hi, everyone. it a 4es:00 in the east. how on earth donald trump supposed to know in january of this year that a deadly pandemic that threatened thousands of americans and the world's economy was heading straight to the country he leads. i mean, other than types of experts that trump often ignores, no one in his inner circle told him that the coronavirus was about to tear through the u.s. -- or did they? new reporting in "the new york times" reveals that a very senior white house official who has the president's ear and seems to see the world almost as exactly the same way donald trump did did warn dx. "the new york times" writes this, quote, memo the warning, written in a memo by peter navarro, president trump's tr e

traded a viedzer is the highest level alert known to have circulated inside the west wing as the administration was taking its first substantive steps to confront a crisis that had already consumed china's leaders and would go on to upend life in europe and the united states. 70 days of coronavirus failures from the president and his administration that memo included warnings that in, quote, worst case scenario a half a million people could die and the president for his part, after january 29th will go on to say that coronavirus cases in the u.s. would go from 15 to zero. and that one day, it would disappear like a miracle. the truth sadly is far, far away from those fraudulent predictions from donald trump. today, 386,000 confirmed cases in the u.s. and 12,000 deaths. in the virus epicenter, new york, more than 138,000 cases.

new york again seeing the highest single-day increase in deaths despite a glimmer of hope that hospitalizations might be starting to level off and there's ongoing concern today about the lack of testing and the confusion that the president continues to sow about drug therapies as well as trump's increasingly disdain of any oversight. trump today moving to remove the watchdog who would be responsible overseeing $2.2 trillion in coronavirus aid and another watchdog who's raising alarms about shortages of ppe and other equipment in hospitals. . the most chilling headline of the day when it comes to the impact that coronavirus has on our day-to-day lives is a warning from dr. tony fauci that we may never get back to normal. >> if back to normal acting like there never was a coronavirus problem, i don't think that's

going to happen until we do have a situation where you can completely protect the population but when we say getting back to normal we mean something very different than what we're going through right now. because right now we're in a very intense mitigation. when we go back to normal, we'll go back to the point where we can function as a society. but you're absolutely right, if you want to get to pre-coronavirus, that might not ever happen in the sense of the fact that the threat is there. >> the early warnings from the president from an ideological soul mate in the west wing fa fading to normal is where we start today. dr. peter hodgson. and john lemier, i want to ask you about this report. for people who don't know who peter navarro, he's an ideological soul mate for donald

trump. this wasn't the kind of red flag raised in late january from the kinds of people that we know that donald trump ignores, senior intelligence officials, senior state department officials, senior experts, this is someone who as trumpy as it gets who wrote two memos warning donald trump that up to half a million people could die. what's the reaction from the white house of this being made public? >> nicolle, peter navarro is a china hawk, he's tough on trade. he aligns with the president on most economic issues. he's lost some battles to steve mnuchin but he's someone who the president largely sees eye to eye with on trade and economics and how those things influence foreign policy. the revelation of these memos is kind of stunning. it's a warning from a very different place. it's not the intelligence

agencies that the president seems rather, you know, doesn't have an issue ignoring their warnings from time to time. from russian election interference to other matters. it's not some of the health experts with whom he has broken with publicly and privately since this pandemic began. this is someone who he usually listens to. the memos released, navarro came under scrutiny the last few days because he fought with dr. fauci about this anti-malaria drug. it was clear that this pandemic, largely still contained to china and asia was on the minds of the president's inner circle yet the warning signals were ignored. that this president and the inner sickcircle of this white e

ignored. >> you gave me two things that i want to unpack with you, the motive for this getting out. i don't like to talk about how things become public. you all dig very hard for them, jonathan, and this is more great journalism during this time. but let's sort of show our work to viewers. peter navarro is on the side of the right-wing media pundits, sean hannity and donald trump in pushing a drug that anthony fauci describes as something exactly like this. it's too early, there's not enough testing, much more information need to be known. it was reported over the weekend that peter navarro raised his voice in a most heated confrontation. the day it was in "the new york times," the day after it looked like he was one of the smart ones, talk about self-serving

the people around donald trump are even as americans are dying. >> right, without getting into particular sources on this particular story, what this is a reflection of is how it's often been within the president's west wing, it's been rid within rivalries, act in self-interest, they put their own self-agendas, by doing so in the media. right now we have this great divide about the potential of this combination of ma lar yal drugs that may or may not be proven effective to treat the coronavirus. the president is all-in on it. even though he admits from the podium he's not a doctor he's putting for their use. navarro is doing so. lot of the right-wing media, from mark levin, to donald trump jr. are pushing for it as well.

