we're following new development at this hour on two different fronts. fresh reporting from the washington post contradicts the president's claim he was blind sided by the vie rrus with more than a dozen officials saying there were americans at the world health organization telling the administration about the virus in realtime and as early as last december. the news contradicts what some in the task force have been saying about the w.h.o. >> more than a dozen u.s. officials have been embedded by the w.h.o. since the crisis began. there were constant briefings with senior officials. they were getting the same information in realtime from the w.h.o. is it fair to blame the w.h.o. for covering up the spread of this virus? >> i think early on, when you go

back to -- again, i watch epidemics around the world. the level of transparency and communication that you need, you have to overcommunicate. you have to communicate even the small nuances. we're following the rulesul of our poll that worry two-thirds of americans are worried that government will open too fast. thank you so much for being here. i want to start with you and get your reaction to that latest news. another example of the white house not heeding the warnings of the w.h.o. we have the president pointing fingers at the w.h.o., blaming them for where we are now. my question is, where does that information leave us as we look to the federal government for a

response to this crisis? >> indeed, thank you for having me today. i think we have seen a president who is literally said, i take no responsibility and he is looked to every one else in his orbit to blame. his latest is to blame the w.h.o., but he's also blaming u.s. governors. he's blaming journalists and the media. he's blaming the obama administration. he blamed the impeachment proceedings. he blames everybody but takes no responsibility himself. the w.h.o. is not a perfect organization. there is no institution in the world that is perfect, but it is an institution we would have to create if it didn't exist and probably one of the most important things is as other country, particularly in the southern hemisphere get coronavirus. we have seen mexico struggling with coronavirus. it has the possibility of boom

ranging back into the united states and creating another cycle of concern. the w.h.o. is actually the glue that holds all that communications together. this is just one more example of the president not taking responsibility and putting it on someone else. >> all of this happens set against the reality that hundreds of americans are still dying every day that this crisis is very much still happening in realtime. the sort of fundamental question when you get to how things begin to return to normal, how you begin to reopen the economy is this question of trust and feeling safe. i want to point you to some polling that shows that more than half of americans don't trust what the president tells them. how can americans feel safe that they -- and feel the trust that it's time to reopen american life when they don't trust what they are hearing from their commander in chief? >> i think that's a valid

question. i think if this white house can basically work with the governors in the states and try to figure out a way to have messages that don't conflict with each other, that may help people feel better. looking towards your local leaders, your mayors, city councils, your governors and what they are saying can also help them increase their trust in government. overall, at the end of the day, because the president is the president of the united states, he has the bully pulpit. he has the ability to go out in front of america and be carried live on multiple networks all the time. people are looking to him for answers and basically what they are getting back is trust your governors. i think it's worth -- i realize there's a lot of people on msnbc who don't say this so maybe this is one of those situations where you listen to the president and listen to your governors. listen to your local officials. listen to the people who are closest to what your pain and what your suffering is and rely

on them to try to make the best decisions for you. >> i want to bring in the awe t author of the washington post power up newsletter. i want you to listen to what steve mnuchin said earlier about funding for the ppp program. >> i think we're making a lot of progress. i've had multiple conversations all weekend with the leadership of both the senate and the house. i spoke with chuck schumer this morning. i know he's on after. i think we're making a lot of progress. >> what are they doing in the next bill to make sure that money gets into the hands of those who need it most, jackie? >> well that is the problem that i think a lot of democrats still have with this next package, this tweener bill. it's not the full package that democrats want but there are 400

billion in small business loans. 75 billion being allocated for hospitals and 25 billion for testing. as for these workers and americans who are part of the gig economy and being affected by the epidemic are not seeing a lot of measures that democrats have been pushing for them. which is hazard pay for front line workers, additional aid for four states that are being hits harder than others and things like rent freeze and additional snap funding for food assistance for people who a month in haven't had a job or paycheck for 30 days. treasury secretary steve mnuchin is saying he believer americans should subsides on $1200 for a very long period of time. >> to your point about rent freezes, we'll be talking about that in a bit.

