that are essential to combatting the virus. this afternoon, 12 states have imposed orders that all residents except for the

essential workers stay sequestered in their home for weeks or longer n. virginia, children will not be returning to school at all. according to the announcement this afternoon and the second state in the country to officially cut the school year short. joining our conversation chief public officer from moveon.org kareen wynter, and also jonathan la mere and jonathan swan. so what do you make, of what the president's real concern of that the economy could be damaged to an irreparable point, and the dire warnings from the public health officials that the social distancing is representing the last and best option for avoiding a real calamity? >> so here it is, nicolle. this is the worst case scenario that we have feared.

the reason that we are in this state in a country is because this president is not prepared. he knew for two months since january that this was coming and he decided not to do anything. and so, now, this thing is spreading and it is spreading very rapidly, and we have no masks, no ventilators and no tests to go rnd and what is happening now is that we are on the freight train that is going down the tracks and it is speeding down the tracks, and the reason why it is going so fast and it is going out of control is because of the lack of leadership that we have from the federal government and that we have from this president, and this reporting that donald trump wants to potentially, you know, lax off or really pushback this distancing, this social distancing, and that is incredibly dangerous. we have to be 100% clear here. if he does that, that is going to kill people. you just had dr. wen on who did

lay out perfectly and passionately why it is important to have the social distancing to, wash our hands, to do everything that we can to stay home, and to do this, it will kill people. people will die, and that not the solution. >> jonathan la mere, i wanted to understand from your reporting what the white house is prepared to articulate if the president -- i mean, all we have is what you and jonathan swan have talked about is this tweet which is often the white house's version of a trial balloon, and let's get to the end of the 15 days and see where we go from there, and do you have any reporting that suggests that there is actually they are laying the foundation for throwing open the doors of society at the end of the month? >> there have been some signs that they are going in that direction and it is obvious that the president's tweet in all caps and part of it, and this morning we had a retweet and a

number of users who are specifically saying that the economy is being crushed here, and the country needs to reopen in 15 days, and more than the vice president said yesterday that cdc is working on the guidelines for workers who have had the and recover to go back to work if wearing protective gear. details of that still being worked out. not a definitive plan, he said that was something on the horizon that they were working towards. we know the president is supposed to take the podium at the white house in about 40 minutes or so. i suspect he will be pressed dramatically on this issue by reporters in the room. the president as we have been reporting all day, jonathan swan as well, is so deeply frustrated at this, and he sees not just the economy potentially in shambles, but sees his re-election chances fading away the longer this continues, and it is setting up this clash with his health advisers, and also, it is going to put pressure on

the white house to show that they can unveil this safely. and again, according to health experts, 15 days is not nearly enough. yet we had a steady drum beat from the president and vice president about a 15 day guideline and not preparing americans yet that they might need to extend it further. i think we'll know more in a short time. >> jonathan swan, good a time as any to preview the fact that they have agreed to bridge the next hour, i will be staying with you into the president and coronavirus taskforce briefing that's set to commence in the next hour. there's a great piece by ben myth in "new york times" about fox news and some spasms, even within fox news, never mind that the president main lines disinformation that comes from some of those programs. what is sort of the state of the

symbiotic relationship between fox news and donald trump and are they expected to carry his water if he starts going against and defying? is there expectation from donald trump that they will go along with him if he starts to defy, down play public health officials after messy, public breakups with some of the anchors like trish regan? >> i think one of the analogies or descriptions that ben used in the piece was that it is not stalt tv, that would imply command and control. there's actually people have their own victims and whatever. i don't pretend to be a krim technological gist, understanding the workings of it. i will say there is a distinction between the news division, opinion division, and trump doesn't see someone like chris wallace as far from carrying his water. trump has been agitating against him, there are certain news posts that trump doesn't view in

that way, but of course he views sean hannity as an engineers tensi -- extension of the white house press. and they willingly embrace that role. that's not changed at all. and they take, sometimes they take queues from the president and sometimes to some extent he takes queues from them. >> unbelievable. as you started out saying, here we are, and i want to ask you, we have been on the air together when donald trump reached deep into the military justice system and pardoned individuals who would have been treated differently if the military had sort of kneaded out justice on their own. we watched donald trump rail against his own justice department as they investigated the russian attack on our election, we watched donald trump have a doctor out there, seemed silly at the time, talking about how the president's health is

unbelievable, at a time of the health crisis, i hope he is right about that. what do you make about how we got here slowly one lie at a time, one sort of hoax at a time, one active collusion between donald trump and fox news at a time, and here we are with people that are out in public, out on spring break because they don't believe people like anthony fauci or their own governor. >> you're right. we have been talking about this moment, this moment where there's going to be a crisis which we're in, and people are not going to believe donald trump, they're not going to trust him because he lies and throws misinformation, he gas lights americans, even with the press conference that you are about to go into and discuss. it is disturbing to watch. you have a president that tells misinformation, who lies constantly, who is doing a weird dear leader praise.

instead of stepping away, stepping out of this, not showing up at the press conference, letting the experts and let the public health scientists and people who know exactly what's going on speak, he has to get in front of the camera. why? because he cares more about his political health than he does about the public health. and this is the president that we have. we have someone who is making short term decisions that leads to his political success, that leads to what he believes he needs to do to win re-election. it is not about us, it is not about how the country is doing health wise, it is about himself, and this is why we are in the position we are today. >> and there's an incredible body of reporting from axios, from ap, from "the washington post" that supports this, that the pandemic and his approach to it isn't about us at all. and i think it was one of the jonathans that said at the top of the hour that he's agitating

to get back on the campaign trail, that without the maga rallies, he's sort of lost, and that explains what tends to sound like open mike night at the briefings than any sort of health information being dispensed from the white house briefing room. i want to ask one of our reporters quickly, at least that room is in use again, jonathan swan? >> it is good to see. i think trump right now, i really do, it was lemire who made the point, not me, i'm not taking credit for it, but i agree with him. i think he sees this as free earned media. he gets to go up there, joe biden is not getting any oxygen right now, trump can get out there and just sell, and just sell with the cameras on him. almost reminiscent of 2015, early 2016 when they carried his remarks live. >> all right. go ahead.

>> very briefly, yes, the president told people that he misses the rally so much, he won't give up these briefings because he knows he can block out the sun, people around him are glad that joe biden has the spotlight. a member of the press corp is expected to have coronavirus, there will be additional spacing in the briefing room even today. something day to day is effecting all of us, even those of us trying to do our jobs in the white house. >> i got chills for about the eighth time this hour. i hope whoever it is is well, getting rest. you guys are all so kind to spend time with us, so kind you agreed to stay into the other other. wonderful to see your face and hear your voice. jonathan lemire, jonathan swan, staying with us. back for another hour, including live briefing from the white house after this quick break. g e house after this quick break wits really haunted me. thankfully, i got quickbooks,

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