dr. fauci and others are saying it's possible that it will be proven right but we simply don't know and is urging caution, there's not enough science or data or time to know whether or not this is going to work. and that erupted in a weekend meeting at the white house, the fight between the two, and suddenly as you pointed out, navarro, these memos emerge that make him look like he was preaching caution and concern about this growing pandemic but it goes to show that in terms of this president he can go back and forth depending where he is he was very close, nicolle, very close to ordering that the nation be reopened on easter even though just now with easter a few days away, new york city and other places are growing through the worst. at the moment he's leaning towards the doctors but towards the others to push forward this

medicine thinking it can accelerate a return to normalcy and help his re-election chances i don't know mr. thnavarro, we don't know if donald trump read these two memos after they circulated inside west wing. this is what he said. >> we think we have it very well under control. very little problem in this country. five. we pretty much shut it down coming in from china. >> the virus -- lot of people think it goes away in april with the heat. >> you have a very small number of people in the country right now with it, around 12, many of them are getting better, some of them are fully recovered. we're finding very little problem. now you treat this like a flu. when you have 15 people and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down close to zero.

it's going to be disappear. one day it's like a miracle it will be disappear. now the democrats are politicizing the coronavirus and this is their new hoax. jonathan, it speaks for itself. but the idea that donald trump didn't know what he was possibly dealing with, what this country was about to face coming from the intelligence community, coming from anthony fauci, i'm sure it was coming from secretary azar now we know it was coming from trumpiest of west wing advisers, peter th navar navarro, what does the white house say about that tape that will live forever. >> one that's going to be played in campaign ads as we head toward november. you heard from the president himself and the top aides a sense of denial and an attempt to rewrite history, suggesting that the president was on top of it. they point to the suspension of

the flights from china. a useful step but not nearly enough. it wasn't accompanied by other efforts, other measures that we have seen other countries take in order to slow the spread most notably the widespread testing. the nations that have turned the corner on battling this pandemic, blanketed their citizens with testing and that's even now a month or more into this crisis isn't happening in the united states. this is president who's in denial about this. he had, you know, it seems like a lifetime ago but just a month or two back he -- the white house was feeling and his re-election team feeling really good about where they were. beaten back impeachment. the economy was doing good. the democratic field was a mess. the president with a huge campaign war chest was excited to use this spring to attack his opponent bernie sanders and now most likely joe biden and use this time to pummel the

democrats and to set the tone for the campaign ahead. he couldn't come to grips with the idea and that the number one argument for his re-election, strong economy was about to vanish because of the growing threat of this virus. >> doctor, i'll let you steer clear of the politics. but many terms of arguments for one's re-election i can't imagine that the sad headlines coming out of new york state and really from coast to coast every day about the numbers of deaths and that body of public sentiment we still don't have testing and we still don't have protective equipment for our doctors and nurses and we still don't have in the governor's view adequate ventilators, where do you see the state of our resources or our ability to fight what's about to come in the pandemic. >> we'll have at some point in the future, have to deep dive in

what went wrong in our national response, why testing was so delayed, why we didn't have adequate preparation for the big surge, intensive care units, we'll have time to do that. right now, though, i'm very concerned over the next couple of weeks, because most of the models indicate that this is going to be the real crunch time, the next two weeks, when we'll really see that steady increase, some estimates are saying within a week to two weeks, 3,000 americans will die every day from covid-19 at least for a while, which means covid-19 will be the single leading cause of death in the united states. lot of it in individuals as we heard from the previous -- when you had the mayor from chicago, the fact remains covid-19 will

be the leading cause of death in the united states at least for a while. then figuring out, as the numbers go down as we move into the month of may, what the world looks like, or what the united states looks like over the next two years because although it will go down it won't disappear entirely and there will be a new more mall when covid-19 will come back, will wax and wane over the next two years and charting a path forward for the country in terms of how you manage public health and how we manage the economy, this is where it's going to be really important to have extraordinary leadership to guide us through this period. >> you picked up on something that really struck me from dr. fauci, there's no going back to the old normal, there's no pre-coronavirus normal. that's gone. can you talk a little bit more about what the post-peak normal