i want you to listen to some sound of nancy pelosi talking about president trump as a leader. take a listen. >> leaders take responsibility. i said he's a weak leader. he doesn't take responsibility. he places blame on others. that might have been okay for before, but we cannot continue down a path that is of combative science, science, science, evidence data and how we could go forward. >> ambassador, you teach a class on leadership. i want to know what you make of this speaker's analysis by speak about who americans should be looking to and listening to. >> i think shanna made a valid point. i think if people are listening to their governors and the president of the united states, his approval rating is in the

40s. he does have a rock solid base that listens to him. when they wills people to go out and protest, there are people who listen to him. nonethele nonetheless, as you say, i teach ledd leadership and we tell young people who want to be leaders they have to know themselves, have courage, confidence, they have to do what's right even if there's a cost to that. political leaders in these times need to do what's right even if it's not in their political self-interest when appears the president is all about his political self-interest. we tell them to learn a set of skills to know what they are doing, to rely on experts in science. we can't all know everything. we have to create a team and rely on that team. we all like it when dr. fauci comes up and speaks. we like to hear that science but this has been an anti-science administration. we know that about climate. we know that about other things. about them taking science add visors out of many institutions

in our government and we tell people to act but we tell folks not to do before you know who you are, have that character, bring the people around you that you need and then take the actions that are necessary. i think shanna is right on. most of the american public is listening to their governors and there are democrats and republican governors, both, who are doing a very good job. >> when you talk to though governors and mayors, the number one thing they pivot back to and talk about when they will know it's time to reopen the economies is their access to testing. listen to what vice president pence said about testing earlier today. we may not have that sound. my fundamental question to you -- we've got it. take a listen.

>> that took us from 80,000 tests one month ago to now four million tests as of yesterday. as we'll make clear again to governors tomorrow on our weekly conference call, we look forward to continuing to partner with governors all acraoss the county as we continue to scale testing because we believe that while we're doing 150,000 tests a day now, states around country will activate all the laboratories that are available if their states. we could more than double that overnight. >> is there appetite for a national testing system? >> i think there's appetite amongst the governors for national testing system. i think it depends what you mean. one central place didn't work when every one was sending the tests to the cdc. i believe as we saw on "meet the press" earlier, the governor mike dewine said we need help to

do tests and get it up to the point where you can get to what is considered phase one of the white house's plan to get people back out to work. i think there is an appetite from people to know that there is a way to ramp up the testing that is more than just state by state. while i said before, i think people are listening to their governors and want to hear them and many of the governors are doing a great job in trying to do this. what the federal government's job is in this is to put some type of overall system of checks and balances into place so the states have something to rely on. mike dewine having to go on "meet the press" and hopefully someone from the fda is hear whing what he is saying what he needs is not the best way to do that. hopefully someone from the fda will hear from him directly on a

phone call and get them what they need. you need an overall system to get that to each and every state as the states determine what they will need to get back into life and society. >> jackie we have spoken a lot about governors, less so about congress. talked a bit about ppp. give us a sense of what this next week is likely to look like. what effort we might be seeing from congressional leaders to combat this crisis. >> i think we're going to see the senate vote on this bill we secretary mnuchin tease. the house is going to debate this package as well. there is a broader discussion here that is still ongoing about a larger, broader fourth stimulus package that does

include more funding for people that aren't getting it. that's a wide range of people from independent restaurants to lower income communities. people on food stamps. workers in the gig economy who haven't had a paycheck for a while who aren't necessarily essential workers and then essential workers who need hazard pay, need paid sick leave in order to stop the spread of the disease so they stop going to work with potentially carrying the coronavirus and continuing the spread of this. i think as was pointed out we'll see governors taking center stage here. more so than washington and dominating the conversation and guiding the conversation of where the states are actually going to go. i think the priority does still need to be testing if anyone

wants to reopen the economy. testing does need to be up to speed. >> all right. thank you all so much. millions of americans are out of work and worried about how they will make rent next month. i'll talk to former hud secretary julian castro about the coming housing crisis and wa we should be doing about it. they're a crucial part of america's food system so what's being done to keep farm workers safe. we'll talk about struggle to get them the essential equipment they need. r. i've been teaching for over 20 years. with everything going on, we've had to alter our classroom settings. we have to transition into virtual learning. on the network, we can have teachers face-to-face with a student in live-time. they can raise their hand and ask questions. they can type questions. we just need to make sure that the education is continuing. (vo) at verizon, we're here and we're ready to keep students and teachers connected to the world. that's why verizon and "the new york times" are offering 14 million students free digital access to "times" journalism.