might look like, countries that have gotten back on their feet, like south korea have instigated -- have repeat testing for their citizenry, they have fever clinics, quarantine centers, those aren't even part of our national discourse. >> we can look to history to get a sense and i like to go back to the 1918 flu pandemic, the spanish flu, we call it 1918 but when in fact when woodrow wilson got sick in the middle of 1919 and the actual pandemic didn't finally go away until the end of 1920 it was a three-year pandemic and this may be the same kind of thing going where it will go down and then you'll start to see a peak again maybe later in the fall or around this time next year and possibly the

year after that. you know, i think, many americans have this decollusion that we hunker down for a while, a vaccine appears, everybody gets vaccinated it's not going to work that way. we hear about a year to 18 months from dr. fauci, that would be a record. the current record for developing a vaccine from start to licenseure in the united states is three to four years. we have to start thinking about. certainly new technologies will roll out but we're going to need a very carefully orchestrated system in place to advise employers, to advise state and local governments how this work and to keep a watch of when the virus comes back and will have the governors have an appetite

for. we now need the best minds in the country to chart a path and the reason i say the national academies because they're considered an independent organization that has the ability to advise congress and the white house and this is very important because, remember, it's an election year, so anything that comes either from the white house or from the opposition party the democrats is going to be viewed with suspicion. we need to have an independent set of experts helping us through this difficult time. >> dr. peter hotez, thank you so much for spending some time with us. when we come back as we reported at the top of the last hour -- another inspector general is moved off the job, this time the person was overseeing the 2.2 d$2.2 trilli coronavirus deal.

plus, chaos in wisconsin after a last-minute legal battle. long lines to vote. as health concerns mount. and the acting navy secretary has resigned this hour under pressure, after a serious concern about spreading coronavirus. all those stories coming up. ies. for many of our members, being prepared... won't be a new thing. and it won't be their first experience with social distancing. overcoming challenges is what defines the military community. usaa has been standing with them, for nearly a hundred years. and we'll be here to serve for a hundred more. you should be mad your neighbor always wants to hang out.

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the president this afternoon effectively ousting the leader of panel of watchdogs tasked with overseeing how the white house will implement the $2.2 trillion coronavirus relief bill. glenn fine chairman of the panel had been serving as acting inspector general for the defense department since before trump took office. however, donald trump announced the inspector general for the

environmental protection agency would now serve as acting pentagon watchdog which in doing so rid fine of his position. another inspector general out. this one replaced of trump's choosing. the latest step in an abruptly unfolding white house power play over semi-independent inspectors general across the government, end quote. frank, this is something that doesn't surprise any of us who have watched donald trump rail against the rule of law, attack anyone investigating russian interference, collusion with his campaign, but it's still a shock to the system, a system that's not equipped for someone willing to corrupt every aspect and element of the federal government. >> right, you hit right on the head. we still find it shocking.

here we have a president who's exploiting a national crisis to move forward his own agenda, his own revenge, his own profit and it's the very concept of what an inspector general stands for, nicolle, it's opposed to everything that this president stands for. i.g. stand for unvarnished truth, reporting the facts, crunching the numbers, the rule of law and compliance. that's what they do for a living and it just rubs trump the wrong way that someone is going to get the truth out. the next person on the chopping block is that hhs inspector general who's reporting that over 300 interviews with hospital administrators have resulted in her finding that the supplies still are in inaid kuwait, he doesn't want to hear the truth. not only do we have to fight this virus to save this lives,

we have to fight it we got to save this democracy. this president is exploiting a virus to dismantle the rule of law and the constitution. >> yeah. and that's not us saying that. that's the evidence donald trump has put into exhibit a. firing the inspector general for the intelligence community friday night. exhibit b, removing the pentagon inspector general. exhibit c you just talked about, now a twitter feud -- not a feud, donald trump is the only one doing the attacking against the inspector general at the hhs, he woke up in year three and there are these people in inspector general, new people in his line of fire for retribution. >> he sees the truth as an adversary, those who represent the truth and advocate for rule of law and compliance are simply not compatible with his

administration, he found a way to start doing it. predict. i hope i'm wrong. we might even see pardons come next as the death toll mounts and a national healthcare crisis we'll see him slip in -- slip in anything that advances his agenda and if he thinks the american people are not going to remember this, if he thinks that the military sailors on that ship aren't going to forget their captain was removed for helping them, their healthcare workers don't have ppe, if he thinks people are going to forget endanger their lives to go vote in a primary in wisconsin, right, death or democracy, he's sadly mistaken and i think this is going to be a strategic error on his part. >> frank, you're the second person in two days to raise the