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a massive wave of layoffs leaving millions of memamerican worried about how to pay their rent or mortgage. a tennessee professor writes for those already struggling to stay in their homes, the coronavirus is a dramatic blow to an already difficult situation. even for those family who is have received some temporary relief for april and may, it's hard to imagine how families

that already pay between 30% and 50% of their salary on rent will be able to pay off any debts when relief programs expire. my next guest have i idea on how to prevent the housing crisis. with me is julian castro. okay, secretary, 12 billion in the last package for this. why was that not enough? >> it wasn't enough because we already had a housing affordability crisis before this pandemic. what we have now is by one estimat estimate, up to 31% of americans who rent who are unable or did not pay their april rent. that's a tremendous burdens on people out there who have found out that their just one paycheck away from tremendous housing insecurity.

$12.5 billion is not nearly enough to cover all of the needs out there. i believe that it is crucial that this next relief package include, especially direct rental assistance for renters. the first relief package did do some things for people who owe on a mortgage to provide them some time so that we can get through this pandemic. i think they still need attention, but it's renters who especially need relief. hopefully congress will be able to include that in the package. the other thing we see is homelessness has been on the rise. we need to be investing to make sure these very vulnerable americans who already, if they are homeless are sleeping in unsanitary conditions, from place to place in communities that they have a safe, decent place to live especially during this pandemic. i want to applaud cities like portland and my hometown of san

antonio that have gotten creative. they have done public-private partnerships to locate homeless individuals in hotels that are closed down. the federal government should step up to provide more relief so things like that can happen and local communities don't have to bear all of that burden. >> throughout the course of your campaign, you talked about reimagining section 8 add a fully funded federal entitlement program. what would that look like in this moment and how would it boost housing opportunities? >> i did. i think we should make an entighe entitlement program. if you make less of 50% of the median income in the community that you live in, you would be entitled to get a housing choice voe voucher to go in the prooifivat market and get place to live. you would still have to pay about 30% of income of your salary but that would provide

more stability than we have now. the other thing i propose was a refundable renters tax credit so that even on a monthly basis we could provide a boost for renters because rent is rising all over the place in many communities even before this pandemic. both of those things will stabilize so many american families that are finding out how close they are to poverty? >> when you talk about housing crisis, how much of the solution focuses on targeted specific programs to address housing and how much is baked into larger economic stimulus. >> i think we need to be both in the years to come. it's going to take bigger solutions. that's why whether it's a tax credit or making the housing choice voucher entitlement program or investing for about $10 billion to create three million more units of affordable housing, it's time for us to see

housing as a human right in this nation and to try to make sure that every single person has a safe, decent, affordable place to live. if we don't learn some lessons from this coronavirus experience, i think that we're going to miss an opportunity to into in a different direction. for the last 40 years we have heard that the smaller the government, the weaker the government, the better. and people are all on their own. i think we're learning we need to go in the opposite direction. we need to do everything as a nation, as one community to ensure that everybody has good health care and everybody has safe place to live. i hope that's the new era we're moving into after this. >> thank you so much for your time. >> thank you. up next, there's new polling that shows how voters feel about president trump, joe biden and the way each of them is addressing the current crisis. sometimes the challenges of today's world

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this presidential race is unlike any other. no one has ever campaigned in the middle of pandemic before. joe biden and president trumpra bases amid the coronavirus pandemic. it's ravaged the economy and taken tens of thousands of lives. in matchup nationally, biden beats trump by 7%. the margin of error for this poll is plus, minus 3.3 percentage points. looik i'd like to bring in iam sams. he's a democratic strategist and the former campaign manager for cory booker's presidential campaign. good to see you both. i want to start with this polling, ian. nbc news and wall street journal of voters don't trust coronavirus campaign and 42%

said they are unaware of his coronavirus statements and don't have an opinion. if you weren team biden, what does that tell you about what you need to do moving forward? >> i think what vice president biden is doing is the right move. can you hear me okay? >> i hear you. >> what vice president biden is doing right now is the right move. he's educating the public about president trump's failures. you see the campaign is up with a new ad that's completely guts president trump's claim that china is to blame when he spent months praising china in the lead up to this crisis and sending some of our ppe to china in the early days. he needs to keep talking about what he would do if he was in charge. i think part of his benefit right now is that people remember the leader that she was when he was in the obama administration. they remember his time as president obama's vice president when he helped lead a response to the ebola crisis and other

major crises like this. reminding voters he's a steady hand in the middle of this chaotic leadership that president trump is offering is a great way to show he would be able to get the job done. >> we're living through this. it's very much in focus in this moment. if the current projections are right, we will continue to be living through this into the fall. how much of an issue is this in the head to head match up between president trump and vice president biden? >> it looks like it could be -- biden campaign. we don't know what the campaign will be about come september and october when the rubber meets the road. i think the biden campaign is doing all they can to provide an alternative to donald trump. his base is loss. that's something we have to

remember. he's fer foperform ning in the house briefing room for them. that's what the biden campaign needs to remind themselves to communicate with every single day. if they do that then they be successful. >> i want to talk about the persuadable voters as it relates to a point we found in this poll. biden was picked over trump as the candidate who better handles a crisis and could better handle coronavirus, but trump edges biden out on being better at handling the economy. what do you make of that? >> it's interesting trend line. i helped with a project called the navigator research which is a daily opinion research opinion of the public and how they are reacting to president trump's leadersh leadership. every single day we're measuring the public opinion. president trump went from having plus ten approval rating on how to handle the coronavirus to

having a minus 6 approval rating. that's largely driven by an initial group of democrats who wanted to support the president in a moment of crisis and a majority of independents really turning away from him as he's e deflecting blame and not taking responsibility. as that trend happens, i think it's natural you'll see voters say, maybe vice president biden would be better at handling a crisis like this. when they are thinking in november as the referendum nature of this election, they're going to say, you know, i don't think donald trump got it done. i think that the leadership we saw under eight years of the obama administration when joe biden was vice president is the kind of leadership we need to steer us in a crisis like this. >> when we break down the demographics in that polling. pretty broad support from african-american voters, latino voters. pretty positive results from

women, younger people. how do you keep those voters engaged and how do you make sure they are fired up in you are joe biden going into november? >> it's the big question. one way he'll be able to do that is with his vice with tpresiden choice. it needs to be somebody who can speak to the base and fire up the base. i think it's what's i said before, making sure we remember this is a fight over a small sliver of persuadable voters but the base turn out is how donald trump is thinking about this race. it's something we have focus on. that means talking to these folks and not taking for granted -- >> i may have lost you. we'll come back to him in a second. i want you to pick up where he left off which is part of it is about the message. part of it is about the

messenger. what you talk about the possibility that is going to -- we're going to be continuing some of these social distancing measures into november. how much of this conversation about turning those folks out is how they vote in november? >> yeah, i think that we need to have as many people as we can. vice president biden, his running mate to keep in mind, he's already promised it will be a woman. it's going be a history making, energizing candidate no matter who he picks. he's got so many great options to choose from. i think it's about getting the voice out publicly. right now you have captive voices in their home who is are watching tv more than usual, streaming more con tent and getting out there and getting the message across about not only this administration's failures but what a good president, what a good administration can look like in managing a moment of crisis like this. to dr. fauci's credit, we have seen him going everywhere in the

media environment right now. the morning shows or youtube streams but we need to see more of our democratic leadership step sboping into that gap and speaking to people where they are especially when we know those core base audiences of voters, younger people, african-americans, hispanics, they consume information in different ways than each other and the broader public. being able to go to where they are online, go where they are in the media landscape and talk about this issue in a credible way is a really important thing to do right now. >> i think i have you back. i hope you do because i appreciated that earlier. you were tweeting about the fact that you were going to make an appearance as was the haircut that your wife has given you during quarantine. i'm glad we got to get you back up on screen. i want you to speak to what ian was saying and you were saying about the vice presidential pick. you also have the vice president saying he would consider announcing some cabinet picks in