"p" word, pardons. do you really think -- i mean, i guess it's only on us if we fail to imagine what he might do with a crisis, do you think that's something we should be braced for? >> well, i think we should brace for the worst. i hate to draw the analogy for bracing this week for the deadliest time in american history but sadly we should be bracing for the person in the white house to exploit this time. you know back in my fbi days, nicolle, some of the most heinous criminals i saw were the ones who exploited crises, 9/11, hurricane katrina for their own benefit. i thought -- i thought that was the most despicable thing that i have seen and i see the president's conduct akin to that kind of inhumane exploitation of a crisis. >> jonathan, jump in on this threat and grab that third rail,

the coverage of this president is a story unto itself and you walk right into the firing squad with questions of this president and helsinski that impacted the rest of his presidency i'm not signaling any individual out, how do you cover a president who in the midst of a crisis firing inspectors general, touting his ratings, displaying any kind of empathy grieving the extraordinary and historic and unprecedented loss of life on his watch. >> e i believe frank just used the phrase that the president abuses the truth, the truth is an adversary. i think what we're seeing is more days than not that's the case, from the white house, from the oval office and these days

from the briefing room, people around the president have said to me and i have said it on this show before he doesn't try to justin a news cycle, to win that day's news, he tries to win a news moment, he's just trying to advance that next headline or change the cry ron at the bottom of a cable screen, he'll do whatever it takes in order to do that. he's someone who's obsess with his re-election and his standing and his media coverage. we have seen it this week in briefing room, he's gone after my colleague at the associated press, reporters from all of the major news networks and that's part of the play. he likes to make the media the story. he likes to paint us as the bad guy. to rail up his spotters. also, if he's undermining the credibility of the reporters and their news outlet, he might be

planting seed of doubts, when we simply trying to convey the facts and he's able to say, that's fake news, you saw how they treated me in the briefing room. and stephanie grisham the now-outgoing white house press secretary, she's being replaced today. she gave us a quote for a story as a final point here, nicolle, just a few days ago in one of her last deals with the media before leaving her post where she was very critical of news a story looking backwards, why aren't you looking at all of the good things this president is doing to battle this pandemic? why are you trying to figure out what happened before? the very sense of the journalists are to examine events both past and present. >> she's being replaced by a woman there's a tape circulating on social media, in an interview

with trish regularian, fired from fox news because she was spreading disinformation for her coverage more generally speaking of coronavirus. trish regan fired from fox news. k k kayleigh became press secretary. when we come back -- news breaking within the last hour, the acting navy secretary is resigning. after a political fire storm largely of his making. (soft music)

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acting navy secretary thomas modal ly modly resigned this afternoon. the subject of criticism after he followed up on the dismissal of captain brett crozier a by berating him to the ship crew.

modly suggested that crozier was either, quote, too naive or too stupid to be a captain of a ship like that. modly later apologized for that comment but the damage was done. modly's address featured the anti-media rhetoric, what started as a military pr issue has turned into a political one. as kevin baron writes in defense one, quote, modly is a welcome reminder that even at the pentagon political appointees are -- the idea that the political appointees in the charge of the defense department are show also apolitical or somehow different than, less beholden to or less responsible for the white house and this

president's views is pure fiction. so this is one of those blood-boiling stories. i'm going to hand it off to you guys. i want to say one thing, my how far has fallen since the statesman led it at the beginning james mattis. >> i served 12 years on the armed service committees. it was professional and nonpartisan. it was about the mission, it was never about the politics of the president. and watching what's happened, whether it's the pardoning of someone who had engaged in conduct that navy s.e.a.l.s came forward, unheard of, and then trump puts him out on the campaign trail. the idea this guy would travel