advance of november. you have an incredibly deep bench of democratic talent which you saw throughout this 2020 primary. do you think it's likely we start hearing about those picks from the vice president's campaign and any names you want to throw into the mix? >> i don't know about -- no. i don't know about likely but i think it might be a good idea. look, other countries have shadow governments. i think at this point our federal government is failing us, our executive branch, at least. to have joe biden out there with team around him presenting the democrat message would be potentially effective. i think we could see something like that in unprecedented times. why not try unprecedented tactics. >> thank you both so much. they're going to work and picking our crops so you can keep putting food on table. many of them are doing it without the protective gear needed to keep them safe from covid-19. we'll talk about what's being done to fix the problem.

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more than two million people are working at farms across the u.s., picking and packing food to be delivered to your dinner table. many are doing so without proper masks. the white house is working on

ways to help struggling farmers to reduce wages for farm workers on guest worker visas which could hurt those already working. the hashtag massings for farm workers. they have a new spokes american. nick joins me now along with founder of justice for migrant women. talk to me about why farm workers are so important to our community and food supply chain. >> this almost feels like a conversation you don't need to have because this is one of the biggest conversations we're having all the time in regards to this pandemic is our food supply lines. the idea that food is not something that we're in short supply of and to calm everybody down but to know that this is an issue that exists all the time and that farm workers have had

not only deplorable conditions to work in and no wages to support them that will commensurate with the work they do or equal rights but now even more so during this pandemic, this is the food supply we rely on. this is the people who grow, pack and plant your food and if we can't bring this protective equipment, even washing stations to wash hands and other living conditions because right now this isn't sustainable. now more than ever this is an issue that america needs the wake up and take care of. >> monica, what do you make of the reports that the white house in an effort to help farmers is considering slashing wages to farm workers. >> well, we think it's outrageous and appalling. they need more help in this moment, not less. for those who would say this

plan they are discussing only pertains to guest workers who are 10% of the labor work force, the reality is that this will have an impact on all workers including the u.s. workers who are working alongside these guest workers. this sends the wrong message and guest workers who live in the labor camps and the deplorable housing are the workers who are fearful that will become ill. if this virus gets into the labor camps, these workers are at risk of becoming ill by the dozens, if not by the hundreds. the fact the white house is discussing the fact that there would be any kind of attempt to limit or lower or relax the aid at this particular moment and failing to understand that farm workers as well as farm workers need ail now is really difficult to comprehend. >> nick, not all farm workers can social distance. talk to me a bit about the working conditions these farm workers find themselves in.

>> in some of your best situations, people are eight or more to one bed room houses, as many as 20. the conditions going to and from work are packed trucks, cars, when ever -- buses. health care opportunities are slim, if even available. over 50% are already closing and more along the way that only have ppe to last another week. the condition's already lend themselves to an outbreak and at our most crucial point. the fact these are issues that have already been facing farm workers prior to this exposure to kmem cchemicals that lead to respiratory issues and birth defects. is it 900,000 of migrant farm workers are women? a lot of conditions that go

along with that. >> that's right. >> this makes them a lot more susceptible to covid, not only the ailments that comes with it and death. this is exposure in things that are happening year round. this is something we're shining a light on but this work has been going on before this ban tell meic hit. it's more needed because of this. the fact we have to go onto explain that to people is increasingly frustrating. >> kmoomonica, what would an appropriate federal response that included farm workers look like? >> we need to make sure that the members of congress include farm workers in all immigrant workers in any relief measures from the covid testing to treatment as well as allocating moneys for these migrant health clinics. nick was talking about fact these health clinics are at real