8,000 miles to tell the sailors that the commander went to the mat for them was stupid and worked in a slam on both the media and joe biden in the same speech and he wanted to say he got rid of the commander because of his judgment, woefully, terrible judgment and i'm so glad that he has gone quickly but don't mistake this -- there's turmoil at the department of the navy right now. there's a real schism between the civilian leadership and the military leadership and the military and mostly because of the temper tantrums and the compulsive and the inappropriate behavior of the commander in chief. >> michael steele, is it time for jim mattis to speak up and speak out, we know he saw things that he didn't write about in his books, of him talking to men

and women of the military saying we're going through a tough time in our country, he's not interested in protecting the morale of the men and women who served this country, is it time for him to say something? >> it is. but he won't. so i wouldn't spend too much time hoping and waiting for that to happen. because there's been enough time since secretary mattis was in the job for him to speak on those points. there have been enough events, there have been enough trumpism that's been out there for the secretary to address his own inside knowledge of what's really going on in departments like the pentagon, certainly in the military departments like the navy and air force and et cetera. i think the expectation for us is to take this episode in the ongoing, you know, reality tv

show of the white house and categorize it appropriately and just get ready to play it all back for november, that's ultimately nicolle where we wind up, nicolle, the american people have to make their own assessments of these matters. it doesn't matter anymore what these other players are saying who haven't said anything up to this point and now coming out to confirm or not confirm what people feel. it leaves it on us whether the individual in the white house is fit to be there for another term. fit to be there to manage the crises that lie ahead. we're in this for now. we got to deal with this. alarm bells going off, states don't have tests. states will bargaining with on each other to get masks. we're here now for that. but again, that's part of a narrative of what will come the

next few months for the voters and the american people to decide exactly what their final judgment will be. >> you know, claire, michael steele has turned us toward the future which is one of his gifts in politics, the election, we have a primary in wisconsin today, i mean, what do you make -- i think most of our anxiety as a country lies around the health and safety of our loved ones, whether or not our children are learning at home with us, i'll raise my hand there, what the toll is there on the country, another bucket of anxieties what comes of our presidential election, this democratic primary process which has been disrupted, and what happens? i mean, what are you concerns in that bucket, claire? >> well, i'm an optimistic person by nature, but the last 24 hours have been tough from

this acting secretary of the navy doing what he did to sailors in uniform on a carrier ship, to what happened with the fact that we have more deaths today in new york than we have had any other day and we've now lost -- over 12,000 loved ones in this country to the fact that this president has now started a war against the inspectors general very near and dear to my heart, something that i worked very hard as my time as an united states senator. the most heartbreaking is, the lines to vote in wisconsin. the underlying partisanship, these are republican legislators could have done the right thing but they had to fight it and they had to take it to the supreme court. the supreme court in 5-4 decision had to uphold the fact that this conservative judge in wisconsin said no, you can't

mail your ballots in unless they're postmarked by today and they have to have an excuse, notary, all this stuff, so really this may be the worst. because what those lines show people -- and i hope it makes the people of wisconsin very angry because they have the right to be damn mad about what they're having to go through today and it's partisan b.s. that's causing them to have to go through this today and i hope they use that as fuel in november to turn these people out of office and get back to parties who want everyone to vote, without fraud, we can do that in this country and it's incredibly discouraging that you're seeing this today in wisconsin. i predict that we'll have a record turnout because i got a feeling there are people who will crawl through glass this year to vote to change the environment and the culture that

they're seeing emanating from the oval office. >> michael steele, i'll give you the last word. >> i think -- sister claire laid it down. >> she sure did. >> i agree, everyone should have full unfettered access to the ballot box and certainly in november. and no legislation lay or the, no court should stay in the way of that and the fact that some want to be partisan and want to play politics to protect the outcome or try to design an outcome for a particular race or a particular reason, belies the with test omt -- the american

people i think are gearing up to crawl through cut glass, broken glass, whatever it's going to take to get to the ballot box and that scares the hell out of some people, maybe it should, we have to be ready for that, too and beprepared on the other side that every state allows vote by mail this november. at this point, don't care exactly where we are with coronavirus, it should be a part of the electoral plan for every state this november. >> michael steele, claire m mccaskill. thank you both for showing up and spending some time with us. when we come back -- more on this primary day in the midst of a pandemic, how do you vote when you're supposed to stay home?