risk of closing and seeing them furlough workers across the country. we're putting them out on front line with no protection, with no benefit, with no rights and their health clinics that serve them if they become ill are closing. we need congress to make sure there's money for these immigrants and we need to talk about the hazard pay that farm workers should be paid for the work they are doing because they are going to work, putting their health on the line in other words to feed us. >> nick, i have about 30 seconds. tell me about the pandemic relief fund and what folks at home can do. >> the pandemic relief fund is a fund we created with -- >> i want to hear her answer. >> monica, you go ahead. >> the pandemic relief fund is a fund that's going to aids farm workers by getting them food for

the basic needs and other emergency assistance. we have this mass for farm workers kamg pain that nick is part of a team on. we're along with national center trying to get ppe for them. you request go to www.justiceforwomen.org/mas www.justiceforwomen.org/masksfor farmworkers to get involved. neighbors helping neighbors and a donor left a big gift for every family. we'll get the story from the town's mayor, next. there's a white house coronavirus task force briefing in just about an hour. we'll bring it to you when it happens. you're watching msnbc live. ere s again soon, and family gatherings. there will be parades and sporting events and concerts. to help our communities when they come back together, respond to the 2020 census now.

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a small town with a big heart. 30 miles outside of des moines,

the town has a population under 1500, who in the wake of the coronavirus outbreak have fallen on hard times. then one morning residents woke up to find three gift cards in their mailboxes, a value of $150 at a total cost of over $82,000. there were enough gift cards for every house in earlham. the person who sent them wants to remain anonymous. mayor, i want you to tell me about the morning you got a call saying you had an anonymous donor who wanted to make this type of contribution. what was your response? >> it was overwhelming, really. the first phone call i got said -- the person said they were representing the donor, and they were thinking about buying $150 gift cards and was looking for some help in the distribution end of it, who needed them the most, who could get the most use out of them. so we started working with the school to identify the families

around town who had fallen on hard times and would get the most help out of that. and pretty soon i got a second call that said hey, the donor wants to go to 250 cards. even better. shortly after that, another phone call said they want to go up to 500 cards. and at that point, i said to the go-between, the third party, you know, at 500, you're almost at one for almost household in town. and he said give me that number as soon as you can, and we'll see if we can make it happen. so i went to city hall and we pulled up our list of households in town because of the water meter, we have everybody's addresses. i said hey, the number is 549. there are 549 households in earlham. and he said done. we're going to go with that. and i said wow, that's amazing. to go from 100 to 150 to 250 to

549 in a relatively short amount of time. we're talking a matter of a couple of hours. it kind of blew me away. when i said that to him, he said jeff, i think you've misunderstood me here. i thought geez, what have i done? how have i messed this up. they said no, we're not buying 549 total cards, we're buying 549 cards to these three different businesses to each residence will be getting all three gift cards. and at that moment, the number i had in my head of the dollar amount that was being spent obviously tripled. and it was just purely overwhelming. >> it is such a moving story. i am overwhelmed when you tell it. when folks started to get those in their mailboxes, i'm sure you got a lot of calls from folks who wanted to know where they were from, what they were for. what did you hear from residents

of your community? >> everything like you just said. the biggest thing everybody wanted to say was obviously thank you. and i got asked the question every which way you can. who was it? give me a hint, do you know, you have to know. i still to this day do not know. and so after that, there was a lot of thank you notes written and turned in to city hall, just everyone wanted to thank someone. and since that person isn't being recognized, it just turned into a card or a note just saying hey, let them know how much this meant to us, and what it means to the town as a whole. >> right. because there is the generosity that it was expressed towards those individuals. but these were also gift certificates to local establishments in town. what has it meant for the town's economy to have that influx of cash? >> it's huge.

it was the donor's idea obviously to have all of these cards come from local businesses from the start. and to me, the brilliance of it was in the simplicity. they could have gone a thousand different ways about this. and to make sure that all that cash returned to the local economy was just huge. the restaurants in particular, for them, that influx of cash not only meant that they were going to be around once all this over, but possibly even stronger, just because being a small town, and, you know, being able to do takeout orders only, they're very slow right now. just knowing that they'll still be in business when all this is over has been outstanding. >> well, what a great story, mayor lilly. thank you. and if that anonymous donor is watching, then thank you to you as well. that wraps it up for this hour. the reverend al sharpton takes

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