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whew! call unitedhealthcare today and ask for this free decision guide. as we've been discussing a primary election under way in wisconsin today. right now. despite the coronavirus outbreak. this marks the first state to hold in-person voting while under a stay at home order. the wisconsin's primary taking place after the republican supreme court and later the u.s. supreme court ruled against the democratic governor's efforts to postpone in-person voting. the results for wisconsin could further joe biden's already sizable lead over bernie

sanders. the latest polling out of that state has joe biden ahead 62% to sanders' 34%. joining us now is nbc national political correspondent steve kornacki, on a normal day, we've been sitting around the same set with our colleagues talking about whether wisconsin moves to joe biden or decisively toward the nomination or whether bernie sanders gets out if he has another disappointing finish. but everything feels different. >> i mean, just the nature of this election the outline there today tells you how different everything is, we won't know the official result for another week, you know the ballots that are postmarked today will continue to come in, they'll tabulate them, they won't release anything for a week out there and in the men time, all these other primaries that had been scheduled for this month and for may, so many of them

have moved back to late may, into june, the primaries and the events that are going to take place in the next few weeks outside of wisconsin, they have shifted to mail-only voting. . a primary calendar that's been . voting methodology in a lot of other states has been completely blown up and it creates a question here. it's a totally different process than we've seen before. but you're right. just in a sort of normal political universe we'd be talking about bernie sanders coming into wisconsin, a state that he beat hillary clinton in by 14 points in 2016, a state where as you just showed he's trailing by 28 points right now. and you'd be looking in a normal world at pretty much a must-win scenario for sanders to prove he's still got viability. and how this all translates, though, in this current atmosphere we'll see. >> you know, steve kornacki, the conversation we've had every night from south carolina on has been about this wave of voters, democratic primary voters, toward joe bide nen states where he didn't have any campaign offices, where he didn't have

any ads up. is that wave still indicative in the polls like you just mentioned, him up by 28 points ahead of bernie sanders in a state that sanders won? >> and there it is. in wisconsin. wisconsin's the ultimate example of what was going right for bernie sanders in '16 and what was going wrong for hillary clinton not just in the primaries but obviously in the general election. wisconsin, that state that hillary clinton lost there. and it was blue-collar white voters in particular who clinton had so much trouble with. again, sanders in the primary and then again in wisconsin against trump in the fall. we've seen places like michigan and minnesota and missouri. you have seen biden doing 20, 30 points better with blue-collar white voters than hillary clinton did in 2016. and wisconsin was absolutely sort of the ultimate opportunity i think for biden to prove that that's still a thing. >> steve kornacki, it's good to see your face. thank you for spending some time with us. we'll be following you all night long in this contest. after the break, celebrating the

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this is how the santa rosa police department honors one of its own, a seemingly endless multiagency procession. transporting detective marylou armer back to her hometown in northern california. 43-year-old detective armer a wife, a stepmother, died last week from coronavirus. her family wasn't able to be with her, but while she was sedated doctors played audio recordings her family had sent. armer's sister was told even while unconscious those recordings appeared to make her heart beat faster. we're also celebrating police sergeant j.j. smith and his wife gloria today. they were starting a new life together after his retirement. j.j. was taken to the icu with coronavirus symptoms and was reportedly improving until gloria died of the disease. then j.j. died a week later.

her family put it like this. j.j. and gloria were the epitome of love and everlasting love. and that's how we're remembering them today too. thank you so much for letting us into your living rooms during this extraordinary time, spending the hour with us. lester holt tonight leads a live primetime special report on the pandemic. all the analysis and health advice from the experts. that's tonight at 10:00 p.m. eastern on msnbc, nbc, on our streaming service nbcnews now. our coverage continues now with my colleague chuck todd and the white house coronavirus briefing. right after a quick break. as a struggling actor,

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♪ we have limited staff in these rural areas. most of the rural hospitals don't have an icu. they do not have a ventilator. >> most of the units in the hospital have now converted over to covid-19 patients only. >> one of the field tents is being set up right now. the hospital is being overwhelmed. >> most of my patients in icu are on ventilators. and they don't even have any underlying, you know, medical conditions. >> i've just seen firsthand the severity of this illness. it's very